Mueller not targeting Trump criminally - how do others at DU feel about this?

[GetRidOfThem]

Last edited Wed Apr 4, 2018, 08:12 AM - Edit history (1)

So the latest news is that Mueller reassured Trump's lawyers that Agent Orange is not currently a criminal target of his investigation.

My wife, who is a former Federal Prosecutor, thinks this may be a tactic to keep Mueller from being fired. She emphasizes the word "currently". If she is right, that gives me hope. Otherwise, I find the news discouraging.

How do others here feel?

[NightWatcher]

1. He's investigating him for the crime of Obstruction of Justice

The "currently" part is just semantics.

He's definitely going after trump.

[Adrahil]

2. Keep in mind that...

Last edited Wed Apr 4, 2018, 02:52 PM - Edit history (1)

Generally speaking, "targets" cannot (correction: CAN be but usually are not as a matter of policy) be subpoenaed to testify before a Grand Jury.

I think Mueller wanted to maintain that as an option.

[PatSeg]

3. Oh that's a good point

[Eliot Rosewater]

51. Great point PLUS he will be a target AFTER he is interviewed and lies repeatedly

[SoCalMusicLover]

71. He's Not Going To Interview

Isn't that apparent by now? He's just dragging it out, but in the end he won't go willingly.

He's probably going to defy any subpoena as well, which will delay it even more.

[berni_mccoy]

58. That's not accurate.

https://www.justice.gov/usam/usam-9-11000-grand-jury#9-11.150

A grand jury may properly subpoena a subject or a target of the investigation and question the target about his or her involvement in the crime under investigation.

[Adrahil]

68. Yes, they CAN, but as a matter of practice usually do not as a matter of policy...

At least that's what the former prosecutor on the TeeVee said. But I'm no legal expert.

[uponit7771]

5. I don't see how "I'm a subject of an FBI investigation" is a good thing either !!

[Vinca]

6. I agree with your wife.

Don has to be treated like the psychotic he is. Coddle him, make him think he's safe, then . . . boom . . . charge him. What does your wife think about the notion a sitting president can't be indicted? I don't see why he can't. Suppose Trump pushed Melania off the balcony and killed her. No one would suggest he couldn't be charged with murder because he's a sitting president.

[Still In Wisconsin]

60. Yep... thats what my lawyer friend (former assistant DA) tells me

Make him think he’s in the clear, get him talking then...BAM! Charge him and watch him shit himself.

[oberliner]

7. Trump will not be charged with any crime

[MariaCSR]

10. How do you know?

[oberliner]

17. Just a gut feeling

I think M will present a report to Congress - and it will give them the opportunity to move forward with impeachment if they have the will to do so - but I don't think there will be any criminal charges.

[shanny]

55. Your feelings are correct but not because

of Mueller's unwillingness to confront Trump. It is not settled law (never been put to the test iirc) but it is accepted practice that a sitting president cannot be indicted on a criminal charge: he needs to be impeached (on the basis of the report for example), and removed, and then charged. Or if not impeached, he can be charged when he leaves office.

Some things are not up to Mueller's discretion.

[bigbrother05]

62. Traditions and untested law aside, if Mueller has the evidence, he'll charge

Don't think he would substitute his own judgment if he has the goods. He 'll make Trump fight it in court to quash the indictment, but if the facts/witnesses point to it, his prosecutor instincts will move him to issue the indictment.

This is my opinion based on Mueller's history in law enforcement. If it is only overwhelming circumstantial evidence, he'll stick with charging the others and issue the report to Congress.

[marylandblue]

65. I agree with that, based not only on Mueller

But also on Jaworski and Starr. Both chose not to indict, but believed that they could and had private memos supporting that claim. In Jaworski's case, the grand jury and his own staff tried to push him into it.

In both cases, Office of Legal Counsel issued public memos saying the President could not be indicted, but as these were the only two times OLC issued an opinion, it appears they were political moves to protect the President.

