Wow... 'The Blue Collar Life' - FDL

[WillyT]

The Blue Collar Life
By: wavpeac
Friday January 21, 2011 7:10 am

<snip>

This morning my husband got up at 5:00 a.m. to work outside in 7 degree F temperatures. He sat on the end of the couch, head in his hands sipping his coffee telling me how much he hates his job. How much it’s wearing him out. He makes $29.00 dollars an hour. Roughly $60,000 a year. He’s a union electrician. His health care premiums come out of his pay check; it is NOT subsidized by his “company.” His disability comes out of his pay check. It is NOT subsidized by his company.

I don’t think most people understand this about the unions. These men get paid what they do because they are subsidizing their own care. Men in suits thinks he makes too much money. Men in suits think he doesn’t deserve health care or disability, that he’s just a body to use and abuse.

They tell the men to talk about safety on their own time, not to take up time they could be “producing” to discuss “safety issues”. They don’t want to spend money on his safety or breaks for his aching back or freezing fingers. My husband worries if he takes too much time to warm up that they might lay him off. The men in suits know he is afraid, they even tease him about lay offs from warm offices when he walks through to take his 15-minute break. The high cost of labor, entitlement. The men in suits make you focus on the unions with their high paying jobs while they sit in offices pushing pencils making eight times the amount that my husband makes. Risking far less in stress and safety than my husband. And complaining about the high cost of labor.

My husband comes from a long line of blue collar workers. His grandfather was a World War II vet who gave part of his leg to the cause. His father a Vietnam War vet lost to alcoholism. My husband was a fatherless boy. In many ways he paid the ultimate price. A price that continues. He says repeatedly, “It’s the middle class that built this country, NOT the rich, and it’s the middle class that sends its children to war.”

And this...

The real truth, the truth that the men in suits secretly fight with every inch of their being is that this man, is the real threat. He knows more than they do, he has paid his dues (in more ways than one). He knows what he is looking at when the man in the suit goes into the bar, or gets drunk on the golf course for the fourth Sunday in a row.

<snip>

More: http://my.firedoglake.com/wavpeac/2011/01/21/the-blue-collar-life/

:kick:

[Brickbat]

1. This is so true. So very, very true.

K and fucking R.

[malaise]

2. Unless workers unite

the men in suits will continue to win.
This is the truth about the real workers' lives - everywhere.

[pasto76]

38. Even Union members vote republican and spew anti-labor bullshit

[pasto76]

39. Your husband can file a complaint with the Dept of Labor - threatening layoffs is unfair labor pract

but he should go through his local reps.....which will sell him down the river. He does have a job, be thankful of that. Yes, it is wearing him down physically.

The Sparkies on my job are working in an enclosed and heated building. And I hate them for that!

sgt pasto
Ironworkers Local 24, Colorado

[dotymed]

73. The NLRB, deal with the Union and their employers.

For many years now, they seem to be anti-union. They will jump all over a Union and bend way over for the employer. People do not realize that as a Union tradesman, you are always a "temp." They can call the "hall" and replace you in a heartbeat. That is why Union trades people are so well trained.


NLRB= National Labor Relations Board

[stockholmer]

57. Obama is an enthusiastic union buster as well (Arne Duncan, et al)

http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2010/03/10/obama-acts-like-reagan-1981-the-union-buster/

http://www.rabble.ca/babble/international-news-and-politics/obama-picks-school-privatizing-union-buster-education-secreta

http://www.laweekly.com/2008-10-16/news/obama-buddy-is-union-buster/

[ewagner]

3. Read it a few minutes ago

Truth.

And very, very moving

[RandomThoughts]

4. A song with hope for such a lovely person.

And for the suits also.


Take The Long Way Home
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nvT3_iSaHU



The funniest thing about concepts, so many people never thought about them, like why it is east south west north. East is birth, South adversity, West death, North Rest.

