This is a big part of this country's problems: Collectively, we're fucking stupid

[cali]

How Dumb Are We?
NEWSWEEK gave 1,000 Americans the U.S. Citizenship Test--38 percent failed. The country's future is imperiled by our ignorance.



They’re the sort of scores that drive high-school history teachers to drink. When NEWSWEEK recently asked 1,000 U.S. citizens to take America’s official citizenship test, 29 percent couldn’t name the vice president. Seventy-three percent couldn’t correctly say why we fought the Cold War. Forty-four percent were unable to define the Bill of Rights. And 6 percent couldn’t even circle Independence Day on a calendar.

Don’t get us wrong: civic ignorance is nothing new. For as long as they’ve existed, Americans have been misunderstanding checks and balances and misidentifying their senators. And they’ve been lamenting the philistinism of their peers ever since pollsters started publishing these dispiriting surveys back in Harry Truman’s day. (He was a president, by the way.) According to a study by Michael X. Delli Carpini, dean of the Annenberg School for Communication, the yearly shifts in civic knowledge since World War II have averaged out to “slightly under 1 percent.”

But the world has changed. And unfortunately, it’s becoming more and more inhospitable to incurious know-nothings—like us.

To appreciate the risks involved, it’s important to understand where American ignorance comes from. In March 2009, the European Journal of Communication asked citizens of Britain, Denmark, Finland, and the U.S. to answer questions on international affairs. The Europeans clobbered us. Sixty-eight percent of Danes, 75 percent of Brits, and 76 percent of Finns could, for example, identify the Taliban, but only 58 percent of Americans managed to do the same—even though we’ve led the charge in Afghanistan. It was only the latest in a series of polls that have shown us lagging behind our First World peers.

<snip>

http://www.newsweek.com/2011/03/20/how-dumb-are-we.html?om_rid=CTiCsY&om_mid=_BNhmKiB8ZvuD37#

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Botany]

2. Take the test

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2011/0104/Could-you-pass-a-US-citizenship-test/Who-signs-bills


I got a 98% .... it is easy

[cali]

3. that's what's frightening, isn't it? It is easy.

[trotsky]

10. Mind-numbingly easy.

Like 7th grade civics easy.

Which, yes, makes this news all the more disturbing.

[Botany]

13. i know somebody who might not do very well on that test

I would love to see her take that test by herself ..... I would bet she wouldn't get a an 80%.

[fightforwhatsright]

20. What if???

If America is STUPID enough to elect this woman president I will move to Sweden!! How can anyone with a brain cell intake take her seriously? REALLY???

[beac]

33. 80%???? She'd be hard pressed to get 8%!! -- and that's if you spotted her on all

the VP questions.

[Modern_Matthew]

57. I missed the type of economy. Could've sworn it is considered "mixed" nt

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

17. I got 97% and feel slightly embarrassed. nt

[Botany]

21. I missed the # of amendments to the Constitution

I picked 23 not 27 :dunce: = Botany

[Auggie]

28. Same here

plus the Federal Papers question and the draft registration question

:dunce: :dunce: :dunce:

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

36. I answered Madison instead of Jefferson. Also got the one on Ben Franklin wrong. Which made me

feel extra stupid. :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

35. That's the 1st one I missed. I picked the same answer. But I'll just go with the excuse that

I wasn't born and raised here....... :silly:

[Zorra]

40. Same here. nt

[ReggieVeggie]

32. I'll let you know my results after this stupid web design let's me finish it n/t

[Frank Cannon]

90. I got bored 10 questions in.

If I did the whole quiz, I'd be here all day waiting for each &#^#ing question (and its answer) to load.

[Zorra]

37. I believe I could have passed it when I was in 5th grade.

And I'm no rocket scientist.

Had to stop at 48 questions because the website was responding to slowly. Had 1 wrong answer.

[NYC Liberal]

42. 99% for me

[Evoman]

45. I got the first 15 right,,,,and I'm not American.

After that, I got impatient. That test was not set up well, loading a question per page.