[shanny]

70. Doubt it.

Remember Nixon left office as an "un-indicted co-conspirator" and boy, did they ever have him dead to rights. Not that Ford's pardon didn't successfully obscure that for any to didn't want to believe it.

[CentralMass]

13. I fear that you are right.

[Codeine]

25. I believe that is the most likely outcome.

Trump has to be voted out; Mueller will not do our job for us.

[vi5]

26. You are absolutely correct.

..again, just gut instinct for me as well.

I just think there won't be any "smoking gun", and even though there is more than enough impropriety and ethics violations to fill a small island, Mueller knows that will require Congress to actually do their job, which they won't.

I think he probably also knows that anything short of Trump on video specifically confessing to any crimes, that all of his followers and all Republicans will not believe it anyway and will revolt. Hell, even WITH video of him specifically confessing to or committing a crime most of those morons will still not care and would go nuts.

[blake2012]

37. Oh, its you

[oberliner]

38. Welcome to DU!

What are your thoughts on this? Do you think he will be criminally charged?

[Eliot Rosewater]

52. Congress has to charge rump, the way I understand it and the current congress is

controlled by traitors so no, he probably wont be charged.

But it is good to PUSH BACK against people who say he wont if they are doing that to paint a picture of innocence, since rump is not innocent.

[alfredo]

105. Things could change after the Nov midterms.

If we crush them in Nov we might get enough backing from Republican Senators to have him removed.

[loyalsister]

83. I don't expect he will be

This investigation has been tangled with a lot of players. I think the people who were committed to the goal of electing Trump would likely have gone to great lengths to insulate him from potential charges of criminallity or glaringly obvious impeachment. By glaringly obvious, I mean admission or evidence that is impossible to doubt, blur, or reinterpret in a defense.

[forgotmylogin]

110. We can still hope...

...if he's not indicted that all the machinery supporting him will crash down in flames and he'll never be able to conduct business again, and will remain little more than a snarky paragraph in history books.

[loyalsister]

113. Indeed

It's tough to imagine that he will be remembered well.

[OliverQ]

8. The discouraging news is that Mueller likely will not try to indict

Trump, because he doesn't legally believe you can until after impeachment. But Trump is not going to get impeached thanks to the traitors in the GOP.

Even if we win the House, you still need 67 Senators to remove him which is impossible for us to come anywhere close to.

[PDittie]

41. You'll also need

someone other than Nancy Pelosi as Speaker.

https://www.factcheck.org/2018/03/pelosi-isnt-calling-for-trumps-impeachment/

[mcar]

69. This again?

At the time she said that, she wasn't calling for impeachment. Do you really think that statement is etched in stone?

[leftynyc]

9. I listened carefully to what

was being said and only laughed when I heard both "currently" and "at this time".

[beachbum bob]

11. this is not so untypical with an investigation as once it crosses over to "criminal" it

changes the tone and tactics on both sides. The "criminal" portion is added once all the evidence, testimony has been gathered, then trump and his lawyers will be notified.

[MariaCSR]

12. Link or it didn't happen.

8

[PJMcK]

27. How's this?

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/mueller-trump-not-criminal-target

There's a link in the article to the original Washington Post report. (WaPo has a paywall.)

A little research can fill a lot of gaps.

[democratisphere]

14. No sense rubbing drumpf's nose in it till the last minute.

Mueller's self preservation is paramount to the ongoing investigation. Makes perfect sense; Mueller is brilliant!

[imanamerican63]

15. He(Trump) will have Mueller fired VERY SOON!

[unblock]

16. It's not a tactic. It's a fact.

I don't think he has the option of claiming he's not a target if he actually is a target. Sounds like prosecutorial misconduct to me.

That said, mueller has to go where the facts lead him, and it seems obvious to all of us here that the facts will eventually lead him to indict, or at least to report that there's enough evidence to properly indict.

I figure that there are many other people to indict and he just hasn't gotten to Donnie yet because he's saving that for last.

