"White Women Who Enable Trump Do Not Deserve The Benefit Of Your Doubt"

[rainlillie]

"It’s easy to see Donald Trump’s presidency as an assault on women. The “grab them by the pussy” president has continued to find new ways to humiliate women, appointed a Cabinet made up almost entirely of white men, and created policies on reproductive rights that are draconian and deadly. Many will argue that the Women’s March and #MeToo movements are reactions to this dystopian feminist novel come to life. But that is too simple a story.

Lost in this telling of events is the role white women play in this nightmare presidency. White women helped Trump ascend to power, and are working to keep him there. They are part of Trump’s base, his funders and his administration. Yet they continue to get a pass for the far-reaching, generational damage they are helping Trump to unleash on this country, and particularly on black and brown people."

Click to read entire article.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daniels-opinion-white-women-trump_us_5a79f67de4b0d0ef3c09fbf0?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

[JI7]

1. They are racist

[rainlillie]

4. Perhaps..

I think it may be more than a race thing, it may be because they're not going to suffer the same fate as minority women under Trump. Therefore they don't give a crap. Either way it's an eyeopener.

[lunatica]

31. Your explanation in itself

is also the definition of racism. If they’re doing anything to hurt minorities they’re racist.

[rainlillie]

58. Yep.. which is why I said more than.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

17. I think theyre more like content in their attachment to CONservatism.

So content, they don’t see reality outside the simplistic explanations for world problems that their bubble provides. And if they can’t see it, it doesn’t exist.

[kcr]

38. I think this is the best explanation. The fact is, conservatives enjoy higher turnout rates.

It isn't actually true that more white women voted for Trump. Many more simply didn't vote at all.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

86. Just had another aha moment...

I realized that as CONservatives, they also don’t have to worry about “living in the style to which they are accustomed”.

They just go ahead and live the consumerist dream TO THE MAX. Fuck everyone else.

Being assured that living the way you want is your right so go ahead and indulge your “patriotic” desires is a pretty strong incentive to them.

Oy vey.

[kcr]

2. Huffpo is clickbait trash n/t

[MFM008]

3. Disagree

ANY woman ....no matter the color...
who supports emperor baby fists
Deserves nothing but contempt.

[kcr]

6. That's not what I said.

Becuase gosh, how hard is it to disagree with the notion that anyone who would vote for Trump deserves contempt? But twist it into something that becomes a smelly sock to wave around and get people outraged, like Gosh, aren't white women just the WORST! Cuz they vote for Trump! That's trash clickbait.

[MFM008]

19. No

That's what I'm saying....

[kcr]

30. Either you're trying to make it look like I'm saying something I'm not.

Or you don't understand what I said. I'm not defending Tump voters.

[rainlillie]

21. Yep.. every single woman who voted for Trump is the worst IMO.

They knew what he was and still voted for him. They knew what Moore was and still voted for him.

[kcr]

25. They sure are

They're also very likely not feminist. So, I don't get the point of blasting The Women's March, or #MeToo on their behalf. I'm suspicious of those who do.

[rainlillie]

27. I'm suspicious of people who lose their shit

because of an OP.

[mythology]

42. You have a very low bar for losing one's shit

[rainlillie]

7. The article was very enlightening.. Not trash at all.

It is a curious thing how women knowing what Trump is and what Moore is voted for them.

[kcr]

9. It's curious how movements like the Women's March, and #MeToo have to be torn down

Even though the majority of people in this country, women included, didn't vote for Trump?

[happy feet]

14. I don't hear this as tearing down the Women's March or #MeToo Some facts:

52% of white women voted for Trump
61% of white women without college degree voted for Trump

the 54% of women who didn't vote for Trump is bolstered by the overwhelming percentages of women of color who didn't vote for Trump

[kcr]

24. She specifically mentions both in her article. How do you not see it?

Like I just told another poster in this thread. It's another typical article meant to diminish and dismiss two very important movements because outrage always gets the clicks.

[rainlillie]

20. This has nothing to do with any of that.

Facts are facts. Whether we like them or not.

