Libyan Revolution Day 37 part 2 (Misrata into second week of shelling. Ajdabya liberated!)

[joshcryer]

Links to sites with updates: http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-26">AJE Live Blog March 26 (today) http://blogs.aljazeera.net/twitter-dashboard">AJE Twitter Dashboard http://feb17.info/">feb17.info http://www.livestream.com/libya17feb?utm_source=lsplayer&utm_medium=embed&utm_campaign=footerlinks">Libya Alhurra (live video webcast from Benghazi) http://www.libyafeb17.com/">libyafeb17.com

Twitter links: http://twitter.com/#!/aymanm">Ayman Mohyeldin, with AJE http://twitter.com/#!/bencnn">Ben Wedeman, with CNN http://twitter.com/#!/tripolitanian">tripolitanian, a Libyan from Tripoli http://twitter.com/#!/BaghdadBrian">Brian Conley, reporter in Libya http://twitter.com/#!/freelibyanyouth">FreeLibyanYouth, Libyan advocate http://twitter.com/#!/LibyaFeb17_com">LibyaFeb17.com twitter account http://twitter.com/#!/ChangeInLibya">ChangeInLibya, Libyan advocate

Useful links: http://audioboo.fm/feb17voices">feb17voices http://www.google.com/search?q=time+in+libya">Current time in Libya http://www.islamicfinder.org/cityPrayerNew.php?country=libya">Prayer times in Libya

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x742110">Day 37 part 1 here.

A young girl is forced to wear a burka in Benghazi

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2011/mar/25/libyan-rebels-advance-ajdabiya-video">Libyan rebels regain key city after airstrikes
AJDABIYA, Libya – Libyan rebels regained control of the eastern gateway city of Ajdabiya on Saturday after international airstrikes crippled Moammar Gadhafi's forces, in the first major turnaround for an uprising that once appeared on the verge of defeat. In a western city the opposition lost to Gadhafi, a resident said security agents had lists of rebel sympathizers and were dragging them from their homes.

Drivers honked in celebration and flew the tricolor rebel flag. Others in the city fired their guns into the air and danced on burned-out tanks that littered the road. Inside a building that had served as makeshift barracks for pro-Gadhafi forces, hastily discarded uniforms were piled on the floor.

"Without the planes we couldn't have done this. Gadhafi's weapons are at a different level than ours," said Ahmed Faraj, 38, a rebel fighter from Ajdabiya. "With the help of the planes we are going to push onward to Tripoli, God willing."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/24/qatar-planes-libya-high-stakes">Qatar's decision to send planes to Libya is part of a high-stakes game
In an air-conditioned room down an alley in the old market of Qatar's capital Doha, enthusiasts of "damah" gather most evenings. The ancient board game, rarely played in recent years, is now being revived by local enthusiasts. It is, afficionados say, a contest of strategy and finesse – and thus an apt metaphor for the high-stakes manoeuvring by the tiny Gulf state and its hereditary leader, 59-year-old Emir Sheikh Hamad bin Khalifa Al Thani, in recent weeks.

For a country the size of Belgium with a population of 1.7 million, Qatar has been playing an extraordinarily high-profile role. This weekend four Qatari fighter jets are set to join the allied forces already off the Libyan coastline. The combat deployment is the first by an Arab or Muslim-majority country and thus of critical diplomatic significance.

Then there is the key role played in the "Arab spring" by al-Jazeera, the satellite TV channel set up by the emir in 1996. Broadcasting from Doha, al-Jazeera is now the dominant Arabic-language news outlet in the region and increasingly recognised around the world. Al-Jazeera English is gaining fans.

"Al-Jazeera were the first on to the events in Tunisia. Its reports from there were watched by the Egyptians. Then its reports from Egypt were watched by everyone else. It has been a very important catalyst," said Hugh Miles, author of Al-Jazeera: How Arab TV News Challenged the World. Others have gone further and described the successive uprisings as "fundamentally driven" by the TV channel.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/mar/24/libya-morality-intervention-united-europe">Libya: the morality of intervention
Could we leave Colonel Gaddafi's victims to die in full view of our TV cameras? I think not. It is quite understandable that the UN's courageous decision to resort to force in Libya should upset our pacifist conscience. Instigated by the UK and France, and backed by the US and other countries, this decision, though necessary, raises major moral and political questions about European integration.

The moral issues relate to the use of violence by states. The question of a just war, which has bothered us since antiquity, may well be addressed with theoretical discourse and historical references, but it remains a source of hesitation and uncertainty that we cannot simply dismiss. These moral uncertainties obviously have a political impact. This is perhaps because European integration is far from complete. The Libyan crisis highlights the need for the EU to grow stronger and gain greater coherence, in keeping with the promise of the Lisbon treaty.

Video of the convoy sent to take Benghazi, taken from a dead soliders cell phone (shows how massive the operation was): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwWwOeZqz6M

Sky News went with Gaddafi minders to find a "civilian town bombed" only they were never shown any such thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-O5KJavfiQo

TNC presser talking about various details of the revolution (thanks to Waiting for Everyone): http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=730234&mesg_id=731532


Videos to bring the Libyan Revolution into context:

The Battle of Benghazi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0vChMDuNd0

BBC Panorama on Libya Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyaPnMnpCAA

BBC Panorama on Libya Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMzwQvcx62s

Latest indiscriminate shelling in Misurata: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wop3C4zrPXI


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x677397">Text of the resolution.

How will a no fly zone work? AJE reports: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWEwehTtK2k

Canada: http://winnipeg.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20110317/cf-libya-canada/20110317/?hub=WinnipegHome">Canada to send six CF-18s for Libya 'no-fly' mission Norway: http://af.reuters.com/article/libyaNews/idAFOSN00509220110318">Norway to join military intervention in Libya Belgium: http://www.lesoir.be/actualite/monde/2011-03-18/la-belgique-prete-a-une-operation-militaire-en-libye-828970.php">Belgium ready for a military operation in Libya Qatar and the UAE: http://www.defpro.com/daily/details/776/?SID=e80884adc09a37d26904578a9b5978cb">Run-up for Western world’s next military commitment ... with unusual support Denmark: http://www.cphpost.dk/news/international/89-international/51229-denmark-ready-for-action-against-gaddafi.html">Denmark ready for action against Gaddafi France: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/19/world/africa/19libya.html?src=twrhp">Following U.N. Vote, France Vows Libya Action ‘Soon’ Italy: http://af.reuters.com/article/commoditiesNews/idAFLDE72G2HE20110317">Italy to make bases available for Libya no-fly zone-source United Kingdom: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12770467">Libya: UK forces prepare after UN no-fly zone vote United States: http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/nations-draw-up-plans-for-no-fly-zone-over-libya-1.2765122">Nations draw up plans for no-fly zone over Libya Jordan: http://www.smh.com.au/world/military-strikes-on-libya-within-hours-20110318-1bzii.html?from=smh_sb">Military strikes on Libya 'within hours' Spain: http://english.cri.cn/6966/2011/03/19/2801s627320.htm">Spain Expected to Join NATO No-fly Zone Enforcement over Libya

"One month ago (Western countries) were sooo nice, so nice like pussycats," Saif says in a contemptuous sing-song tone."Now they want to be really aggressive like tigers. (But) soon they will come back, and cut oil deals, contracts. We know this game." - http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2058389,00.html">Saif Gaddafi

(Yeah, Saif, as if you weren't "cutting oil deals, contracts" with western states. Who are the 'tigers' now? Bombing your own people.)

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-march-10-0">March 10 7:28pm Saif al Islam Gaddafi says "the time has come for full-scale military action" against Libyan rebels. He goes on to say that Libyan forces loyal to his family "will never surrender, even if western powers intervene".

