Libyan Revolution Day 45 (rebels hit by NATO fire, Brega mostly retaken)

[joshcryer]

Links to sites with updates: http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3">AJE Live Blog April 3 (today) http://blogs.aljazeera.net/twitter-dashboard">AJE Twitter Dashboard http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12776418">BBC Live Blog http://live.reuters.com/Event/Middle_East_Protests">Reuters Live Blog http://feb17.info/">feb17.info http://www.livestream.com/libya17feb?utm_source=lsplayer&utm_medium=embed&utm_campaign=footerlinks">Libya Alhurra (live video webcast from Benghazi) http://www.libyafeb17.com/">libyafeb17.com

Twitter links: http://twitter.com/#!/aymanm">Ayman Mohyeldin, with AJE http://twitter.com/#!/bencnn">Ben Wedeman, with CNN http://twitter.com/#!/tripolitanian">tripolitanian, a Libyan from Tripoli http://twitter.com/#!/BaghdadBrian">Brian Conley, reporter in Libya http://twitter.com/#!/freelibyanyouth">FreeLibyanYouth, Libyan advocate http://twitter.com/#!/LibyaFeb17_com">LibyaFeb17.com twitter account http://twitter.com/#!/ChangeInLibya">ChangeInLibya, Libyan advocate

Useful links: http://audioboo.fm/feb17voices">feb17voices http://www.google.com/search?q=time+in+libya">Current time in Libya http://www.islamicfinder.org/cityPrayerNew.php?country=libya">Prayer times in Libya

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x792681">Day 44 here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixwx_B38678">Marching On in Libya, for the revolutionaries!

Demonstrators in Benghazi (Feb 26)

Photograph: Lynsay Addrio for the NYT

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Libya-Rebels-Blame-Themselves-For-Deadly-Coalition-Air-Strike-Near-Brega/Article/200910115964848">Rebels Blame Themselves For Deadly Air Raid
Libyan rebels have blamed themselves for the deaths of their comrades who were killed in a coalition air strike near Brega.

A rebel flag snapped in the wind next to the charred remains of a machine-gun shoved barrel-down into the sand.

They marked the fresh graves of 14 people, among them an ambulance crew - killed by a coalition air strike.

This was a scene that would delight Colonel Gaddafi - the dead were rebels, fighting to drive him from power.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2062920,00.html">A Mystery in Tripoli: Blood on the Street?
When gunfire breaks out in Tripoli, it pushes a city on edge into paroxysms of speculation and rumor. The gunfire was heard in the early hours of Thursday, and went on in staccato bursts for a little more than an hour. It took place outside the Rixos Hotel, where the journalists stay, which is just a few minutes' walk to Muammar Gaddafi's Bab al Aziziya compound. Witnesses to the aftermath described "pools of blood" on the streets. "But you won't find anything now," a resident, who cannot be named in order to protect his safety, told me a few hours later. "The fire trucks came to hose it all down." A friend quipped, "They probably used shampoo to make sure they got it all up." Dark humor has become the trademark of Libyans in a town with little reasons to laugh.

The fight, I was told, took place between a small band of rebel boys from the restive neighborhoods of Tajoura and Souk al Juma, armed with stolen weapons, and Gaddafi's volunteer militia — civilians given arms by the government. The reasons are unclear. The Libyan speaking to me surmised that the rebels, some 30 in total, were attempting to make a show of force at the gate to Gaddafi's compound, but no one knows for sure. What is clear, he told me, is what happened next: the security forces intervened, stopped the fighting and captured the rebels. The Libyan, who comes from those neighborhoods, didn't think any had been killed, though there had been plenty of injuries he said.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-2#update-22706">2:40pm Al Jazeera's correspondent reported that Libyan pro-democracy fighters have taken control of most the Libyan city of Brega after having engaged in clashes with Gaddafi forces.

Video of the convoy sent to take Benghazi, taken from a dead soliders cell phone (shows how massive the operation was): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwWwOeZqz6M

Sky News went with Gaddafi minders to find a "civilian town bombed" only they were never shown any such thing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-O5KJavfiQo

TNC presser talking about various details of the revolution (thanks to Waiting for Everyone): http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=730234&mesg_id=731532

Topic on the women of the revolution, dispels myths that they are treated poorly: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x594751

Videos to bring the Libyan Revolution into context:

The Battle of Benghazi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0vChMDuNd0

BBC Panorama on Libya Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyaPnMnpCAA

BBC Panorama on Libya Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMzwQvcx62s

Tea of Freedom Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WD5tu5bJWKc

Latest indiscriminate shelling in Misurata: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wop3C4zrPXI

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x677397">Text of the resolution.

How will a no fly zone work? AJE reports: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWEwehTtK2k

Canada: http://winnipeg.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20110317/cf-libya-canada/20110317/?hub=WinnipegHome">Canada to send six CF-18s for Libya 'no-fly' mission Norway: http://af.reuters.com/article/libyaNews/idAFOSN00509220110318">Norway to join military intervention in Libya Belgium: http://www.lesoir.be/actualite/monde/2011-03-18/la-belgique-prete-a-une-operation-militaire-en-libye-828970.php">Belgium ready for a military operation in Libya Qatar and the UAE: http://www.defpro.com/daily/details/776/?SID=e80884adc09a37d26904578a9b5978cb">Run-up for Western world’s next military commitment ... with unusual support Denmark: http://www.cphpost.dk/news/international/89-international/51229-denmark-ready-for-action-against-gaddafi.html">Denmark ready for action against Gaddafi France: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/19/world/africa/19libya.html?src=twrhp">Following U.N. Vote, France Vows Libya Action ‘Soon’ Italy: http://af.reuters.com/article/commoditiesNews/idAFLDE72G2HE20110317">Italy to make bases available for Libya no-fly zone-source United Kingdom: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12770467">Libya: UK forces prepare after UN no-fly zone vote United States: http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/nations-draw-up-plans-for-no-fly-zone-over-libya-1.2765122">Nations draw up plans for no-fly zone over Libya Jordan: http://www.smh.com.au/world/military-strikes-on-libya-within-hours-20110318-1bzii.html?from=smh_sb">Military strikes on Libya 'within hours' Spain: http://english.cri.cn/6966/2011/03/19/2801s627320.htm">Spain Expected to Join NATO No-fly Zone Enforcement over Libya

"One month ago (Western countries) were sooo nice, so nice like pussycats," Saif says in a contemptuous sing-song tone."Now they want to be really aggressive like tigers. (But) soon they will come back, and cut oil deals, contracts. We know this game." - http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2058389,00.html">Saif Gaddafi

(Yeah, Saif, as if you weren't "cutting oil deals, contracts" with western states. Who are the 'tigers' now? Bombing your own people.)

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-march-10-0">March 10 7:28pm Saif al Islam Gaddafi says "the time has come for full-scale military action" against Libyan rebels. He goes on to say that Libyan forces loyal to his family "will never surrender, even if western powers intervene".

http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/2011/03/2011328194855872276.html">Libyan Karzai? Chalabi? Forget it
Fortunately, the Council wasn't made-in-the-USA or manufactured by another foreign power. Rather it came into existence, a month ago, at Libyans' own initiative, soon after the winds of revolutionary change blew Libya's way, and after its people rose to the occasion with pride and courage.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/03/31/getting_libyas_rebels_wrong">Getting Libya's Rebels Wrong
Don't buy Qaddafi's line: The rebels aren't al Qaeda.

http://www.newyorker.com/talk/comment/2011/04/04/110404taco_talk_anderson#ixzz1HvS7iW22">Who Are the Rebels?
During weeks of reporting in Benghazi and along the chaotic, shifting front line, I’ve spent a great deal of time with these volunteers. The hard core of the fighters has been the shabab—the young people whose protests in mid-February sparked the uprising. They range from street toughs to university students (many in computer science, engineering, or medicine), and have been joined by unemployed hipsters and middle-aged mechanics, merchants, and storekeepers. There is a contingent of workers for foreign companies: oil and maritime engineers, construction supervisors, translators. There are former soldiers, their gunstocks painted red, green, and black—the suddenly ubiquitous colors of the pre-Qaddafi Libyan flag.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/mar/29/vision-democratic-libya-interim-national-council">A vision of a democratic Libya
The interim national council, formed by opposition groups in Libya, has said it will hold free and fair elections and draft a national constitution. Here is its eight-point plan in full.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/02/25/world/middleeast/map-of-how-the-protests-unfolded-in-libya.html">Click here for updated map

Military Installations



Oil Map



http://bit.ly/fe3P">Google Earth DL here to see positions of army and patrolling route of mercenaries

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=212059469427545728757.00049c4df2474b6543347&ll=31.203405,30.058594&spn=96.173452,183.867188&z=3">MAP of Protests across the Middle East

Mohammed Nabbous, killed by Gaddafi's forces while trying to report on the massacre in Benghazi

"I'm not afraid to die, I'm afraid to lose the battle" -Mohammed Nabbous, a month ago when all this began

I'm struggling to come up with something to say about this man. I was not aware of the Libyan uprising until I saw Mo's first report, begging for help, posted here on DU. I was stricken. Here was a man giving everything he had to explain a situation that clearly terrified him, I would not call him a coward in that moment, but you could see the fear in his eyes, and desperation in his voice. For 30 days Nabbous would spend many hours covering the uprising in Benghazi. For many nights I would go to sleep with the webcast of Benghazi live on my computer screen, looking to it occasionally to be sure it was still 'there.' Mo treated the chat room as if we were his friends, and in some way, we were. I never signed up to LiveStream to thank him for all his work and it seems somewhat shallow to do so now, given that I was a lurker for so long. Ever since I took over posting these threads "Libya Alhurra" has been linked as a source of information. It wasn't until last night, when I posted, and twitter posted on Mo's adventures out into Benghazi to try to determine the truth of the situation, that Mo's webchannel became a hit, over 2000 people were watching him stream live. This was curious to him because he'd done many reports like this in the past but he appeared somewhat bemused that the view count exploded as it did. Last night Mo became a star. This is a man who first started out with a webcast replete with fear and desperation finally overcoming that aspect of himself and losing that fear, to become someone who was a fighter for the resistance just as much as those who held the guns. Reporting on the front lines of Benghazi became his final act, and for that he should never, ever be forgotten. I'm so sorry Mo that I never got to know you better.

Mo's first report, which many of you may remember, begging for help: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38EXALI60hg

Mo's last report, a fallen hero trying to spread the word to the world: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ecu_iWLn-rg

Mo leaves behind a wife who is with child, she had http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2011/03/23/a_bright_voice_from_libyas_darkness">this to say about the No Fly Zone and R2P UN resolution:

We started this in a pure way, but he turned it bloody. Thousands of our men, women, and children have died. We just wanted our freedom, that's all we wanted, we didn't want power. Before, we could not do a single thing if it was not the way he wanted it. All we wanted was freedom. All we wanted was to be free. We have paid with our blood, with our families, with our men, and we're not going to give up. We are still going to do that no matter what it takes, but we need help. We want to do this ourselves, but we don't have the weapons, the technology, the things we need. I don't want anyone to say that Libya got liberated by anybody else. If NATO didn't start moving when they did, I assure you, I assure you, half of Benghazi if not more would have been killed. If they stop helping us, we are going to be all killed because he has no mercy anymore.

