TV Box is floating $8.00 a gallon.

[lonestarnot]

Where's the cap Mr. President? If we run out that's one thing, but I'd rather walk than let them have my $8.00!

[hedgehog]

1. If $8 per gallon is what it takes to get people out of their cars,

c'mon $8 a gallon!

[ProdigalJunkMail]

2. yeah...fuck all those people who don't have a choice n/t

[hedgehog]

4. People don't have a choice now; in most places, unless you have

a car, you are SOL.

I've driven used cars for 30 years; it's fine when they're in good shape, but when they're not, each errand becomes an unwanted adventure. Will the car get me to work, to the doctor's, to the store, to pick up the kids; will it get me home again. Unless you've been there, you can't imagine the stress. It's even worse when you are depending on a dubious machine to get you to your job on time. I've seen people fired because they didn't have reliable transport. A $500 repair bill can put a real hurt on someone working minimum wage.

If you're elderly or otherwise handicapped, often you are trapped because you don't have a driver's license. I have a daughter who struggles because she can't see well enough to drive.

We will not have reliable, cheap, convenient public transport until the middle class demands it.

[proud2BlibKansan]

3. And people with no other choice are just out of luck

Good plan!

[lonestarnot]

7. What about a finite resource don't people get? One day there will be no other choice. We are going

to run out of oil. What is so hard about that?

[Javaman]

18. Complaining is part of the American way!

All the while flooring the gas toward the cliff. LOL

People want magic not real world answers. Haven't you learned that yet?

Cheers. :)

[lonestarnot]

19. Fucking A! We suck!

[Javaman]

23. Um, okay...

I was agreeing with you, but I'm not sure what to make of your reply.

:shrug:

Your answer that I replied to was probably one of the best and most succinct observations I have read on DU in a very long time.

Cheers!

[lonestarnot]

40. Uh, what I meant was, we've let 30 years to wit we could have reacted to the finite nature of oil.

We wait until we are so fucked that people are and will starve and continue to starve until we move out on sustainable renewable energy. We are just fucked.

[Yavin4]

28. Precisely.

The automobile is an antiquated mode of transportation. We need new forms of personal transportation or better public transportation that does not rely on fossil fuels.

[proud2BlibKansan]

32. We need to develop better public transportation before we tell people to give up their cars

[RebelOne]

43. Right. The public transportation in the area I live

in North Georgia is nonexistent. I live northwest of Atlanta. The closest bus depot is about 7 miles from my house. So I would still have to drive to catch a bus. Fortunately, I am no longer working, so I don't have to worry about driving to work.

[Thunderstruck]

45. It's too late for that. There's not enough recoverable oil left

with which to build such a system.

We had our chance and lost it when we failed to re-elect Jimmy Carter.

[proud2BlibKansan]

48. So let's all give up our cars, quit our jobs we can longer get to

and sit at home doing nothing while waiting for the foreclosure papers to arrive.

:sarcasm:

[Thunderstruck]

49. Yea, THAT's what I said...

:eyes:

[Angry Dragon]

5. .............

:thumbsdown: :wow:

[Renew Deal]

I know people with this point of view.

I'm more like ProdigalJunkMail. I think it would severely damage the economy. But the argument is that $5 gas is what it till take to get people out of these cars. I think there are better ways to solve this problem. Mostly through proactive government action rather than sudden price hikes.

[lonestarnot]

8. Exactly, so why rob people in the interim and why should it be allowed to happen?

[Renew Deal]

10. Who's doing the robbing?

It's not the government. It's the oil companies.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

12. the oil companies do not set the price... n/t

[lonestarnot]

14. OPEC osmek, they SUCK ASS. If Nigeria blows then what?

Price won't make a fucking diff if there is NO oil.

[Javaman]

26. There was an interesting article written back in '08...

theorizing if suddenly Norway staged oil price hike. It was fascinating. I will try hard to find it, but I don't recall were I read it.

Basically, they ran the price up to over $200 a barrel, then the author extrapolated out the reaction from the various nations of the world based on the 2008 situation. It wasn't pretty, but at the same time it was enlightening.

I will try hard to see if I can find it.

[lonestarnot]

56. K

[lonestarnot]

13. Yes, therefore the government should step in and stop the fucking robbery. How much profit did they

haul in last year? How much ecosystem should they be allowed to destroy? Pathetic they.

[polmaven]

6. Well, beginning Monday,

I will be driving 50 miles in each direction for my brand new temp job. There is no public transportaion to get me there. I will likely be filling my tanki at least twice per week. What would you suggest for me? - And please don't say "move". This is a temp job and I own my home (or 2/3 of it, anyway).

[lonestarnot]

9. Electric car?

[polmaven]

11. Maybe someday,

but I hjave been unemployed for 10+ months, and, as I said, this job is temporary. UI barely pays the bills now. An expensive new car is not in mix for a good long time.

[lonestarnot]

16. Car pool?

We are just fucked.

