Thank goodness for health insurance

[negativenihil]

Good morning DU!

This morning as I am sitting here, writing a couple checks to a few local hospitals, I find myself very thankful that I have health insurance.

Back at the end of September, I unfortunately had a minor stroke. (I am better now, been through a physical therapy program and completed it ahead of schedule - this isn't a thread trolling for sympathy! I'm doing awesome and have already recovered 99.9% with no real lingering after-effects! DO NOT WORRY ABOUT ME!)

After a trip to one ER and a 2 day stay in a big hospital - without insurance I'd be on the hook for something in the ballpark of $50,000. With insurance? I'm on the hook for $300 total. This is a $300 check i am more than happy to write.

If anyone is reading this who CHOOSES to not carry health insurance (esp. the younger DUers - I'm only 31!), I hope that this helps you to see how terribly costly these out of the blue things can be. It's worth EVERY cent.

[ananda]

1. I don't think people choose not to carry health insurance.

Many millions of people simply can't afford it.

[SkyDaddy7]

12. It is BOTH...Some can't afford it but many CHOOSE...

not to buy it, especially young people who think they are invincible...I know I was one of those ignorant youths who thought he was invincible...I got lucky & did not need it.

However, when I was older (30yrs old) & got married my wife & I began paying for health insurance & BAM I suffered a spinal cord injury...8 months into the worst nightmare of my life my insurance company, PRINCIPAL INSURANCE, dropped me!

Until the new health care law is fully implemented the case could be made why pay for health insurance if chances are you will be dropped when you do need it.

[sammytko]

49. Yes, I know several people who can afford it, but choose not to

One is a teacher with a master's degree. She pays for her and her kids through the school, but balks at the added expense to insufe her self-employed farmer husband. It makes no sense at all to me, especially when you are driving around in a new fully loaded Lincoln Navigator.

One farm accident and there you go - in the poor house.

[girl gone mad]

100. Odds are she would end up in the poor house either way.

Most medical-related bankruptcies are filed by people who have health insurance.

[OneGrassRoot]

2. I'm glad you're well and that you had a positive experience...

with both insurance and with the healthcare system.

As you must well know, that is becoming a rare experience.

The ability to afford decent insurance coverage is becoming a thing of the past -- for all ages, but especially if you're over 30.

It's also becoming a thing of the past for the insurance companies to actually COVER expenses to a degree that doesn't lead to financial devastation for the "insured."

:(

[izquierdista]

3. Chooses?

Some of us make that choice because we would rather have food, clothing, shelter, you know, those things that take away from what we can contribute to insurance company profits.

[trumad]

4. You left out a key part...

What do you pay per month.

The average policy for a family of 4 is around 1000.00 per month depending on your employer and health plan.

It's simply to much money for people to afford in lower income brackets.

Everyone wants health insurance---not everyone can afford it.

[negativenihil]

5. no idea honestly

It's part of my benefit package from my job. I'm a married guy, no kids - wife has her on insurance through her job.

The reason i posted this was rooted in the fact that my brother in law has several friends who opt out of getting insurance because they too see it as some silly monthly cost from their paychecks. They can't be the only people who feel this way...

[rfranklin]

6. You're right--that''s Russian roulette...

But the fact that so many do not have that option or that it is more than can be realistically deducted from the paycheck is one the great disgraces of this nation.

[Fumesucker]

16. Why bother posting if you don't have all the facts?

It's your own situation and you really should have anticipated the question of how much your insurance costs..

I actually see you as part of the problem, your don't even know how much your own insurance costs.

[raccoon]

21. +100. nt

[SammyWinstonJack]

22. What you said!

:thumbsup:

[negativenihil]

23. really?

It's a part of my benefit package form my job - why should I keep track of what it costs every month? It's really of no concern to me.

Anyway - I'm sorry that my attempt to share some good news with DU has offended you so much. Please forgive me.

[Fumesucker]

26. Because it's a totally obvious question..

It may not be of concern to you but it's damn sure of concern to those of us who cannot afford insurance.

[girl gone mad]

110. Then your entire premise is flawed.

You could have come out ahead saving and investing your money all these years and paying out of pocket for your care rather than using a middle man. We'll never know, I guess.

[dembotoz]

7. this is the way it is supposed to be

you get sick
you go to the doctor or hospital
you get better
you go back to being productive
you do not have to file for bankruptcy and loose all your savings

i am VERY happy about how it worked out for u
wish your outcome was more common

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hobbit709]

9. You got off cheap.

a friend of mine had a stroke last spring. He had insurance-what there was of it. His expenses are about $5000 even after insurance paid most of it.

When my wife died two years ago, I was still billed for $1500 total that her insurance didn't cover.