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/02/25/world/middleeast/map-of-how-the-protests-unfolded-in-libya.html">Click here for updated map

Military Installations



Oil Map



http://bit.ly/fe3P">Google Earth DL here to see positions of army and patrolling route of mercenaries

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=212059469427545728757.00049c4df2474b6543347&ll=31.203405,30.058594&spn=96.173452,183.867188&z=3">MAP of Protests across the Middle East

Mohammed Nabbous, killed by Gaddafi's forces while trying to report on the massacre in Benghazi

"I'm not afraid to die, I'm afraid to lose the battle" -Mohammed Nabbous, a month ago when all this began

I'm struggling to come up with something to say about this man. I was not aware of the Libyan uprising until I saw Mo's first report, begging for help, posted here on DU. I was stricken. Here was a man giving everything he had to explain a situation that clearly terrified him, I would not call him a coward in that moment, but you could see the fear in his eyes, and desperation in his voice. For 30 days Nabbous would spend many hours covering the uprising in Benghazi. For many nights I would go to sleep with the webcast of Benghazi live on my computer screen, looking to it occasionally to be sure it was still 'there.' Mo treated the chat room as if we were his friends, and in some way, we were. I never signed up to LiveStream to thank him for all his work and it seems somewhat shallow to do so now, given that I was a lurker for so long. Ever since I took over posting these threads "Libya Alhurra" has been linked as a source of information. It wasn't until last night, when I posted, and twitter posted on Mo's adventures out into Benghazi to try to determine the truth of the situation, that Mo's webchannel became a hit, over 2000 people were watching him stream live. This was curious to him because he'd done many reports like this in the past but he appeared somewhat bemused that the view count exploded as it did. Last night Mo became a star. This is a man who first started out with a webcast replete with fear and desperation finally overcoming that aspect of himself and losing that fear, to become someone who was a fighter for the resistance just as much as those who held the guns. Reporting on the front lines of Benghazi became his final act, and for that he should never, ever be forgotten. I'm so sorry Mo that I never got to know you better.

Mo's first report, which many of you may remember, begging for help: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38EXALI60hg

Mo's last report, a fallen hero trying to spread the word to the world: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ecu_iWLn-rg

Mo leaves behind a wife who is with child, she had http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2011/03/23/a_bright_voice_from_libyas_darkness">this to say about the No Fly Zone and R2P UN resolution:

We started this in a pure way, but he turned it bloody. Thousands of our men, women, and children have died. We just wanted our freedom, that's all we wanted, we didn't want power. Before, we could not do a single thing if it was not the way he wanted it. All we wanted was freedom. All we wanted was to be free. We have paid with our blood, with our families, with our men, and we're not going to give up. We are still going to do that no matter what it takes, but we need help. We want to do this ourselves, but we don't have the weapons, the technology, the things we need. I don't want anyone to say that Libya got liberated by anybody else. If NATO didn't start moving when they did, I assure you, I assure you, half of Benghazi if not more would have been killed. If they stop helping us, we are going to be all killed because he has no mercy anymore.

[joshcryer]

1. Current time in Libya, 3:20pm Saturday, March 26

[joshcryer]

2. Gaddafi: Inside the mind of a tyrant

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/8406994/Gaddafi-Inside-the-mind-of-a-tyrant.html#">Gaddafi: Inside the mind of a tyrant
This week, newly released papers from the German government revealed something rather pertinent for those considering what the embattled Col Gaddafi’s next trick would be. The papers declared that on May 27, 1980, Gaddafi handed a written demand to Günter Held, the West German ambassador in Tripoli, for the eyes of Chancellor Helmut Schmidt.

He insisted that Schmidt expel exiled Libyan opponents of his regime who were living in Germany. If the Chancellor refused, Gaddafi swore he would take “counter-measures” against 2,500 Germans in Libya, including the few being held in jail. The Colonel asked if West Germany wanted “to co-operate with traitors – or the Libyan people”. He even offered to stop subsidising Red Army Faction terrorists, provided, of course, that Schmidt allowed him to liquidate “a relatively small number of people” living on German soil.

This, in a nutshell, is Gaddafi’s modus operandi. He bears grudges heavily, is never shy of wreaking blood-soaked havoc or proffering deadly threats – and has next to no sense of reality outside his own paranoid bunker.

Now Libya’s fate, and the credibility of the coalition’s governments, hinges on what this devious and ruthless man is thinking inside his Tripoli miltary-cum-residential compound. In power for 41 years, Gaddafi is not what his son Saif’s friend, Peter Mandelson, calls “a quitter”.

[Iterate]

21. This one is worth reading twice

Though much of it is available in other, scatter sources, few have gathered it as well or put it so coherently.

It also helps end the "rebels are really jihadist and AQ" meme that's used both by him publicly and fearful Americans quietly. Because, as Gaddafi didn't brook any opposition or organizations and didn't hesitate to simply kill them, the idea that he would give groups like that a pass and be somehow unable to eliminate them runs counter to everything else we know.

The core philosophy that Gaddafi corrupted, communitarian socialism, is no more radical than a local farm coop in South Dakota. It has wide appeal across the world and his brilliance, if you can call it that, is that no one I know of had thought before of using it as a covering political philosophy on this scale. It also helps explain why some who still believe in it as a basis for a social structure feel betrayed, defensive, and suspicious of intervention, all at the same time.

For those wanting to learn more about the social structure and manipulations of Gaddafi's era there's this audio interview, posted before but may have been missed:

Dirk Vandewalle Peers Inside Gadhafi's World
http://www.npr.org/2011/02/28/134132726/dirk-vandewalle-peers-inside-qaddafis-world

[joshcryer]

32. Continue to appreciate your insights, Iterate.

I don't think I've said that before, but I do enjoy your little rants. I did see your post saying that you would be too "slow" to do these updates because of how much thought you put in to thinking about this sort of thing. Your views are very much appreciated, and truly food for thought.

Didn't want you to feel ignored (since I didn't reply last time with regards to Gaddafi's faux anti-imperialism), I'm devouring everything. :hi:

[bobbolink]

49. I second that emotion! Much appreciation and many thanks.

I also think that Iterate's posts are indicative of the fact that so many of us who have come to this heartbreaking conclusion are very thoughtful people.

Which is what is so agonizing.

[Iterate]

54. and I look at your fast running

arguments through threads, complete with links, note the one or two minute lapse in-between, and wonder "How in god's name does he do that?" Good lesson in that; we need all kinds.

[MedleyMisty]

62. I love you

Just so you know that. Brilliant post and good points - can I borrow them for non-DU discussions?

[bobbolink]

70. Watch it... I saw him first!

:rofl:

I have to admit... what I like is that he breaks the brevity rules, and I do, too. Too often the popular concept of brevity leads to misunderstanding, which takes more words to sort out than to just use more words to begin with.

Where he is different from me is that his words are exquisite. :hi:

[dipsydoodle]

3. There are odd news reports

that the citizens of some of these towns which have been "liberated" being pretty pissed off at being stuck in the middle of something about which they don't really give a shit.

[joshcryer]

5. Please post them.

All I'm finding are reports from citizens being thankful that Gaddafi's indiscriminate shelling and shooting of civilians is over when it finally comes.

edit: to be clear I do want you to post them, I find such articles charming, because no doubt people are pissed off that the whole thing started to begin with. I know for one that if some sort of uprising happened here I'd be damn pissed off!

[dipsydoodle]

8. They're verbals on tv news broadcasts

Do feel welcome to come over here and watch them - stay with me you like. You don't get our home stuff on world news links despite what others may lead you believe.

I still don't think anyone knows exactly how representative of the whole population the insurgents are.

Whilst I'm certainly not in support of Gadaffi I'm not really in support of a crew many of whom don't seem to know which end to hold a hammer either.

Gaddafi's indiscriminate "shelling and shooting of civilians" obviously cannot be condoned : its a territorial issue to stop the insurgents moving west. The "civilians" are a combination of the insurgents , who don't wear uniforms , and those that just want a peaceful life caught up in the middle.

[joshcryer]

12. Fair enough, video is welcome, also.

Which stations have the blurbs?

I've posted editorials about hash smoking rebels, about rebels lying about their victories ("we took out 12 tanks!"), etc, etc. No war is perfect, no revolution is saintly, and no revolution is always welcome by all. These posts are an archive of events as we catch them, no doubt the events have a lot of holes since it's only two people regularly updating. But there ya go.

[joshcryer]

4. The Libyan opposition's interim national council leader has said they no longer need outside help

1257: The Libyan opposition's interim national council leader Mahmoud Jibril has said they no longer need outside help, in a letter to Nicolas Sarkozy, published in Le Figaro newspaper. "We do not want outside forces. We won't need them. We will win the first battle thanks to you. We will win the next battle through our own means."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[bobbolink]

50. wow... that was quick. I knew they would speak up if they wanted the UN out, but didn't expect it

that quickly.

Not with Misrata and Tripoli still being in such an uproar.... not to mention Sirte.