[MinneapolisMatt]

5. HUGE KICK.

:kick:

[HysteryDiagnosis]

6. Some truth, how refreshing a thing it is, Kicked through the goal posts. n/t

[HysteryDiagnosis]

7. This article brings to mind another subject of concern, off shoring, and I can't

help but think that if the top management was also required by law to be replaced with people from the country "offshored to" we would see a lot less of it.

[whathehell]

9. You can bet on that one...n/t

[Nye Bevan]

10. On the positive side, it's hard to see how an electrician's job could be offshored

Some of the men in suits should have more to worry about in this regard. Accounting work, for instance, can easily be offshored. But you can't call someone in India when there is an electrical problem.

[Edweird]

13. That's what illegals are for - to take the jobs that can't be offshored.

So, no, it's not 'positive'. If you point out what's going on you're a 'racist xenophobe'.

[Nye Bevan]

41. I don't think there are many electricians who are illegal immigrants (nt)

[Edweird]

44. Construction trade wages have been decimated by cheap 'undocumented' labor.

This guy making $29/hr is damn lucky. He could be making $15/hr with no benefits and a 1099 at the end of the year.

I partially agree with you - calling them 'electricians' is an insult to tradesmen that have learned their craft through on the job training and formal schooling.

[WillyT]

45. Ironic Isn't It... The Guy Making $29/hr Is Lucky...

How about making $15/hr with no benefits and a 1099 at the end of the year, unacceptable, exploitive, and illegal?

:shrug:

[Edweird]

47. It's the glut of cheap labor - but only college graduates can complain about it, apparently.

If you're Blue Collar you deserve to compete with third world wages - while being saddled with first world financial obligations. If you're an IT worker DU expresses an outpouring of sympathy and understanding of how wrong cheap labor is: if you're a carpenter DU rages at you for your insensitivity.

[WillyT]

48. Yep... And Those College Folks Got A Lesson In The 1968 Sanitation Strike In NYC

Just because you don't have a college degree, does not mean what you do for a living isn't valuable.

:shrug:

:hi:

[dreamnightwind]

114. This IT worker thanks you

for your posts pointing out that jobs that can't be offshored are still vulnerable to cheap immigrant labor, and that is exactly what is happening. Very sad to see so little recognition of this on DU, it seems many on the left have forsaken their own constituency (workers) in order to support the immigrants.

This is a dangerous argument to make, it puts you up against those who would make you out to be a racist, but it's an important issue that more of us need to recognize and fight. It's also extremely widespread these days, especially in the construction industry.

[socialist_n_TN]

87. All the above. Hell, just call it capitalism..........

It's everything you said, but illegal.

[tinkerbell41]

50. No

But they hire immigrants willing to work for 10 an hour, or the full 29 but they kickback.

[eilen]

89. My IBEW dh is on a nuke job and says they have

imported Iranians to work on it-- they may be engineers. Right now jobs are so tight the suits don't need to use illegal or workers from other countries, their own union is selling them out. Just go to http://www.ibew.org/ and click on the "Who's doing the work in your town" video by Ed Hill. They mailed all members a dvd of this.

Anyway, not all union locals pay $29/hr--everyone has a different agreement. We lost health benes for a little while until the local he is working out of now built up enough money in his account. The wage/bene packet here puts $8/hr into health benefits but where he is they only put in $3. Most local halls have special agreements with larger employers such as utility and energy providers.

Lately the National org. has been forcing local halls to accept different categories of workers and management friendly capitulations. It used to be that all electricians out of the Hall were "Journeyman A" and they could do any job. Now there are "B" and Residentials as well as others. Now they are required to have other special certifications as well for many jobs. None of these additional training requirements are borne by the union hall or the employer-- costs are borne by the workers in addition to union dues taken out of their paychecks and the union dues we pay outright to the hall.

There are many in dh's union that spout Right wing teaparty garbage. He always asks them "do you really hate having employment?" This is true not only in the South but in the Northeast where you think they might know better as there is less brainwashing going on there on Sundays.