[Demsrule86]

18. Nice try. But that was not what was said...so I feel great...hope it lulls the orange

fascist into a stupor. He doesn't have enough brains to blow his nose. I sincerely hope the GOP do their duty and get him out before he destroys the economy.

[NurseJackie]

19. I trust that Mueller knows what he doing. He's doing it by-the-book. Methodical. Thorough.

[dlk]

20. After Trump is Impeached, There's Nothing to Stop Criminal Charges Being Filed Against Him

To avoid the divide on whether or not a sitting president can be criminally charged, and a Republican-controlled Senate and House, Muller is playing it smart. His first goal is to get an in-person interview with Trump. Once Trump is on the record, criminal charges can follow. That won't happen if Trump is too afraid to meet with Mueller.

[highplainsdem]

21. See this thread for a better perspective from a former US attorney:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210447643


Read the second point there in particular.

[blueinredohio]

22. I think this is Muellers way of getting Trump in for an interview.

He's smart enough to know once Trump starts talking that's when he'll screw himself.

[triron]

48. Yes this is much more adequate in addressing the original post.

[The_REAL_Ecumenist]

23. For NOW....

The dumbazz is attempting to garner enough energy to lift his prodigious heft an inch off terra firma, believing that he has NOTHING to worry about.. I'm starting to pop the corn to chomp on while watching his ignorant ass turn tomato orange once he figures out that his fat ass is toast...

[sprinkleeninow]

84. Inhahing the delectable aroma of

my buttery corn poppin'. 😋

And hopefully to savor the eventual spectacle of a revolting specimen getting totally humiliated/reduced to impotence.

Every, every day......

[genxlib]

24. I think we are looking at Reagan 2.0

He is surrounded by a pit of vipers that does his dirty work. Some of them will go down for what happened.

Trump will just shrug and say he wasn't aware of any of it. Then when the dust settles, pardon most of them.

What's more, their will be arguments about what is really illegal about parts of this story. They will argue that the Russians were acting on their own and it wasn't illegal to have meetings with them. No need to argue with me. I don't agree, but that is what will happen.

We have seen it often in recent history. Things that are clearly wrong aren't deemed illegal because the laws aren't written to clearly define that level wrongdoing. That is what happens when you have that kind of groundbreaking, leading edge fuckery at work.

It was at work in the 2008 crash when Wall Street was clearly defrauding investors of sub-prime mortgages but lo and behold, look what happens. A few claims of carelessness and unforeseen consequences and everyone walks free. BS.

Here, they will say it isn't illegal to buy legally available information from Facebook and customize false messages to millions of Americans.

Again, no need to argue with me. I don't agree, but that is what will happen.

[fallout87]

35. Unfortunately I agree

[Awsi Dooger]

50. That's always been the likelihood

Regardless of phrasing by Mueller.

Anyone who expects Trump to be forced out of office simply has an incompetent grasp of variables and outcomes.

Always ignore today. That's easily the best advice for anyone who wants to improve predictive skill. If you constantly believe today matters, then every day you are absorbing new details and new focus and making new decisions. It becomes a wash of subjective dizzying mush.

Nobody is that good. Instead of focusing on the signal, per Nate Silver's book, people who allow their opinion and perspective to be up for grabs every day are relying almost exclusively on overblown or irrelevant noise. Rachel Maddow is example A along those lines.

This Mueller stuff is devastating in terms of what happened. In terms of how it will impact Trump, it is nothing but noise. That's been my position all along, and easily formed because I always rely on big picture and never on today. As I've emphasized, Donald Trump is a life long cheater who learned from Roy Cohn very early. Consequently Trump by age 70 has surrounded himself with fellow cheaters who remain loyal to the cheat. None of them will squeal or cave, not to meaningful level.

Trump will emerge from this proclaiming victory over an unfair system that wasted so many years. His devotees will gobble it all up and add more outrage of their own.

[genxlib]

81. Agreed

My opinion had nothing to do with yesterdays news. It is what I have always thought.