[krispos42]

73. 95/96

And that miss was due to a wrong mouse click; I knew the answer!

[EstimatedProphet]

74. Perfect score

[JohnyCanuck]

84. How do you answer this sample question?

What is the "rule of law"?

a)Everyone must follow the law.


b)Everyone but the President must follow the law.


c)Government does not have to follow the law.


d)All laws must be the same in every state.

Now that's a tough one to answer these days.

[Frank Cannon]

91. Tough for some.

Generally, people with an (R) after their name.

[jpgray]

4. Stupid? Lazy? Incurious? Mix?

[cali]

5. sure, all of those things.

and more- anti-intellectual, overly materialistic, etc.

[whathehell]

27. Speak for yourself and

the 38%. Those adjectives (and scores) don't represent me

or any Americans I know.

[cali]

50. uh, you do know what collectively means, right?

read the frickin' article. And no, I'm not part of the uninformed. I'm part of the egghead over educated crowd- hell, I was that by the time I was 12.

[whathehell]

68. Uh, yeah...

and I read the frickin' article...Read my frickin' comment.

[whathehell]

76. Unaware is more like it..

Unaware and lacking in the leisure

time afforded most of the other Western democracies

with their much longer vacation

times, shorter work weeks, (um, no.."lazy" wouldn't be it)

is more like it.

Positing that some people are naturally more "stupid"

sounds out and out racist.

At this point, we have a lot less of a "middle class" and as

the article itself notes, the ranking of the more "well off"

Americans is comparable to the Europeans.

"Stupid", and "incurious", my ass.:eyes:

[OHdem10]

6. It is much easier to govern when ignorance prevails. I give you

the Middle East.

Who is rising up against Government?? The Educated.
All the young people have become educated and understand
their are better ways.

When you have populations who are either uninformed or
ill-informed they are much easier to manipulate. It does
not matter where they are located geographically. When
a country "puts down" scientific knowledge and denigrates
educated citizens, ignorance and misinformed people prevail
but the country falls behind. Can be beneficial to leaders
who are manipulative in their approach.

[DCKit]

15. Standard operating procedure for any repressive/regressive regime.

The number of scientists and intellectuals who fled from Nazi Germany, Communist Russia, et al is all the example any of us should need to prove the point.

However, where those regimes were actually rounding up and either imprisoning or killing those with a clue, here we see the marginalization of intelligence - the use of the media in swaying public opinion to shut down any reasonable discourse. Insidious.

[newfie11]

7. it will get worse

Teachers being layed off, fox news and the rest of murdocks channels. It's no wonder so many repugs were elected

[L. Coyote]

61. Watch the film "Stupid" for a clear idea of the problem.

Also:

Stupidity(2003)

In this cheeky documentary, filmmaker Albert Nerenberg conducts an inquiry into the origins of stupidity, exploring why humans increasingly choose to be ignorant despite information being more widely available than ever. Footage includes interviews with authors, academicians and pop-culture personalities such as Noam Chomsky, Coolio, John Cleese, Salma Hayek and Bill Maher.

[eridani]

83. Trying to strike one more blow against the confusion of stupidity with ignorance

Stupidity is comparatively rare, and can'tt be helped. Ignorance is a choice, which makes it much worse.

[Auggie]

8. Who does a U.S. Senator represent? There isn't an option for "largest corporate campaign donor."

No wonder so many fail the test.

Yes, easy test. Score: 96%

[tosh]

25. Yes, I thought the same thing.

[lonestarnot]

9. Too busy texting, gaming and drinking to learn shit.

[reggie the dog]

92. while us criminals smoked a pipe, read a book, talked

about what we read with others.... if you don't belive me compare the level of conversations in most bars in the usa with those of most coffeehouses full of americans in amsterdam.