[joshcryer]

6. AFP reports from Libyan city of Ajdabiya, after those allied air raids: "The damage is astonishing"

1331: AFP's Sara Hussein reports from Libyan city of Ajdabiya, after those allied air raids: "The damage is astonishing. Body parts - some identifiable as such, pink and covered with flies, others little more than piles of ash - are visible next to the carcasses of tanks."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

Maybe Gaddafi will scoop them up and present them to the media as civilians. :puke:

[joshcryer]

7. HAHA! SERIOUSLY LIBYAN STATE TV? CMON!

1341: Libyan state TV has an original take on the march in London against government spending cuts. A screen caption reads: "Tens of thousands of British citizens out in mass protests now in front of the British House of Commons condemning the colonialist, crusader aggression against the Libyan Great Jamahiriyah."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[dipsydoodle]

11. Sometimes

yes its best just to laugh. :rofl:

[joshcryer]

14. Gets better:

1347: And the Libyan state news agency, Jana, quotes a military source as saying that within Libya "crusader colonial aggression forces were bombing, without distinction, all military barracks, weaponry of armed forces and unarmed civilians, to enable Al-Qaeda-affiliated terrorist gangs advance on and control oil installations and oilfields."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

BBC News showing their bias this morning (I'm sure this news will be reported on there as a victory for the policies of Cameron).

Wait aren't you in the UK?

[dipsydoodle]

22. Yup - UK

I do like that expression "crusader colonial aggression forces " Sounds quite apt.



:hi:

[MedleyMisty]

66. That is insane

and funny. And also sad, because I see so many Americans repeating and believing Gaddafi's propaganda.

[bobbolink]

Even FAUX hasn't been that "bold".

Even :rofl: doesn't cover it.

[Vattel]

9. So far, the more I learn about the situation in Libya,

the more I am inclined to think that France, the UK, and the US did the right thing by intervening. I hope I feel the same way in a month ot two.

[atreides1]

13. By then

The "rebels" could be doing what the current government is doing now...but go ahead and have your feel good moment!

[joshcryer]

15. Let's hope not. So far every liberated city is peaceful.

What will be tested in the coming months is the racist idea that "Arabs aren't ready for Democracy" and I think the Libyans are going to prove a whole lot of people wrong. One thing that Gaddafi has suppressed for so long, along with most Arab world tyrants, is free expression and free movement.

[defendandprotect]

31. Well, after 40 years of Gaddafi, his murderous, torturous ways are well known ...!!

This certainly isn't an ideal way to have power change hands!!

But, perhaps this time the fates will work against the violent --

regretably the protesters were unable to continue in non-violence given

the extremes of Gaddafi resistance. But, can only hope that power of

non-violence will return.

[silver10]

113. +1

[bobbolink]

52. Its an agonizing conclusion to come to, isn't it? None of us take this easily or simply.

In that respect, I guess it is sort of like the issue of abortion.... nobody makes that decision lightly.

"I hope I feel the same way in a month ot two."

As do we all.

[joshcryer]

10. More Misurata airstrikes, revolutionaries move on towards Ras Lanuf after passing Brega.

3:00pm In the past hour allied war planes have hit Gaddafi targets in the opposition-held town of Misurata. Pro-democracy fighters now say they have moved past Brega further to the west. And that they are heading towards Ras Lanuf - another oil-rich town.

Al Jazeera's James Bays says celebrations by the rebels in Aj dabiya, where he is reporting from, are continuing after the town was retaken by the rebels. But he added that it is unclear whether the rebels' victory was planned.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-26

[joshcryer]

16. back from 'liberated' Ajdabiya. Much celebrating. one rebel was cleaning his boots with green flag

http://twitter.com/#!/MaryFitzgerldIT/status/51641534952652800">@MaryFitzgerldIT
Mary Fitzgerald
Just back from 'liberated' Ajdabiya. Much celebrating there. Met one rebel fighter who was cleaning his boots with Gadafy's green flag
21 minutes ago

[joshcryer]

17. Lots of nice tweets from this correspondant, check 'em out:

http://twitter.com/#!/MaryFitzgerldIT

[Waiting For Everyman]

18. Story on the woman in Tripoli who says she was raped by G's loyalists

She took refuge in the hotel where international journalists are staying, told them and asked for help. Police came and dragged her away again. Story at link below about halfway down the page, with video.

http://www.channel4.com/news/libyan-rebels-take-back-ajdabiyah

She says she was arrested because she is from Benghazi. There is a lot of angry twittering going on about this.

[joshcryer]

19. OMFG @ that western guy with glasses defending her! OMG. He needs to get out of there NOW.

They wrestled him to the ground at the end (instinct for many sane western guys to defend a female in distress, the very idea that people would just "take" some girl claiming to have been raped was very unsettling to him, and he wasn't the macho type). I couldn't believe that they got that on video. Jesus.

http://www.channel4.com/news/libyan-rebels-take-back-ajdabiyah

OMFG! Those fucking scumbags.

[Waiting For Everyman]

23. This may actually set off big demonstrations in Tripoli

I wouldn't be at all surprised. There is already a Wiki entry for her name. And this below is from a very followed Libyan tweeter...

@ChangeInLibya
Eman Al-Obaidi - http://goo.gl/BfBgO Guys, remember this name. She is probably not alive anymore. God bless her bravery. #libya #feb17

She is/was brave and smart - going to the hotel where the international press is staying. The reporters got her name, and it's on film. Gaddafi might even have to release her - if that's still possible. But alive or not, I think Tripoli is going freak out just as Tunisia did about its martyr, and as Egypt did when Ghomin was released.

It could be a turning point. Lots of reporters are going to have that story, and it's going to be a big story, I predict.

I agree, I'm concerned about the guy who stepped in too. He may be ok because it's on film and there were so many witnesses. Gaddafi may be checkmated on this, no matter what he does. Something like this could actually turn the tide for the revolution.

And btw, she is from Benghazi. It might take a while for the folks there to find out, but they will likely react intensely too. It could be "a match to dry kindling", you never know.

There will probably be demonstrations for her release, and if martyred double that.

[joshcryer]

26. Hope so.

She was indeed at least thinking quick to go to the reporters in the hotel, had she reported it to Gaddafi people no one would have ever learned of it and she'd have been disappeared by now (most likely raped some more, to boot). As of now she does stand a chance of at least being kept alive, and probably not terribly beaten.

The reporters won't let that one go, which is a testament to their own bravery. The fact that it was caught on film speaks absolute volumes. Not that the reporters couldn't be believed or wouldn't be, but they got it on film showing that the rape allegation was treated with pure evil.

And yes, I have no doubts that poor woman was met with the atrocities she claimed, her eyes told the story vividly.

I hope you're right on all accounts.

[Waiting For Everyman]

29. A twitter hashtag has started already... #WhereisEmanAlObeidi

Nic Robertson and a NYT reporter went to officials to find out where she is. Officials say they don't know. That won't work for very long.

[joshcryer]

30. HAH! That's fucking awesome! If she's alive she's going to be trotted out real quick.

[tabatha]

35. Eman Obeidy is part of the biggest tribe in Libya

@Libyan4life: FYI: Eman Obeidy is part of the Obeidy tribe which is the biggest in #Libya. NOT a good idea #Gerdaffi

[CJvR]

42. Sure...

Once they find some good hostages she will be allowed to explain how she was misstaken and her attackers were in fact drugged rebel A-Q members funded by the CIA and how much she loves Gaddafi.

[joshcryer]

44. Easier to find a couple of black scapegoats, and do a quick public execution.

That's how it'll go down I bet you.

[Cognitive_Resonance]

20. K & R nt

[joshcryer]

24. Gaddafi's army Bilgasim Al-Ganga has been captured (committed major atrocities)

3:53pm Al Jazeera's Sue Turton, reporting from Benghazi, the opposition's stronghold, says a senior Libyan army office has ben captured by the rebels.

We're hearing reports that the number three in Gaddafi's army Bilgasim Al-Ganga has been captured overnight in fighting in Ajdabiya. He has a fierce reputation among the opposition who accuse him of committing many atrocities under the Gaddafi regime. Nation Council had press conference - They now believe they have Gadadfi forces on the back foot.
There is muted optimism. It really does feel the momentum of the Gaddafi forces has been stopped. They are not outwardly celebrating but they are definitely optimistic.

Turton said the general would be brought to Benghazi.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-26

[CJvR]

51. Yeah...

...I saw one of the idiots in the provisional regime, or whatever they call themselves, saying they didn't need any more military aid. Someone needs to take away that moron's microphone priviliges! The last thing you want is to give Gaddafi's supporters more ammo on halting the bombing campaign and while your Bengazi hide might be safe for the moment others elsewhere are less fortunate.

