Zero tolerance for Dems but, no accountability for GOP

[Miigwech]

How is this gonna work? We throw out everyone and anyone while repubs continue with all of their racism, sexism, xenophobia! We need to come together to figure out how we are going to deal with this.

[guillaumeb]

1. Agreed.

There are 2 different standards. For the GOP, racism and sexual assault are just fine.

[Eliot Rosewater]

5. There is actually only one standard, democrats must follow it to the T, any variation requires

instant political death.

Republicans have no standards, no morals, nothing. Media holds them to nothing.

If any con ends up as gov of VA, we might as well all just give the fuck up because that will mean we SURELY dont understand what is happening.

And remember, as with Franken, even the least believable accuser was believed, someone we know was lying who was working with cons.

Yet...there he went

[theboss]

7. That's the ol' fighting spirit

Let's give up because a Republican may run Virginia for two years because all our people are complete shit heads.

[TheRealNorth]

79. They will be running VA for longer than that

Because they will then have the power to gerrymander the legislative and congressional districts after the census, and enact more laws to make it more burdensome for Democrats to vote (see GA)

[guillaumeb]

9. What is happening, in my view,

is that we are all seeing once again how racism is so foundational to everything in this country.

[Eliot Rosewater]

10. Of course many, not all white folks from that state and other states in the South are or were racist

no matter the party.

This is simple, either a current rabid racist or someone who votes with non racists. Which is better for the people of VA? Easy when you think of it that way.

many, not all
many, not all

many not all

many , not all sigh

I waited a while to chime in on this , but I am seeing a VERY CLEAR ATTEMPT to RATFUCK our party in that state from some folks PRETENDING to care about the issue.

All I have to say to them is FUCK THEM, and they can answer to any woman or POC in VA who's life is destroyed because they facilitated a republican taking over.

[guillaumeb]

12. I believe that Northam has evolved.

And I know that in the South, the racists in 1960 were generally Democrats.

[RKP5637]

27. Yep!!! And the southern democrats jumped ship when Johnson signed the civil rights act. In fact,

President Johnson as much said that when he signed the bill ... something like I have lost the southern democrats. And many jumped to the republicans.

[guillaumeb]

28. And they stayed.

So how do we move on?

[RKP5637]

32. I think racism for many is a core value and hard to shake ... and often they get their racism

reinforced by where they live and what they do / hang out with ... family and friends. ... sometimes I think for some it's a hard-wired brain function.

[guillaumeb]

33. Learned in childhood.

And we can see all of the young racists marching in Charlottesville, and wearing Nazi uniforms.

And we can call them out, but will they really lsiten and change?

[RKP5637]

36. Some might, but sadly I think for many it's far too ingrained in their default character. n/t

[Hassler]

48. +1

[Glorfindel]

52. Thank you, Mr. Rosewater. You said it just right.

"... VERY CLEAR ATTEMPT to RATFUCK our party in that state from some folks PRETENDING to care about the issue." Not just that state. The entire country. To quote Charlton Heston in "Planet of the Apes":
"God. damn. you. all. to hell!"

[Power 2 the People]

30. +1

[radius777]

55. Agree. We're burning ourselves alive.

Most whites (especially in the South, especially 30+ years ago) have had racist incidents, this is not a disqualifier to me as a PoC voter and how I look at candidates.

Better a Dem who once wore blackface/klan hood but who changed their worldview and embraced the party of civil rights (like Northam and Herring did, they wouldnt still be Dems otherwise) - than a Repub who as a party wears the blackface/klan hood in their hearts, whose right wing ideology is anti-civil rights.

We don't see the forest for the trees.

This ratfucking is all about 2020 and Trump swinging Virginia red - and with it the election.

[Blue_true]

13. And having sex with lovers while married and getting some of them to have abortions.

All the while calling on self a devout anti abortion Christian. The dichotomy turns my stomac, but that is the field that we are playing on.

I believe in karma, us being the true saints will pay off in a final and permanent way. Maybe I am just sappy enough to believe that good always defeats evil in the end, but I truly believe in that conclusion.

[guillaumeb]

16. The GOP has no standards.

But they are willing to attack Democrats.