[tinkerbell41]

97. Yes

That is the issue right now. HUGE issue. But it's not the Union hiring these guys. The video is showing the non-union element in the trade.

[eilen]

109. Back in the day there would be no non union elements

it was an understood deal. Union labor completed the job or it wouldn't get done. They could try but there was no one as well trained or able that wasn't organized. Usually the company or contractor would have to hire the union labor back to clean it up and make it work.

[tinkerbell41]

110. Still that way

We usually do have to come in and fix it. I did a job for a Union painter, who decided he would let some buddy of his finish the rest of addition instead of calling us back in. Needless to say there were BIG problems. We went back to finish some things on back order and were speechless how bad this guy got screwed. He knew better.
Once I was on the phone arguing with my ex about how we make "too much" he blabbered on about how the guys he knew only got 10 an hour. And I shit you not, the ceiling fan that was installed a few weeks before came crashing from the ceiling. I hung up.

[eilen]

111. LOL , love the instant karma.

Unfortunately, we end up with bridges collapsing, tunnels cracking and filling in, fires, explosions, contamination etc. when they cut corners on the big stuff.

Maybe your ex secretly wants to pay you alimony-- lol.

My husbands grandfather was a Master plumber in Yonkers. For some time he kept the city's boilers running. When he retired they were hard pressed to replace him. They ended up hiring a team.

It is a big problem in this country-- deskilling. Too many people working behind desks and counters. No one knows how to really do anything anymore. You keep outsourcing and hiring migrant labor scabs, the day of reckoning won't be far behind. Look at the state of textiles now. In 10 years you will be unable to find anyone who knows how to mill cotton, set up looms in an industrial setting. Already the garment making skills are dying off-- there was no other way of communicating these skills-- skilled cutters, pattern makers, -- how about making shoes? Anyone still know how to do that? I don't believe we have any cotton mills left in the US anymore. They all went to India. An economy that only ships out raw materials resembles the 3rd world. Value added goods is how we achieved a first world economy.

Before long they will be importing building sections and putting them together like Legos and going on and on about innovation. Until they stop working or we run out of oil.

[tinkerbell41]

113. I agree completely

[StarsInHerHair]

59. this should be snuck into a bill using arcane language, I hope someone WILL

do it, we really need to change course.

[Overseas]

8. K&R! Excellent! //nt

[samplegirl]

11. Wow! That was head on!!!

I feel the same way about my husbands job. Well written and glad to push this to the greatest.

[MindPilot]

12. The suits live in fear.

They know in their heart of hearts that when push comes to shove they need the electrician way more than the electrician needs them.

[Kurovski]

14. There are more electricians than head honchos.

We win the numbers game hands down, if we can focus and stop fighting each other.

[tinkerbell41]

51. Exactly

there lies our power. If it wasn't for the tradesmen nothing could get done. Well I guess they could pencil push by candlelight.

[Ernesto]

15. The Sheet Metal Worker's Union

is one of the best things that ever happened to me!

BTW>>>> My wife is a UNION nurse.

[SheilaT]

16. I've been watching Undercover Boss,

and every single time the CEO's discover that the rank and file in their company work very hard, harder than the CEO is capable of doing, and have often seen their pay cut to boot. Those who work in offices are clueless about what real work consists of.

[HelenWheels]

21. Management easier

I'm a retired nurse and I worked both in management and also direct patient care. Management was a lot easier. Patient care is harder physically and mentally. Managers have time to think over a decision, direct care nurses make many life and death decisions at the bedside. Also, pay, benefits and work schedules are better for managers.

[SheilaT]

43. Exactly what I've noticed during my entire

working life. Not that I've ever worked in management myself, but I've had office jobs, as well as line jobs, and office work is laughably easy compared to the other.

