What would you have preferred Barack Obama had done differently?

[kentuck]

Not saying any of it could have been accomplished, but what would you have had him try?

Instead of taxcuts, would you have preferred jobs programs?

Would you have preferred instant withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan?

Would you have preferred some sort of public option for healthcare reform?

Would you have preferred a shutdown of Guantanamo?

Would you have preferred an investigation and charges brought against Bush and Cheney?

Would you have preferred a longer time to study the problem before the money was shoveled to the banks without any question?

Would you have preferred a stronger defense against the big bonuses given the thieves of Wall Street?

Would you have preferred he let the taxcuts for the wealthy expire?

What kind of progressive policies would you have liked to have seen the President try?

Realizing, of course, that none of it was likely or possible with the steel-strong opposition of the Republicans. Right?

[treestar]

1. I'd have preferred Lieberman to have done differently

And we'd have a public option.

Why does everything have to be on the President? Because it's simpler?

I wish the voters of Massachusetts had done differently, and elected a Democrat to Teddy's seat.

This is a Republic. There are millions of people who could have "done differently."

[kentuck]

3. Are you suggesting the President is powerless?

He seemed to have a lot of power when he wanted to get the taxcuts through?

[BzaDem]

10. He is powerless to enact legislation when there aren't 60 Senators willing to vote in favor of it.

[kentuck]

14. He cannot bring any pressure to bear on any Senator ...?

...that votes against the will of the people?

I recall that he was making speeches every day when he wanted his healthcare program to pass.

The bully pulpit is useless to such a mediocre speaker as the President?

[BzaDem]

18. He can certainly bring all the pressure he wants to bear on any Senator he wishes.

That is completely distinct from actually changing the vote of the Senator in question.

Republicans do not care about the will of the people. They are FAR more concerned about their primary electorate than they are about the general electorate.

[Lucinda]

21. Evidently the veto pen is out of ink too.

:hi:

[BzaDem]

28. The veto pen is useful when the state of affairs with a veto is better than the state of affairs

without a veto.

But that wasn't the case with the tax bill. A veto would have resulted in families of 4 at the poverty line losing a few thousand every year. A veto would have been much worse policy than no veto.

[Lucinda]

31. I was speaking in general terms

and using the power of the veto as a tool...which he doesn't seem to do.

[BzaDem]

35. I think he will be using it in the future

since in the future, the situation with a veto will be preferable to the situation without the veto.

For example, if Republicans attempt to repeal HCR and FinReg, obviously a veto is better than a non-veto.

However, for the past 2 years, I don't really blame him for not using the veto. Why? Because Democrats controlled Congress. Anything that Obama would veto wouldn't even make it out of committee, let alone pass one or both houses. Saying "I will veto Healthcare reform if it doesn't have a public option!" doesn't result in a public option. It results in no healthcare reform.

[PBS Poll-435]

40. With Derp as Minority Leader in the Senate and Agent Orange in the House..

We all knew how hard it would be to get ANYTHING done.


You gotta hand it to the GOP, they all fall in line. Always.

[tekisui]

48. 51, hell, 50 plus his Veep will do it.

[treestar]

12. Jesus on a trailer hitch!

No, the President is NOT powerless. But he doesn't hold ALL the power either!!!!

You talk as though he were a KING!

Try basic Civics 101. Article I to III of the Constitution is a basic start.

Holy cow!!

There is just no talking to anyone who thinks the President should have the powers of Kim Jong Il. That is simply not so!

To have the public option, the voters of Mass and Lieberman have to have done differently. Are you saying the Senate has no power? The House? The states? The courts? They are all just rubber stamps for a leader? Were you educated in the US? If so we are in deep doo doo unless you are rare!

[kentuck]

15. No need to get your bowels in an uproar...

Calm down.

[PBS Poll-435]

41. ROFL

Your OP is pure drama, someone corrects you (or informs you) and you tell THEM to "calm down"?



:rofl:

[kentuck]

43. Yeah, look at all the exclamation points?

!!!!!!!!! a little excited, I suppose?