[joshcryer]

1. Current time in Libya, 12:09am Sunday, April 3

edit: we've been doing this now longer than the previous person

[joshcryer]

2. Libyan conflict descending into stalemate as US winds down air strikes

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/02/libyan-conflict-descending-into-stalemate">Libyan conflict descending into stalemate as US winds down air strikes
For weeks, Libya's revolutionary leadership has spoken almost in awe of the soldiers who defected from Muammar Gaddafi's army and who would lead the rebel assault to bring him down.

And for weeks, the disorganised civilian volunteers who have rapidly advanced and almost as swiftly retreated along a few hundred miles of desert road have awaited the arrival of these professional soldiers to turn around the revolution's fortunes.

Finally, some made an appearance for the first time at the frontline near Brega. They appeared disciplined, well armed and under command – a stark contrast to the free-for-all of the civilian rebel militia. But there were no more than a few dozen of them and the question still remained: where were the thousands of experienced soldiers that the revolutionary leadership had so often invoked to bolster morale? Did they exist?

While the revolutionary governing council has appealed to foreign governments for larger weapons to confront Gaddafi's tanks and artillery, it has become increasingly apparent that the real issue for the rebels is a lack of discipline, experience and tactics. Even where they have had the advantage, they have been outmanoeuvred in large part because there has been no plan for attack or defence. Instead, the young rebels, full of bravado, charge forward only to turn and flee when they come under fire, often conceding ground.

[joshcryer]

3. Bares reposting: Comprehensive update from the city of Az Zawiya

http://www.libyafeb17.com/2011/04/translated-comprehensive-update-from-the-city-of-az-zawiya/">Comprehensive update from the city of Az Zawiya
In a call I had with some of the freedom fighters in the city of Az Zawiya, they told me what they have from information regarding the latest events in the city. The city has been overrun with troops from Gaddafi’s battalions, most of them are foreign mercenaries and some Libyans also. In every street there are tens of them, some above buildings and roofs of houses which have become empty from their residents.

The northern area of the city is near empty of residents. The majority of them fled southwards after their houses were shelled by Gaddafi’s tanks and rocket launchers. Houses are deserted and have been broken into, looted and robbed by Gaddafi’s mercenaries. Many of the stores and shops have been burned and looted also.

Anyone who goes outside from the youth is either killed or kidnapped to an unknown location. The number of people kidnapped has exceeded 3000 and the martyrs 500 so far. Killings, rapes and transgression, I swear the situation does not require any exaggeration.

The city of Az Zawiya has been destroyed and its residents live in a state of fear, horror, murder and kidnappings. Basic food supplies are near non-existant, children’s milk is not available at all. The youth and elderly are being kidnapped and even women have not been spared from this. The number of kidnapped and missing women has reached 88 so far. I swear by God that the martyrs are being buried in people’s back gardens/yards.

Much more at link. Az Zawiya had these important reports from Sky News' Alex Crawford:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_lQY7PuH7M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymCYt-UP6XE

As you can see, Az Zawiya is not a Gaddafi "stronghold."

[gateley]

10. Are the majority of Qaddafi's forces mercenaries? I'm guessing that those

who showed up (In your previous post) were Libyans?

If it's just money, can't we "hire them" away?

[joshcryer]

14. I think the street enforcers are, yeah.

I've been compiling confirmed reports of all the mercenaries since so many "liberals" contest that Gaddafi is using them.

The street enforcers need to treat the Libyan people with disrespect and power, so it requires foreign entities, because a Libyan wouldn't treat their fellow person that way.

Apparently using "mercenaries" or rather, foreigners who aren't of the same cultural background is Gaddafi's secret for staying in power so long.

[gateley]

21. Thanks. I wonder why more of the 'real' Libyan army hasn't joined up, but they're

probably doing will working for the Man. Relatively speaking, anyway. And then there's always those tribal loyalties.

[pinboy3niner]

4. Where is Eman al-Obeidi? Regime promised she would meet journalists "by Saturday"

Libyan government spokesman Mousa Ibrahim said "hopefully" two women journalists would meet with her by Saturday. It's now Sunday in Libya, and still no word...no news reports...

Here's one earlier report on the regime's promise (with that "hopefully" weasel word):

Alleged rape victim to meet with journalists, Libyan government says


By the CNN Wire StaffApril 1, 2011 5:47 a.m. EDT


Tripoli, Libya (CNN) -- A woman who was dragged away by Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi's officials after telling journalists that some of his troops had raped her will finally be seen by journalists in the coming days, a government spokesman said Thursday.

Eman al-Obeidy will "hopefully" be visited by two or three female journalists by Saturday, Mousa Ibrahim said.


MORE w/ video report:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/03/31/libya.rape.case/index.html

[pinboy3niner]

113. EMAN AL-OBEIDI HAS BEEN RELEASED! See WFE's Post #104 and links nt

[tabatha]

5. Another video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFxeHwUfKt0

(back to taxes)

[joshcryer]

6. Libyan rebels name team to run areas they control

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/04/02/uk-libya-rebels-idUKTRE7311YV20110402">Libyan rebels name team to run areas they control
(Reuters) - Libya's rebel council named what it called a "crisis team" on Saturday, including a new armed forces head, which will administer parts of the country it holds in its struggle to topple Muammar Gaddafi.

The team headed by Mahmoud Jebril will take its direction from the transitional national council, which remains the top rebel political body, council spokesman Hafiz Ghoga told a news conference.

Omar Hariri is in charge of the military department, with General Abdel Fattah Younes al Abidi, a long serving officer in Gaddafi's armed forces, as his chief of staff. Younes will be in charge of staff matters and field operations, Ghoga said.

Younes, a former Libyan interior minister, changed sides at the start of the uprising in mid-February but is distrusted by many in the rebel camp because of his past ties to Gaddafi.

[joshcryer]

7. "He has no position. There is only one army led by Younes," Ghoga said.

Completely debunks the slanders that an "expat was running things."

I knew that something was up about that shit. He's an old fart with no ability whatsoever, he's not just going to return to Libya and run their entire rebel force.

[gateley]

8. K&R nt

[joshcryer]

9. Translated: Comprehensive Update from the city of Misratah today

http://www.libyafeb17.com/2011/04/translated-comprehensive-update-from-the-city-of-misratah-today/">Translated: Comprehensive Update from the city of Misratah today
Hisham: We have the brother Marwouan Al Misratri, a revolutionary from 17th February Revolution from Misratah, official cameraman for Freedom Group and Wefaq Libya, he would like to speak to you about the morale amongst the revolutionaries in Misratah and what weaponry they gained from Gaddafi’s forces over the past few days. Go ahead brother Marouwan

Marouwan: Thank you brother Hisham, and in the beginning, may peace, blessings and mercy of God be upon you. With you is Marouwan Al Misrati, from the city of Misratah. One of the free revolutionaries. We shall speak about the clashes and battles that occurred between the revolutionaries and Gaddafi’s forces today. Today the revolutionaries captured 2 cars, Toyota Land Cruisers which contained some weapons and ammunition type 14.5mm anti-aircraft, some hand grenades and light weaponry.

Let’s speak about what happened in the city of Misratah in details. This morning coalition fighter jets performed air strikes on an area in the south called Abdul Raouf in which some heavy artillery and tanks that were coming to support Gaddafi’s forces from the south were destroyed.

As for the area of Souawa, which is close to the coastal highway and situated in the west of Misratah, in this area a tank was destroyed and 6 Gaddafi troops were killed.

Much more at link.

[pinboy3niner]

11. Libyan rebels 'receiving covert training' (from US and Egyptian Special Forces)

Libyan rebels 'receiving covert training' (from US and Egyptian Special Forces)


Source: Al Jazeera

Libyan rebels 'receiving covert training'

Rebel source tells Al Jazeera about training offered by US and Egyptian special forces in eastern Libya.


Last Modified: 02 Apr 2011 19:29



US and Egyptian special forces have reportedly been offering covert armed training to rebel fighters in

the battle for Libya, Al Jazeera has been told.

An unnamed rebel source related how he had undergone training in military techniques at a "secret

facility" in eastern Libya.

He told our correspondent Laurence Lee, reporting from the rebel-stronghold of Benghazi, that he was

sent to fire Katyusha rockets but was given a simple, unguided version of the rocket instead.

"He told us that on Thursday night a new shipment of Katyusha rockets had been sent into eastern Libya from Egypt. He didn't say they were sourced from Egypt, but that was their route through," our correspondent said.

"He said these were state-of-the-art, heat-seeking rockets and that they needed to be trained on how to use them, which was one of the things the American and Egyptian special forces were there to do."

The intriguing development has raised several uncomfortable questions, about Egypt's private involvement and what the arms embargo exactly means, said our correspondent.

"There is also the question of whether or not the outside world should arm the rebels, when in fact they <rebels> are already being armed covertly."


http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/2011/04/201142172443133798.html

[joshcryer]

12. New dangers on road to Ras Lanuf where the Allies ran into Rommel's Afrika Korps

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/03/libya-history-danger-road-ras-lanuf">New dangers on road to Ras Lanuf where the Allies ran into Rommel's Afrika Korps
In Libya 70 years ago this month, it had looked for several weeks as if another dictator was on his last legs. What followed was a grim warning of how quickly things can change in this vast and empty land if one side has air superiority and better tanks.

By the end of February 1941, Benito Mussolini's grip on his north African empire had been humiliatingly weakened. In only 10 weeks, Lieutenant-General Archibald Wavell's 30,000 British and Commonwealth troops had routed a much larger Italian army that had attempted to invade Egypt and capture the Suez canal.

Much to the joy of the local Senussi tribesmen, the pursuit of Mussolini's soldiers had continued through eastern Libya, an Italian colony since 1912. The ports of Tobruk and Benghazi had fallen, and shortly afterwards the retreating army was trapped in a pincer movement which brought the total number of prisoners taken to about 130,000.

The British were within an hour's drive of Ras Lanuf. In 1941, today's much-fought-over oil terminus, with its billowing clouds of black smoke and litter of burned-out vehicles, was just another small fishing village on the Mediterranean's southern shore. All it was famous for was the nearby Arco dei Fileni, a Fascist monument that British troops called "Marble Arch". With his artillery almost in range of it, Wavell thought he was poised for total victory and would soon be in Tripoli. Then – as it has done twice for the Libyan rebels – it all began to unravel.

