Fellow under 55 friends. A BIG bus is coming to run us over.

[Safetykitten]

We are being set up to be run right the fuck over by Obama and it's compliance to rid us of Medicare as we know it. Social Security will be quite different also.

[liberal N proud]

1. If this is true, we had better take to the streets

It is our generation that did all the protesting over Vietnam, we may need to do it again for retirement.

[SidDithers]

2. When will this bus hit?...

I'd like to know, so we can evaluate your "prediction" to see if it's ever wrong.

Sid

[originalpckelly]

5. The bus already hit.

That's why people on Social Security get so little in the first place.

[Safetykitten]

6. As correct as my prediction of us losing the last budget gig. Which of course was correct.

[SidDithers]

25. So. When will medicare and SS be cut?...nt

Sid

[Safetykitten]

35. Ok, bet time again. 2012 budget. 50 bucks to DU if I am wrong.

[Safetykitten]

42. Well...waiting for that bet.

[cleanhippie]

59. I have the feeling you will keep waiting.

You put your money where your mouth is, and well, that scares some people...

[SidDithers]

62. Define your cuts and you're on...

though, since you're not a donor now, I don't have much faith you'll donate to DU if you lose.

"rid us of Medicare as we know it. Social Security will be quite different also." means what exactly?

Sid

[SidDithers]

68. Well...waiting for that definition...nt

Sid

[donheld]

85. It's sad when they ask that question a bit late.

Sorry bubba, the wheels are nipping at your heals now.

[WillyT]

3. K & R !!!

:kick:

[Sky Masterson]

4. I doubt that very much.

It would be political suicide for him.

[Safetykitten]

7. Why? We have people that will vote for him no matter what. He knows this.

[Sky Masterson]

8. Name a senior citizen that would vote for him

after doing that. I think your worries on this issue are misplaced

[Safetykitten]

13. Really? Hows this for his pattern? Change it but delay...

HC? 2012. Oh it will be fine, everything will be perfect.

Medicare? Oh those changes kick in in 2015...You will be fine, it will be perfect.

[originalpckelly]

14. If the Republicans do it at the same time...

who are they gonna vote for?

[Exilednight]

16. He secures the senior citizen vote by securing their social security. The plan only takes

effect to those under 55. He might lose the 50-55 vote, but that's about it.

[Safetykitten]

20. And that's about it. Really, so simple.

[Sky Masterson]

29. I still doubt the assumptions on this.

But go ahead and freak out. I'll watch the chicken little's from sidelines.

[JTFrog]

44. So far she's batting zero.

:shrug:

[Exilednight]

60. Calling people "chicken little" proves that you have no sound rebuttal. n/t

[Sky Masterson]

64. Ok ,How about this.

OP "We are being set up to be run right the fuck over by Obama and it's compliance to rid us of Medicare as we know it. Social Security will be quite different also."

I don't believe that the sky is falling.
And I can't give a rebuttal to an outcome or a choice that hasn't happened or been made yet.
If Obama (Who I don't believe would go along with it) does,Then I am wrong and everyone else who is freaking out is right.
I'll wait and find out what happens before I soil myself.

[Exilednight]

66. I would argue that his past behavior has proven that he is more than willing to go along

with bad Republican ideas. He said he wouldn't cut Pell Grants, but he just did. He said he wouldn't extend the Bush tax cuts, but he did. He said he wouldn't sign HCR without a public option, but he did.

What makes you think that SS will be any different. What past behavior are you basing your belief on?

[Sky Masterson]

67. Because SS is a sacred cow

And to dilute it or destroy it would be a sure way to lose the next election for Pres.Obama.
I believe that he wants to run on stopping the republicans from destroying Social Security because it sells.

[Exilednight]

75. Republicans are, again, winning the messaging battle on this. It's become common

belief that SS is in deep deep trouble and if we cut SS we will magically fix our deficit.

It's a completely false statement, but one that is quickly being believed and Obama is doing nothing to counter that argument. The more Republicans hammer home this false message, the more public opinion shifts to their advantage.

[Sky Masterson]

76. They may be

They have a noisier mouthpiece.But I'm not ready to raise the white flag yet.