[TwilightGardener]

11. Apparently, the country runs on autopilot while we have our heads up our asses.

At some point, our addiction to toys and movies and games and People magazine and dance contests, to the exclusion of important "boring" stuff like how our nation runs and what is happening in the world, will doom us.

[L. Coyote]

63. If George Washington is the father of our country, who was the mother?

Will the 10 % who answered "Sarah Palin" please go back to first grade :rofl:

[bullwinkle428]

12. I would LOVE to see how Michelle Bachmann would score!

:rofl:

[WatsonT]

14. And every one of them can vote

that thought keeps me up at night.

[rasputin1952]

16. I took the 20 question test and got them all correct...

In fact, I found it pretty easy. Incredibly, one of the easiest one's, "What is the term for a US Senator?"...(6 yrs), had a 71% fail...:eyes:

I took one of these when I took American Government at the local Community College...6 individuals in the class were gearing up to become citizens, only they, and I aced the thing. Students going back 4-5 generations came out average, or worse yet, actually failed...82% didn't know that women were granted suffrage in 1920, (the question had only the dates: 1776, 1789, 1863, 1920; not mentioning it was the XIX Amendment).

[dmosh42]

18. I call it the "Nation of Morons"! Most people will know all about Celebrities and billionaires...

but can't remember why or who they could vote for. Pathetic.

[whathehell]

30. Are you a Ranking Member?

I am put off by the percentage

but I'm also annoyed by the ongoing,

sometimes self-serving attempts to paint the

entire country as a "nation of morons".

[whathehell]

43. I don't know what Ignored said below, so

I guess I'll have to imagine the worst, lol.

[dmosh42]

44. Well, if you're in disagreement, tell us the highlights of our 'educated'...

society. Maybe I missed something that you see so clearly with all your knowledge.

[whathehell]

69. I believe my statement speaks for itself.

If YOU are in disagreement with that,

I believe it's you who owe an explanation.

[reggie the dog]

93. most of us are not morans

a good third of us in the USA on the other hand.....

[vaberella]

19. My mum and I passed with perfect scores---well, we're not American by birth so had to take the test.

nt

[rustydog]

22. I remember this rant by an idiot in the comment section of a news story

Who insisted America was a Christian nation and the fact that our founding fathers placed the phrase "In god we Trust" on our money and: "One nation, Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance is PROOF!

I am ready to give up all hope for this country.

[reggie the dog]

94. that was an easy argument to debunk

just look at any coin from before the 20th century.

[Angry Dragon]

23. The test should be required to run for office

and they need to get 100% because they are the ones making the laws so they need to prove they know what they are doing

[Hotler]

24. kicking n/t

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Gormy Cuss]

29. It doesn’t help that the United States has one of the highest levels of income inequality...

It doesn’t help that the United States has one of the highest levels of income inequality in the developed world, with the top 400 households raking in more money than the bottom 60 percent combined. As Dalton Conley, an NYU sociologist, explains, “it’s like comparing apples and oranges. Unlike Denmark, we have a lot of very poor people without access to good education, and a huge immigrant population that doesn’t even speak English.” When surveys focus on well-off, native-born respondents, the U.S. actually holds its own against Europe.

Note the last line.

[whathehell]

72. You are correct....When you are working two or three jobs to make ends meet

brushing up on history and/or current events

is probably not uppermost in your mind.

[Marr]

31. So cutting education would be a stupid move, right?

No... somehow that's the responsible, adult, "serious" thing to do.

[unblock]

34. worse, we take PRIDE in our stupidity.

if a candidate for office scored 100% on such a test, they had best keep it a secret. seriously, it would hurt their image as an "ordinary joe".

it's not just that we're dumb, we actively seek out dumb. we don't trust smart. we've been brainwashed to think smart means evil somehow.

[whathehell]

80. "We"?...You're mistakenly conflate a Minority with "Americans in general" and that's wrong.

It's too large a minority, but it's still a MINORITY.

[reggie the dog]

95. +1

[whathehell]

100. Lose the "We" and speak for yourself..

Maybe "you" take pride in "your" stupidity.