Interesting historical article. Anyone want to comment please do (our military history buffs). :hi:

[joshcryer]

13. Lord Woolf's conflict of interest at the LSE (must see, if only for hilarity)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/apr/03/nick-cohen-lse-libya-lord-woolf">Lord Woolf's conflict of interest at the LSE
Rarely since the death of Josef Stalin has an intellectual fawned over a tyrant with the unctuousness Alia Brahimi displayed when she welcomed Muammar Gaddafi via video link to the LSE. Flicking her hair coquettishly, she addressed him as "brother leader" – choosing as a free woman in a free country to honour the title Gaddafi compels his subject people to use on pain of punishment. She did not mock the quasi-Maoist and wholly deranged ramblings of his Green Book – "according to gynaecologists, women, unlike men, menstruate each month", is a typical example of Gaddafian prose. She quoted Gaddafi's words respectfully, instead, as if she agreed with the slogans he had forced generations of Libyans to parrot.

Watching in the audience was Anthony Giddens, whose "third way" philosophy baffled many until he met Gaddafi and explained that "the brother leader" may be putting theory into practice by making Libya "the Norway of north Africa: prosperous, egalitarian and forward-looking". More depressing than the compromised academics were the LSE's dumb and conformist students. Not one had the independence of spirit to defy their lecturers and heckle a dictator who had crushed the hopes and deformed the lives of his people for 42 years.

The LSE says the intellectual corruption of that evening is old news. Howard Davies, its director, has resigned. The university has appointed Lord Woolf – a retired lord chief justice, no less – to investigate Giddens, Brahimi and their colleagues. He will find out what happened to the hundreds of thousands of pounds the university took from Gaddafi's son, Saif, and whether it was in return for a Phd and academic support for his crime family's rule of Libya. The "independent inquiry" will establish the "full facts", the university says, as it drops heavy hints that it is time to "move on".

The video link is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vOVRLBQuDQ

The Youth of today are not Gaddafi apologists, never have been, never will be. They've laughed at him so hard the idiot must not have realized he was being openly mocked by hundreds of students. So much craziness in that video.

[pinboy3niner]

15. What US conservatives never saw coming

Opinion


What US conservatives never saw coming


Obama's critics say Arab revolutions vindicate Bush's freedom agenda, but they overestimate US influence.


Todd M. Thompson Last Modified: 02 Apr 2011 10:56

...


In his aptly (and mischievously) titled article, Project for a New Arab Century, Muhammad Khan alleged that the recent eruption of popular revolutions in the Middle East left conservative enthusiasts for democracy promotion "largely silent". In fact, conservatives have been very vocal as of late. In the midst of the Obama administration's waffling response to the protests, George W. Bush supporters have seized the opportunity to seek vindication for the former president's 'freedom agenda'.

...


While conservatives such as Bush spoke enthusiastically about the universality of democracy they remained convinced that beneficial change would come about in only one of two ways: Regime change or gradual internal reform. In either case, American power and support were considered the essential element. American inaction meant either the maintenance of the status quo or the spread of Islamic radicalism.

In many ways, this myopic, American-centric view of power and change continues to govern both conservative and liberal American views of the Arab world. What conservatives never saw coming, along with the majority of American foreign policy analysts, was the manner in which the Arab world has changed in recent months. It turns out America was not the essential catalyst for change that everyone assumed.

...


At this juncture, as Americans ponder their future relationship with the Arab world, they might do well to consider the ideas of an important, but neglected theorist of political power, John Howard Yoder. He offered the sound insight that state power (whether 'soft', 'smart' or 'hard') is not equivalent to real power and that he who wields the sword is not the source of agency or creativity in history.


Todd M. Thompson is an assistant professor of International Affairs at Qatar University.

The views expressed in this article are the author's own and do not necessarily reflect Al Jazeera's editorial policy.



http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/04/201142919917507.html

[joshcryer]

16. Another home run for Al Jazeera.

This article is amazing so far (no where near done). Thanks.

[pinboy3niner]

17. It's an excellent article, but attribution is not to AJ

It's an opinion essay attributable only to the author. AJ offers the platform for opinions, but it publishes them with a disclaimer.

It's a pet peeve of mine when an article is put up with a subject line like, "WaPo: Obama should go back to Chicago," when the viewpoint expressed is not that of the Washington Post, but of a columnist or op-ed contributor. There is a difference.

[joshcryer]

23. Thanks for that, I do know they have editorials that they endorse, but as you say...

...at the bottom there is a disclaimer. I had posted before I finished reading!

[MedleyMisty]

18. Hmm

Reminds me of people assuming that I held that view, that I was talking about the American government and American influence, as opposed to just good old plain workers of the world unite stuff when I said we should globalize democracy. "We" there meant the human species.

The pronoun "we" is very telling - watch what people assume you mean by it. Shows which side they're on. If they assume you mean the US government, they're probably not the friend of workers.

And I've also been saying that lately - that all the conspiracy theories from the left show that the left has the same kind of American exceptionalism going on as the right, assuming that the US runs the world, that everything in it happens due to the US government and its interests, that there's no way the Arab people could decide on their own to rise up or to ask the UN for help.

[MedleyMisty]

19. The myth of tribal Libya

Not sure if this has been posted already, but hey.

In the last few weeks, the word "tribalism" has been used extensively in the context of the Libyan democratic uprising – a spectre looming over the country, embodying the devil we don't know. This was first introduced into the public mind by Saif al-Islam Gaddafi during his address last month in which he threatened the bloodshed and destruction that his father's regime has let loose on the Libyan people.

Disappointingly, this image of Libya as a backward tribal society with no real national identity has been picked up and amplified by many western pundits and politicians – often as part of their reasoning why military and material support for the Libyan revolution is a bad idea.

The regime has two main aims for this repeated yet baseless claim. First, people in western Libya are largely cut off from outside media and so the assertion that the Gaddafi regime has the allegiance of regional leaders is intended to crush the confidence of those wishing to rise up in their own cities. Second, it aims to confuse outsiders into believing that the Gaddafi regime is all that's holding together a fractured and disunited people. Images of Iraq are the desired effect. Among some in the international press and anti-interventionist movements, Gaddafi's aims seem to have been met without much resistance.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/mar/30/libya-tribal-myth-national-dignity?CMP=twt_fd

No wonder the guy stayed in power so long. He's very good at playing the world with his propaganda. And the world is just falling for it and letting him commit genocide.

I asked my husband yesterday if it was possible to save the human species from its own ignorance.

Thinking of taking all the sources that debunk Gaddafi's propaganda about tribalism and terrorism and everything and making an OP, but I don't know if it would be worth it. People don't want to hear that a brutal and insane dictator duped them.

[joshcryer]

20. Definitely has, I've been meaning to post it in the debunking part of the everyday post.

Thanks for reminding me! :hi:

[pinboy3niner]

22. Rebels concerned about a 'fifth column' of infiltrators from Gaddafi forces dressed as civilians

Fighting continues between pro- and anti-Gaddafi fighters, and as Al Jazeera's Hoda Abdel-Hamid reports from eastern Libya, rebels there are concerned that Gaddafi forces - dressed as civilians and driving mounted pick-up trucks - may have actually infiltrated their ranks:


Fears of Gaddafi loyalists in rebel ranks (2:15):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6DiA7l9ps0&feature=player_embedded


1:31am:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[joshcryer]

24. I think that's fueled by insecurities more than anything.

[pinboy3niner]

25. I think you're right

All it takes is one or two actual infiltrators to create an atmosphere of suspicion and paranoia--the kind of thing that's been reported at rebel checkpoints.

It is true, though, that Gaddafi forces in many cases have adapted to the threat of airstrikes by turning from military to civilian vehicles (like those used by the rebels). And there are multiple foreign press reports that they're even putting rebel flags on some of their vehicles. The question is, are they doing this only for camouflage against NATO airstrikes--or for that reason AND for infiltration?

[joshcryer]

26. Video: Turkish ship arrives at Misratah port on April 2nd to take wounded

http://www.libyafeb17.com/2011/04/video-turkish-ship-arrives-at-misratah-port-on-april-2nd-to-take-wounded/

[defendandprotect]

40. Libya Hurra -- !!

[joshcryer]

27. US begins withdrawing forces from Libya no-fly zone

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/03/us-withdrawing-forces-from-libya">US begins withdrawing forces from Libya no-fly zone
The United States will begin withdrawing its combat jets, missile ships and submarines from the operation to secure the no-fly zone over Libya, as the conflict appears to be descending into a stalemate between the two opposing sides. The move, announced by senior US military officials, comes amid increasing vocal scepticism from members of President Barack Obama's administration over the capability and representative nature of the Libyan opposition.

Among the US planes being withdrawn are the A-10 Thunderbolt and AC-130 ground attack aircraft, which have been used to devastating effect against Muammar Gaddafi's armour. The number of US navy ships involved in the campaign had already shrunk to nine, compared with 11 at the start of the operation, and it is likely to shrink further in the days ahead.

The US had committed 90 aircraft to the Libyan missions. Their withdrawal will leave coalition forces with 143 aircraft, including 17 British aircraft and 33 French. The move comes amid signs of sharp differences over tactics in the coalition, with France still understood to be pushing for an escalation in intervention.

The past few days have already witnessed a reduction in the number of US combat missions. The announced withdrawal follows the transfer of command from the US to Nato.

[pinboy3niner]

29. Darn!

You beat me to it--had it all formatted, too! Curses!1!! Foiled again! :)

[joshcryer]

30. Ha! Blame Internet Explorer!

:rofl: :hi:

[defendandprotect]

38. Gates -- he offered also a sneering for what he dubbed "nation building" in Libya!!

What BS!!

[tabatha]

28. Photo says it all

The real picture is here, but it would not show on DU so I had to copy it to my Flickr account and that can sometimes be unreliable.

?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJ6IHWSU3BX3X7X3Q&Expires=1301875008&Signature=mMwmlW2HnS3nXodVlYiG1sUmcc4%3D

[joshcryer]

31. Thank you for that, Day 46 photo for sure. Adorable.

:D

[tabatha]

34. Well, there is a bit of a problem with the source.

I don't know if you have the time to futz around with it so that it shows up on DU - because my source is not always reliable.

Btw, have you seen this cool map -

http://www.mibazaar.com/meprotests.html

(Well, that was a dinner break - now back to paper work.)

[joshcryer]

36. Actually, I always resize the pics for consistency, and to save bandwidth.

So no worries. I use imgur for my host, just a free image host.

Thanks for that link, interesting. Enjoy the paper work. :P

(I believe you said were a programmer? Props to you for being a female programmer! It's so awesome!)

[tabatha]

46. Thanks.

Yes, I have been at for quite a while. And the work these last couple years has been overwhelming (but interesting) so for most of the year I hurriedly file in a few files, and at tax time (I'm late this year), take time to sort it all out.

[tabatha]

32. Another article on the pull-out.

WASHINGTON (AP) — The Pentagon is about to pull its attack planes out of the international air campaign in Libya, hoping NATO partners can take up the slack.

