Just wondering how many people eviscerating Vick eat meat, eggs or dairy products?

[prolesunited]

Where do you think all of those food products come from? How is the cruelty that goes into the mass production of the animal products you eat any better than cruelty to dogs or cats?

Contrary to what many will likely try to argue, you don't need to consume animal products to survive. Vegans are the only group that can claim the moral high ground in this situation IMHO.

[superduperfarleft]

1. I don't, and I posted an identical thread on this a year or two ago.

It was quickly flamed and locked by DU's conventional wisdom. I guess now it's okay to say that though when we have to twist ourselves into pretzels to defend Obama.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[prolesunited]

4. If you think I am

you are sadly mistaken. I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy in many posters' rants.

[cottonseed]

48. I don't think it's about Vick. It's the viscousness shown towards the man that scares some.

Is this about dog fighting or dogs in general or is this about lynching Michael Vick?

[hlthe2b]

52. "is this about lynching Michael Vick" ?!!! You didn't really say that?

OMG, that takes the conversation to a new all time low.

[Ken Burch]

90. Especially from a poster called "cottonseed"...

:eyes:

I didn't realize Justice Thomas posts on DU.

[Javaman]

3. I don't think it right for vegans to take away the offspring of plants.

Aren't plants living things too? I think it cruel that vegans think it's perfectly okay to eat living breathing plants. Ripping them right out of the ground, then cooking them in hot oil.

While you continue to throw your rocks, I will eat my steak medium rare.

[prolesunited]

7. Are you serious?

Last time I checked, plants were not sentient beings.

BTW, I'm not throwing rocks. Although I'm a vegetarian, I am not a vegan and still consume eggs and dairy, but try to do it as responsibly as my budget allows. I also have not posted rants against Vick because I recognize my own cruelty to animals.

[phleshdef]

17. Christ. Do people really need sarcasm tags for even the painfully obvious sarcasm?

[Javaman]

37. Actually I'm very serious.

who is to say what is sentient and not sentient these days?

[superduperfarleft]

41. "who is to say what is sentient and not sentient these days? "

:facepalm:

[superduperfarleft]

9. You do realize that OP is not a vegan right?

But don't let that get in the way of your juvenile attempt to bait vegans.

[Javaman]

39. I am aware of that...

and I still stand by my post.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Vickers]

71. Name-calling, Superduperfarleft?

Tsk, tsk.

[Javaman]

80. Your post was deleted. Shame. I would have loved to read your insult.

cheers!

[onpatrol98]

61. Medium rare...wow

LOL...way to shake up the group. Although, I must admit I don't like receiving roses that have been cut as a gift. Live flowers do seem the better option.

I'm not vegetarian and definitely not vegan...but I did see a double yoke in an egg one time...really creeped me out. Twins...how brutal? I am interested in how moving to a vegetarian lifestyle would affect my health. It could be good.

[NashVegas]

5. As Much As Possible

I eat free range.

[Lucian]

6. I've seen people try to rationalize their love for Vick, but this is way overboard.

Equating someone who made dogs fight, for money and entertainment, to those who eat eggs and meat for sustenance is ridiculous. Even you should realize that.

Argument FAIL.

[prolesunited]

13. I don't love Vick and I'm not defending him.

If football was banned, I wouldn't care. I think the sport itself is violent and brutish, a notch above boxing.

In any case, talk about argument fail. Are you telling me that eggs and meat are NOT mass produced in some of the cruelest ways possible for money?

[LynneSin]

14. Is it?

Have you ever seen how farm animals are raised for corporations that produce meat?

http://web.archive.org/web/20080701091042/www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/12840743/porks_dirty_secret_the_nations_top_hog_producer_is_also_one_of_americas_worst_polluters

That's the article that Rolling Stone did on Smithfield food. When you see the living conditions of 27million pigs a YEAR, well that kinda puts Vick in the minor leagues.

And there are other ways we can find sustenance without relying on corporations that farm animals in some of the most inhumane conditions.

I am still a meat eater but after that article I make it a point to buy only organic/free range meat products. I'd like to cut back in the amount of meat that I eat each year but doubtful I would go vegetarian.

[superduperfarleft]

30. So you're going to continue to slaughter animals for their flesh, yet you're trying to paint those

of us who despise Vick and think this was a really dumb move on Obama's part as hypocrites. Lulz...