[Exilednight]

77. Are you willing to fight for SS, or are you going to sit idly by and wait to see what happens? If

history is any indicator, most will sit idly while other who complain get called chicken little and we end up with the same type of compromises like we got with HCR and Bush era tax cuts.

[Sky Masterson]

80. I'm not planning a preemptive strike.

When more information and details come to light I may join you in the revolution.
Anyone who knows me knows that my opinions are chiseled in stone.
When I get more information I'll decide.
My apologies for the chicken little remark. I can be an asshole sometimes.

[1monster]

46. No, because those of us who are 55 and up are already looking back and forth

watching that blade swinging erratically back and forth, wondering just when it will hit us.

My husband is 64 and he's starting to get really worried. If those under 55 get cut, then they'll be coming after those who are 55 to 60 next, and then the 60 to 65 year olds. There is not stop button for that cutting blade unless it hits something it cannot cut through.

[Exilednight]

55. That's only if you believe the public at large is looking that deeply into the subject. n/t

[Warren Stupidity]

38. 51% of voters 60 and older voted for McCain.

Older voters, now increasingly boomers, vote to shoot themselves in the head with predictable regularity. The knucklehead cohort within this group is strong.

http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/results/president/exit-polls.html

[Sky Masterson]

54. I know..But 49% didn't vote McCain

He couldn't afford to lose them.

[Warren Stupidity]

78. I was responding to your assertion that seniors won't vote against

their own interests. They will. In large numbers. And that doesn't address how they will or will not vote in response to scrapping social security and medicare for those 55 and under.

The hornswoggling of what I will loosely refer to as 'white suburban voters' is pretty much complete. They have bought the bullshit, lock stock and barrel. They are the angriest, most mean spirited, deluded demographic a modern industrial democracy has seen in quite some time. They think they are under attack and the world is against them, a world of dark, queer, 'librul', unamerican, unchristian, city dwellers; they are afraid of losing something they never had and that is already long gone, and they are listening to the blatherers of hate and misdirection. They are voting to completely screw themselves and doing so with manic determination. Fuck all of us, this is going nowhere good.

Sorry for the rant.

[Sky Masterson]

81. Damn!

I wish that I could disagree with you. Nice rant!
I think a lot of it depends on the region of the country the Seniors live in.
Blue state Seniors will probably state Blue State Seniors and Red will stay Red.

[Exilednight]

61. They started doing that with Reagan. n/t

[TheKentuckian]

53. As long as they get "their's" many will accept the ladder being pulled up.

[Sky Masterson]

58. No doubt that some will

Some may also have aging kids who might give them cause to want this program left for them. Who knows

[RebelOne]

56. Here is one senior citizen who will vote for him

unless there is another Democrat running against him that I would like better. I will not vote for a Republican ever. I would rather not vote.

[EFerrari]

24. We had two elections stolen right in front of our eyes.

I don't think they care how we vote very much except insofar as it gives the election industry a pretext to make millions for the event.

[northernlights]

45. actually, not doing his masters' bidding would be political suicide

as long as he does his masters' bidding, his political career continues should he wish it to. They will buy all the votes they need to ensure that.

If he fails to do their bidding, that will be political suicide. They'll simply hire somebody else for the hit.

Either way, we the people lose.

He's already got his and Michelle has admitted she considers being first lady as "hell," so I won't be surprised if he chooses to lose the next election or even decides to bow out.

[WinkyDink]

71. Or worse, non-metaphorically-speaking.

[WinkyDink]

70. Not really, if it's couched as "In order to save it for future generations...."

[abelenkpe]

9. K&R

Better not take my social security or Medicare. There should be massive protests against that.

Who under 55 would vote republican knowing that????

[OKNancy]

10. I'd wait until Obama proposes such a thing... and he won't

At no time has this administration said they would go along with Ryan's plan.
In fact just this morning on Meet the Press, David Plouffe ( and he would know) said Obama
favors taxes on the rich and he also said, that Ryan's plan may pass the House but will never get past the Senate
and WON'T BECOME LAW.