My neighbor had to shell out $5000 out of pocket for her hip replacement surgery that her crappy insurance-which costs her $800/mo(which happens to be 40% of her paycheck)-didn't cover.

[negativenihil]

15. I sure did!

In more way than one. Above all else, im just happy to still be alive.

[Bonhomme Richard]

10. If you didn't have insurance it would probably cost way over 50K..

That's assuming that the 50K is what the insurance company paid. If that's the case they are paying a contractual amount where you would have no contract and you would be charged full amount for everything.

[strategery blunder]

11. This year's health insurance premium increase came out of my FOOD budget.

I'm 26. I held on to the health insurance I had for as long as I could, but 15% increases per year are only sustainable for so long, especially with $400 a month in student loan payments and vastly underemployed.

I had the choice between either cancelling it and continuing to eat, or keeping it and using it as I started to experience symptoms of malnourishment down the line. :x Even if I went to eating beans and ramen to pare down my food budget, I'd still be at the same decision next year when the premium went up again. Or the year after that. The current system is unsustainable, even for us young folk.

I'm glad you dodged a bullet. Not all of us are so fortunate to be able to keep good insurance.

Occupy.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mmonk]

14. Triple the cost and be denied benefits due to age and will you be so

happy with private health insurance? I am in no man's land. Should my cost be more for less? Your insurance company I'm sure thinks so. Remember that as you age or encounter more sickness.

[Tatiana]

17. Virtually no one CHOOSES not to carry health insurance.

It is a financial decision made based upon the astronomical costs that keep rising. People can't afford it. If it comes down to a choice between food, electricity, housing, transportation costs, or daycare people are going to pay those immediate expenses first.

I'm glad you have health insurance. Even better would be a national plan that covers everyone so that we could bring some of these overpriced costs down.

It may not have been your intention, but this post read a lot like rubbing salt into the wounds of those who are unfortunate enough NOT to have health insurance.

[Safetykitten]

18. Thank you. You are much kinder than I, as my response to this would be deleted.

[TBF]

67. My response WAS deleted -

OP did enough intentional name-calling to get the post deleted. Savvy ...

[negativenihil]

25. hah

"It may not have been your intention, but this post read a lot like rubbing salt into the wounds of those who are unfortunate enough NOT to have health insurance."

This boggles my mind. I survive a stroke, and share with DU how happy I am to have health insurance and how it helped me...

and it's seen as rubbing salt in someone's wounds.

I'm sorry my post has offended you so much. I'll refrain from sharing in the future.

[liberalhistorian]

Excuse me, but hubby and I do not CHOOSE

to go without health insurance, nor would we. But our employment doesn't offer insurance and our ages (both over forty, he in his late fifties) make any individual plan prohibitively expensive with horrendous deductibles (the cheapest being $5,000), despite the fact that we're both healthy with no major issues and no history of any major illnesses.

Another thing is that you must have a better plan than what most people are offered, because most people with insurance would have paid a helluva lot more in co-pays and deductibles, often to the tune of several thousand dollars that the hospital usually wants ASAP, regardless of circumstances. That is, if you could even get the company to cover it, they're good at finding ways to not have to fulfill their responsibilities. Oh, and be prepared-now that you've actually utilized their "services" and have cost them money, they will find a way to deep-six you or not cover other things, and if you need to switch companies-good luck getting insurance then.

Here are your reins, you can climb back up on your high horse now.

[negativenihil]

24. well then

clearly the line where I call out people who CHOOSE to go without health coverage was not aimed at you...

I'm sorry my post offended you so much. I was only attempting to share something positive with DU. I'll know better next time.

[PassingFair]

47. Funny really...

considering your DU name.

[Obamanaut]

105. Many people did not read the last two lines of the OP. In the event someone

chooses not to insure, then this suggestion is for them - from the OP "...If anyone is reading this who CHOOSES to not carry health insurance..."

For all others, this does not apply.

[raccoon]

19. Do you have insurance through your employer, or an individual plan?

Because individual plans are very expensive, have huge deductibles, and include riders
on their policies for pre-existing conditions.

I have such a policy.

[negativenihil]

20. through my employer n/t

[JoePhilly]

27. You're getting flamed unfairly I think.

My reading of your OP is this ...

You're relatively young (31). Your job provides a health care benefit. You CHOOSE to purchase health care insurance through your company. The premium comes out of your paycheck each month. You don't know the exact amount, but its not a burden. You just had a major medical event. It would have wiped you out. Based on this experience, you recommend others who are in a situation like yours (young, healthy, and have ability to purchase insurance), CHOOSE to purchase health care.

I don't think there is anything in your OP calling out those who don't have insurance because they can't afford it. Nor do you appear to be claiming that they have made a bad choice.

