This whole blackface on Northam is really dividing and conquering us on DU and other progressive

[kimbutgar]

Sites.

It is almost as if this issue came out to destroy unity in the Democratic Party.

The Brietbarter writer actually did the work of Russian trolls.

Who benefits from the division of the Democratic Party over this issue?

Just asking not attacking!

[Iggo]

1. I don't FEEL conquered. Do you?

[kimbutgar]

2. Not so much conquered as divided and turning us against one another which is a form of conquering

[jrthin]

3. I haven't turned on anyone and I don't feel divided.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

92. Nor does ANY reader, not working for Trump or the DNC... check out a Super Bowl response by MLK...

Sounds like herding cats at DU...
Here are some serious issues:

"There's always more misery in the lower-classes than there is humanity in the higher-classes."

[McCamy Taylor]

7. No, because I can smell Divide and Conquer from 1000 miles away

and being a member of a union family, I know just how to counter it. I encourage everyone here to respond to this latest Divide and Conquest attack by either joining a union or forming a union. That is the way we will teach the 1% that we shall not be moved.

Oh, and watch Boots Riley's film "Sorry to Bother You." It is fun and informative. And buy a few Coup cds while you are at it. His band rocked at the 2005 March on Washington for Peace and NOLA.

[manor321]

4. No. It's a legitimate issue and some are being stupid about it.

He needs to resign. Now.

[EffieBlack]

5. Or maybe Northam shouldn't have posed in blackface with a Klansman. And once he did that,

maybe he shouldn't have run for governor without ever mentioning it.

And then once he did that and got caught, maybe he should have resigned with dignity when this first came out rather than by trying to pull a Kavanaugh and hanging on by his fingernails, thereby, causing Democrats to have to choose sides on the issue.

You can try to blame the right wing, Russian Trolls or your fellow Democrats, but this is ALL on Northam

[rogue emissary]

58. Thank you for this post.

[redstatebluegirl]

101. This.

[Codeine]

6. Seems to me the entirety of the Democratic leadership

as well as the Black Caucus and the NAACP have come out against the governor. A handful of older white people are defending him, but not many and not enough to worry about.

The dude is toast. We’re not conquered, not divided, and not defeated. To pretend we are is to buy into FUD.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

52. The white-splainin is not helping... it needs to stop!!

I stand with the Black Caucus and NAACP... period!!

[kimbutgar]

70. I am a black woman

Sorry no sympathy .

[stonecutter357]

8. you seem very concerned !

[jayddrew]

9. Who is really divided on this?

It appears the vast majority not named Megan Kelley or working for Fox are on the same page.
It's sad we must pay for sins of long ago, but so be it. What if he had raped or murdered someone back in 1984? Would we say, "it's so long ago, he's a different person now," and let it go?
Think about it: putting on blackface isn't an original idea. It dates back nearly a century in American pop culture, but even longer overall. And it is known to be offensive by every American alive as soon as one becomes knowledgeable of its existence.
In 1984, I was in college. If anyone had done that at any gathering I went to at the time, I would have called him out because it is highly offensive. This man was in medical school, age 25. He was not living under a rock, he knew what he was doing.
This goes back to the Democrats not being able to call out racism if we accept it among our own. He can ask for forgiveness and it should be granted. But he should step down from this office.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

23. Seriously?

Your comparing rape or murder to blackface?

[delisen]

71. What college did you go to in 1984?

[kimbutgar]

91. I was a working minority woman in the banking industry in 1984

I have a picture of myself wearing a Native American headdress with warpaint with a guy in an ape mask at Halloween.

[bobnicewander]

10. What have you done for (to) me lately?

There is no means to prove the racial intent, if there was one, connected to the picture. Everyone's opinion about it is just that - their opinion. And everyone is entitled to that. Each person's beliefs about it will influence their behavior from this time on. To be dumb, stupid, ignorant or insensitive is not necessarily to be a hater.

What can, and I think should, be done in an effort to elucidate a person's leanings regarding race is to discover their words, and most importantly, their actions on the subject by researching their entire lives as much as possible. People can and do change. A study of Mike Pence's life will show that.

Vice president Pence was raised in a family of Irish Catholic Democrats.