[onpatrol98]

58. Raised on a farm...

I grew up on a farm and we did quite a bit of slaughtering of cows, pigs, chickens, etc. You mention buying only organic/free range products. How do they handle killing the animals?

[LynneSin]

60. I was raised on a farm too. I know how to setup a pig for a pig roast and butcher a deer

The difference between organics and corporation farming is how the animals are raised and treated. Trust me, after reading that article about Smithfield Farms I barely could eat pork products for a month. The photos were revolting.

Please understand, I know I am just as hypocritical but there are things we meat eaters can do to make it lest retched.

[onpatrol98]

64. No, I agree...seriously

I was just curious. As a child, (and I'm sure a backwards one compared to others on DU), my family expected the animals to be treated well. LOL. I know that sounds hypocritical. After all, you're planning on killing some of the animals. But, I mean there were no quick trips to the grocery store for eggs and milk. Mistreat a cow or chicken at your own peril and you'd be in some serious trouble. My grandparents probably didn't know vegetarians existed. I was wondering if they found a way to make ending the life of an animal better.

[LynneSin]

67. I think the main thing is how they are treated while they are alive

For corporations it's important to have as many animals confined to the limited space they have. Smithfield farms would have pigs stacked on crates above crates above crates - you had to feel sorry for the pigs that got stuck at the bottom, since they were pretty much covered with the crap coming from the pigs up top.

But it's like animal euthenasia - keep it quick and painless.

[onpatrol98]

70. No...that's good

Quick and painless is good. Smithfield is shameless. It's not a farm. I'm not sure what it is.

[KansDem]

79. In addition to shooting them, Vick also drowned, hanged, and slammed his dogs onto the ground.

Are these killing methods acceptable for butchering meat?

John Goodwin of the Humane Society said the manner in which losing or unwilling dogs were killed was especially troubling.

"Some of the grisly details in these filings shocked even me, and I'm a person who faces this stuff every day," he said. "I was surprised to see that they were killing dogs by hanging them and one dog was killed by slamming it to the ground. Those are extremely violent methods of execution -- they're unnecessary and just sick."

Vick and the others are accused of "knowingly sponsoring and exhibiting an animal fighting venture" and conducting a business enterprise involving gambling, as well as buying, transporting and receiving dogs for the purposes of an animal fighting venture.

About eight young dogs were put to death at the Surry County home after they were found not ready to fight in April 2007, the indictment said. They were killed "by hanging, drowning and/or slamming at least one dog's body to the ground."

ESPN

Sounds like a sociopath.

[LynneSin]

8. Alec Baldwin wrote an article for Huffington Post about just that

About how people will villify Michael Vick but then turn around and enjoy meat products that came from farms where the animal treatment there probably was just as bad or even worse than what any Vick dog may have suffered (and millions more animals are affected by farming than they ever were by Vick's dog fighting).

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alec-baldwin/michael-vick-black-sheep_b_260990.html

[superduperfarleft]

10. That's because Alec Baldwin is a vegetarian, as far as I know.

"Sorry you can't be bothered to learn more about it."

[LynneSin]

15. And a big PETA supporter - you'd think he'd be on the front lines of villifying Michael Vick

and yet he has valid arguments as to why some of us are the biggest hypocrites out there.

[superduperfarleft]

20. You'd think? No, I wouldn't think, because I actually know what I'm talking about.

PETA and HSUS, the two largest animal "rights" organizations, are 100% behind Vick. PETA to this day is calling for all of the Vick dogs to be euthanized, even the ones that have been rehabilitated, because Ingrid has always had a bug up her ass about pit bulls.

"Sorry you can't be bothered to learn more about it."

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LynneSin]

31. Oh, I'm sorry, this is Democratic Underground. I thought we were allowed to support Obama here

:grr:

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[prolesunited]

19. I hadn't seen this article

Thanks for posting.

[LynneSin]

28. Made me think twice about Vick knowing that perhaps I was just as bad

no, I don't have a dog-fighting ring in my backyard but I do eat meat. If anything I have probably been responsible for the inhumane death of more animals than Michael Vick ever has been. All in the name of me being able to get a cheap hamburger or chicken fingers to eat.

[AmandaMae]

11. Oh boy, here come the defensive comments from omnivores...

[LynneSin]

18. I'm an Omnivore and I have to agree with the OP

Alot of hypocrisy there in how we judge people.