[kcr]

22. Maybe you missed this part:

"A majority of white women ― 53 percent ― voted for Trump. This oft-repeated data point tends to disappear from coverage of the Women’s March and the #MeToo campaign. Instead, feel-good accounts of the resistance repeat a cheery narrative about women in pink hats as a fixed, biological category of people who all experience the world in the same way and uniformly hold center-left political views."

It's just another wag the finger at the pussy hats article that's all the rage right now. It's nothing to do with any actual meaningful debate or discussion. IOW, clickbait.

[Yavin4]

50. Disagree. The author is countering a media narrative that ALL women oppose Trump when that's not

entirely true. The bulk of anti-Trump women voters are made up by women of color, not White women, but it's White women that are featured heavily in movements like the "Pink hats" and Me-Too.

It's important to point this out.

[kcr]

52. I'm only going based on her actual words.

And her actual words said that she wondered why no one mentioned the fact that more white women voted for Trump (which as I've said in other posts isn't actually true because of low voter turnout) during events like the Women's March.

Why should we, a diverse group, have to turn in our Pussy Hats and sew on white T patches because of a group of women Trump voters who are actually a minority with extreme views and not representative of any demographic? I'd actually like an answer to that.

[brush]

62. I'd like an answer to this statement of yours...

"...because of a group of women who are actually a minority with extreme views and not representative of any demographic?"

Are you saying women of color at the womens' marches have extreme views?

I certainly hope not but you did write that.

[kcr]

63. I have no idea how you got that from what I wrote

I'm defending the women's march.

Edit that phrase was referencing Trump voters.

[brush]

72. Ok, I'll got with what you seem to be saying. The writing is not very clear.

[kcr]

78. I see that. I clarified what I meant. Thanks n/t

[rainlillie]

57. Seems you jump right in to bash the OP for no good reason. Fact: White women overwhelmingly

voted for Trump and Moore, end of story. That's the only point I was making and no, they don't deserve the benefit of the doubt. They are grown ass women who make their own decisions.. not their hubby's fault, or society's fault. It's all on them.

[kcr]

61. But fact. Voter turn out is really low.

Is it really that you think disagreeing with you isn't a good enough reason? I don't get it. I really don't like Huffpo and if you did a search you'd see I've ripped that sight before. Multiple times. They're a clickbait farm and that was my primary reason trashing them. But it's also a fact that it's incorrect to state that a majority of white women voted for Trump. It's simply a fact that right wingers are a loyal and reliable bunch when it comes to voting and Dems and liberals aren't. Most Americans on both sides stay home but Republicans will vote more reliably. So stating that more white women voted for Trump isn't accurate.

[rainlillie]

65. It has nothing to do with how many turned out on the other side,

the point is pigs like Trump and Moore had the support of those women and that's a huge problem.

[kcr]

68. Well, that's a neat trick.

Claim a part of a group is the majority by saying a significant chunk of the rest is irrelevant.

[GoneOffShore]

66. So, here's a link to an interview with Donna Ferrato not long ago

http://www.macleans.ca/politics/washington/donna-ferrato-what-is-wrong-with-white-women/

But through this last year—as it became really apparent that so many white women were against the rights of women, and that so many women who supported Trump and really made this nightmare come true are steadfast in their support of him—I started to get really angry with women. Really, really angry with these women.

I think she nails it down.

[rainlillie]

69. Thanks, I'll go read it.

[kcr]

77. Same thing. My response is the same.

The problem is with our political system that gives their vote so much power. If we let them quiet our voices and shut down our movements, we lose. That is exactly what is happening. They may have an outsized voice in our political system, but we have them beat in numbers. We shouldn't lose sight of that. I see no good reason why we should have to mention their existence every single time we have a march or mention #MeToo. That dilutes our message. It simply isn't true that a majority of any women demographic actually voted for Trump and it is misleading to say so.

[TygrBright]

5. Truth.

I have never once gotten pulled for extra search at airport security.

The few times I've been pulled over by cops for things like a busted taillight, etc., I haven't even gotten a written warning, just a verbal one.