From Wikipedia, "In his childhood and early adulthood, Pence was a Roman Catholic and a Democrat. He volunteered for the Bartholomew County Democratic Party in 1976 and voted for Jimmy Carter in the 1980 presidential election, and has stated that he was originally inspired to get involved in politics by people such as John F. Kennedy and Martin Luther King Jr. While in college, Pence became an evangelical, born-again Christian... . His political views also started shifting to the right during this time in his life, something which Pence attributes to the "common-sense conservatism of Ronald Reagan" that he began to identify with.">"

[EffieBlack]

14. To be dumb, stupid, ignorant or insensitive is not necessarily to be a hater. Putting on blackface

and posing for a picture next to a guy dressed up in Klan robes IS necessarily to be a hater.

And an excellent way to elucidate a person's leanings regarding race is to discover their words, and most importantly, their actions on the subject and when finding conclusive, photographic evidence that they PUT ON BLACKFACE AND POSED FOR A PICTURE NEXT TO A GUY DRESSED UP IN KLAN ROBES, it is perfectly reasonable to conclude that they, at least during a mature period in their lives, were indeed necessarily a hater.

[bobnicewander]

19. Why?

Why did you attack me?

And why did you wrongly quote me by leaving out this part of my post? "...by researching their entire lives as much as possible."

[WhiskeyGrinder]

22. There was no attack in her response.

[Charlotte Little]

43. I second this

Folks on here need to dial it down a notch. I'm old enough (seriously I'm old enough) to remember when forums were just starting. Back then, debate got heated but no one used the "I'm being attacked" tactic like some members of this forum do.

[Empowerer]

48. And it is a tactic

And some people - the ones who speak uncomfortable truths - are the targets.

[Empowerer]

45. She didn't attack you

But I think you know that, don't you?

Reminds me of when I was little and minding my own business, only to have my sister fall out on the floor and yell that I had hit her, hoping that I'd get a spanking.

But she was five ...

[EffieBlack]

50. LOL!

You know you're wrong!

[bobnicewander]

99. To Clarify

When all caps are used as part of a post that is taken to mean the person is yelling. When that is in a response to a post by me I take that as being directed at me and when someone yells at me in an agitated state I take that as an attack.

My post asked for due diligence, an investigation, to be done. I did not condone the behavior by those in the picture. I hope you understand the difference.

[bobnicewander]

100. My post asked for due diligence

Quote of my post "To Clarify" (Reply #99) in response to EffieBlack (Reply #50) on Tue Feb 5, 2019, 08:29 AM in the thread "This whole blackface on Northam is really dividing and conquering us on DU and other progressive" referring to an earlier post by me suggesting that an investigation of Northam's entire life be made before judgements were made. (My earlier post referenced: "What can, and I think should, be done in an effort to elucidate a person's leanings regarding race is to discover their words, and most importantly, their actions on the subject by researching their entire lives as much as possible.&quot

"My post asked for due diligence, an investigation, to be done. I did not condone the behavior by those in the picture. I hope you understand the difference."

A new post by Yosemito today, Mon Feb 11, 2019, 03:03 PM:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211806056

"Northam opponents will not like this New York Times article"

[bobnicewander]

60. Your opinion

and mine are different.

She took words from my post (using a tactic of not quoting them) and changed their intent by reorganizing them.

[Empowerer]

62. We have different opinions but there's only one set of facts

And your accusation that Effie attacked you has no basis on fact. Yet you continue to smear her. Fortunately, everyone seems to be seeing through you.

What's your endgame?

[bobnicewander]

66. context

You see it your way and I see it mine. She distorted the intent behind my words in my opinion and I took that as an attack on me.

Finis.

[RobinA]

75. Sooooo...

sometimes it’s OK to tell others not to be upset by something, but other times it isn’t? Interesting. 🙄

[jrthin]

87. Oh good grief, stop the victimhood. You weren't attacked.

[mcar]

59. ????

Effie did not attack you. Why do you say this?

[RobinA]

77. Apparently

the poster feels attacked. I thought we were supposed to respect people’s reactions and not question them.

[Empowerer]

90. When the "reaction" is to wrongly accuse a DUer of "attacking" them, their reaction deserves

Last edited Mon Feb 4, 2019, 02:05 AM - Edit history (1)

to be questioned.