The reality is that those who can't afford insurance don't really have a meaningful choice in the first place. So by my reading, that's not who you are talking to. You are talking to those who do have a choice. They could afford it, and choose not to have it.

And your getting flamed for it.

Oh well, if there is an unfair flamming, it must be (as you note), Monday morning on DU.

:shrug:

[negativenihil]

29. THANK YOU!

You got my point. Thank you a million times!

[JoePhilly]

39. DU could make a fortune selling fire insurance ... or flame retardant keyboards.

Oh ... also glad to hear you are OK. I too have had the good fortune of being able to maintain a good insurance plan, and its saved me a fortune over the year. So anytime some one who I know could afford it says "Eh ... I don't need it" ... I start to show them scars, telling them the age I was when I got them, and then attaching a price tag to each one as I go.

As an aside ... I found it ironic that so many compassionate liberals thought flaming a recent stroke victim was a fun way to start the week.

Gotta love this place!!!

:rofl:

[Fumesucker]

31. He doesn't even know how much his insurance costs..

The very definition of clueless.

[Robb]

36. Do *you* know how much his insurance costs?

:D

[Fumesucker]

44. I don't recall saying I did..

;)

[JoePhilly]

37. That doesn't matter ... here is why.

If you set aside your flamethrower for a second ...

He doesn't know how much he pays because its not a burden on him. That's part of his point.

Folks who are younger and see themselves as fairly healthy, often make the decision to not carry insurance based primarily on the fact that they are "young and healthy". They don't even look into it. Some, like the OP, get it without looking into it much too. Its a quick, binary decision.

So some think "I'm healthy, so I don't need insurance" ... and THEY don't know how much it would cost either. They just say "Na ... don't need it." without really looking into it. And because nothing bad has ever happened to them, they don't really understand how expensive it might be IF something serious was to happen.

They aren't making the decision based on the specific amount of money it would cost.

And I think that's his point.

But you should feel free to call him names. Flame on.

[OneGrassRoot]

40. While I hear what you are saying, JoePhilly....

I see it differently.

I've tried not to "flame" him but instead have tried to explain why his post came across as upsetting and/or offensive, and why he is experiencing so much push-back from a post he, reportedly, intended to simply share good news.

And, most of us, I do believe, ARE glad anyone is well and is well without extraordinary financial consequence to them personally.

If someone posts here or any message board devoted to a particular overall viewpoint (Democratic, progressive), they need to take responsibility for being aware of the general tone of discussion.

His post fell short because he was intending it for such a small minority of people in this country, most DEFINITELY a small minority here, and he should have realized that.

It was a naive post that is getting push-back.

He is handling it just fine. If anyone were truly upset that they were being flamed, they'd back away and let a post fall into oblivion. He seems to enjoy the interaction, though still doesn't seem to understand why so many took exception to his post.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[OneGrassRoot]

45. It is a shame that his personal event took a back seat ...

I agree with that.

And once again, I'll express how glad I am he is well and intact in all ways after such an intense experience. I'm glad he had good healthcare and the resources so that the financial aspect wasn't an issue for him.

:)

[Fumesucker]

46. He posted on a forum in which facts are important..

And left out what is possibly the most important fact regarding his post.

Then when called about leaving out the fact he says he doesn't even know.

You are making a lot of assumptions about people, I'm going on what was in the OP, a distinct lack of important facts.

[negativenihil]

55. So you want a photocopy of my pay stub?

Maybe then we can get to the bottom of this?

Sheesh.

[Fumesucker]

61. Why so defensive?

If you have read here much you know there's a lot of us that don't have insurance, you know the cost of it is a lightning rod for negative emotions.

Your handle should give you at least a small clue.

[negativenihil]

65. what?

You have flamed me several times... railing on the fact that I simply don't know how much my company supplied insurance costs... and wonder why I'm so defensive?

Seriously?

[Fumesucker]

68. If you think I've flamed you then you are sadly mistaken..

All I have done is pointed out that you came here bragging about how great your insurance is without even knowing what it costs.

That's not flaming, that's dealing with facts.

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[negativenihil]

64. You're a smart one!

Not really, but yeah...

By all means, block/ignore me if you really feel I'm a paid shill. No skin off my back.

[Pithlet]

94. They think they're healthy so they don't need insurance

But why are they forgoing it? Because it's bloody expensive, that's why. Have you been paying attention to the current crop of youth and how underemployed the majority of them are? They're graduating from college with massive debt and no jobs and going back to live with mom and dad. Many are lucky enough to be able to stay on mom and dad's insurance. BUt if they can't? I'm sure they're indeed rationalizing it with young and healthy. But the majority of the time it isn't because they could easily afford it otherwise.

