For those against intervention: How many women/children need to die before you would support it?

[Very_Boring_Name]

[Taitertots]

1. How many women and children will we murder by going to war with them?

We will get far more civilian casualties than we hope to prevent.

So how many women and children do you support murdering?

[silver10]

3. +1

[Arctic Dave]

2. Before we started dropping bombs on Libya the world did business with MG.

How many miles were you willing to walk or what price a gallon of gas would pay for our countries to not do business with a crazy dictator?

[silver10]

5. +1

[TBF]

41. At least you are honest Arctic Dave,

I give you props for that.

[atreides1]

4. 900,000 died

In Rwanda, and the UN ran with it's tail between it's legs, and the US wouldn't classify it as genocide until years later.

[Old and In the Way]

13. Clinton has said that this was the nadir of his Presidency.

I think he deeply regrets not intervening and spearheading UN action to stop that bloodbath.

[joshcryer]

18. Hey, you do know R2P was created because of Rwanda right? Took 'em 11 years...

...but they finally passed it.

[sabrina 1]

28. Link please. I know this is a talking point meant to gain

support for this latest war for oil, but so far I have found nothing to back it up.

I would appreciate a link that proves the U.S. is so regretful for not interfering in Rwanda that they decided to make up for it by starting a war in oil rich Libya.

Thank you in advance.

[swilton]

32. You're right

And the next thing they'll do is create a museum to the victims of genocide - I'm sure these after the fact actions will make the families of the victims feel so much better!

:sarcasm:

[sabrina 1]

33. And as you can see, there is no response.

Same old propaganda we saw during the Iraq war. It was all about liberating the Iraqi people from a brutal 'torturer'! I recall rightwingers accusing me of wanting the Iraqi people to be 'tortured'.

When the Abu Ghraib atoricites were revealed, I asked them to tell me again about how we were liberating the Iraqis from torture. For at least a day, before arch propagandist Limbaugh returned from the weekend to tell them what to think and to deliver the talking points, they were silent.

[DainBramaged]

37. Your seeing their best and brightest trying to sell this UN 'action'.

[sabrina 1]

46. Looks that way, not very impressive. Watching news from

around the globe, no one is buying it. Too eerily similar to our last illegal invasion.

Does Congress even know we went to war btw? Just wondering. I know we have a unitary executive now, but a little semblance of democracy to keep us believing, would be nice. I guess they don't feel the need to even pretend we're a democracy anymore.

[Telly Savalas]

52. Did you try google?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&biw=1366&bih=554&q=rwanda+responsibility+to+protect&aq=0&aqi=g1g-v2g-b7&aql=&oq=rwanda+respon

While whether Libya is an appropriate application of R2P is certainly subject to debate, it's pretty well documented that the doctrine was established in response to the Rwandan genocide. That's not a cheesy talking point. It's a fact.

[myrna minx]

6. Thank god we saved all of those women and children in Darfur on our

mission of humanitarianism. Oh wait...
On edit - I'm not voting in your poll.

[rfranklin]

7. How many do we have to kill before we stop butting in all over the world?

We are not the world police.

[bobbolink]

35. "We" didn't "butt in". The Libyan people asked.. no... BEGGED the UN to approve a

no-fly zone.

Maybe that distinction doesn't mean anything to you, but it does to some of us.

[rfranklin]

39. All 6 million of the Libyans begged?

You are naive.

[bobbolink]

47. Thank you for the name-calling. I guess you are one of the ones who is falling for the Faux meme

that this is a "civil war"?

Yeah, you wanna call names, cuz you can't discuss with reason, so I will come back with the snark.

Isn't it fun?

[rfranklin]

60. I wouldn't know about the "civil war" meme...

But Richard Perle--remember him--seems to think we need regime change in Libya...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x705412

[AsahinaKimi]

58. I didn't get my badge in the mail yet...

Did anyone :shrug:?

[Old and In the Way]

8. I guess it feels better to let Gaddahfi do whatever he wishes to the Libyan people.

Or any murderous dictator for that matter. I would be interested in seeing some of our posters who are so anti-intervention, quantify their opposition in expendable lives. Looks like one already has.

[EFerrari]

12. I guess embarrassing false dilemmas are all the rage around here on this issue. n/t

[wellst0nev0ter]

20. No, He's Right

I would have gladly went to war with the Soviet Union back when it existed. Why should defenseless non-nuke countries have all the fun?

Edit: Now that I think about it, I'm in a mood for some Chinese. You?

[EFerrari]

23. Sounds like a plan.

:)

[meow mix]

9. wow 10 million isnt even enough, glad DU wasnt around in the 30s

theyd probally be tearing up for hitler right now.