Everyone knows the poster wasn't attacked. We can all see what's going on here. But it didn't work, did it?

[bobnicewander]

51. Your Response To My Post

You get to have your opinion but I don't get to have mine without you rewording my post that

A. "There is no means to prove the racial intent, if there was one, connected to the picture."

and

B. "That "What can, and I think should, be done in an effort to elucidate a person's leanings regarding race is to discover their words, and most importantly, their actions on the subject by researching their entire lives as much as possible."

You don't know me. You don't know anything about me except for an opinion formed after reading a few of my posts.

[GoCubsGo]

11. Well, it was an attempt to divide and conquer.

But, I think it backfired, based on the comments of a majority of the folks here. Their attempt to take out Northam may also have backfired right along with it. It looks like he'll dig in his heels, much to his own detriment. He might not get forced out, and if that's the case, I think the remainder of his term is going to be pretty miserable for him.

[peggysue2]

12. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on the matter

We don't have to agree on every single point to remain united in the need to rid ourselves of Donald Trump. On the other hand, I think we need to be cognizant of how the pictures in Northam's yearbook and his nickname 'Coonman' is offensive and hurtful to the AA community and in 2019 should evoke immediate repudiation by the white community. Northam didn't help himself with that disastrous presser yesterday.

Terry McAuliffe spoke to the dilemma this morning, gave what I thought was a good response. McAuliffe considers Northam a good friend and he views him as a good, decent man who has worked hard. But . . . Northam has lost the moral authority to lead the Commonwealth, particularly in this moment in our history. Though McAuliffe didn't say it, Northam has also become a political liability. If the GOP put this reveal into motion (the way they did with Franken), you can be assured they'll bang the Democratic Party over the head with it all the way to 2020.

We fought over Franken's resignation, sometimes bitterly. But it did not break our resolve in fighting for a Blue Wave victory in 2018. So, we may fight like cats over this issue but there's no way Democrats will be conquered, not with the Trumpster remaining in the White House and a Republican Senate happy set the country back 50 years.

As Kamala Harris said during her rollout rally:

We rise together or we fall together.

[bobnicewander]

17. We rise together or we fall together.

Thank you.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

24. Nicknames are generally given to people by others

Few pick their own. At least that's my experience.

[peggysue2]

33. Agreed. However . . .

'Coonman' is a very strange and provocative nickname. The pretense of not knowing what that could mean is specious at best for anyone growing up in the good ole US of A.

Again, where Northam damaged himself was by not being open and transparent about the whole thing. I suspect he probably panicked when he saw that yearbook photo, realizing how damaging it was. And his initial apology might have been accepted if he'd given an honest explanation of who he was back in 1984, the culture he grew up in, the culture at the school at that particular time.

But then, the presser he did yesterday completely destroyed his credibility. I just don't see how you recover from a fiasco like this. Don't think you do.

[Charlotte Little]

49. Pam Northam

Is his conscience - made evident yesterday during that presser. I don't think my jaw could have dropped farther than when he had to ask her who the singer (Michael Jackson) was, then said he always liked Michael Jackson, and then actually considered, with a smile on his face, demonstrating the moonwalk after proudly stating that he'd won the dancing contest. I was 14 in 1984. I knew better than to don blackface to imitate Tina Brown in a dance contest, for God's sake. It was not acceptable at all.

He has got to go.

[peggysue2]

73. I always feel sorry for the wives

trotted out during these televised fiascos. I remember Spitzer's wife standing beside him when the brothel story broke. Agonizing.

And you're right, I actually caught my breath, thought the man was going to moonwalk across the platform. How to go from bad to worse without even trying!

As for the nickname? One poster informed me this is a term that Cajuns use among themselves. But I don't believe I've ever heard Northam claim a Cajun background. For the rest of us, the term 'Coonman' brings alive a very sorry past where derogatory names and racial slurs were the norm. They're meant to wound and they do; they're certainly not terms of endearment. I know one thing: if I were given a scurrilous or provocative nickname, I'd say: What the hell is this??

He's done.