Leave the rest of us out of it.:eyes:

[unblock]

112. wow, i seem to have struck a nerve -- you responded defensively twice to the same post!

in the other one, you made a simple grammatical error ("you're mistakenly conflate"). normally, i wouldn't bother pointing that out, but given that you want to talk about '"my" stupidity' in this one, i thought i'd clue you in.

also, in the other post, you acknowledge that o.p.'s point, but somehow it's important to you that it's merely a significant minority, not a majority. yet, that's the problem with generalizations; they don't operate by majority rules. if a minority is significant enough, well-positioned enough, vocal enough, and so on, they are in a position to define the group's image. sad, but true.

of course, in this post, you make it clear you don't care about america's image, you only care about your image and my image. you want to make it clear that you're not one of those stupid people and that i am one of those stupid people. well, good luck with that. it may not make america a better place, but i suppose it will do something for your ego, and that's all that really matters, right?

[whathehell]

113. wow...you seem to want to think so, lol

"yet, that's the problem with generalizations; they don't operate by majority rules. if a minority is significant enough, well-positioned enough, vocal enough, and so on, they are in a position to define the group's image. sad, but true".

Sorry, dear, but the above statement is a matter of dispute. Oh, and you've made some spelling errors. Normally I wouldn't point that out, but since you want to point out my grammatical errors, I thought I'd clue you in.

As important as the significance, positioning and vocal ability of the generalization would be the willingness
of a particular audience to accept it as fact.

I can understand that willingness, when it comes from citizens of other nations who resent (rightly or wrongly) our power and influence.

I do not understand it coming from other Americans.


You say that I "don't care about America's image", but I am trying to defend

it. It's you and a few others here who seem to delight in debasing it.

[leftstreet]

38. Bullshit. It's useless information

Americans can tear apart car engines, repair broken sinks, perform brain surgery, teach their kids the alphabet, cook pot roasts, and program computers.


What does not knowing the name of the Vice President have to do with anything?

:shrug:

[ReggieVeggie]

39. being an informed voter?

maybe?

[leftstreet]

41. Informed about what?

Which wing of the Money party to vote for?

[cali]

48. really? Americans can perform brain surgery? Riiight.

Sorry, being modestly informed about how your gov't works is damned important.

[leftstreet]

51. Um...they're called "doctors"

Hello


:shrug:

[cali]

56. hello. brain surgeons are a teeny percentage of the population

(most doctors can't do brain surgery). You said Americans can cook pot roasts and do brain surgery- as if the majority of the population is qualified. And btw, I bet most Americans can't even cook a pot roast.

[leftstreet]

58. Your OP said "we" and "collectively"

They gave "1000 Americans" a test

"We" don't know what percentage were brain surgeons, electrical contractors, pole dancers, retired people, nuclear physicists, homemakers, disabled people, dentists, or teachers.

But you decided that all the above are stupid

:eyes:

[whathehell]

70. I'd guess brain surgeons are a "tiny minority" of any society.

What do you think?:eyes:

[L. Coyote]

66. Yeah, and they learn how watching Fox News

:rofl:

[rucky]

53. It's not a measure of intelligence as much as awareness.

:shrug:

[leftstreet]

54. Half the eligible people don't vote. They must be aware of something n/t

[Tatiana]

46. This is obvious. How else do you explain someone like Michele Bachmann getting reelected?

These people love to tout the Constitution, but they have no idea what the document actually says.

And, actually, I think the current educational deform efforts seek to ensure that the masses stay stupid, uninformed, and unable to think critically for themselves.

[mstinamotorcity]

47. They Shouls have asked

the latest lyric to the newest pop song!!!

[johnroshan]

49. Panem et Circenses my friend.

It's nothing new. The Romans had the same problem.

[rucky]

52. Is Independence Day before or after the Fourth of July?

[BuelahWitch]

55. What year did the War of 1812 take place?

:hi:

Who is buried in Grant's Tomb?

