Oh my:Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez kicks off 1st day of freshmen orientation w protest ⁦@Pelosi⁩'s office

[hlthe2b]

I like Ocasio-Cortez, but heavens... I can't help but be incensed that she, so overtly kicks those who led the way for her and other women--in the face

Link to tweet

[Corvo Bianco]

1. She has so many things going for her..

God grant her wisdom quickly

[hlthe2b]

2. I fear her own success has "gone to her head" in an unfortunately self-destructive manner

[unitedwethrive]

37. That is the sense I got from recent interviews with her.

It’s as if she does not realize that being a congress member is not all powerful. It is designed to be a cooperative venture.

[Hortensis]

67. Yes. It may be that she is not suited to cooperative ventures,

working for change from within as part of a team instead of from outside. And still being very young, if it were the case, she might not understand that about herself yet.

Notably, although she did work for Sanders' campaign and became one of his young people encouraged to run for congress, her primary victory was something of an accident, with only a total of 5% of her district voting, 11% I think of Democratic voters.

Or she could just be a slow learner with an ardent soul. As Corvo so kindly wished, "God grant her wisdom quickly," because it's starting to look as if god's help really could be required.

[PatSeg]

186. That's the impression

I got awhile back. She is young and inexperienced, and her behavior often appears impulsive. Nancy Pelosi is a leader for good reason. Alexandra might want to step back, take a breath, and access the situation. She has a lot to contribute, but being a member of congress is a collaborative position. Making an enemy of a Democratic leader will do nothing to solve the many problems we have right now.

In politics, someone can go from being a media darling in the spotlight to yesterday's news where no one even remembers your name.

[kstewart33]

271. Alexandra has a great deal to learn.

The first lession - your effectiveness in Congress depends on the committee membership(s) you obtain.

Nancy Pelosi determines that.

She needs to stop grandstanding, keep a very low profile, write a private note of apology to Pelosi, and hope she gets decent assignments.

[Turbineguy]

301. Washingtonitis.

[Baitball Blogger]

16. LOL.

[Honeycombe8]

293. That's not a protest. It's just a group of people to meet w/Pelosi...

to get an assurance or commitment on climate change. There's nothing to protest, since the Democrats take the same position on climate change that the group of people does, and always has. OAC isn't protesting, either.

I'm thinking some of those people are from OAC's district, or climate change is one of OAC's big issues, so she just met with them to encourage their involvement.

There are always groups of people in the hallways to meet with reps, aren't there? This doesn't seem like a big deal to me, except that it would be best for a freshman rep to lie low on orientation day, IMO. It's best to be a wallflower until you know the lay of the land.

This doesn't seem like a big deal at all. I think it was just how the tweet characterizes this that got people worked up.

[DURHAM D]

3. She is a performance artist and

doesn't know who the enemy is.

[Bleacher Creature]

184. This is spot on.

She's a member of Congress (or about to be one). If she has issues with Pelosi she can raise them directly with her. This is just grandstanding and only feeds into the "Democrats are in disarray" bullshit.

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

319. Yeah, she needs to be a team player to be effective.

Hopefully she learns that soon. It would have been better to just have a conversation with Pelosi. These are people she is supposed to be working with now. She needs to show some respect, especially considering she is new and Pelosi has done many terms.

[Brainstormy]

4. Good grief!

a little disappointed in this. Time will tell, I guess.

[Wounded Bear]

5. Playing to her base...

which, I suspect, is not the majority of Democrats.

[WillowTree]

176. Ms Pelosi plays for keeps.

I can't help but wonder how that "base" likes it when their hero gets frozen out to a large extent.

[George II]

228. Inasmuch as the election was barely a week ago in a heavily Democratic district, the "base".....

....is probably as yet undefined.

[a kennedy]

6. Can blame it on her being the youngest........

Someone just needs to quietly whisper in her ear........shhhhhhhhhh

[DFW]

65. Hardly.

There has ALWAYS been a youngest new member. They do not pull stunts like that.

[George II]

200. That's polite.

[UTUSN]

7. My "liking" has pretty much worn off.

[vlyons]

8. Some people just have to learn things the hard way

To pull the levers of power, one has to actually be close to them. Pelosi is a master at keeping discipline. It will be interesting to see what she does with Ocasio-Cortez.

[GemDigger]

9. The new peeps going in thinking they know it all is going to NOT get them very far.

Learn YOUR job first, then move onto bigger and better things.

[MrsCoffee]

10. Well, I tried to like her. But that's over. Good luck with that Ms. Ocasio-Cortez.

[workinclasszero]

112. I tried too...thought she was great when Fox made fun of her lack of money

But now she takes a shit in her own damn nest!

I'm out!

[FSogol]

11. I'm guessing she's going to hate her committee assignments. n/t

[Small-Axe]

33. What's so wrong with being on the Joint Committee on the Library and the Joint Committee on Printing

[TeamPooka]

165. Lol

[FarPoint]

254. Yea...it will be in the basement or...

lunch room....

[OnDoutside]

12. Not gone down well on that thread

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[hlthe2b]

15. If there is anyone in her inner circle that can sit her down with some common sense...

NOW is the time. She is manifesting an arrogance that approaches some on the other side.

[Bfd]

47. That's why she is there. "Fresh Face" they call it, I think.

Like omg, ya know, "Sarandon's fresh face of L'Oreal!

Ss is still giddy of the coming revolution, but ya know that revolution won't happen if not for the strength of the Powerhouse Democrats ready to sit at the top of ending the reign of Trump's destruction.

Gee, thanks Democrats!!

Pelosi, Feinstein, Schiff, Swalwell, Harris, Cummings, Klobuchar & the rest of our finest Democrats taking the House on Jan 3rd, 2019.

[Cha]

246. Thanks for those tweets, OnDoutside..

Link to tweet

[melman]

251. What is it about that particular tweet you like?

Please do tell. I mean, as far as I can see what it's doing is trashing a Democratic representative. How is this good?

[Generic Brad]

329. Trashing a Democratic representative because she trashed a Democratic representative?

My head is spinning.

[melman]

330. What?

AOC didn't trash anyone if that's what you're saying. But maybe it's not. No idea what you're getting at.

[FSogol]

256. Oh my. Thanks for posting. n/t

[Maru Kitteh]

13. If she wants to be the Ted Cruz of the left, she's on the right track here.

What a damn tragedy, because she has great promise if she doesn't BLOW IT.

[Bfd]

56. She just did with this stunt. She drew the line in the sand. Not the Pelosi Democrats

Bye.
While she's busy carrying Cenk Yuger's anti Dem message, the Congressional powerful Democrats will be kicking Trump & the Republicans out of power for good.

One can do good for their country or one can stand in the way of progress.
Choice tbd.

[brush]

130. It didn't bode well when she campaigned with Our Revolution against incumbernt Dems.

That didn't make sense then, if they were successful, to bump one Democrat for another Democrat who might not even win the general election because even if they did win that would not add to our total seats in the House.

This protest at Pelosi's office on orientation day doesn't make much sense either.

She desperately needs a mentor, and desperately needs to understand she needs a mentor.

[redstatebluegirl]

166. She needs to get primaried in 2020 with a really strong candidate.

[awesomerwb1]

14. Not sure I'm a fan anymore.

I'm not a big fan of Pelosi because she's such a lightning rod for all the idiots who have bought all the garbage about her - but her experience is extremely valuable.

I was with a moderate russiapublican this morning and he basically said he hates Pelosi. (I know the guy well, and he's definitely not a trumper).

Get your act together Ocasio-Cortez. This stunt does nobody any good.

[LuvLoogie]

55. WHO THE FUCK CARES WHAT GOPERS THINK OF NANCY PELOSI???

Get out of here with that shit. This is the Democratic Underground.

[awesomerwb1]

62. Classy.

[LuvLoogie]

147. Pfffft...

[LiberalFighter]

60. Whoever is the Democratic leader will be the lightening rod.

It won't go away when Pelosi is gone.

[FSogol]

70. Exactly. We shouldn't buy into RW framing and we sure as hell shouldn't spread RW framing. n/t

[Proud Liberal Dem]

218. Exactly!

Remember that- per Fox News- John Kerry was one of the most liberal members of the Senate in 2004 and then Barack Obama was in 2008. They'll demonize whoever they're afraid of being successful, whether it's Nancy Pelosi, Hillary Clinton, John Kerry, Barack Obama, Howard Dean, et al.

[Ilsa]

220. Exactly my thought as well.

If the new Speaker was someone else, the gop will feature them in 2020 ad campaigns along with Warren, Feinstein, etc.

[octoberlib]

123. Anybody who becomes Speaker will be a lightning rod. Doesn't matter who it is.

The person who replaces Pelosi will become a lightning rod as well.

[muntrv]

140. Steny Hoyer would be a lightning rod for republicans if he were speaker.

Any house speaker is going to be hated by the GOPee.

[Glimmer of Hope]

17. Ugh. She needs to wise up.

[onetexan]

154. i thought the young lady was smarter than that - showboating already

as my grandmother would say in her squeaky voice with finger wagging - eh eh eh eh eh

[ProfessorGAC]

18. Disappointing

No matter the position, nobody does this on their first day.

This is just silly.

[SHRED]

19. The ONLY focus should be taking down Republicans...

...and writing legislation to help the American people.

[seaglass]

20. AOC is very impressed with herself. She should spend a little time learning instead of thinking

she knows it all.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/08/politics/climate-change-committee-democrats-congress-pelosi/index.html

[Wintryjade]

229. That is the big one I have seen since she came onto stage. Lack of education or information.

I was hoping she would educate herself on the wait to step into job. Not looking like she has bothered. People that are a lot of talk, but do not do the work to get it right.

[themaguffin]

21. Wow. What the hell. She's on the inside now. Act like it. Use her seat to influence change.

Very disappointing.

[R B Garr]

22. Attack Republicans instead. Thanks.

[R B Garr]

27. My comment was about Ocasia-Cortez.

Not you. Sorry I didn’t make that more clear.

Thanks for posting this, which highlights the losing strategy we’ve seen of attacking Democrats.