[Blue_true]

34. Look what that got them in the 2018 midterms.

What we as democrats should focus on is nominating strong candidates that make a connection to voters and articulate policy proposals in easy to understand language. If we do that, we will be fine.

[guillaumeb]

35. Agreed.

And if any of these candidates are less than perfect, perhaps we should judge them by their entire history.

[ProudLib72]

2. Because we are better than they are?

I think it's pretty simple. Let them be associated with racists, misogynists, xenophobes. We shouldn't have to just because they do it.

[Miigwech]

11. Yes, we are better but when good Dems are caught in

some kind of scandal, why are they being tossed out to make room for repub's? Let's have a way to give Dem's ,accused, to have a fair
and transparent investigation before we throw them out .

[ProudLib72]

21. Ok, I admit that I haven't heard whatever is the latest news of the day

But I assumed you were referring to Northam and Fairfax. If that is the case, Northam's situation is cut and dried. Fairfax's, on the other hand, needs investigating.

[Honeycombe8]

46. Who are you talking about? Which politician are you referring to? nt

[Blue_true]

14. Agree 10000000000%. nt

[bdamomma]

3. Repigs

do it because they deny, deny and deny. I would like to see repigs thrown out, too many of them just stay in their positions. Just that privileged entitlement shit.

[Miigwech]

18. Agree!

[manor321]

4. This doesn't answer who in VA should leave, who should stay, and why

[Blue_true]

23. My take.

All of them should stay. Why?

One was a hyper privileged prick that years seemed to make a better person.

The second has an allegation against him that is appearing more to have holes in it. Maybe he should have done a better job of keeping himself in his pants, especially if he was married.

The third guy was trying to mimic entertainers whose music he admired. Were his actions boneheaded, yes, but they were not intensionally derogatory.

[Alliepoo]

77. Don't think he was married.

Didn’t the report say they were both single st the time?

[theboss]

6. I can't control them. I can control me and who I associate with.

We deal with it by being better than them and prevailing.

I like down and dirty politics, but I'm not going to sacrifice my deeply held beliefs to win.

I don't believe in "He's a rapist, but he's a Democrat so it's ok."

If Republicans can run awful people and win, well, that's depressing, I guess.

[bpj62]

22. Wow

Did Tyson say that Fairfax raped her. Can you show me that assertion in her allegation because oral sodomy and forced vaginal penetration or rape are two completely different legal definitions under most criminal codes. But hey please continue on your tour of accusing Fairfax of being the second coming of Ted Bundy.

[theboss]

24. Fine, he's an accused sexual assaulter, but he's on our side

I was thinking in general. But I get the confusion.

[ehrnst]

83. You should write screenplays.

You have a vivid imagination for dialogue.

[Blue_true]

25. Wow, I think you misread what the poster wrote.

The point seemed to be that republicans excuse all gross acts because the person is a repug. We know that is 2016, Donald Trump had real allegations of violent rape out against him, yet, he won the presidency largely on republican and evangelical christian support. The poster did not accuse Fairfax of anything.

[bpj62]

39. I dsagree

Currently are there any other high profile Democrats being accused of sexual assault? The answer is no there isn't. The poster specifically said "if the rapist is a Democrat it is ok". Lastly this poster has been all over any post involving Justin Fairfax. Thier point is very clear.

[Blue_true]

41. I posted several post with the poster on sexual assault.

The poster seems to be pretty convinced that not enough is being done to stop it. My point was that in the MeToo era, anyone that turns a blind eye to sexual assault end their careers and likely all job and political office prospects.

BTW, I still did not read the posters statement like you did. Too me, the person was saying "Republicans are hypocrits, I won't be". But again, the line was not about Fairfax in particular, but that ANY democrat that find themselves in a sexual assault situation won't get his or her support.

My position on Fairfax is that an unsubstantiated allegation has been made against him that, so far, only he and the woman were witness to. I have had thoughts about the circumstance. I am single and except for occasional visits from family, I am alone in my home, if a woman made an allegation against me for any reason, there is no way that I could prove that she is lying because no one else would likely be around and I don't have cameras running 24/7 like some on social media.