I appreciate your take on "ignoring today". That is the right way to look at it. Today is just another data point to add to all the other data points before. If today isn't taken in that context, you will miss the big picture.

I don't believe Trump will be forced from office. Not because he doesn't deserve to be but because his party is too craven to do the right thing. I do predict that he will decide not to run for re-election though. He will declare victory and claim he has nothing left to accomplish but really he will just be afraid of losing.

[PRETZEL]

28. Was listening to Chris Hayes last nite

and he had Renato Marioti on who agreed with the basically what your wife mentioned. He also emphasized the term "currently" and also mentioned that that could change virtually overnite.

I also think that if Mueller only limited this statement as it pertained to the obstruction charge is also significant. I hope and tend to believe that since this investigation has many tentacles that Mueller didn't mention in his statement leads me to believe that Trump may still be a subject in those as well but Mueller isn't ready to make that statement just yet.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

29. Just because he hasn't yet doesn't mean he won't.

From what I've learned from obsessively watching MSNBC and reading various knowledgeable Twitter feeds, anyway.

[LuckyCharms]

30. This post is how I feel about it:

https://upload.democraticunderground.com/100210447677

[MontanaMama]

36. That made me feel better.

Hope it isn’t wishful thinking. 😖

[GetRidOfThem]

42. Agree n/t

[Hawaii Hiker]

31. I can't imagine Mueller's team being put together to only come up

with minor or no charges....Just doesn't make sense IMO..

http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2018/politics/meet-the-mueller-team/

[fallout87]

34. He already has 4 indictments

as well as the dozen charges against the Russians to pack up and claim it was worth the money.

[kentuck]

32. "Agent Orange"?!

That's a good one!

[GetRidOfThem]

43. It...

It has been Agent Orange with me from the beginning, as it started campaigning! First name I could come up with (there are many more, but I'll stick to this one....)

[fallout87]

33. I feel like we need to prepare for defeating Cheeto in 2020

Mueller is not going to save us. Sure, this report doesn't mean Trump is in the clear, but it is very worrisome. If he hasn't found evidence in the past year sufficient to make Trump a criminal target, it's unlikely anything will be revealed now.

[anneboleyn]

49. I really doubt that your take is correct, as this is a matter that will require some of the most

intensive and documented work in American prosecutorial history. The implications for the country are massive. This is about a sitting U.S. president and his involvement (yes, I know, alleged) with a hostile foreign gov to manipulate a presidential election, to cover up god knows what while he kisses Putin’s ass constantly in front of the entire world, and the (alleged) continued bad behavior after the election.

We have never dealt with something of this magnitude; its implications for our country, our electoral process, our fbi and national security matters, are absolutely massive. Mueller is fully aware of just how serious the investigation is for the country. He is already very meticulous and very steady, and he will be extraordinarily careful in this matter since it could be world-changing. Seriously.

The huffing and puffing over the idea that a year has gone by so there must not be anything, especially when we have a prez who lies openly to confuse matters and long trails of corruption in the case of people like Manafort, which take a long time to untangle, seems to be short-sighted to me. The griping over “it’s been a YEEAAAR!” has become a right-wing mantra on Fox News (even though the Clinton investigation went on for years and stumbled over the perjury/Lewinsky situation). When the issue is one of this magnitude and involving so many people and so many different levels of involvement by these people — well, it’s going to take time. Also, the police/prosecutors etc use the expression that a person isn’t CURRENTLY a target for many deliberate reasons. And yes they certainly use it even when they anticipate charging someone later with a crime.

[fallout87]

89. But What evidence is there of collusion?

Something should have leaked by now. If not before the inauguration, at least afterward when there were still Obama admin working in the FBI/NSA/CIA.....It's completely possible that the russian just wanted to mess with our democracy (mission accomplished) and there may be no smoking gun tying Trump himself to it.

I would love to wake up one day and read that cheeto is going to prison. But I'm coming to grips with the fact that it just might now happen.