[Enthusiast]

66. I could tell you stories. nt

[Brickbat]

17. K&R. Everyone should read this.

[marew]

18. Excellent and thought provoking post! n/t

[reggie the dog]

19. when talking about prejudice in grad school

I remember telling my classmates and the professor that my biggest prejudice was to think that all people wearing suits were my enemy. I was scoffed at by most of my classmates, except for 3 people, one who was a machinist going back to grad school, another had been a roadie for aerosmith for years, and the third was an army brat....

[Gormy Cuss]

22. Fair's fair. The people in suits were thinking all of the blue collar types were too stupid

to be in college and low income people were stupid and immoral.

[tinkerbell41]

52. Well I decided to become an electrician

based on 5 yrs of free education, and our 2nd -5th yr we got paid 40 hr a week to be in school for 11 weeks. Gee go to college and be in debt or..... come out making 40g a year and no debt.
I am not disputing you, just saying who is the smart one??

[eilen]

90. Wow, where was that?

My dh (who is a college grad) apprenticed. He had school 3 nights a week after work for 5 years. he was paid for 40 hours at apprentice rate for the hours he worked. He started out ABC and then applied, tested and got into the union and they put him back a year so he actually did 6 years and every year was the top of his class.

[tinkerbell41]

95. Chicago

Not being smug or sarcastic, but we have the BEST training program in the IBEW. This was 20 yrs ago and still continues today. It can't be beat. If your family can't afford College, or if you are not the type who learns with the way education system is structured there is still a way to make a decent living.

[eilen]

108. Illinois has some of the best agreements. I agree.

dh loves working there.

[Gormy Cuss]

98. The attitude is that you work with your hands, therefore you can't be that smart.

Remember that I was responding to a post about prejudging.
:hi:

[tinkerbell41]

100. I know: No harm meant

I know the standard thinking, but I also know the reality. I guess I was just replying to the standard thinking in general and not necessarily you. Just throwing something out there to think about. :)

[Hannah Bell]

20. kr

[walldude]

23. K&R.. Thanks Willy

I was having a "discussion" yesterday with a couple DU'ers on what constitutes "WORK". People have lost what the meaning of that word is. Sitting behind a desk making decisions may be taxing, it may be stressful, it may be difficult... BUT IT IS NOT WORK!

Work has become a dirty word in this country and people who actually work for a living are looked down upon.

[cantbeserious]

24. And For These Men, Obama Appoints Immelt To Champion Job Growth

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x252247

[Little Star]

25. k&r

[BobbyBoring]

26. Excellent

The "men in suits think your husband should be making $7.50 an hr. and would still be overpaid at that. This is why the right demonizes unions. Unions are what created the "Middle Class" for many Americans. Once Reagan busted the Air Traffic Controllers Union, it's been all downhill~

[TomClash]

27. Nonsense - He's not a threat

He's a great man but he's not a threat.

He won't revolt. He's never going to pick up at 30 on 6 or a mac 10 or AK or any other serious weapon. Not happening.

Sorry, no one fears him. If he withholds his labor there's always someone else. If he turns violent, he will be exterminated. If he protests, people will yawn. If he votes he will vote for people who are bought, sold and controlled.

I would love to be wrong; I wish you were right. It would be just. But it's not a just world.

The men in the suits don't fear him. They don't even think of him. Ever.

[Marr]

56. Exactly.

The entire problem is that our government and business community are completely unconcerned about the general population, because it is not a threat in any way. People have come to believe that "fighting back" means having a parade and carrying a cute sign. And they wonder why their government doesn't listen to them at all.

[raccoon]

77. Sadly, you are right. Still, K&R for this thread. nt

[joanbarnes]

28. Middle class/union members

Ditto. Now imagine those of us, union or non-union who make 1/3 to 1/2 less pay with all the same problems.

[Stumbler]

29. We've heard this warning before:

"Labor is prior to and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor" -- A. Lincoln

The problem is "we" didn't "actually" "hear" this point. But it was made for our benefit.

