They are going to take you down, rung by rung, until we are all at the bottom

[Horse with no Name]

IF republicans have their way--teachers are going to be paid lower wages.

As I posted in another thread, my mom went through this many years ago--from almost a $20 an hour job being offered at $5 an hour. She wasn't going to GIVE them her experience and instead did a career change.

Do you think teachers are any different?

I don't.

Not the teachers that I know who struggled to pay back student loans in order to land themselves in a "stable professional job".

Well, if the republicans have their way....those won't exist.

Who is going to go to school for 4-5 years in order to make $8-10 an hour and be vilified for doing one of this nation's most important jobs?
I'll answer that.
Nobody. It will be relegated to an unimportant job, but honestly? Isn't this what republicans have been going for in the past 20 years anyway?

Private charter schools. Standardized testing. Things that ANYONE can do--not just seasoned professionals.

They want to bust teaching down from a professional job to a para-professional job so that when they turn the schools over to corporations--those poor corporations aren't going to be saddled with employees who expect to be able to make a comfortable living. That interferes with profits.
Instead, more than likely the only requirement will be a high school education. Then they can get by with paying less money.
Hell, Texas has been doing it for YEARS.

Subbing in many districts in Texas involves little more than an application and high school diploma.

There are "teachers" in our district who don't have degrees. Coming soon to a school near you. Watch for it.

So, while my best friend is a teacher, it really isn't "personal" to me yet because I am a nurse and I have a good professional job. Right! Right?

Well, as the economy worsens because people don't make living wages anymore or aren't guaranteed health insurance in their benefit packages anymore, hospitals are going to take on more and more of a burden in taking care of people.

The majority of hospitals in this country are owned by corporations. Now, if we can't expect the corporations that own schools to lose money for the common good--do you really think hospitals are going to expect any different?

Do you think they are going to continue to pay what many consider HIGH wages for nurses? Or, do you think that they will start busting their salaries too? Remember, very few states are union for nursing. In fact, I have always felt that is why nurses are governed state by state instead of nationally (which truly makes more sense)...to keep them from organizing a powerful union.

And do you think that nurses (who are already underpaid by standards of being an extremely demanding job--much like teaching)will readily take paycuts or do you think they will enter other fields instead?

The nurses I know will leave the profession. It is already a thankless profession...and if it doesn't pay the bills...

So...what is your profession and can you fit it into the mold of what is happening to the schools and the teachers?

[Vinee]

1. when you have lost everything, you have nothing left to lose.

maybe that's what it will take to get folks off their asses and into the fight.

[MedicalAdmin]

12. The coming revolution will be economic.

We won't pay our mortgages, our rents, our student loans and we will close all of our bank accounts and liquidate all our investment and retirement accounts.

And after we get their attention. THEN we'll take to the streets with sticks, torches, pitchforks, and some serious firepower and maps to the homes of the rich and powerful. And any that flee the country, we'll give them 2 choices - either return the money you stole or we will "munich" you and your entire families.

They have shown no mercy. WE will show none in return. There are 400 of you and 100 million of us. Do the math you rich fuckers.

[Vinee]

18. I'm too new to say that kind of thing but yeah...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYwjhAVtIMc

[MedicalAdmin]

25. Wow man - that takes me back.

I saw them live about 20 years ago - front row, center. Great tickets.

It was a great show - my ears are still ringing.

[RKP5637]

2. It's one huge downward spiral and it's contagious. This will be a nation of serfs and

any not seeing what is happening have blinders on or are on the take. And when you have a gov. funded and bribed by endless outside money how can it be any different. The SC decision on Citizens United was absolute proof of where we are headed. I've lost faith in the future of American for most of the population.

I'm convinced I lived the best of the years in America and I'm saddened to think future generations IMO will not be very well off. Maybe something will change, I hope so, but right now I don't see what it is ... I thought 2008 was a major turning point, but now I don't think so. I do hope I am wrong.

[MedicalAdmin]

27. 100 million with sticks versus 400 uber rich.

It ain't gonna be pretty. And if they run we send special forces after them and every living relative, friend and associate.

[Hannah Bell]

3. kr. first they came for the air traffic controllers.

[Vinca]

4. It's curious how the teachers are being vilified just when it's being

reported in the MSM that America doesn't have enough highly educated people to fill some of the jobs in the tech industry. (Something about that doesn't ring true . . . I suspect they can't find enough highly educated people willing to work for peanuts.)

