At 11:52 AM on 11/14/18 MORE PROBLEMS w/ Florida recount reported

[Jeffersons Ghost]

Overheating machines complicate Florida’s recount battle
Terry Spencer and Gary Fineout, The Associated Press • November 14, 2018 11:52 am

FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. — Florida’s election recount drama is intensifying as lawyers return to court and tallying machines break down ahead of a Thursday deadline to complete reviews of the senate and governor races.

Much of the trouble centers on the Democratic stronghold of Palm Beach County, where tallying machines have overheated. That’s caused mismatched results with the recount of 174,000 early voting ballots, forcing workers to go back and redo their work with no time to spare.

Meanwhile, lawyers for Democrats planned to ask a federal judge on Wednesday to set aside the state law mandating that mailed-in votes be thrown out if the signature on the envelope doesn’t match the signature on file with election authorities.
https://bangordailynews.com/2018/11/14/national-politics/overheating-machines-complicate-floridas-recount-battle/

Most importantly, I have never seen an envelope with a signature. The news article claims a technician had to be flown in to repair the voting machines. So, did they have an army of handwriting analysts available, to compare envelopes with signed ballots? What about elderly and physically impaired citizens, who lack the ability to fill out an envelope; do their votes count?

[AJT]

1. What about young voters who never learned how to write in cursive?

I'm guessing that their signature would be different all of the time because of how rarely they use a signature.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

17. What about voting machines overheating? What caused this unique phenomenon?

[Blue_true]

22. Over worked. They are facing far more ballots per day than a normal election. nt

[yellowcanine]

2. Election clerks are not handwriting experts. Absurd law on its face.

A good lawyer ought to be able to easily get this law struck down. No one has exactly the same signature from one time to another. And many of the signatures on record could be very old - signatures change as people age.

[Blue_true]

23. Exactly. nt

[2naSalit]

3. In my state...

I vote by mail as does 1/3 of the voters in the state. There are two envelops that the ballot goes into when it is mailed back. the inner one is generic and only has holes in it to see there is actually a ballot inside but not any markings. The outer one is the one you sign, also has the postage stamp making it a federally protected document as it travels by US mail is confirmation that the voter has voted. If you miss an election you are asked if you wish to continue to vote by mail in future elections.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

5. Which state? Is there an actual "signature" on the outer envelope?

[grantcart]

6. Yes, AZ, I believe it is standard in most states

Also there is alone for some to sign if they assisted the voter

Also requests a phone number to call if they have a question

And they have a web site so you can track your ballot so you can see if it was accepted

[Jeffersons Ghost]

12. HOW DOES AN ELECTRONIC VOTING MACHINE OVERHEAT?

[grantcart]

16. I assume that there are motors that move the ballots through and if used

Continuously without a break they will overheat.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

18. In that case, they will break again, totally destroying the recount. but maybe...

News articles on voter recounts in Florida, are setting up the public for more Republican Voter Fraud, similar to "W" wins - AS A RESULT OF HIS BROTHER JEB BUSH - discontinuing the vote recount in Florida.

[2naSalit]

7. Yup. Won't get counted without it.

The signature is an affirmation that the registered voter actually voted, since the ballot is a fill in the bubble thingy. The signature is confirmed, I don't think they use handwriting analysis as much as they look to see if resembles the one on file. From my experience it seems pretty simple.

Here's how it goes in Montana:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10621252

[Jeffersons Ghost]

19. What I find most disturbing is voting machines, which allegedly overheated....

There are not details ANYWHERE, on these voting machines overheating.

[2naSalit]

20. Agreed...

that crap smells so fishy I can smell it upwind in Montana.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

24. Here's the solution to voting machine recounts! Let China control US elections

Ivanka Trump obtained approval from China for trademarks—including for voting machines.

Teflon Don Trump's daughter and senior advisor, Ivanka Trump, won initial approval from the Chinese government for new trademarks, covering a wide range of products, including voting machines.

It occurred while her father continued to wage a trade war with China, according to the the public interest group Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington, which first reported the approval.

Is Russia the only nation meddling in US elections?

I remember when China, under Xi, demanded EVERY international corporation that manufactured electronic devices in China, had to furnish back doors for China to manipulate their communications systems, which caused Google to stop operating in China.

[central scrutinizer]

10. Oregon

That's the way vote by mail works here. You sign on the back of the outer envelope. There is an inner secrecy envelope as well if you want to use it. My wife's signature was challenged a few years back so she went down to the county elections office and proved it was her ballot. The office is in our town so it wasn't a big inconvenience but still it was chickenshit

[Jeffersons Ghost]

25. At polls, do voters in Oregon put paper ballots into machines, leaving paper-trails to be recouted?

In New Mexico, we start with paper ballots, which can be recounted, manually.