[bpj62]

42. Understood

As a Virginian this has been a very bad week so I am probably a little edgy at this point.

[Blue_true]

44. Yeah. I can't say that I am happy about what is happening there.

But, you guys did well voting there over the last two years. Just focus on picking very sound candidates for November. My guess is the current events will play out big in the primaries on our side, I think for the better.

[regnaD kciN]

26. Don't know Massachusetts law, but...

...in some other states, non-consensual sexual penetration of any orfice is considered rape.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

31. I can't believe we are debating whether forcing someone to fellate you is a crime.

It was a felony if and when it occurred:

https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartIV/TitleI/Chapter265/Section22

[bpj62]

40. Read my post

No one was debating that if he did assault her that it wasnt a crime.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

29. Here are the relevant statutes for Boston where the alleged assault occurred.

https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartIV/TitleI/Chapter265/Section22

It's a felony.

[Honeycombe8]

49. It's not a legal case. It's an accusation of something that was done to her.

She didn't use legal terms, and nothing any layperson says about a crime committed should be taken to be in legal jargon.

Whether it's legally rape, sexual assault, molestation, harassment, etc., is what attorneys determine under the governing law at that time and location.

[triron]

54. You live in a dream world. Sorry.

If someone is a rapist I would agree. None of these democrats in Virginia has been accused of rape.

[ffr]

8. And like the big tent party we are, we work through our issues.

Them? It's their way or the highway!

EFF that! I'll take a democrat any day.

[Miigwech]

20. Yes we can!

[doompatrol39]

15. For years I asked questions....

...about why we don't fight harder.....why we don't push harder on things.....why we don't call the GOP out and expose them on more things.....why we don't play hardball. Invariably the answer I always got was "We can't be like them! We can't sink to their level!! We have to be better!!"

But now when it comes to defending racists and racist behavior....NOW.....for THIS we have to fight fire with fire and stoop to their level?

How about the way we deal with this is stop electing people who do stupid fucking things including (but not limited to) wear blackface, put it in yearbook photos, and refer to themselves as "coonman" in multiple yearbooks.

[Honeycombe8]

50. Well, you misstated some of the facts there.

He did not put the photo in the yearbook. He did not refer to himself as "coonman."

I don't know if he should resign or not. My position is that Virginia should decide that. Right now, it looks like the leading Dems in VA are trying to oust him. Meanwhile, he's considering leaving the Democratic Party and staying. Don't know if he can do that.

But it's up to Virginians. He is their Governor. They elected him.

I find it hard to believe that if he has racism in his past, that this wasn't already known by Virginians. He's lived there all his life. A lot of people know him.

[doompatrol39]

66. Wait, how are those facts?

Did he state that unequivocally? Has anyone verified that students didn't pick their own yearbook photos, quotes, and nicknames as they do in most other places? If it's not his nickname did he also not put it in his VMI yearbook page where it also appears?

He was a Republican in the south until 2007. Really? You find it hard to believe he had racism in his past? I'm all about benefit of the doubt, but this strains my generosity in a big way.

[Honeycombe8]

67. Yes.

There is no evidence whatsoever that he referred to himself as coonman, etc. None. Zippo. A reporter asked him about that nickname, and he said that 2 people called him that while in school & he doesn't know why.

Plus, it's common sense. People typically don't give themselves nicknames.

[doompatrol39]

69. Why is it in 2 different yearbooks?

That, to me is evidence that just wasn't just 1 time or 1 rogue yearbook editor. Him saying he doesn't remember is not evidence.

So did 2 different yearbook staffs at 2 different colleges have it in for him? Did he not look at either of his yearbooks?

[Honeycombe8]

71. This is not a trial. You are the only one...

who has said he thinks he gave himself the nicknames. It doesn't really matter, anyway.

[doompatrol39]

72. I never said that he gave himself the nickname.

However, if it were just 2 people who called him that at some point and he doesn't remember why then how did it make it into 2 different yearbooks at 2 different universities at 2 different times in his life?

Again, those are evidence. We can see 2 different yearbooks with that nickname in them, from 2 different times in his life and 2 different locations/schools. That's not up for debate.

