How To Engage This RW Talking Point: Help Please!

[bayareamike]

Hi all,

I have a few fairly right-wing people in my family who, although they aren't bad people, rarely follow politics and really aren't paying attention. Last night one of them wanted to talk to me about how I felt about the incident that occurred at Occupy Oakland.

I kept hearing the talking point, "well the police are also part of the 99% and are just doing their jobs/trying to feed their families/etc. -- of course there are going to be unfortunate accidents/incidents like the one that involved Scott Olsen; they aren't the ones to blame!"

I'm not sure how to engage this; surely the police ARE a part of the 99% but it doesn't dismiss the inexcusable actions that have taken place not only in Oakland but in locations all around the country. How can I engage this talking point intelligently without sounding confrontational? Thanks ya'll.

- Mike

[FarLeftFist]

1. How about just arresting people non-violently like they were trained to do. Or better yet....

How about letting a non-violent peaceful protest occur because it is our goddamn Constitutional right to do so. If the cops didn't show up ZERO violence would have occurred.

[Enrique]

2. agree with them

they're right.

[bayareamike]

5. Well, I DO agree

that the police are members of the 99% but the argument dismisses the fact that the police are at fault. It's a dismissal of the brutality. So I can't agree outright given that it is an excuse for police incited violence.

[FarLeftFist]

8. Yeah and how about the fact that the RW'ers NEVER trust the Govt, unless it fits their agenda

They denounce the Govt but are quick to take the Govt's side of the story no questions asked because they hate the protestors. They're hypocrites. The cops were wearing riot gear. IF people were throwing things then arrests should have been made. Its what they're trained to do. They don't even fire tear-gas on people shooting at them with guns, just those who are throwing plastic bottles?!

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. I am sorry but the use of excessive force

And Ilegal orders should trouble you, regardless who does it.

[FarLeftFist]

3. WHO exactly were the cops even protecting?!

[CJCRANE]

4. Maybe try the personal responsibility angle...

if the police make a mistake they need to take responsibility for it, just like the banks and corporations need to own their mistakes instead of making us pay for them.

[Mz Pip]

6. They had the opportunity

to help him when he was injured but not one of them crossed the barracade to give him assistance. When the protesters ran to help him, one of the police threw one of those explosives into their crowd.

They could have helped but didn't. They just made matters worse. They are supposed to "protect and serve" but this was neither.

[kestrel91316]

7. No cop's job description includes unlawful escalation to violence where no threat

of violence exists.

And Scott Olsen was no accident. That was a point blank shooting in the head, quite deliberate, and IMHO attempted murder.

But you go right ahead supporting authoritarians who wish us all dead.

[FarLeftFist]

9. Not to mention: The Mayor apologized. It's admission of wrong-doing on their part.

[Arkansas Granny]

10. I had a conversation with my boss about this incident yesterday.

He is a good man, not particularly political, but has RW viewpoints on many issues. He hasn't been following the Occupy rallies closely, but he had heard about this and considered it to be an unfortunate accident. I asked him to think why tear gas and other riot control procedures were being used against unarmed, peaceful citizens who were exercising their First Amendment right of free speech. He had never thought about it in that context.

I think that this shows how the liberal viewpoint is very rarely discussed or explained in the MSM. Many people are unaware of the issues because they never hear an honest debate on them.

[DemocratAholic]

11. typical Republican game

it seems that you are getting caught up in the typical Republican game which uses pseudo-philosophy to confuse the issue.

you actually answered your own question..."it doesn't dismiss the inexcusable actions."

99% doesn't mean that everyone in the 99% believes the same thing, it simply refers to the number of people who are not millionaires. you can also tell your Republican family members that they too are in the 99%, it certainly doesn't mean you agree with anything they think.

i would caution you not to get caught into a trap of believing Republicans want to have serious discussion as they pretend to ask questions. whenever my republican family members try and engage me in those type of conversations, i simply tell them i don't want to waste my time talking with devil worshipers.

[CJCRANE]

12. Ask them: Do tea party protesters have a right to freedom of speech?

What about everyone else?

[libertypirate]

14. I used the justified force motivation

Was it justified for the cops to use force against the 99% of the crowd doing nothing wrong?

The police were not concerned that non-lethal weapons cause harm to people. There is a problem when our society is trying to justify harming people because someone is just doing their job. No citizen in this country should be afforded such an illegitimate excuse to cause harm to others. Either the cops were in imminent bodily danger from a large portion of the crowd. Or the cops fucked up royally. I know where I stand and it is not with a cops who think harming non-violent people is doing their job.

Oh and I have yet to see a picture of a bludgeoned bleeding cop. That would give the cops something to stand on.

[Fire Walk With Me]

15. They do not yet KNOW they are part of the 99%, and are still following orders from the 1%.

As the #WallStreet sign said, they're one layoff away from marching with us.

[MannyGoldstein]

16. Show them the video of Olsen getting shot

and the aftermath where the police threw explosives at rescuers.

I don't believe that anyone can watch that and believe the cops were just feeding their families.

[Jumping John]

17. Never is it a cop's job or duty to lob a tear gas grenade at people who are gathered around

the injured in an attempt to help a wounded marine veteran who is lying unresponsive on the street of Oakland.

Nor is it any cop's duty or job to shoot a rubber bullet into the side of a person that is trying to move the wounded marine veteran to safety.

But that is what the cop's in Oakland did.