I hate people who dismiss facts from reliable organizations.

[white_wolf]

I gave my speech defending single payer healthcare to my RW professor today, and it went just as I expected. I cited figures from the World Health Organization showing that we were ranked 37th overall in terms of healthcare and he dismissed it saying that it is debatable how accurate those figures are. What really pissed me off,though, was when i talked about how 45,000 die every year according to research done at Harvard medical School, and said "Well in your speech you said Palin's death panels were a lie, but then you say without singe-payer 45,000 will die, so what your doing the same thing." I was just like "My stats are from Harvard, Palin made her stuff up."

[Drale]

1. Facts get in the way of a good time.

[GreenPartyVoter]

2. I would say it's good thing the other students have you to educate them, because the prof certainly

isn't!

[pnwmom]

3. Good for you for standing up to him. n/t

[white_wolf]

4. This does lead into a question I have.

Why does the RW hate the UN so much, and want us to leave?

[Angry Dragon]

23. If the US leaves the UN then the repugs figure this country

can invade anyone we want and we will not have to answer to anyone

[SheilaT]

30. And how would that be different from

the current system?

[orwell]

5. It happens to us all...

...as we age it is human nature for our minds to close.

I see it here all the time as well.

Most people don't let facts get in the way of a cherished long held myth...

[Curmudgeoness]

15. Excuse me! Aging DUer here! Watch the stereotypes.

As I get older, I have become more open-minded, not less. I have more experiences with the "shit happens to us all" problems, and I am more able to realize that the only reason I am not living on the streets with a bag holding my belongings is dumb luck. I used to be much cockier in my youth. These old people who are close-minded have always been close-minded.

[RC]

18. I'm with you on this.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

25. yep... i see plenty of young fundies too, and it's sad to see such close mindedness

I recall some studies showing the personality trait of conservatism or authoritarianism is genetic, along with physiological brain differences. Hard-wired, in other words.

Some got it and some don't.

Thank god we won THAT gene pool lottery!

[Curmudgeoness]

26. Didn't I hear that our brains work.....

and theirs don't?

Yes, thank god I am not a close-minded moron.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

45. heh, yes

I think i the end, it comes down to that.

:P

[anneboleyn]

19. I am more open-minded now in my late thirties than I was at twenty

or at least I am much more tolerant now than I used to be when I was younger. I was an over-idealistic whippersnapper then.

[ohheckyeah]

24. No it doesn't happen

to us all. My 84 year old parents aren't closed minded at all.

[kiva]

27. Good to see that moronic sterotyping is still alive and well

and not just for conservatives anymore :puke:

[cali]

6. Where on earth do you go to school?

[white_wolf]

8. University of Tennessee.

Of course, it is a business communication class, and I've always heard business schools are RW propaganda mills. I just took it because normal public speaking was full.

[cali]

11. sounds like a horrible class, though I suppose it's interesting

to get a close up view of this kind of idiocy.

[SDuderstadt]

22. "I've always heard that business schools are...

RW propaganda mills"

Or, it could be those who told you that are biased.

[themadstork]

35. They are in my experience. . .

[TheKentuckian]

38. I'll take door number one, Monty.

[Egalitariat]

31. Go Big Orange!

[laundry_queen]

41. not all business schools

I've taken that same class (well, not sure if it was exactly the same, but it was called business communications and we had presentations...) and in no way was the prof political in any way, shape or form. I'm full in the business classes right now and even in textbooks, they are extremely fair - even with a whole page on why outsourcing is bad. Then again, I'm in Canada so maybe that's the difference, although most business courses are pretty standardized across North America.

[anneboleyn]

14. I was wondering this too. My husband and I are both professors

and there aren't too many right wing profs out there...

[damntexdem]

7. And who rely on 'facts' from dismissable organizations.

Palin, Harvard: oh, how can one decide between them? ;-)

[RKP5637]

9. Your prof. definitely thinks from the primitive portion of his brain. I've had

similar. Great for you with your perseverance to get the truth out.