[Charlotte Little]

95. Whoever posted that Cajuns use that term is full of it.

In the south, it means one thing and one thing only: https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=coonman

There is more to Northam's past and it's likely to surface. He earned that nickname somehow.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

97. I think the Cajun word is coonass

And it's generally considered derogatory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coonass

[peggysue2]

98. Ahhh . . .

Had no idea. That busts the Cajun explanation out of the water--how this is a term used among friends and family. And the fact I'd never heard of a Northam/Cajun connection.

[Charlotte Little]

46. Funny you mention that.

I assumed someone else gave him that nickname and it didn't sit well with me. Being a southerner, I remember some folks being given nicknames that spoke specifically to their controversial actions. A frat boy I knew in college got nicknamed "horndoggie" because he was known for getting girls drunk at the fraternity to try and bang them conscious or otherwise.

So, why would someone be nicknamed "coonman?" Disturbing and weird. Northam should explain. He also should resign like all of yesterday.

[Empowerer]

72. If my friends had started calling me "Ofayhunter" I'd want to know why

And if they meant what it sounded like, I would have made them stop. If they continued to call me that over my objections, I'd have found a new set of friends.

I certainly wouldn't have let anyone put it on my yearbook page.

[UniteFightBack]

13. It will do no such thing as 'destroy' the Democratic Party. nt

[Jarqui]

15. "The Brietbarter writer actually did the work of Russian trolls." Really?

Did the "Brietbarter writer" produce the blackface-KKK picture and get it in the 1984 yearbook?
Did the "Brietbarter writer" produce the "Coonman" nickname and get it in the 1981 yearbook?
Did the "Brietbarter writer" produce the hollow/inadequate responses Northam has in response?

There are more things that concerned me about Northam on race
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=11765247
that the "Brietbarter writer" had absolutely nothing to do with.


This is a favorite Trump tactic => shoot the messenger via "Fake News!" for example in the face of the media reporting on the nearly 8200 false or misleading claims Trump made during his first two years in office. A lot of deadheads watching FOX News have been sucked in but not many around here.

So you can go ahead and try to shoot the "Brietbarter writer" and try to blame him for Northam's alleged racist behavior but I doubt you'll suck many into accepting that point of view on this site.

Most realize that those reporting real facts - whether they lean left or right- are not responsible for creating or causing those real facts. They're just responsible for reporting them as accurately as they can. In this particular case, the image of the 1984 yearbook the "Brietbarter writer" originally reported has been corroborated to a substantial extent by many in the mainstream media and Northam himself.

[Empowerer]

74. The entire "Coonman who?" and "It wasn't blackface, it was Michael Jackson in shoe polish"

are sounding more and more like the bogus definitions Kavanaugh gave us for boofing, devil's triangles and the other boys will be boys hijinks he, Squee and the rest of the gang engaged in ...

[Jarqui]

76. It might be getting uglier ...

It is not a right wing media/blog as best as I can tell

Because it is not mainstream, I do not want to make a big deal out of it yet.

I was trying to find out the outcome from the meeting and this turned up:

Are Northam’s Supporters Engaging In a Whisper Campaign to Undermine Fairfax?

Ralph Northam has refused to resign despite growing calls for him to step down. Now, some say, his aides are engaged in a whisper campaign against his Black successor.
https://rewire.news/article/2019/02/03/are-northams-supporters-engaging-in-a-whisper-campaign-to-undermine-fairfax/

Quentin James, co-founder of the Collective PAC—a political action committee working to elect Black candidates on the local, state, and federal levels—is among those who have called for Northam’s resignation. Now, according to James, the Northam camp appears to have launched a whisper campaign to undermine Fairfax.

“We’ve learned through various sources that Governor Northam’s team and advisors have now decided to start attacking Lt. Governor Justin Fairfax by spreading lies to reporters and state leaders in an attempt to quell support for the Lt. Governor as Governor Northam’s impending successor should he resign,” said James in a statement to reporters. “This pathetic method of attack, along with the racist photos released on Friday are entirely beneath the office of the governor and exemplify yet another reason why Governor Northam is no longer fit to serve the great people in Virginia.”

In a phone interview Sunday afternoon, James told me that he and his colleagues had been contacted by several different reporters who told them that a number of Northam’s aides are speaking with the press and with Democratic leaders across the state “to sow uncertainty about Fairfax and his leadership ability. They are questioning his age, you know, questioning if he’s ready,” James said.