[PBS Poll-435]

44. They are right

The President is not a king. Congress is the collar around President Obama's neck.

Plus, surprisingly, there are a lot of dicks in Congress. So that doesn't help either.

[kentuck]

50. Who said he was a "king"?

Or are you just making shit up?

[Hawkeye-X]

2. Removing Byrd's dual-tracking system would have stopped ALL Republican offensive

and accounted for for stalling businesses. And if it is taken out in time for next Senate session, we will just show the entire America the hypocrisy of Republicans and what it means for the people. And who's on our side.

Hawkeye-X

[notesdev]

4. If he had done just two things it would completely change my opinion

Thing #1 - hire people like William Black and Liz Warren to run Treasury and the Fed instead of the compromised, elite-fellating pair of Geithner and the Bernank

Thing #2 - Put an expeditious end to indefinite, interminable war policies


Had he done those two things I would support him regardless of anything else. Those are the key indicators as to whether a politician is working for us (we the people) or working for them (elites/bankers/moneymen).

[Octafish]

5. Kicked and Recc'ed and it stayed at "zero"

Excellent summation, Kentuck. If I may, I'd prefer an Attorney General who was more interested in Justice for ALL Americans and not just for the wealthiest and most powerful.

[Liberal_in_LA]

26. recc'ed, it's edging into the positive.

[lpbk2713]

6. He should have been realistic in dealing with rethuglicans right from the start.

He should have known they don't have it in them to put aside partisan politics for the good of the country.
He made it much too easy for them to gain ground at his (and the country's) expense.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

7. I'd have preferred he broke his promise to escalate the lost war in Afghanistan.

And, admitted it was a failed "mission" and ended the fiasco.

[enough]

8. Not retain Bush officials at the top of the military and financial bureaucracies. (nt)

[Ichingcarpenter]

9. Time ,power and get a grip

Difficult the having two years. on what is what


But I thought he said that at one tie on what is what.

When you are the the President of the Planet

I need a Nobel peace prize for saying that and not making it happen.

[Ichingcarpenter]

11. 'They would kill me and my children"

I really think he knows now
who'..... they are.

[Ohio Joe]

13. I would have preferred all of those things and more

I will still be voting for him come 2012.

[egoclothes]

16. Not only Repubs but Dems included in much

of the opposition.

[ProSense]

17. Here is something he did do

Wall Street reform gives regulators power over executive pay

[Marr]

36. Laughable. That is a PR bandaid on a corruption game they've happily exacerbated.

People get angry about executive bonuses. They understand it. But it's literally a drop in the ocean of fraud, and trumpeting that as some kind of triumph is almost funny. Politicians took steps to cover that easily understandable outrage, while sedulously servicing the fraud machine itself.

It's like they painted a brick yellow, called it gold, and when someone noted a chip in the paint and a bit of brick beneath it, they hurried to paint the chip over and pronounce it gold yet again.

[ProSense]

42. "I genuinely hope you weren't sincere. " Yes, I was.

"But it's literally a drop in the ocean of fraud, and trumpeting that as some kind of triumph is almost funny."

Every "drop in the ocean of fraud" counts, some have the potential to produce a ripple effect of change.

I realize that, in the face of the worst economic crisis in decades, when the measure of success is that the President hasn't reversed/undone everything Bush did or hasn't changed the trajectory of America's downfall enough, he's bound to be considered in a less than positive light. This is of course completely ironic given that most of his predecessors made significant contributions to the country's downfall.

An objective measurement recognizes that this Presdient has made considerable progress to right many of these wrongs in the face of significant opposition from forces beyond even the current Republican members of Congress.

So yeah, this is a "drop," but one in the right direction. The rules are forthcoming and then the determination of their effectiveness will be made.

The President also put Elizabeth Warren in place, and for the first time ever, there is an agency and force to begin to counter the abuse that has plagued consumers.

[Peregrine Took]

19. Not put all those Clintonista's/Wall streeter's in his brand new administration.

I was shocked when their names were announced. Many, many bad things have come out of those decisions but I think the main thing I wished he had done was to have run as the very middle of the road DLC'r he is.