I never got asked for verification ID at the courthouse when going through the security scanner, during jury duty.

It's an unearned privilege that sits weird with the lifetime's worth of being dismissed, talked-over, underpaid, harrassed, assaulted, presumed to care about shit I don't give a damn' about and not to care about stuff that's terribly important to me.

It feels weird that I have it, and even weirder that I don't have to pay any attention to it. That's the nature of privilege in our culture, even when it accompanies a completely opposite not-privileged status.

Articles like this are important.

diffidently,
Bright

[rainlillie]

15. ITA!

My co-worker and I talked about BLM. I told her that not only do minority parents have to worry about their children interacting with other people when they leave the house, unfortunately they have to worry about their encounters with police officers too. Their sons need to know how to respond, where to put their hands, what tone of voice to use. She looked at me and said: that's something I never even thought about. She's a dear, sweet woman without an ounce of malice in her heart, but she had no clue on what life can be like for others.

[Ferrets are Cool]

82. Your post is such an important lesson that most of

white people, of which I am one, never ever think about. WHAT IS IT LIKE TO BE BLACK?
I know that if I were black, I would be scared to death to even leave my home. And, even being a white male, the fact that I must be completely deferential to the police is maddening, since they are supposed to be there to serve and protect ME. I cannot even imagine how difficult it must be to be black and be stopped by a police officer...it must be absolutely terrifying.
It should NOT be that way in America. It should not be that way just because you were born with different pigments in your skin.
And you are correct, most do NOT have a clue.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

8. 53 percent of the white woman vote went to Trump. It's so, so important to remember that.

[EffieBlack]

10. With many notable exceptions, throughout history white women have always aligned themselves

with white men against women and men of color. In many instances, it wasn't just a matter of siding with white oppressors but they actually were complicit in creating the oppression themselves. Racism and a fear of losing their perceived but often imaginary privilege are often the driving forces.

So, while I'm disappointed, I'm not too terribly surprised that a critical mass of white women continue to behave as they always have.

[Yavin4]

51. Also, they benefitted mightily from the oppression.

Wives of Southern plantation owners lived like queens.

[LisaM]

11. This is sexist.

Lost in all this is the fact that many white women are part of a larger pattern of emotional "abuse", if you want to call it that. I'm using it for lack of a better term. It has a lifelong effect on their behavior and their worldview.

In the small town I'm from, many women grew up in families that attended very strict and right-wing churches that were essentially small patriarchies. Others were raised on farms, or were in families where the fathers worked at GM or a car company, maybe on a late shift, and the values were very traditional. Some of the men were mean. One of my friends suffered physical abuse from her husband, and her minister advised her to stay in the marriage (she didn't, but she always held it against that church that the minister gave her that advice and it really soured her and pushed her into another unhappy marriage).

Women were pretty much, in both cases, pegged into traditional roles and, in the case of the churches, actively discriminated against. I grew up with girls who had to wear full length dresses just to go swimming, and I knew a girl who went to a small religious college where the coeds were actually made to do household chores for the boys in the same college (including their laundry).

It's very easy to pick on a group and say that they should know better. The reality is far, far more complicated.

[EffieBlack]

12. I'm tired of the excuses for white women behaving badly

Yes, some white women are abused. That is not why 53% of white women voted for Trump.

[rainlillie]

23. Exactly!

[LisaM]

37. No, but it's part of why some of those 53% did.

Last edited Wed Feb 7, 2018, 05:53 PM - Edit history (1)

I think that we, as Democrats, should be better than just shoving wholesale blame on a group. I said nothing against any other group. I'm simply telling you the way it was for women in my small town, who were yes, for the most part, white.

Some (no, not all) of these women were emotional hostages. It's difficult to break away from that.

It's also a huge complaint I have about all mail-in voting. Say you live in one of those weird, patriarchal communes like in Colorado City, Arizona. How can we guarantee a vote is sacred if there's no guarantee someone is voting in the sanctity of a ballot box?

I stand by my comments.