[Safetykitten]

15. Oh no! Of course He won't. But he will be more than compliant.

[Name removed]

49. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Exilednight]

18. Just like he wasn't going to extend the Bush era tax cuts. He "compromised" because he

believed he got something better in return.

[Safetykitten]

28. The "how do you know" crowd questions again. It's not rocket science now.

[SidDithers]

30. +1...

but it's easier to be outraged about speculation of cuts than actual facts.

Sid

[bullwinkle428]

63. Plouffe's comment : "Taxes on the rich will be raised EVENTUALLY"

That "eventually" stuck out like a sore thumb to me.

My take : someday, a really strong and courageous group of politicians will be willing to stick their necks out and raise taxes on the rich.

[southernyankeebelle]

11. That worries me. Everyone and I mean everyone call your reps and let them

know not to touch these programs. The only way they are going to understand if people fight back. Our voices is the power. I sent an email to the president and told him if he dares touch these programs forget my vote.

[sarcasmo]

12. If our government screws with medicare it's Canada for me.

[Safetykitten]

17. In case anyone has not noticed, the goal is no healthcare of anykind for anyone. Just pay.

[Enthusiast]

19. I believe it is true.

The pattern is set.

Medicare should be available to all citizens that care to enroll. Instead the ONLY voice we hear in the media is that of deficit hawk Ryan. The media is laughable. All Ryan's plan does is shift the burden onto those the least able to pay while rewarding GOP insurance industry cronies.

[Safetykitten]

22. It will be a privatized plan.

[Enthusiast]

32. Exactly

Designed to reward his GOP donor buddies in the insurance industry. Just another little transfer of wealth to the already absurdly well off.

[MiniMe]

21. I'm 53 and currently unemployed

This is scaring me to death

[Safetykitten]

23. It should. We have a person scampering to the nearest monument for love.

[madrchsod]

50. if you don`t get back into the work force your ss check will be crap

you`ll end up like me..no pension,401k,and the minimum ss check. i worked two jobs that gave pensions but were bought out. 401k went after two long periods of unemployment. retired at 62 after almost two years of drawing unemployment. 578 per month.

[RebelOne]

72. At the age of 62 I doubt that this person will have a shot

at a job now. Maybe a WalMart greeter position is about all anyone in his or her 60s will be able to get. I am 72 and was laid off my job January 2010. I had planned to work as long as possible to build up more into my 401K. I have been collecting the maximum in social security for the past 10 years, so I was not penniless. The company gave me 6 months severance pay, and then in October last year, I applied for unemployment. I will be collecting that until October of this year. I'm trying to bank as much of that as possible.

Without my salary, I have had to cut back in some of my spending. Fortunately, I have no bills, just the usual expenses, such as electric, phone, cable, Internet, car and home insurance. I live in a mobile home that I own. I just pay lot rent of $364 a month, which includes water and trash pickup. And I have no car payments since such as it is, I own my car. I have some savings that I am trying not so break into unless there is an emergency.

The only thing I am worried about is Medicare. I have it, but have not used it as my health is fairly good, and I don't go to the doctor unless I absolutely have to because I hate, hate doctors.

I have not even tried to look for any permanent work, but at my age I would not have a chance of being hired at what I used to do. I was a copy editor for 30 national outdoors magazines. I have searched for freelance work, but there is not anything out there.

[Tarheel_Dem]

26. I know what we should do. Let's all run out and support Obama's Republican

challenger so that your prediction will definitely come true. How about that? Oh, and how about we scare seniors to death about Obama taking their Medicare? :eyes:

[Safetykitten]

31. Will they end it? Yes. Will he end it? Yes. Now tell us all your big solution.

[Tarheel_Dem]

65. Seems you have all the answers. You've told us your prediction, but

you didn't give us a date for the big reveal. Could you narrow it down a might, so we can check the accuracy and truthfulness of your crystal ball? :shrug:

[KG]

27. 52 and underemployed. I know i'm totally screwed and know that no help is coming from the dem party.