[hlthe2b]

28. Oh, thanks for clarifying and sorry for misunderstanding your point.

[R B Garr]

30. No problem! Thanks for your follow-up.

[Eric J in MN]

24. I couldn't hear all of that.

Can someone tell me one negative thing she says about Pelosi?

[zipplewrath]

34. She didn't.

It's piling on time here at DU and listening isn't high on the agenda.

She was there supporting her constituents that are pushing for the inclusion of a robust long term environmental agenda. She was actually saying that she thought that Speaker Pelosi agreed with them and was committed to making the changes that were needed, long term. She tried to frame it as giving Pelosi the support she needed to move the agenda forward.

[Eric J in MN]

38. Thanks NT

NT

[hlthe2b]

50. Pelosi had already made a statement that she intended to

reinstate the committee. Already made the pledge. AOC is grand-standing on day 1 and given her prior professed disdain for Pelosi, it seems rather obvious.

Of course, Pelosi was gracious in giving her benfit-of-the doubt.

[zipplewrath]

54. Supporting her constituents

She has supporters there and she wanted to show them some support. I thought she actually walked the line quite nicely by trying to re-frame it as supporting Pelosi while also supporting her constituents. He constituents will remember for a long time, in another week, no one else will.

[Bfd]

69. No she tried to frame it as tho she influenced Pelosi to agree to an environmental agenda that hasn'

been presented yet since it's still 2018.
She grabbed the mic to toot her own horn. In front of Pelosi's office.

It was just another media promo for herself.
Geezus.

[zipplewrath]

76. Support her constituents

She was supporting her constituents, and being the squeaky wheel in the process. And, yeah, gettin' some face time on CNN. And hey, if Pelosi came out to do a photo op, all the better. The Drum Major instinct isn't always bad, and drives most politicians. Jimmy Carter talked about it. So did MLK.

Yes, if you want to say that I was a drum major, say that I was a drum major for justice. (Amen) Say that I was a drum major for peace. (Yes) I was a drum major for righteousness.

[Bfd]

79. She wasn't supporting her constituents. But thats a good line.

[zipplewrath]

84. Sorta

It was a group that shares her issues. She built up more street cred with them and supported their actions. Actually, Pelosi was smart enough to do something similar. All those kids were in the hall because they filled up her office.

[octoberlib]

129. If that's the case , then all she had to do was knock on Pelosi's door and

have a conversation. Does she also understand that Republicans control the Senate and there will be no climate change legislation passed until we take over the Senate? They should be over at McConnell's office yelling. This is utterly pointless.

[zipplewrath]

145. She didn't organize it

Pelosi's office was already full of the people she was supporting.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

182. Amazing how people get worked up in to a tizzy over a headline that doesn't match the content.

I opened it expecting a protest and AOC saying mean things. It was exactly the opposite.

And the shit pot stays stirred...

[zipplewrath]

202. She's already pissed off people

So now they are looking for examples of how they were "right". It'll never pass.

[Autumn]

152. She didn't and the bullshit on the protest?

These are her words from the video to the protesters. The rest of the interview is pure fucking truth and the best interview I have ever heard.

Should leader Pelosi become the next Speaker of the House we we need to tell her that we've got her back in showing and pursing the most progressive energy agenda that this country has ever seen.

But all must follow the most important rule : no reason to bash her should ever be allowed go to waste.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

209. Omg! She said the protesters should have Leader Pelosi's back in Green Legislation?

She’s a monster!!!

[Autumn]

234. Obviously! The raw nerve of her. She complains about poverty and now says that.

She should have a challenger as soon as possible!

[brush]

25. Ahhhh...now is the time to learn and learn the party has long push environments legislation.

[UniteFightBack]

26. I'm starting to think that she is a grandstanding opportunist. I don't care for her ANTICS. NT

[Bfd]

29. She is a Cenk Yuger Justice democrat. Cenk, a friend of Farrankahn' groupies

Sausour & Mallory.

We expected no less.

Will be interesting when its time to convince her district back home to vote her back in again.
Her record will speak for itself.
They are Pelosi & Hillary Democrats, not Cenk democrats.


If she has been held up to lead the fight against our Dem Leaders, she has already revealed her real agenda for being there.

[hlthe2b]

31. Interesting because Cenk was a Republican for the majority of his life and remains

a big time HRC hater.

Ocasio-Cortez has so much going for her. It will be sad if she self-destructs.

[Bfd]

36. Yup. Thus we were introduced to Cenk's Pac, cleverly named, 'Justice Democrats'

Duh. Genius. NOT.

[comradebillyboy]

44. What exactly does OAC have going for her?

Certainly not wisdom or experience.

[womanofthehills]

226. Young Democrats connect with her

She can help inspire younger people to become more active and vote.

Does everyone in the party have to walk in a straight line. Why so black and white?

[Honeycombe8]

288. Her district chose her to represent them. I assume they are like she is to some degree.

She's there for the same reason all the other reps are there. No more, no less.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

53. Cenk is a big Richard Ojeda fan

And, while he smears Biden, Warren and Harris with cherry picked issues for his "not a true progressive " litmus tests, he champions that Trump-endorsing, anti-EPA immigrant basher

[Bfd]

78. Oh ffs. Well its good to know how far into the Dem Party Cenk has slithered.

Appears there's a defining line of racial determinants in that Pac.

Glad its oozing to the top for all to see.

Of course, there are those who will gladly stand in a flock of purist racists.

However, that's not the Democratic Party, thank god.

[Ccarmona]

108. Horse Shit

Has anyone here actually watched TYT. They don’t “smear” fellow Dems. They encourage Progressive values and issues. Like other Progressives, they send out the alarm when Corporatists try to keep Progressive ideas and candidates on the sidelines. If they are any “litimus” tests, it’s here at the DU where a wide range of views and opinions are shunned by some. This is where purity is King, but it’s a false motive.

[emulatorloo]

217. TYT's Jimmy Dore never met a rightwing conspiracy he didn't fall in love with

TYT’s Michael Tracy tried to claim Maxine Waters physically assaulted him.

They are a real stellar bunch. AOC is way better than that crowd, no doubt she’ll distance herself from them at some point.

[Ccarmona]

253. Jimmy Dore Has His Opinions and Many Times He Clashes with Cenk

Which Cenk encourages. I know many here aren’t familiar with the expression of multi-opinions that at times might not be mainstream.
Michael Tracy is long gone from TYT.
AOC is a Justice Democrat and will not distance herself since a lot of her campaign funding came from TYT members, including myself.

[Cha]

247. And, Ojeda was so smart he voted

for trump.

[JCanete]

219. Yeah, okay, and Cenk is no longer anything like a Republican. It is clear that he's not just playing

lip service to some faux liberal issues because he can champion them quite effectively. Holding onto his past beliefs as if that means something is tragic. People can evolve and should be given the room to do so. Nor do his issues with Clinton come from a right-wing direction, though, I agree, he definitely doesn't like her and in my opinion is often over-the-top and unfair to her. That said, he's far harsher about the GOP and has only found common ground with a few of them when it comes to campaign finance reform. He doesn't pull his punches with Republicans.

[EllieBC]

179. Farrakhan groupies

are why the women’s march will never see a penny of ounce of support from me.

Anyone allying with hateful Farrakhan is a disgusting human.

[Celerity]

236. this is a pure slur that that infers she is somehow a Farrakhan supporter

or at least linked via a really dodgy guilt by association (a standard RW tactic btw).

So, because these following House Democrats won on November 7th



and were also endorsed by Justice Democrats (along with dozens of other organisations)
that they are somehow linked to Farrakhan too?




narrowly lost to the (hopefully) soon to be felon Duncan Hunter

Pres. Obama personally endorsed him, along with Justice Democrats

Are you saying Obama knowing supported a Farrakhan linked candidate?

Ironic, as Hunter used overtly racist horrific ads insinuating he was a terrorist and an anti-semite because of his family (the Arab side)

What about

?

he sure looks like a Farrakhan dupe, lolol.

I find your post disgusting.

[AlexSFCA]

32. so dissapointing

so much potential and wasted on toxic populism.

[In It to Win It]

35. I think she will come to understand that this term will likely result in nothing getting...

...accomplished. These two years, spend it learning the arcane rules of the House and how to navigate the different personalities.

[KCDebbie]

39. Pelosi is not even officially Speaker yet...

But history has shown that, "The squeaky wheel gets the grease!"

If they don't start asking for what they want, they won't get it!

And it's NEVER too soon to squeak!

[zipplewrath]

43. I caught that

I think she referred to Pelosi as "Speaker Pelosi" or something like that. Technically premature.

[mr_lebowski]

83. She called her 'Leader' every time that I heard, and NP is clearly already 'Leader' at minimum (nt)

[zipplewrath]

88. absolutely

And one I suspect that knows how to "harness" the energy of the new incoming women in congress.

[Bfd]

92. Well then, addressing Pelosi as such, must mean she will approve of Pelosi when the Speaker vote

is taken.
Well thats nice.

[zipplewrath]

95. Or stategic

Let's remember, they are all politicians.

[Bfd]

86. Camera is rolling, grab a mic! Can't believe it! On day 1, she strong armed Pelosi into hearing

her well written & researched agenda on environmental issues that she has clearly brought from her many discussions back home in her district

All that on Day 1, and Pelosi isn't even Majority Speaker yet!!

Whoooweee!

[comradebillyboy]

40. OAC is very unimpressive. Does anyone still think

she is the future of the Democratic Party? Being the Lone Ranger is not an effective tactic in the House of Representatives.

[brooklynite]

41. What exactly was the protest about?

[hlthe2b]

45. ...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/congress/the-latest-ocasio-cortez-speaks-at-pelosis-office-protest/2018/11/13/b25b6f30-e767-11e8-8449-1ff263609a31_story.html?utm_term=.edf2812189cd

Pelosi has pledged to reinstate a special committee on climate change after Democrats take control of the House. The California Democrat said in a statement that she welcomes the activists.

Given that prior pledge from Pelosi, this seems to me to be grand standing, especially on day one of orientation

[Bfd]

105. Yup. She wants to spin it as tho she convinced Pelosi.

Sure okay.

[Cha]

252. Thank You for that, hlthe

Yep, grandstanding.. look at me!

Nancy Pelosi is the best!