Individuals that relate to the world from the primitive portion of their brain will always filter and refute even facts. And often a line of reasoning they might also give is, "well, if you choose to believe that." There have now been a number of studies on this, so I'm not pulling it out of thin air.

It's something most of us are quite familiar with, those that cling to their programming and hold lines of thought even when presented with overwhelming facts to the contrary.

[stevenleser]

42. Yes, this is right out of George Lakoff. He discusses the difference in how Conservatives and

Liberals brains' work when thinking about issues.

[yurbud]

10. wow, what school is this, Liberty University? Oral Roberts?

[fascisthunter]

12. your professor is a fraud with an agenda

he is not objective at all.

[Mojeoux]

13. See if you can access the records of your next professors before you

sign up for the class. The little assessment form that you fill out at the end of each semester, with the little #2 pencils, is on file for you to choose from. Most people damn with faint praise. The ones to look for have extra comments praising the teacher a lot. Even at Tennessee State, you can maybe find some cool mentors. Be quick about it, those classes fill up fast.

[anneboleyn]

17. Look at Rate my Professor too. It's all anonymous, so anyone can post about any prof

but often actual students post as well. Take what you find there with a grain of salt as any disgruntled person can post, but sometimes issues like this come through in the ocmments. You won't have been the first student to experience bias.

[BOG PERSON]

16. my favorite world health organization report is about the dprk

you should google it. it describes their health care system as "the envy of the developing world"

edit: i'm not saying this in order to discredit the WHO, i just think north korea is neat!

the WHO is a fine organization as well.

[gratuitous]

20. If you're allowed a follow-up

Get into the metrics of what the World Health Organization measures. While it may be "debatable" whether the U.S. should be ranked ahead of or behind Morocco or Croatia, the fact is that there is a valid statistical method at work. Is there a valid statistical measure (besides "America - Fuck, Yeah!") that says health care is better in the United States? (By the way, the website I saw said that WHO quit doing the health care system rankings because of the "complexities" involved in evaluating disparate health care delivery systems, and the last ranking is from 2000.)

As for the Harvard Medical School statistic, it's difficult to say if the professor mangled your speech or if you were sloppy in your phrasing. It sounds from his criticism that you said without a single-payer health system (according to HMS), 45,000 people were going to die. What I presume you meant to say is that under the current system, 45,000 people die because they don't have access to the system, a number that would doubtlessly be reduced under a single payer system because of improved and enhanced access. This is a far cry from Sarah Palin's "death panels" trope.

[white_wolf]

29. What I said was:

"According to a study done by Harvard Medical School,45,000 people die every year from lack of healthcare in the United States." I think that was clear, but then again I said it, so I'm probably not the best source. What do you think?

[gratuitous]

34. I'll take your word for it

And from your description, I would not be surprised if the prof mangled what you said. Certainly lack of access to health care in the United States is mortally negligent. The system as it was before the enactment of the Affordable Care Act was horrible; now I think it's merely lousy. Soon it will be mediocre. An improvement, to be sure, but there's room for lots more improvement.

Another point you may wish to make is the importance of regular access to preventive health care. When people don't have to wait until it's time to go to the emergency room can see a doctor, conditions can be treated before they become acute, saving money and lives. And isn't that the point of a health care delivery system?

[Johonny]

48. If death panels were true... where are they?

the thing passed. :)

[JoePhilly]

21. Any time you want to believe that the Dems and Republicans are "the same"

remember that experience.

We on the left are up against an insane wall on the right. We on the left can have an honest debate about ANY policy decision.

The right cares nothing for that honest debate.

[anneboleyn]

28. There are some things you can do...(suggestions)

I am also a professor, as is my husband as well, and we have encountered some situations like this in the past (in which students have expressed to us that they feel bullied by a professor who is demonstrating clear bias of a political nature or otherwise). Has this bias been clear in the grading of your work in the class? Is it evident in the professor's written or emailed comments regarding your work? Have any other students experienced a problem?

