Addendum -- Fundraising for Japan makes no sense

[Bragi]

I'll leave this post up (below) but I'll not comment further on it. I've been concerned for some time about what I see as the dysfunctionality of fundraising practices around natural disasters, but I see from responses that, clearly, this isn't the time to discuss the matter. My apologies for my bad timing in trying to raise these concerns.


Seriously, I don't get the logic in all these groups now on twitter trying to raise money to aid earthquake, tsunami and (now) radiation victims in Japan.

I say that not because I don't care, but 1) because Japan is a self-sustaining, relatively rich first-world country that does not routinely receive or need foreign aid,, and 2) because the amount of what will be needed for Japan to recover (possibly in the trillions) dwarfs anything that could reasonably be raised by charitable fundraising.

So while I've nothing against anyone giving to whatever they wish to donate to, I question the idea of fundraising specifically for Japan.

If people want to help Japan, they should pressure their own governments to work with other governments and the UN to put together the financing and help that Japan will need to rebuild. This isn't the time for bake sales and kids sending in the coins in their piggy banks.

These are nice gestures, and no doubt well-intended, but lets not think that these efforts will be meaningful when measured against the enormous support that will be needed.

[LynneSin]

1. Or we could be good neighbors and help when someone is down

Japan has helped us in the past, why not do the same for them. It's just good policy

[Bragi]

8. I agreee with helping

It's just this type of fundraising makes no sense given the situation.

My concern is that when it comes time to really stand up and help the Japanese people, everyone will think "Hey, I gave them $10 when people were fundraising at the mall, so what more do they want?"

[LynneSin]

52. It's all good karma - why begrudge these folks

If you don't think it's a good idea then don't donate :D

[geardaddy]

2. Interesting thoughts.

I wonder if we received aid from other countries post-Katrina. I know we got rescue workers from abroad, but what about finances?

[LiberalEsto]

4. There were many offers of aid

but our Misadministration at the time turned them down, to the best of my recollection

[geardaddy]

13. Thanks. I thought other countries would offer.

[shraby]

24. My recollection is that the Bushies turned it down cause they

didn't know how to handle it. In other words they didn't know how to rake the cream into their pockets.

[bobbolink]

6. We turned away most of it.

[geardaddy]

15. Thanks bobbolink.

I guesss * wanted to sweep it all under the rug.

[bobbolink]

60. People dying, and * turned away ships with supplies, doctors, etc.

I'm sure his God was proud. :grr:

The one that really got to me was Cuba... they send medical ships to all disasters like that in the area.. they have doctors and nurses to spare. So many people were injured, dehydrated, etc., and they wouldn't let the Cuban ship dock.

:nuke:

[geardaddy]

61. He needs to rot in jail

along with his little cabal.

[bobbolink]

63. I'm all for that, along with a lot of others, but our President is not.

:grr:

[pitohui]

37. lots of donations from japan and japanese people

in the new orleans we accepted the money but ultimately didn't make use of the planning/recovery assistance-- japan had a lot of experience in well-organized planning to re-build in less than 10 years from the kobe earthquake and they had some planning experts that they offered, but i guess it was considered to be a bad fit for american culture, because it was pretty clear that they would have planned for a more efficient smaller footprint city, and it was politically impossible to tell people that certain neighborhoods (like
new orleans east, now pretty much a free flowing guns and drugs and home invasion crime zone) probably shouldn't be rebuilt

but japan didn't just offer expertise, good expertise which we ignored

they gave CASH

we just celebrated the largest mardi gras in history, our recovery was amazing, and a lot of it is thanks to help received from good people all over the nation AND all over the world

george bush could only throw away or lose so much...he did manage to squander millions, such as an entire boat of medical supplies from italy and other awful embarrassments...but don't kid yourself, the donations from good people around the world were a great help

if there is shrinkage, the answer isn't to refuse to help people in need, the answer is to flood the people in need with help and round up the criminal class of thieves later

why deny help to the good people because once in a while a shithead picks up a penny? makes no sense to me...

[geardaddy]

53. Thanks pitohui

Glad N.O. has seen good recovery.

