Which one industry would you mostly blame for all of America's woes?

[occupyeverywhere]

Certainly it's a tangled web, but which one is most responsible for our horrible situation? For example, the automotive industry that destroyed pedestrian culture, destroyed public transportation infrastructure and has essentially guided our foreign military interventions worldwide for the exploitation of cheap fossil fuels.

[rfranklin]

1. The politican industry...selling out to all the other industries...

we need a Constitutional amendment against corporate personhood to start.

[piratefish08]

2. The Presidential Election Industry.

16 out of 17 lobbyists love it though.

[raccoon]

3. The financial industry (?) deserves a good helping of blame too.

But the automotive industry is way up there.

[PassingFair]

4. Wall Street/Bankers

For creating and pushing bogus mortgages and then
reselling them as solid investments.

They've crippled industry in this country and
defrauded other countries.

[Javaman]

5. the repuke lobbying industry. nt

[Rabrrrrrr]

6. right wing Christianity - the dominionists and dispensationalists

[get the red out]

31. Yes, they convince too many people to fight against their rights.

Their allegiance with the right wing corporatists has served to deter people from actually doing anything to stop the destruction of the middle class by all the corporate monsters.

They sold the souls and quality of life of their followers in exchange for support of their particular brand of hate, and that has tipped the balance in numbers of regular people who will stand up for themselves.

Then they popularized the "prosperity Gospel" which takes the values out of Christian Values to the point that huge numbers of their followers run around spouting Ayn Rand without even knowing HER values. It would be comical if it weren't greatly contributing to the total destruction of our nation.

[Selatius]

7. The banking industry. They backstop all major corporations and provide lines of credit.

They have a stake in almost every major enterprise in the United States. They sit on the boards of countless corporations and are friends with many in private industry. If a corporation wanted to establish a new munitions plant to make more weapons to blow up a country, it has to line up financiers to do so, and banks can do that. If a company wanted a city to privatize its utility so that the company can be a local monopoly on power generation, it can talk to its friends in the banking industry, who likely own some of the debt the city has, and force the city to privatize or risk default. The list goes on and on.

[Kaleko]

67. Agreed. The multinational banking industry has no allegiance to any nation,

culture or social structure. It only cares for its own bottomline: survival of the parasite at the expense of each host (country) it sucks dry.

[IndyPragmatist]

8. The auto industry didn't destroy pedestrian culture, we all did

We collectively made the decision that we wanted to live in suburban areas or build cities that are spread out. The auto industry didn't destroy the pedestrian culture in the rest of the world. America just had the luxury of a lot of space to build, and many cities were built as autos were becoming more common. Thus, cities were designed for cars instead of people because that's what the people wanted.

We love our cars in America.

[HillbillyBob]

14. Don't forget in the late 40s and through the 50s

GM bought out the local trams/trains and demolished them leaving most inner cities with little choice in transport and almost no mass transit. Their lobbies also worked against passenger intercity trains too. When Amtrak came along they have been steadily strangling it all along.

This mess was created over the last 3 4 decades with puke deregulation that has gutted all fairness (starting with the Fairness Doctrine and ending up with funnymoney mortgage ghouls.

We bought this place during the height of the bubble(it was abandoned and for sale cheap). I spoke with about 12 15 real estate agents, all but the very last one tried pushing jumbo, interest only, and or adjustable rate mtgs and they pushed hard.
I said at the time that I have never seen an adjustable rate mtg reduction in apr rates. I don't know if we are going to be able to hang on even though our pmts are less than rent. I just had another bypass surgery and partner has been laid off for months..and I know we are doing better than many..but still after 30yrs of low wages and 10 of that disabled Im really disgusted by the idiots voting for 'famblyvauues' and bailout/well fare for the rich while I try to figure out what to fix for dinner.

[occupyeverywhere]

17. That's not true

Read about the Great American streetcar scandal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_American_streetcar_scandal

[IndyPragmatist]

22. I've heard of that, but it's minor in the grand scheme of things

That probably accelerated our reliance on automobiles, but it wasn't the reason for it.

Americans like to move. People want the ability to move to places where land is cheaper and they can live more comfortably. Our suburban sprawl made it nearly impossible for public transit to keep up in the middle part of the 20th century. Additionally, suburban towns were often chartered on their own instead of being annexed by the larger city so they could make their own decisions (which usually meant getting rid of many of the urban services such as public transit, parks, and sidewalks).

Americans made the decision to choose cars over public transit, the automakers just helped us down that path.

[occupyeverywhere]

24. That is really incorrect

The suburbs started out as suburbs because of their proximity to streetcar lines. Your whole argument falls flat.