The working (wo)man wants only a living wage to feed their(our) families. The "leaders" want much more than they can produce themselves and have no shame in using fear-tactics to "earn" what they want.

[cyberpj]

30. K/R - with shared tears and concern for a 40yr old Blue Collar son.

And yet - SO many of them have been convinced to vote Republican, against their own self-interests, because of ridiculous issues like gay rights and right to choose. I just can't wrap my head around the gullibility and stupidity of it!

I guess it's the blurring of the lines as more and more of our collective government was purchased with corporate money but when I was growing up it was clearly true that Democrats were the party of the working man and Republicans were the party of big business. Now that both parties have become the parties of big business, the working man has nothing left but to fall prey to the media idiots that can rile them up and pretend to care for them.

[WillyT]

31. + 1,000,000,000... What You Said !!!

Exactly!!!

:shrug:

:hi:

[Enthusiast]

67. Many of these "against their own interest" voters

have also been convinced that the Democrats are going to take their guns away. This is why I consider gun control a losing issue for the Democratic Party, right or wrong. Single issues voters are killing us.

[uponit7771]

81. +1

[Joe the Revelator]

32. Why is the blame on the suits? His union negotiated his package...

Down to the length of his breaks. The blame goes there. And trust me, as a "suit" in a union workplace, I make way less then the employees who are under a CBA.

[WillyT]

33. I'm Pretty Sure They're Talking Higher Level Suits !!!

The ones with the power to lay-off hundreds and ship jobs overseas.

:shrug:

[Joe the Revelator]

34. Maybe, but they said the ones on site who he saw on his breaks.

Those guys more often then not get paid shit, work holidays, nights, weekends etc.

[eilen]

92. Are you allowed to use the bathrooms in the building?

the cafeteria and break rooms? The tradesmen are not. They are directed to port-a-potties outside and must lunch either in a work trailer sitting on a bucket or outside.

Those were the conditions at the state hospital my husband helped renovate two years ago.

[tinkerbell41]

103. Spot on!

We are not allowed to use their facilities. And sitting on a bucket for lunch or the ground is standard.

[tinkerbell41]

102. And if you couldn't negotiate

If the business threatened to close or fire everyone and hire new. They do what they can. The "suits" are the ones who question "why" we make so much. When they should be asking why they don't make more. Share the wealth.

[JDPriestly]

35. Best post ever on DU. Thank you, FireDogLake.

[hfojvt]

36. hard to believe that health care and disability are not subsidized

They are by many employers. He'd be better off from a tax perspective if he changed his contract to $25 an hour and had the company pay for the insurance and disability. Then he wouldn't have to pay the taxes on the $8-10,000 that went to those expenses.

[Catherina]

37. Proud to be rec #100. On edit, I'm confused, 78% had employer health insurance in 2009

In March 2009, 78 percent of union workers were covered by health insurance through their jobs, compared with only 51 percent of nonunion workers.

http://www.aflcio.org/joinaunion/why/uniondifference/uniondiff6.cfm

100% should have it. Same for the rest of ALL US workers, legal or not.

[eilen]

91. This is not true for the Trades

it is for the government unions and the factory unions.

[Catherina]

112. Thanks Eilen. n/t

[Curmudgeoness]

40. I grew up in a mill town and everyone I knew worked in mills.

I can relate to this and it breaks my heart all over again.

:kick:

[GrantDem]

42. I regret that I can rec this only once...

[tabbycat31]

46. Sounds like the guy I am sort of seeing right now

I don't come from a line of blue-collar people (in fact my mom disrespects them) and once I got to know him my feelings on everything changed completely.

Why should he not deserve the same kind of chances that people in an office do? He works just as hard (if not harder) than my white collar sister and BIL do. I have a newfound respect for the blue-collar union guys that I never knew much about before.