[woodsprite]

42. Did someone forget to tell her they're on the same side of the aisle.

She was sent there to fix problems, not cause them.

One of her buds was running here in DE. Not entirely happy with how Carper's wishy-washiness and reaching across the aisle all the time, but glad he won his primary and defended his position as Senator.

[Kaleva]

46. Pelosi welcomed activists (not "protesters"). So should we. Unless one wants to divide.

"We welcome the presence of these activists, and we strongly urge the Capitol Police to allow them to continue to organize and participate in our democracy.”

Link to tweet

[Power 2 the People]

106. +1

[Zoonart]

48. Incoming back-benchers need to listen and learn.

We have a lott of deep shit to sort out and we need those with the experience in government to lead the way.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

49. Protest organized by Justice "Democrats"

The political arm of Young Turks, spearheaded by Seth Rich troofer and Hillary-has-secret-Parkinson's conspiracy theorist Jimmy "Let Trump win" Dore

Ocasio-Cortez has made multiple appearances on Dore's nutty show

[Cha]

255. Really? Justice "Democrats" organized

that protest?!

Well that settles it for me, if so. They're nothing but gaslighting Bullshit.

[sheshe2]

264. Yep, scroll up and see the video on post 46.

[Cha]

265. Thanks, she!

[sheshe2]

268. Hey!

Sorry, to lazy to grab the link...with these long threads my computer never gets me back to my place.

[Cha]

269. That's okay..

FWIW.. I'm too lazy to do a lot of things these days.

[sheshe2]

270. Then I am in good company.

[Cha]

272. lol Yes We Are!

[Cha]

276. This! Tweet from Nancy LeTourneau

Link to tweet

[sheshe2]

280. They were remiss in not doing so.

Thanks for my fav, Nancy LeTourneau.

[George II]

299. Yes, and who was on the Board of Justice "Democrats" until just recently?

[Gothmog]

51. I have been wondering about AOC's committee assignment

This will be amusing

[zipplewrath]

57. Probably environment

There's more than one subcommittee she could be put on that would have her on an environmental committee, and then these people might find themselves outside HER office. Pelosi ain't dumb.

[Gothmog]

172. Time will tell but this candidate campaigned against democrats like Sharice Davids

I strongly believe Davids will be making more of an impact in Congress compared to AOC.

[violetpastille]

52. Sit down AOC. Just sit down and learn something.

[DFW]

73. Thinking you know it all before you are even sworn in.

Yup, that is SURELY the right attitude to take to make a difference for your constituents.

It sounds like the only accomplishment she can claim so far is making all the Democrats in her district who stayed home during the primary kick themselves downstairs for their fatal complacency.

She needs either a bit of humility or a lot of getlostery.

John Lennon was about her age when he wrote this:

You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You better free you mind instead

So, it ain't the age, it's the attitude.

[grantcart]

164. Well we should all call her office and complain except of course she actually doesn't have one yet

I am surprised anyone is surprised.


This is exactly what she said that she was going to do.

[JonLP24]

250. They still could have voted for Joe Crowley

She beat him again for the general election.

[JCMach1]

58. Wow, know who your allies are ...

[geardaddy]

59. Stupid.

[libdem4life]

61. Sorry to say, her age is showing.

Nancy knows how to handle this...she's got it. There is little she hasn't seen. But I am disappointed...no matter why...she is hogging publicity. Sad.

[hlthe2b]

64. I think you mean her "youth" (AOC)?

[libdem4life]

72. Yes, her age is 29 I think...which is very young.

As we used to say, it's gone to her head. But still give her respect for her accelerated journey which had to require the ability to cope with and overcome many pitfalls and challenges. She needed that over-confidence to get where she is today.

But she's smart and will make this transition, as well, I hope. She has a lot of Latinas and other women sending her their support and looking for a role model.

[DFW]

63. It sounds like OAC's behavior will land her some interesting committee assignments

The House select subcommittee on recycling used fish scales

and

The House Committee on determining the legitimacy of obscure Scrabble words.

[JCanete]

178. what I love is the contradictory framing people have that there is no establishment that has to be

appeased but if you challenge those in charge in ways they don't like, that may affect your career, which is almost applauded here.


So which is it? Is there a line to tow, or is there not?

[DFW]

203. What I love is centuries long traditions of respect, civility and decorum tossed out the window

And that just to appease the ego of a few headline-hungry lovers of the limelight.

I thought the headline-grubbing was the domain of the Republicans, led by their egomaniac-in-chief. I was hoping it wouldn't rub off on our bright new freshmen class. Well, most of them seemed to have figured it out anyway, so that's a consolation. The wings of Icarus always melt sooner or later.

[JCanete]

206. What breaches are you even pointing to? I'm sorry but you can't make a case privately outside of the

eyes of the public. You have to actually state what you think needs to change, not JUST with the opposition party, but with your own. And when you don't...when you don't get the people behind that change, guess the fuck what....

shit don't change. Its a catch-22 anyway. If she were keeping her head down nobody would be talking about her and she'd have even less influence, and THAT is what you'd be happy about. If she uses her popularity to voice her issues, then that isn't about her issues, THAT is about her grandstanding. Fuck that noise. Its pathetic.

[DFW]

221. If she were keeping her head down and talking to the right people

She would get shit done, and we would all hear of it when it was "done deal, check this out." That's the way it works in DC. Grandstanding in front of the cameras and getting nothing done is pure Trump--and AOC, if she keeps this up.

When you start out, you learn the ropes first. If you show up on day one, and say, "here I am, and I know all I gotta know" that's pure Conrad Cornelius O'Donald O'Dell, and it will not only earn her a similar caricature, but it will lead to notoriety instead of the fame she is seeking. And guess what? People that nobody talks about get stuff done--precisely because they are so effective at not getting talked about.

I don't give a rat's ass what kind of influence she has. She's a freshman congresswoman. In Congress, her influence as a newbie will be in direct correlation to how well she puts her ideas across, and how well she gets along with the people she needs to convince to be on her team when she presents them.

In DC, if you think you have ideas that have merit, you convince people, you don't bash them over the head until they scream, "OK, you're right!" because they won't. If you've been in DC enough, you also learn that people you wish were always be right just aren't always right, and I grew up in the thick of it. Your idols just aren't infallible, no matter how you wish it were so.

As Unamuno told the Spanish Fascists in 1936: "Ustedes vencerán, porque poseen la fuerza bruta. Pero no convencerán." There is a big difference between vencer and convencer, as any Latina will (or should) know, and AOC isn't even at the "vencer" stage. Having won her election in no way distinguishes her from any other member of the House.

[JCanete]

224. Really? Trump got elected and got shit done. Some horrible shit done. I guess getting your message

out works, no matter how twisted.

And it was the whole crux of Roosavelt's success. His fireside chats...his bringing the issues to the people was what kept them galvanized behind him.


Ultimately, the thing you're missing in your equation is that if there is no will there is no progress. And the squeaky wheel always gets the oil. If you think things are going to change for the better when nobody is demanding it, when there are plenty of very powerful influences demanding quite the opposite, you are soo damn mistaken, and we've gone too many decades like that.

The time to strike on healthcare was because these issues had been finally germinated into the public consciousness. For all the hatred of Michael Moore here, do you really think we would have gotten even the ACA without SICKO?

You've got to bring these things to the public. They are the butress against the power of big money.

[sheshe2]

267. + 1000

[progressoid]

284. " centuries long traditions of respect, civility and decorum "

I suppose respect, civility and decorum is in the eye of the beholder.

[octoberlib]

66. The comments were interesting, too

@sarahkendzior
Replying to @HoarseWisperer
There seems to be a significant disconnect between what AOC is actually saying in that interview -- that she wants a green new deal and wants to work with Pelosi, not against Pelosi, on implementing it -- and what the people whooping in the hallway think she's saying...

The Hoarse Whisperer
‏

@HoarseWisperer
Replying to @sarahkendzior
When you show up to peacock for cameras, people tend to process the spectacle more than the message.

That’s why anyone with an ounce of political savvy - or even basic judgment - don’t do stupid things like this.

AOC has neither

[HopeAgain]

77. She is young and she is learning

This makes me think of the way the establishment Dems reacted to the student movements of the 60's. Just sayin....

[sheshe2]

266. She is not a student.

She is a newly elected Congresswoman yet to be sworn in. This is her first day. Some decorum is called for. This was an arranged protest by Justice Democrats...a group that is hard to find that much info on.

[HopeAgain]

274. She also more liberal

Which I believe to be the real issue.

[sheshe2]

279. There are many 'more' liberals in Congress.

Mine is Joe Kennedy III and is 'more' liberal and displays decorum as a representative in MA.

[Celerity]

282. he sure isn't 'liberal' on marijuana (even medicinal)

I do not smoke at all, but that is certainly a stance he will have to give up if he wants on the ticket.

[mr_lebowski]

98. I agree w/both here, I don't think the grandstanding on Day One was helpful & not the proper venue

et cetera

THAT SAID, I don't actually have a problem with what she had to say, really.

Nothing about what she said leads me to think this was intended as a 'Protest Against Nancy', and people interpreting it as such should probably slow down, and actually LISTEN. She's just agitating for Dems this session to make a strong push on Climate Change, and attempting to elicit Pelosi's help on this goal. What's so wrong with that message (outside of the 'venue', if you will)?

Let's not let our side be led by the nose by SPIN ... like the knuckle-dragging cultists are all the damn time. This wasn't a Protest Against Nancy, okay folks?

Just sayin' ...

[octoberlib]

131. Is she even remotely aware that Republicans control the Senate and there will be no

climate change bill passed until Dems re-take it? That's just a fact. I hope Nancy Pelosi has her magic unicorn wand ready to wave it over Mitch McConnell and enact legislation. She's gonna need it.

[mr_lebowski]

135. Are you implying she's basically an idiot? Cause it kinda sounds like it ... (nt)

[octoberlib]

156. I'm trying to understand the motivation for doing it besides a publicity stunt because

her term will be up and there will be no new climate change legislation because Republicans control the Senate. And if we don't take back the Senate in 2020 , it may be longer than that. Is she going to blame Pelosi for that, too?