James said these comments are not coming directly from Northam, but members of his team. I reached out to Northam’s communications team to ask for comment on these assertions, but did not receive a reply by the time of publication.

If true, Northam’s team is making an already very bad situation that much worse.

Take it with a big block of salt because I have not corroborated it.

So far, there has been nothing on the outcome of his impromptu meeting with black leaders of his admin as of a few minutes ago when I last checked.

EDIT: Quentin James, who supports black candidates, was vocal and critical of Northam before for leaving Fairfax out of some of his campaign literature - which he alleged was racist. James may have some bias ... not sure

[Empowerer]

84. If this is true, it's further evidence of northam the unfitness and political inadequacy

First of all, the most important feature of a whispering campaign is that no one knows you're doing it. (That's why you're whispering ... Duh)

II he doesn't seem to know how stupid and dangerous it is to get on the wrong side of his electorate.

He really needs to go

[Jarqui]

86. It will blow up and really get people's backs up if it is true

Nearly everyone has called on him to resign

Why call a meeting with just black staff in his admin tonight and leave Fairfax out of it?

Why is he still hanging on?

It's starting to get kind of weird ...

[Lunabell]

16. Nobody is conquered.

His response to this horrible revelation has been less than stellar. He could have saved his career with a real heartfelt mea culpa, but I guess he couldnt muster a lie.

He needs to resign.

[msongs]

18. its a useful conversation that could lead to a satisfactory outcome nt

[yardwork]

20. I don't see this difficult conversation as a negative.

I think it's important to HAVE these difficult conversations. I don't see this as damaging to Democrats. In fact, I believe that this could actually strengthen our party, if it causes some of us to listen to one another.

It's progress, not perfection.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

21. I don't feel divided. I'm always aware that there are Democrats who have different opinions than I

do, particularly when it comes to labor, race and women's rights. Talking these things out actually makes our party stronger in the long run. I find it much more worrisome when people want to sweep racist incidents and racist people under the rug for the sake of "unity." All it does is tell POC that their perspective doesn't matter in the party. How helpful is that?

[guillaumeb]

27. Very well said. eom

[uponit7771]

28. +1

[EffieBlack]

29. Well said

People debate all manner of issues on DU, but it seems only when racial issues come up in which minorities express a strong point of view that suddenly folk start decrying "DIVISIVENESS!"

[RobinA]

79. I Guess

you missed all those Bernie discussions. And the Hilary/Obama debates.

[jrthin]

89. Well stated. eom

[Bradshaw3]

25. Not an issue we should be divided on

He should resign. Forgiveness is fine but he doesn't need to continue in office. Source of the story doesn't matter in this case. Age 25, in blackface or a robe, in 1984. Are you kidding me? Pretty simple decision really.

[delisen]

36. In 1984 Reagan was re-elected in a landslide & Reagan Democrats

were a huge voting block all over the north as well as elsewhere in the country.

It was the Age of the Civil Rights Backlash not the Age of Enlightenment. In the eighties America embarked upon de facto a re-segregation of school systems

https://historynewsnetwork.org/article/158887

In 1984, when Reagan won an historic reelection victory, 85 percent of Americans casting votes were white. Reagan got about two thirds of their votes. This by itself spelled a huge win for him. This is not to say that white voters all voted for Reagan because they were white. But Reagan rode the white backlash—along with other major issues, to be sure—farther than anyone else ever did in American history, before or since. It is long since time that historians of Reagan, Reaganism, and the 1980s overcame their reluctance to tell this basic part of that era’s history plainly.

[Bradshaw3]

37. I'm aware of all of that

Not sure what it has to do with my post, other than 1984 was the same year as the yearbook. Yes, there was racism then as there is now. But 1984 wsn't the same as 1964 when it came to overt racism. Trust me, I was around for both.

[guillaumeb]

26. It is the racism that is the issue.

And the Breitbart writer did not make anything up. If the photos had been altered that would be another matter.

But the photos, and the nickname, are out there for all to see.

[ZZenith]

30. Not much division as far as I can see.

The vast majority want the idiot gone yesterday.

Some people are trying to paint it as division but it’s really not.

[WeekiWater]

31. I see one problem with it.

Other than the fact that the ass hat should have never done it in the first place.