[superduperfarleft]

23. So are you going vegan?

You know, since you see such a similarity between eating meat and fighting dogs? I'd be happy to help you with the transition, from resources on nutrition as well as more information on the more "political" side of animal rights. Just let me know.

[LynneSin]

34. Why are you stalking me on 2 threads now

I have no desire to switch to vegetarian, just pointing out the obvious hypocrisy of meat eaters who make some sort of superior high ground to Michael Vick.

I have made changes by decreasing the amount of meat and going for organic/free range if you're keeping scorecard here.

[superduperfarleft]

35. So you're continuing to consume animal flesh while calling those of us who won't twist ourselves

into a pretzel to defend Vick "hypocrites?"

Hmmm....

[davidinalameda]

12. when chickens and cows and pigs and whatever else

are thrown into a pit and fight for the enjoyment of some thugs, then you can criticize my eating meat, eggs, and dairy

and dogs have a special place in our society

you don't hear chickens referred to as man's best friend

Obama was wrong to defend Vick

[jmowreader]

96. You might want to edit that title

to remove "chickens," since cockfighting is "throwing chickens into a pit to fight for the enjoyment of some thugs."

[davidinalameda]

98. oh well too late

but yeah you're right

[Zanzobar]

16. Insects are a large part of the global biomass.

Plenty of life is killed farming fruits, nuts, and veggies.

I cede no moral high ground to you.

[prolesunited]

26. I'm NOT trying to claim any

As stated above, I am NOT a vegan.

[Zanzobar]

29. I cede no moral high ground to vegans.

[prolesunited]

36. Yeah for you

I'm saying that when they condemn dog fighting, their actions in life lend weight to their argument. They are not condemning cruelty to dogs while eating a steak mass produced in a factory in which cows stand in their own shit in tiny pens and never see the light of day while being pumped full of hormones and antibiotics. How is that not cruelty to animals. There is purity, not hypocrisy in their stance.

[Zanzobar]

69. And I'm telling you

That by plowing under a field to plant beans, hundreds of birds, mammals, reptiles and insects were butchered and maimed.

The runoff of the pesticides and herbicides goes into the rivers and destroys fish habitat.

How pure is that? Where's the high ground?

[Travelman]

75. No kidding!

It seems that lots of people who are so worried about the furry cows readily forget that pretty much every being out there is likely doomed to a violent and painful death. Who here thinks that a gazelle taken down on the Serengeti by some big cat did not die a rather cruel and painful death? Who here has ever seen an eagle take down some prey? Hint: the fuzzy little bunny shrieks out in pain for quite some time while the eagle plucks out his innards while he's still very much alive. Don't you people who have cats ever watch them when they catch a mouse? It's not exactly a "clean kill."

And yet I'm supposed to be some sort of horrible, awful hypocrite for taking down my prey in the cleanest, quickest, least painful way possible? I don't think so.

There's a vast gulf here between Michael Vick and food, even processed food. Vick and his compatriots were engaging in cruelty for cruelty's sake, not some necessary evil to be gotten through to put food on the table. Next time some farmer gets his rocks off slaughtering cows or pigs or whatever, someone come let me know. In the meantime, I'm going to go enjoy some of the venison sausage I made from my own deer kill that wasted none of the animal and caused no pain whatsoever to Bambi when I dropped her.

[Boojatta]

21. Lots of dogs eat dog food. Where does it come from?

You don't need to own a dog.

[HEyHEY]

22. I don't think it's that black and white

I think it comes down to whether or not people believe in Crime and Punishment. What he did was absolutely horrible. Having animals kill slowly and viciously is horrible. However, I do believe that someone should be given a second chance, especially if they've just been released from prison. ANd, though the thought of what he did is disgusting to me, if he is sincerely remorseful, I can forgive him. Shit, I've sat through murder trials where the accused is sincerely remorseful and I've felt sympathy.

[prolesunited]

33. I really don't care about Vick, football or Obama's comments

My only point is that it is hypocritical to eat meat that is mass produced and condemn Vick. Both are done for money.

[MH1]

25. And, should we also excoriate Koreans who eat dogs?

http://askakorean.blogspot.com/2009/08/dog-its-whats-for-dinner.html

There are apparently around 530 such restaurants in Seoul, which is not many for a 12 million people city. Roughly 1 million dogs are slaughtered for food each year. By weight, it is the fifth-most consumed meat in Korea, following chicken, pork, beef and duck.