[TBF]

48. Of course it is. I'll be looking for your pro-insurance post sometime this week.

Make sure to include all the elements:

* major unexpected expense
* reasonable premiums
* personal responsibility

Make sure to not include:

* any mention of single payer

[JoePhilly]

83. Single payer would be a much better system. Since we don't have it yet ...

what should he do, not purchase it via his company's plan?

[TBF]

97. Of course not - what he could do is have some empathy for others as opposed

to romanticizing the insurance companies in his OP. If the post had simply reflected being grateful for having insurance and getting well, and pointing out how it is ridiculous that others don't have the same, I could've believed that. Instead it was a missive against those who supposedly "could buy insurance but don't". That's a meme my friend, and quite carefully crafted. I don't believe he had a stroke, rather his sole purpose in writing the thread was to get his "could buy insurance but don't" point across.

Several folks disagreed with him & he persisted in name-calling to get many of those posts deleted. Very obvious...

[Ishoutandscream2]

28. I am very happy for you!

Sorry about all the terrible responses. This is DU after all.

[negativenihil]

30. Thank you!

Thank you for your kind words :)

[Ishoutandscream2]

34. Oh, and by the way, THANK GOD YOU'RE OKAY!

You just had a life threatening experience. I thought a democratic message board would be compassionate and giving you well wishes after what must have been a harrowing experience.

But, again, this is DU.

[negativenihil]

35. I am thankful

...for each and every day since. I am really looking forward to seeing the entire family over Thanksgiving this week. At the end of the day this entire situation could have been so much worse, but I got lucky and then some.

Hope you have a great holiday :)

[Brickbat]

32. Glad it worked out for you, and I'm sorry you're getting flamed.

Everyone gets the torch at least once around here.

ETA: When I had health insurance through my employer, I didn't know off the top of my head how much was being deducted from my check. Mr. Brickbat knows to the cent how much he pays in health insurance, but that's because he's heavily involved in his union and knows the breakdown very well. I don't think it's that unusual not to know -- or if someone doesn't know, I don't think it's a sign that they're clueless. It's certainly a privilege, and god forbid anyone show any of that around here.

[negativenihil]

33. Thanks!

I appreciate the kind words :)

[libinnyandia]

38. I am relatively new to DU (though not new to the

progressive movement which I've supported for over 40 years) and I was surprised how negative people could be here. I am glad you were fortunate to survive your health problem without it destroying your life. The people on DU should be directing their anger to the GOP and the people who vote for them, some of whom vote out of ignorance but all too many seeming to despise all 99%ers. Good luck.

[Ishoutandscream2]

52. They're are some good people, and some really hateful ones

The things said about the south and the state of Texas are so narrow-minded and bigoted. What I have learned is to call them on it, and get in their cyber face if you know what I mean. The only thing some can understand here is to be called on their hatefulness, and unfortunately, the only thing they understand is throwing hatefulness right back at them.

Don't back down. Don't let anyone bully you here. And be proud of who you are, what your beliefs are, and where you are from. You will be fine.

[TBF]

50. The issue is NOT that he doesn't know his exact deduct -

the problem is the obvious post in favor of for profit health care with no sensitivity to the fact that many on this board have no insurance or health care (especially if they are unemployed).

Sane people with any consideration for others are looking for single-payer at this point, not romanticizing their for-profit insurance carrier. But I can see from the responses in this thread that I was dead-on about this being the issue of the week. All the centrists are coming out in support of the insurance companies. No surprises here.

[negativenihil]

53. again

You have read WAY too much into my post. I am not in favor of for profit health care as you've so kindly said. I am thankful for the health coverage I have, but that in NO WAY means I do not support single payer or reform in general.

You assume too much with too little information.

[TBF]

57. Oh save it. I'll be looking for your post advocating single payer. I'm sure I will not see it.

nt

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Fumesucker]

58. You have the lack of information in your OP to thank for that..

I'm having a hard time believing that you didn't realize you would be asked what your insurance costs.

To those without insurance or with crappy insurance they can't afford to use that's the very first question that comes to mind.

BTW, I'm really glad for you that you will be OK and got the help you needed, I don't think anyone here begrudges you that, mostly we would like to be able to share your good fortune.

[Name removed]

62. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Fumesucker]

66. A lot of us here are considerably older than you..

And a lot of the more regular posters are out of work, jobless.

For myself it's been five years since I had health insurance and slightly longer since I've seen a doctor.

If I have a stroke I expect to die with at best minimal care.

[Brickbat]

93. Huh. I read a lot of gratitude for "insurance," not "for-profit insurance."

You're cracking me up.

[TBF]

96. You think it's funny that folks can't afford health care, and that people file

for bankruptcy because they can't pay their medical bills? I don't find it humorous at all. I find it a sad commentary on our society that so much wealth is concentrated in the hands of so few. YMMV.

