Thu May 17, 2018, 04:31 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
We cannot let Trump become worse than Bush.
Of course, there’s still time, but with Bush we had:
- The Iraq War, which killed millions of people - Mercenaries running around shooting people in New Orleans. The President’s mother felt that they were better off this way. - High profile Liberals being blackballed from their positions because they only disagreed with the Iraq War. You were either “with them or against them,” and free thought was heavily discouraged in favor of rigorously-enforced group-think. - The media was totally in the tank for Bush, and made its mission spouting cartoonish patriotic platitudes while negatively stereotyping all Liberals. - The oxymoronic “Patriot Act” - “Mission Accomplished” - Dick Cheney and his thirst for never-ending war - An administration that would have invaded Iran next, had there not been such war weariness - The prospect of gay marriage looked bleak - Gay people were literally not allowed in our military. They had to keep quiet, almost like criminals - A bunch of other stuff that was equally as terrible. Too many things to list. I know it’s only been over a year, but we will get through this. Not to minimize Trump, but we’ve gone through this and worse before. Now is not the time to fight over petty issues (not that you can’t make your opinion known!) - a united front will minimize the damage Trump and his cronies can do. We came so far in 8 years, but we’re falling into the abyss again. I’m confident we can get through this, but we need to start rallying now. It’s already 2018!
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29 replies, 5183 views
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Author | Time | Post |
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Oneironaut | May 2018 | OP |
bettyellen | May 2018 | #1 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #5 | |
bettyellen | May 2018 | #10 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #15 | |
bettyellen | May 2018 | #18 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #21 | |
bettyellen | May 2018 | #25 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #28 | |
bettyellen | May 2018 | #29 | |
EffieBlack | May 2018 | #2 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #6 | |
beachbum bob | May 2018 | #3 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #4 | |
unblock | May 2018 | #8 | |
smirkymonkey | May 2018 | #22 | |
unblock | May 2018 | #7 | |
Hoyt | May 2018 | #9 | |
grantcart | May 2018 | #11 | |
LastLiberal in PalmSprings | May 2018 | #19 | |
apnu | May 2018 | #12 | |
smirkymonkey | May 2018 | #23 | |
elleng | May 2018 | #13 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #16 | |
nini | May 2018 | #14 | |
Oneironaut | May 2018 | #17 | |
northremembers | May 2018 | #24 | |
MariaCSR | May 2018 | #20 | |
The Velveteen Ocelot | May 2018 | #26 | |
Clarity2 | May 2018 | #27 |
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:33 PM
bettyellen (47,209 posts)
1. If you're not a woman. Or POC maybe. But to the Dem base, he's horrid.
Sick of hearing he’s not so bad from people exempted from his hatred.
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Response to bettyellen (Reply #1)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:38 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
5. Good thing I never said Trump is "not so bad."
He can easily become much worse than Bush. We can’t let it get to that point.
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Response to Oneironaut (Reply #5)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:47 PM
bettyellen (47,209 posts)
10. He already is, if you're a woman losing her rights or a life endangered
POC. There’s nothing like losing your liberty and safety being ignored because.... why is that? Oh yeah, not your problem.
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Response to bettyellen (Reply #10)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:55 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
15. I'm LGBT, so I would probably be first in line for the Pence express.
A little over the top, perhaps, but Pence looks like he’s in a perpetual state of bloodlust. It’s those eyes...
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Response to Oneironaut (Reply #15)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:06 PM
bettyellen (47,209 posts)
18. Is this a comment on Trump? He hasn't had any success harming LGBT but please do go on. When you
the hate speech coming directly out of the Oval Office give me a call. Pence my patootey.
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Response to bettyellen (Reply #18)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:26 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
21. You're right. He has only been making transpeople his punching bag since he first started.
You might want to read this if you’re serious:
https://www.vox.com/identities/2018/1/22/16905658/trump-lgbtq-anniversary I truly hope you are not being serious, or maybe just forgot. |
Response to Oneironaut (Reply #21)
Thu May 17, 2018, 06:02 PM
bettyellen (47,209 posts)
25. He's not caused nearly the huge denial of reproductive rights or endangered LBGT citizens with hate
speech. As the article you cited notes, most of his actions have had no success and he never demonizes them as he does POC. Women are having their rights to their physical bodies taken away and you’ve suffered nothing remotely comparable.
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Response to bettyellen (Reply #25)
Thu May 17, 2018, 06:36 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
28. No offense, but that's absurd. There is an ongoing campaign to ban transgender people from
the military, and deny them access to public bathrooms. Don’t kid yourself - both fights aren’t over.
Furthermore, I have no desire to get into a “he demonizes us more!” debate. That’s the high of absurdity. None of it is ok, and all of it is vile. Please understand that Trump has been an absolute disaster for LGBT rights - especially for transpeople. I’m happy Trump has had astounding failures in trying to oppress the LGBT community, but he’s had some success as well. The worst part is both his normalization of hate and support for candidates who want to erase us as human beings. It doesn’t matter if he failed - the psychological impact should not be ignored. It is as commonplace for the LGBT community to be lectured by others on why their problems aren’t real as it is for women to be lectured on how their problems aren’t real. |
Response to Oneironaut (Reply #28)
Thu May 17, 2018, 06:41 PM
bettyellen (47,209 posts)
29. His normalization of hate has been completely directed at others.
As the article you cited says, he’s kept his trap shut about LGBT. And the pols he supports? Same shit as every other GOPer I’m afraid.