The announcement Thursday drew incredulous reactions from some in Congress who wondered aloud why the Obama administration would bow out of the single key element of the war strategy.

“Odd,” “troubling” and “unnerving” were among critical comments by senators pressing for an explanation of the announcement by Defense Secretary Robert Gates and Joint Chiefs chairman Adm. Mike Mullen that American combat missions will end Saturday.

“Your timing is exquisite,” Republican Sen. John McCain said sarcastically, alluding to Qaddafi’s military advances this week.

Gates and Mullen, in back-to-back appearances before the House of Representatives and Senate armed services committees, also forcefully argued against putting the U.S. in the role of arming or training Libyan rebel forces, while suggesting it might be a job for Arab or other countries. The White House has said repeatedly that it has not ruled out arming the rebels, who have retreated pell-mell this week under the pressure of a renewed eastern offensive by Qaddafi’s better-armed and better-trained ground troops.

My view would be, if there is going to be that kind of assistance to the opposition, there are plenty of sources for it other than the United States,” Gates said.

http://patdollard.com/2011/04/breaking-war-is-over-u-s-ends-air-campaign-in-libya-any-future-military-involvement-uncertain-as-gates-warns-forcefully-against-arming-or-even-training-rebels/

[joshcryer]

33. I am so fucking proud of Obama. He's the fucking man.

The revolutionaries may not like it, and I'm sure there will be reports about that, but it's the right thing to do. This is the United Nations' battle, not the United States'.

[tabatha]

35. Yep, he sure is playing with the minds of people

who think USA #1 USA #1.

[defendandprotect]

37. Gates and Mullen are working against Obama and Libya -- probably don't want to distract

from the right wing $$$ machine in Iraq/Afghanistan -- !!

Not to mention Heroin -- !!

[joshcryer]

39. Now if only Obama would leave Iraq and Afghanistan!

But you are right, the PTB want to keep that money machine going.

[defendandprotect]

41. ... but not anything like Libya which just reeks of democracy -- !!

You could see it in the few seconds I watched Gates -- he was delivering

the message. Distorting as much as possible.

And, I'm sure we're all afraid that this whole Libya thing could get distorted in

its purpose -- especially with someone like Gates running it.

Can't believe all the crap about Libya in GD -- concern for Gaddafi and his rights!!

Meanwhile, you can barely get a peep out of these same people re Iraq and Afghanistan

and the end to get the hell out of there!!

Amazing!!

[catchnrelease]

42. K&R

[Waiting For Everyman]

43. Video of rescue in Misurata: bombed truck passenger pulled to safety with rope.

Of course it's impossible to go out in the open to get someone who is wounded, with the constant sniping going on there. Very interesting.

April 2, 2011: A Toyota pick-up truck was attacked by Pro-Gaddafi forces in the city of Misrata. The driver was killed and the passenger severely wounded. Bystanders help the wounded passenger, instructing him to crawl to the rope so they could pull him to safety.

http://feb17.info/media/video-revolutionary-car-attacked-in-misrata-by-pro-gaddafi-forces/

I couldn't understand the Arabic, but I'd imagine it would include instructions to lift one's head up off the ground while it's being done. That would hurt a lot!

[joshcryer]

44. At least one person was killed and several wounded early on Sunday by pro-Gaddafi forces in Misrata

4:44am At least one person was killed and several wounded early on Sunday when forces loyal to Gaddafi shelled a building in the rebel-held city of Misurata, a resident told the Reuters news agency.
The shelling hit a building which was previously being used to treat the wounded from the fighting in Misrata, the resident said by telephone. He added:

We have one confirmed dead and we don't know how many wounded. The ambulances are arriving now bringing the wounded

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3#update-22796

[tabatha]

45. Is It Better to Save No One?

(This is an awesome article)

Best quote:

Isn’t it better to inconsistently save some lives than to consistently save none?

By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

Critics from left and right are jumping all over President Obama for his Libyan intervention, arguing that we don’t have an exit plan, that he hasn’t articulated a grand strategy, that our objectives are fuzzy, that Islamists could gain strength. And those critics are all right.

But let’s back up a moment and recognize a larger point: Mr. Obama and other world leaders did something truly extraordinary, wonderful and rare: they ordered a humanitarian intervention that saved thousands of lives and that even Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi’s closest aides seem to think will lead to his ouster.

We were all moved by Eman al-Obeidy, the woman who burst into the reporters’ hotel in Tripoli with her story of gang-rape and torture, only to be dragged away by security goons. If we had not intervened in Libya, Qaddafi forces would have reached Benghazi and there might have been thousands of Eman al-Obeidys.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/03/opinion/03kristof.html?ref=opinion

[joshcryer]

47. What an article! Thank you!

[joshcryer]

48. US public opinion wavers on Libya

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/americas/2011/04/01/us-public-opinion-wavers-libya">US public opinion wavers on Libya
There's been mixed reaction to the operation in Libya by the American public. Prior to the mission, the Pew Research Center found that Americans were evenly divided over whether or not the US should enforce a no-fly zone over Libya.

Since then, the number of people who disapprove has risen. The US began flying sorties and launching missiles against Muammar Gaddafi's forces on March 19. Shortly after the operation began, Gallup found 47 per cent of those surveyed approved of US military involvement while 37 per cent disapproved. One in six people were unsure.

The most recent public opinion polls have found that more Americans now disapprove of US involvement in Libya. Earlier this week, Quinnipiac University completed a poll which found 47 per cent of registered voters oppose US involvement in Libya, compared to 41 per cent who support it. But 62 per cent are optimistic that the mission will succeed.

In his most recent comments on Libya on Monday, President Barack Obama argued his case to the skeptical public, "To brush aside America's responsibility as a leader and – more profoundly – our responsibilities to our fellow human beings under such circumstances would have been a betrayal of who we are."

Haha, US withdraws for the most part. :rofl:

[joshcryer]

49. Starting today US aircraft are not to fly strike missions in Libya

8:10am Starting today, US aircraft are not to fly strike missions in Libya, though NATO commander General Charles Bouchard can request them, which would trigger an approval process in Washington DC, the AP reports. On Saturday, just before the deadline, US combat aircraft flew 24 strike missions in Libya, the Pentagon said.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3#update-22811

[pinboy3niner]

50. About 70 corpses retrieved from the Med. Sea over past few days likely Eritrean refugees from Libya

Around 70 corpses have been retrieved from the Mediterranean Sea over the past few days, and they're believed to be sub-Saharan refugees who tried to flee Libya.

The bodies are believed to have belonged to a group of Eritreans who left Tripoli on March 28 on a dinghy, the head of the Jesuit Refugee Service in Malta told Al Jazeera. Some of the bodies washed up on shore, and others were picked up at sea across an area spanning 10 kilometres.

9:19am:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

51. Hospital sources: Pro-Gadhafi forces attack clinic in Misrata

Source: CNN

STORY HIGHLIGHTS

o One person died and 15 were injured in two attacks Sunday, a hospital doctor says

o Source: The shelling took place at a clinic that had been evacuated due to earlier attacks

o NATO says it is investigating a report that rebel fighters were killed in an airstrike

o Rebel spokesman: Rebel forces went to assess airstrike damage when they were hit

Hospital sources: Pro-Gadhafi forces attack clinic in Misrata


By the CNN Wire StaffApril 3, 2011 -- Updated 0844 GMT (1644 HKT)



Tripoli, Libya (CNN) -- The deadly battles in Libya forged ahead Sunday as pro-government forces shelled

a medical clinic in the city of Misrata, killing one person and wounding 15 others, a hospital source said.


The source, a doctor who was not identified for security reasons, told CNN two people were injured by an

initial mortar blast. The rest were wounded by a second mortar blast when they went to the scene of the

first attack to help victims.



One of the injured is a 14-year-old child who suffered a fractured skull and is in a coma, the doctor said

Sunday.



The clinic that was attacked had evacuated patients because of recent attacks, said another doctor at a

Misrata hospital that received the patients. But it was being guarded by opposition "fighters and young

people" who were injured.

...



http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/04/03/libya.war/

[joshcryer]

52. 14 year old = combatant

:(

Not really.

Anyway I must sleep, take it EASY pinboy3niner, no need to do a million billion updates! :hug:

[pinboy3niner]

53. A million billion? Isn't that a brazillion? :)

Hey, "All the news that fits, we print." :evilgrin:


Goodnight, Josh. Hasta la vista, Baby! :hug:


:hi:

[pinboy3niner]

54. Rebels hit by airstrike "went ahead to see what the damage was, and that's when they got hit"

From a CNN report:

NATO airstrikes hit several rebel vehicles and killed at least 13 rebel fighters, spokesmen for the Libyan opposition said Saturday. Seven others were wounded.


"Based on the information we have, they (the opposition forces who were hit) heard the airstrikes and went ahead to see what the damage was, and that's when they got hit," rebel spokesman Shamsiddin Abdulmolah said. "They were told to stay back, but they jumped the gun."

http://us.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/04/03/libya.war/index.html?hpt=T2

This was pointed out iln the last thread--that not only did the rebel fighters fire AA when NATO warplanes were overhead (either in celebration, or as a provocation by a pro-Gaddafi infiltrator, according to various reports); they had moved forward to an area NATO already had struck--presumably an area identified as held by Gaddafi forces.

Given these circumstances, it's not surprising that this 'friendly fire' accident happened.

[pinboy3niner]

55. U.S. denies its Special Forces are training rebels in Libya--Al Jazeera

The initial reports on this used two terms for the trainers--both "secret forces," and Special Forces." It's possible that the reference to SF was an error introduced by the correspondent. Up until that point, only a US CIA team or teams--not US military personnel--was reported to be involved in training rebel fighters. And CIA agents might also be referred to as "secret forces."

Now the AJ correspondent who originally reported the SF connection, Laurence Lee in Benghazi, says rebels returning from the fighting say they had been trained, "but they didn't say by who."

It looks lilke all the outraged reaction caused by the "SF" report over US boots (not just tennis shoes) on the ground in Libya may have been caused by a reporter's careless use of the label, "Special Forces" instead of "secret forces."

[pinboy3niner]

56. Libya: Fighting resumes in key cities

Source: BBC

3 April 2011 Last updated at 06:17 ET


Libya: Fighting resumes in key cities



Fighting has resumed in Libya with rebel forces continuing to battle for control of the eastern oil town of Brega.

Rebels have captured the university on the outskirts of the city, AFP says.

Overnight, shelling resumed in Misrata, Libya's third biggest city and the last big rebel stronghold in the west, which has been besieged for weeks.

...


The rebels had claimed to have recaptured the key oil town <of Brega> on Saturday, but pro-Gaddafi snipers were still said to be active, and others were apparently holed up in the university, AFP reports.

Early on Sunday morning, the rebels pushed forward and were occupying the university's vast campus on the outskirts of Brega, according to an AFP journalist.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12949859

This story also reports that Gaddafi's forces have shelled the town of Yafran, in the mountainous region southwest of Tripoli. This is consistent with other reports that the army for the first time is attacking western towns that have not come under attack before. It looks like an attempt by the regime to consolidate control of the West of Libya at the same time that its forces are fighting the rebel army in the East.