[Poboy]

7. No. Its about privatizing Schools. Obama and Jeb are about to kick it off!

(see thread in general discussion announcing it)

link-
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x535817

[babsbunny]

5. seems the prez could do something!

i am sure he has a plan.............

[steve2470]

6. The CEO's and major investors in the multinational corporations want us to be like Bangladesh

Cheap wages, no pesky laws, almost total freedom to do what they want.

[RKP5637]

29. Exactly what is going on! Why so many Americans are so naive is beyond me. It must

be sheer laziness and generations of propaganda kicking in ... and it has nothing to so with IQ and/or education. Some smart and well educated people I know in the big picture are really stupid fucks.

[bobbolink]

8. Then I guess you will all have to finally deal with where poor people of this country are NOW.

Or, you could stand up for us now, and then we could all work together to change this mess.

Either ignore us and end up WITH us, or be WITH US now and we can fight.

Your choice.

[Horse with no Name]

9. Some of us do fight bobbolink

and are extremely aware of the economic injustices in this country.

Even though some are at better stations at this particular time, it doesn't mean we don't care.

The evil is not US...the evil is a parasitical government that we have no control over.

I do hope you are feeling better.

[bobbolink]

14. I realize that there are a few who care, and am extremely grateful for them.

However, if you look at the situaton from my eyes, what you see is NO response to the proposals of all the cuts. NOTHING.

From my eyes, what you see and hear is nothing except "the middleclass".

From my eyes, what you see is protest after protest for middleclass concerns, AND NOT ONE for poverty.

From my ears, what you hear is poor people seeing this and saying, "I am ready to give up. I know I won't survive this, because it ism't important." That is heartbreaking, and there is no answer to it, because it is TRUE.

[Horse with no Name]

17. We don't have a government of the people, by the people and for the people anymore

We have a government that takes care of the elite in this country. Period.

I am struggling at how to word this--and if I get it wrong, please allow me the courtesy to clarify before judging what I say. Hopefully, it will all come out correctly and you will understand where I am coming from.

I believe our class system was structured so that you always had a bigger sibling taking care of a younger sibling, so to speak. But what we see now, instead of a symbiotic relationship between classes it has become a parasite-host relationship.

The upper class was supposed to look after the middle class--and help elevate the ones who excelled and help support the ones who lagged behind. This was most evident in the structure of jobs. The ones who excelled were given "management" jobs while the ones who needed support were given "labor" jobs.

The middle class was supposed to look after the lower class--and help elevate the ones who excelled and help support the ones that lagged behind. This was most evident in the structure of social services. It implemented a plan to help the middle class stay middle class (social security and Medicare) after they retired, while at the same time supporting the lower classes to a point that they could survive when they were older. Food stamps, Medicaid, and WIC are also support features that include the middle and lower classes.

The contributions of the lower classes have always been (no matter what the intentions of either of the higher classes)that of exploited cheap labor--whether in the form of menial jobs or military. There really is no other way to put it. The other indelicate truth is that once that you are firmly entrenched in the lower class--that short of winning the lottery there is no way out. You have to depend on the other classes to throw crumbs downward to exist. That is why the destruction of the middle class becomes so important.
THEY are your protector. It isn't the rich and wealthy who wanted to benefit the lower class with social services. It is the unions, the working people, the ones that KNOW that if they don't stay afloat, not only will they not be able to help themselves, there will be nobody else to help you.

[bobbolink]

19. Maybe you see that as the way it is supposed to be, but it hasn't functioned that way in a very long

time.

However you choose to look at it, the middleclass *are* responsible for ignoring the coming cuts, and the suffering and death those cuts will bring.

[Horse with no Name]

20. We agree here too.

What has happened is that the rich people have found their own little "overachievers", "bootlickers", etc in the middle class. Think of washed up radio hosts that have been fired from coast to coast and back again...to start dividing the "labor" part of the middle class, but solely focused on the ones that are of lower information and intelligence and basically, susceptible to propaganda.

Think Tea Party mentality--but here long before the Koch brothers decided to give them their own little political platform.