[Javaman]

22. Yes we are.

People want answers and solutions, but sometimes, there aren't any. And sometimes the solutions were purposely derailed for 1) profit 2) immediate gratification 3) screwing a competitor or 4) all 3.

We as a nation have effectively painted ourselves into a corner.

We worry and fret about the recession/depression now, just wait till gas reaches $5 as the national average.

There will be whole sale defaults in the business sector from 1) inability of low wage employees able to afford to drive to work 2) the ramping up of shipping and product cost. 3) Food costs will jump up; just to name a few.

The fall out from high gas and diesel prices will make our current situation look like a walk in the park.

[Yavin4]

29. Question: Would Renting A Motel Room or Extended Stay Hotel Room Near Where You Work Be Cheaper?

Do a quick google search and see how much a hotel/motel room would cost for an extended stay near where you work, and then do a cost comparison analysis of how much gas would cost commuting back and forth.

It may turn out to be cheaper to rent a motel/hotel room.

Also, look into whether there are people who would take in a border.

[Taverner]

27. Carpool. Partial Public Transport. Consider Hypermiling.

Hypermiling ------> http://motherjones.com/politics/2007/01/guy-can-get-59-mpg-plain-old-accord-beat-punk

Granted it can be unsafe at times, but you can squeak out 59 MPG from an old accord

Overinflate your tires, don't gas on turns...do a lot of coasting

The biggest takeaway I had was do not accelerate to red lights. When it goes red, unless you are driving up a hill, just coast to a stop.

ON EDIT: and when doing downhill, never EVER accelerate

[polmaven]

39. I said in my post

there is no public transportation available in the area. I am alone in my part of the state working at this company, so carpooling is not in the question. The vast majority of the trip is major highway, so "unsafe at times" would be an understatement.

Please understand...I was simply responding to the declaration to "bring on" $8.00 if that is what it takes to get people out of their cars. Sometimes getting out of the car is not possible. Oh, and, by the way...I am a member of my city's "green" committee, so I am not just ignoring that aspect.

[Taverner]

53. Well try hypermiling

I've done it with a Saturn, and if you do it you can cut your Gasoline bill in half

Granted, I wouldn't do it in the snow

[Bluenorthwest]

20. That logic is like saying a famine is a good thing because you

need to lose a few pounds before the swimsuit season.

[Raschel]

42. Bicycling will give the elderly more muscle, and people with disabilities more air.

Of course, sarcasm.

[SoCalDem]

34. yay..more unemployed people...just what we need

not everyone can walk to work..most places have NO public transportation that works with the wacky scheduling that jobs have these days..

like it or not, we ARE a commuter society...transitioning @$6-7-8 a gallon is a bad thing, because marginal companies will shut down, and marginal people will have to quit work if they cannot afford the gas to GET to work..

there is no way that an alternative to driving can be done in the short term, and in the long term, there will be no money for it (like there isn;t now too), because more unemployed people means even LESS tax money coming in..

[XemaSab]

58. I've wondered before why companies

haven't opened more satellite offices.

If you're a company with 200 people in downtown LA, and 10 people are driving in from Santa Clarita every day, why not open a small office up there? The workers could have the benefits of being with colleagues without the hassle of driving for an hour, and morale would improve.

I wonder at what point the math would make sense for the company to do something like this.

[SoCalDem]

64. Too many companies are just sure that employees would not work hard if they were not watched

:grr:

[David__77]

46. It won't get me out of my car, or even get me to alter my driving habits.

But it sure would impact a lot of people who need to drive to make money to feed and clothe and house their families. I was very poor at one time, and have always been struck by how much more time people have to spend doing things when they have no car. And my city has "great" public transportation. I'm done with it, thank you very much.

[uppityperson]

59. Have you noticed food costs skyrocketing due to increased fuel costs? Should we just eat less?

[ohheckyeah]

62. Are you insane?

Seriously, dude, what about people who have to drive? Or do you just not care about anything but an agenda?

Not to mention what it will do to the economy. Food will go up and everyone needs food. If it goes up much more than it is now we will see more foreclosures as those who have to decide between gas to get to work and the mortgage.

[bhikkhu]

15. I'd rather bicycle, myself

Which I do, having switched to commuting by bike during the last "price shock". Anyone who might have that as an option (and after the first week its easier than you might think, even if you think its not a realistic option) should give it a try. Get a decent bike - go to an actual bike shop - which might be $300-400, and plot out a route.

I've saved many hundreds of dollars on gas and vehicle maintenance, and the rides to work and back home are often the nicest part of the day, or at least ones I wouldn't give up without a fight.

[lonestarnot]

17. See above. This poor devil has no fucking choice as he puts it. Stuck.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

25. no, i am not stuck...but loads of people are...

loads of people that you would probably claim to be a champion of...working people...

sP

[Bluenorthwest]

21. So are you in Portland?

The level of biking in Oregon is very high, in part because of the paths and planning, the bridges, and so forth. I have a friend who likes to bike who is in LA, I sent him a map of Eugene bike paths and he said at first he though it was a joke, or a plan for the future.

