General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI no longer care if the Senate votes for impeachment
although I do want the House to vote a bill of impeachment. Trump is so compromised and hated, ridiculed every night on late TV that he will never get a 2nd term. After the Mueller report and the House investigation bring out more facts and evidence of Trump and GOP collusion, not voting to impeach will be the death knell of every GOP senator's career. Some are so involved and implicated (ya hear that Mitch?) that they may well have to resign before there's even an impeachment vote.
One thing is for sure that the GOP is chin deep in a sewer of every form of corruption possible. It is my hope that post-Trump, there will be renaissance of talk about ethical behavior. We hear from the GOP a lot of bullshit about law 'n' order, but when have you ever heard one of them talk about the self discipline of ethical behavior? When have you ever heard one of them talk about basic human decency? When have you ever heard one of them talk about the corruption of greed? Like no time, right?
So going forward, I shall be listening for which Dev POTUS candidates say something beyond empty platitudes about honor, decency, integrity, and ethical behavior. Which candidates will have a campaign platform that includes strengthening campaign finance laws? Which candidates eschew campaign contributions from corporate bad actors, pirates, and environment degraders? I hope that they all talk about this. We shall see.
pecosbob
(7,538 posts)I believe it to be an issue of moral responsibility. The House has an obligation to impeach, regardless of the consequence. I do not believe for a minute that this will negatively impact Democratic turnout next year, but will energize GOTV efforts.
N_E_1 for Tennis
(9,721 posts)Could be the only reason thats good about Individual #1 being where he is. It will take really strong candidates to refuse corporate corrupt money but thats what must be done.
Ponietz
(2,966 posts)pecosbob
(7,538 posts)From Pruit and Zinke, to both of the DeVos siblings, to the Senators and Representatives in Putin's pocket. Failure to do so is to admit that we have two sets of laws in the nation...one for the rich and one for the poor.
elocs
(22,569 posts)but they can destroy him with a political death of a thousand cuts with enough investigations to bring him down. Then when they have built a strong case with lots of evidence, impeach him.
empedocles
(15,751 posts). . . imo, the case against trump needs to be as fully developed as possible. Important for making sure we get rid of trump, with broad support, that will better support efforts to root out as well as legislate against corruption, do full justice, etc.
vlyons
(10,252 posts)to vote a BILL of impeachment
populistdriven
(5,644 posts)The only possible way to make us whole is to reverse absolutely everything he did. The only way this is possible is with Democratic house, Senate, White house and 2+ supreme Court justices.
And that will never happen if he is impeached.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)The House impeaches the president. Think of it as a political indictment. Impeachment is the act of bringing charges in the House. Thats it, nothing more. Bill Clinton was impeached. He was then aquitted of the charges in the Senate.
The Senate holds a TRIAL to determine whether the articles of impeachment are valid. Each article is voted on separately. Each article must garner 67 guilty votes to remove the president. A single article garnering 67 votes of guilty is enough to remove the president.
Words matter. Please dont make up terms like voting for impeachment in the Senate. Thats like saying that the Senate votes to indict the president.
brooklynite
(94,519 posts)And if they fail to vote to convict him, effectively he's been acquitted. That's worse than not impeaching him in the first place.
Joe941
(2,848 posts)vlyons
(10,252 posts)the Senate does in effect vote to impeach and remove from office. You missed my point entirely
stopbush
(24,396 posts)Impeachment is the act of bringing charges. Thats it. It has no other meaning beyond that, no matter what you think. The Senate votes to remove from office. They do not vote to impeach. Whether the president is found guilty or not guilty they were still impeached by the House.
You are missing the point that words have meanings, especially a word as specific as impeachment.
Ill make it clear thru an example: if Mueller indicts tRump and tRump must face those charges in a criminal court, that court will decide his guilt or innocence. What they will NOT do is in effect indict the president if he is found guilty. The indictment has nothing to do with the finding of guilt or innocence. Same thing with impeachment.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Baltimike
(4,143 posts)is trying to save him. He will survive impeachment bc of Moscow Mitch and the Senate, and that will just bolster his low iq base.
Fuck that.
drmeow
(5,017 posts)and cronies. Trump's children (except Tiffany - she's exempt) and their spouses are young enough to be able to continue to do serious damage and commit lots more crime. I want them stopped. I want them stripped of their ill-gotten gains. I do not think than any of them can be rehabilitated so punishment is the only way to protect people from them.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)elocs
(22,569 posts)And if they don't impeach Trump, what will you do then?
vlyons
(10,252 posts)Living in Texas, I especially want to see Cornyn defeated
Takket
(21,563 posts)We need Mueller's report to lay out all the crimes, and the report is clearly going to contain a MULTITUDE of them.
At that point, the House will impeach and all the Dems Senators will vote to convict in the trial.
If ignoring the mountain of evidence to not risk pissing off their base compels the GOP senators to vote to acquit, they are certainly welcome to roll the dice and send that message out to the electorate. It won't work out well for them. The GOP will lose independents and 2020 will be one of the greatest electoral bloodbaths of all time.
whether GOP senators vote for or against is now irrelevant. Trump is toast already, and soon to be burnt toast. The crimes of Trump and his cronies and enablers will be laid out for all to see and hear. So go ahead GOP senators, vote to acquit and watch your party go the way of the Whig party.
woofless
(2,670 posts)for going forward with impeachment.
https://link.esquire.com/view/5bef5d642ddf9c2d0d43d18f96hpm.1hy/1d604444
Buckeyeblue
(5,499 posts)Depending on what else comes out, they may not have as choice. 45 will only resign if he gets something out of it. Which will make it harder for them. But who cares.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)convicted and tossed out of office.
Hermit-The-Prog
(33,337 posts)There is enough known already to bring articles of impeachment, it's just not enough for about half the country. By the time the House finishes investigating, it will be enough for all but deplorables. That will be the proper time to impeach.
It will then be an obvious dereliction of duty if the GOP Senate refuses to convict. Regardless of what the Senate might or might not do, if the Democratic House refuses to impeach when it's the obvious course to most of the country, Democrats will be seen to have failed to do their duty.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)He makes Nixon look like an amateur crook.
Hermit-The-Prog
(33,337 posts)The House has promised more pressing things first -- such as voting rights and voter suppression.
brooklynite
(94,519 posts)None of them said that voters wanted them to focus on investigating/Impeaching Trump
Hermit-The-Prog
(33,337 posts)Most voters don't follow these events as closely as folks do here. As the news gets filled with more and more scandals, investigations and indictments, more people will be catching up. The House will be investigating multiple fronts and that, also, will make the news. When Mueller finishes, it's going to hit the news.
At some point, if he doesn't resign, impeachment will be the focus of voters. The disapproval rating in polls will change to impeachment rating. Watergate is the closest thing I can remember, and it wasn't as dirty, as widespread, nor international like this. The general public is going to get madder before 2020.
Meowmee
(5,164 posts)Threatened with impeachment/ charges etc he will resign, I doubt it though. Id like to see him and P ousted one way or another and Nancy is prez😹
KWR65
(1,098 posts)LBM20
(1,580 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)The only occurrences that could persuade me to oppose impeachment is if Mueller and the SDNY exonerate Individual #1.
Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)LiberalLovinLug
(14,173 posts)And more so, that its trending that way.
But hopefully that would change once more details of his crimes comes out. Although I have a hard time trying to find reasons why anyone would not think there is more than enough now.
Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)But not everyone thinks alike.