[catabryna]

39. Japan did make financial donations after Katrina, if I recall correctly. nt

[subterranean]

42. The Japanese gave a lot of financial assistance for Katrina.

See this:

http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2005/September/20050915165123ajesrom9.768313e-02.html

[geardaddy]

51. Thanks for the link subterranean

:D

[LanternWaste]

54. Internation Aid for Katrina is listed in the milliions of dollars are per Wiki.

Wikepedia has a list of countries which donated money, material and/or personnel to the Katrina response. From $50,000 from Cyprus to $7,500,000 from Australia.

The listing for Japan is particularly enlightening...
"The Japanese Foreign Ministry said that it would provide $200,000 to the American Red Cross to assist victims of Hurricane Katrina. Japan also identified needs in affected regions via the U.S. government and provided up to $1,000,000 in emergency supplies such as tents, blankets and power generators if they receive requests from the U.S. for such assistance. One Japanese individual, Takashi Endo, donated USD $1,000,000 from his personal funds to Katrina relief efforts."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_response_to_Hurricane_Katrina


ed: grammar

[geardaddy]

57. Thanks for the link LW

I was sure that there was aid from abroad.

Thanks.

[somone]

58. For many years Japan was the second-largest foreign aid donor worldwide

right after the U.S.

[geardaddy]

59. Thanks, that's all I needed to know

:hi:

[el_bryanto]

3. Well that is certainly true

That said, if I donate $20 and that money goes to buy a japanese guy a sandwich; I'm pretty sure he'll appreciate the sandwich.

No reason not to do both.

Bryant

[Renew Deal]

5. If a little bit of money can be raised to make someones life better, then it should be done.

A little more food, clean water, and supplies will go a long way.

[FSogol]

7. People feel powerless in this complex world. If giving $20 makes them feel better, why not?

Will it solve all problems? No, but it won't hurt. Wanting to help is the human thing to do.

[Bragi]

14. I agree with the desire to help out

I agree people want to help, and I have no real problem with "feel good" giving. However, putting $10 into the donation box is not the kind of help that Japan needs.

They will need trillions to rebuild, and the big decisions will be made by governments around the world. That is where I'd rather see the pressure put.

My fear is that the opposite will occur -- people will give their $10, and then agree with their governments when they refuse (due to austerity) to underwrite the big money needed for reconstruction.

I can see this shaping up now. The people who put their money in the donation box will feel self-satisfied that they helped out, despite the fact that it was largely just a symbolic "feel good" act.

[FSogol]

18. Then, match your $10 donation with a call to Eric Cantor's office.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/03/15/956549/-Cantor-To-Japan:-NO-HELP-FROM-US

[shraby]

26. Each 10 bucks will fill in that huge amount...it always has and

always will. If 10 bucks will help a child get water or diapers or whatever it's worth every penny.

[myrna minx]

9. Why did people from all over the world donate pizzas to the Wisconsin

protesters? Because it's kind, thoughtful and helps connect us to one another.

[Bragi]

16. So it's all about the donor feeling good? /nt

[myrna minx]

17. No, but you know that already. n/t

[LanternWaste]

56. I imagine the protesters eating the pizza felt pretty good too...

"So it's all about the donor feeling good?"

I imagine the protesters eating the pizza felt pretty good too. The one does not deny the other... :shrug:

[daleo]

10. Additional resources during an emergency are always helpful

But, it is obviously quite different from Haiti. I suppose it's more akin to a loan than a gift, since Japan will be in the position to help out in the event of a disaster somewhere else in the world, in the not too distant future.

Goodwill and reciprocity go together.

[Bragi]

20. Haiti is a great example of such aid going wrong

People dug deep to help this impoverished nation, and people there haven't received even a decent percentage of all the money "donated" to help them out after their earthquake. It's a scandal how and why this has happened.

[shraby]

27. The republicans blocked the aid going to Haiti. I will never

capitalize that word again. They aren't worthy.

[AsahinaKimi]

11. My sensei sent me this email message today

You might be interested in making a donation to support Japan ,starting from $10. Just informatin I received donate to www.globalgiving.org . Yu

She is from Miyazaki Prfecture. I loved her as my teacher. If she thinks its important, so do I. Next week I plan to donate $300.00. I have already donated $100.00. Its the best I can do.

頑張れ日本 !!