[tinkerbell41]

49. IBEW member for 20 yrs 2nd generation

This speaks to me. I am a woman and have had the very thoughts described here. I love my trade but it has taken it's toll, mentally and physically. When it is cold we come home too exhausted for anything but dinner and sleep. When it is hot the same thing. I have had to drive with windows down and music blasting on the cold days, just to stay awake for the drive home. Your body uses tons of energy trying to keep warm for 8 hrs.
All of the article above is true.It is feast or famine for most of us. Always there at the back of your mind if you will go home in one piece everyday. I am proud of what I do, and know why I made the sacrifice. I am tired of the claim we make too much money, to me that should never be the question. The question should be why doesn't everyone else make more.

[Alcibiades]

53. The job of management is to prevent work from being done

That's been my experience, anyway. The best bosses I have had have been the ones who rose up through the factory floor, guys who would not ask you to do something they have not themselves done. The worst have been folks with a college degree and little else to recommend them other than whatever nepotistic or self-promoting qualities it was that got them their jobs in the first place.

The irony is that we have a situation wherein large monopolistic corporations are the ones who have the most political clout. Yet they are the ones who generate the fewest jobs, and are the quickest to outsource, thanks to the mistaken belief that their only social obligation is to generate return on investment for shareholders. Time and time again, these folks, supposedly paid to take risks, impose risks on others while taking all the benefits for themselves. Time and time again, they have nearly blown up the global capitalist economy: the S&L crisis, the dot com bubble, Enron, Long-Term Capital Management, the housing and derivatives bubble, etc.

Actual productivity is inversely related to compensation.

[Starry Messenger]

54. k&r

[Populist_Prole]

55. Definate K & R

I only regret that I have got around to reading this thread so late that I can scarcely offer anything pithy after so many excellent comments thus far. This is THE singular issue for me. I have over time, regretfully, painted white collar types with a broad brush in my mind as condescending assholes, based on remarks I've seen written, broadcasted, and spoken to or overheard personally, and it's everything I can do to not adopt a reverse predjudice of sorts.

[krispos42]

58. My dad... IUOE Local 478 for 30 years.

Arthritis, artificial hip, still recovering from have an artificial knee (finally) installed. Once took a 4x4 to the noggen after it fell from a building. Freezing cold and blistering muggy heat. Overnights on the interstate, dawn to dusk pouring concrete for an office building, weekends.


He's sixty now... and his 88-year-old father-in-law gets around a bit better than he does.

[Enthusiast]

68. Surely he can work till 69 years old.

He just needs a little toughening up, that's all. :sarcasm:

[cvmeds]

60. Blue Collar Life is

Hello,

I'm from Florida. Wish to see the happenings here in the forum and get some information on pharmacy businesses in general and also providing Blue Collar Life is about.

I've worked in the pharmacy industries for a number of years now so I figure I can offer some useful advice here 'n' there! Here is Blue Collar Life is ...........


The real truth, the truth that the men in suits secretly fight with every inch of their being is that this man, is the real threat.



Thank You


Regards
Cris Bob
cvmeds.com

[Sherman A1]

61. K&R Well Said

:kick:

[JCMach1]

62. Meanwhile electricians in Asia can make as little as $100-500 per month...

The $500 would probably be a person with an electrical engineering degree. :(

Oh yeah, and they are mostly un-unionized.

That sort of economics in a 'globalized' economic model just isn't sustainable.

The guy in the suit is also playing by what he sees in front of him and that isn't good.

Globalization is killing whole parts of the U.S. economy.

[lib2DaBone]

63. The 3-piece suits and their Gucci loafrers... ahhhh... the bane of existance...

The 3-piece suits are everywhere. They fill chairs on the school boards, town halls, CONgress, City Hall, every front office in every town and city.

They make the laws, control the media nad make billions by keeping the working people on their knees.

The only problem is.. without the working people who keep the lights on, keep the water running, drive the trucks, keep the roads open.. these 3 piece suits cant even wipe their own behinds.