[Cha]

257. I think that's a valid question,

octoberlib

[Honeycombe8]

289. Am I correct in thinking that the "protesters" were from her district?

That's why she's standing there with them?

Am I also correct that she is not protesting, as such, bu is there to encourage them for being involved and wanting some assurances on climate change? She refers to Pelosi several times as "leader Pelosi," and that she knows Pelosi feels the same way about climate change, but (etc.). Seems like she was there just for them, to support them. That's why I'm thinking they're from her district.

So altho this doesn't look good, if my assumptions are correct, she's not there "with them." And she's not protesting.

She probably should've recommended they come on another day. If they wanted to do it that day, she could have met with them but not spoken to media. OTOH, if she hadn't spoken w/media, it would have looked like she was protesting even more.

A tricky situation for her. But it's best to lie low and don't make waves on the first day.

[Blue_Tires]

127. +1

[muriel_volestrangler]

68. So are all those criticising her here against renewable energy?

Yes, I know the sound quality of that clip is atrocious (the camera clicks are louder than her voice - why do digital cameras click, anyway?), but you all know what the protest was about, so what have you against AOC supporting it and saying she thinks Pelosi is on their side? Which she seems to be:

New York Congresswoman-elect Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, the most prominent of the progressive millennials elected to Congress in the midterm elections, joined a protest led by left-wing groups Justice Democrats and the Sunrise Movement outside House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi's personal office calling for House Democrats to put forward a climate plan. Protesters called for Democrats, who will have a substantial majority in the House next year, to create a select committee to develop a plan to switch to 100 percent renewable energy.

The demonstration was spurred by a recent United Nations report which showed that the world only has 12 years to limit global warming to manageable levels. Ocasio-Cortez, who is in Washington for new member orientation, spoke before a group of protesters with signs bearing slogans such as "Green Jobs For All."
...
In a response to the protests, Pelosi said in a statement that she was "inspired by the energy and activism of the many young activists and advocates leading the way on the climate crisis."

"I have recommended to my House Democratic colleagues that we reinstate the select committee to address the climate crisis," she said in the statement. "We welcome the presence of these activists, and we strongly urge the Capitol Police to allow them to continue to organize and participate in our democracy."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/alexandria-ocasio-cortez-participates-in-protest-outside-nancy-pelosi-office/

[hlthe2b]

71. No.. but you clearly have not read the thread.. Try the post just above yours for start.

[muriel_volestrangler]

81. Well, that's the problem with the USA, isn't it? "Don't do the right thing because someone ...

...will misinterpret 'the spectacle'".

Especially if a professional reporter posts a video with shitty sound so you can't make out what she's saying.

No, I hadn't read that reply - because it was made seconds before the one I was writing. But thanks - my opinion of "The Hoarse Whisperer" has gone down a notch.

But I had read a lot of the rest of the thread, and it's clear mosty people are not talking about the environment or renewable energy, but their own hatred of AOC. Which is a more minor thing wrong with the USA.

[hlthe2b]

82. Oh stop it. NO one hates AOC--that is ridiculous grandstanding of your own

Her naivete' hurts her causes and that bothers most of us.

[muriel_volestrangler]

90. *You*, the thread starter, think *I* am grandstanding?

Bless you.

[hlthe2b]

91. Yes. I started the thread. And I don't want your "blessings" nor your poorly veiled insults

Bless your heart, though.

[muriel_volestrangler]

97. Tell people replying to you to "stop it", and that replying is "grandstanding"

and you'll feel that any other reply to you is "a poorly veiled insult". Is your conscience guilty?

[hlthe2b]

101. Not at all. Your attempts to insult aside... bless your heart....

[Celerity]

242. this entire thread is based off a slanted, misinterpreted tweet that in no way reflects

the reality (laid out by other posters above and below) of the situation. Some of the replies reek a of 'burn the witch' mentality, with more than a few matches at the ready. Very disheartening how this rat-packing occurs. AOC (who I greatly admire and can so relate to as she is also a woman of colour, is only is 6 years older than me and backs many of my political initiatives and desires) seems to climbing the charts here to become a bog standard whipping girl.

Should leader Pelosi become the next Speaker of the House we we need to tell her that we've got her back in showing and pursing the most progressive energy agenda that this country has ever seen.

@sarahkendzior
Replying to @HoarseWisperer
There seems to be a significant disconnect between what AOC is actually saying in that interview -- that she wants a green new deal and wants to work with Pelosi, not against Pelosi, on implementing it -- and what the people whooping in the hallway think she's saying...

Nothing about what she said leads me to think this was intended as a 'Protest Against Nancy', and people interpreting it as such should probably slow down, and actually LISTEN. She's just agitating for Dems this session to make a strong push on Climate Change, and attempting to elicit Pelosi's help on this goal. What's so wrong with that message (outside of the 'venue', if you will)?

Let's not let our side be led by the nose by SPIN ... like the knuckle-dragging cultists are all the damn time. This wasn't a Protest Against Nancy, okay folks?

[Blue_Tires]

125. She'll do well to remember that Pelosi isn't her enemy

This is what she gets for skipping "Congresscritter 101 Orientation"

[Fiendish Thingy]

74. Here's a link for context

With Pelosi’s support and approval:

https://m.dailykos.com/stories/1812543

[hlthe2b]

75. Pelosi had already announced her intent. She is being publicly gracious to AOC

[YessirAtsaFact]

80. Looks stupid to me

Pelosi is most likely be the next speaker.

Ocasio-Cortez will get shit committee assignments for years if Pelosi becomes the Speaker

[dalton99a]

99. That would be unacceptable. Ocasio-Cortez must get what she wants

Otherwise you're discriminating against Ocasio-Cortez

[msdogi]

85. hope she gets a sit down with the grownups

this is embarrassing, she is no longer campaigning and needs to learn to work will with her peers

[dalton99a]

87. Pretty soon she'll be as likable and collegial as Ted Cruz

[comradebillyboy]

149. Consider how well loved her mentor is with his

colleagues in the Senate.

[brooklynite]

89. What's the over/under on how long it'll take her to get arrested as a Congresswoman?

[Kaleva]

93. Response by Nancy Pelosi

"Deeply inspired by the young activists & advocates leading the way on confronting climate change. The climate crisis threatens the futures of communities nationwide, and I strongly support reinstating the select committee to address the crisis."

Link to tweet

Comment by AOC on Nancy's support for reinstating the select committee:

"Reinstating the Select Committee is a great decision that I fully support. These dynamic leaders want to ensure is that the committee: - Has a mandate to draft a Green New Deal for 100% renewable energy - No appointed members that accept funding from the fossil fuel industry"

https://twitter.com/sunrisemvmt?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

[hlthe2b]

96. Yes... She is being gracious, providing cover to AOC's grandstanding attempt

having already prior expressed plans to restore the committee. Nancy, is being protective of a naive' new member, whether AOC deserves it or not.

[Kaleva]

104. Where does Nancy mention AOC?

[hlthe2b]

109. I never said she did, nor is it necessary that she do so.

[Kaleva]

126. Then you are just guessing.

Your comment:

"Yes... She is being gracious, providing cover to AOC's grandstanding attempt"

It fits your world view to believe that Nancy is providing cover and is being gracious to AOC but there are no facts that support such a claim.

[hlthe2b]

128. Just as you are... My impressions comes from watching Nancy over decades in the House.

To suggest anyone here is offering anything other than their informed opinions is ridiculous... so I don't know what point you tried to make.

[Kaleva]

134. But you stated it as a fact and not as an opinion, didn't you?

This comment of yours for example:

"Nancy, is being protective of a naive' new member, whether AOC deserves it or not. "

The above is not an opinion or speculation. It is written as if it's a fact even though there is no evidence that supports it.

[hlthe2b]

141. I, as everyone else here state my opinion directly and with no links to anyone else.

I am sorry you seem to have so much problem understanding and interacting with me, but your statement is just ridiculous.


Have a nice day.

[Kaleva]

168. "I, as everyone else here state my opinion directly" is more speculation not supported by facts.

I provided links and quotes, You, for the most part haven't.

Even your comment in the Op leads me to wonder:

"I can't help but be incensed that she, so overtly kicks those who led the way for her and other women--in the face "

Why get incensed over something that isn't supported by actual evidence but is based on your own bias and specualtion about what took place?

Edit: Not trying to be an ass. Take care. Have to sign off and do some house work!

[hlthe2b]

173. This is a discussion board... Anyone and everyone here makes their opinions known. That is the point

That you can not be respectful of opinions with which you disagree is obvious, but to claim you don't understand the difference between an opinion and factual assertion tells me everything I need to know about interacting with you and we are done. There is no benefit to either of us to continue.

[Kaleva]

230. I know the differance between an opinion and a factual assertion.

You write your opinions as if they were factual assertions and that's the discussion we've been having.

[muriel_volestrangler]

188. Yeah, but when people disagree with you, you order them to "stop it"

and accuse them of grandstanding. I think the problems people have interacting with you come from your posting style.

[hlthe2b]

190. Muriel... we were done a long time ago. Unless you'd like to engage in respectful discourse.

as we have many times in the past.

[muriel_volestrangler]

194. Why would you want to start being respectful now? You were rude to me

and you're doing it to others too.

[hlthe2b]

297. Pot meet kettle, muriel.

as is your pattern.

[Small-Axe]

113. This is what makes Nancy Pelosi a master.

She just threw AOC a lifeline, whether the foolish neophyte deserved it (or not).

[Cha]

258. Exactly.. Nancy is Brilliant and Gracious.

[Wintryjade]

232. Right. Pelosi and the Dems are already on it. Gonna pick a battle, pick one that is not already on

the table.

[Honeycombe8]

291. It sounds like a policy statement, and that she was proud of the public's involvement...

and excitement over this issue that was blown apart by Trump.

I think these long time reps are used to people gathering in the halls and such. OAC was respectful & referred to Pelosi as "leader Pelosi" at least twice...she didn't appear to be joining a protest. It didn't seem to be a protest at all, actually. If some of the people wre from OAC's district, that would explain why she went there to speak with them. Or because climate change is a major issue for her (as it is for the rest of us).

Doesn't seem like a big deal to me. All this fuss over nothing.

