Here's why I suspect Barr deliberately shut Mueller down before he was finished:

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

Prosecutors investigating a scheme involving multiple potential defendants almost always start with the small fish first and work their way up to the capo. So far, Mueller has bagged a bunch of Russians (who will never be prosecuted here), small fish Papadopulous, van der Zwaan and Pinedo, larger fish Butina, Flynn, Gates, Manafort and Cohen; and Roger Stone will be tried for charges arising from his alleged involvement with Wilkileaks in November if he doesn't plead first. Witnesses who have spoken with investigators include Alan Weisselberg, who probably knows even more than Cohen. When Stone was busted, the FBI seized an enormous amount of data from his home and devices, and Flynn, Gates and Cohen are still cooperating.

This means there must be more evidence still being collected and evaluated that was not included in Mueller's report - because Barr stopped the OSC investigation. The reason the report didn't find evidence of "collusion" or a conspiracy with the Russian government (at least according to Barr's letter, which he probably wrote three weeks ago before he even saw what Mueller had discovered) was because Mueller was shut down before he could find enough of it to warrant more indictments, particularly those of Trump Jr. and Kushner. What he'd have done if he'd found evidence that Trump himself was involved still isn't clear.

The investigations are continuing with other prosecutors, and if there is prosecutable evidence of "collusion" (more accurately, conspiracy) on the part of any of the big fish, it will eventually be found, but it will not have the political impact of Mueller's report, and in the meantime Trump is free to twist and poison the media narrative - which is what he wanted all along.

[Kahuna7]

1. 100% nt

[riversedge]

2. Serious. Did Barr actually stop the Mueller investigation??

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. I don't know. What I'm saying is that it really seems odd that there are still

ongoing investigations; the grand jury term was extended for six months; Flynn, Cohen and Gates are cooperating, but all of a sudden the OSC investigation is over and Mueller has to issue a report that we don't get to see. And a reasonable explanation for it being over so soon after Barr was confirmed, even though it's obvious that investigations are continuing, is that Mueller was developing evidence from the cooperating witnesses that definitively, not just speculatively, connects Trump, Trump Jr. and Kushner with the Russian election interference. And Barr was called in to stop it. I don't know that this is true but this whole thing stinks more every day.

[bluestarone]

4. I'd say your right on the money here!!

And the RETHUGS know it!!!!

[BadgerMom]

33. It certainly seems your suggestion is just what occurred.

It’s my best guess.

[Moostache]

5. Well...do you believe it is coincidence?

A man, who pre-emptively wrote a 19-page letter condemning the Mueller probe and STATING that it could not find Obstruction of Justice because there was no Collusion, is sworn in as Attorney General about a month ago. He is in regular contact with Mueller after that point and determines that 3 weeks ago Mueller was NOT going to determine the charge/no-charge for Obstruction, instead sending the information to the Congress to fulfill ITS role in the discipline / chain of command for dealing with the Chief Executive...

Then a 700+ page report is distilled into a 3 page (look at it again, its generous to call that 4 pages when 1/2 of the first and last page are blank or filled with addressees) whitewash summary of findings...

Sure, sounds legit...and I'd trust my kids with THIS guy too...

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

6. Stinks, doesn't it?

[warmfeet]

21. Yuge stink

ever since January 20th, 2017.

I got yuge whiffs of the stink even before that - somewhere around June 16th, 2015.

I have been trying not to barf, every few seconds, ever since.

The orange asshole needs to go, and soon.

[Chin music]

9. "Can you help me put this couch in the back? I hurt my arm"

"It puts the lotion in the basket.......put the lot'...I said PUT THE FUCKIN LOTION IN THE BASKET."

[Funtatlaguy]

20. It puts the lotion on its skin or else it gets the hose again.

Great writing in that movie.

[Chin music]

24. SO damn creepy. That van part based on the lawyer who was a mass

murderer. Cant think of his name. He used casts etc to make people think he was incapacitated. Fricken creepy.