This country is LONG overdue for a massive work stoppage and a rebirth of strong unions. JMHO (as one of the experienced worker types who's been humping that load for 50 years)

[harmonicon]

64. This "middle class" trope really needs to stop.

The man described here is not middle class. He is working class. The "men in suits" might be middle class, but they're probably just slightly more wealthy proletariat. Functionally, the United States does not have a middle class! There is a tiny elite and a huge working class. It's less than 2% of the population making 8 times 60k. Those at the bottom of that rung may be middle class, but almost everyone below them is working class. Here's a simple test: Do you need your job (meaning, do you have to worry about losing it, and do you need the income that comes from it)? Do you have any debts, including car loans and mortgages? If so, you are not middle class, you are working class. Once the person who makes $150,000 a year realizes that he has more in common with the guy working a part-time minimum wage job than he does with the truly wealthy, real changes might be made. Until then, we're fucked.

[barbiegeek]

71. BRAVO!! BRAVO!!! Your comment should be a post

It's not your income, it your debt.

If you spend $70,000 in borrowing money & student loans to have an office job, plus a mortgage & car payments, healthcare, etc. Your title or suit doesn't make you rich. You're still a pauper for life in chain of debt, you're just wearing nicer clothes.

[Enthusiast]

65. Anti-labor sentiments

have been cultivated since the earliest history of organized labor. This effort has been rewarded.

I have been on message boards all over the net. There is one opinion that is nearly universal -unions are no good, they have outlived their usefulness and they do nothing but take your dues while giving nothing in return. Anti-labor propaganda has been very effective, so effective that even a majority of blue collar workers don't recognize the value of organized labor.

[whathappened]

70. this is a true shameful story

with out the unions today , we would be like china , getting paid 2 dollars a day , you no it has'nt been that many yrs ago that people did work for 3 bucks a day in this country , it was the last depression , my father can attest to this but he has gone down under , he worked 37 yrs in a union factory and come out the other side , with beaten down health issues , lived maybe 10yrs after his retirement , he breathe cast iron dust for 37 yrs in this factory and did'nt miss much time in all them yrs , i worked at the same factory for 16 yrs befor throwing down my gloves and walking out , i gave up alot and have worked my ass off for the remaining time i could work tell i fell and hurt my back . so just because your working a union job and may have benifits , don't make it any better on your health , u still have to breath other people building products to make that living , and whats left after all them yrs of hard work could have shorten up your life by 10 to 20 yrs , i still have bad lungs even after being away from them dirty old machine shops for 30 yrs , so anything these people make in the trades , is'nt enought concidering the abuse a man or women has to indure from there health issues , from bad lungs to bad backs , legs , sight ,etc., so a big thumbs up to all people of labor , but 1 thing for sure , it has been the unions workers who have paved the way for better wages in this country , if it was'nt for them , just stop and think what these cheap ass suits who own all these buinesses would be paying you , yes they are trying to bring the unions down and if they win , nobody that labors will make enought to rub 2 nickels together

[Enthusiast]

72. Thank you for sharing your story.

There are millions like you and your dad. I worked in factories too. I agree with every one of your points.

[raccoon]

78. Amen to that, "with out the unions today , we would be like china, getting paid 2 dollars a day " nt

[tinkerbell41]

96. Thank you!!

[liberal N proud]

69. I know exactly where this story is coming from

There are 10's of thousands of them repeated every day. Many working for much less.

[Bosso 63]

74. Labor day and Memorial day - the bookends of summer

Both of these days should be about the sacrifices that have been made to protect our rights and freedom. The people who fought and often died for labor rights, were also fighting for all of us, but that fact is being pushed down history's memory hole.
Sadly, both days are now just celebrated as opportunities to sell us crap.

[Hubert Flottz]

75. K&R

36 year member of the AFL CIO.