[joshcryer]

120. That information is being improperly reported here. They are still wanting airstrikes...

...they are reaffirming that they don't want troops on the soil (ie, second phase of the battle). People are reporting it here, unsurprisingly with dishonesty, that it is a call to cease operations altogether.

Nothing could be further from the truth.

[joshcryer]

25. In the past hour allied war planes have hit Gaddafi targets in the opposition-held town of Misurata.

3:00pm In the past hour allied war planes have hit Gaddafi targets in the opposition-held town of Misurata. Pro-democracy fighters now say they have moved past Brega further to the west. And that they are heading towards Ras Lanuf - another oil-rich town.

Al Jazeera's James Bays says celebrations by the rebels in Ajdabiya, where he is reporting from, are continuing after the town was retaken by the rebels. Gunfire could he heard from background as he spokes and referred to it as "fresh celebrations".

The opposition fighters have come along the main road, hit the roadblock of Gaddafi's forces and that was a stalemate ... It was only when those airstrikes took place that the situation changed.

It (town) was recaptured because of what came from the skies. It was here- at the west gate in Ajdabiya - that Gaddafi forces made their last stand ... There was bombardment from international jets; international coalition ... People here are celebrating. The people are firing in celebration rather than anger. Most people had fled Ajdabiya during the fighting, but some had hidden in their homes but now they (are) joining the celebrations.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-26

[defendandprotect]

33. LIBYA HURRA -- !!

[defendandprotect]

34. LIBYA HURRA -- !!

[bobbolink]

55. I second...and third... that emotion!

Its going to be back and forth for a while yet, but I intend to cheer for each victory!

[defendandprotect]

57. Hi - glad to see you here ....

-- and glad to see things are turning around again.

:)

[bobbolink]

59. This is my refuge.... as long as Team Cryer/Niner suffer my puns gladly, and allow me to stay.

:rofl:

As I posted elsewhere, there are going to be ups and downs with this for quite a while. Revolutions don't run smoothly.

It is heartbreaking and tragic, and yet... we have so much to learn. At the risk of sounding melodramatic, I think we are seeing the beginning of a new step in understanding... a new step in evolution of the human race.

Chew on that. ^_^

[defendandprotect]

68. Thinking about it ....

and tears in my eyes re pics of Benghazis thanking the world for support -- !!


here ...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=744173&mesg_id=745911

[MedleyMisty]

71. Oh, I agree

I've been thinking that for the last month. I've also watched a few Anonymous videos claiming that is their philosophy and their goal - the next step in human evolution, aided by the internet and the free flow of information. Something to chew on, as you say.

[bobbolink]

77. Well, damn... here I thought I was being so freaking original. ^_^

If you coe across any linnks to that effect, I would be most grateful!

:pals:

[joshcryer]

27. AP also has a sinister report from formerly rebel-held Zwara in western Libya.

1445: AP also has a sinister report from formerly rebel-held Zwara in western Libya. It says pro-Gaddafi forces now have a firm grip on the town. "They have lists of demonstrators and videos and so on and they are seeking them out," says a resident, who then describes a friend being dragged away. "They came with four or five cars with four people in each one, all of them armed to the teeth with Kalashnikovs. They surrounded the house and took him out."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[joshcryer]

28. A rebel spokesman, Ahmed Khalifa, has told AFP that at least 13 pro-Gaddafi captured, POWs

1549: A rebel spokesman, Ahmed Khalifa, has told AFP that at least 13 pro-Gaddafi fighters have been taken captive and are being treated as prisoners of war.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[kenny blankenship]

36. Al Jazeera English reported the Libyan rebels claim they have taken Brega

[CJvR]

37. More reports that Brega has fallen...

...and that the road into Brega is littered with bombed out military vehicles. If the Ajdabiya garrison ran it didn't get very far.

[joshcryer]

39. LOL! So true.

[kenny blankenship]

45. I doubt the Ajdabiya garrison escaped at all.

They were surrounded on the ground and eventually the West realized that they were using the city as a shield (as well as a punching bag) against being attacked from the air. It was costing many more civilian lives not bombing the Gaddafy forces and prolonging the city's agony, than going after them.

Yesterday, CNN's Arwa Damon reported that civilian refugees from Ajdabiya, thousands of whom had run from the city and were sheltering in the desert, said that Gaddafy forces shot civilians in the open, snatched young men from homes and enforced a climate of terror such that noone even dared to retrieve dead bodies from the streets.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/03/25/libya.refugees/index.html

[joshcryer]

48. I went on Google Earth to the town they escaped to, it's not even named there.

Small, tiny, outcrop of a town that is more of a tent city (in the Google Earth image it looks like tents, perhaps a stopping place between Tobruk and Ajdabiya, I am aware those images are months old if not years). Really dire situation.

edit: to find the 'town' go about 25 km due EAST from Ajdabiya

[bobbolink]

56. What agonizing decisions. I HATE the bombing, but I hate the atrocities worse.

What a tragedy.

[joshcryer]

38. Holy shit I need sleep but this is amazing. Gaddafi blew his fucking load on Benghazi.

And he was retarded fighting for Ajdabiya!

[CJvR]

46. Well it was a gamble.

But had the world delayed another 24h it would have payed off. With that column rolling into Bengazi we would have been seeing the end of the Libyan revolution. As for how retarded Mad Dog was to fight at Ajdabiya, the loyalists didn't really have much choise. The flat open ground on the south coast of the Syrten bay is probably the worst ground imaginable for mechanized forces to evade air attacks. Either stay and die fighting or run and get shot in the back. It is not as if there are anywhere to run to short of the more broken terrain back west. Staying and fighting while hoping the air campaign would be brief was probably the best of the bad options.

[defendandprotect]

60. Interesting ... there was too long a delay before NFZ --

but you're right in that another 24 hours could have caused it all to be lost!!

[Iterate]

47. And there isn't a good defensible position before Sirt

Defensible by using towns and civilians as cover, that is. I don't know about Sirt. It's really not like the other cities, much more affluent. Bypass on through the desert highways, house-by-house fighting, or suddenly declare it an open city, the best outcome is the one least likely.

Get some sleep, the bench will watch the feeds (though not nearly as well, but we'll try).

[joshcryer]

40. More: Pro-Gaddafi tanks advancing eastwards towards Misrata, Reuters reports.

1635: Pro-Gaddafi tanks advancing eastwards towards Misrata, Reuters reports.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

They won't get very far either.

[joshcryer]

41. YEMEN: President Saleh is saying he's ready to leave power "with dignity", even within hours

1633: Back to Yemen, President Saleh is saying he's ready to leave power "with dignity", even within hours, Al-Arabiya reports. Not clear what the "with dignity" condition means.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[defendandprotect]

58. Wow -- I had BBC on and missed it --

just have TEXT on -- and got distracted --

Thanks for letting us know!!

[joshcryer]

63. Apparently premature. :(

[pinboy3niner]

93. Talks failed--protesters' demand for immediate resignation "unacceptable" to Saleh

It sounds like earlier indications that President Saleh of Yemen might be prepared to resign may have been premature. A spokesman for the president tells AP that talks with the opposition made no progress - the opposition demanded the president's immediate resignation, a demand, he says, that's unacceptable.


1724:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[bhikkhu]

80. Maybe its like cashing out at the casino while you're ahead

...though I don't know much about Saleh - so much to keep up on lately!

In any case, he sounds much smarter than Gadhafi, and best hopes for the good people of Yemen.

[joshcryer]

43. Misrata: "Strong and random bombing targeting the residential areas"

1628: A Misrata resident who's been in touch with the BBC reports: "Strong and random bombing targeting the residential areas... Gaddafi's troops are trying to enter the city by any cost and they're commencing a brutal and fierce attack from two directions."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418

[CJvR]

53. Well...

...the two critical battles will be Misrata and Sirte. The Eastern rebels need to get past Sirte before Gaddafi crushes the Misrata pocket or the partition of Libya is very real possibility.

[defendandprotect]

64. Does anyone know if these pro-G troops are regular army or mercenaries now?

'cause I noticed that NATO was in the Med trying to stop G from bringing mercs

in --

Sirte -- think that was hometown of G? And didn't the rebels inspire the citizens

there to rebel with them? Trust the NATO forces will be able to clear more of the

way in these two towns. How many times have the anti-G rebels taken and retaken

these towns now -- maddening!!