Northham saying he just doesn't remember is not evidence it's obfuscation at best, outright lying at worst.

[Honeycombe8]

73. Yes, you did. That's exactly what you said.

That's WHY I pointed out what I thought was your mistake. You had misunderstood. You said, " refer to themselves as "coonman" in multiple yearbooks."

To my surprise, you're actually arguing about it. LOL. Whatever.

[ehrnst]

75. Are you saying that VA democratic voters knew about this yearbook photo before November?

I see no other explanation of how your accusation that they somehow knowingly did the following:

How about the way we deal with this is stop electing people who do stupid fucking things including (but not limited to) wear blackface, put it in yearbook photos, and refer to themselves as "coonman" in multiple yearbooks. "electing people who do stupid fucking things including (but not limited to) wear blackface, put it in yearbook photos, and refer to themselves as "coonman" in multiple yearbooks,

Can you please state your reasons for smearing Virginia Democrats this way?

[0rganism]

17. problem is, the 2 major parties don't share a common ethos

for Republicans, racism, sexism, and xenophobia are basically part of their platform. it's what people expect from them. they're the party of rich white men, and their base knows it when they vote, and they approve.

Democrats have the difficult position of trying (or at least purporting to try) to represent racial, sexual, and ethnic minorities. this is the end result of decades of strategic partisan maneuvering. with a demographic shift toward majority minority population, the Democratic party is well-positioned to lead our representative government.

however, the unpleasant up-shot of this is when Democrats use racist, sexist comments, we become hypocrites and risk alienating a base that already has enough problems turning out to vote. when Republicans do it, they're representing their constituents.

[MH1]

68. Very well said. nt.

[Caliman73]

82. Exactly.

People seem to want to have Democrats hold Republicans accountable. We cannot except by showing up to vote for Democrats who represent our values. We do not police the Republicans. Call for them to step down are often made by Democrats but are basically irrelevant since we did not put them into office anyway.

We can only hold our own people accountable for the values we claim to represent. It is difficult to lose politicians who we believed were honorable and ultimately it is the decision of the voters and leaders in Virginia, but to say "We shouldn't hold to our values because Republicans don't hold to their values" just strikes as emptiness.

[helpisontheway]

19. Pisses me off because Dems want everyone to throw up their hands

and quit because we must take the high road. What the hell ever...And you think the Republicans that will replace them aren’t racists and don’t have skeletons in their closets? Please...I don’t want to have to live with Republican assholes running my state because the Dems did not vet their candidates. We should have known are candidates had skeletons....So pissed right now..And that headline on CNN website is not helping.

[ananda]

37. I know. This double standardism is wrong on so many levels ...

nt

[Miigwech]

38. Yes. We stand for truth

They don't. When they throw Dem's out it is not for truth but for their demented politics. The "noble lie"

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In politics, a noble lie is a myth or untruth, often, but not invariably, of a religious nature, knowingly propagated by an elite to maintain social harmony or to advance an agenda. The noble lie is a concept originated by Plato as described in the Republic.

In religion, a pious fiction is a narrative that is presented as true by the author, but is considered by others to be fictional albeit produced with an altruistic motivation. The term is sometimes used pejoratively to suggest that the author of the narrative was deliberately misleading readers for selfish or deceitful reasons. The term is often used in religious contexts, sometimes referring to passages in religious texts.

[lancelyons]

43. Not only that but the gop transgressors get elected. Nft

[Laura PourMeADrink]

45. Think we are supposed to do the right thing, say

the right words, over-apologize, not boo trump when he lies, do all the right things with hopes someone notices and votes for us

[Squinch]

47. How about we have a hearing on Fairfax? If she comes up with some credible evidence, he steps

down. If not, he doesn't, but we still treat her with the utmost respect.

How about that? It really isn't complicated.

[theboss]

58. Ok....where?

And who judges the evidence? Hillary Clinton? Howie Mandel?

[Squinch]

59. Good question, and I don't know the answer, but he is certainly not the first

Virginia official accused of wrongdoing. I imagine there is a mechanism in place.