[Cali_Democrat]

22. Hitler declared war on the United States

[hfojvt]

30. 10 million would be kinda tough

considering the current population of Libya is under 7 million.

[WatsonT]

45. In the 30s Hitler hadn't killed 10 million

[angstlessk]

10. Is that that WE kill or THEY kill?

[grahamhgreen]

11. I just want to know HOW MANY IN THIS COUNTRY WILL DIE WHEN WE USE THE MONEY FOR SOCIAL PROGRAMS TO

fund another war?

[Modern_Matthew]

26. +1

[snappyturtle]

48. +1 nt

[jacquelope]

50. Booyahhh!!!! Well said! n/t

.

[patrick t. cakes]

57. now your just being greedy.....

:sarcasm:

[Foo Fighter]

59. I think the answer those in DC would give is "Whatever it takes."

War profiteering spending knows no bounds. However, funding for food stamps needs to be cut back. And Social Security and Medicare spending is completely out of control...yeah, we've been pwned.

[lumberjack_jeff]

14. I support action if the lives saved outnumber the lives lost.

I think that Obama is right about this.

[mzteris]

15. those answering the last

so you'd be against intervening in Hitler's pogrom, too, I take it?

they're just women and children, after all, right?

I'm "anti-war". I'm anti-death penalty. Hell, I don't even believe in killing animals! But let someone try to hurt my children and I'll do anything - whatever it takes - to protect them.

What do you do against a madman who is hellbent on murdering anyone who gets in his way?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

16. How many people did we kill in our "interventions" in Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos,

Iraq, Afghanistan, and, now Libya? Not to mention our efforts "intervening" on the side of various dictators in Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador, Mozambique, Congo, Angola, and many more.

If Gadhaffi killed all his people he'd still be far behind our record of slaughter.

[joshcryer]

17. Please tell me DUers didn't really vote this way.

:(

[wtmusic]

19. No f*cking kidding.

Next question: You see someone drowning in a river... :crazy:

[joshcryer]

21. It was a lame poll but whoever voted that way...

:(

[wtmusic]

24. A step further: If we could save 900,000 by killing one person, should we do it?

Or killing 10? 100? 10,000?

[grahamhgreen]

55. If we could save 45,000/year by increasing taxes on 400 rich hoarders, should we do it?

[wtmusic]

56. Absolutely nt

[wellst0nev0ter]

27. Like Me?

Going into a country with no clue what the endgame is going to look like is not being "humanitarian" in my book.

[Upton]

31. I voted that way..

not because I want see millions die, but because the poll is BS...

[fascisthunter]

25. rrrright

I think we need to start to take care of our OWN problems.

[Starry Messenger]

29. For all of the born-again humanitarians here...

Where were you all when this first started? I'm seeing lots of new faces of people who are suddenly "concerned" about Libyans now that the US is going in.

[elocs]

34. For most DUers against intervention this is a black/white, right/wrong issue

and they can see it no other way.

Would we actually be willing to stand by and do nothing, watching people being killed by a superior force simply because their nation has oil? Does this mean that if Libya was like Haiti and had nothing we would help them? Are Libyans disqualified from help because we are not perfect or consistent in how we give it?

If the rebels in Libya got no help would there be a lot of sorrow and hand wringing here when Khadafi crushed them and then took revenge on the supporters, or would it be "too bad, so sad"?

If we cannot help those who truly need our help in spite of the fact that their county has oil, then we truly have lost our soul as a nation.

[DainBramaged]

36. What a horrible thread

How many Americans should die to satisfy Colonialistic expansion by the Right?

[Gormy Cuss]

38. To the OP: What's your response to this question?

Just curious.

[Very_Boring_Name]

51. I support the intervention so the question does not apply to me

[Gormy Cuss]

53. No, the question does apply. Did you support it when the first Libyan was killed?

When it was clear that it was at least a dozen? A hundred? A thousand?

eta: It applies to you because you posited that a body count was the measure of when the U.S. should intervene.

[Very_Boring_Name]

54. The second a dictator starts attacking peaceful protestors, I support it

[JackRiddler]

40. How many women/children must be killed by America before you oppose more wars?

[TBF]

42. Where were you when the women/children were being killed in Rwanda? nt

[BulletproofLandshark]

43. Fuck your ridiculous push poll. n/t

[WatsonT]

44. Wrong question

since people have already pointed out the numerous *worse* atrocities that were ignored I will skip that part.

The real question is: why is it our responsibility? Are we the worlds policemen?

Also weren't there numerous polls basically like this in the lead up to the Iraq invasion?

Saddam used poison gas on his own people, you support the invasion?

[tledford]

49. At least half as many as our cruise missiles and bombs will kill. eom