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PJMcK

(22,035 posts)
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:36 PM May 2018

A thought-provoking idea

The evidence has been extremely strong that the Russian government was actively involved in our 2016 elections. They sought to damage Hillary Clinton and assist Trump. Their accomplishments were remarkable and probably beyond their expectations. It would be naive to think that it won't happen again.

As this interference has become public knowledge, there is an understandable outrage from many Americans. How can we let the Russians mess with our elections?! So, we have the Mueller investigation, Congressional investigations and many journalists reporting what can be discovered about this intrusion into our democratic system.

And yet...

The United States has interfered in other countries' political and economic systems for more than a hundred years. Consider our government's actions in Chile, Iran, Iraq, Venezuela and other sovereign nations. In our names, the government has skewed elections, assassinated political foes and installed authoritarian rulers in order to dominate those countries' regions and resources.

I'm a life-long Democrat and a proud American. I vote and I pay my taxes. I volunteer and give to charities. I try to contribute to my community.

And yet, I find it pretty rich that we're outraged that another nation would interfere with our elections. It's just another of the many lessons we've taught the rest of the world.

12 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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A thought-provoking idea (Original Post) PJMcK May 2018 OP
That's rich to you? Crutchez_CuiBono May 2018 #1
The history of the CIA's activities in other countries is well known PJMcK May 2018 #6
I know what you were saying.. Crutchez_CuiBono May 2018 #8
What's rich is that we are trying to normalize it now ck4829 May 2018 #2
Exactly! PJMcK May 2018 #4
Not going to normalize this shit uponit7771 May 2018 #3
Many in the rest of the world have been discussing this malaise May 2018 #5
My OP was inspired by a conversation with a friend in Ireland PJMcK May 2018 #9
Yep malaise May 2018 #11
... mcar May 2018 #7
I'm not sure what you mean PJMcK May 2018 #10
The issue is Trump/Republican collusion with Russia. OneBro May 2018 #12

Crutchez_CuiBono

(7,725 posts)
1. That's rich to you?
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:43 PM
May 2018

Hang around a little bit. Methinks shits about to get real..real fast. What evidence have you that we've interfered? And precisely, why would that be any shade of justification for what happened to us?

PJMcK

(22,035 posts)
6. The history of the CIA's activities in other countries is well known
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:50 PM
May 2018

Importantly, I was asking why would we be exempt from foreign interference?

If our government took similar actions in other countries, our outrage is a bit hypocritical.

Crutchez_CuiBono

(7,725 posts)
8. I know what you were saying..
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:52 PM
May 2018

you sounded like dt on the campaign trail. Touched a nerve. You take care.

ck4829

(35,069 posts)
2. What's rich is that we are trying to normalize it now
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:44 PM
May 2018

"Every country does it now."

No it doesn't have to be OK - Pinochet was a pedophile abetting monster. I didn't vote for him to be dictator of Chile in any way.

The Putinist regime has murdered their own people and skewed elections in their own country - It's not Sweden or Denmark interfering in our country's politics. If every country does why is it the country that has a government-by-mob doing it today and not the countries with universal healthcare that actually gives a hoot about their own populace?

How many Ryazan situations do we have?
How many should we have?

How many Alexander Litvinenko people do we have?
How many should we have?

How many Beslan school crises do we have?
How many should we have?

How many Sergei Magnitsky people do we have?
How many should we have?

PJMcK

(22,035 posts)
4. Exactly!
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:47 PM
May 2018

If Trump were as smart as Putin, we'd be in even deeper trouble than we are now. Additionally, and thankfully, some of our fundamental government institutions are holding our Republic together inspire of Trump's chaos.

I can see a possible future where the breath of the corruption that is within our governments is exposed and eradicated. I'm an optimist.

PJMcK

(22,035 posts)
9. My OP was inspired by a conversation with a friend in Ireland
Wed May 16, 2018, 08:53 PM
May 2018

She shared the idea that Americans have a sense of exceptionalism that most of the rest of the world doesn't recognize; they simply tolerate our self-important posture.

malaise

(268,968 posts)
11. Yep
Wed May 16, 2018, 09:10 PM
May 2018

Americans don't realize that much of what the RWs are doing at home these days was practiced and perfected overseas by both parties.

OneBro

(1,159 posts)
12. The issue is Trump/Republican collusion with Russia.
Wed May 16, 2018, 09:13 PM
May 2018

True, the US has a long history of putting dictators in power in foreign lands, but our outrage comes from the traitorous ratfucking Republicans and Trump who worked with Russia to undermine the integrity of our elections and to ultimately alienate us from our allies.

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