Not interventing in a situation means that you are willing to accept the stronger side winning

[RZM]

It's ok if you think that, but at least admit it. If you are dead set against intervention in Libya, what you are essentially saying is that the two sides should have a 'fair fight.' And we all know how that will turn out.

[joshcryer]

1. That's why the UN acted. They saw the outcome and it wasn't pretty.

And for the first time they invoked Responsibility to Protect.

[RZM]

2. Exactly

This is what happened in both Spanish Civil War and the first 4 years of the Yugoslav Wars. The great powers dragged their feet and the stronger side had its way. In both cases it led to outcomes that DUers would generally oppose.

[dipsydoodle]

3. For comparison

that didn't happen in Cuba where the Revolution started with just 15 rebels in Santiago de Cuba. The stronger side didn't win - they lost.

[RZM]

4. Apparently they were the stronger side n/t

[dipsydoodle]

7. Yes -as it turned out.

That was mainly to support from the people.

:hi:

[joshcryer]

10. Are you implying that the revolutionaries in Libya could've turned the tide?

I think that is unbelievably doubtful. And it detracts from the thousands that would have died if the UN didn't invoke R2P.

[dipsydoodle]

13. I'm not implying anything.

I do however think they started this in anticipation of outside help unlike Castro's crew.

[joshcryer]

14. I don't think so, they got over a dozen cities before Gaddafi hit back.

I think they stretched themselves very thin and were naive in their progress.

[joshcryer]

6. If Batista had west provided armaments I think that would've been quite a different affair.

The Battle of Las Mercedes was a strategic failure and had Castro's cease fire been ignored Cuba would look quite different today.

[dipsydoodle]

8. If Batista had west provided armaments ?

So where did he get his arms from ?

[joshcryer]

9. I meant heavy arms.

I do not believe he had, say, arty and tanks and jets, as Gaddafi does- erm, did.

[ejpoeta]

5. how fair is that fight when saudi arabia (?) has sent soldiers in to help

khadaffi?

[RZM]

11. I'm not aware of that

I don't think that the Saudis have sent troops into Libya, though they have sent them into Bahrain, which is an action I strongly oppose. What I mean by 'fair fight' is the government and rebels slogging it out, which is what much of DU seems to be in favor of. All I'm saying is that we all know who will win such a contest.

[ejpoeta]

12. was it bahrain? i am sorry. i get confused there is so much going on over in that area.

I am torn by this because I feel that since the rebels have started it they definitely need help. my concern is that we tend to get ourselves involved and then think that we have a right to tell them what to do after that.