[loyalsister]

183. Her response is informative

I get the impression that AOC was acting as a moderator. Showing respect and making room for activists AND most importantly letting them know that Pelosi is on their side.

We are working in a political environment with unprecedented anger because we have a POTUS who deserves it.

We are in a precarious situation similar to what McCaskill was dealing with in MO. She alienated the left by bragging about supporting Trump on immigration then calling out crazy democrats. GOTVers were left with having to encourage voters to at least support the statewide and down ticket Democrats when we were met with hostility towards her.

Not only do Democrats in the House have to develop and maintain relationships with the expanding youth constituency, they have be able to function as a legislative body.

Things have changed, elected officials have to respond rather than leaning on what clearly has not been working even when they have had power. Let's not forget that under inefficient leadership of republicans with competing factions, hostility grew within government and among citizens. AND more importantly, Obama still got re-electioned.

[Stinky The Clown]

94. . . .

[Blue_true]

100. Sorry, your OP is deceptive, IMO.

She was very complementary toward Nancy Pelosi and said that she was there to back Pelosi up. The protest was about green energy and renewables, a group was protesting and the freshwoman came to support that group. It is nice that progressive groups can protest in front of leaders that will actually listen to them instead of have them arrested, I just hope they don't take things too far.

I suggest that everyone listen to the video and make your own judgement.

[hlthe2b]

102. My OP merely posted a twitter thread. Accusing me of being deceptive?

Agree or disagree, but that is your being deceptive yourself.

[Blue_true]

111. You got me. Instead of deceptive, I should have used wrong.

Deceptive implies evil intent, which I honestly don't think you had. Sorry, after watching the video, I got hot under the collar and started posting. I apologize for the inappropriate word.

[Nanjeanne]

103. She doesn't appear to be protesting AGAINST Pelosi at all. From what I am hearing in the

video she has joined a group of climate activists who are there to push Pelosi as the apparent majority leader to push for climate legislation. And AOC is saying she wants to work with Pelosi on this and knows her to be a supporter of green energy etc.

Sometimes a tweet can be misleading especially if there is some inherent bias in the tweeter’s dna. Perhaps that’s the case here. Don’t know but if you listen to the video it’s possible to have a completely different impression.

[Blue_true]

115. I saw it as you saw it. Great summary.

I got a little hot before I posted, you stayed calm and summarized things just right.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

214. Shhhh--don't let facts get in the way.

They're on a roll and need a reason to criticize AO-C

[Celerity]

227. yes, agreed 100%

And even if the original tweet had no intentional bias, you soon get all the Twitter bots, professional axe-grinders, shills, etc, the super biased, the usual suspects, etc etc on every side turning it into a shitstorm

I hate twitter politics

[workinclasszero]

107. What the actual f***????

You have got to be shitting me!?

First day on the job and attacking your own party members/leaders??????????

Damn I guess the fucking GOPers in the House really appreciate the assist AOC!!!!

[Blue_true]

118. Listen to the video, she seem to admire Nancy Pelosi. nt

[hlthe2b]

133. and she has withheld support for Pelosi for speaker, so I find that highly disingenuous

New York Democratic candidate Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez will not say if she would support Nancy Pelosi for Speaker of the House if she wins in November and Democrats take the House: "It's far too early to make those kind of commitments right now" https://cnn.it/2yKhNpq

[Kaleva]

151. Here's a list of 58 Dem candidates & incumbents who had spoken out against Nancy as Speaker

AOC isn't on that list but she seems to be the one you are most worried about.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/democrats-opposing-pelosi-n899536

She's one of 35 nominees who didn't make a commitment for or against prior to the election.

“Let me win the election first in November before I make commitments… I think that she’s a candidate to consider.”

"

[JCanete]

192. How is that disingenouous? Two entirely different issues. She may like somebody better when there

choices. Why should she have to pledge fealty?

[NurseJackie]

110. What a shame. I wonder if she'll serve more than one term.

What a shame. I wonder if she'll serve more than one term.

[justhanginon]

158. Probably not. She will most likely as things seem to be going,

announce her run for the presidency in 2020.

[NurseJackie]

163. Ha! That wouldn't surprise me.

[Tarheel_Dem]

223. She probably would, but she's not old enough to run in 2020. Thank goodness. n/t

[Cuthbert Allgood]

114. Wait? I thought we were only supposed to support Dems on here?

You know, the whole don't be divided thing?

[hlthe2b]

121. we don't have to be sycophants... No one here would have voted against her in General nor

advocated others to do so. Most here are expressing concern and/or disappointment. That is not a withdrawal or withholding of support.

We can, however discuss her attacks on other Dem leadership and other members-- thinly veiled or not-- as well as their attempts to integrate into their newly elected roles. That her ambition appears to be clouding her judgement right now is worth discussing.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

211. Any "concern and/or disappointment" in Clinton after the general

was not met with anything but scorn by the majority here.

Additionally, saying that one does not want Pelosi to be the Speaker has rarely been seen as something we can discuss, though, by the majority here.

Interesting that the displeasure in a young woman of color is OK.

[hlthe2b]

213. Actually it is because she is such a promising and exceptional young woman & POC that I want her to

succeed.

[ismnotwasm]

116. Somebody explain this to me

Because nothing I’m coming up with has a positive spin

[people]

117. Ocasia-Cortez responding to Sunrise Movement demonstration

The people lined up in front of Pelosi's office want a commitment by the Democratic congress for an actual plan to transform the U.S. to 100% renewable energy and in so doing hope to head off the most egregious climate changes and provide tons of jobs and a transformation of our economy. What I read of Nancy Pelosi's statement was that she wants this environmental committee formed and she supports a major infrastructure plan which will help protect communities from climate change -- all good things. But, the Sunrise Movement wants more than that for VERY GOOD REASON. United Nations says we only have 12 years to significantly slow this down. This is an emergency and Ocasia-Cortez is to be admired for publicly aligning herself with this movement. Nancy Pelosi is a tough leader who knows how to get things done, and she should remain there, but Ocasia-Cortez should continue to verbally push us to no longer close our eyes to the climate changes that seem practically inevitable. Whether or not Ocasia Cortez is grandstanding, I don't care. I thank her for being right out there.

[workinclasszero]

136. So instead of holding a protest in front of the current GOP Speaker's office

And protesting the ACTUAL FUCKING PEOPLE THAT ARE STOPPING ALL RENEWABLE ENERGY POLICY from being written into law....

Let JUMP THE FUCK all over the people in our own party that WANT this legislation?!

Does that make any kind of ****ing sense to anybody?

Well except of course the GOP and those holier than thou that would like to drive a wedge into the democratic party and weaken us?

[Qutzupalotl]

119. Watch the video.

AOC says she's there to support Pelosi's call for renewable energy, not to protest her.

[Celerity]

142. that was my takeaway too

[mr_lebowski]

120. Observing how easily DIVIDED our side is ... no wonder we (usually) f***ing lose ...

This thread is a nightmare for me, I gotta say ...

Just have one friggin' person in the entire Twitterverse IMPLY that a Young Progressive Dem is 'protesting' a more-established Democratic leader like Leader Pelosi (even though they're actually NOT)?

Et voila ... everyone at each other's throats!

We must not be this easily manipulated, friends

Just MHO, fwiw ...

[hlthe2b]

124. ..

perhaps you can not tolerate constructive criticism--something our side will require for future success. Hide thread may be your best option, if so.

[mr_lebowski]

132. I assure u that what I have a hard time tolerating, is the mis-characterization, not the 'criticism'

Constructive, or otherwise.

Calling what she did a 'protest', & implying it was against Leader Pelosi, is basically BS, and it's pointlessly (imho) divisive.

I say that NOT as some AOC fanboy, btw. I actually didn't want to her win her Primary, for the record.

Had this headline MORE ACCURATELY stated "AOC, accompanied by Supporters, Lobbies Leader Pelosi for Swift Action on Climate Change in 2019" or something along those lines ... we'd not be having this discussion.

Fair enough?

[hlthe2b]

138. Not at all. I do not accept your premise--at all.

It is simply not helpful to be a sycophant. And to be otherwise, does not mean we are failing to support Dems.

I think it is more to the point that AOC may well not be so willing to support Dems or at least leadership, her platitudes notwithstanding:

New York Democratic candidate Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez will not say if she would support Nancy Pelosi for Speaker of the House if she wins in November and Democrats take the House: "It's far too early to make those kind of commitments right now" https://cnn.it/2yKhNpq

And yes, I think Nancy P very graciously covered for her today. I'm glad she did and am hoping AOC will learn to be collaborative.

[mr_lebowski]

139. In the interest of not participating in that which I deplored from the onset, allow me to agree

... to disagree.

[hlthe2b]

143. I get it...

you deplore me. ANyone else you'd like to call out with whom you merely disagree?

[mr_lebowski]

150. No, you really don't get it I'm afraid.

What I 'deplore' ... is not YOU, it's all of us fighting among each other in the manner observed on the thread.

Ergo ... I'm trying to drop OUR little 'fight' ... which is a microcosm of the greater whole ... by simply 'agreeing to disagree'.

Fair enough?

[Celerity]

144. you sum up my feelings well

[SubjectTrip]

157. There's a bit of a personality cult surrounding Pelosi

And it's not good.

[melman]

239. There sure is

And it sure isn't.

[Cha]

259. I see the same for AOC

[Soxfan58]

122. Don't protest Pelosi

Learn from her. She would have some valuable wisdom for a young congresswoman

[zipplewrath]

146. She wasn't

The people she was supporting were petitioning Pelosi. Pelosi welcomed them and supported their position. It's kinda how the systems supposed to work. It's written right in the constitution.

[SubjectTrip]

162. She wasn't.

Try actually reading her statements?

[avebury]

137. She will prove to be her own worse enemy.

I want to like her but she is rapidly acting out of control. Someone needs to give her a copy of How To Win Friends and Influence People.

[disillusioned73]

148. How dare she...

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[SubjectTrip]

159. Direct action gets the goods

All the hang-wringers on here would do well to realize that

[disillusioned73]

174. Yup...

I applaud her for getting to work right out the gate.. I know ppl are not used to that... but as minorities we know we don't have the luxury of sitting back & waiting for things to happen.. this is who she is, and why she won..