[pinboy3niner]

57. Freedom for Libya and from boots on the ground

Freedom for Libya and from boots on the ground


Donna Brazile


Sunday, April 3, 2011 12:00 am



It is surprising how often the obvious has to be explained," a Cairo citizen tweeted last week. President

Barack Obama must have had a similar thought listening to his critics dissect his Tuesday speech to the

nation on Libya.


Donald Rumsfeld, George Bush's secretary of defense, appeared on CBS Wednesday morning saying,

"The continued ambiguity by the president ... about whether or not Gadhafi will ultimately be gone is

harmful."


On March 3, Obama told the Associated Press, "We will continue to send a clear message ... Moammar

Gadhafi has lost the legitimacy to lead and he must leave."


That sentence is clear to me. Gadhafi found it clear. Yet Obama's critics have seized upon the "how."

"How will we cause Gadhafi to leave?"


"How" we will "get" Gadhafi is also clear. We will not use military might to get Gadhafi. We will use

diplomacy.


President Obama cobbled together, in record time, the U.N. military response to Gadhafi's threat to the more than 700,000 citizens of Benghazi - a remarkable diplomatic feat we haven't seen from a U.S. president in decades.

...


Therefore, for the future of Libya, the Libyans must own their revolution. Our troops on the ground would be unwise and counterproductive there. Employing diplomacy to remove Gadhafi will require patience, something Americans are in short supply of right now. But this president, I have no doubt, will see that he goes.


A colleague shared these tweets from a Libyan to him: "Someday the 'Libyan Fellini' will remember this

madness in great films watched the world over ... Happy ending (equals) great Libyan filmmakers,

writers, philanthropists, teachers, nurses, doctors, all free everyone!"


And it will have come about without a single American's "boots on the ground."



Donna Brazile is a political commentator on CNN, ABC and NPR, and a contributing columnist to Roll Call, the newspaper of Capitol Hill.


http://www.phillyburbs.com/news/local/burlington_county_times/news_columnists/freedom-for-libya-

and-from-boots-on-the-ground/article_6e52e442-128c-5013-baf9-38977bd8e358.html

[MedleyMisty]

82. I agree with that

And so do the Libyans, that if someone else wins it for them then it's far too easy for that someone else to impose a government, to take control, to deny the Libyans their future.

But at the same time, I think NATO could do more.

Erdogan won Gaddafi's human rights prize last year. I really think the main enemy here is Turkey.

[pinboy3niner]

58. Gaddafi forces shell rebel-held Misurata

Source: Al Jazeera

Gaddafi forces shell rebel-held Misurata


At least one dead and makeshift clinic said to be "overwhelmed" as forces loyal to Libyan leader pound

the western city.


Last Modified: 03 Apr 2011 07:59



A mortar attack by forces loyal to Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi killed at least one person and

wounded several others in Misurata early on Sunday morning.


Two mortar shells hit a building that had previously been used to treat the wounded, but patients and

medical staff had left a few days ago, a resident told the Reuters news agency.


Ambulances carrying an unknown number of wounded were arriving at a new building being used as a

makeshift hospital, the witness said after the shelling.


A man named Ayman who said he was a doctor in Misurata told BBC Radio that the clinic was

overwhelmed.


"We have one killed, three in the operating room now, one with an amputated leg, we have one in ICU

(intensive care) because of shell fragments in his chest and we have six wounded with different wounds

and they are waiting for an operation but we have only three operating rooms," he said.

...


http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/2011/04/20114354942249240.html

[joshcryer]

59. Blood for Corporate Russian Oil in Cote D’Ivoire? UPDATE: GOP Ties (MUST READ!!)

http://jenkinsear.com/2011/03/26/blood-for-corporate-russian-oil-in-cote-divoire/">Blood for Corporate Russian Oil in Cote D’Ivoire?
As the crisis escalates seemingly daily in Cote D’Ivoire, I’ve been wondering why Russia and China abstained on a Security Council measure regarding Libya but have been slow to allow anything in Cote D’Ivoire. The answer, upon doing some research, appears to be oil. Conventionally, one thinks that Libya has oil and countries like Cote D’Ivoire do not. See, for instance, the comments here.

But there are many oil wells off the coast of west Africa, much like the Gulf of Mexico. The oil production in the country has dramatically risen (PDF link) the past decade by a factor of three and more wells are scheduled to be drilled. And even though MMS regulations in the Gulf of Mexico have been notoriously lax, regulations in west Africa are even weaker, if not nonexistent:

LUKoil produces almost 2 million barrels of oil per day, but faces a declining level of output from its Russian oilfields. For this reason it has been more active than other Russian oil producers in pursuing oil prospects outside Russia — in Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and west Africa. The Gulf of Guinea. In the mid-Atlantic, is as rich in potential oil reserves as the Gulf of Mexico, the Russian oil company says — but with a significantly looser regulatory supervision and lower drilling and environmental safety costs.

Russia and China both have oil interest in the country, and the Russian firm (see directly above) LUKoil has an especially close relationship with the illegitimate President Laurent Gbagbo, which has made Russia unwilling to endorse any real action in the country. LUKoil has made big investments in the country and is scheduled to drill wells in Cote D’Ivoire waters with the state oil company Petroci in 2012, as part of a comprehensive LUKoil expansion. LUKoil highlights the Cote D’Ivoire projects on its website. Gbagbo still controls oil interests in the country through Petroci.

Found this rather interesting progressive blog (very very slight libertarian slant, but they're progressive), pro-Libya, and saw this article. Couldn't sleep so I had to post it. Wow.

[MedleyMisty]

83. Saw a clip on YouTube from Russian TV

Saying that the US was attacking Libya for oil.

There were a lot more comments than there should have been from the number of views. A lot of those comments talked about the US and Europe draining their money in Libya and destroying themselves while Russia and China rose and would have all the money and control the world.

I have had so many illusions shattered these last few weeks.

[pinboy3niner]

60. Turkish ship carrying 250 wounded from Misrata expected to dock in Benghazi on Sunday--Anatolia nt

[pinboy3niner]

61. Gaddafi's departure could be "a matter of days"--top rebel official

Official: Libyan rebels seek democracy
(AP) – 2 hours ago


BENGHAZI, Libya (AP) — The Libyan rebel movement that controls the country's eastern half wants to

install a parliamentary democracy across the country once they topple the regime of longtime ruler

Moammar Gadhafi, a top rebel official said Sunday.


Abdel-Hafidh Ghoga, vice chairman of the National Provisional Council told The Associated Press that the

government established after Gadhafi's fall would reject all forms of terrorism and extremism.


"The Libyans as a whole, and I am one of them, want a civilian democracy, not dictatorship, not tribalism

and not one based on violence or terrorism," he said.

...


Gadhafi's growing international isolation and the international military intervention, together with the

rebels' improved military prowess, means Gadhafi's departure could be "a matter of days," he added.


http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hzoZSFS8eIbCU-gLgAwnqvIjuw-w?

docId=69d4feaaead84854903afa3a25e49783

[pinboy3niner]

62. Al Jazeera explains the "Special Forces" reports:

Here's the latest on the overnight report from Al Jazeera's Laurence Lee regarding claims from a Libyan
rebel that he and other fighters have received specialised training from US and Egyptian special forces
on newly arrived Katyusha rocket systems.

The Egyptian and US governments have both denied that they have special forces training the rebels, and
a spokesman for the Libyan opposition's Transitional National Council has declined to say whether the
rebels have bought new weapons or are receiving such training.

The spokesman, Mustafa Gheriani, said the rebels are seeking weapons and would welcome training
from any friendly country. The opposition has almost from the beginning of the uprising sought to
purchase weapons from other countries and on Friday announced a deal whereby it would sell oil to
Qatar and use the revenue to purchase weapons and supplies.

The rebel source told Al Jazeera that he had been taken to a "secret facility" in the east to receive training
on advanced, "heat-seeking" Katyusha rockets but had wound up receiving a shoulder-mounted model.
Such a scenario is unlikely, though, since Katyushas - Russian-made rockets in use for decades - are
heavy weapons with little guidance that are usually mounted in multi-barrel arrangements on truck beds.

Several media sources have said that CIA and SAS clandestine intelligence officers are in Libya, likely
liasing with and training the rebels. It's possible that a civilian rebel with no military training could
confuse such officers with special forces troops such as the Green Berets, who traditionally train foreign
fighters.

1:33pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[Turborama]

88. I saw a report on CNN earlier which showed how it really is like herding cats

The young guys from town are full of adrenalin and just want to go for it, whereas the older military trained soldiers are getting pissed off with their recklessness.

I'll try and find the video, it was quite a telling report.

BTW this is an OT announcement but I wanted to share. I am now carrying out a zero tolerance campaign against Terry Jones apologists. Each and every single one of them that I see are instantly put on full Ignore, permanently. Safe to say that list has grown exponentially over the past 24 hours and I can see hardly any threads supporting him in GD anymore.

:hi:

:yourock:

[pinboy3niner]

94. I remembered a reference to a 'scuffle' breaking out over volunteers' lack of discipline

I just stumbled onto it again when Reuters updated its original story:

The volunteers tend to get on well with the rebel army but a small scuffle broke out near Brega's eastern gate on Sunday as a soldier berated them for their lack of discipline.

"These revolutionaries go in and fire and that's it. They don't have any tactics, these guys. They cause problems," said the soldier, Mohammed Ali.

Former Air Force Major Jalid al-Libie told Reuters in Benghazi that a brigade of professional soldiers had been formed and it would bring order to the rebel army at the frontline.

"We are reorganising our ranks. We have formed our first brigade. It is entirely formed from ex-military defectors and people who've come back from retirement."

http://af.reuters.com/article/libyaNews/idAFLDE73205E20110403?sp=true

OT, I noticed a couple thread titles indicating something is raging in GD over the pastor, but to tell you the truth, I've had no time to pay attention to ANYTHING else going on in GD. I know the debate is a repeat of one that's gone on before. I think I'll stick with these Libya threads... :)


:hi:

[tabatha]

116. I had never used ignore before

until this uprising. Sometimes posts were so disjointed that my head hurt - and my ignore list has grown to all of 5.

[pinboy3niner]

63. CNN update on Brega: "Still being fought over"

CNN's Reza Sayah just gave a live report that Brega remains contested, and that Gaddafi forces are now shelling the town.

An opposition spokesman called it "no man's land," Sayah reported.

"Perhaps Brega was never in control of the opposition, despite what an opposition spokesman told us yesterday," Sayah said.