According to a survey conducted in 2000, 83 percent of Koreans (91.9 percent of males and 67.9 percent of females) have eaten dog meat. 86.3 percent of Koreans favored eating dog meat (92.3 percent of males and 72.1 percent of females).

Because Livestock Processing Act does not cover dog meat, dog-ranchers (so to speak) and dog meat sellers essentially go for the raising/slaughtering method that generates maximum profit. This generally leads to unsightly living conditions for edible dogs, similar to those of pigs or chickens in industrialized farming in the U.S., only in a smaller scale. Dogs are raised in a small cage and sold alive until they get to meat market. Then they are generally electrocuted before being processed and shipped to restaurants.

...especially in rural areas where people slaughter dogs to cook and eat on their own, the common method is to hang the dog and beat it to death, in an attempt to tenderize the meat. (This, however, may be counterproductive; while beating the meat does tenderize it, an animal that dies in a stressed state generally produces tougher and less tasty meat.) A figurative expression in Korean for a severe beating is “like beating a dog on bok day.”

Disclaimer: I was stationed in Korea while in the service, and loved it. I generally like the Korean people, and most Koreans I've known personally. I don't agree with this element of the culture but while I was there it was something we had to know about. So hopefully when we went to restaurants we could be sure what we were eating. (And how many of you think that NO G.I. ever, EVER, went to a restaurant SPECIFICALLY to find out what it tasted like? If you think that you really need to get out more.)

I support the right of a legally released convicted felon to earn a living at the job they've been trained for, if such work doesn't in itself invite a repeat offense.

[HEyHEY]

43. Fun fact, in China and Korea eating dogs is illegal now

In Canada, parts of the USA and Europe...flay at er!

[shawn703]

38. What about the entertainment factor?

I think a lot more people would be eviscerating butchers if they slaughtered animals for entertainment value. If they were taking bets on how long it took a cow to bleed out for example, I'm sure you'd see them treated just like Michael Vick.

[prolesunited]

44. Hunting as a sport doesn't have "entertainment" value?

How many meat-based meals are part of an entertaining evening for people.

Or are you arguing is that cruelty to animals is only bad if someone is entertained by it?

[shawn703]

54. I'm comparing Vick's actions with those of the butchers and farmers you mentioned in your OP

I'm not defending hunting for entertainment value.

[amyrose2712]

42. Good try ...My BF posted something similar about hunters...

and he got flamed. One person actually defended the hunters by saying "but hunting is a sport" :banghead: Uh and that makes it ok. And I know the deer or what ever game aren't tortured. Tell that to the ones that get shot and get away and died a painful gangrenous death. Because I am pretty sure not every hunter is a expert marksman. I agree about the blatant hypocrisy and am actually kind of surprised at the calls for him to "rot in jail" for the rest of his life. Even child rapists don't always get life, I mean WTF?

Not that I don't completely understand where this anger comes from, we put a value on certain lives more than others. Why? Emotions. But, we shouldn't deny the hypocrisy that goes along with it. People get more upset with someone like Mark David Chapman, who kill one man, albeit a revered man(by some,at times, except when they were bigger than Jesus). But most are not in the streets livid at the fact that murders like Bush and Cheney are still walking free. Maybe not so much here at DU, but there is no outcry. Ok now that I have rambled on in my caffeinated state, I will shut up now.

[ZombieHorde]

45. Do you really believe torturing animals to death for fun is the same as eating a cow?

A simple yes or no will do.

[prolesunited]

50. Is the cow not tortured during its life

and then brutally killed? Please elaborate on the differences.

[superduperfarleft]

53. There is little discernible difference. So are you going vegan? n/t

[ZombieHorde]

57. Answering a question costs one answer to another question.

I asked, you answer, then you ask, and I will answer.

I get the first question because you made the OP.

[prolesunited]

59. Only if you are playing your game

and I am not. Have a nice day. :hi:

[ZombieHorde]

66. You expect me to answer your questions but you won't answer mine.

At least my game is fair; your game is not.

[slackmaster]

87. You can buy meat from cattle raised in human conditions

It is an available option.

http://www.greenpromise.com/resources/grass-fed-beef-suppliers.php

[Poll_Blind]

46. I agree with your point...sort of. I don't make pigs fight to the death, tho.

I've seen slaughterhouse video and it's not like they're getting cut much of a break either.