[IndyPragmatist]

28. Sorry, you are incorrect. That's only true in a handful of cities like NYC, Boston, or Philly

The rest of America saw suburban sprawl as a result of automobiles, cheap land, and zoning laws.

"Although sprawl is not a recent—or even uniquely American—phenomenon and has been common to every city from the beginning of “urban history,” it has exploded as an area of focus in recent years, with researchers citing the automobile, governmental single-use zoning laws, accessible mortgages, and housing subsidies as necessary indicators for the present-day version of the phenomenon (Bruegmann 2005). "
http://www.randomhistory.com/1-50/027sprawl.html

-------------------------------------------

"Henry Ford was also a big reason why suburbs caught on the way they did. His innovative ideas for making cars cut manufacturing costs, reducing the retail price for customers. Now that an average family could afford a car, more people could go to and from home and work everyday. Additionally, the development of the Interstate Highway System further encouraged suburban growth.

The government was another player that encouraged movement out of the city. Federal legislation made it cheaper for someone to construct a new home outside of the city than to improve upon a preexisting structure in the city. Loans and subsidies were also provided to those willing to move to new planned suburbs (usually wealthier white families).

In 1934 the United States Congress created the Federal Housing Administration (FHA), an organization intended to provide programs to insure mortgages. Poverty struck everyone's life during the Great Depression (beginning in 1929) and organizations like the FHA helped to ease the burden and stimulate growth."
http://geography.about.com/od/urbaneconomicgeography/a/suburbs.htm

--------------------------------------------

"Thus, after World War II, at least in the United States, the automobile, the auto industry, the urban road network, and the suburbs grew together. The result was a dispersed urban geography, often called sprawl, which characterized not only the suburbs of large cities but also whole cities that experienced the bulk of their growth after the automobile became popular, they include Phoenix, Arizona; Los Angeles, California; Dallas, Texas; and Orlando, Florida. This is a geography in which travel is less focused on nodes and corridors (denser, centrally located city and suburban downtowns). It is a dispersed market that is difficult to serve economically with mass transportation."
http://l3d.cs.colorado.edu/systems/agentsheets/New-Vista/automobile/suburbia.html

---------------------------------------------

"Hartshorn and Muller describe a five-stage model of suburban growth:

1) Bedroom community, which refers to the development of residential communities in the suburbs, motivated by the availability of cheap land and financing, as well as the location independence brought by the car and high-speed highways

2) The stage of independence, which refers to the development of suburban regional malls, as well as office and industrial parks, which brought jobs close to suburban communities, reducing or eliminating the dependence of suburban residents on central city employment

3) The stage of catalytic growth, during which housing and commercial development intensifies and becomes more diversified in terms of quality and price

4) The high-rise/high-technology stage, which was marked by the emergence of high-rise office towers housing the growing middle and upper-middle management functions and corporate headquarters, as well as the emergence of high-tech research and development activities, located in selected suburban corridors.

5) The mature town center stage, during which cultural, social, and recreational facilities are developed, completing the full spectrum of land uses found in mature urban areas."
http://www.property-investing.org/suburban-growth.html




That's just from the first few google results.

[occupyeverywhere]

38. Actually, you left out

quite a few. Saint Louis, Indianapolis, Richmond and a whole bunch of others. The data indicates that suburbs were prompted by the creation of street car lines to outlying areas of major American cities. Not as you say, by the advent of the automobile. So, again, you are wrong.

[Selatius]

39. My city is relatively small, but back in the 1920s and 1930s, there were street cars.

Old photographs from the era attest to it. The oldest part of the city is very pedestrian friendly. Everything is built close together, and there are sidewalks. The newer areas of the city are covered with nothing but sub-divisions and shopping centers with large parking lots. Most of the newer areas were built in the last 30 maybe 40 years. There are few if any sidewalks there, regretfully so. The traffic on the highway that runs through the city can get pretty bad during rush hours. I usually avoid driving during the day if I can get around it; I hate heavy traffic.

[IndyPragmatist]

42. The presence of streetcars didn't help the suburbs in Indianapolis

http://web.me.com/willvdv/chirailfan/indt1940.html


I know you are not familiar with Indy, but none of the lines ran into the suburban areas. They stopped in areas that had been developed since the early 20th century.

I do not know about Saint Louis or Richmond, but the fact of the matter is that nearly every researcher of suburban growth attributes zoning laws, cheap land, and the growth of the automobile as the reasons for suburban growth. Indianapolis is the perfect example of that. We, more than any other city sans maybe Detroit, love our cars. We had a thriving streetcar system in the early 20th century, but as people could afford cars, they abandoned the streetcars. After WWII, there were barely any streetcars left as the suburbs were starting to take off.