[joshcryer]

67. Hard to say, the way they tucked tail and ran indicates to me that they're not...

...exactly loyal to Gaddafi, you'd think they'd stick around and fight it out. Certainly the general they captured didn't run.

[defendandprotect]

69. They announced capture of some new POW's but not who they were -- above somewhere...

can only hope that they have been able to stop the mercenaries from coming in --

Hope you get some rest -- this really gets you caught up in it -- !!!

[joshcryer]

73. Thanks, going now. Sorry for no thread #3.

It'll keep you guys from feeling pressured to update it minute by minute anyhow. Seems the news has died down a bit.

[pinboy3niner]

76. *YAWN*...you're leaving already?

Did I miss anything? lol! :hi:





http://i948.photobucket.com/albums/ad321/pinboy3niner/LibyaUprising.jp

[CJvR]

81. I suspect they were regulars.

They had some of the best gear and knew how to use it. African mercenaries are just irregular infantry willing to machinegun civilians, boots on the ground but hardly able to conduct more serious operations.

[joshcryer]

61. Massive demonstrations in Benghazi supporting Air Strike and angry at Russia - (3/23/2011)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhhJnVlUUqQ

[defendandprotect]

65. Beautiful ... LIBYA HURRA!!!

[MedleyMisty]

72. Those pictures show up in this beautiful video

I'm proud to say I saw the link on Twitter when it was first posted and was one of the first few people to watch it. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixwx_B38678

Another link I found on Twitter - http://www.libyagear.com/online-store.php

The Libyans endorsed it, so I figure it's trustworthy. I ordered one of the black shirts with Arabic script on it yesterday. :)

[joshcryer]

75. Thanks for that, I'll get a good nap.

:hug: :hi:

[Turborama]

84. That's a great video. It's in the videos forum with far too few Ks & Rs

Here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x566958

:hi:

[bobbolink]

85. There go the tears again....beautiful, beautiful people!

Any more where these came from?

Thanks... its thing like this that give me *real* hope!

Josh, may you some day meet these people on their own ground! :pals:

edited to ask.. are these photos and ones like them showing up on corporate media?

[joshcryer]

74. Gaddafi commander: 'I was forced to fight'

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8408665/Gaddafi-commander-I-was-forced-to-fight.html">Gaddafi commander: 'I was forced to fight'
Unwilling to die for a cause he "was not convinced of", Brigadier Mohamed Aladin Hanesh dropped his weapon the moment he saw rebel fighters on the outskirts of the opposition capital on Saturday.

The 56-year-old then fled his armoured column and headed for enemy lines, preferring to take his chances as a prisoner of war in Libya rather than participate in the fierce battle that followed.

After a beating on the scene from his captors, he was taken into a rebel detention centre, from where he told his story to The Sunday Telegraph.

"I was forced to fight," said Brig Hanesh, who still sported fresh scabs across the temple, chin and nose.

[tabatha]

82. That s why the more towns are liberated

the more will defect. It is also why Gaddafi has had to import "troops".

[Fire Walk With Me]

78. Thank you!

[pinboy3niner]

79. Mohammed "Mo" Al Nabbous' Assassins: Gaddafi's Secret Death Squads In Rebel Territory

Posted in Political Videos by Turborama:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x567061





http://i948.photobucket.com/albums/ad321/pinboy3niner/LibyaUprising.

[pinboy3niner]

83. At least 9 busloads of Gaddafi snipers have arrived in Misrata

Per an opposition council member there who was on a live call with CNN a few minutes ago.

Said the snipers came in civvies w/ backpacks and sniper rifles on civilian buses operated by a local public carrier co. running buses from Misrata to Tripoli.

Snipers forcing people to leave their homes, can't take their cars or any possessions. Some people being shot. "It's just one crazy scenario after another."

A doctor came on the phone...he was asked if talking to media endangered his life..he shrugged off the question, sayiing, "Nobody's safe in this city." Talked of a family klilled by Gaddafi forces' shelling..a mother holding a baby in her arms and 2 kids with her.."They died together."





http://i948.photobucket.com/albums/ad321/pinboy3niner/LibyaUprising.jp

[kenny blankenship]

86. When the Gaddafies vow to punish civilians for the uprising,

it is the one thing they say that can be believed.

[CJvR]

88. Also...

... a howitzer will be blown to bits by NATO, but two guys on a roof can supress just as many rebels and be impossible to take out by air unless you are willing to pay the butcher's bill in civilians. Helicopter gunships could do the job but then they would be exposed to short range man portable SAMs and the danger of collateral damage would go through the roof.

[pinboy3niner]

87. Dr delivers 2 babies in Ajdabiyah w/o electricity: "I did it with candles"

Report aired on CNN from ITN's Geraint Vincent in Ajdabiyah. Talked to owner of a factory that employs 200--Gaddafi's forces torched his warehouse before they left. "They want to destroy our economy." No electricity at hosp, Dr. just delivered 2 babies by candlelight.

[kenny blankenship]

89. The factory was shelled by the tanks - Scorched Earth tactics against the people of Libya

[pinboy3niner]

90. Up-to-date interactive Libya map, timeline, developments at CNN:

http://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2011/03/world/libya.civil.war/?hpt=T1

[pinboy3niner]

91. Rebels say Gaddafi armored forces advancing on Misrata from W. & shelling port...

Reuters: Libyan rebels say Gaddafi armoured forces are advancing from the west along the coastal road toward Misrata and shelling Misrata port with artillery.

[pinboy3niner]

92. A rebel says shelling on Misrata stopped when coalition aircraft appeared--Reuters nt

[pinboy3niner]

94. CURRENT TIME IN LIBYA = 10 PM SATURDAY, MARCH 26

Time flies when you're having...a REVOLUTION!

Libya time = EDT +6 hours, PDT +9 hours, GMT +2 hours

[pinboy3niner]

95. SIGN THE PETITION: Shut Down Gaddafi State TV!

(From the progressive group change.org:)





Shut Down Gaddafi State TV!


OVERVIEW
URGE NILESAT TO STOP BROADCASTING STATE TV INSIDE LIBYA!

The Gaddafi Regime has lost its legitimacy by orchestrating ongoing campaigns of violence and murder on Libyan people. Estimates of the death toll vary. According to Wikipedia it may be upwards of 6,000 while the Interim Government places it at over 8000. Yet State Run TV continues to broadcast and be used by the regime to incite violence against innocent Libyan civilians. Gaddafi has banned all media broadcasts inside Libya except for his 3 channels. They all rely on Nilesat satellites to broadcast.

Tell Nilesat to shut down Gaddafi TV!

UN Security Council (UNSC) resolutions and sanctions have been enacted with strong support from the international community. The sanctions include cutting off assets to the regime, travel bans and penalties on companies starting new business in the country. Despite the sanctions Gaddafi continues to terrorize and murder civilians. Recently a no fly zone was put into place by the UNSC to protect the people from violent attacks by the Gaddafi regime and a likely massacre against the million people living in Benghazi. The no fly zone was enacted at the urging of the Arab League and the Libyan people themselves.

Despite these measures by the international community Nilesat and other corporations continue to provide a platform for the Gaddafi's regime to spread its terror propaganda to the Libyans citizens and people around the world. Furthermore, there have been reports from Libya that coded messages have been disseminated to Gaddafi’s mercenaries and security forces via Al-Jamahirya satellite TV channel. Please tell these corporate service providers to stop broadcasting all of the Gaddafi regime’s satellite channels immediately. Tell them to stand with the international community and do their part to protect the Libyan people.



Sign the petition and then share it widely with your friends:

http://www.change.org/petitions/shut-down-gaddafi-state-tv#?opt_new=f&opt_fb=t

[tabatha]

102. Done.

[MedleyMisty]

112. Signed it the other day.

Glad to see it has a lot more signatures now.

[bobbolink]

125. As with all these things, not having an address is a liability. :(

[pinboy3niner]

96. Libyan rebels say they have seized control of the oil port of Brega--AJE

Libyan rebels say they have seized control of the oil port of Brega, but there is no independent confirmation. Brega, site of an oil export terminal and refinery, sprawls over a large area and overall control can be hard to determine.