[central scrutinizer]

26. Paper ballots

With bubbles you fill in with a blue or black pen so they can be read by a scantron, like many standardized tests in school. I assume the paper ballots are retained at least until the vote has been certified by the Secretary of State's office. They could be hand counted.

[Codeine]

14. We sign the outer envelope here in CA as well. nt

[Heddi]

4. in Florida, you sign the envelope (disclaimer: I live in FL and vote by mail)

You put your ballot in an inner envelope, I think they call it a secrecy envelope, that's green (if I remember correctly). You then put that in the main envelope. You seal that envelope which has your name and a bar code along the back and you sign along the back. You don't fill out the envelope, the envelope itself already has the address of where it is to be mailed to filled out. Your signature goes on the back and has a bunch of wording about how your sig must match what is on file, etc

https://www.votepinellas.com/Mail-Ballots/Mail-Ballot-Overview

https://www.votepinellas.com/Mail-Ballots/FAQs-Voting-By-Mail

Do I have to sign the ballot envelope? Is my signature going to be checked?

Yes. State law requires that a mail ballot certificate envelope be signed by the voter in order to be counted, unless other provisions are made pursuant to F.S. 101.68(4). Your signature on the envelope will be compared with the signature on your voter file to verify your identity. If you need to update your signature on file, please complete and submit a Voter Registration Application to our office, checking the "Record Update/Change" box in the top line. Signature updates must be received before the canvassing board begins canvassing mail ballots - no sooner than the 15th day prior to an election.

If you go here, you can see a picture of what the envelope looks like and where you sign
https://www.tampabay.com/florida-politics/buzz/2018/11/05/forgot-to-sign-your-mail-ballot-theres-still-time-to-fix-it/

[Jeffersons Ghost]

9. During lawsuits, where signitures on wills and other contested documents are in question...

Both the defense and plaintiff must hire handwriting experts, with massive credentials. These handwriting experts make plenty of money! Volunteer vote-counters and underpaid poll-workers are not qualified to compare signatures. Does Florida have a team of qualified handwriting experts to compare signatures; or is this more Jeb Bush Florida recount bullshit?

[Codeine]

15. It's complete bullshit.

I guarantee my signature doesn’t match my old registration signature, but it’s not an issue because I vote in person and nobody is comparing anything. My wife voted by mail, but luckily her signature is always identical.

My penmanship - or lack thereof - shouldn’t impinge in my right to vote.

[Jersey Devil]

8. Palm Beach recount was extended to 11/20

Election officials in Palm Beach County, Fla. will have an extra five days to complete a machine recount of votes in four closely contested races after a Leon County judge extended a key deadline for submitting election results to Nov. 20.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/416512-judge-orders-recount-extended-for-pbc-to-nov-20

[deurbano]

11. I hadn't realized what an issue the signature thing is until this election...

I mean, it would be ACTUAL voter fraud if someone forged a signature pretending to be someone else... but these ballots are just not counted? Why are the voters not prosecuted? Am I missing something? People with no expertise in handwriting analysis are unilaterally allowed to disenfranchise voters (often without ever telling them!)... but the premise of the disenfranchisement is that the voter is committing a crime (and apparently, tens of thousands of voters are committing this crime)... so where are the criminal cases? If the votes are tossed out, that's penalty enough for committing a crime?

I have never had to show an ID at my polling place, and as far as I know, my signature has never caused my ballot to be tossed out, but my signature varies WIDELY depending on how much effort I make (if I'm trying to make it somewhat legible or not), like if I decide to slow down and cross the t's and actually attempt to write all the letters instead of the usual blur... or don't.

[SoCalNative]

13. California mail-in ballots

the signature is on the outside of the envelope.

[Blue_true]

21. I recently had a problem with my right wrist. I am right handed.

I have been somewhat idle for two weeks because a lot of my work involves writing either words or figures.

I took a document that I wrote out longhand before and after I developed the wrist issue. The before writing flowed easily, figures were well formed and easy to recognize, the after was cramped with badly formed figures. Now, I knew what was happening, but if I were a stranger looking at the document, I would have concluded that two different people were involved with writing it, that is how stark the differences were.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

27. huh?

[Blue_true]

28. I guess the English language can be baffling if a person allow it to be. nt

[peekaloo]

29. Meanwhile Rick Scott was attending freshman orientation in DC.

I heard one of Nelson's lawyers talking yesterday about how these machines can't handle large voter turnouts and the only cure is more money to update them.

btw Gov. Scott, who campaigned as being personally invested in hurricane recovery, must not have seen the tent cities that have sprung up in Northern Florida. Too busy whining on Fox News about voter fraud and liberal activist corruption.