[Brickbat]

117. No, I think it's funny that you're reading the most outlandish things into what I and other people

write.

[TBF]

121. Yes it's completely outlandish to want health care for all. I'm completely insane

for thinking that would be a good thing. I'll try praying to my Ayn Rand statue to see if I can become more "sensible".

:eyes:

[stillwaiting]

42. I'm very happy that you had such a positive experience dealing with such a horrible situation.

I think after reading this thread that the problem with the OP lies in not addressing your audience appropriately.

Many of us here on DU are acutely aware (many through our own personal experiences) how insurance companies treat so many of us. Also, being mostly liberal/progressive minded, others of us don't have to have something happen directly to us before we know something's wrong with the system. When something is clearly wrong with the system we're not likely to blame the individual victims for their financial disasters and health care catastrophes due to our grossly inadequate system. After reading your comments in this thread it is clear that you favor single payer which is fantastic.

Just keep in mind that your experience with our health care system is from a very privileged place. You receive a fantastic benefits package through your employer, and if I were to guess you probably don't pay too much towards your own insurance premiums. This would be another huge perk for you which certainly must be very nice, and unfortunately is becoming rarer and rarer in this country.

Be grateful for what you have (I'm pretty sure you are) and maybe going forward you might present this information in a way that shows that you know you are lucky and that you also know that many, many Americans do not get treated this way within our current health care system. Even WITH health insurance. After all, a majority of individuals who end up declaring medical bankruptcy HAVE health insurance.

I'm thankful to have you on our side in supporting single payer, and again, I'm glad things worked out so well for you. Unfortunately, many individuals that buy health insurance (especially on the individual market) would not have such a positive experience. The evidence lies in the comments to your OP.

[dawg]

43. Sorry you've tapped into so much bitterness.

I'm glad you were able to make it through this bad situation without being financially devastated.

Just remember that you are truly one of the lucky ones. Few employers offer benefits that generous. And more employers drop coverage or reduce benefits each year.

Some even have the money to pay for insurance, but cannot get coverage because of pre-existing conditions. We've done something about that, but they are threatening to take even that small reform away.

You were lucky. Many people are bitter because they were not.

[TBF]

54. "Many people are bitter because they were not" - such a heap of BS.

My family and I are close to the top 1% and we have major medical. We also pay for that so-called "privilege" at a higher rate in order to subsidize lower-income employees. Our premiums are over 1K a month.

I am not "bitter" - I have excellent coverage and doctors. And I STILL think the system should go because IT IS NOT ALL ABOUT ME. The majority of folks in this country do not have the care I do and it is wrong that so many don't even have a chance to have health care. Their sole choice is to show up in the emergency room when they are sick and hope to be seen.

If I could only advocate for one issue this is the one I would pick. It's absolutely embarrassing that our country has so much wealth and it is concentrated in the hands of so few. In the case of health care this leads to people dying - often through no fault of their own if they unexpectedly lose a job or a serious illness wipes out their savings.

[dawg]

70. A heap of bullshit? Really?

I'm not as lucky as the OP. I have major medical with a $10K deductible.

And I'm bitter about it.

I just didn't feel the need to direct my bitterness toward the OP.

I'm just curious as to why you feel I'm wrong to say that people are bitter because of the shitty hand they've been dealt by the U.S. healthcare system?

You may not be bitter, but I sure as hell am.

[Ishoutandscream2]

72. Excellent response!

I'm lucky to have health insurance, but shitty. I would have to be paying much more than the OP. But I'm happy for his circumstance, and grateful he's okay. The venom on this thread is just so DU.

[JanMichael]

76. "The venom on this thread" pretty much reflects the mood of much of the

country right now; many of whom are out in the streets with OWS. I wish I could take time off and be out there with them.

[Ishoutandscream2]

89. No, disagree

The venom should not be directed at someone who is definitely not in the top 1 percent, as the OP is obviously not. There needs to be a fight for change, and yes, for single payer. I am happy that the OP was able to get the help he needed. Instead of attacking him, I congratulate him and wish him continued good health. Why in the world couldn't some of the others here do the same? I think that's a very sad statement on DU, and yet, pretty damned typical.

[OneGrassRoot]

92. Beyond the reasons already stated (salt in a wound, naivete, etc.)...

Another reason so many react strongly is when they/we -- rightly or wrongly -- perceive someone's post as playing in with right-wing talking points.

It doesn't mean a poster intends something that way at all, but if it reads that way, we feel it's harmful to what is put "out there," as we work so hard to show that the vast majority of people struggling aren't lazy, aren't all young, didn't make poor choices, etc.

It's unfortunate when an OP unintentionally goes off the rails, but that's nothing new here. I don't always agree with it, but I can see how it happened very clearly in this case. I can wish him well and be glad for him, while also clearly seeing the push-back to his post.