[WatsonT]

59. Trick question!

Depends on if it's a leap year or not.

[SoCalDem]

60. Not surprising to me at all..

People "study" history to pass a test these days, and how many kids who do not go on to major in history in college, really try to learn much about history?

History in schools often is concentrated in elementary school aged kids, and then all-but-forgotten by high school when so many other electives become more important to kids.. Many school offer several options that "apply" as a "history credit", when in actuality, they are not all that applicable.

If the last "history stuff" you learned was in 6th grade, it's probably likely that by the time you are an adult, you will not have retained all that much:(

I wonder too, how many people tune into The History Channel, and think they are getting a history lesson:(

[reggie the dog]

96. multiple choice tests do that

this online test is crap too as it is multiple choice, history is not to be studied with multiple choice, you get those kind of answers in English as a foreign language or perhaps history class in jr high in france but in high school you would be laughed at by your peers if you give students multiple choice questions in hisotry, they are supposed to be albe to examine a primary source document and a secondary source document and write an essay placing the historical context and their significance. vive la France

[reggie the dog]

97. in district 214 in illinois

we had to study at least 2 years of history in high school back in the 90s

[SoCalDem]

101. There is history and then there is HISTORY

In 1997 when our youngest was a senior, there were at least 5 courses that "satisfied" the history requirement.. He was in AP History, so he got plenty of it, but how many others took an "option"?..

When I was in high school , we had civics as juniors and government as seniors.. No opting out..

[reggie the dog]

102. at the university it was great to have cross over credit

i took US history to get the largely wealthy white male interpretation contradicted with the white working class interpretation, i took latin american studies, african american studies, and native american studies to learn US history through 3 other lenses with crossover credit.

[SoCalDem]

104. College students often do know history.. but for the millions and millions who never go

to college, or who drop out of high school...well those people grow up, have families and some even vote...and many of them learn their history from Hollywood, the History Channel and Fox..:(

[whathehell]

107. If, during the Reagan Administration they had not dropped Civics

as a mandatory course in public school, if they didn't

have Right Wing Media blasting 24/7 every day..We might not

be experiencing all of this.

[Raoul]

62. Duh??

Ya really think so? But who is your favorite singer in American Idol? ROFL

[Initech]

64. Idiocracy isn't a comedy it's a documentary.

[Lost-in-FL]

85. Lol!

:spank:

[L. Coyote]

65. Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former

Quote from Albert Einstein.

[L. Coyote]

67. Quotes from our Fearless Liar-in-Chief, George W. Bush

Quotes from our Fearless Liar-in-Chief, George W. Bush

Forward

"I'm the commander-see, I don't need to explain-I do not need to explain why I say things. That's the interesting thing about being President."
George W. Bush, President of the United States of America

On Education:

"Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning?" "Why don't you mentor a child how to read?" "Reading is the basics for all learning." "You teach a child to read, and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test.'' "I love the idea of a school in which people come to get educated and stay in the state in which they're educated." "So community colleges are accessible, they're available, they're affordable, and their curriculums don't get stuck. In other words, if there's a need for a certain kind of worker, I presume your curriculums evolved over time." "I mean, if you've ever been a governor of a state ..........

On Geography:

"I was raised in the West. The West of Texas. It's pretty close to California. In more ways than Washington, D.C., is close to California."

On War:

"I think war is a dangerous place."

On Terrorism:

"People say, how can I help on this war against terror? How can I fight evil? You can do so by mentoring a child; by going into a shut-in's house and say I love you."

On the War on Iraq:

"I wish I wasn't the war president. Who in the heck wants to be a war president? I don't." "I'm not the expert on how the Iraqi people think, because I live in America, where it's nice and safe and secure." "Had we to do it over again, we would look at the consequences of catastrophic success, being so successful so fast that an enemy that should have surrendered or been done in escaped and lived to fight another day." "CIA laid out several scenarios and said life could be lousy, life could be OK, life could be better, and they were just guessing as to what the conditions might be like."