"Brega is 100 percent in the hands of the liberating forces," Shamsiddin Abdulmolah, a rebel spokesman in Benghazi, said.He said forces opposed to leader Muammar Gaddafi had been driven out late on Saturday afternoon in what would have been a signficant success for the rebels.

There were no journalists in the town and no immediate independent confirmation of the rebel breakthrough.

9:45pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-26

[pinboy3niner]

99. Libyan Rebels Push West To Capture Brega--Sky News

Source: Sky News

Libyan Rebels Push West To Capture Brega

7:02pm UK, Saturday March 26, 2011

Sam Kiley, in Brega, and Emma Hurd, in Ajdabiyah


Libya's rebels have captured the towns of Brega and Ajdabiyah from forces loyal to Colonel Muammar Gaddafi after advancing about 80 miles in just 24 hours.

...


Brega, from where a great deal of the oil and natural gas exported by Libya is pumped to Italy and elsewhere, and Ajdabiyah had both been held by the rebels in the early days of the uprising but were lost to Gaddafi's better-armed forces.

...


There were also reports of coalition aircraft above the rebel-held city of Misrata, halting shelling by pro-Gaddafi forces.

...


A rebel told the Reuters news agency that tanks were advancing from the coastal road towards the city. "They are also trying to bring in soldiers," he said.

"From the east, they are shelling with mortars and artillery the port and areas around it."


http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Video-Libyan-Rebels-Retake-Brega-And-Ajdabiyah-After-Gaddafi-Forces-Flee-Amid-Coalition-Airstrikes/Article/201103415960556?lpos=World_News_Top_Stories_Header_3&lid=ARTICLE_15960556_Video%3A_Libyan_Rebels_Retake_Brega_And_Ajdabiyah_After_Gaddafi_Forces_Flee_Amid_Coalition_Airstrikes_

[pinboy3niner]

97. BREAKING, CNN: French fighter jets destroy Libyan fixed-wing aircraft & helicopters nt

[pinboy3niner]

98. French warplanes destroy 5 Libyan planes and 2 helicopters on ground at Misurata airport

French warplanes destroy five Libyan planes and two helicopters on ground at Misurata airport, Reuters news agency quotes armed forces spokesman as saying.

10:35pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-26

[pinboy3niner]

100. Libyan woman brutally silenced after accusing Gaddafi forces of rape

Source: The Guardian

Libyan woman brutally silenced after accusing Gaddafi forces of rape


Journalists try to intervene as Benghazi woman fleeing sexual assault is taken away by government officials


Ian Black in Tripoli guardian.co.uk, Saturday 26 March 2011 16.34 GMT

...

Obeidi said she had been arrested at a checkpoint in the capital because she is from Benghazi, stronghold of the anti-Gaddafi rebellion in the east. "They swore at me and they filmed me. I was alone. There was whisky. I was tied up. They peed on me." She said she had been raped by 15 men and held for two days.

Charles Clover of the Financial Times, who tried to protect her, was pushed, thrown to the floor and kicked, and Channel 4 correspondent Jonathan Miller was punched.

Obeidi was frogmarched, struggling, into the lobby and driven away, shouting: "They say they are taking me to hospital but they are taking me to jail." Minders again tried to stop journalists taking pictures. It was impossible to verify her account. Musa Ibrahim, a government spokesman, said he had been told Obeidi, apparently in her 30s, was drunk and suffered from "mental problems".

...


An American TV cameraman said: "I think she probably was raped, otherwise I can't see her having the courage to put herself at such risk to let us know what the regime is doing. We see the fear in people all the time. But this is the most blatant example of the vicious way the regime treats the Libyan people."


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/26/libya-woman-silenced-accusing-gaddafi-forces-rape

[pinboy3niner]

101. More details from Al Jazeera's news report:

Anita McNaught, Al Jazeera's correspondent in Tripoli, said: "The government initially suggested that she was drunk ... but when they (officials) came back to the journalists later to reassure them that she was being well cared for ... they did describe this as a case of rape."

...


She had scratches on her face and bruises on her body. She said neighbours in the area where she was detained had helped her escape.

...


The Associated Press news agency reported that waiters called her a traitor and told her to shut up.

She retorted: "Easterners - we're all Libyan brothers, we are supposed to be treated the same, but this is what the Gaddafi militiamen did to me, they violated my honor."

Government minders attacked al-Obeidi and pushed out of the way journalists who tried to protect her, smashing some of the journalists' equipment.


Full story WITH VIDEO REPORT byi Anita McNaught (2:39):
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/2011/03/201132617491827374.html#

[tabatha]

106. More twitter info from Nic Robertson

# Govt spksmn said she's being offered legal aid and in next few days, gov may allow a few journalists access to her half a minute ago via web

# Libyan govt spksmn said her case was agnst 4 or 5 men and will be investigated to the full extent of the law. 2 minutes ago via web

# Presser w/govt spksman: Woman taken is “safe & well.” She being held Natl Investigtn HQ. He said her case is “criminal” not “political.” 2 minutes ago via web

http://twitter.com/nicrobertsoncnn

Probably because it was all caught on camera.

[tabatha]

107. Facebook page Free-Iman-Al-Obeidi

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Free-Iman-Al-Obeidi/204101406285342?sk=wall

[pinboy3niner]

108. The foreign press attention probably saved her life

Going to the hotel where the international press stays was both very brave--and very smart!

Eman al-Obeidi may not have expected to survive being caught talking to foreign press. She may have expected the worst, and decided to make one last, desperate act to try to get the story out about what is happening in Libya.

Good for her that she's still alive! The fewer martyrs, the better.

[bobbolink]

129. Looking through the posts and the facebook page... I'm not finding how she was released.

Just got back here... could I find that news somewhere? Thanks!

[pinboy3niner]

132. She hasn't been released yet, as far as we know

But the government is well aware of the international interest in her safety and well-being--so much so that they already held TWO news conferences about her.

It's not yet 4am in Libya--too early to check for updates--but here's Jonathan Miller's account of the news conferences (from his story linked in Post #115, below):

The journalists, shocked to the core by what they had witnessed, were extremely hostile to Libya's deputy Foreign Minister and Government Spokesman in a news conference, called just minutes later. We sought assurances that we would be able to verify that Ms al-Obeidi had not been harmed during her questioning.

Libyan government says Eman al-Obeidi is safe

The government spokesman, Moussa Ibrahim, challenged on what had happened, claimed he had not been aware of any altercation. He then said the initial investigation suggested she was drunk and he raised the possibility that she was suffering from a mental disorder.

"She is refusing to give us any details about her identity or her family," he said. Not entirely surprising.

"We are checking to see whether she was really abused or whether they are fantasies," he added.

Tonight Moussa Ibrahim has held another news conference. "She is safe and well," he said, "with the Criminal Investigation Bureau, who have interviewed her at length. We know she is sane, in good health. She has serious claims about four or five individuals. We don’t believe it’s a political case. It's a criminal case. A lawyer has been offered. We can't find her family. She feels secure."

[bobbolink]

134. Thank you. I saw that part. So it is only taking the regime's word for it.

Somehow, that isn't comforting to me.

While I want everyone to be safe, I have a particular soft spot for a woman who would take that kind of risk to report her experience.

Altho0ugh, as I watched the video, she didn't seemm to be particularly struggling against the men who were leading her away. I probably would have been kicking, spitting, whatever I could do. Which also may not be wise... but.......

[pinboy3niner]

115. RECOMMENDED: BEST detailed account is by Jonathan Miller, Channel 4 News:

I'm posting only Miller's concluding paragraphs, but the full story is worth reading.

Libya: a woman's cry for help in Tripoli hotel

Saturday 26 March 2011
Jonathan Miller
Foreign Affairs Correspondent

...

Judging from what I saw with my own eyes today, I do not believe for one moment that Ms al-Obeidi feels secure. We are still demanding access to her to verify the government account.

For the past two weeks, journalists have been confined to our Tripoli hotel, other than the odd bus trip out with government minders to film pro-Gaddafi supporters. We are unable to venture out to independently report on what is going on or to hear dissenting voices.

Many ordinary Libyans contacted by journalists, even taxi drivers, have been arrested. The government denies this and, bizarrely, continues to insist that we can go freely, anywhere we want.

Those who have attempted this have been arrested, without fail, and returned to this hotel. Some have had black bags placed over their heads and held for hours in stress positions, at gunpoint. Some have had this happen several times. A number of foreign journalists are missing in this country. It has been impossible to tell the story of what is truly happening.