[TBF]

98. The OP very clearly came here to talk about his "friends who could buy insurance but choose not to"

I don't believe he had a stroke or any of the rest of his tale. This was a concocted story to garner sympathy and spread his propaganda. I will save my sympathy for the folks in this country who don't have health insurance and cannot afford it or any health care. We need single payer now, not flowery OPs about the beauty of for-profit health insurance companies.

It is just sickening that I have to explain this on a supposedly democratic party site.

[TBF]

102. Sometimes 99%ers (or 53%ers as the case may be) fight for the

talking points of the right wing. I think we should point out the fallacies of right wing arguments. YMMV.

[girl gone mad]

103. The OP went out of his or her way to attack others..

insinuating they were making an irrational and irresponsible choice in not carrying health insurance.

I went without health insurance for over a decade and I assure you that my decision was well-considered.

[Ishoutandscream2]

115. "Went out of his way to attack others..."

Wow, I did not see it that way at all.

[Pithlet]

116. What do you think all the deleted posts and subthreads are about n/t

[Ishoutandscream2]

118. Not certain. But I sure as heck would be shocked

to be attacked over personal good news, especially when it comes to my health. Maybe, just maybe, if a few more would have said something to the effect, "Thank goodness you're okay" instead of showing disdain, then there may not have been these deleted threads. Again, DU can just be incredible.

[Pithlet]

120. Right. It was his good news he was attacked for.

Not his views that people simply choose not to be insured, and further down the thread (since deleted) that if they were employed better maybe they could get if if they wanted. Sure. People don't like good news at DU. I guess it's just my imagination when OTHER DUers post their good fortune, and DUers are wonderful and supporting. Right.

[Quantess]

51. I feel lucky to not have to worry about health care.

You see, I live in Sweden. In fact, earlier today I told a Swede about my American friend who works, has health care, and needs a double masectomy for her breast cancer. Even though she has insurance, she's looking forward to owing $40,000 in medical bills. And yes, I am sure she is happy she won't be owing a lot more than that.

[stillwaiting]

56. I love your country more than words can say.

The Scandinavian countries are as close to heaven on earth as I can imagine pertaining to how a society is run and the prevailing and majority opinions of most citizens regarding their own society.

You're very lucky!

[Quantess]

88. Yes, I do feel lucky.

Most doctor visits cost a little money (about $20 to $25) but I hear that having a baby or a fixing a broken arm gives you a bill of 0.00
I've gone to the general practitioner a couple of times here. The first time, I got an appointment that day, and the other time I waited 2 or 3 days for my appointment.
Some people choose ;) to buy dental insurance or insurance to get them into specialists faster, but you can certainly get along fine without it.

I don't want it to seem like I'm "rubbing it in" by mentioning the health care system here, but people need to know that the USA health care model royally sucks in some ways, and that other countries do it better. I only mention it to remind people that the USA's model is not even close to being the best, and that Americans should demand better.

:)

[TBF]

60. SINGLE PAYER NOW

Fuck the "for-private health insurance" meme.

God the right wing pisses me off.

[Diclotican]

69. negativenihil

negativenihil

I'm thankfully I have a public health care system, where I can get the healt care for free - even tho I pay a little more taxes than I might have been doing without it.

And I have been in the hospital a few times the last couple of years - and never paid a dime for it - because I had already paid for the privilege by my taxes...

But, it is good that you are better, and that you are not ruined by your hospital stay - so many americans it sound can say goodby to a safe economical life.. Often for many years to came...

Diclotican

[Ishoutandscream2]

75. So happy to see you Diclotican

Your friendly responses are a breath of fresh air.

[Diclotican]

95. Ishoutandscream2

Ishoutandscream2

I try to write friendly, even when the other guy sometimes are not polite... Some even put me on ignore.. Oh wel I don't care..

Diclotican

[JackDragna]

71. Health insurance is pretty awesome.

Now, let's make sure everyone has it and those who provide cannot do hideous things to their customers.

[Pithlet]

73. I think if you'd left off the last part about people choosing to buy health insurance

You wouldn't be getting the pile on you're getting right now. Because that made you come off extremely clueless and out of touch. Anyone who thinks there's a significant number of people merely blithely choosing not to buy insurance is clueless. It could easily be interpreted instead as a rub, by people who think "No one could be that clueless!" You walked into a hornets nest with that, I'm sorry.

[JanMichael]

77. and then piled on with not even having a clue

as to how much it costs his/her employer, or how much comes out of the paycheck. That didn't help too much either while so many people are trying to figure out food/heating/keep the damned car running right now.

[Pithlet]

79. But everyone on DU are just bitter meanies for pointing it out.

It's crazy.