His campaign people must have had the idea that they had to get the progressives and liberals revved up to get the little people donations and to get the excitement ball rolling and then BOOM! they gave it to us between the eyes on day one of his getting into the WH.

[DrDan]

20. yes

[JackRiddler]

22. What I wrote here right after the election...

Obama's pragmatic choice: Prosecute the criminals or be Whitewatered!

Tue Jan-13-09 04:17 PM

Machiavelli says:

There are those who mistakenly believe that pragmatism means avoiding a treatment of the many crimes of state, war crimes and violations of the Constitution commited by the outgoing regime. They call themselves realists and moderates and say investigations, prosecutions or truth commissions will bog down the new administration in a focus on the past, when it's "time to move forward."

First of all, this is wrong. When justice and truth are secondary, no republic, no democracy will survive. When crime pays, criminals receive new incentive.

Second, it's unrealistic. Pragmatism should not be confused with a cowardly push to sweep it all under the rug and pretend it never happened.

Has anyone been paying attention the last 30 years? What do you think the right wing reaction will be to a "post-partisan" "moderate" "time to move on" program? Anyone remember 1993? Clinton was all about moving on, after succeeding to another famously criminal government.

What happened then provides the pattern for what will happen now:

They will dig up every minor piece of bull they can sling at members of the new administration. Sooner or later, something will stick; we live in a country where "real estate" and "financial sector" are synonyms for low-grade corruption. Or something else will catch the media's attention as a decent spectacle. And off we'll go: everything will revolve around some bullshit about someone's sexual affairs, or how they took a payoff when they were dogcatcher, or some insult.

The beast that brought you the recent disasters is still running free, people. If you want change, you need to deal with them.

The choice is not between "pragmatism" and prosecution. If the criminals are not rooted out now, they will return, and the right wing will play dirty. The choice is between prosecution and Whitewatering.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4822017&mesg_id=4822017

[coalition_unwilling]

23. I think the probs all started with giving Bush and Cheney a free pass. That

immediately diminished Obama's credibility as any real agent of change and meant that, for all intents and purposes, Bush and Cheney were able to get away with their crimes against humanity and fraud and conspiracy against the American people.

[onehandle]

24. Wielded his mandate like a sack of doorknobs.

They accused him of not being bi-partisan from day one. He should have gone along with the accusation.

He had high approval ratings and solid majorities in both Houses that we will not see again for a long time.

A lot of political capitol was flushed down the toilet.

[kentuck]

27. Not only that...

The times were so critical at the time of the bailouts that few politicians, Democrats or Republicans, could oppose anything the President proposed. As the year went on and the Teabaggers came out at the healthcare debates, the Repubs gained more and more courage to oppose this President. And they did it with a vengeance.

[BzaDem]

30. Keep in mind though that nearly all Republicans DID oppose EVERYTHING Obama asked for, even

at the moment he was inaugurated.

Every House Republican voted against the stimulus. All but 3 Senate Republicans did as well. And one of the 3 Senate Republicans immediately had to switch parties out of fear of his primary electorate.

It's not like Republicans were marching with Obama until the healthcare debates. Far from it. The townhalls were just a manifestation of what was already going on.

[vi5]

25. There's lots I'd prefer, but.....

...I realize it was not all possible.

I would have preferred instant withdrawal but I realize that was not possible or realistic either militarily or politically. Same thing with investigations and charges brought against Bush and Cheney.

The things that were completely in his control which he did that I hated and which I blame for a lot of what happened was who he surrounded himself with.

Arne Duncan, Tim Geithner, Larry Summers....keeping on Ben Bernake and pretty much maintaining Bush's entire military leadership. Putting these people in charge of very important things was a big mistake and indicated to me where is real loyalties lie. I know people want to point to what he gave to Elizabeth Warren well after the fact and well after any real window of opportunity to fully stop the bleeding and to reform how things was done was long since shut, but that was too little, too late. It might somewhat stop things from getting worse but there was already a great deal of damage done that is now irreperable.