Today, though, thanks to a distraught and terrified, but extremely courageous woman, the story of what life is like in Gaddafi’s Libya came to us. What a shocking insight.


http://www.channel4.com/news/libya-a-womans-cry-for-help-in-tripoli-hotel

[pinboy3niner]

103. Obama says Libya mission averted 'blood bath'

In his weekly radio address, President Obama says U.S. military force in Libya has saved countless lives. He stresses that American involvement in the international coalition is limited and denies that it will draw the nation into a wider war.

Video here (3:58):
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/middleeast/la-fg-obama-radio-address-20110327,0,7920423.story

[pinboy3niner]

104. CURRENT TIME IN LIBYA = 12:05 AM SUNDAY, MARCH 27

Time flies when you're having...a REVOLUTION!

Libya time = EDT +6 hours, PDT +9 hours, GMT +2 hours

[tabatha]

105. Muhannad Bensadik

# Muhannad Bensadik's body, missing for weeks, was found today in #Ajdabiya, and given a burial before sunset, according to his family #Libya 1 minute ago via TweetDeck

# Muhannad Bensadik, source for @feb17voices who was killed in #Libya: His mother has just learned son's body has been found, buried.


Muhannad Bensadik is a 21-year-old Libyan American medical student who has joined the armed struggle against Col. Muammar Gaddafi’s forces. He was reportedly shot during fighting near Brega earlier this month, but it’s unclear if he is dead or missing. We air an interview conducted by Democracy Now!'s Anjali Kamat with Bensadik just two days before he disappeared. We’re also joined by Bensadik's mother, Suzi Elarabi. She recently learned that her son may not have died in the shooting as previously believed.

http://www.democracynow.org/appearances/muhannad_bensadik

http://www.facebook.com/abcnews/posts/195220723845598

http://abcnews.go.com/International/libya-american-died-revolution/story?id=13131628



http://www.martinsvillebulletin.com/article.cfm?ID=27711


Muhannad Bensadik is seen in a family photo provided by his mother, Suzi Elarabi of Martinsville. Bensadik, 21, died Saturday while fighting with rebels in Libya, his mother said. An American-Libyan citizen, Bensadik chose to fight in Libya because he supported freedom for its citizens, his father has said. (Contributed photo)

[pinboy3niner]

109. Tripoli witness: The Whistlers on the Roof...

26 March 2011 Last updated at 12:34 ET

Tripoli witness: fear and uncertainty

The uncertainties and fear over what is to come and what is happening at present remain rife in Libya, as the coalition air strikes on military targets continue. One Tripoli resident - who did not want to be identified for security reasons - describes the mood in the capital.

...


Whistlers on roof

A new public talent is on display these days.

Every night in Tripoli, since the coalition air strikes began, people race to the rooftops of their buildings or houses at the first audible sound of anti-aircraft artillery shots or the rumble of an explosion.

A few minutes in, you will start hearing the men whistling, some are close, others from a distance, and - in the otherwise still and silent dead of night - the chorus of whistling echoes across the neighbourhoods and rises up.

No-one really knows what the whistling means - we're left privately assuming that there is an underlying tone of excitement in the choir and not of the type that would impress the regime.

Another new talent being enforced is stone-throwing. I have yet to see it for myself, but my friends excitedly tell me of the scenes they witnessed.

"Some people in Ben Ashour area and in Souk el-Jumaa district have been stoning the pro-Gaddafi, green flag-bearing cars that drivedown their streets; they throw the stones and sprint," they say.

...

[Iterate]

110. Mark Blyth: The Black Swan of Cairo

Mark Blyth in conversation with Chris Lydon at Brown University, March 22, 2011.

Mark Blyth, the know-it-all professor with the Sean Connery delivery, is back in the pub tonight, and not a moment to soon. When the political economy of energy is screaming red-alert, from Japan melting to Libya’s oilfield civil war, cheerful chatter from a certified political economist can sound like music. Let’s just forget that Mark Blyth, on our last round, told us that austerity would be our nightmare in 2011. And let’s remember it was Mark Blyth’s friend Nassim Nicholas Taleb who cautioned us almost a year ago that we seem to have entered the Age of the Black Swan — a black swan (think: BP oil blowout in the Gulf of Mexico) being an unimaginable event with big consequences and its own impervious mythology of cause and effect. The social service of black swans is to remind us that fragility is a main mark of global systems. In conversation at the Watson Institute, Mark Blyth is generously scooping himself from an article he and Mr. Taleb have co-authored for the magazine Foreign Affairs.

...more and audio player with the interview>
http://www.radioopensource.org/mark-blyth-the-black-swan-of-cairo/

There's quite a bit about Libya, Egypt, Iraq, Iran, and Japan here. I'm sure that many would disagree with some of his views, as he is after all an political-economist and we're bound to disagree with the economist part.

I have my own disagreement with the Black Swan view, not the least of which are his notions tightly coupled systems and the impossibility of prediction. Nonetheless, it's at least an intermediate stage in the evolution of a theory of human systems (and the events in Libya) as complex and nonlinear. If for no other reason, listening to the audio is worthwhile for the chance to vicariously sit in a pub with someone who is interesting and engaging.

Tiny little quote: "We’ve been lucky so far, but that doesn’t mean we’re not turkeys looking for Thanksgiving once again."

[tabatha]

111. Why Qaddafi Has To Go - Posted by Andrew Solomon

In Libya, there was never any meaningful effort to persuade people of the fictions spouted by the Qaddafi regime; everyone knew perfectly well how wide the gap was between what was said and what happened. Yet Qaddafi went on saying, almost as though it were a nervous tic.

Many citizens of the Soviet Union knew that their country was not a paradise of workers and that the K.G.B. was actively watching them; many whites in South Africa recognized that apartheid was a bigger problem than the government wanted to acknowledge. But I have never been anyplace where the fictions were so pervasive, occupied so many resources, and were known by all the people they affected to be so specious.

Working in Libya was worse than working in any other country I’ve ever covered; indeed, it was the most unpleasant experience I ever had as a journalist.

The international community needs to recognize that what is said in Tripoli and what happens during this time of war are unrelated. We cannot make policy decisions based on what Qaddafi guarantees or proposes. The imperative to give him the benefit of the doubt severely delayed our entry into this fray, which has cost many Libyan lives.

Read more http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2011/03/why-qaddafi-has-to-go.html#ixzz1HkUD2RK7

[MedleyMisty]

114. Don't see the code for quotes on the HTML lookup table?

Quotes from an article about the women of the revolution:

In a bare, shabby side room in Benghazi's central courthouse, the hub of pro-democracy Libyan operations, Salwa Bugaighis talks animatedly, hardly flinching as gunshots ring out from the raucous crowds outside. They, like her, are in a mood that veers between celebration and defiance to anxiety. They flood the area of the seafront, which is littered with boards displaying caricatures of the Libyan leader Colonel Muammar Qaddafi and stalls selling souvenirs since the eastern part of the country was liberated on February 20.

The 44-year-old lawyer, an elegant woman dressed in black trousers and jacket, her eyes neatly lined with kohl, was on the steps of the courthouse at the first protest on February 15, when a group of legal professionals and academics gathered to protest the arrest of a colleague and to call for legal reforms, including a constitution. She has barely left the building since. By February 17 the government's vicious reaction had led to calls for regime change, and just three days later rebels claimed control of the city, Libya's second largest after the capital Tripoli.

"There is so much to do," Bugaighis says as she strides down the corridor lined with graffiti, her jacket flying out behind her. "We had no idea we would get rid of Qaddafi in just a few days and we were left with nothing, no institutions at all. We had to quickly work out how to organise everything for ourselves."


Rest of the article - http://www.thenational.ae/news/worldwide/africa/the-women-fighting-organising-feeding-and-healing-libya-s-revolution

[tabatha]

116. Try the "div" code

class="excerpt"

I can't quote it directly because it is used as html.

[pinboy3niner]

117. To create the graybox...

...type :

div class="excerpt"

enclosed in brackets before the text you want boxed.

To end the graybox, after the text you want to include type:

/div

Again, it must be enclosed in brackets.

Good luck, MedleyMisty! Hope to soon see you grayboxing to your heart's content! :)

[tabatha]

124. You explained that well.

[pinboy3niner]

130. Thanks

Wouldn't want to give a member of our Libya blogging team a bum steer. :)

[pinboy3niner]

118. Libyan rebels at crossroads after taking Ajdabiya

Source: BBC

26 March 2011 Last updated at 18:16 ET

Libyan rebels at crossroads after taking Ajdabiya

By Kevin Connolly
BBC News, Benghazi

...