[still_one]

12. I am not sure if you appreciate the situation. There are international organizations, such as the

Red Cross, who have a Japanese branch, and can get help and shelter to these people very quickly

[Dorian Gray]

19. Exactly

If you donate to an aid giving organization that specializes in giving shelter and medical aid to those in need, they will get it to them.

The government will need to rebuild a LOT after this, but right now it's about evacuations, medical aid, and emergency food and shelter. Providing donations to the orgs that provide those things WILL help the people most in need in Japan.

[Bragi]

23. No it won't

Money donated today won't get to Japan for months, if not years.

[KittyWampus]

32. it goes to organizations that WILL BE IN JAPAN. Now you are being obtuse.

[still_one]

35. Really, what if the money is used to buy blankets, food, etc. /nt

[Dorian Gray]

48. Okay

I get it. You don't want to donate to any of the organizations that will provide relief to the Japanese. Don't. It's not our business. You don't need to justify it.

[Bragi]

22. And I expect they will do so

They do not need immediate money from abroad to do that.

In fact, I doubt that any money donated now will get to Japan anytime in the next year.

[Arkansas Granny]

47. The money donated now will probably be used to replenish supplies

that are being used in Japan right now. The aid organizations are not going to wait until they have collected a certain amount of money first and then send help. They are dipping into stocks that they have on hand that will need to be replaced for use in a future disaster.

[Bonobo]

21. Would you say that if this happened in France or Sweden?

Do you think all Japanese people are rich?

Do you realize that tsunami / earthquake insurance doesn't hardly exist in Japan?

Do you realize there will be 50,000 orphans?

Perhaps hundreds of thousands of homeless, if not millions?

I think that is a pretty damn shameless OP.

Even if you thought it yourself, to make the decision to encourage people NOT to donate?

Damn, that's cold for a god of Poetry.

[Bragi]

30. I'd say the same when harm comes to any developed nation

I fear the immediate rush for small donors has more to do with the marketing strategies of aid organizations than it does with helping people through these kind of disasters.

I am simply saying that feel-good giving by individuals won't do much to help Japan now. Japan will need trillions in support. Bake sales and the inevitable "Band AID for Japan" concert isn't going to do the job.

As for being cold, I fear from the reaction here that that may be how my posting is coming across. But in fact I am very concerned about what's happening.

I fear that Japan will end up with piles of blankets stacked at airports, and governments around the world claiming that their citizens have given enough, and it's now up to Japan to come up with the trillions needed for reconstruction.

[Bonobo]

34. I'd say if a stockpile of blankets at airports is the worst thing, it is no big thing.

Karma is real, I think.

Giving is giving and it comes back, goes around and flies into empty spaces.

I think you are talking about very minor stuff.

But consider the effects of posting that "Donating is a bad idea."

It is a messed up and poorly thought out OP if you really do care.

[Dorian Gray]

49. +1

The OP feels like he/she has a stake in proving that Japan is not worthy of aid. Whatever makes him able to sleep at night.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

25. The Japanese government can't do everything by itself

That's why other countries are sending search and rescue teams. People could still be alive in the rubble. About a sixth of the entire country has been devastated.

Did you know that other countries offered to help during Katrina and the Bush administration turned them down?

[Bragi]

36. Here's something few know or talk about

The rescue workers who rushed (selflessly) to Haiti after the earthquake mostly became obstacles to getting things done.

The army of well-intended fire and rescue workers cluttered up airports and prevented medical aid and doctors and heavy equipment that were needed from getting through.

And they rescued very, very few people from the rubble because there was simply no infrastructure to support their efforts. In short, they accomplished very little, and may have inadvertently done more harm than good.

Meanwhile, most of the money that was donated by people for Haiti sits unused, and much of the rubble remains as it was right after the quake, uncleared.

[pitohui]

41. and you know this how? a doctor from new orleans went to haiti himself

do you think his efforts were "clutter?"

i think one more doctor is better than one fewer doctor myself

the problem in haiti is severe, and i'm sorry it wasn't whisked away fast enough or magically enough for you, but it sure as hell wouldn't be whisked away by now if we cruelly refused to do eff-all about it!!!

[Dorian Gray]

50. Yes

x1000

[shraby]

28. This is one of the cruelest posts I've seen in a long time. Why

don't you go where there are like thinkers? I think you'd be much happier. You're giving people a bad name.