[kcr]

39. It's especially unwise when it comes to voting groups, because it's not accurate

Voter turnout in this country is very low. Conservatives have the highest rate, and even that is comparatively low. Ascribing the motives of a conservative bloc of voters to the entire demographic, when Conservatives are the most motivated voters, isn't fair or accurate. Trump voters are still a relative minority in this country. White women Trump voters are still a minority of white women in this country and are extreme in their views. They aren't representative.

[brush]

93. The thread is about white women who voted for trump, not all white women. That's pretty clear.

[kcr]

95. The article isn't, and that's what I was talking about

The title of the article states that White Women who voted for Trump shouldn't be given a pass. If it stopped there, I'd agree with it. I have no problem with that statement. But then reading the article, apparently women marching in Trump protests and participating in the MeToo movement shouldn't either. I feel like I'm the only one who actually paid attention to what the writer actually said. A writer who, if you google her name, seems quite fond of tweeting stuff like this.

[brush]

70. Come on. 53% means 47% had enough sense and critical thinking skills to not vote for abuser trump

That 47% had similar growing up experiences as the 53%.

Pls stop with the excuses for trump voters who knew he was a sexual predator and racist yet still voted for him.

Low self esteem or beholden to their husbands views or their churches' teaching is bs.

Neither the husband nor the pastor is in the voting booth with them.

[EffieBlack]

73. Thank you.

[LisaM]

83. Some don't vote at all and not everyone votes in a booth.

Washington and Oregon don't even have in-person voting anymore; I can't speak for other states, but it's an unfortunate trend. I'm certainly not trying to imply, though, that every woman who voted for Trump was forced to do so, that would be ridiculous, I'm just saying that some of them fit into categories where there are other factors than just being a white woman (and one is wealth, I'd be the first to acknowledge that).

I'm a bit tired of these attacks on one voting group. And I do think it's a sexist comment; YMMV.

[brush]

87. Still with the excuses. We're talking about white women who voted, not all white women. 53%...

Last edited Thu Feb 8, 2018, 12:17 PM - Edit history (1)

of those who voted voted for trump whether it was a voting booth or by mail.

They themselves did the voting.

No one forced them to.

trump is a known sexual predator and racist yet they still voted for him.

There's really no reason to try to defend how they voted.

Hopefully they've learned from women of color and the 47% of other white women who didn't vote for a racist, sexual predator.

And on top of his unprecedented, well known, before-the-election negatives we add the debacle of chaos trump has made of the presidency—they really should be ashamed of voting for him.

And FYI, criticizing women where criticism is due is not sexist.

Being a woman does not exempt one from criticism.

They helped this unqualified, orange embarrassment and abuser of women into the WH over the most qualified presidential candidate ever—another white woman. WTF?

[radius777]

88. and a general election is a huge sample size

more than enough to extrapolate the voting preferences of any particular demographic.

Lost in the fray is the 5% of white women cared so little about stopping Trump that they threw their vote away to 3rd party.

Thus only 42% of white women voted for Hillary, the only candidate who stood for women's (and civil) rights, potentially the first female president.

[brush]

90. Yes. Points well taken.

[EffieBlack]

28. Bullshit

53% of white women did not vote for Trump because they're being abused.

Women of color have endured far more than white women have over the years, yet we don't consistently vote against our and other women's interests - and we don't blame everyone but ourselves for our bad choices.

White women aren't weak, pitiful flowers who have no power or control over their choices.

They need to own their shit and other white women need to stop circling the wagons and making excuses for them.

[EffieBlack]

48. True - but assuming the primary cause is that these women are victims

defies history and ignores reality. And it's deeply insulting to women of color who have been victimized for decades yet don't vote to damage other women.

The bottom line is that far too many white women voted for Trump and others like him, not because they're victims but because they wish to maintain their white privilege. These women aren't stupid - they know what they're doing and they're doing it knowingly.

And this black woman - who owns her shit and doesn't vote her privilege - is tired of being expected to clean up privileged white women's messes and when I object and point out the ridiculousness of this arrangement, being told by other white women that I'm playing "identity politics" and I should just be more sympathetic to these poor, put-upon, misunderstood white women who continue to use their political and social power to subjugate people who look like me.