[pinboy3niner]

64. Editorial: War in Libya is worthy, but U.S. action should remain limited

Editorial: War in Libya is worthy, but U.S. action should remain limited


Published: Sunday, April 03, 2011, 7:10 AM


By The Grand Rapids Press Editorial Board



The specter or the 1994 massacre in Rwanda continues to influence U.S. foreign policy. The U.S. failure
to intervene in that terrible crisis remains a moral failing and a haunting what-if. No doubt that lack of
action helped spur military strikes in Libya as henchman-dictator Moammar Gadhafi threatened mass
slaughter of rebels within his country.

The humanitarian plight of the Libyan people provides a compelling reason for military involvement.
Gadhafi promised devastation for rebellious citizens in Benghazi — to go “house to house” and “show no
mercy.” Those threats, from the mastermind of the Pan Am Flight 103 murders in 1988, had to be taken
seriously.

The worthiness of the cause should not erase the difficult questions raised by U.S. intervention. Why
Libya and not another country — Yemen or Bahrain — where people are dying or being threatened? What
is the end game of military action? Are the rebels we’re supporting truly freedom-seekers, or will they
topple Gadhafi only to establish another repressive regime? While removal of Gadhafi isn’t one of our
stated goals, can we cease military action with him still in place?

...


A mass slaughter in Libya while America stood by would have been just as abhorrent to this country’s
ideals as the genocide in Rwanda. In addition, it would have elicited protests from some of the same
people now criticizing the president.

That said, the United States is already fully committed to conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan, although with
end dates for both on the horizon. The U.S. can’t afford another operation of that size. Action in Libya
should remain as Mr. Obama has promised — limited in time, scale and mission. Such limits would be in
the national interest, just as much as the prevention of slaughter.


http://www.mlive.com/opinion/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2011/04/editorial_war_in_libya_should.html

[pinboy3niner]

65. Two Die In Gaddafi Forces Bombardment

Source: Sky News

Rebels return fire against Gaddafi forces near Brega Sky News
_______________________________________________________


2:06pm UK, Sunday April 03, 2011


Two Die In Gaddafi Forces Bombardment


Government forces have bombarded two towns southwest of Libya's capital, killing at least two people
and wounding many more, according to eyewitnesses.



Two people were reported dead and four wounded when residential areas in the city of Yafran, about 62
miles (100km) from Tripoli, were shelled by forces loyal to Colonel Muammar Gaddafi early on Sunday.

Further attacks were launched in the nearby town of Zintan later in the morning with tanks rolling in to
the area and opening fire.

A Yafran resident, known only as Ezref, told Arabiya television:

"We are facing fierce attacks from the north since yesterday."

"Two people have died a short while ago and so far we have four wounded.

"Residential areas have been shelled with Grad rockets."

While Zintan resident Abdulrahman said: "Gaddafi's brigades bombarded Zintan with tanks in the early
hours of Sunday. There has been random bombardment of the northern area. They are still besieging the
town."


http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Government-Forces-Shelled-Yafran-And-Zintan-

Near-Libyas-Capital-Killing-Two-And-Wounding-Four-More/Article/201104115965052?

lpos=World_News_Carousel_Region_1&lid=ARTICLE_15965052_Government_Forces_Shelled_Yafran_

And_Zintan_Near_Libyas_Capital_Killing_Two_And_Wounding_Four_More

[pinboy3niner]

66. Volunteer doctor: "600 to 1,000 deaths since the fighting started" in Misrata

Source: Reuters

Last Updated: Sunday, April 3, 2011, 09:44


Pro-Gadafy forces maintain assault



Forces loyal to Col Muammar Gadafy shelled a building in Misrata early today to try to dislodge rebels
from their last big stronghold in western Libya where a doctor says hundreds have been killed.

Like many cities, Misrata rejected Col Gadafy's rule in a revolt in February. In a violent crackdown,
Gaddafi's forces restored control in most places in western Libya, leaving Misrata cut off and
surrounded, with dwindling supplies.

...


After weeks of shelling and encirclement, government forces appear to be gradually loosening the
rebels' hold there, despite western air strikes on pro-Gadafy targets. The rebels say they still control the
city centre and the sea port, but Col Gadafy's forces have pushed into the centre along the main
thoroughfare.

A doctor who gave his name as Ramadan said by telephone from the city that 160 people, mostly
civilians, had been killed in fighting in Misrata over the past seven days.

Ramadan, a British-based doctor who said he arrived in Misrata three days ago on a humanitarian
mission, had no figure for the total toll since fighting began six weeks ago.

"But every week between 100 or 140 people are reported killed - multiply this by six and our
estimates are 600 to 1,000 deaths since the fighting started," he said.


http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2011/0403/breaking4.html

[pinboy3niner]

67. Gaddafi forces shell town as rebels name "crisis team"

Source: Reuters

Gaddafi forces shell town as rebels name "crisis team"


By Alexander Dziadosz
BREGA, Libya | Sun Apr 3, 2011 9:16am EDT


BREGA, Libya (Reuters) - Libyan rebels put their best troops in to battle Muammar Gaddafi's forces for
the eastern oil town of Brega on Sunday while Western warplanes flew overhead and the sound of
explosions ripped through the air.

Libya's civil war is in danger of getting bogged down in a stalemate as neither Gaddafi's troops, tanks and
artillery, nor the chaotic rebel force is able to gain the upper hand, despite Western air power effectively
aiding the insurgents.

The rebels are, however, attempting to put their house in order, naming a "crisis team" with the former
interior minister as the armed forces chief of staff, to try to run parts of Libya it holds and reorganising
their military forces.

Outside Brega, better rebel discipline was already in evidence on Sunday with the less disciplined
volunteers, and journalists, kept several kilometers (miles) east of the front. The insurgents have also
deployed heavier weapons.

...


"We are reorganising our ranks. We have formed our first brigade. It is entirely formed from ex-military
defectors and people who've come back from retirement," Former Air Force Major Jalid al-Libie told
Reuters in Benghazi.

...


(Additional reporting by Maria Golovnina in Tripoli, Angus MacSwan in Benghazi, Christian Lowe in Algiers, Tom Pfeiffer in Cairo, Joseph Nasr in Berlin, Justyna Pawlak in Brussels; Writing by Jon Hemming; Editing by Elizabeth Fullerton)


http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/03/us-libya-idUSTRE7270JP20110403

[pinboy3niner]

68. Former Libyan human rights official: possible "conspiracy" by NATO in not bombing some areas

Mohammed Ibrahin al-Ellagi, a former secretary general of the Libyan Human Rights Society, and newly
appointed justice minister in the Libyan transitional national council, tells Al Jazeera that there is a
possible "conspiracy" to be seen in the fact that NATO and allied troops have not bombarded Gaddafi
positions in Misurata and Az Zintan in the same way that they did in Benghazi.

al-Ellagi, speaking only in his capacity as a human rights activist, says UN Security Council Resolution
1973 is "flexible" and meant to provide protection to civilians, and that it should provide complete cover
for allied forces to launch attacks on Gaddafi's forces across the country.

He terms the situation in the western mountains of the country "very dire", saying that "heavy attacks"
have been launched by pro-Gaddafi forces on the opposition there.

Al-Ellagi says a possible motive for allied forces to not take on Gaddafi in the west would be to allow
Gaddafi to "create a solid platform for negotiation", or to choke the rebels' movement.

3:40pm:
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/

[CJvR]

80. Paranoid asshole.

The situation is a bit different out east than it is in the west.
Grab a rifle and go defend Misrata and you might agree that blasting every AFV in sight might not be a good idea if they are actually parked in a city.

[pinboy3niner]

69. Libya deputy FM "crossed into Tunisia at about 0900 GMT this morning," Al Jazeera confirms

The Tunisian state news agency says that the Libyan deputy foreign minister, who Reuters names as Abdelati Obeidi, was in the country on a "private visit", the same term used to describe the visit by Moussa Koussa, the former foreign minister who resigned after leaving Libya.

Reuters, citing a Tunisian security source, says Obeidi has flown to Athens from Djerba airport.

4:29pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

70. Reuters: Dep. Libya FM in Athens to convey a message from Gaddafi to the Greek prime minister

The news agency cites a Greek government source.

[pinboy3niner]

75. Greek Foreign Ministry confirms visit is official, to meet with Greek Prime Minister--AJ

A Greek foreign ministry spokesperson has confirmed to Al Jazeera that the Libyan deputy foreign minister is in Athens to meet with George Papandreou, the Greek prime minister.

5:08pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3


1999 file photo of Libyan deputy foreign minister Abelati Obeidi from a conference in Stuttgart (Reuters):

[pinboy3niner]

86. CNN reports he is traveling with guards

Obviously, they don't mean bodyguards. Gaddafi has 'minders' with all Libyan officials these days...ARMED minders.

[pinboy3niner]

71. NATO says 184 sorties flown today, including 70 "strike sorties" nt

[pinboy3niner]

72. A British delegation has arrived in Benghazi to meet with the Libyan transition national council

A British delegation has arrived in Benghazi and will be meeting with the Libyan transition national council, according to Mustafa Gheirani, a spokesman, AFP reports.

The visit comes after an early British contact team, reportedly consisting of six soldiers from the elite Special Air Service (SAS) and two diplomats, was rounded by lightly armed rebels soon after they touched down near Benghazi by helicopter.

4:23pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

73. Libyan survivor tells his tale--"There is a massacre happening every day"

While the news from the fighting in Libya has largely been grim, Al Jazeera's Sue Turton in Benghazi caught up with the family of a man who survived a trek across the strife-torn country to finally reach home, two months after he had left.

She filed this report:

Libyan survivor tells his tale (2:27)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j28ma8xoKV0&feature=player_embedded


OR watch at AJE:
5:06pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

74. More from Reuters on the rebel "crisis team"

...

The team headed by Mahmoud Jebril will take its direction from the transitional national council, which remains the top rebel political body, council spokesman Hafiz Ghoga told a news conference.

Omar Hariri is in charge of the military department, with General Abdel Fattah Younes al Abidi, a long serving officer in Gaddafi's armed forces, as his chief of staff. Younes will be in charge of staff matters and field operations, Ghoga said.

Younes, a former Libyan interior minister, changed sides at the start of the uprising in mid-February but is distrusted by many in the rebel camp because of his past ties to Gaddafi.

...


The economics and finance portfolio is held by Ali Tarhouni, a U.S.-based academic and opposition figure in exile who returned to Libya to help the struggle. Under Tarhouni, a new National Oil company will be led by Waheed Bougaighis and a Central Bank by Ahmad Shareef.

Others appointments included foreign affairs -- Ali El-Essawi, infrastructure -- Jumma El-Osta, information -- Mahmoud Shamman and justice -- Muhammad El-Alagi.

...


http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/02/us-libya-rebels-idUSTRE7311Z120110402?WT.tsrc=Social%20Media&WT.z_smid=twtr-reuters_%20com&WT.z_smid_dest=Twitter

[MedleyMisty]

85. OMG, a national oil company!

I suppose that means that as soon as they win, we'll start bombing them. After all, aren't we bombing Gaddafi because he was about to nationalize the oil?