[Bonobo]

29. It's not enough to simply not donate, OP feels the need to encourage others not to. nt

[myrna minx]

31. This week has been surreal. I'm so sorry that you've had to

read so much cruel rubbish. I wish you and yours well.

[pitohui]

33. this is a shitty post, what the hell is the matter w. people?

other countries of the world gave millions after katrina, in both supplies and cash, true, bush and his fema were incompetent and not ALL of the money got to where intended but plenty of it did get here and it was BADLY needed -- to make up all these excuses for why you're too cheap to give is just bullshit and i don't see the need for it -- some gov'ts just boldly came in and overrode bush, for instance, city of vancouver and some other canadian cities were rescuing people with helicopters in st. bernard parish while george bush was pretending he didn't even know the parish was completely flooded (EVERY residence was flooded in that parish -- a parish is an entire county, for those who wonder) -- foreign gov'ts got in there and helped A LOT

even tiny brutally poor uganda, some folks from uganda got together and sent $800 to new orleans/lower 9th ward fund, you wouldn't think there was $800 to donate in the whole country, but kind hearts reached out to help

seems like people keep repeating "no money got to new orleans, no money got to haiti," blah de blah, this is bullshit, money got to new orleans and it helped A LOT, and i have full confidence that any money sent to haiti through doctors without borders got there as well

family members in japan (not that part of japan, it's a big place) say that sending donations to red cross international should get there just fine, they also mentioned the globalgiving.org mentioned in another post (a new organization to me)

there will always be crime, waste, & cronies in a natural disaster, some evil people will emerge to line their pockets, however, one must rise above it -- you don't say, "i won't give anything to food stamps because a crackhead might get some food instead of a child," no, you accept that we have an imperfect world and sometimes it's better to feed a child and worry about catching crackheads later, same thing in a disaster, GET THE DAMN MONEY AND SUPPLIES IN PLACE, clean up the criminal class and the takers-of-advantage later

priorities, people, there are people in need right now, red cross may not be perfect but they're in place and it seems to me that any money donated there can get there pretty much immediately, if you use some kind of debit method like paypal

people who want to make excuses to themselves why they're too cheap to give, keep the excuses to yourselves, don't also try to stop others from helping out, if you're a shitty miserable human being, i have an idea--KEEP IT TO YOURSELF

[masmdu]

38. My Two Japanese Children are fundraising to do what they can to help ... There is no reason that

There is no reason that small individual donations and massive governmental giving can't both be done.

For my kids it is a way to not only help others but also to cope with what they see happening.

[zorahopkins]

40. Would You Have Said The Same Thing About Katrina??

Just curious.....

Would you have also said that fundraising to help the victims of Hurricane Katrina made no sense?

After all, the US is "a self-sustaining, relatively rich first-world country that does not routinely receive or need foreign aid".

I donated money to help the people of New Orleans (and I will also donate to help the people of Japan) because it is the right thing to do.

You help people in need when you can.

[demmiblue]

44. That is the first thing that came to mind when reading this post.

Just because a nation is "a self-sustaining, relatively rich first-world country that does not routinely receive or need foreign aid," doesn't mean that timely and comprehensive aid will be given to those most in need.

Besides, the sheer magnitude of this event is staggering.

[zorahopkins]

43. "Nice Gestures"

About those "nice gestures":

I have two things I can do with my money:

I can spend it on myself. (And I don, to need my real needs).

Or I can spend it on others.

Once I have met my own needs, I think the appropriate thing to do is to spend my money to help others -- ESPECIALLY those in dire need.

This is more than a simple "nice gesture".

This is the thing decent people do.

[pintobean]

45. Most of us can't say 'fuck you, friend, you're on your own'.

[judy]

46. You can always donate to the Red Cross

They always need the money, they bring tents and immediate relief supplies.

[dogday]

55. Just like help was offered when Katrina hit. It is the

human thing to do to want to help and offer help.... If you add together all the help being offered, it does make a big difference.

[lumberjack_jeff]

62. Although I don't really agree with you, this is worth discussing.

The immediate humanitarian needs are pretty fundamental; search and rescue, food, medicine. The Red Cross is doing useful work in this regard.

The longer term rebuilding will be immensely expensive and largely be funded Japan itself. In part by curtailing lending to the US.