[EffieBlack]

79. True dat

[DonCoquixote]

55. it would have been nice

if that same thought was applied when a black or brown person gets caught, but of course, it's wont be

[rainlillie]

59. AMEN!!!

[rainlillie]

26. Maybe some are just awful people who don't have a problem voting for a man accused by over 19

women or a man accused of being a pedophile.

[mythology]

47. You do realize a lot of people here would vote for a guy

With 8 allegations of sexual misconduct right? People let what they want to believe justify all sorts of things. Republicans, Democrats, non-voters.

[EffieBlack]

81. The differences being, among other things ...

Sexual assault is very different than sexual misconduct, the person accused by 19 women of sexual assault admitted on tape to several instances of assault but called all of his accusers crazy liars while at least one of the 8 accusations of misconduct was shaky on its face, the man accused of sexual misconduct treated his accusers with respect and and dignity and asked for a full hearing but was denied any opportunity to defend himself.

Shame on you for suggesting the two situations are even remotely equivalent.

[Yavin4]

53. Aaaaannnddd African American women have a charmed, easy life in America?

They face the same shit that White women do, just more of it. Yet, some how they're able to pull themselves together to vote against Trump and Roy Moore.

[rainlillie]

60. So true. The first thing people have to do is to stop making excuses

for bad choices that impact the lives of others.

[EffieBlack]

71. They also need to stop claiming to be so impressed with black women's political savvy

the day after each election, but then telling us we don't know what the f*ck we're talking about the rest of the year when we try to tell them what's going on.

[rainlillie]

76. LOL! That's true.

We must face the truth and tell the truth.. Even if some are uneasy with that. It's only a reflection on the women who voted for him. Even Cecile Richards spoke out about it.

[EffieBlack]

80. Not only that

We also don’t do the mirror image of what white female Trump supporters do - vote for batshit crazy black people because we feel more “comfortable” with them than we do with th “other.”

Black women (and men, for that matter) consistently vote for white candidates when those candidates are better for our people and the larger community, even when those candidates are running against black candidates. Unlike many white voters, we vote qualifications, not race. That’s why we didn’t line up to vote for Al Sharpton, but instead voted overwhelmingly for Kerry, Edwards and Dean. (Caveat - Sharpton’s neither unqualified nor batshit crazy - we just thought the others were better candidates).

That’s one of the reasons I get sick and tired of hearing white women complain about “holding their noses” to vote for Hillary because voting for “the lesser of two evils” somehow besmirched their purity. Black voters have been holding our noses and voting for the lesser of two evils for decades but we don’t ask the world to give us a damned medal for it. We just do it.

Yes, I’m pissed. Can you tell?

[JI7]

91. they voted for Trump because they are racist, not because they are Abused

[colsohlibgal]

16. No They Dont

As a woman I cannot fathom why other women would vote for that vile creepy guy.

[smirkymonkey]

56. Neither can I. I really can't get my mind around it.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

18. Women are essentially conditioned to act againt their own best interests because

The dynamic of our male-dominated culture still calls for them to be programmed to support, excuse, and defer to men in order to win men's approval, regardless of the repercussions. I don't give women who support Trump a pass, but I do recognize that many of them are conditioned to choose their own debasement over full equality.

[EffieBlack]

29. How have black women managed to escape this dynamic?

I call bullshit on the "white women are so oppressed they can't help themselves from standing by racist white men" justification.

White women vote for racist white men because they think - with good reason - that it's in their interest to do so because they place more value on their whiteness than on their femaleness. Period.

[sheshe2]

40. Bullseye.

Thank you Effie.

[GulfCoast66]

43. Yep. Innocent victims. Its all we mens fault

Sorry but that is just wrong and insulting. I would love to introduce you to my rural, wealthy(now, not 50 years ago), widowed, strong willed aunts and cousins. Many voted for Trump. Many are at heart racist and bigots. Many voted for Hillary. Many are not racist and bigots. Same families, same upbringing and same religion.