These debates are good for us. It's a debate about reality. A truth. People need to know where our party stands, as a whole.

My problem? This shit is suppose to have happened during a primary. These are not debates to have about a sitting governor. I now understand there might be reasons this didn't come out in a primary. To me, this is a statement as to the importance of primaries and opposition research even when it is Dem v Dem.

[Newland56]

32. If

I think if this never would have come out Democrats would continue to view him as an effective democratic governor from a southern state that strengthens the Democratic Party in a very important battle ground state.

I do think that the revelation of this has caused strife and conflict in the party and the party is less strong today than it was last week and the stupid, insensitive, racist behavior from 35 years ago had no bearing on the belief he is racist until that picture came out.

Not condoning the behavior but the mission of Brietbarter
Was successful.
We seem incapable of taking the fire away.
We can never seem to come out with something like “we are so happy to have a reformed racist that saw the error of his ways and dedicated his life to public service to make the world a better place for all races and all people through his progressive policies that promote the values of the democratic policies”

There
Story over
Brietbarter fails

[EffieBlack]

35. On edit:

"We've decided that we cannot reward a man who engaged in some horrendous racist acts but kept them secret and allowed his dedicated voters to be blindsided by it, inflicting terrible psychic pain on them, shaking their trust in him and feel like they were played for fools and, once he got caught, claimed that he is NOW ready to do the hard and painful work of atonement, which he admittedly didn't bother to do until two days ago, and whose continued presence as the governor of the state would be unfair and insulting to the state electorate, especially African-American voters.

We have made the difficult but morally appropriate and politically wise decision to request he leave office and replace him with the dynamic young Lieutenant Governor, who was popularly elected by the state's voters and who will help make Virginia and the world a better place for all races and all people through his progressive policies that promote the values of the democratic policies."

Yup. That works.

[Newland56]

40. And

Malcolm x should have never been allowed to have a leadership position
And Abraham Lincoln
And probably jimmy carter and John Kennedy and definitely Lyndon Johnson
And MLK’s alleged affairs
The list can go on and on

The point is
The NEW Democratic Party does not believe in redemption, forgiveness, and I’m afraid compassion

[EffieBlack]

42. Seriously?

Neither Malcolm X nor MLK ran for elected office nor am I aware the Democratic Party was in any way involved with or influential over their "leadership positions."

Malcolm X acknowledged, apologized for and worked to atone for his past behavior

Ralph Northam isn't being held accountable for extramarital affairs

Jimmy Carter and LBJ? Seriously?

Abraham Lincoln? WTF?

The NEW Democratic Party believes in appreciating and respecting the concerns and support of ALL of its members, not just the white ones. Do you have a problem with that?

Welcome to DU

[Newland56]

61. Yes

Abraham Lincoln said “mixed race bastards” and mixing of races was a threat to “the supremacy of wits men”
Yes he said that and a whole lot more.
Do I judge him on that statement as that was the total measure of the man?
Nope I prefer to look to his good
And yes, jimmy carter probably
He was a son of the south in a time that language and standards are very different than 2019
And yes LBJ probably
He had lots of tense moments with civil rights leaders
And had no filter on his vocabulary. I’m sure the N word slipped his lips a time or 2.

Now, saying all that
Abraham Lincoln and jimmy carter are 2 of my biggest heroes and Malcolm x and MLK stand a head higher than other people in my mind.

And the truth is, the apology didn’t do anything for Al Franken and he had to resign and I’m 99.9% certain that an honest apology from Northam wouldn’t do a damn thing to stop the calls for resignation.

[EffieBlack]

63. As I said-You're SERIOUSLY citing Abraham Lincoln in a thread about whether the governor of Virginia

should resign 150 years after Lincoln's death for something he did 120 years after Lincoln died?

Seriously?

[Newland56]

65. Yes

Seriously
Lincoln said profoundly racist shit a long time ago but his reputation is beyond reproach and rightly so.

Northam did a racist thing a long time ago

Yes I am citing Lincoln

I’m also citing Al Franken
And I’m also citing any position or leader who did something bad in their past but went on to serve the greater good.
And I’m also responding to you saying some of those apologized and saying if Northam apologized it wouldn’t do him any good at all just like franken

[Kurt V.]