[undeterred]

71. And some people idolize fucking stupid people like Sarah Palin.

[whathehell]

75. And a lot of people don't.

..like most Americans, actually.

A year or so ago, when she was at her most popular, 70 percent of ALL Americans

said she was unfit for office.

[Hotler]

77. kicking again! n/t

[Gin]

78. 11 wrong for an 89%.....interesting

[JI7]

79. when i go out trying to get support during elections, most people just have no interest

it's not even that they don't have faith in the system . they just don't care and have other things to do.

and just now with the nuclear reactor in Japan you see how misinformed people can be. even on DU where people do have interest are usually not so well informed. though this is more on science than govt.

[whathehell]

81. Collectively, only a Minority failed the test....How does that make it "we"?

Is it too large minority? Yes...but it's STILL a minority, not even half.

[Brigid]

82. I got 99%.

Missed the one about why we went to war with Great Britain. I would have diputed the answer that was supposed to be correct; the colonists had for 150 years been used to taxing and governing themselves, and England really was kind of clueless about what was going on over here. For example, Ben Franklin had crfeated a terrific postal system, the best in the world at the time, and the British had no idea. We used it heavily, of course, to communicate before and during the war.

[old mark]

86. Amen, sister...nt

[Agony]

87. Americans are NOT stupid

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJuNgBkloFE&feature=related

Wait! It's just a YouTube!

[whathehell]

88. Americans are self-haters?

Wait! It's just a thread on an "Except Me" Board.

[Mimosa]

89. I took it a while back & scored 100%

Some other publication carried a similar report a few months ago. I was happy to score 100%. Trying not to brag...but...;)

[reggie the dog]

98. what is the supreme law of the land?

money talks and bullshit walks?

[creon]

99. apathetic

40 t0 60% of the eligible voters do not vote.
Prior to not voting, many know little of politics, current events, government or public policy.
People simply do not care.

[LeftishBrit]

103. Interesting test

I got 96%. I have seen the equivalent tests for British citizenship, and they are more difficult and also more peculiar: i.e. rather less basic history and geography, and rather more knowledge of bureaucratic rules.

I think, however, that people in most countries can be fairly 'fucking stupid' when it comes to such knowledge. E.g. - David Cameron, who had an extremely privileged Eton education, and went on to get a first-class degree in Politics, Philosophy and Economics at Oxford University. He stated that Britain was the 'junior partner' to America in WW2 in *1940*!

[whathehell]

108. Thank you for a different perspective.

Too many here are willing to drink the Kool-Aid,

all with an "Except me and mine" clause, of course.:eyes:

[reggie the dog]

105. . What major event happened on September 11, 2001, in the United States?

yet no possible anwser of "our own government organized a false flag operation and used it to suppress our rights while we were shocked and awed.

[NashVegas]

106. Speak For Yourself

[reggie the dog]

109. I got French nationality by marriage

and had no test at all like this, no oath to say, nothing, i signed a paper and they sent me one saying i was French and explained how to get a national id card and a passport.

[ChoppinBroccoli]

110. No, Americans Are NOT Stupid!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJuNgBkloFE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27f0IimLQpU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuKMtLOKG8k&feature=related

[LWolf]

111. Here's what drives middle school history teachers to drink:

<whine> "Why do we have to learn about the past? All those old, dead people? It's NOW that counts. Old fogies and their lives don't mean anything in today's world. History is BORING. Unless I can make a castle or mummy or pyramid, or wear some armor and bring my sword to school to show it off...can we quit learning and make a castle?"

I should add that my students, in the course of learning history, have made castles, mummies, and pyramids; have dressed in Revolutionary War clothing and examined a decommissioned brown bess, have participated in simulations, and many other engaging activities. They enjoy that, as long as they don't have to actually read, research, study, or THINK about the actual history behind those things. As soon as any of those unwanted activities rear their heads, the whining begins.