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Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:34 PM
EffieBlack (14,249 posts)
2. Um, no.
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:36 PM
beachbum bob (10,437 posts)
3. Bush did not dissemble America...he did horrid things but trump is
10x worse
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Response to beachbum bob (Reply #3)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:37 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
4. Time will tell, I suppose
Hope we don’t let it get that that point
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Response to beachbum bob (Reply #3)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:44 PM
unblock (51,194 posts)
8. he lied us into war!
and he lied about the tax cut and the budget, claiming a surplus would be damaging and claiming we had more than enough for the tax cut and plenty left over. all lies.
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Response to beachbum bob (Reply #3)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:28 PM
smirkymonkey (63,221 posts)
22. I agree. Trump is already 10x worse and he has only been in office a year
and a half.
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Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:43 PM
unblock (51,194 posts)
7. hmm, a pile of damp, decaying dead skunks; or a giant vat of bodily waste and sewage in the hot sun?
which smells worst?
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Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:46 PM
Hoyt (54,770 posts)
9. trump is much worse. bush's warmongering was deplorable, but he didn't deport immigrants and
he did not stand in the way of the Medicare drug program which is probably the biggest positive change in Medicare in 3 decades. Prior to that, the elderly had no Medicare coverage for prescription drugs.
So bush did accomplish a few things. Other than the war and 9/11, bush's biggest problem was missed opportunities, including not heading off the big recession. trump is much worse. |
Response to Hoyt (Reply #9)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:48 PM
grantcart (52,533 posts)
11. can you imagine if 9/11 happened under Trump
We would be dropping nuclear bombs within 72 hours Trump is 10 times worse than Bush |
Response to grantcart (Reply #11)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:18 PM
LastLiberal in PalmSprings (12,239 posts)
19. Thanks. Now I've got something else to lose sleep over.
You think Donnie Two Scoops wants to be a dictator like the strong men he so admires? Give him an excuse -- any excuse -- to suspend the rule of law and institute martial law and he'll be Leader for Life. Fortunately, with all the Big Macs and KFC he eats, that won't be too long, but still...
I'm in the LIHOP camp as far as 9-11 is concerned, but if something similar happened now I'd definitely be among the MIHOP believers. |
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:51 PM
apnu (8,646 posts)
12. Sorry Mate he already is.
And we aren't at the Midterms.
His drone killing is up 500% His policies are 1000% more regressive than any of W's wet dreams The bullshit out of his mouth, DAILY, is more than "Mission Accomplished" He's got Bolton the next generation Cheney He's a racist, something, oddly, W was not. Every minority, not just GLBTQ, is living in fear for their lives, double if you are GLBTQ and not white. He attacks the media on a daily basis. He's running an active (if poor) propaganda campaign that's exactly from the Nazi play book. He attacks the judiciary daily He is openly taking millions in bribes (See all the Cohen and Mnunchin stuff) He is openly profiting from the Oval Office by moving official US business and functions to his private hotels and resorts, to say nothing about using the power of the office to enrich himself and his children. Trump is past our worst W nightmares. W is Mr. Rogers nice by comparison. |
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:53 PM
elleng (121,899 posts)
13. He already has,
in ways, of course, we'd never imagined, especially the effect on Americans.
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Response to elleng (Reply #13)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:57 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
16. True. I feel like it's the Odyssey, where you dodge one monster, only to land on another's island.
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 04:53 PM
nini (16,608 posts)
14. I don't remember W conspiring with a foreign hostile govt to dismantle our democracy
I'm not so sure we've dealt with a crisis like this before which is magnified because of a congress who is just as bad.
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Response to nini (Reply #14)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:00 PM
Oneironaut (4,496 posts)
17. He was just dumb enough to destroy us from within.
Clinton left the US a massive juggernaut. Now, the termites are feasting.
I agree, though, that Trump is a truly unique crisis. |
Response to nini (Reply #14)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:58 PM
northremembers (63 posts)
24. It's hard to say
W was the one who said, "I have looked into Putin's eyes and seen my own soul." Bush let Bin Laden get away and used Al Qaida as an excuse to cut taxes, deregulate Wall Street, deregulate fracking, bailout Enron (that one didn't go so well), and invade Iraq. I might be more inclined to say they all suck (Trump, Bush I, Bush II, Reagan, and Nixon). I would not agree with the idea that the Republicans now are so much worse than the Republicans then. They were right about ending slavery. They've been the bad guys ever since.
I look at it as the Republicans are going to do a lot of damage. We can slow them down, but we are going to have to rebuild our democracy which was already on the ropes before Trump, thanks to the last 24 years of Republican scorched earth politics. Whatever agencies he closes we have to replace them with new ones geared towards the goals we set for our country. Whatever freedoms he abolishes we have to replace them with more inclusive ones. We know the Republicans will never be partners and will do everything they can to hold us back. That's all they ever did. We still got social security, legal labor unions, victory over fascism, NATO, the UN, the moon landing, and gay rights. This is only the end if we don't look forward. |
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 05:20 PM
MariaCSR (642 posts)
20. He's already worse than Bush.
Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 06:05 PM
The Velveteen Ocelot (105,684 posts)
26. He's already worse. This is not a defense of Bush, but
Trump has done much more to undermine the foundations of our government than Bush ever even thought of. Bush abused the government but Trump is destroying it.
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Response to Oneironaut (Original post)
Thu May 17, 2018, 06:23 PM
Clarity2 (1,009 posts)
27. Seriously?
Trump is an asset for a hostile government that hacked our election.
He is a money laundering mobster who would pull a coup if he could get away with it, who would attempt to rig the election again at any cost...argh, I could go on, but that should be enough of a comparison. |