[Safetykitten]

33. No it's not. They will not help.

[Oilwellian]

86. KG, I've known you here for a long time, my friend

I'm 55 and feeling guilty for falling right on the cusp of this thing. I worry for my sons though and the privatized government they will be inheriting if we don't put a stop to this madness now. I can't imagine falling right below the magic number of 55. You've paid into the system for close to 30 years and suddenly they're going to change the number of years you have to work, and/or the amount you'll receive each month? Fuckers. If this doesn't bring people out into the streets, nothing will.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

34. No kidding....are they going to hear you complaining on DU? DO something!

....we wont be able to collect full SS until we're 70 there will be no Medicare - hell, there may be no SS. If you can't save several MILLION dollars NOW to take care of yourself when you're older, then you're screwed. That would mean....most of us.

That's where we are. That's where the GOTealiban has brought us and Obama has and will inexplicably continue to help them screw us over. That's why I posted the below yesterday and wrote a letter:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x855454 <---- READ IT - it explains in detail what we're up against!

You can write a letter too, about this. A REAL snail-mail letter - NOT email! Everyone should. Of course they can ignore it and they may do so.... but it's your choice: sit there and whine, or DO something, at least.

How will they hear our voices if we're not SAYING anything - other than on DU or f*cking Facebook?

YELL!!!! Use PAPER. Or, phone calls, or both! The only other thing? Hit the streets in protest.

Beyond that, leave the country and let the GOTealibanKochBrothers have it.

YOUR choice. What are you going to DO?

[Scurrilous]

36. Oh noes!!1!

:scared: :scared: :scared:

[Safetykitten]

37. Now the funny ones.

[notesdev]

39. Well, we knew that already

Didn't we? I can't remember when I came to the realization that Social Security, Medicare, etc. would not be there for me, but it's been quite some time, a decade or two at least.

[Safetykitten]

41. Wonderfull that works for you. Good thing every poor old person feels the same way.

[hansberrym]

40. If you were born in 1970 or later....

you are going to retire later and collect only 78 cents on the dollar. And that is without any tinkering, what a great system!


Those of us just shy of 55, will get a bad deal, but the deal gets worse for those retiring after we do.

[JoePhilly]

43. I remember when he annouced this during the Sate of the Union speech.

Oh wait, that didn't happen.

[patrice]

47. If you don't think that Medicare/Medicaid are going to be degraded ANYWAY, even without cuts, you

don't know how "health" "care" works.

For example, even without cuts, staffing ratios WILL be affected and even if there is a nurse there for you when you need one, there is no gaurantee that it will be the RIGHT nurse, who does what needs to be done no matter what his/her department head $ay$$$$, you are not gauranteed a PROFESSIONAL who does the RIGHT thing instead of going along to get along and that particular pressure is increasing.

If what's coming cuts the political fat out of "health" "care" administration and, thus, improves services I'm all for it.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

52. staffing ratios have already been affected where I work

of course, I work in a "for-profit" system but, I bet the non-profits will/are affected, too.

[WinkyDink]

74. Yeah, as if that's the goal.

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bennyboy]

51. 55 here...

And yep, this is it. We arent gonna make it. Not only are they not hiring us due to healthcare costs as well as liablity factors in regards to comp claims, but they are now going to take away any hope.

Get yourself a good tent, not one of them cheap ones.

And the diots are gonna end up the same way, Not unions no retirement.

[high density]

57. Anything to support some more tax cuts for the rich

Everybody else needs to work for nothing for a few decades and then die.

[watercolors]

69. We hears the same rhetoric when we grad from College in 60's

It made us start making plans to think about being financally responsible for our selves. We did a good job of it ,raised 4 children, educated them. Time to make plans for financial future, we have stressed the point with our children & grandkids. So far they are listening doing what they can.

[WinkyDink]

73. All well and good. Now, about those needing "Survivor and Disability" benefits from SS.......

[watercolors]

79. Insurance polycies out there for all kinds of needs!

nt

[Safetykitten]

82. Well...looks like we will hear about the bus in this speech coming up.

[kenny blankenship]

83. Yup.

You can hear it rounding the corner. Sounds "historic".

[slipslidingaway]

84. A major reason why a national HC system should have been on the table...

during the HC reform discussions, not to even mention the economic divide.

Divide and conquer.

[upi402]

87. Why yes, and it will be far worse than just that.

some here still think there's an opposition party to corporate rule
:rofl: