Impeach Obama Over Libya, You Got to Be Kidding

[ProSense]

Impeach Obama Over Libya, You Got to Be Kidding

By earl ofari hutchinson

Perennial congressional gadfly Dennis Kucinich completely lost his political screws when he even uttered the word "impeachment" of President Obama over his action in Libya. Kucinich has often been the lone, outraged voice, in blistering Obama on everything from his tax cut compromise with the GOP to his Afghan war policy, but the Libya outburst made no sense by even Kucinich's radical rhetoric standards.

No one disputes the legal, constitutional and political need of Presidents to get approval from t Congress when the issue is waging war.

This obligation is clearly spelled out in the War Powers Act. And those congresspersons that made that point were right to make it. Kucinich and the handful of Democrats that rip Obama about Libya certainly know that there is virtually no possibility that Obama will blatantly abuse that power as Bush did in Iraq and Afghanistan and commit American ground troops to combat in Libya. That would be a gross violation of the provisions of the Act.

Obama backed the Libyan no fly zone because the United Nations "Security Council by unanimous vote backed it. The House Foreign affairs and intelligence committees backed the action. The Arab league backed it. And nearly every humanitarian group around has backed it. But most important he backed it because it's the politically and morally right thing to do. Kucinich and others would have screamed the loudest if Obama had done nothing and Khadafy slaughtered thousands in a revenge blood lust rampage against the rebel groups. In his case, and that of every other dictator that's ever been under siege from their own people that almost always translates out to the slaughter of innocent women children and old folk, under the guise of restoring order. If Obama hadn't acted he would have been even more loudly damned as being weak, indecisive and a chronic ditherer when it comes to making tough decisions on foreign policy issues.

He's already heard that slander endlessly from his GOP attackers. So the screams about the president violating congressional trust and prerogatives simply adds to the noise. Kucinich and some of Obama's severest critics among Democrats real goal is to send the message that they don't like a lot of what Obama does and they will pick at every little issue to dramatize their pique at him. They continue to hope that they can nudge Obama from his cautious, centrist stance they loath on issues a little more to the left. Libya is just the latest, and the most convenient way to do that.

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Kucinich has lost his mind!

A U.N. resolution is not a unilateral U.S. action.

[patrick t. cakes]

1. Bush was impeachable...nt

[dennis4868]

28. HE LIED....and many died.....

big difference...

[mmonk]

2. It may not be a unilateral action but the Constitution does not make

adjustments based on the amount of combatants.

[Karmadillo]

4. Empires don't need no Constitution.

nt

[Motown_Johnny]

6. please go look up the War Powers Act, you are just so F___ing wrong here

I don't have the words to describe it


POTUS has 60 days before he needs Congress to approve


http://www.thecre.com/fedlaw/legal22/warpow.htm

^snip^

SEC. 5. (b)

Within sixty calendar days after a report is submitted or is required to be submitted pursuant to section 4(a)(1), whichever is earlier, the President shall terminate any use of United States Armed Forces with respect to which such report was submitted (or required to be submitted), unless the Congress (1) has declared war or has enacted a specific authorization for such use of United States Armed Forces, (2) has extended by law such sixty-day period, or (3) is physically unable to meet as a result of an armed attack upon the United States. Such sixty-day period shall be extended for not more than an additional thirty days if the President determines and certifies to the Congress in writing that unavoidable military necessity respecting the safety of United States Armed Forces requires the continued use of such armed forces in the course of bringing about a prompt removal of such forces.

[Modern_Matthew]

10. A piece of paper means diddly. War is wrong no matter what's collecting dust in our law archives. nt

[Motown_Johnny]

15. isn't the Constitution a piece of paper? Are not all our laws just pieces of paper?

I suppose WWII was a bad thing. We should have let the Fascists conquer the entire world instead, it was a war and therefore must have been wrong no matter what.

BTW the war powers act is from 1973. Not much dust yet when compared to other laws. ~9 months younger than Roe v Wade.

[dennis4868]

29. get your damn facts out of here....

this is DU for gods sake....we bash Obama 24/7 here no matter what the damn facts are....

[mmonk]

32. Read it. It is supposed to relate to unavoidable necessity.

[ProSense]

7. It's a U.N. action

Congress cannot impeach a President for following the U.N. Charter. It's completely bizarre to even suggest that. Also, even the War Powers act gives the President months to gain Congressional approval.

Kucinich is either pretending to be or is oblivious of those facts.

[David__77]

11. The UN doesn't supersede the US law.

This is a sovereign country, and its leaders must follow US law. If there is any contradiction between US and UN, the US supersedes it. The UN resolution compelled no one to "take action." It did ALLOW the US to do so according to its own dictates.

[ProSense]

19. What?

The U.S. signed the U.N. charter, which is specific.

If Kucinich wants to revoke the charter, there are likely a number of Republicans who will join him in doing so.

[David__77]

23. Are you saying the UN charter trumps US constitutional or statutory law?

...

[dennis4868]

30. no....

the US Constitution says Obama has 60 days...what is the problem here?

[mmonk]

35. There is no reason to have a Congress involved at all in war under your premise.

[dennis4868]

36. No again....

If Obama wants to extend this military action he will have to get Congressional approval after 60 days from the start of the action....he has no obligation to get approval now....I know DUers hate Obama but please dont change the US constitution because of your hate....

[mmonk]

42. The War Powers Resolution, a law created in the wake of the Vietnam war

still requires an unavoidable reason to commit. It can not be argued that the decision was unavoidable rendering no consultation before hand unavoidable or that the US was under attack.

The War Powers Resolution of 1973 (50 U.S.C. 1541–1548) was a United States Congress joint resolution providing that the President can send U.S. armed forces into action abroad only by authorization of Congress or if the United States is already under attack or serious threat. The War Powers Resolution requires the president to notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action and forbids armed forces from remaining for more than 60 days, with a further 30 day withdrawal period, without an authorization of the use of military force or a declaration of war. The resolution was passed by two-thirds of Congress, overriding a presidential veto.

My arguments have nothing to do with the standard Obama apologist line of "hating Obama".

[ProSense]

45. Here is something

established long before Vietnam.

[mmonk]

53. See my answers there.

[amandabeech]

49. Not the Constitution. It's the War Powers Act. n/t

[ProSense]

33. Are you

that a President deciding to honor a treaty or a charter which the U.S. signed onto is an impeachable offense?

How utterly ridiculous.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

41. well, the supermacy clause might have some impact if the charter is considered a treaty of sorts

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land ; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding.

[AsahinaKimi]

3. Wouldn't it be amazing if

The Republicans jumped on the Kucinich Band wagon?...then again, maybe not. :crazy:

[Joe the Revelator]

5. Dennis is such a dope.

[Modern_Matthew]

8. Sounds good to me. A decision to go to war should always be met with such action. nt

[Azathoth]

9. Go wrestle some more olives Dennis n/t

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

12. Oh, well, it's just another war. Let's just ignore it and get on with selling arms to Brazil.

Peace prize, anyone?

[dennis4868]

31. Obama should get the peace prize...

for this....this is a humanitarial action saving innocent lives.....i think libs woud never approve of war....if they had their way Jews in Germany would still be in the ovens....

[Windy]

37. The UN should have acted in Darfur too... would have prevented a slaughter

I agree with you. Many here would oppose going after Hitler for what he did to the Jewish race and would think that talk of the camps was just smoke and mirrors to justify war...

Sometimes the use of military power, when it is an international action and not a unilateral one, is just to save lives.

Some here would like to see no U.S. military at all. Very Polyannish...

[dennis4868]

39. I agree with you 100%

But I also think there are many here against this military action because Obama is for it....if a Holocaust was happening some where in the world and Obama wanted to go in and stop it Michael Moore and the ultra liberal DUers would be against it only because Obama was for it....it's sad but true.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. Maybe. He seems to have hocked the first one to the MIC and the Neo-cons.

[Motown_Johnny]

13. Kuch's constituents eat this stuff up. Nobody seems to understand that

Dennis is doing what is in his best political interest to do.



Sometimes it is a good thing. The Kucinich Amendment in the HCR law was a very very good thing. Dennis going off the deep end every time any military action is taken is a bad thing but his approval rating among Liberals in his district just went up.

[patrick t. cakes]

14. oh, his district sounds horrible...

:sarcasm:

[Motown_Johnny]

18. not at all, but everyone seems to think he is never motivated by self interest

he is a politician (and a fairly successful one at that)


as I said, sometimes it is a good thing, sometimes it isn't

[patrick t. cakes]

22. im just glad his self interest

is a progressive self interest.
wish more politicians had that.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

21. Durn, bleeding heart liberals, just don't understand that war is a good thing.

Or, as the general said, "Killing is fun."

[Scurrilous]

16. Dennis ain't kidding.

He's series!!1!

[GSLevel9]

17. political events like this separate the political "fan-boys"

from the honest citizen.