[kentuck]

92. I'm almost certain that Mueller's team has information we don't know about...

Just a hunch.

[tazkcmo]

108. And much of it

Comes from classified sources like wiretaps that reporters, pundits and the citizenry are not privy to.

[shanny]

61. Investigating a third-rate burglary took two years.

[fallout87]

90. Yes

But I think Mueller has more integrity than Starr....

Plus, Rosenstien sent a memo to Mueller that limited his scope.

[shanny]

95. Third-rate burglary wasn't Starr and Whitewater, it was Watergate.

But I agree, Mueller has LOTS more integrity than Starr then or Republicans now could ever dream of. This seems like it is taking a lot of time, but given the number of facets and players I think it is both very focused and moving ahead at warp speed.

Also, the memo Rosenstein sent expanded Mueller's scope to explicitly include Manafort...and anything that arises from there.

[PubliusEnigma]

39. I feel your concern is unwarranted.

[CanonRay]

40. Meaninglesss

he can become a target at any moment Mueller decides it is so.

[Paladin]

44. Keeping trump optimistic, stupid and reckless is a shrewd legal tactic.

I think Mueller is playing things just right at this point. When has trump failed to live down to our expectations? He's toast.

[octoberlib]

45. If the source for WaPo's story is a Trump lawyer, I don't believe a word of it. I think the

source was probably Ty Cobb as he was quoted in the article (Mueller's spokesman declined to comment). Trump's lawyer also said that Mueller's team told him the investigation would be finished by December of last year. It's all bullshit.

[ooky]

46. I think the news that he is a subject in a criminal probe

is as much as we could have realistically hoped for - for a sitting President - who supposedly "can't be indicted". So this is the next best finding. To me its the first confirmation from the special counsel Spanky is definitely linked to criminal activity and Mueller is maneuvering to make it stick.

[D23MIURG23]

47. IMO it's an indication that he's not likely to indict trump.

The precedent at the justice department is that sitting presidents are not indictable, and old, conservative prosecutors like Mueller like precedent, and don't challenge it lightly. This means whatever he thinks about the evidence against trump he is free to honestly call him a "subject" instead of a "target".

That doesn't mean he won't comment that there would be enough evidence of obstruction to indict trump under different circumstances, and refer that evidence to congress for action.

[Dawson Leery]

53. Mueller has to be careful to not go directly against Trump.

That would ensure he is fired before the investigation is complete.

[MFM008]

57. Exactly

Leaving things vague, make maggot feel safer ,
Maybe even confident...get that interview....
Snap.
The giant orange vermin is caught in the trap.
A report so devastating the republicans cant ignore
It / or
The gop gets wiped out in November and
We democrats wont need much persuasion
To impeach that MFer.
........................

[Gothmog]

54. Being a subject is still very serious

One can move from being a subject to being a target in a heart beat

[tblue37]

56. Emphasis added:

"Special counsel Robert S. Mueller III informed President Trump’s attorneys last month that he is continuing to investigate the president but does not consider him a criminal target at this point. . . ."

More:

"In private negotiations in early March about a possible presidential interview, Mueller described Trump as a subject of his investigation into Russia’s interference in the 2016 election. Prosecutors view someone as a subject when that person has engaged in conduct that is under investigation but there is not sufficient evidence to bring charges."

He is collecting that evidence. He knows that when you go at the "king," you have to make sure to strike true, because you don't get a second chance.

[Hekate]

59. Dentist: I am not pulling your tooth at this time. Patient: Whoopie! Tooth is great! Dentist: ...

Dentist: Make an appointment for next week.
Dentist to hygienist: That guy has a really nasty abcess. I ned to figure out the best way to do the root canal...

There is at least one retired professional who says that if Mueller used that kind of language about him, under the circumstances he'd be wetting his pants.

[Blue_Tires]

63. Just like before, the unspoken implication is "Not targeting Trump *YET*"

[matt819]

64. You know what?

I'm gonna bet that Mueller has all this wired and so I'm gonna leave all this in his able hands.