[theboss]

60. Yea, they can copy the Kavanaugh hearing model

That worked so well.

I'm going to guess that all the Republicans think he did it. And the Democrats don't know whether to shit or wind their watch.

The Republicans are going to have a professional black woman in front of them and treat her like she is speaking from God on high and are going to wait for a Democrat to ask her a hard question. And there is your campaign ad in Hampton Roads.

Why don't we just slit our wrists while we are at it?

[Squinch]

61. The decision would be whether the Democratic party would support him. It would be made

by Democrats. It has nothing to do with republicans.

[theboss]

62. So we're going to rent a VFW Hall?

Bring in some folding chairs?

And have cross examination?

[Squinch]

63. As I said, I imagine there is already a mechanism within the party. If there is not,

given the current climate, don't you think it's high time we created one?

Why are you acting as if the concept of a hearing or investigation to determine whether the Virginia Democratic Party would support these candidates is ridiculous? I am sure the Virginia party has lots of meeting rooms at their disposal, so I am not really clear on why you are worrying about renting halls and folding chairs.

[theboss]

64. There isn't and we can't.

I'm a delegate to our state convention. I'm a dues paying active Democrat.

Recently, one of our local officers discovered that a candidate was lying on her resume. The officers decided to pull our local endorsement and all support. She's still on the ballot as a D. If she wins, she'll go into office as a D. We can't stop her from running or staying in office if she wins.

[Squinch]

65. But they seem to have managed to have a meeting where they investigated the facts, considered

them and came to a consensus that they would pull their endorsement and support. Which would be a devastating vote of "no confidence" if done on the state level to a Governor. Essentially, it's what made Nixon resign at the federal level.

Did they rent folding chairs for it?

[erpowers]

51. Do Not Throw People Overboard After Two Second

First, we need to stop throwing people overboard in two second. Second, we need to demand investigations to get to the bottom of allegations that are lodged against Democratic politicians.

[triron]

53. Pretty much seems that way doesn't it.

[triron]

56. knr

[loyalsister]

57. They have no standards for decency

and don't care what kind of fool represents them. I want to be represented by someone who doesn't have a history of offensive behavior that reflects a lack of awareness of the pain inflicted by bigoted humor and white supremacy.

[bigtree]

70. how does keeping bad people in our party in power work?

...why would anything change, in that instance, in the republican party?

We'd just be left with racist, misogynistic, homophobic, xenophobic government.

So many rationalizations for excusing these abhorrent behaviors and actions in the name of holding power. So many, period. This is wrong, on the very face of the excuses.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

74. One simple reason for this insanity....

Republicans have extremely well-funded clandestine teams of ratf***ers that do nothing but search every nook and cranny of any Democrat's past history. If they find one of our guys even let a fart in public 20-years ago, it hits their media megaphone and here we go again.

These are well-paid full-time assholes with no morals. We Democrats simply do not have that sort of operation and I hope the hell we never do. Republicans always seem to have the ways and means ($$$$$$$) to cover their past sins.

There will be no stopping or even putting reasonable limits with the ratf***ing until these groups are exposed and hopefully grounds can be found for taking them to court and sued for defamation. Tie them up in court like tRump likes to do until they're broke or just give up. If we don't, they'll manage to flip more states red. Not by fair elections, but by pure ratf***ing.

And, flog the hell out of them on social media and the Sunday news shows.

I'm also betting some of these same teams research their key Repug guy's past and help to scrub the records squeaky-clean, or perhaps even pay some people off.

Just my pissed-off 2c worth rant.......

[AncientGeezer]

76. Is Dr. Tyson a ratfu***r?

http://www.scrippscollege.edu/academics/faculty/profile/vanessa-tyson

[KY_EnviroGuy]

81. I've seen no evidence to believe that contention.

Have you seen credible evidence that she's a member of a paid right-wing smear group?

[FakeNoose]

78. You're right about the ratf*cking - it's all the Repukes can do anymore

Our only hope is to find all the Roger Stone wannabes out there, and get their asses in jail.



Can't find my rat gif, but this one is also apropos.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

80. +1, quite appropriate and makes me think of that old RAID commercial!

........... ..........