[Name removed]

80. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TBF]

109. Perhaps clueless -

but that's a pretty obvious FAUX news talking point. Honestly, how many dems do you know that sit around praising health insurance companies? My family is fortunate that we have coverage and can afford it, but we would switch to single payer in a heartbeat.

And even if you are a capitalist and enjoy your health care, why rub it in the faces of so many who are unemployed and/or unable to purchase any insurance or healthcare? That is very insensitive to say the least.

[Pithlet]

112. Well, I did post that awhile and a deleted subthread ago

I'm not so sure about clueless anymore

[TBF]

113. If I could change only one thing about this country it would be switching us all

to a single payer system (well, that would be second to getting rid of capitalism, but assuming all I could make is a policy change). People are dying because they can't afford health care ...

[JanMichael]

74. I doubt your friends CHOOSE not to have healthy insurance; they probably

can't afford it, despite what you think you might know about them, where they live or what they drive...

[negativenihil]

78. Really?

This is what you had to add to this conversation?

These are people who actually refuse the standard health care offered by their employer. These are people who worship at the altar of rush and hannity and see their lack of insurance as a badge of honor. These people make 6 figures and can afford it easily. They simply choose not to because they feel young and invincible.

Do me a favor - Don't assume anything about anyone you don't know directly, and I'll keep doing the same.

[JanMichael]

81. We live in an area of seriously wealthy people..old money...

lots of "young people" making six figures...sitting around listening to Rush and Hannity and in debt to their eyeballs. They can't afford insurance. Your "friends" might not be able to have that deducted from their checks either...and brag about it to save face. You have no idea... any more than I do. You don't even know how much you pay.

[negativenihil]

84. Whatever

You've got this topic so twisted to fit your view there's nothing i can say.

Have a great day!

[Pithlet]

82. Yeah. Ad they are vastly outnumbered by those who can't afford it.

It's as if you were shining your Mercedes out in the general public. And you loudly announce "Gee, I don't know how anyone couldn't choose to buy one of these babies!" And then couldn't understand why you got nasty reactions. Your proclaiming "Hey, if you can't afford it, I obviously didn't mean you!" probably wouldn't do much to smooth anyone over then either, and I'm sure the other Mercedes drivers would soothe you with "Hey, never mind them, they're just bitter and jealous..."

[court jester]

85. Obama explained it pretty well during the Campaign a few times

Here he is on the Ellen show:

Obama: "Well, obviously I think that they represented her position properly which is that she supported in the past NAFTA, which has been pretty hard on Ohio, and we’ve had an ongoing discussion about healthcare. Both of us want to provide healthcare to all Americans. There’s a slight difference, and her plan is a good one.

But, she mandates that everybody buy healthcare. She’d have the government force that every individual buy insurance and I don’t have such a mandate because

>>>I don’t think the problem is that people don’t want health insurance, it’s that they can’t afford it.<<<

I focus more on lowering costs. This is a modest difference. But, it’s one that she’s (Hillary) tried to elevate, arguing that because I don’t force people to buy healthcare that I’m not insuring everybody.

If things were that easy, I could mandate everybody to buy a house, and that would solve the problem of homelessness. It doesn’t. But this is a philosophical disagreement that we have and it’s one that we’re going to continue to talk about. Overall though, as you said (Ellen), this has been a relatively clean campaign. I have enormous respect for Senator Clinton and I’m looking forward to working with her to make sure that Democrats win in November..."

Here's the Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9R-z-fFnuh0

See, I believed him and I supported him over Hillary because of this very thing. There was not much difference otherwise, IMO.

So maybe you can see why some of us feel kind of duped.

I'm sincerely glad everything worked out for you

[raccoon]

86. Oh, and if you had an individual policy, they probably would've dropped you like a hot potato

after your minor stroke.

[RebelOne]

87. I am fortunate to have Medicare.

But it still costs me, but it is less than if I had private insurance. Out of a $1,400 monthly SS check, I have to pay $110.

[TBF]

99. I wish we all would have medicare - it may not be perfect but one system that

we could all pay into (perhaps sliding scale based upon our incomes?) would be much more humane and fair to all. It seems that it could be much more efficient in terms of paperwork and of course we wouldn't have the profit motive on top of actual cost.

[City Lights]

90. Congratulations!

Your inexpensive experience is rare. Did you have a deductible you needed to meet before your coverage kicked in?

I'm glad you're recovering. You should be thankful not just for health insurance, for the health insurance you have. It sounds outstanding. Many of us with health insurance wouldn't get off as cheaply as you did. Our plan has a $1,500 deductible per person, and I have yet to file a claim that was paid for as invoiced by the doctor. My health insurance company always excludes stuff that must be paid out of pocket.