[SubjectTrip]

177. Amen n/t

[SubjectTrip]

153. Welp I guess today is the day DU turns against AOC

God forbid we make sure we hold our leaders accountable when the world is literally at risk.

[workinclasszero]

170. So you are saying that Nancy Pelosi is against renewable energy?

I guess I missed that part of her Democratic agenda.

Would you please give me a quote and a link to back that up?

Seems awful funny to me that dem leadership is against renewable energy.

[Cha]

260. Nobody is making Nancy Pelosi "accountable"

Nancy for FOR ReNewable Energy.

They need to make the GOP ACCOUNTABLE.

[SubjectTrip]

261. Does Nancy support drafting a Green New Deal by 2020?

Does Nancy support not allowing any members on the Select Committee that take fossil fuel industry donations?

Those were AOC's demands.

[Cha]

262. Does AOC know the GOP Controls the

Senate and there will be NO legislation passed until we take back the Senate in 2020?

[SubjectTrip]

263. So that means we should not pass any bills in the House whatsoever?

We should do nothing until 2020 except, like, subpoena Trump? That's not going to play well whatsoever.

[lapucelle]

316. I wasn't aware that AOC is making demands of Nancy Pelosi.

If AOC wants legislation drafted, perhaps she should get busy doing it.

[George II]

298. Welp, if she had done a little bit of homework she would have realized that Pelosi...

...had already decided last week that she was going to reinstate the committee about which the protest was all about. So for what was she "holding our leaders accountable"?

I certainly hope she attends her orientation classes today.

[SidDithers]

155. Oh FFS...

Sid

[SubjectTrip]

160. 2nd day in office and she's already using direct action to advocate for a green jobs deal

And we're upset about this? Good grief.

AOC is awesome.

[DURHAM D]

195. She is not yet in office. nt

[Cuthbert Allgood]

216. So she's doing work before she's paid to? What a loser.

I don't get your point. At all. Unless it's just to bash AO-C. Then it's loud and clear.

[janterry]

161. good luck to her on her committee assignments.

I'm sure she'll enjoy the very special one that Pelosi (or her successor) picks.

[Tarc]

167. "Oh my" indeed, what a disingenuous & dishonest topic title.

Ocasio-Cortez didn't organize or spearhead a protest of Nancy Pelosi, she showed up and voiced her support for their opinions. She then quite articulately and calmly, explained her point of view to the reporters present.

Let's not savage the newbies quite yet.

[End Of The Road]

222. +1 Some DUers need a refresher course in reading reliable news sources before opening their pie hole

[redstatebluegirl]

169. Isn't she a big Bernie supporter?

That would figure with this stupid stunt.

[George II]

171. Dale Carnegie wrote a book decades ago that should be required reading for her.

[gademocrat7]

175. This is inappropriate behavior.

Nancy Pelosi has the expertise and experience on how to navigate bills through the House. A young arrogant member does not.

[Mr. Sparkle]

180. She is protesting the Democrats reversing a position to take money from fossil fuel companies.

according to this TYT video

I have to say i agree with her. If Democrats are going to take corporate money, which i think we have to because of the current rigged system . We should take donations from those companies that are fighting to give us a better future and not fossils that are destroying the planet.

[George II]

199. TYT? And yet Cenk and TYT have few qualms about taking money from Buddy Roehmer.....

....and RT?

Both, TYT and Justice Democrats, are Cenk's concoctions. We can do better.

[mr_lebowski]

181. Implying this was a protest is wrong to start, but yelling "ZOMG A PROTEST AGAINST NANCY PELOSI!!1!"

Is WILDLY inaccurate.

I'd encourage everyone to dig a little deeper here, and listen to her interview, learn a bit of the backstory, read how Leader Pelosi responded, etc ... before assuming that the original Tweeter ... is characterizing this situation accurately.

Cause I really don't think they are.

[hlthe2b]

185. First of all, the subject line derives from the tweets. It was a protest that she attended & was

already addressed by Pelosi's agreement to reinstate the committee upon her taking leadership role (assuming she does) in January. For that reason and because she did so on DAY 1, instead of bringing her concerns directly to Pelosi, it is sheer grand-standing.


Apparently, you want to continue this after, all. I thought we'd agreed to disagree?

[mr_lebowski]

193. Look HL, I'm NOT blaming you at all ... for simply accurately posting "what the tweet said", okay?

That's not your fault, I'm not 'accusing you' of anything, or anything like that. This isn't personal, this isn't you vs me.

There was simply another recent raft of posts from people who've appeared to only read the headline ... I'm just urging them to look deeper, because I don't think the headline (*not* your personal fault ) from the original tweeter ... is accurate.

With that, I'm officially done

[JCanete]

187. So are they suggesting Pelosi would be within her rights to vindictively assign Cortez less

than desired committee positions because Cortez publicly has a beef? Well wouldn't that be something we could all get behind....

This is certainly not an accusation that I personally levy at Pelosi's feet since I don't have any idea whether she would use her power like this, but why would that ever be acceptable amongst us here? That is not good justification and it doesn't at all support the common nonsense here that if you're in the senate or congress, then by definition you are an insider and part of the establishment. Sounds more like people are saying you have to play ball the way the powers that be want you to play ball, and that if you don't you may be, justifyably, marginalized. Hmmm

[Autumn]

189. Oh my:Someone should tell the jackass whisperer that he/she should listen to what

is said in the video and the protest instead of tweeting bullshit which can be made into sensational phony headlines.
By the way, had anyone listened to the video and what was said ,AOC kicked no one in the teeth, unless you consider praise for Leader Pelosi to be kicking her in the teeth. Well maybe it was a kick in the jackass whisperers teeth, I notice that twitter twit goes more for sensation than truth.

[George II]

204. There's nothing sensational OR phony in the headlines.

And as she's done for decades, Nancy Pelosi handled this with class and aplomb.

[SidDithers]

191. Hope Sharice Davids gets AOC's committee assignments...nt

Sid

[JCanete]

196. why? Would that be an appropriate way for Pelosi to respond? Besides, did you watch the video? nt

[DURHAM D]

197. LOL

AOC campaigned against Sharice Davids in the primary.

Hope Sharice gets the committees she wants and AOC does not.

[JCanete]

201. Bullshit spin and offensive. She campaigned for the candidate running against her. That's

not the same fucking thing. What the hell dude?

[DURHAM D]

205. She had absolutely NO BUSINESS getting into a Democratic primary. EOS

[JCanete]

207. What the hell are you talking about now? Everybody else gets involved in democratic primaries, but

SHE had no business? According to who, and do you extend that to all of your favs? Wow.

[DURHAM D]

208. Nominees (not elected) newbies don't/should not get involved in primaries

halfway across the country, at least not in the US. Maybe Russia but not here.

[JCanete]

210. according to what rule? Public citizens absolutely do. I guess at that level that's what she was.

Where are you pulling your ideas from exactly?

[DURHAM D]

212. "Pulling your ideas"? What the f.

Weird question. Guess you watch/listen to CT crap for your "ideas".

BTW I am not a dude.


Просто скажи «нет» Путину




Сделано с вами

[JCanete]

215. I wasn't using dude to denote gender, but if you bristle at the term, I'll avoid it. Why is that a

weird question? What are you basing your whole premise on? Where did you come up with the idea that a nominee should not advocate for candidates that nominee believes in?

I have no idea what you are insinuating regarding CT, but who cares...you made a claim. I'm asking you to justify it with....hell, something...not just a randomly stated standard that as far as I can tell, isn't even a thing outside of your own head.

[redstatebluegirl]

198. I agree, she needs to be sat down and talked to.

[bunny planet]

225. just found this....with more specific information about the protest

https://www.thedailybeast.com/alexandria-ocasio-cortez-joins-protest-in-nancy-pelosis-office-during-her-freshman-orientation?ref=home

[LovingA2andMI]

231. Attention Seeker....

Ignore her and eventually, the media will also. Not like she will get one real Committee Assignment so this attention seeking will wear thin, REAL SOON.

For now, she's the new Tulsi Gabbard. In months she will have to beg for an interview.

This Too Shall Pass....

[beachbum bob]

233. She will soon be irrelevant....

[Kaleva]

235. Freepers are having a good time talking about this thread over at FR.

"LOLOL! Now this is a great comment...

“It sounds like OAC’s behavior will land her some interesting committee assignments The House select subcommittee on recycling used fish scales and The House Committee on determining the legitimacy of obscure Scrabble words.”"

"You know you’re in deep doo-doo when the DUmmies are bailing on you."

What's interesting is that a number of comments over there are similar to ones in this thread.

"Junior congressmen don't have the luxury of pissing off the leadership. They have no power, they have no ability to project power. They're at the leadership's mercy.

She's just another vote for Pelosi or Schiff or whoever will run the show. She's an idiot, so she hasn't realized that yet, but she will and then she'll be a nice, quiet lapdog. "

"I’ll go out on a limb and say that she won’t last past her first term. She’ll be bored to death in Congress.

It all depends on how heavily she is “corrected” by House leadership."

"It will be fun watching Pelosi deal with this adolescent."

"She and her staff should sit down and watch The Distinguished Gentleman and Boiler Room."

"Rush predicted a few days back this little gem would be a pain. She’s feeding off of media publicity, and will not stop."


As I've often said before, when one finds themselves in agreement with Freepers on any given issue, it's time to take a good, hard look at one's own values.

[hlthe2b]

238. Frequent there often?

Most of us don't go there, don't give a damn what they think, and surely don't run over there to see what is being said about us. Why do YOU?

[Kaleva]

240. I prefer not to live in an isolated bubble.

And I do lurk there often. It's sometimes entertaining to read their posts when something goes south for Trump. It's been especially fun to read their posts as House seats flip to Blue and Kyrsten Sinema was declared the winner in the Arizona Senate race.

A better question maybe why would anyone here agree with Freepers on anything?

[hlthe2b]

241. "why would anyone here agree with Freepers on anything?"

they seem to like a lot of your pro-gun posts, so there is that.... hmmmm?