[pinboy3niner]

76. Ivory Coast: U.N. evacuates staff after attacks

Source: Reuters



ABIDJAN | Sun Apr 3, 2011 11:29am EDT


ABIDJAN (Reuters) - The United Nations mission in Ivory Coast (UNOCI) said Sunday that it had relocated some of its non-essential staff to the northern city of Bouake after a number of them came under attack.

"We have made a temporary relocation of some of our staff to Bouake. It is a small part of the staff, mostly non-essential personnel," Hamadoun Toure, UNOCI spokesman told Reuters.

"Our patrols and headquarters were targeted by attacks, but we continue to work," he said.

Toure declined to give number of those evacuated.

...


http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/03/us-ivorycoast-un-idUSTRE7321LE20110403?WT.tsrc=Social%20Media&WT.z_smid=twtr-reuters_%20com&WT.z_smid_dest=Twitter

[pinboy3niner]

77. Libya crisis will not end in stalemate--British Foreign Secretary

Source: BBC

3 April 2011 Last updated at 11:25 ET


Libya crisis will not end in stalemate - William Hague


The military intervention in Libya will not end in a stalemate, Foreign Secretary William Hague has said.

He said Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's regime had no future because it was isolated and "can't sell any oil".

...


Earlier, a poll for BBC News suggested that two-thirds of people believed Britain's military involvement in Libya would go on for some time.

Of 2,000 people asked, 65% said the UK's involvement in Libya "will last for some time", while just 14% chose the option "will be over pretty quickly", and 20% did not know.

...


Asked on the Andrew Marr show on BBC One about the danger of a military stalemate between pro-Gaddafi forces and rebels, Mr Hague said there was no future for Libya under its current leadership.

"Let's be clear, if the Libyan regime tries to hang on in this situation, they are internationally isolated, they can't sell any oil," he said.

"There is no future for Libya on that basis, and so I think even the prospect of stalemate should encourage people in Tripoli to think, 'Well, Col Gaddafi has now got to go.'"

...


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12948467

[pinboy3niner]

78. Former Archbishop Desmond Tutu: 'Soft landing' for Gaddafi would save lives, be lesser of 2 evils

Former Archbishop Desmond Tutu of South Africa appears to have taken a pragmatic view of the conflict in Libya. Speaking to the BBC, he said:

It's quite clear in the best of worlds it would be a good thing for us to say you clobber (Gaddafi), capture him and let him stand for trial ... But we know that doesn't usually happen in the world in which we inhabit."

He added that the "lesser of two evils" could be to allow Gaddafi to "have a soft landing and save the lives of as many people as you possibly can".

5:52pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

79. Qaddafi Son Proposes Peace Plan, Diplomat Says

Source: New York Times

Qaddafi Son Proposes Peace Plan, Diplomat Says


By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK
Published: April 3, 2011



TRIPOLI, Libya — Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi’s son Seif el-Islam is proposing a resolution to the Libyan
conflict that would entail his father relinquishing power for a transition to constitutional democracy under
his son’s direction, a diplomat with close ties to the Libyan government said Sunday, citing “eminent
people” in Tripoli.

But neither Colonel Qaddafi nor the rebels seeking his ouster appear ready to accept such a proposal,
the diplomat said, speaking on condition of anonymity to divulge private conversations within the Libyan
government.

Despite the evidence of deep internal discontent, Colonel Qaddafi appears to believe that rebellion
against him is a foreign conspiracy of Islamist radicals and oil-hungry Western powers attempting to take
over Libya, the diplomat said. And the rebels, who have set up their own provisional government,
continue to insist on the exit from power of Colonel Qaddafi and his sons.

“This is the beginning position of the opposition, and this is the beginning position of the Libyan
government,” this diplomat said. “But the bargaining has yet to commence.”



http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/04/world/africa/04libya.html?_r=2&hp

[pinboy3niner]

81. Syria frees Reuters photographer after six days

Syria frees Reuters photographer after six days http://t.co/0dOAGTW
2 minutes ago via Tweet Button

http://twitter.com/reuters

[pinboy3niner]

84. BREAKING, MSNBC: Defense officials confirm US Harrier jets flew strike missions in last 12 hours

Despite proclaimed end of US role, the Harrier 'jump jets' flew strike missions and dropped at least 3 bombs, 2 defense officials confirmed. The delay in the end of the US role was reportedly due to bad weather.

[pinboy3niner]

87. Eman al-Obeidi still missing, father says

Source: CNN

Father of alleged Libyan rape victim says she is still missing


From Saad Abedine, CNN
April 3, 2011 12:38 a.m. EDT



Benghazi, Libya (CNN) -- The father of a woman who was dragged away by officials loyal to the Libyan regime after telling journalists that troops had beaten and raped her said Saturday that he has no idea where his daughter is.

"We hope that she is still alive," Atiq al-Obeidy told CNN. "We pray for her safety but I am worried about her fate. I believe that she is imprisoned somewhere."

...


On Thursday, government spokesman Musa Ibrahim said al-Obeidy would "hopefully" be visited by two or three female journalists by Saturday. There was no indication Saturday that any journalists had seen or spoken to her.

...


But her father said he has serious doubts that Moammar Gadhafi's government would allow reporters to talk to his daughter.

"We are just like the rest of you. We are glued to the TV hoping that we will hear something about her. God willing she will be alive and safe," he said.


More w/ video reports:
http://us.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/04/02/libya.rape.case/index.html?hpt=T2

[Turborama]

90. I was thinking of what Musa Ibrahim said when I read the title and started reading the article

I knew that asshole was lying when I watched him smarm his way out of the difficult questions with that vague promise. The thing he said about "being looked after in a shelter" was bull, too.

I really hope she's OK. I've thought about her at least a couple of times everyday since I 1st saw her disappear on TV and went and uploaded the report to YouTube to add exposure: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eyuG-C5nH8

[pinboy3niner]

92. CNN was doing a good job of following this every day

It was included among their correspondents' live reports from Libya, and Anderson Cooper had excellent reports on his AC360 program. Then coverage seemed to drop off yesterday, the day Eman al-Obeidi was supposed to be allowed to meet with female journalists.

Putting it on YouTube is a great idea. If anything can help Eman--and possibly save her life--it's the Gaddafi regime's awareness of international interest in her safety and well-being.

:yourock:

[pinboy3niner]

89. Gaddafi forces attack western towns, shell houses, kill farmers' livestock

Sky news reports eyewitness accounts from embattled towns:

Two people were reported dead and four others wounded when troops loyal to Colonel Muammar
Gaddafi shelled residential areas in the city of Yafran, about 62 miles (100km) from Tripoli, early on
Sunday.

Gaddafi's forces were also killing farmers livestock there, residents said.

Further attacks were later launched in the nearby town of Zintan with tanks rolling in to the area and
opening fire.

A Yafran resident, known only as Ezref, told Arabiya television: "We are facing fierce attacks from the
north since yesterday."

"Two people have died a short while ago and so far we have four wounded.

"Residential areas have been shelled with Grad rockets."

While Zintan resident Abdulrahman said:

"Gaddafi's brigades bombarded Zintan with tanks in the early hours of Sunday.

"There has been random bombardment of the northern area. They are still besieging the town."

He added that he had been in touch with relatives in Yafran who told him pro-Gaddafi forces had moved
into the area around the town.

"They have been searching houses ... The soldiers have killed everything they found, including cattle.

They have killed and eaten a countless number of sheep.

"About 100 camels belonging to one of my relatives were killed. They kill everything."

The truth is out there, we’re sure, somewhere between the scorched earth and the long grass. And I
promise you we’re still searching.

--Sky News presenter Jeremy Thompson, in Tripoli

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Government-Forces-Shelled-Yafran-And-Zintan-

Near-Libyas-Capital-Killing-Two-And-Wounding-Four-More/Article/201104115965052?

lpos=World_News_Carousel_Region_1&lid=ARTICLE_15965052_Government_Forces_Shelled_Yafran_

And_Zintan_Near_Libyas_Capital_Killing_Two_And_Wounding_Four_More

[pinboy3niner]

91. Turkish ship forced to leave early, carrying 250 wounded from Misrata to Turkey w/ armed escort

A Turkish ship carrying 250 wounded people left Misurata today, escorted by 10 Turkish air force F-16s and two navy frigates, Ali Akin, head of consular affairs at the Turkish foreign ministry says.

The ship was forced to make an earlier than expected departure, as thousands pressed forward on the dockside hoping to be allowed safe passage out of the besieged city.

Akin says the Ankara, a chartered ship, is bound for a Turkish port, where a field hospital has been set up.

7:08pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

93. Note the ship's escort: "10 Turkish air force F-16s and two navy frigates"!

Clearly, Turkey sees a serious risk of Gaddafi attacking a ship full of 250 wounded people.

[MedleyMisty]

101. Yeah

Once again I find myself deciding to hold back before making a decision. I still don't trust Erdogan though -getting a human rights prize from Gaddafi is not the best sign in the world. But one man does not an entire nation's government make.

The petition to him about Iman al-Obeidi has over 500,000 signatures now, btw. :)

[pinboy3niner]

105. Turkey also is looking after the interests of countries that have withdrawn their diplomats

They've represented the U.S. in pursuing the release of American journalists held captive by Gaddafi forces, for example (like the four NYT journalists recently released).

Turkey seems to have some pretty complex relationships and interests here, and its positions don't always appear to be consistent.


:hi:

[pinboy3niner]

95. UPDATE on Red Cross humanitarian teams in Libya

From an International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) press release:

Delegates of the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) arrived in Tripoli on 30 March at the
invitation of the Libyan authorities. The aim is to discuss the expansion of the organization's
humanitarian activities to the entire country, in particular to areas hardest-hit by the armed conflict.


The ICRC team met with Dr Al-Baghdadi Al-Mahmoudi, Libya's prime minister, Dr Mohammed Al-Hijazi,
Secretary of Health and Environment, and Dr Bashir Saleh, Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's chief of staff.
More high-level meetings are to follow in the coming days.


"The first discussions were substantial and encouraging", said Jean-Michel Monod, who is heading the
ICRC team in Tripoli. The organization stands ready to assess the situation from a humanitarian
viewpoint in some of the worst-affected areas in order to meet the most pressing needs of vulnerable
people. Access to people arrested in the initial phase of the unrest and to those captured in connection
with the ensuing armed conflict has also been discussed.


The ICRC first sent delegates to Benghazi on 26 February, and now has an office there with some 40
international and national staff. It also has a logistical base and a warehouse in the eastern city of
Tobruk and has been working in the city of Ajdabiya, where it has provided about 15,000 people with
food and essential household items, and supplied the main hospital with surgical instruments and
dressing kits to treat wounded patients. The ICRC has so far visited over 80 Libyan servicemen and
other people held by the armed opposition in Benghazi.


http://pr-usa.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=677615&Itemid=29

[pinboy3niner]

96. Reporting from Tripoli, chafing on Gadhafi's leash

Source: AP

Reporting from Tripoli, chafing on Gadhafi's leash


By Hadeel Al-shalchi, Associated Press – 28 mins ago


TRIPOLI, Libya – At the Rixos Hotel, Moammar Gadhafi's gilded cage for foreign journalists, fistfights break out. Paranoia is high. And the Libyan government is on unblinking watch for any deviation in the official script.