[Abu Pepe]

66. Lawyers, such as your wife, use precise language.

A "target" in a federal criminal case receives a target letter I believe. Not sure. Ask your wife.

[wishstar]

67. He wouldn't officially be a target until Spec. Counsel brings case for indictment to Grand Jury

so my takeaway is simply that SC is still gathering evidence from witnesses and subpoenas of documents before they decide to go to Grand Jury for further indictments. He is definitely not in the clear. His lawyers are entitled to know his legal status in order to advise him about interviewing and they apparently asked for a timeline causing SC to indicate June-July as possible conclusion of obstruction part of investigation and issuance of a report.

I think it sends a clear message to Trump to avoid any further attempts to obstruct or he could suddenly become a criminal target and it signals that Mueller has months to go before finishing the probe, so Trump cannot expect to be cleared anytime soon.

[doc03]

73. I think they are setting things up to

not charge tRump with anything.

[kentuck]

74. I think this is "fake" news created by the White House...

...leaked to the reporters of the Washington Post in an attempt to get Mueller to respond. He has not, thus far.

[triron]

75. Just curious but who is the source of the Post article's assertions about Trump?

[pnwmom]

77. Multiple anonymous sources. But it's not hard to believe. What they are saying

is that DT himself is under grand jury investigation.

He's not just a witness. He is a subject, under investigation himself. And from that position he could easily move to become a target -- or possibly he already has, since the reported discussions were a month ago.

[triron]

86. Thanks.

[kentuck]

88. My guess would be Sekulow?

As advised by Donald J Trump.

Did anyone on Mueller's team confirm the story?

[tazkcmo]

76. Yet. n/t

[klook]

102. Yep. (nt)

[Cary]

78. Let Mueller do his job

We don't know. We aren't supposed to know. So why speculate?

[Binkie The Clown]

79. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say Mueller knows what he's doing. nt

[Snackshack]

80. The distance between...

Currently not considered a “criminal target” to being a “criminal target” is about this much _ so I am not fretting over Mr. Mueller’s announcement.

I read today that trump has changed his mind and decided not to sit down with Mr. Mueller for an interview. I certainly hope that is not true. Trump should absolutely sit down with Mr. Mueller to explain his side of the story...certainly that would clear up everything... 😉

[underthematrix]

82. This post is FALSE

Reading comprehension is supposed o be a basic skill.

The report was that Trump aka LilStumpy is NOT a target of the Special Counsel's criminal investigation. His status as a subject versus a target seems to relate specifically to the obstruction of justice issue. There was some indication although slight that Mueller is also looking at abuse of power.

There was no mention of the counterintelligence investigation.

[0rganism]

85. not a big deal... yet

saying he's "not a target" means he can be called to testify before a grand jury, at which point his severe tendency to bullshit will very much make him a "target" one way or another

[kentuck]

87. I do not believe the WH would have kept the story secret for that long...

...if Mueller had told them that he was no "target" in a criminal investigation.

It doesn't add up.

I think this story was created by Sekulow and Trump and they wanted to set a deadline of June or July to end this investigation and if Rosenstein or anyone else disputed their version, they would be fired.

I do not believe Mueller or his team said any such thing to Trump's lawyers. This was a scam dreamed up by the White House.

[Oneironaut]

91. Muellers job is not to oust Trump. It is to investigate crimes.

Keep in mind that, even if it’s proven that Trump did something wrong, it’s very unlikely he will be removed from office.

Trump will be in office for at least 4 years. We need to focus on this year’s election.

[Azathoth]

93. Mueller *can't* target Trump

Forget about the man-baby's "red lines." The position of the DOJ is that a sitting president can't be indicted. If Mueller were to attempt to indict Trump, that could be used as proof that he is a renegade who is flouting DOJ policy -- which would establish legitimate grounds for Rosenstein to remove him.