[bhikkhu]

30. SE Oregon - on the snowy side of the mountains

Though it really is much nicer riding in snow that in rain. And I am lucky to have a bike path for 5 miles of my 6 mile commute.

[Yavin4]

31. That's Why I Hate LA

They have great weather 90% of the days of the year, but they designed their entire city around people sitting in cars on the freeway, instead of designing their city so that people can bike or walk to work.

What's the point of having the nice weather if you never take advantage of it.

[cliffordu]

24. Couldn't have said it better myself!!

Since 1974 for me - the first oil embargo was enough to scare me to death.......

I have lived ONE place since then that required a car - for seven months - and it was the agonies of hell for me....

YMMV

[SoCalDem]

35. My husband is 66, in poor health and I can't see him biking 32 miles each way to work

Biking to work locally may work for some, but in most places it will not ..

[Hutzpa]

36. That is such a selfish comment

and I noticed you are not the only one making selfish comments, so many of you are forgetting that
there are people who live in bigger cities and do not live closer to where they work.

[bhikkhu]

55. I know I am fortunate, but its also by design

I have been pretty good about keeping my health and fitness up over the years, and I deliberately moved years ago to a smallish town where the traffic is manageable and the distances aren't too bad because it was affordable, and a good choice for my family.

There's nothing selfish about that. Some of it is good fortune and some of it is good planning, and I'd advise anyone who could do the same to do so, if they were able. If enough people who can make the decision to use less actually do make the decision to use less, then two things happen:

First, their health, budget and life improves

Second, they are no longer part of the big demand problem that drives high prices for everyone who needs to drive every day for physical or logistic reasons. Think of it as opting to not use a resource, so more is left for those who need it.

Again, its not selfish, and I would do more if I could.

[Hutzpa]

60. All that is nice

but what about affordability, yes it makes a lot of sense but also remember that most people cannot afford to move from there present location.

High gas prices should not determine my level of comfortability.

[Warren DeMontague]

63. Do you think that the individual you're responding to is somehow responsible for gas prices?

Look, if people don't want to hear the truth, that's unfortunate, but telling them the truth isn't being 'insensitive' to them. Here are the facts: Addicts are at the mercy of their dealers. Either they will pay what the dealer will charge, or they will kick the habit. And most of us, yes, as human beings are addicted to fossil fuels.

It's a fact, it's a reality, and whether or not people respond by going "Grrrr! It's intolerable, I tells ya!" or not, it's not going to change.


Suggesting people think about alternate means of transportation is actually a reasonable, kind response. These aren't the people in charge of the oil prices. There are no shell executives posting on DU, I'd wager.

[trumad]

33. Yeah---thanks to wall street and the speculators

for getting us out of our cars...

Wait a minute...what?

[Skink]

37. 8 dollar gas would make the bus cost effective .

If we could just suspend the car payments like we can suspend netflix.

[Robb]

38. 1 in 4 gallons of fuel is burned by the trucking industry, IIRC.

Increased freight costs on everything everyone purchases would not be borne by the manufacturer, nor the supplier.

You can walk, but everything from food and medical supplies to building materials -- no matter how green -- can't be physically carried. No bus or light rail can solve this issue.

We are seeing a resurgence in investment in rail freight infrastructure, but there is still the last 20 miles to consider.

[Yavin4]

41. Or, We Can Make Stuff Here

And shipping would be closer. Correct?

[Robb]

52. Perhaps. Although by "here" I doubt you mean "within 20 miles of my home."

Agribusiness' general malfeasance aside, most Americans do not live in climates appropriate for all manner of healthful produce we have grown accustomed to eating year-round, or even more than a few weeks a year.

Big pharma's general malfeasance aside, most Americans cannot home-brew insulin, or weave bandages.

And Weyerhauser et al's general malfeasance aside, timber production is relatively localized, and a sawmill on every block is cost prohibitive.

It's an old management joke that to simulate thoughtful progress in an organization, one should centralize everything that's currently decentralized (and decentralize everything currently centralized) every few years. My only point is that neither move, in and of itself, is a panacea.

[taught_me_patience]

44. Not going to happen

the economy will collapse way before that. However, if it does, hopefully my boss will allow telecommuting a couple times a week.

[Blue_Tires]

47. The President cannot set some arbitrary cap on fuel prices...

[Yavin4]

54. Yes He Could

Right after he cures cancer and saves little Timmy from the well.

[roamer65]

57. Yes he actually can.

He can declare a national emergency, take over the oil companies and set prices. If you think I am wrong, go look it up. He can do it.

[shanti]

50. what about the trucking business??

it's disconcerting to think that the price of EVERYTHING else trucked in will rise proportionately, which does affect everyone.

[dkofos]

51. Yeah, that will help the economy.

[upi402]

61. It'll go to 5 and we'll be fearing 8, and

when it settles at 4 Americans will think they never had it so good.

Speculators will need to be sworn-in and testify. Then it will go down. BUT!
Which party will do that?

lol