I also would have preferred if he didn't wave huge signs and send engraved letters to Republicans before negotiations even started on everything indicated what, where and when he'd be willing to give up once negotiations did start. I'd like to believe this is political naivete but I'm not stupid and he's not naive. Him doing this every time was taking a dive, plain and simple.

So yeah. I know every cheerleader on this board prefers that it be viewed as an all or nothing prospect and that saying that I think the things I listed above really suck and were bad for the country and bad for progressive policies and bad for the democratic party means I hate Obama and I don't understand how government works. But whatever.

[MisterP]

29. not gone out of his way to keep us in the Middle East

not gone out of his way to sell us to the insurers
not gone out of his way to torpedo public option and single payer
not gone out of his way to make the biggest arms deals in human history
not gone out of his way to coddle BP and drive off reporters
etc., etc.
but just keep comforting yourselves with the notion that "none of it was likely or possible"--because the President made sure we'd never actually find out if his "compromises" really were necessary

[PhillySane]

32. Yes to all

and the President does have the power. Without it, George W. Bush would never have been able to accomplish all of his wonderful achievements. In fact, Dick Cheyney seems to have had more power as Vice President than Obama does as President.

What he could have done is hunker down. He had the house on his side with the tax-cut legislation. He needed to convince 7 Senators that he wanted things his way. Even if that wasn't do-able, I would have liked to see him try a little harder. With the shift in congress next year, you can kiss the rest goodbye.

[kimmerspixelated]

33. Large wide spread alternative energy programs

put in place as soon as humanly possible. It would have solved a lot of unemployment problems alone. Quit giving Big Pharma so much power.

[Marr]

34. No bank bailouts, get rid of the Financial Services Modernization Act, reinstate

Glass Steagall, make major cuts to funds being wasted by the defense industry, let the Bush Tax Cuts lapse and jack up the taxes-- way up-- on the top 1%, give US manufactures the incentive to bring production back to the US by using tariffs. Use the money to fund the construction of a clean energy infrastructure.

[Cleita]

37. I would have liked it if he had launched an

investigation into why we went to war. We need true answers not excuses for it.

[Taitertots]

38. Immediately end the wars of aggression

Cut the military to less than half it's current size.

Immediately revoke Bush tax cuts for the rich, increase their taxes, and impose capital controls.

Immediate jobs programs.

National public health care within first 2 years.

Tax cuts for lowest 50% wage earners.

Impose harsh demands on firms being bailed out. Practically take them over, sack the leaders, charge them with fraud, and take all their ill gotten gains.

End off the balance sheet operations(fraud).

Strict laws with wide interpretation to cover all financial intermediaries.

[WingDinger]

39. I would have preferred he paid my mortgage and car payment.

Given the stupidity of the American idiot, he is lucky to get anything. In the end, he wins, cuz he bidens his time. And after the tide changes, YOU and all the other chicken littles will run retraction with head held in shame mode. I hope. }( ;) :7 :evilgrin: :party: :toast: :think:

[Davis_X_Machina]

45. He should have resigned the day after his inauguration.

Power corrupts, the greater the power the greater the corruption, and no one is more powerful that the President.

The only principled thing to do is to refuse to participate in your own corruption.

Let the Republicans run everything. They don't mind being corrupt.

That's the only way Democrats can continue on, un-bought, un-bossed, untainted by office.

[nevergiveup]

46. Better communications out of the White House

and a little better grip on the realities that are Afghanistan. Considering what he is up against I think he is doing a good job and I will work for him again in 2012.

[xchrom]

47. What was the point of your asking if the only possible

Outcome were the outcomes achieved?

Unrec.

[timtom]

49. In this order:

1) Get the fuck out of Afghanistan and Iraq.

2) End the Fed and restore the minting powers to Congress.

3) Turn those trillions of dollars to bolstering our infrastructure and create jobs in that process.

4) Single-payer universal health care.

That's just for openers.

[emilyg]

51. Good openers.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

52. Badgered the Blue Dogs to give ground to the Progressives instead of

the other way around.

[Iggo]

53. I would have preferred that, after his asking us to hold his feet to the fire...

...he wouldn't have complained so much that we were holding his feet to the fire.