So...while the upper class is reneging on being caretakers of the middle class--they are using disinformation and propaganda to make these low info folks believe that the ONLY reason they aren't getting promotions and raises and a boost up into the upper class is because the LOWER class has gotten too uppity and have too many needs and requirements. Failing to mention that the rich aren't being taxed--so it really is NOT their money supporting social programs that benefit middle and lower classes--but again, that point is missed on the low info folks who seriously want to kick some ass because they are being held down!
Instead of realizing that the wealthy are amassing wealth at a higher rate than ever in history, it doesn't dawn on these people because they want to believe that their nemesis is someone that they have the power to push back down, instead of realizing that there fate is being dictated by the person that they have no power over.

It's a totally fucked up situation--that is no doubt.

I really don't believe that the middle class will survive this assault from within...and more importantly, I believe that when the dust settles we will be left with an entirely different social structure that will consist of the bourgeoisie and the peasants. I also believe there are going to be a lot of shell-shocked republicans who didn't see this coming, while the fat pigs dance all the way to the bank.

[bobbolink]

21. And while all the "shaking out" is happening, people are dying and it doesn't matter.

I have to say... all the left-brained analysis leaves me cold.. there is no compassion that comes through. Death? So what?

So, you will pardon me if I really don't have anything left with which to care what happens to those who are ignoring us now.

Its certain that *our* deaths don't and won't matter to them.

If you could hear what some DUers are saying to me about their own devastation..... or maybe that wouldn't matter, either.

To be blunt... I am looking for heart, for a human connection, and I am getting intellectual analysis.

[Horse with no Name]

22. It does matter. It also matters that WE are ALL being shut out of the process

I *want* to believe that the majority of people saw something in the election of Obama.

I *want* to believe that the majority of people believed that the coldhearted republican shit would shut down the second Obama took his oath.

I was never convinced. I was even driven from here by the "true believers" because the disconnect between what they saw and what I saw was a difference between night and day.
They saw a savior. I saw what we have now.

The paradigm is that now we are ALL stuck with this--and the few true believers are going to try to bully us into the same decision in 2012. IF it isn't too late at that point--IF we don't make major changes--it will be too late.

People are dying. That is true. I don't have the power to stop that. I am not represented in Washington. My family is struggling--but I do realize there are those that are worse off.
I still donate where I can. It isn't enough and I know that--but it is all I can do.

[bobbolink]

23. there is a gulf between us, and I can't bridge it.

I don't hear in any of this any actual reason why the rest of you middleclass people aren't protesting the cuts, why the deaths of people considered beneath all of you aren't a factor... aren't even thought of, let alone spoken of.

I hear nothing about that.

THIS is what is creating the real class war, and it ain't the doing of the rich.

I ask you to honestly consider that.

[Horse with no Name]

26. Let me put it bluntly Bobbolink

I *may* or *may not* still be middle class. I lost my job because I was sick. I haven't found another one. My unemployment was cut off or put on hold or some other shit.
I have had to sell some of my furniture to pay bills.
My SO had a 50% salary cut.
All of our bills have gone up.
My daughter who graduated from college is still working at a fast food restaurant--can't find a job and I am STILL having to pay her car insurance and her health insurance.
I have a very ill granddaughter who has to be driven 400 miles round trip to the doctor at least once a week. She is on Medicaid--and it looks an awful lot like she will end up being dropped. They quit paying for her Physical Therapy and she is having a very hard time functioning as a normal child.
I may NOT be in YOUR shoes--but I am definitely firmly in mine and they are pretty damned uncomfortable.
So, my friend, if there is a "gulf" between us--it is simply because you put it there.

[bobbolink]

32. I don't accept the blame.

You haven't talked about your own situation, and I flunked Mind Reading 101.

I will say it again..... I talked about the pain of being ignored, and the pain of the hopelessness I am hearing from others because these cuts are being ignored by the middleclass who wants all the attention now.

I expressed that, which is right brain and sharing of *myself*, and I got back left-brained explanations rather than compassion and understanding of what I and others are going through. THAT is the gulf, and *I* didn't put it there.

There simply seems to be no interst in relating to each other on a human level. That is tragic. And it will end badly.

That is exactly what the Egyptians and Libyans are showing us... the only strength is in coming together and bonding and sharing the pain. AND constantly reminding each other to remember those who are at the bottom of the ladder. Too bad we can't seem to learn from that. THEY certainly aren't only about the middleclass!

[a kennedy]

10. Just had my haircut, and the gal that cuts it said they'll lose

their house.....her husband teaches in a local high school and they'll lose their house with the Wisconsin cuts..... I gave her an extra 5.00 tip. I feel so bad.