It was to defend that strategic location that Col Gaddafi's commanders deployed tanks and heavy artillery there in such numbers. And it was for that reason that they defended it for several days - the hallmark of their tactics an extraordinary brutality and carelessness for civilian casualties and suffering.

Col Gaddafi's forces made Ajdabiya into a war zone, and then lost the war there.

...


A Libyan government armoured column destroyed on the road outside Benghazi last weekend by French fighter jets was plainly sent to attack the civilian population.

And in Ajdabiya they were clearly using weapons of war against civilians.

...


They say protecting the civilian population of Libya involves the systematic destruction of Muammar Gaddafi's military infrastructure, if possible down to the last rifle and pair of desert boots.

...


The countries behind the rescue of Libya - and make no mistake, Libya has been rescued - meet in London for talks next week. They have plenty to talk about.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12872863

There's more discussion at the link about what the U.N. mandate is and how to carry it out.

[pinboy3niner]

119. Libya's Ajdabiyah retaken by rebels: what next for coalition forces?

Source: Channel 4 News

Libya's Ajdabiyah retaken by rebels: what next for coalition forces?


Saturday 26 March 2011

3:49 pm
Lindsey Hilsum

It’s not that our driver has been hedging his bets, but he did keep a green Gaddafi flag under the car seat just in case. Everyone here brandishes the red, green and black flag of the uprising, with its star and crescent in the centre, but if Gaddafi’s forces had retaken eastern Libya, green flags would have suddenly appeared from nowhere as insurance against retribution.


Today, as we entered newly ‘liberated’ Ajdabiya, he decided that he would not need that policy. As he whipped out the green cloth, ‘shabab’ fighters reached into our car and tore it into pieces. One rag was used to wipe the windscreen. Someone made a great play of blowing his nose on another. And – insult of insults – another cleaned his shoes with the third piece. Our driver laughed and laughed.

...


This evening a fighter we’ve met on several occasions called to say he was heading for Brega, the next town to the west. It’s a small oil town, and the people fled weeks ago. If Gaddafi’s forces need resupply, they won’t find anything there or in Ras Lanuf, the next town along. So they may have to pull back to Sirte, Gaddafi’s home town.

The question now is whether the coalition will attack Gaddafi’s troops on the road west, or whether that will be deemed a breach of the UN mandate which is confined to protecting civilians. The fear here is that if allied airstrikes don’t take out what remains of his forces, they’ll regroup and come back to Ajdabiya again.


http://blogs.channel4.com/world-news-blog/libyas-ajdabia-liberated-what-next-for-coalition-forces/15706

[pinboy3niner]

121. Intensive airstrikes on Gaddafi forces along 400km road between Ajdabiyah and Sirte

AJE reports:

Coalition forces were carrying out intensive air strikes on pro-Gaddafi forces on the 400 km long road between Ajdabiya and Sirte, in the east, a government spokesman said Saturday.


2:17am:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/live-blog-libya-march-27

[pinboy3niner]

122. Potential GOP candidates scold Obama on Libya

Source: LosAngeles Times



Potential GOP candidates scold Obama on Libya


Newt Gingrich concedes he made conflicting remarks but is unrepentant.


By Paul West, Los Angeles Times

March 27, 2011


Reporting from Des Moines—


Likely Republican presidential candidate Newt Gingrich conceded Saturday that he made conflicting statements about U.S. involvement in Libya, but he blamed them on contradictions in President Obama's policy.

...


Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.), who is moving closer to a presidential run, gave Libya a lightning-fast fly-by in a speech devoted largely to "tea party" themes of spending and taxes.

Noting that Obama had just engaged U.S. military forces in a third conflict, she quipped, "Talk about March Madness," a reference to the NCAA college basketball tournament. "Can anybody say Jimmy Carter?"

...


Barbour said that before commenting further he wanted to see what Obama had to say in his speech to the nation Monday night. But Barbour said that "if we're going to commit our resources, our people, particularly, we need to lead, we need to decide; we don't need to dither while we're waiting for the Arab League to tell us what to do. We need to be very careful about nation-building in Libya or anywhere else."

...


"To say to us Americans he's relying on a collection of dictators called the Arab League and a corrupt institution called the United Nations — and by the way, he didn't quite get around to consulting the U.S. Congress — that is a fundamentally false model of American government," Gingrich said to applause.


http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/middleeast/la-na-gop-iowa-20110327,0,2061517.story

[tabatha]

127. And will they flip flop again when Gaddafi is gone?

[pinboy3niner]

133. Why stop now?

:rofl:

[MedleyMisty]

128. Bullshit

http://nationaljournal.com/congress/senate-passes-resolution-calling-for-no-fly-zone-over-libya-20110301?page=1

It's nonbinding, but still - they can't say they didn't know.

[pinboy3niner]

123. Behind the Scenes of the French Lead on Libya

Nathan Gardels.Editor, NPQ, Global Services of Los Angeles Times Syndicate/Tribune Media
Posted: March 26, 2011 07:12 AM


Behind the Scenes of the French Lead on Libya



The French philosopher Bernard-Henri Levy and Bernard Kouchner, founder of Doctors Without Borders and until last year President Sarkozy's foreign minister, have long been champions of "the right to protect" -- that is, the right of the international community to intervene if a sovereign is committing crimes against his own people.

It is thus no surprise that BHL (as he is known in France) was involved behind the scenes
in moving President Sarkozy to take the lead in Libya. Here is my conversation with him about the lead up to the strikes against Gaddafi's forces, the aims of the military campaign and the nature of the Libyan rebels France has recognized:

NATHAN GARDELS: It's been said that you have played the key role in convincing Sarkozy to enter into this war.

BERNARD-HENRI LEVY: The key role, I don't know. President Sarkozy is certainly old enough to know what he has to do. Especially since, as you may know, I am a fierce opponent of his policies. I didn't vote for him in 2007. I will not vote for him in 2012. And he knows it.

GARDELS: Then why is it that you were present on March 10th, at the Elysée, when he received the representatives of the National Council of Transition and recognized them as the legitimate representatives of the Libyan people?

BHL: Well, that's something else. I was there because I was the one who arranged the meeting. I am the one who convinced Sarkozy to receive these three men and who had suggested this "diplomatic recognition" to him. I was in Benghazi covering a story in the liberated section of Libya. As luck would have it, I met these people from the National Council of Transition and, in particular, its president, Mustafa Abdel Jalil. And it's true that I called the president of my country from Benghazi to tell him, "There are people here, good people; these people hold the same values as we do, and they're going to die to the last one if we allow Gaddafi to go on to the conclusion of his criminal logic. Would you accept to receive them in Paris and thus send a strong signal to the butcher?" Nicolas Sarkozy immediately said yes. And he confirmed his agreement the following Monday, on the morning I returned, when I went to see him at the Elysée.

GARDELS: Fine. But why did you operate in secret? And place your partners, in particular the Europeans, before the fait accompli?

BHL: Because talking about this idea, verbalizing it, revealing it, would have meant its failure. When you consider everything that happened afterwards -- squawks of protest from one and the other, dilatory maneuvers of all kinds -- you can imagine what would have taken place beforehand: The operation would simply have been drowned in the flood of quibbling and neo-Munichesque blah-blah-blah. It would have been sabotaged before it had even begun. It had to be secret. For this powerful political act, this decisive act of sovereignty, this act that would break with all custom, all diplomatic rules, all conformisms, the effect of surprise was absolutely necessary. Nicolas Sarkozy understood that. And I am grateful to him for that.

GARDELS: From your point of view, what is the purpose of the operation?

BHL: The purpose is written in the resolution. To protect civilians. To prevent the bloodbath Gaddafi is anticipating. And, beyond that, to break the military machine that Gaddafi, as you know, had turned against his own people. Protecting civilians, then, is putting the army and the power of Gaddafi out of commission.

...

More:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nathan-gardels/behind-the-scenes-of-the_b_840946.html

[tabatha]

126. civilian airstrikes

1:30am

The Obama administration says the Libyan government's claims of civilians killed in airstrikes are unproven.

Defense Secretary Robert Gates says "the truth of the matter is we have trouble coming up with proof of any civilian casualties that we have been responsible for"

[joshcryer]

131. Day 38:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x748891