Waitresses who serve coffee with smiles on their faces act more like trained intelligence agents hours later, when a woman bursts in claiming that militiamen had raped her. They expertly wrestle her to the ground.

Government minders feed reporters the narrative of a nation united behind its longtime leader, then arrest or even expel those who sneak away to find out for themselves. Government-led trips dubbed "magical mystery tours" by the press corps sometimes turn perilous.

...


The Rixos, by contrast, is a five-star hotel, though it has rapidly declined as journalists and minders have taken over the building and some staff have fled. Still, for Western journalists accustomed to press freedoms, working in Tripoli under Gadhafi's rules has in some ways been tougher than reporting from a battlefield.

One reporter muses about whether his dinner is being drugged. An Italian journalist punched a government minder and had to be pulled off the man by a couple of British reporters.

...


If on the off chance, journalists are able to slip away and get one or two precious quotes of dissent in the capital, they walk around with the sense of pride that comes with beating the system, and brag to their colleagues and competitors about their work.

Usually the sneaking trips have ended badly — some reporters were arrested, cuffed, detained for a day, disappeared for a few hours, or kept in a parking lot to get berated by Gadhafi militiamen.

Sometimes just being arrested feels like work has been done that day.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110403/ap_on_bi_ge/af_libya_bizarre_hotel

Hat tip to Al Jazeera. :thumbsup:

[pinboy3niner]

97. More than 500,000 signatures collected on petition demanding release of Eman al-Obeidi!

AJE reports:

An online petition demanding the release of Iman al-Obeidi, the young Libyan woman who says she was gang-raped by Libyan militiamen loyal to Muammar Gaddafi, has reached its target of over 500,000 signatures.

It will now be delivered to Turkish officials in Benghazi, requesting that Ankara guarantee the "safety and release" of al-Obeidi.

8:29pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[MedleyMisty]

102. Oops, I was late

See you guys already know. :)

[pinboy3niner]

98. Qatar airlifts critically injured Libyans

Several of the critically wounded from clashes between pro- and anti-government forces in eastern Libya have been flown out to Qatar to receive urgent medical treatment. Al Jazeera's Alan Fisher reports:

Qatar airlifts seriously injured Libyans (1:32):
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3


OR watch at AJE:

8:26pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[pinboy3niner]

114. To clarify--the airlifts THEMSELVES did not actually HURT anyone :)

Sorry--the subject line of that story could have been written better. I didn't notice until now that it could

be taken to mean that the airlifts CAUSED critical injury to Libyans. :rofl:

[catchnrelease]

99. Kick

[pinboy3niner]

100. New television channel for a Free Libya:

Al Jazeera's Nazanin Sadri reports this story:

New television channel for a "free Libya" (1:36):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47DMb0fouyg&feature=player_embedded


OR watch at AJE:

8:37pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[Waiting For Everyman]

107. Sorry, pinboy3niner, I didn't see your post before mine below.

:blush:

Thanks for your link to the interview with them.

[pinboy3niner]

103. Libyan deputy foreign minister has met with Greek Prime Minister Papandreou in Athens

Abdel Ati al-Obeidi, the Libyan deputy foreign minister, has met with George Papandreou, the Greek prime minister, in Athens, though officials refuse to divulge what the content of the discussions was.

Papandreou's office says that Baghdadi al-Mahmudi, the Libyan prime minister, requested the meeting during a phone conversation on Saturday. Papandreou has also discussed the Libyan crisis with British PM David Cameron on Friday, Qatari PM Sheikh Hamad bin Jabar al-Thani on Saturday and Turkish PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Sunday.

On Friday, al-Obeidi had said the Gaddafi government was attempting to hold talks with Britain, France and the United States.

Earlier, another Libyan envoy had visited Athens in March to meet with foreign ministry officials ahead of an EU meeting on the Libyan crisis.

9:00pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[Waiting For Everyman]

104. 1) NEW English Libya Sat TV channel; 2) Interview on Eman Al Obeidy's release

The TV channel info: url is http://newlibya.tv/

http://www.facebook.com/newlibyatv?sk=wall
@newlibyatv

The channel isn't quite active online yet, so this story on Eman Al Obeidy was posted by Feb17 tv:

Translated: new Libya Satellite channel in Qatar confirms Eman Al Obeidy is released from custody - via phone interview #libya http://t.co/4zTbSNF


Pretty soon when that new channel is fully activated, we'll start getting more information out of Libya from the local sources.

[pinboy3niner]

108. THANKS! THAT'S GREAT NEWS! EMAN IS FREE!

The transcript is a fascinating read. And Eman herself says she "would never have seen daylight" if it had

not been for the demonstrations in support of her and the attention focused on her case by the media:

Eman – I told the Attorney General that i want to go to my family in Toburk, but they declined my

request

Anchor – Another question regarding those who were detaining you. Were they pressured,

especially by the huge demonstrations that were organised by our sisters in Benghazi and Tobruk.

Thousands of women came out asking for the freedom of Eman Al Obeidy. Did these demonstrations

help to pressure the regime to set you free?

Eman- Yes, if these demonstrations did not come out and had the media not take care of my case,

I would have never seen daylight again. You know very well that Gaddafi’s regime is not understanding in

these situations

Anchor – Eman Al Obeidy, the women of Freedom, we thank you greatly. And in my name and the

name of all the new Libyan channel, we congratulate you for your release and praise God for your safety.

http://www.libyafeb17.com/2011/04/translated-new-libya-satellite-channel-in-qatar-confirms-eman-al-

obeidy-is-released-from-custody-via-telephone-interview/

Congratulations! I've been working at this for hours, and you just got the scoop of the day! :fistbump:

[Waiting For Everyman]

112. Dumb luck I guess, I just got online and there it was.

I saw late last night on twitter that the new tv channel was getting activated, but thought I'd post it later today if no one else did, because nobody would've seen it in the wee hours of the morning.

Before I could even do that, I saw this tweet from Feb17 about the new station, and it turned out to be that interview.

So glad she's released!!! (I had a strange feeling at the beginning she was going to get her "miracle" - as her mom called what it would take - and come through this. No doubt the world's attention, and the local demonstrations, made Gadaffi think twice.)

Once again... another woman playing a key role in Libya.

[tabatha]

119. She is on the hero list already

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIDmosspxxw

[Waiting For Everyman]

106. DOD: some US aircraft strikes will continue until Monday.

DeptofDefense DoD
Due to recent poor weather in #Libya, the US has approved NATO's request to extend use of some US strike a/c thru Mon iso #UnifiedProtector
1 hour ago

[tabatha]

111. Often the rebels get despondent because

there is no air support - but the weather is a factor.

[pinboy3niner]

109. EMAN AL-OBEIDI HAS BEEN RELEASED! See WFE's Post #104 and links nt

[tabatha]

110. Great news.

I saw that on http://www.libyafeb17.com/ and was going to post - but it was already posted.

http://www.libyafeb17.com/ seems to have gotten their act together now.

:hi:

[pinboy3niner]

115. Libya wants end of fighting: Libyan envoy

ATHENS | Sun Apr 3, 2011 4:15pm EDT

Libya wants end of fighting: Libyan envoy

ATHENS (Reuters) - Libyan Deputy Foreign Minister Abdelati Obeidi told Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou on Sunday that Libya wants to end fighting in the country, Greek officials said.

...



(Reporting by Renee Maltezou; Editing by Michael Roddy)



http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/03/us-libya-obeidi-greece-idUSTRE7322DW20110403?WT.tsrc=Social%20Media&WT.z_smid=twtr-reuters_%20com&WT.z_smid_dest=Twitter

[pinboy3niner]

117. Libyans greet Turkish hospital ship with guns and roses - (photos)

These pictures were taken in Misurata, where a Turkish hospital ship today took on 250 wounded people and 100 members of their families, transporting them to Turkey for treatment. Residents of Misurata welcomed them with Guns and Roses. (Reuters)







9:41pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-april-3

[tabatha]

118. Greeted with flowers. At last.

I applaud Turkey and Qatar for what they are doing on the humanitarian front, and taking the wounded out of the country so that they will not be slaughtered by Gaddafi's thugs.

[pinboy3niner]

120. CNN reporting Gaddafi forces capture Brega as rebels retreat

Ben Wedeman reporting live from "outside Brega."

[al bupp]

121. CNN Link

http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2011/04/03/wedeman.libya.update.cnn?hpt=T2

[tabatha]

122. expletive!

[pinboy3niner]

123. Thanks for the link nt

[pinboy3niner]

124. CURRENT TIME IN LIBYA = 1:02 AM MONDAY, APRIL 4

Libya time = EDT +6 hours, PDT +9 hours, GMT +2 hours

[tabatha]

125. The Libyan regime is more of a corrupt consumerist kleptocracy

One reason Qaddafi might fold

Apr 1st 2011, 19:21 by M.S.
AS MY colleague notes below, Muammar Qaddafi's troops are holding out pretty well against rebels on the road to Sirte. But his officials, the people who actually staff his government and belong to his ruling elite, are defecting one by one. Why is that?

Here's one tiny window into what might be going on. The European Union imposed sanctions in late February that froze Libyan assets across the continent. As one example, Libya's national investment authority and national oil company are co-owners of a company called Tamoil that owns refineries and gas stations across Europe. The company is still operating, but it may not be for long unless it can cut its ties to Libya. And when you look into the registration documents of the holding company that owns Tamoil, the sole company director, a Libyan fellow, lists his residential address as a condo in Monaco.

This is the Libyan elite that forms the backbone of Mr Qaddafi's regime. That's very different from the people who form the backbone of, say, the Iranian or Yemeni regimes. The governing and business elites of Libya (and in all likelihood as in most commodities-based developing countries it's basically the same people) want to own condos in Monaco and send their kids to the London School of Economics. If Muammar Qaddafi's regime survives, they won't be able to do that anymore. They'll lose their Netherlands-based holding companies, they'll be blocked by no-fly lists when they try to disembark in Paris, and their bank accounts in Frankfurt will remain frozen. These concerns don't matter much to clerics in Qom, which is partly why the Iranian government is not likely to be terribly vulnerable to economic sanctions; for all its faults, it's unfortunately stable because it's based on a genuine grassroots revolutionary movement. The Libyan regime is more of a corrupt consumerist kleptocracy. For the moment, that makes me cautiously optimistic about the chances of a rapid departure for Mr Qaddafi.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2011/04/libya?fsrc=scn/tw/te/bl/onereasonqaddafimayfold

[joshcryer]

126. Day 46 here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x804896