PB

[superduperfarleft]

47. If anyone who delights in calling others "hypocrites" would like info on going vegan, PM me.

I'd be happy to help you with your "hypocrisy."

[bluerum]

49. Self-righteous pomposity is unbecoming even for vegans.

[prolesunited]

55. I'm not a vegan

as I have stated repeatedly. :D

[HEyHEY]

56. fuck, so you think you can just omit commas whenever?

[PeaceNikki]

73. .

I lol'd. :loveya:

[HEyHEY]

95. wOOt~

[woo me with science]

51. He's being "eviscerated," is he?

Is he being lacerated, too?

[blueamy66]

62. How does eating an egg hurt a chicken?

:eyes:

[Name removed]

81. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[City Lights]

63. I'm a cannibal...am I allowed to comment?

:eyes:

Unrec.

[LanternWaste]

65. Entertainment and profits versus well... food.

"How is the cruelty that goes into the mass production of the animal products you eat any better than cruelty to dogs or cats?"

Entertainment and profits versus food. I happen to perceive and precise and relevant difference in the two wholly different subjects, yet I understand those who do not or cannot.

"Vegans are the only group that can claim the moral high ground in this situation IMHO..." Said with the dogmatic ease of a Sunday morning televangelist who believes he alone knows who may or may not take a moral high ground.

[prolesunited]

68. I am not a vegan

nor a televangelist, but I do admire your turn of a phrase. And I definitely claim no moral high ground. I'm simply pointing out the hypocrisy.

BTW, food is mass produced for profit. It is exactly why we have the type of animal cruelty that was not present on the family farms of yesteryear.

[flvegan]

72. Woo hoo! Moral high ground!

:rofl:

Meat eating Vick eviscerating DUers, please continue doing so. I don't think you have to be vegan to feel and voice outrage over animal cruelty and those that commit horrible acts on animals, no matter which ones they are.

[Name removed]

82. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Vickers]

74. I'm comfortable with my hypocrisy. n/t

:spank:

[TexasObserver]

76. Or wear leather shoes, or wear leather clothes, or have leather hand bags.

Or snake, or ostrich, or alligator purses, hand bags, wallets, boots, or shoes.

[WinkyDink]

77. Pets are considered legally different from "food" animals, in case you are unaware.

Drowning a dog is illegal; eating a chicken is not.

Take it up with your Congressperson.

[AndrewP]

94. That seems to be a hard thing for some to figure out

[ileus]

78. If only he'd eaten the dogs...

[frylock]

83. i electrocute, de-teeth, rape, and body slam my meat to the ground..

before i eat it.

[toddaa]

84. I do, but only at Olive Garden while my kids run around screaming

Joke's getting worn out, but I can keep it up as long as the rest of DU can.

[LWolf]

85. I do.

I eat the eggs my hens produce, and I eat free-range, grass-fed organic meat raised locally, that never see feedlots or large processing plants, that don't need hormones and anti-biotics. As a matter of fact, great care is taken to ensure that there is no stress prior to killing, as that stress reduces the quality of the meat. I also eat wild-caught salmon, and various trout and freshwater salmon from local waters.

I don't drink milk or eat butter, but I do eat cheese. I get my cheese from small local homesteads where I can see the animals producing the milk that goes into the cheese, and see their living conditions.

I don't need to consume animal products to survive, but I can do so without supporting the mass production of meat for large populations of people. It's one of the benefits of living rurally. I drive 13.5 miles to work one way, and never see a stoplight. There are 4 stop signs along the way, and most of the road runs by pastures and open land. There are horses, cows, sheep, goats, lamas, pigs, and poultry out in those pastures, which are not at all overcrowded. The geography and climate where I live is not favorable for wide-scale grain, vegetable, or fruit production, but we can grow grass for livestock and we can get fish from the abundant lakes and rivers. Supporting local food production, especially small-scale, family farms, is part of the solution.

[slackmaster]

86. I do, and I wear leather shoes, but I don't condone cattle fighting

Or place bets on hog fights.

[MellowDem]

88. Vegans kill things...

Insects, small mammals, fish, etc. are all killed by the farming practices that they rely on to survive in this modern world.

The truth is, there is no "moral high ground" when it comes to eating. Unless you think all omnivors and carnivores are lacking in morals. Humans are animals, and they eat other animals. Doing it responsibly is one thing, but then again, when man was mostly hunter gatherers, eating lots of meat, there was much less overpopulation and death to animal habitats before the advent of agriculture. Agriculture does much more to contribute to global warming and habitat destruction and extinction than anything else, and large scale agriculture is absolutely necessary for today's world with as much population as we have, even if we all went vegan.

