My critique of Obectivist philosophy.

[white_wolf]

In this thread I'm going to quote 3 main tenets of Objectivism and give my philosophical reasons against them. I'm mainly doing this for fun (yes my life is this boring), but I'd like to hear DU's thoughts. There is a 4th principle from this article I'm quoting, but it is about capitalism and I think we all know my feelings on that.

1."Reality exists as an objective absolute—facts are facts, independent of man’s feelings, wishes, hopes or fears." My main problem with this one is, so what? This isn't a groundbreaking new discovery. Most rational people will say that we can't change facts simply because we don't like them. This one is true, and honestly I think Rand is engaging in dishonestly here by loading the question. If someone agrees with the first premise they will be more likely to agree with the others. It is something polling companies take advantage of a lot as well.

2."Reason (the faculty which identifies and integrates the material provided by man’s senses) is man’s only means of perceiving reality, his only source of knowledge, his only guide to action, and his basic means of survival." I disagree here one some things and agree on others. First reason is man's only accurate way of perceiving the world, that is true. Again, fairly basic, but later on she goes into territory I disagree with. Reason is NOT our only guide to action. No one, save sociopaths(and its very questionable how rational they are), live their lives making no decisions based on emotion. There have been movements that preached that such as Stoicism, but they never achieve the ideal and that is because emotions are a fundamental part of the human experience. Why do people choose to get married? Most of the time it isn't for a rational reason, but because of love, which is arguably the strongest of all emotions, that or hate. For example a few weeks ago my best friend called me from his vacation in California and he told me he had no internet at his grandparents trailer park, but had a paper due when he got back and asked me if I could help him with the research. I agreed, why, because he is my best friend and I care about him, it wasn't reasonable or logical, but it was the right thing to do. Should we make all our decisions on emotion? Of course not, that would be very dangerous, but to try and live our lives using cold reason alone as our guide is equally dangerous.

3. "Man—every man—is an end in himself, not the means to the ends of others. He must exist for his own sake, neither sacrificing himself to others nor sacrificing others to himself. The pursuit of his own rational self-interest and of his own happiness is the highest moral purpose of his life." This is where I can really say, I agree with nothing at all Rand says. Man is not an end unto himself, nothing man does is ever done in total isolation. Man cannot exist solely for his own sake, if he did society would cease to function since we must work together to make it survive. Man's own happiness cannot be the highest moral purpose in life. If so than what is to stop me from stealing or killing someone I don't like, as long as it makes me happy? Her last sentence there is really just so wrong that I'm not sure how to say it. I mean the very idea that man should worry about himself alone is extremely dangerous and can lead to terrible atrocities. Oh, and when soldiers die for other people's freedom that is living for another human being and not pursuing their own happiness, so in Rand's eyes they are immoral, so Republicans why don't you support our troops?! Oh, and who the hell is Ayn Rand to tell me I can't live my life for someone else? I thought she was about personal freedom, it seems to me that for her to call me immoral for sacrificing some of my happiness to make others happy is a trying to take away my free will.

Here is the article this was taken from, let me know your thoughts: http://www.aynrand.org/site/PageServer?pagename=objectivism_intro

[napoleon_in_rags]

1. I think your stance on 3 is what makes a leftist a leftist.

The idea of the left is that the purpose of life is to find cause in lives beyond your own, that service and sacrifice to others is a high moral goal. The goal of the right is to live your dream life, and the belief is that this action will guide others to do the same.

[dkf]

2. What if making other people happy makes you happy?

Are you then doing it for them or for yourself?

Or does it only count if you are making someone happy and making yourself thoroughly unhappy in the process?

[Ron Green]

3. Objectivism is the preferred philosophy of precocious seventeen-year-olds.

By the time they're twenty-five, they've gone beyond it.

Or if they're dimwits, they get into it in their thirties and stay with it.

[DonCoquixote]

4. Hey

There are many 17 year olds who would NEVER buy into Ayn Rand bullshit, they are the ones who make fun her of her as they "bioshock" a game that parodies her.

[Kip Humphrey]

5. The Hunter/Warrior is the walking dead. The future belongs to Cooperatism.