A few years ago we were insured by a different company and my son ended up in the hospital. By the time we met the deductible and paid for all the crap they wouldn't cover, we were on the hook for $7,000.

You are very fortunate to have that kind of coverage.

Hope your recovery continues. :-)

[LWolf]

91. Yes. Thank goodness that my employer pays enough

every month to pay a mortgage so that I can pay more premiums, and then pay more deductibles, and co-pays to get actual care.

Thank goodness it only cost me $250 to treat my case of shingles last month; $250 which came out of my grocery budget, since there's nothing left over in my budget for actual care after I pay my part of the premium.

It's a damned good thing I know how to survive on a minimal food budget.

[renate]

101. I haven't read this whole thread (the first time I've ever posted without reading everything)

I feel really bad that you shared some good advice and some good news and, basically, described the way health insurance ought to be for everyone who has it, and got flamed (by some, not all). Obviously you had absolutely no intention making anybody feel bad about their lack of coverage--you were just warning even the younger members here that the unexpected sometimes happens.

I do also understand where those who say your post was like rubbing salt in the wound. You went through an ordeal that is the worst nightmare of somebody without insurance--something that probably is in the backs of their minds all the time and keeps them up at night sometimes. So I can see how your post could be taken the wrong way. However, I also think your thread is a little bit like the "I found a job" threads we are all so genuinely happy to see--good news for one DU member is something for all of us to be happy about. I don't remember seeing anybody who's unemployed flaming somebody who shared good news about getting a job; I think those without insurance are actually angry at the powers that be that make it so damn difficult to get it, and rightly so, needless to say.

I remember having insurance like yours, not that long ago. It really is the way it ought to be, in any civilized nation and, if that's not how a certain nation decides to run things, for anybody who pays an enormous percentage of their income for insurance. My family is sort of in between--paying a lot for our insurance, but with a huge deductible; one that would hurt if we had to pay it, but we wouldn't lose our house. However, I miss the days of not giving a visit to the doctor a second thought, with no worries about what would be covered and what wouldn't. It's the way health care ought to be, so people don't postpone care because they're afraid to look after their health.

Congratulations on your recovery--that is fantastic news--and I'm really happy for you that you don't have financial worries hanging over your head as a result of an unexpected crisis like that. I hope, and I know you do too, that someday your story is no longer unusual. :hug:

[TBF]

What you missed before OP's edit -

one of the main points in his OP (where he changed the wording) - was that he had friends who chose not to buy insurance even though it was available. That set me off - and others as well - because it is a quite common right wing meme that there are supposedly all these folks out there who are eligible to buy insurance but "choose" not to. I don't think that is the case at all. There may be a few in that boat, but for most folks these days insurance is very expensive and they are lucky if they can even afford the deductibles/copays.

[Pithlet]

108. And then there were the comment about all the unemployed DUers

and the DUers who must work fast food. Charming, huh?

[girl gone mad]

104. ""Obviously you had absolutely no intention making anybody feel bad about their lack of coverage"

How is that obvious?

[Broderick]

107. I am getting killed because of surgery I recently had

and I am in collections with three entities because of it. I have insurance. It costs me 1000 a month for the family. Even with coverage, one can go broke. My bills are up to 5000 plus.

[Obamanaut]

106. It appears from many of the responses that not everyone read the last two lines of the

OP.

"...If anyone is reading this who CHOOSES to not carry health insurance..."

For anyone else - no insurance for any other reason - this suggestion obviously does not apply.

[TBF]

119. You didn't read his original last sentence before the edit this morning. nt

[ThomWV]

111. Last week, on monday alone, I ran up nearly a quarter million dollar medical bill

Who can be without insurance? No one.

[DiverDave]

114. 10 days room and board=130K

In 05 I was hospitalized for pneumonia, that 130,000 was just for the bed and food. And as I recall (dimly, as I was hallucinating the first couple of days) I didn't eat much at all.
My total bill was 310K.
(Or there abouts, I forget the actual figure)
I joke that all the nurses and doctors could have went to club med for that much.

Helping to pay for the indigent is the reason it was so high.
We need single-payer, NOW!

Oh, on edit, I think I paid 150 for the whole thing.

Thank god (or whoever is up there) I had insurance

[TBF]

122. Interesting and apropos article Truth-out published today on the health care industry -

The Health Care Industry's Stranglehold on Congress
Monday 21 November 2011
by: Wendell Potter, iWatch News | Op-Ed

Special interests target the independent board that may be the last best hope for Medicare reform.

One of the reasons why Congress has been largely unable to make the American health care system more efficient and equitable is because of the stranglehold lobbyists for special interests have on the institution.

More here -- http://www.truth-out.org/health-care-industrys-stranglehold-congress/1321907388