[Kaleva]

312. I'm very much in favor of strict gun control.

I think it'd be a good idea to ban semi-automatics, handgun and long gun, although I don't think that will ever happen in my lifetime. I support limits on detachable magazine capacity. 5 rounds is plenty. I started a thread in the Gungeon proposing a group rule that one would have to be a member of DU for at least a year and have at least 1000 posts before being able to post in the gungeon. Not surprisingly, that proposal didn't get far. I've written my state representative and state senator asking them to sponsor legislation that would impose stiff penalties on those gun owners who don't properly secure their guns when not in use.

I've been called a "gun grabber' numerous times over the years.


Here's a post of mine made back in 2012:

"A. Federal Requirements


Applicants for a Federal Controlled Ammunition License must:

1. Be at least 21 years of age

2. Be a citizen of the United States or an immigrant alien lawfully admitted into the United States

3. Have successfully completed a firearm safety training course

4. Not be subject to any of the following:

An order requiring involuntary hospitalization or alternative treatment
An order finding legal incapacitation
A finding of not guilty by reason of insanity

5. Not be subject to a conditional bond release prohibiting purchase or possession of a firearm

6. Not be subject to a personal protection order

7. Not be prohibited from possessing, using, transporting, selling, purchasing, carrying, shipping, receiving, or distributing a firearm.

8. Not have been convicted in any court of, or under indictment for, a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year (i.e. felony, or any misdemeanor punishable by more than 2 years)

9. Have not been dishonorably discharged from the United States Armed Forces

10. Have not been found guilty but mentally ill of any crime and has not offered a plea of not guilty of, or been acquitted of, any crime by reason of insanity

11. Have never been subject to an order of involuntary commitment in an inpatient or outpatient setting due to a mental illness

12. Not have a diagnosed mental illness at the time the application is made, regardless of whether he or she is receiving treatment

13. Not be under a court order of legal incapacity in this state or elsewhere

14. Not be detrimental to the safety of his or her self or any other person if issued a Controlled Ammunition License

15. Not be a fugitive of justice

16. Not be an unlawful user of, or addicted to, any controlled substance, as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802) nor reside in a household where resides any person who is an unlawful user of, or addicted to, any controlled substance, as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802)

17. Not be an alien who is illegally or unlawfully in the United States

18. Not have renounced his or her citizenship

19. Not be subject to a court order prohibiting harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner or child of such intimate partner or from engaging in other conduct that would place the partner or child in reasonable fear of bodily injury.

20. Not be convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence nor reside in a household where resides any person convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence.

21. Not reside in a household where resides any person who has been diagnosed as having a mental illness at the time the application is made, regardless of whether that person is receiving treatment

22. Not reside in a household where resides any person who has been under a court order of legal incapacity

B. Federal controlled ammunition license Application and Instructions

Federal controlled ammunition license application kits are provided during normal business hours by the following:

County sheriffs
Local police agencies
County clerks

Federal controlled ammunition license application kits are free of charge to individuals who wish to apply for a license to posses or purchase controlled ammunition.

Federal controlled ammunition license application kit includes the following:

Written procedure to obtain a Federal controlled ammunition license
Application form
Written procedure to appeal and the appeal process form if denied a Federal controlled ammunition license
Reference numbers for current firearm safety training entities

Processing Application

Applicant files their application with the county clerk in the county in which the individual resides. This must include: (1) a certificate of completion of the firearm safety training course, and (2) a passport quality photograph.
Applicant pays a fee of $105 to the county clerk at time of filing.
Applicant receives a receipt for payment.
Applicant provides receipt and has fingerprints taken by sheriff department or a local law enforcement agency. However, the local agency may charge an additional $15 for the taking of the fingerprints. Some sheriff departments participate with a vendor to provide applicant finger printing. There is no additional charge for this service.
Sheriff department or local police agency forwards fingerprints to the applicant's State Police for processing.
Once county gun board receives the fingerprint comparison report, they will issue or deny the license within 45 days. "


https://www.democraticunderground.com/117296531#post50

I don't think Freepers like my "pro-gun" posts.

[hlthe2b]

321. Pleased to "hear"....

[Kaleva]

323. You don't just have to "hear" it. Here's some more reading for you.

"I don't think attitudes will change much until so-called accidents are prosecuted
There's a story in GD about a mother who left two kids in her car while she went into a store to shop. The girl found a gun in the car and fired it. Fortunately, the 4 year old boy was only wounded.

In many such cases, the victim isn't so lucky and was killed. Like the woman who was killed by a boy who got hold of a rifle left out by her husband as he was cleaning his weapons.

Often, no charges are brought against the gun owner and the situation is described by law enforcement as a tragic accident.

It's no accident to leave a gun out unsecured or to handle it in an unsafe manner. That's criminal negligence and ought to be treated as such by prosecutors and law enforcement."

https://www.democraticunderground.com/126210448

"Many, IMHO, talk themselves into a need for a gun for protection
rather then research the statistics which may show that the chances of them being a victim of a violent crime are very low. In my own case, being a middle aged white male living in rural Michigan, the possibility of me being a victim of a violent crime are practically zilch. And yet on Facebook, since the recent school shooting, I see many posts made by family and friends who live near me who are adamant on the need to have a gun or guns for self defense. I don't get into discussions with them on this as it'd be like getting into a debate with a fundamentalist who believes everything written in the Book of Genesis is factually true.

Over the years I've occasionally looked for articles where a citizen used a pump action, bolt action, or lever action rifle or a revolver for self defense but died because the gun they had didn't hold more then a few rounds. I have yet to find such a case. I've read posts here at DU made by members who have said they want a semi-auto pistol or rifle with magazines that hold 10+ rounds because of the chance they may need that many to save their own or a loved one's life in a self defense situation. The chances of that happening may be less then the chance of winning a mega-millions lottery but they have faith in their belief and that cannot be refuted by facts and statistics.

Numerous stories are posted here at DU about instances where a gun was needed and successfully used in self defense. It does happen but so also happens where people win large amounts of money playing the lottery or the local casino. The state lotteries and casinos really advertise the people who win or the amounts that could be won but say nothing of the great majority who do play who lose or that people who never play in their life do just fine."

https://www.democraticunderground.com/12629818

"I have yet to see anyone hunting deer with an AR-15
I live in Upper Michigan and deer season is a really big thing. What I see are hunters armed with what one would consider to be traditional hunting guns. A recent National Shooting Sports Foundation (a gun manufacturers trade organization) study stated that 27% or respondents said that they have used a Modern Sporting Rifle (a term the gun industry is trying to get people to use for AR-15s instead of assault weapon) or MSF for short for hunting. Of that 27%, 48% said they have used such a gun in the past 5 years. So only about 13% of respondents have used a MSF or assault weapon, if you prefer, for hunting purposes in the past 5 years. And we really don't know how often that 13% have used a AR-15 type gun in lieu of another firearm. That could vary from just once to all the time. Not a high percentage at all and it supports my own unscientific observations. That the AR-15 platform is not a common hunting rifle.

If one goes to gun and hunting forums, which I do as I have an interest in the subject, one can find threads where the viability of using an AR-15 for deer hunting is hotly debated. Some say it's fine, others say it's borderline and the rest say it's inadequate and they wouldn't use such a gun and prefer a gun that fires a more powerful round. I've seen comments here that the AR-15 is excellent for hunting coyotes but they are really saying that the .223 round, and not the gun itself, is a great choice for hunting coyotes. One could get a H & R or Rossi single shot break action rifle with a scope that fires the .223 round and you are going to bag coyotes just as well with one of those rifles as one would with an AR-15 firing the .223."

https://upload.democraticunderground.com/100210239322

" Don't have a use for an AR-15 or any semi-automatic

Hoyt asked me in GD if I had an AR-15 or something similar and I said I didn't. Have a couple of revolvers and my next purchase will be a single shot break action 20 gauge shotgun. A gun that will do for me what the revolvers can't. Hunting, varmint control and a backup home defense gun my wife can use while I have the revolvers. It's simple to operate and thus train on and is very reliable as it has few moving parts."

https://upload.democraticunderground.com/1172206186#post31

"Put a bump fire stock on a Bushmaster AR-15 with high capacity magazines and you get this:
This video is almost 8 minutes long but you'll see why some folks don't want to give up their high capacity (so called "standard" magazines. This device is perfectly legal and is also available to install on semi-auto AK-47 clones.

If one wants to take the time, there are numerous videos on youtube showing how to "bump fire" most any semi-automatic long gun even without a special bump fire stock as shown in the video. Bump firing allows a shooter to send a wall of lead down range in seconds and the technique works best with rifles that are fitted with high capacity magazines.

Hard core pro-gunners will poo-poo bump firing and say shooting a gun that way isn't accurate. Well, it's as accurate as firing a fully automatic M-16 shooting the same ammo as the AR-15 or a fully auto AK-47 firing the same ammo as a semi-auto only AK-47 clone.

I've posted about bump firing before in GC/RKBA but it is quickly dismissed and I think it's because some hard core pro-gunners don't want the average lay person to know what one can do, legally, with a semi-automatic rifle fitted with high capacity magazines but that is just my opinion. "

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10022141644

"Bump firing a modern semi-auto w/high capacity magazines
In this video, one watches a man explain how to bump fire using his RRA LAR-15 9mm with a 30 round magazine:

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/82431826/

I've seen comments in GD about how easy it is to convert a semi-auto such as the AR-15 and any semi-auto knockoff of the AK-47 to full auto. I don't believe that's commonly being done here in the US. For one reason, a person can get a very lengthy prison sentence just for having in one's possession an illegal auto.

On the other hand, the bump fire technique coupled with the easy availability of high capacity magazines gives a person essentially a select fire auto.

Now here's a video showing a slide stock that can be fitted to many semi-auto AK-47s and AK-74s. With high capacity magazines, you got yourself a (legal in most states) machine gun.

For those who want stricter gun control, going after guns such as the AR-15 (which is an excellent small game hunting rifle) and the semi-auto versions of the AK-47 is, IMO, a wasted effort. They'd be better served by going after the high capacity magazines."

https://www.democraticunderground.com/117236419

"The biggest threat to a woman is a husband, boyfriend or male acquaintance with a gun

Interestingly, when a man decides to get a gun for the purpose of protecting a female loved one, he statistically becomes the biggest threat to her safety. "

https://upload.democraticunderground.com/10029587879#post25

[Blue_Adept]

244. You've been here since 2001 like me - you know people always bring back "outside" reports

This is nothing new at all. Hell, we've had legendary threads going on about them.