You have the problem of having to deal with this professor in order to receive your grade in the class, so I do recommend that you take steps (but carefully). You should try to protect yourself. Can you speak with your academic advisor? That's the first person I would recommend visiting to discuss the matter, as well as the Dean of Students (see below). Also you could meet with the chair of this professor's department (assuming that he is not the chair), and you csn tell the chair that you are having a problem in the class and that you do not feel comfortable with the situation. Tell the chair that you wish to keep the meeting in confidence, but that you felt you needed to alert a third party in case of any problems.

I looked at the website for your school (Knoxville. I am not sure which campus you are attending). But this would apply no matter which campus you are attending. I would strongly suggest making an appointment with your Dean of Students if you haven't already (Dr. Maxine Thompson Davis). There is a bias reporting form located on the Dean's web page. You could take this to the meeting and tell the Dean you are in a difficult situation since this professor will be deciding your grade. Take any comments the professor has written, and be sure to explain all of the professor's comments. I think this will be a big help. The deans are usually prepared for this sort of thing and your dean should have some good ideas.

Just some suggestions. I am so sorry you are stuck in this situation. I have endured it myself, and it is miserable. Please send me a note if I could do anything else to help out.

[readmoreoften]

32. Your professor is not a very good professor.

I'm sorry. It happens sometimes.

[BOG PERSON]

33. In France and in England the bourgeoisie had conquered political power.

Thenceforth, the class struggle, practically as well as theoretically, took on more and more outspoken and threatening forms. It sounded the knell of scientific bourgeois economy. It was thenceforth no longer a question, whether this theorem or that was true, but whether it was useful to capital or harmful, expedient or inexpedient, politically dangerous or not. In place of disinterested inquirers, there were hired prize fighters; in place of genuine scientific research, the bad conscience and the evil intent of apologetic.

[lumberjack_jeff]

36. Every time a college student says "I was just like" meaning "I said"...

God kills a kitten.

If not for language, at least think of the kittens.

[white_wolf]

39. I'm typing on an internet message board, not in

a paper. I actually don't use "I was like" very often, though.

[MessiahRp]

37. I dropped out of a World Events class because of this reasoning

We had to do short reports like 2x a week on a current news event but the teacher was a whackjob right winger so she would tell me any negative articles about what Bush was doing, anything from the NY Times, CNN, anything using a study from a group she considered to be liberal was biased and that my reports were inaccurate and false. After 2 weeks of getting horrible grades from this stupid ass teacher at a Technical College, I decided it wasn't worth an F to kiss ass and lie to prop up her right wing belief system.

Rp

[applegrove]

40. That is not a real professor.

[divvy]

43. Catch ONE of them in a lie, then they argue "they ALL do it"

That is the type of bad reasoning that I hate.

edit to fix formatting

[truedelphi]

44. This is where Palin is an aboslute necessity for the RW

Talking points.

But it still means they are using illogic to defeat logic.

[Obamanaut]

46. In the quote attributed to your professor, you typed "...what your doing the..."

Should this be "you're"?

And you were "'like My stats...'"? "Like"? Did you say anything?

What in the world is being taught there?

[white_wolf]

49. Sorry, I really need to read over things before I post.

I was in a hurry and kind of mad over the whole thing, thanks for pointing it out.

[DirkGently]

47. For RWers to win an argument, Palin MUST equal Harvard Medical School.

[StarburstClock]

50. The "other side" of any debate shouldn't be a pathologically lying repub

Our entire culture still props up these proven liars as if they have some side of something to represent when they have nothing but lies and decades of failures behind them. The entire paradigm is just as insane.

[lunatica]

51. That professor must have a stupid quota he hasn't used up yet

[nadinbrzezinski]

52. Hold it.. you got a RWer teaching in College?

I thought that all them profs were long haired unproductive hippies... the right told me so.

:-)

And I am not surprised he dismissed them facts.