Those guys in suits are scabs at "Heart"

[xchrom]

76. recommend

[annabanana]

79. k&r . . for the people who do the real work!. . . .n/t

[intaglio]

80. On this side of the pond very different

Firstly all electricians are recognised as having a safety critical job, both the work they do and the conditions in which they work. Companies in Europe are liable if the work is not up to standard, ie they have to employ fully qualified electricians, provide correct tools, correct materials and have a safety inspection afterward. For safety they have to ensure employees are trained in site safety before beginning a job, hold the correct certification, they have to provide all safety equipment and make sure it is in good condition and all of this even applies to companies employing sub-contractors.

Of course insurances, health and "disability" are covered in national taxes and by company being required to carry insurance for the job. Pay without overtime is about $45,000 - $60,000. Tax and National Insurance about $10,000 - $12,000

Guess what? This standard of care even applies to unskilled labour doing other parts of the job and usually the tax take will be proportionally much lower.

Being dismissed (fired, pink slipped)
Well firstly if you have been employed more than 6 months you cannot be just laid off - except by mutual agreement. You have to be given a proper notice period often 1 week for 6 to 18 months and 1 month thereafter. Often the employer would have to show cause and be very careful of the libel laws.

[DirkGently]

82. The idea that only owners matter & workers deserve contempt is pushed relentlessly. Great find.

[mimitabby]

83. yes you're right

every 4 years our contract comes up for renegotiations and the company and their thugs try to take everything we have away.

It always ends up that we lose a little pride at the settlement, because the company is out to give us the least amount possible while averting a strike. We were the first successful white collar strikers in the country, but i fear the starch has gone out of us
and we probably will never go out on a strike like that again.

[SayitAintSo]

84. Wonderful post - and so true....n/t

[james0tucson]

85. If he started a business

If he started a business and had to face the realities of operating one, I wonder if he would be paying his electricians more than $29/hr, dealing with unions *at all*, or doing without heat in his office.

[eilen]

94. I guess he would if he wanted things done correctly

and not have his business burn down.

[tinkerbell41]

99. Are you serious?

Do you know how dangerous our job is?? Do you know the calculations involved with trying to run 4in in an overloaded drop ceiling? If your electricians are coming out of 5 yrs of school, willing to work in any condition, be ready to change lightbulbs to handigging a trench at a moments notice.
Be able to figure load calculations because the engineer screwed up. Come in and figure out what the guy who was in there 20 yrs ago did with the wiring, so it doesn't burn down, you better be paying.

[seabeyond]

86. there are so many wrongs in this post even though i value what it is saying. them against us....

is bullshit.

this op isnt talking about the top... he is talking those in office vs those outside office. there are many things that are dismissed, ignored or flat out wrong in addressing the "suits"

i have never felt it necessary to bring down one, to raise another.

[tinkerbell41]

104. Believe me

On a jobsite we are looked down upon and treated like dirt. The suits know we make more and are jealous so they turn against us. They watch us for any little thing that might annoy them. They tell on us constantly, if they lived our lives for 1 day, they would understand.

[seabeyond]

106. i have been in all the positions including owner. there are stories to be told from all perspectives

i dont agree with a lot that is said. and all the groups are important, cant be done without the other.

it does not make sense to me to battle, one against the other.

[tinkerbell41]

107. Me either.

We go in with good attitudes, but the mentality we encounter makes it hard. Right now I am dealing with a new step-mother who somehow thinks because we are all blue collar we have no idea what a crack-berry is. She is a "socialite" and really talks to us like we are stupid. Maddening

[socialist_n_TN]

88. I can't add much, except some personal experience........

I worked 5 years in steel construction as a young man and I come from a working class background and I KNOW what the capitalists and their toadies will do if you don't stand up to them. They will LITERALLY kill you for production. I've seen it first hand. YOU are not a person. YOU are a unit of work energy to be used until you're used up and then discarded.

[eilen]

93. Massey Energy. BP. You are absolutely right. nt

[tinkerbell41]

105. Agree

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

101. Such a great article and so true...

...Thank you for posting.

:thumbsup: