A GREAT rape analogy...

[Playinghardball]

[demmiblue]

1. A LAME rape analogy, imho.

This is not even close to being comparable.

[Warpy]

2. I think it's pretty apt

and shows that minor property crime is treated very differently from the soul crushing experience of being raped.

They care about twenty bucks in a wallet. They don't seem to care about forced sex.

[demmiblue]

3. No, it is an attempt to equate the two. Hence the word 'analogy'. n/t

[Curtland1015]

5. It's not saying mugging is as bad as rape.

It's attacking the logic used to justify crime.

I think it works well.

[CatWoman]

8. I'm with you

[demmiblue]

10. Perhaps. However, I do not think that it is a good comparison.

I do realize the intent, yet I find it lacking.

[gollygee]

11. How do you find it lacking?

[demmiblue]

13. I guess that I feel that...

giving up one's pocket is no where near giving up one's soul.

I think part of my response is due to reading many DU women's accounts of being raped/molested in the last week.

[gollygee]

16. I see

Yes, it isn't as horrible a crime. Though I don't think that's where the author was trying to draw a comparison.

[demmiblue]

18. I am glad that we can agree to disagree.

I, too, don't think that that was the intention... but I still stand behind my first impression.

[Moosepoop]

23. I did not give up my soul.

I was raped and, granted, it was a horrible experience with a lot of emotional/mental aftermath.

But one thing I did not lose in the ordeal was my soul.

Do you really mean to tell me that since I have survived rape I now have no soul??

That sentiment is what is lame. The OP is excellent. Take a rape victim's word for it.

[demmiblue]

26. No, not at all.

I am talking about the immediate effects. The feeling of loss, the feeling of weakness, the feeling that that person took your soul for a moment in time. NO, they didn't take it forever. Of course not. I am sorry that you can't recognize someone who is in your corner.

[Moosepoop]

30. I'm not so sure that you are in my corner.

The OP speaks for me -- I have used the same analogy myself many times. For whatever reason, you are trashing the OP, presumably because you feel it does some sort of disservice to rape survivors. It does not, whereas your comments do. I'm sorry that you can't recognize being given perspective from someone who has it.

[Warpy]

27. They're not comparing the seriousness of the crimes

They're only comparing the different legal reactions to them.

You can complain about the false equivalency between rape and mugging, but that's really not the point here.

[treestar]

6. An analogy does not mean equality

It's an illustration.

It's my pet peeve when people say how dare you compare such and such! Anything can be compared - no one is saying they are equally "bad" but using the comparison to explain something.

To me it's the ultimate anti-intellectualism - trying to use emotion to prevent an explanation.

[valerief]

22. Are you from Kansas? nt

[demmiblue]

28. No, I am from MI.

I don't understand the nastiness that is directed toward me.

I simply took the OP in a different way.

[valerief]

29. I dunno. I think if you used the 'inadequate' instead of 'lame' it might have gone over better.

Not that I agree with you. I think it's a great rewrite.

[tblue37]

25. The word "analogy" does NOT imply equivalence. It means that

Last edited Tue Aug 21, 2012, 02:25 PM - Edit history (1)

there are significant similarities in certain key features of two things that are relevant to a point you wish to make.

The idea that a cop would assume that a victim of a mugging is not really a victim if that person did not resist being mugged by screaming or fighting back, even if in fear of his life, is as absurd as the idea of saying a woman was not really raped if she didn't fight back or scream for help when raped. Also, the idea that someone who voluntarily gives money away (philanthropy) has lost the right to complain if someone takes his money against his will is as absurd as the idea that a woman who willingly has sex with other men therefore loses her right to say no if someone wants to take sex from her without her consent.

The GOP definition of rape ("forcible rape&quot says that if the woman doesn't scream for help or fight back, and if she has in the past willingly had sex with other men, then when she claims to have been raped, her claims can be dismissed, because her lack of resistance and her previous sexual history indicate that she probably had sex willingly and now just wants to ruin a guy's life by accusing him falsely of rape.

The relevant features of the mugging story are precisely applicable to the GOP perception of rape, and thus reveal clearly how absurd are the GOP claims about what defines rape.

No attempt is being made to say rape is the same as mugging--just that the absurd attitude of the GOP is the same (and as unconscionable) as the absurd attitude of the cop in the mugging story.

Those who are unable to understand why the GOP definition of rape is so wrong can easily see how wrong that attitude is in the mugging story, so the mugging story can help some of them overcome their stupidity on this topic, which is what everyone who deplores rape should want!

[spooky3]

31. Excellent explanation n/t

[icarusxat]

38. well put

totally understandable and courteously written
thank you for giving us clarity

[jeff47]

4. One tip:

If you hope to convince anyone, you have to actually explain why the analogy is wrong.

[The Doctor.]

12. The analogy isn't to 'Rape'.

But the title : "A good analogy to what a woman faces when trying to report being raped" is a little unwieldy, so the author relied on the reader's ability to make that distinction.

Can you see the distinction now?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

34. For a Right Winger, taking their money is "rape".

So while this trivialize the act of violence that is rape, it does put in terms those money obsessed types can understand.

[treestar]

7. that's pretty good

No man who ever was a crime victim had to face that - or women when it is other crimes, too.

[madamesilverspurs]

9. What IS analogous

is the response, wherein the officer (playing the part of the powers that be) utterly invalidates the victim's experience.

Having been on the receiving end of the assault and the invalidating response, I choose to share this with others.

Thanks for posting it.

-

[redqueen]

14. I'd like to see a booze reference...

Officer: And did you have anything to drink?
Man: Yes, why?
Officer: Are you sure you didn't just have a little too much, offer the man some money, and now you're just regretting that decision?
Man: WTF?

[Raine1967]

15. +1 n/t

[gollygee]

17. Or whether he was wearing expensive clothing, showing off how much money he had

"Did you look particularly wealthy that evening?"

[mopinko]

32. "were you wearing a rolex?"

"yes, i wear a rolex"
"sir, why don't you just think about this and call us back tomorrow if you still want to press charges."

[freshwest]

19. Perfect, just what it is. And I have been in safety classes where the police told the women to not

Fight back if the guy has a weapon, because he'll kill you with it and to only fight back if he's trying to remove you to another location, which means you won't be coming back alive.

They also advised us to all take self-defense courses, karate or get a license to carry. So we did. We were advised to keep our vehicles in good condition, not go out alone, at night and lot of things like looking around parking lots, the back seat, etc.

Of course this was back in the old days. I have no idea what the police tell women now.

If a woman does not have the protection of her own vehicle and has to walk or ride a bus, which is more common with poverty, her chances of rape rise. That's why cutting services and Medicaid funding for women to control the after affects is a double tax on the poor and should never be allowed.

Part of being a woman is knowing that the possibility is out there and arrange accordingly, although it's not enough, as sometimes the rapist is not a stranger.

This is a great analogy here. Thanks for posting it, because it that right wing thinking pattern, saying that women are dishonest and can't be trusted, they must be lying about rape.

[redqueen]

20. They still say all that, and to have flats or sneakers to change into

cause you can't run in heels.

They also now say not to park next to suspicious looking vans, and if you come back to your car and one is parked by your driver's side door, wait till they leave or until someone can watch before getting into your car.

Now that human trafficking has surpassed the profitability of the drug trade, they're stepping up efforts to combat it.

[freshwest]

21. Having known two young girls who were kidnapped that way, that's great advice.

The police see all the horror that society has. I would not want that job, especially in these cases. It blights one's view of humanity. I'm glad they are getting more involved in the trafficking because it is not a left or right issue. it's a human one. Which is something that should never be forgotten.

[CrispyQ]

33. The second location comment is spot on.

I've heard & read that several times. Get the hell out however you can.

And this:

If a woman does not have the protection of her own vehicle and has to walk or ride a bus, which is more common with poverty, her chances of rape rise. That's why cutting services and Medicaid funding for women to control the after affects is a double tax on the poor and should never be allowed.

This just makes me cry. The burden we put on the women in these socio-economic classes - shame on this country. My eyes have only recently been open to the privilege I have being white & moderately middle class.

On an aside, I read that women who carry umbrellas are less likely to be victims. I now keep an 18" piece of rebar in my truck. It's got some nice heft, it's easy to carry.

Your best defense in bad situations is to pay attention, be alert. Carry yourself with a "don't fuck with me" attitude. Don't be afraid to be an asshole. Lots of predators hope you will be the one who was raised to always be nice to everyone. Don't. There's no upside.

I sound so cynical.

[Lifelong Protester]

37. And I worry about young women

who are constantly looking down at their cell phones. They are not taking in their surroundings. I hate to say it makes me nervous for them, but it does.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

24. Better than what I thought it would be.

[JHB]

35. It's better than most, but can we find one that doesn't equate...

...forcible bodily abuse with loss of cash?

[Coyotl]

36. All dressed up like a person with money in his pants, what did he expect?

[RC]

40. Yep, he was asking for it.

Shoulda dressed like a dumpster diver or a wino.

[pacalo]

39. This analogy made me realize this...

Some men -- particularly those who write the laws & enforce them -- seem to think that women eat, sleep, & live for sexual encounters; that the pleasure is so powerful & great that we would be receptive even if taken by force.

There must be a lot of sensual power in a man's sexual organ capacity than in a woman's for men to believe that rape could have any mitigating circumstances. It's a crime, period.

Even under the best circumstances, a woman's main sexual drive begins in the brain & we need psychological stimuli to get us into the mood. I can only imagine how devastating a rape would be.