[Newest Reality]

11. Not that the schools aren't already

dumbed-down by older standards, but it seems that the system is now gearing-up for nothing more than training as opposed to what I would call a real education.

If they keep-up with this trend towards churning out test-taking, semi-literate graduates who have only have basic skills, then we are just seeing the creation of a new generation of corporately-controlled robots. Corporate monoculture would benefit from a McEdcuation system and that won't require many highly skilled professionals.

Think of the impact on our culture as thinking, creativity, knowing about many subjects, and other facets of education are sliced away in favor of crony test systems.

Now, imagine the impact that could have on our very survival in the long-run. Adaptation and our ability to think, grow, and solve problems has been the highlight of this specie's durability. In times like these, with the problems we face, those skills, and knowledge about more than just basic abilities, are going to be crucial.

Teach your children well! Parents can, at least, do their best with their kids and open their minds to learning. The rich kids will be trained in their fancy, high-end schools in order to control and dominate our children, ey?

This shit has gotta' stop.

[Horse with no Name]

13. Good post.

Just curious. Do you think that OUR kids are being dumbed down because THEY have dumbed THEIR kids down so far by wealth and entitlement (think dubya) that they are fearful when their old and evil asses are dead and gone that our kids would be smart enough to overthrow this shit?

[Newest Reality]

16. Thanks ...

That's a good question.

According to what I have read, the school systems have been dumbing down the curriculum for decades. You might want to refer to:

http://www.deliberatedumbingdown.com/pages/book.htm

Also, people have compared tests and subjects from the turn of the century, (both my Mother and Grandfather were very well educated with only High School degrees and Gramps became an Engineer without college training) that show just how dumb things are out there and this, in my opinion, is systematic and system-based, not entirely a blame that goes on the teachers themselves who are delivering the system to the students.

I think that the wealthy and upper percentiles tend to educate their children with high standards and at levels that money can buy. Quality education is out-of-reach for most of us from Kindergarten to College. That is a great way to maintain control, as I said. You have to have somebody at the top of the pyramid who is not thick as a brick.

Don't get me wrong. I think that humans have an innate intelligence and a huge capacity for learning and creativity. If we were able to spend more time with our children, (rather than effectively having them raised by others) we could just as well incite their curiosity and instill a love of learning, reading and creativity at home. In fact, most of my "education" came from copious reading over many years thanks to my Grandfather who mentored me and inspired my craving for books.

Dubya is just an aberration to me. He is atypical as far as elite training goes. Maybe it was a birth defect or he was dropped on his head. Who knows. Just goes to show you that you can become President no matter what if your Dad has connections and there is enough money behind you. Plus, being installed the first time by the SCOTUS helps, too. Dubya was all other people's brains and money. He isn't much on his own. Well, he is a good fool.

[firehorse]

15. step 1. lower wages to the point that only a few people can afford to enter the teaching profession

Step 2. eliminate public schools entirely, privatize all education, only the top 10% of the population will be able to send their kids to school

Step 3: home schooling becomes the norm with what was once the middle class, with one parent working, the other teaching, family becomes low working class from loss of income. Some groups will form their own education co-ops, education levels drastically vary from person to person. Low income kids get no education at all and we create a new generation of ignorant under educated people, incapable of entering the work force.

Step 4: if you can afford private schools, you will pick the school like flavors of ice cream as they will be specialized (such as creationism, military, managing wealth, etc).

Step 5: we go back to a time when only a few people can read, do math, etc. beyond a 6th grade level, only the rich can afford to have kids.

Step 6: America becomes like third world countries in terms of education, and economic class

[Ameriva]

24. Its not just Republicans

If you have not realized that there are two faces of one party I would be conerned, watch Russian TV, French TV, Al Jazeera, German TV etc.

Get the truth.

The USA is going to be brought down into the dirt whether the Democrats do it by debt and inflation or the Republicans do it by union busting and gerrymandering and corporatism.

Things are going to get real bad in the world we are facing a huge Malthsian nightmare.

[MedicalAdmin]

28. Malthus was an asshole.

Unfortunately he was also right.

[Major Hogwash]

30. Hahahaha. Well, somebody had to say it.

That fucker never had any vision of the future.

LoL

[MedicalAdmin]

33. Oh, he had a vision....

It just wasn't a disney movie vision. More like the Terminator, only with out all the feel good moments.

[RKP5637]

31. Those are excellent sources for news. We're headed for rough roads, many

Americans choose to sleep. Very sad.