[BeFree]

20. Just a no-fly zone idea

<snicker>
I am glad to see our representatives being mad about this new war.
Because the warmongerers make me sick.

[provis99]

24. it is not a benign no-fly zone, Hutchinson you idiot.

Its a goddamn full-scale bombing war. You know, stuff that liberals threatened to impeach George Bush over.

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Windy]

38. He's off... we call him Moon Man in our house..and he is a publicity hound.

Sad but true.
He has some good ideas, but he is the Ron Paul of the dems.

[Desertrose]

51. Uber Left?

You have to be fucking kidding me.

So now we are "them". Says it all.

[Buzz Clik]

58. If, after all the water under the bridge, you embrace Kucinich, you are "them"

Period.

[Desertrose]

59. Please explain what bridge & what water.

"them"...just who exactly are "them"again?

[Buzz Clik]

62. Your word, not mine.

Tell me your intention, and I'll tell you if I agree.

[Rex]

26. I agree, what a fucking joke!

I LOVE DK...but seriously folks, we are all about to lose our minds if we do this; let us not impeach ANOTHER Democratic POTUS! IMO the absolute wrong thing to do right now is impeach or talk about impeaching Obama. He has 90 days before he has to go before Congress and explain his actions...it was CONGRESS that gave the POTUS these powers!

Don't like it? Then get rid of the War Powers act! Hard to blame the guy, if the blamers are the enablers!

[dennis4868]

34. Impeach for what?

because Obama did not get congressional approval before 60 days when he has 60 days per the constitution? WTF is wrong with Kucinich and the very left of left of DUers....

[Rex]

40. I dunno, I am just as confused over all this as you.

And I am a liberal! It is as if they forgot was laws their own governing body passed in the past!!! It is kinda embaressing, no really really embaressing.

I THOUGHT IMPEACHEMENT WAS OFF THE TABLE?

No wonder we lose...argh...I need to go outside for awhile.

[meow mix]

27. and when this is done DK can sink into obscurity

keep flapping your mouth dennis dig deeper.

[Monique1]

48. DK is an extremist

Glad I never voted for him.

[krabigirl]

56. lool. Yeah, so extremist, to consider that perhaps another war is not in our best interests?

It's the neocons and neolibs that are extremists.

[geek tragedy]

43. I bet 50% of this site agrees with DK. nt

[NorthCarolina]

47. Maybe even more than 50%. nt

[Shagbark Hickory]

46. If US boots on the ground in Libya then yes, totally.

[jwirr]

50. I do not want to defend this war - I am very uneasy about it but this

is different than the boooosh war. We are working through the UN and with allies. Obama has already said no troops and no occupation. Now we wait and see how truthful he has been with us.

[Ignis]

52. "Kucinich has lost his mind!" ... except when he does exactly what we want.

:eyes:

Some Democrats are true to their core principles. And then there are the "Centrist" politicians, who shift with the wind when it's politically expedient.

[fittosurvive]

54. War is defined is a behavior pattern of organized violent conflict.

I believe the power to declare war was vested in the Congress to ensure a rational contemplation of the grievances, as well as the projected cost of lives and resources of the People. The War Powers Act has resulted in one disastrous blunder after another and now The United States is charging into a third undeclared war in the Middle East.

These so-called police actions usually develop in situations that result in our troops being stuck in no-win situations. The Constitution permits the President to act if the legislature cannot be convened; however, that is not an issue in the present era. In view of that, the War Powers Act was an unnecessary relinquishment of Congressional power to the Executive branch, thereby denying the People's representatives the opportunity to consider the consequences, and then decide the matter as a legislative body.

Are willing to sacrifice your life for the Libyan revolution? How about the lives of your children? To be clear, you are calling on others to do just that. Before we go to war with Libya, the People's representatives should demonstrate why the outcome of this conflict justifies the sacrifice of their sons and daughters.

[krabigirl]

55. good for Kucinich.

[Dangerman]

57. Kucinich is my hero.

He's right about the Iraq War and is right about the unnecessary assault on Libya.

Do not insult him ProSense. Millions of civilians and thousands of soldiers died in that hellhole in Iraq. And I don't want the same happening in Libya.

[bluestate10]

60. The White House must send Dennis an olive wrap to silence him.

Progressives like Kucinich can't have issues two ways. Either stop a brutal maniac dictator that has promised to revenge kill his people, or stand aside and let the maniac carry out his promise. Kucinich has a bit of moral blindness going on.

[FLPanhandle]

61. Shit like this is why Kucinich has no credibility

Come on Dennis, think before talking.