[Ken Burch]

89. I'm a vegetarian and I don't actually care that much about Vick

(my biggest reaction was being mystified at the claim that dogfighting was just part of "black culture". That would be sort of like Stanley Kowalski claiming that wifebeating and rape were just part of "New Orleans working-class white culture", wouldn't it?)

But my biggest question has always been...how many people who were offended about what Vick did to dogs(which WAS a horrible thing, of course) would have been equally offended if he'd been involved in producing the "Bumfights!" videos? Or if he'd been a slumlord who evicted people on Christmas Eve?

There's a lot of people in this country who would say "That's DIFFERENT, dammit!", and then go back to watching the Eagles game.

We need a movement against cruelty, not JUST cruelty to animals.

[cbc5g]

91. Just wondering how many people eviscerating Vick eat veggies and fruit products?

Because the industrial production of these products involves destroying the habitats of many animals, running them off, poisoning them. It involves the destruction of forests, home to many animals, to be used as farmland. It also involves heavy pesticide use that contaminates water, destroying ecosystems and numerous wildlife for decades if not more. Deforestation, pesticides, animal killings/runoff, need we go on? It involves the makers of agent orange, Monsanto, creating hybrid foods that no one knows the future ramifications of eating such food.


No one who loves the planet likes food industrialization and indeed the industrialization of meat is abominable. And it sucks that industry insiders and lobbyists control the FDA. But there actually are sanitary and humane farms that produce organic meat eggs and dairy products just as there are sanitary and humane farms that produce organic crops. At least while its still legal to have them.

Sometimes its not easy to come to grips with the cycle of life, and since we have it easy now it is also easy to feel for animals being eaten since we have no survival stressors. Vegetarians today would become meat eaters if food was scarce. They may deny that but it is true. We become different when survival is at stake.

We should all fight for industrial farm regulation so animals are treated better...are not tortured or killed off and poisoned by fruit/veggie farming as well..but to say that vegans have the high ground? Unless they produce their own food that they eat, not a chance. Even then, to have their home and their garden they would have had to have directly or indirectly killed or ran off animals in the process even if they weren't aware of it.

[texshelters]

92. I was a vegetarian, but

contrary to the misinformation that many in the vegetarian community promote, some people ARE healthier when they eat meat from animals. I ate all the beans, and mixes, and brown rice with the correct grain and supplements but I felt sick. Biologically, humans are omnivores and our bodies thrive on the meat of animals. Why ignore scientific realities like global warming deniers? Can some people live well without meat? Sure. Not me.

It wasn't until I ate flesh that I felt better. Does everyone need to eat as much meat as they do? No. However, you come from the assumption that meat eaters are cruel and unaware of how their meat is treated. You are wrong. Everyone I know and I assume most on DU are aware how animals are treated in the slaughter house and make informed decisions for themselves.

Some of us omnivores eat free range meat. Some only eat that they kill. Some don't eat mammals, for they are the treated the worst. Some of us reduce our consumption of meat because we are aware of the way animals are treated.

Contrary to the belief of many vegetarians, meat eaters are not all ignorant cruel bastards we are made out to be.

Another thing: eating meat from animals is NOT the same thing as training dogs to fight each other. Is the killing floor cruel? Yes. But if animals are treated well and killed rapidly without the torture of the pens, it is less cruel than the drown out torture of dog fighting.

What's next, are you going to go after those cruel hyennas that stalk and torment an animal for hours before killing it for the meat?

Perhaps if you came from a position of teaching instead of shaming more of us would listen to your message.

Peace,
Tex Shelters

[Countdown_3_2_1]

93. Cruelty makes my meat taste better.

I've eaten alligator and rattlesnake, Ostrich, bunny, Bambi and more.
I've not met or et the animal I didn't like.

I still eat veal. When animals learn English and demand the right to vote, then maybe I'll think twice about having steak for dinner. Nah! Who am I kidding? I'll still eat steak.

[still_one]

97. There is a big difference consuming an animal for food and torturing one. Incidentally, I am a

Vegetarian, and though I won't consume animals for food, I don't condemn people who do, but do detest those who hurt animals, including hunting just for sport and torture, not for food