These theories that take away free will from women are just silly.

But I am a man. What do I know.

[rainlillie]

67. "These theories that take away free will from women are just silly. "

ITA! have those types in my family too.

[HopeAgain]

32. Okay, so now we are all mad at white women too?

My problem is with people who voted for Trump. Black, white, male, female and Caitlyn Jenner.

This is the definition of identity politics and clickbait, as someone pointed out above.

[EffieBlack]

33. NO - just the 53% who voted for Trump

His second largest voting block after white men.

Yeah, they deserve a little anger.

You may call it “identity politics” - I call it calling it what it is - pointing out that a majority of white women are either happy that or don’t care that a racist is president of the United States.

[kcr]

35. They do deserve every bit of anger they get for it

I just don't understand why The Women's March and other women's movements have to get drug in the mud along with them because I doubt very much Trump voters, even women, give two shits about them. And I have to say it irks me that the largest contingency gets a pass, as usual. They always do. And there's a lot of good, thoughtful and nuanced discussion out there that gets ignored in favor of Huffpo garbage like the OP.

[sheshe2]

41. Not all white women.

[brush]

94. Oh please. No one said "white women". The thread is about white women who voted for the racist,...

sexual predator.

[Anon-C]

36. I agree! -NT

[Yavin4]

46. Trump won the White women vote over a White female candidate who may have been the best qualified

candidate for that office ever. That's a double betrayal.

[Azathoth]

49. The two most rabid Trump supporters I know are women

In general, the male Trump supporters I know are basically mean people who see him as a blunt weapon that helps achieve their already-set agenda (tossing out "illegals", putting the blacks in their place etc.) In other words, they see him as a means to an and. His female supporters, however, seem to support HIM personally. They were already sympathetic to his positions, but they support his policies primarily because HE supports them, not the other way around. If I had to guess, I'd say that the core of his personality cult is majority women.

[EffieBlack]

64. Does anyone believe for a second that the "Trump can grab my p-ssy" t-shirt

would have ever been caught dead in a "Obama (or Carson or Cain) can grab my ..." shirt? Of course not. This had nothing to do with white women being abused by or subjugated to men. It was about white women aligning themselves with white men against "others." Tribalism.

This is nothing new - it's been happening for centuries. The primary reason black folk come in such an array of hues is the systematic rape of black women by white men, usually with full knowledge (and often tacit approval) of their white wives who looked the other way - and were more than willing to reap the benefits of the additional cash-producing merchandise their husbands produced with their black slaves.

And it was many of these same women and their progeny who knew they held power of life and death over virtually any black man in America, and with one pointed finger and three words: "He's the one" (who raped or whistled at or looked at her) could provoke a mob of white men into a bloodthirsty murderous frenzy in defense of her honor.

So, I'm just not feeling a whole lot of pity for modern day white women who continue to line up with their white men to put a modern day racist into the seat of power in the 21st century. They are complicit in racism and evil and I don't need to be told to "understand" them. I already understand them all too well.

[markpkessinger]

54. The article is probably 100% correct, but . . .

. . . do we really think this kind of rhetoric is going to enlighten anyone? Seems to me it is just likely to further alienate, and hence further entrench them in their thinking.

[mvd]

85. You do have a point

It was a slim majority that voted for Trump. I still can't fathom it, though. Trump appeals to the inner racist (sometimes outer) and inner irrationality in some people.

[JI7]

92. i didn't read the article but Trump's "Grab them by the pussy" didn't stop them from voting for him

the only thing that will get them to change would be to stop being racist.

[spicysista]

84. I wish....

The folks responding should really take a few minutes to read the article. It articulates an unhappy point, but one that needs to be seriously discussed. I'm still wondering how Roy Moore was able to get 63% of the white female vote. I mean, really sisters?

[lindysalsagal]

89. It's mindless evangelicals. Seriously. I'm not being insulting.

They like being mindless. Gawd makes it all so simple. They avoid responsibility. Eternal childhood. Always the republicans pander to them. Religion is killing this county.