The suburbs of the early 20th century may have relied on streetcars and trains, but there was very little suburban growth until WWII. The current suburbs were completely developed, designed, and supported by the automobile.

[JuniperLea]

54. Los Angeles is high on that list as well...

The Pacific Electric Railway connected most of Southern California... you can still see a lot of the abandoned tracks. Huntington Beach, Fullerton, Long Beach, San Pedro, Santa Monica, Pasadena, Downtown Los Angeles... it was a beautiful thing. Now we have notoriously bad freeways.



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_nHk4eRE8Qbc/TFkEmc6NAkI/AAAAAAAADbY/H1120AXC81s/s1600/Pacific+Electric+red+car,+Fullerton,+1937.jpg

[no_hypocrisy]

9. Combination of the financial industry, the corporate aggregate, and

the military-industrial complex.

[OneGrassRoot]

10. Adding to the above: mainstream media n/t

[blogslut]

11. Sorry

It's just not that simple. The blame lies with greed, oppression and a human race that's advanced technologically far faster than it has sociologically.

[Scuba]

12. Big oil. They run our energy policy and our foreign policy. Probably own Wall Street too. n/t

[Kingofalldems]

13. Agreed. They also totally run at least 2 states.

[Blue_In_AK]

70. Watch out, North Dakota...

[yardwork]

57. Gas and Oil. I agree.

[Blue_In_AK]

69. They would be high on my list.

Alaska is virtually a colony of BP, Conoco-Phillips and Exxon, and our governor, Sean Parnell, is openly and with much enthusiasm fellating them right in front of our eyes nearly every day. It's sickening. Did I mention that he worked as an attorney for EXXON during the spill litigation and was a lobbyist for Conoco-Philips? Formerly known as Captain Zero (Don Young's nickname for him), but we've all taken to calling him Seanico Parnellips these days.

[valerief]

15. Banking. It's always been banking. nt

[Ineeda]

16. Among several, I'd choose not an actual industry, but a corporation:

Wal Mart. They sell only cheap imported goods, pay lousy wages and benefits, discriminate, and drive all competition out of thousands of communities. Downtown shopping areas are disappearing and even malls are negatively impacted. American manufacturing has been decimated, in large part by Wal Mart, eliminating a vast number of jobs. Competing retailers are driven out of business, eliminating those jobs also. Choice of shopping options will someday be obsolete.

[occupyeverywhere]

18. I'll have to agree with that.

[dkf]

19. The Iowa corn subsidy, which bastardized our entire way of producing food.

In the end it's all about the basics, food, shelter, clothing and I would add health. How much of our exploding costs are due to health care? How much of that is impacted by what we eat?

[BrendaBrick]

59. On the Iowa corn subsidy...

not to mention the draining of our aquifers (which are NOT replenishing to keep up with demand) when energy competes with food!

[Bluenorthwest]

20. Bankers who deal in debt

Along with the arms dealers they use to make the conflicts that create the huge debts they seek.

[woo me with science]

46. Yes. This is the driver of it all. nt

[City Lights]

21. Conservatism.

It poisons everything it touches.

[Johonny]

41. I agree they invented the concept of a CEO president

[justabob]

23. lobbyists

They are the enablers of all the others.

[Marrah_G]

25. The Political Industry

Fucking Parasites

[tsuki]

26. Media. nt

[Tsiyu]

43. Bingo. We have a winner!

Our media is owned by the 1%.

They've been telling us how healthy and tasty shit sandwiches are for years.

"Just shut up and eat your shit sandwich. Now here's a missing blond woman and a royal wedding and a scandal involving SEX. Next up, how to save money on your shit sandwiches in the new economy."

No Fairness Doctrine to point out that perhaps shit sandwiches aren't the healthiest thing to be eating or feeding your kids.

No required truth in "news" per the Supremes who ruled that FOx News can LIE through their teeth and still call themselves "Fair and Balanced."

Until we have true public access to the truth on our PUBLIC OWNED radio and TV stations, we'll just keep on munching....


And the media will continue to ask "White or whole wheat?" as if we have some say in the matter.

[SammyWinstonJack]

49. "When you trust your television, what you get is what you got....

'cause when they own the information, they can bend it all they want."


Yep!

[Tsiyu]

52. Sociopaths ruin everything

(yeah, Rupie, I'm talkin' to you, too...)

[Whisp]

50. that's my vote too.

an honest media would keep all those jackals at bay.

[RegieRocker]

27. The citizen industry. Way too many scabs and suck ups.

Me,me, me.

[Blue_Tires]

29. for-profit health insurance

[mmonk]

30. The political think tank industry funded by the multi-nationals.

[graywarrior]

32. United Fruit

They started this whole mess.