[hlthe2b]

245. thus the question... most of us lost (if we ever had) the interest.

[Tarc]

273. And many of us did not lose interest

I still have access to two rather high-placed accounts over there, they are used to subtly troll and egg on some of the more ludicrous threads over there.

Destabilizing FReeperland, while keeping an eye on it, has benefits.

[KG]

237. I LOL'd

[Awsi Dooger]

243. Some of us were criticized months ago for criticizing her

But it is easy to spot poor instincts, and she has displayed that flaw repeatedly.

Well, she will be mocked on the cover of right wing magazines and front page of right wing websites, that's for sure.

[LBM20]

248. Why do you give a flying fuck about right wing magazines and websites?

[NastyRiffraff]

249. I was willing to wait and see

I didn't really like her, but she was after all democratically elected so I was willing to give her a chance and hope her new position would temper her--for lack of a better word, impulsiveness. No more. She's young, but she's not a child and she's acting like she's in middle school.

I hope one of the Democratic women in Congress takes her aside and gives her a few home truths about behavior.

[Demsrule86]

275. she will be primaryed in two years in my opinion.

Glad we have a Democrat.

[Iggo]

283. In this thread, you're right.

[elfin]

278. She really irritates me - and she shouldn't

Perhaps because I am older. But even though I agree with much of what she says -- I really admire the effectiveness and experience and savvy of Pelosi that has nothing to do with her age.

Ocasio-Cortez is from a super super safe safe district that allows her to spread her wings without fear of losing her district. But I do not think her actions and fame are to our long-term advantage.

She is enjoying the spotlight way way too much. I fear she may crash and burn before she has any real impact. Other than dividing the Progressive movement.

Hope I am wrong.

[Whoa_Nelly]

281. We have another Dem in the House

Why is there bashing going on???

[Takket]

285. THE. ENEMY. IS. DRUMPF!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For goodness sake we're already infighting before we even get SWORN IN??????????????????

The GOP is laughing its ASS off at us!

[SubjectTrip]

286. Just curious

Why is there no ~300 post response thread about Steny Hoyer challenging Pelosi for Speaker? Surely him have 155 democrats backing him would be more cause for concern among the Pelosi sect than a young woman of color joining a protest, right?

[Denzil_DC]

295. Perhaps because Hoyer is NOT challenging Pelosi?

Hoyer is standing for House Majority Leader, whereas Pelosi is standing for House Speaker!

And it's a "Pelosi sect", is it?

Hmmm. Curious indeed.

[George II]

300. Hoyer isn't challenging Pelosi. He's vying for the position of Majority Leader, which he had...

...under Pelosi until 2011 when the republicans took over the majority.

[Polybius]

287. She would be banned if she were a member here

Facts.

[Orrex]

290. A few more ridiculous grandstanding stunts like this...

and she'll qualify to be a Senator from Vermont.

[Honeycombe8]

292. That's not a protest. Whoever called it that is wrong. It's just a grup of people to meet w/Pelosi..

to get an assurance or commitment on climate change. There is nothing to protest. The Democrats take the same position as the group does, and always has.

There's no protest going on.

[BlueWI]

294. The DU circular firing squad takes aim.

A lotta bandwidth wasted over a lotta nothin.

It's not just AOC that needs to spend more time attacking Republicans.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

296. Well, if we are smart and/or lucky, we will vote for someone other than Nancy

Her time was 12 years ago. Different era.

[dlk]

303. We Are Already Lucky to Have Someone with Nancy's High-Level Skills and Experience

When she is Speaker, again, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. Not all women over a certain age are useless.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

307. Her gender has nothing to do with it for me...

...but yes, from an age standpoint, it's time to pass the torch. Her generation is no longer the big voting bloc, and she had her turn to be speaker.

[NurseJackie]

320. Oh brother! GMAFB!

from an age standpoint, it's time to pass the torch.

That's very offensive.

Her generation is no longer the big voting bloc

We're the most loyal and most reliable. It's unclear what you're referring to here. I can tell you, however that "big" only counts when the "voting bloc" actually bothers to vote. (It reminds me of how people often conflate the word "base" with "fringe".)

and she had her turn to be speaker.

OMG... "had her turn" ???! Seriously? Did you just say that?? Unbelievable!

[Algernon Moncrieff]

325. I'm not your brother. Let's get that clear up front.

Offended though you may be, I want a speaker born after 1959. Xers and Millenials now make up the biggest voting block. She had the speakership. She was minority leader. Now we have the House back - it's a great opportunity to clean House in the leadership.

[NurseJackie]

328. Oh good Lord!

I'm not your brother. Let's get that clear up front.

it's a great opportunity to clean House in the leadership.

LOL! Actually, we've already "cleaned house". (I'm surprised you missed it, it was in all the papers an on TV!) Nancy's leadership doesn't need "cleaning out". She's the one we need, and she'll be our next Speaker. Might as well start getting used to it.

Democrats should be wary of throwing away one of the most disciplined speakers in recent memory. Pick a speaker who is over their head and the House turns into a shit storm fast. One more thing: Republicans ran against Pelosi this year and had their worst loss since Watergate.

[33taw]

305. Who would you recommend?

[Algernon Moncrieff]

306. Ted Lieu of Adam Schiff would be my picks

Or how about someone new, like Connor Lamb?

[33taw]

309. Are they interested? I have only heard that Steny Hoyer is interested.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

313. I have essentially the same issues with Hoyer that I have with Pelosi

[33taw]

317. I have no interest in Hoyer and like Lieu. However, I have not heard that he is interested.

Have you?

[33taw]

310. Nancy Pelosi managed to get house members to agree to the ACA after nearly 2 years.

Do you think that someone who is new to congress could managed to garner the support needed to do that. Additionally, Democrats do not control the senate. We will need to compromise with Mitch McConnell to get anything accomplished. Just being honest here, Conor Lamb does not have the experience or connections he needs to do this. He might have great ideas, but those will need a lot of work to implement. Think about where you work or worked - if someone new to the organization came in completely green to work, how receptive would you or other more experienced employees have been?

[Algernon Moncrieff]

314. We had a huge advantage in the House in '08 and 60 Senate seats

I'd assert getting the House to agree to the ACA should not have been that hard.

I am thinking about where I work. Frequently those in charge are those who've mastered how business is done today. Experience in how things were done 15 years ago isn't always useful. But what would be useful is leaders like Pelosi and Hoyer acting behind the scenes and transferring what useful lessons they do have to the younger generation of leaders.

[33taw]

318. The Republicans had the House and Senate (no supermajority required) in 2016 and

.failed to repeal the ACA. The reason for that was failed leadership. Trump thought he could get a repeal vote on January 22nd, 2017 based on the previous 64 votes to repeal that had no chance of getting voted on by Harry Reid or signed by Obama. He failed initially in the House and then McCain basically said “FU”. Pelosi had the same trifecta as Trump, but was successful. Pelosi appointed a leader that put together a team of people to work with republicans. They had over 160 meetings that were bi-partisan before voting. Even though no republican voted for the bill, they agreed in content. It is why it is such a struggle for them to repeal it. There are many good things for their constituents and they are aware of it. Throwing together legislation generally results in failure or mistakes. There were mistakes in the ACA even after 18 months of discussions and negotiations. Pelosi did not write the ACA and likely had little input. It was done in committee and my guess is with little oversite.

Navigating the politics of the individuals in the house in the Senate takes a unique talent. Whoever is chosen will need to recognize that the Senate will likely block much of their efforts. For example, Jeff Flake’s bill meant to protect Mueller will never see a vote under McConnell. Flake knows it, but is politicking for 2020.

Mentoring comes in the committees where relationships are built and knowledge transferred. The leaders have only so much first hand knowledge of issues, their main role is in getting people to work together. Pelosi is the public face, but likely has a very small roll if any behind the scenes, aside from appointments. The appointments are generally assigned by interest. Pelosi is far from perfect, but you need someone who wants the job. If Ted Lieu wants the job, I support him. But even the suggestion of Conor Lamb shows a lack of understanding how difficult navigating the house waters can be.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

324. The reason was they barely had an advantage in the Senate

Ryan had no problem ramming that bill through the House.

Theyd do it again in lame duck, but now they've pissed Flake off.

[33taw]

311. Also, any reason you are not reccomending any of the new women?

The trend in congress was for women, why not follow that thinking?

[Algernon Moncrieff]

315. If we were talking about the Senate, If love to see Duckworth replace Schumer

Sharice Davids or Cindy Axne strike me as having leadership potential.

At the end of the day, Lieu is who Is really like to see as Speaker.

Or, as has been pointed out - an outsider can serve in that role. Hillary Clinton could be a really interesting choice.

[R B Garr]

322. She is the same age as Bernie. nt

[Algernon Moncrieff]

333. Great. What does Bernie have to do with this?

Whether it's President or Speaker, I want someone who doesn't remember radio shows, Pearl Harbor, or when dinosaurs roamed the planet.

[dlk]

302. Let's Hope Ocasio-Cortez Grows Up Fast-Her Entry Level Antics Won't Get Her Very Far in DC

Her constituents would be better served if Ocasio-Cortez could figure out a way to work with other Dems to create something positive. Overt antagonism is generally a losing strategy. I would like to see her succeed.

[33taw]

304. I think she needs a mentor she trusts to help her navigate the politics.

Isn’t Bernie her supporter?

[nini]

308. I'm not surprised

I don't trust her.

[Kablooie]

326. It's gonna take awhile before she learns the ropes.

I hope she doesn't cut hers before she figures it out.

It seems like she sees her position as a citizen who protests the people in power instead of realizing she can be part of the power if she plays her cards right.

[Crutchez_CuiBono]

327. She'll learn. She's just a kid shot in the fanny with herself.

Save the protests for the gop little mamma.

[shanny]

331. heavens, why is this post still up?

[VOX]

332. Won't this zombie-thread ever die? Trashing ASAP.