For all practical purposes, there was never a chance that Trump would be a "target" of the investigation. However, a prosecutor doesn't write a report about your actions unless you are the focus of an investigation. So it's really a word game on Mueller's part. Trump is being targeted, but not for prosecution.

This investigation was ALWAYS going to end in 1) prosecutions of Trump's associates and 2) a detailed report about the criminal behavior of Trump himself. Whether that report lays the foundation for impeachment, or whether it forces the DOJ to reconsider their position on indicting a sitting president, or whether it sparks mass revolt, or whether the GOP simply throws it in the trash and forgets about it, is not up to Mueller to decide.

[kentuck]

94. If the high crimes and misdemeanors are absolutely terrible...

...then they might think about impeachment? Not that they would ever impeach, but they would probably think about it...

[Stuart G]

96. Whatever the headline is, Mueller will somhow get Trump..

He may not be "targeting" him "criminally" but if Trump is behind all of this, if he is the "mastermind" or boss of this, then Mueller will get him somehow and someway. I don't know. Perhaps Mueller will set up a situation that demands impeachment. Perhaps something else. Perhaps Muller is "targeting" someone else "criminally" and that person will in the end squeal on Trump to save his/her own ass.

I will say it again...Mueller will set up a situation where Trump is "toasted" "burned" "resigned" or "impeached." Trump may not go quietly...after he is gone...like Nixon, but Mueller will somehow set up a situation where Trump is gone.

[kentuck]

98. I think it is a likely scenario...

...that Mueller will have such damning evidence that it will be difficult to ignore impeachment. It will be hard for even McConnell to sweep under the rug.

I could envision this scenario.

[Lil Missy]

97. BREAKING NEWS. Trump is now under CRIMINAL investigation!

Just heard it on MSNBC

[Dream Girl]

101. Not breaking, this is from yesterday...

[Lil Missy]

111. Yesterday he was a "target", today he was a "criminal"

[Dream Girl]

112. Not a criminal target - a subject of a criminal investigation

[Honeycombe8]

99. Whatever the evidence is, it is. The investigation is wrapping up.

I feel disappointed that after looking at a mountain of evidence...no Trump criminal behavior has been detected to a sufficient level for him to be looked at for criminal indictment.

It may be a tactic, but the bottom line is...there isn't enough evidence for "you're not a criminal target" to NOT be true, since Mueller is truthful; his credibility is what got him this gig.

I'm not overly hopeful. But there may be obstruction of justice, which Mueller may not be lumping in with "criminal" behavior.

There's not much time left, if what I heard is right. The report will be submitted to Rosenstein in June. Only two months. There's more to do, but the investigation is close to concluding. The documents have been reviewed and analyzed, discussions held, all the evidence analyzed and matched with criminal behavior, indictments filed.

Say good night, Gracie. Well, not just yet. Almost.

[mnmoderatedem]

100. you forgot the key word.

not targeted YET.

[Hoyt]

103. Might change, but not a good sign if they haven't found damning evidence yet.

[JNelson6563]

104. According to all the lawyers weighing in

That is the natural order of things.

[alfredo]

106. Three words

At this time. They are the turd in Trump’s punch bowl

[WhiteTara]

107. Mueller bought himself another month.

[SomethingNew]

109. I'm not so sure we want to see Mueller try to indict Trump.

I really hope no evidence that Trump was involved in the collusion exists (in that I hope he actually wasn't involved). I fear for the future of our democracy if we set up a showdown between the branches of government like that.

IMO, the best case scenario is to take back the House and make some progress in the Senate in November. That should keep things from going completly off the track for two more years. Then keep the momentum going for a complete victory in 2020. Resolve this democratically and then, hmm hopefully, indict Trump for obstruction after he leaves office.

[GetRidOfThem]

114. I beg to differ - I am impatient

I want him to go down. I want Mueller to find stuff and nail him for it.

I don't want law and order politicized and relativized. I want the law to come down on Trump & hit him hard.

He has survived on a "soft way out", I want not more "soft way out"s for him.