[Octafish]

45. Gen. Smedley Butler mentioned them in 'War Is a Racket'

I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902–1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested.

[graywarrior]

55. Yep, he was a real dink.

[guitar man]

48. yep

And it's funny where you might see United Fruit mentioned, like here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMQxGRykdVY

[graywarrior]

62. LOL!

[slackmaster]

33. The incumbent politician machine

We won't see any meaningful change until we:

1. Stop thoughtlessly voting for the most heavily advertised candidate, and

2. Vote out the incumbents and replace them with better people.

[BrendaBrick]

61. BINGO!

I'm with you on this one slackmaster! Though I agree with much that has already been posted here, to some extent (and I'm waiting for the backlash on this one...) I blame (in part) the overall complacency of the American people for not being more involved with who votes (or doesn't vote) for what with the same vigor normally attributed to sports in this country!

But perhaps this "current" is changing. Wouldn't it be nice if say, the last few minutes of the local news station (or even in a separate section of the local paper - what still remains of them ~) were dedicated not to sport scores and stats, but to local political ones? In a perfect world, I would imagine - but still, there are heroes such as Brian Lamb making it easier as well as other forms of media and information outlets which sadly have to be mindfully and purposely investigated in order to flush out what is really going on...still. To some extent...all about the priorities.

On a positive and realistic note, I do feel that by supporting local progressives along these lines is probably our best chance right now to counteract all the corruption and greed, at least to a somewhat viable extent.

[hifiguy]

34. Banking/high finance, for sure.

Though Big Oil and Big Insurance deserve (dis)honorable mentions.

[Aerows]

35. Lobbyists

They are the direct cause of the vast majority of horrible policy. Our media is part of the problem, but it all comes down to the lobbyists. We have NO chance of ever reforming the system until we get rid of people buying votes. It's legalized bribery.

[barbiegeek]

36. HEALTH CARE INDUSTRY & INSURANCE

MASS MILITARY INDUSTRIAL CONTRACTS

[Occulus]

37. Ultimately, I blame the magnates of the rail industry

for Santa Clara Cty. v. Southern Pacific Railroad Co. and the associated other test cases the rail company lawyers (as well as other corporate powers of the time) pushed into court.

If you don't know what the hell I'm talking about, read up on the issue of "corporate personhood". Although Santa Clara ultimately brought us that particular nest of snakes, it's important to remember that that case didn't take place in a vacuum; indeed, the decision- or rather, the statements the clerk (himself a former rail executive!) inserted into the headnotes of the case- was actually one of many the various rail companies and other large corporations were trying to obtain in order to secure rights under the Constitution they didn't already have.

It was a truly awful event in US history. Like many such, it usually goes untaught.

[NNN0LHI]

40. Turning our prison system into a for-profit industry was probably our biggest mistake

When it became profitable to incarcerate people guess what was bound to happen?

Don

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. The MIC which provides the muscle for the capitlaists.

[WinkyDink]

47. Halliburton.

[Throd]

51. The lawsuit industry

[JuniperLea]

53. It was the melange...

Between the banksters and the Wall Street investors... the credit default swaps and collateral debt vehicles... the shitty deals they were able to makeup after the demise of Glass-Steagall.

Ménage à trois, perhaps, when you consider the legislators who were also in that bed.

[deaniac21]

56. The cereal industry.

[yawnmaster]

58. Education...and science.

It has allowed us to move from a happy hunting/gathering society, to an ag based, to an industrial society.
It has enabled corporations to run off-shore business.
It has enabled inventions such as the internal combustion engine which destroyed the horse and buggy industry.
and it goes on...

[in_cog_ni_to]

60. K Street. Open door policy...pay to play. Add to that, Wall Street and the MSM. n/t

[craticdemo]

63. Oil.

For the wars which are bankrupting us, and in turn causing so many problems with things like healthcare and education.

[SomethingFishy]

64. The Military Industrial Complex.

If we spent as much money building things as we do destroying them we could probably solve most of the worlds woes.

[Fool Count]

65. Mass media and advertzoning, for turnig the US population into a pack

of brainwashed zombies who care less about their own well being and future than some quasi-religious principles
Implanted in their heads by self-serving ideologues of the 1%.

[ThomWV]

66. The communications industry, be it be commercial television or radio and of course Print.

They have failed us completely and the reason is that there is no real competition between them.

And for all those who decry the absurd expense of running a campaign these days, just where do you think it goes? TV, Radio, and Print.

[redqueen]

68. Banking/Wall Street... or media

The financial industry has the government in their control.

The media helps the corporatocracy maintain control, though... in addition to so many other evils.

It's a tough question.