34. nah. we may be momentarily divided on this one issue,

but dem solidarity overall is great!

[delisen]

82. I predict you are mistaken on that

[blue neen]

38. Not feeling divided or conquered.

Nope.

[EffieBlack]

41. A Democratic governor with a racist past that he never acknowledged or apologized for: Meh

Talking about a Democratic governor with a racist past that he never acknowledged or apologized for: YOU'RE BEING DIVISIVE!!!

[c-rational]

39. No, and be careful whose words you let define a discussion. This is imo a needed discussion

for all Americans which is long overdue.

[delisen]

83. It not much of a discussion. Lots of accusations. Little attention to facts

[PAMod]

44. There are other Progressive sites?

[2naSalit]

47. I haven't changed. I just figure that trolls are feeding the fight

so I'm staying out of it and aiming my focus on the prize, getting LOSER45 out of office asap and that's priority number fucking one.

[RiverStone]

53. I don't think this changes our unity against the orange racist.

Northam will resign soon, imo.

[agingdem]

54. no it's not dividing us...

the guy has to resign...period..two days from now no one will be talking about this...and no we're not eating our own...

[Texasgal]

55. What's so awful

about wanting to hold our elected officials to a higher standard?

[raging moderate]

56. No, it is good to learn all the details.

Last edited Sun Feb 3, 2019, 11:37 PM - Edit history (2)

As a practicing Luddite, I am afraid to go to any unusual internet sites. I have inadvertently introduced viruses to my computer several times. Now, I just ask questions here and then get the information that way. We are not perfect beings, but together we can work out the best choices. Of course, insults, accusations, and naughty words are all counter-productive, but adults can forgive these lapses in people who are upset. As long as we gather all available information and take time to consider all possibilities, we can build a reasonable consensus.

[mcar]

57. I don't feel divided

I do feel 25 YO man, especially one who is smart enough to get into med school in 1984, knows blackface and the KKK are morally reprehensible.

I also feel that same man 30+ years later running for office who doesn't seem to think said blackface isn't important enough to bring up, is also morally reprehensible.

[MineralMan]

64. No, I don't think so.

That we are never in lockstep with each other sets us apart from Republicans.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

67. Think how we'd feel if Nancy Pelosi wasn't Speaker of the House...

[treestar]

68. I think there is honest disagreement

And there are a few who won't even let you question their position without attributing bad motives to you. But that's the nature of debate.

There have been a lot of arguments on DU and we survive.

Remember when Edward Snowden did what he did? Half DU thought he was a whistleblowing hero and half DU thought he was a criminal. Same with Julian Assange.

The Bernie vs. Hillary primary did a number on us too.

Then there was the Olive Garden and the Moon Bombing.

[philly_bob]

69. Or perhaps more accurately, DISTRACTING the Democratic Party. /nt

Nobody here says it was a good idea what Northam did. We're parsing subtle nuances of blame.

My mind is more on Venezuela and Russia and Net Neutrality and the crowded field of 2020 candidates.

[walkingman]

78. He will either resign or not. Not really our decision.

[Kaleva]

80. It's only dividing and conquering those who wish to be divided and conquered

[DemocratSinceBirth]

81. If he heeded the call of the party to resign the issue would go away.

[delisen]

85. A subset of self authoritarian. Self styled progressives benefit. 2016 as the same

Susan Sarandon progressives.

A paraphrase from Vietnam War comes to mind: The military officer explained decimating a village: We had to destroy the village to save it.

[McCamy Taylor]

88. Yawn. I've seen worse. I lived through 1972.

[disillusioned73]

93. There is no division...

for sane people.. anyone still defending this guy needs to recalibrate their moral compass..

[DemocratSinceBirth]

94. I can't believe this obstinate clown hasn't resigned yet.

[loyalsister]

96. Or, revealing?

The greatest protection of white supremacy lies in the denial that it exists. Trump supporters don't have a monopoly on it, and to actually challenge it as a system demands calling it what it is and taking responsibility. Northam had his chance and failed, thereby actively upholding it.

[HopeAgain]

102. So, what does that mean?

Everybody has to defend Northam? Everybody has to condemn him? We should ignore the issue completely? Never sure what someone means when they say we should not be "divisive" on a controversial issue.