[robbob]

39. There's a robot chicken for every occasion...

[True Blue American]

51. Touche

[TheRealNorth]

11. The question is how would we know

At least we won't know for sure until we sit Mueller down in front of the House Judicial Committee.


You can't trust anything that comes out of the Trump Administration.

[Perseus]

26. Of course he did

Didn't anyone notice that his team started to shrink as soon as Barr got the job? They did it slowly, they avoided firing Muller because of the backlash it would have produced, so they did it surgically.

As soon as puppet Barr became AG we started reading about "Muller investigation is getting close to being over, another prosecutor has left...blah, blah, blah" I have been saying it here for a while that it was strange that Barr taking over suddenly the Muller investigation looked like it was close to "being completed".

Of course Barr had to do with it, of course there is plenty of proof of conspiracy, and the fight better be tough on the Democratic side because if these crooks get away with it, then brace yourselves there will be no stopping them.

Clue that there is conspiracy with Russia and that Putin is calling the shots...Venezuela...Pence and the buffoon with their bravado calling Maduro out that "all cards are on the table", then in Helsinky Putin told the buffoon to stay out of Venezuela...has anyone heard any more bravado from the crooks? Well, guess what, Russia sent military to Venezuela, and only crickets from the WH...Anyone need any more proof that Putin is calling the shots?

[triron]

8. I do as well. eos.

[dlk]

10. I Agree-This Web is Much Bigger that What We've Seen So Far

Mueller is a patriot and has, no doubt, found a way to continue the investigation without the continual attacks and pressure from Trump and his enablers to end it. There's no telling how many counterintelligence investigations are currently being conducted.

[Azathoth]

12. I think it would have leaked by now if Barr had directly intervened

I'm sure he made it clear to Mueller that he wasn't going to approve breaking new ground, but I also think Mueller & Co. always knew that December 2018 would become their de facto deadline.

This whole thing has been so jarring because it looked very much like Mueller was building larger cases. I mean, why offer Manafort anything at all if he's the big fish. But in hindsight, appearances might have been deceiving. Many of the cooperation agreements might have been struck to further counterintelligence investgations rather than criminal cases. Many of the witnesses may have given much more limited testimony than we assumed (I'm particularly thinking of Weiselberg here).

I personally think Mueller consciously punted on both the collusion and the obstruction. I don't think he had any stomach to go to war with a Republican administration, and so he focused on Manafort and whatever Russians he could nab, along with any easy process crimes along the way. I think his plan always was to dump anything he learned re the administration in Congress' lap.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

13. That's possible, too.

I just don't know - but it all smells very bad. We won't know what the real story is unless the entire report is released.

[empedocles]

14. Or until the Barr-Mueller story is fully investigated.

[mr_lebowski]

15. Well said and thought-through. I agree these are decent possibilities (nt)

[Karadeniz]

19. I agree.

[Hoyt]

25. Agree. If Mueller is half the man he was made out to be, he would have

said, “Screw you Bill Barr,” on Rachel Maddow’s Show.

[triron]

36. Pure conjecture. Lots to be suspicious of nevertheless.

[Hassler]

16. 100 contacts between this mob gang and Russians is a coincidence.

And as Malcolm Nance would put it, that much coincidence takes a lot of planning.

[Horse with no Name]

17. I've thought this as well

There was a hurried feel to this.
I wish Congress would get Mueller to testify before he falls off of a balcony or something.

[lunatica]

18. I agree with your theory

This whole thing reminds me of Rumsfeld’s idiotic verbal pretzel about the things we know we know, the things we don’t know we don’t know, etc. But we can certainly add things up and analyze.

It stinks and we know where the smell is coming from.

[zentrum]

22. Thing is, if I was

...one of Trump's hench persons, I'd feel heartened this week that by slither and lie and maneuver---Trump will survive the Mueller report.

Therefore I would not cooperate further with these new or on-going investigations, since, if convicted,Trump will give a pardon. I've always wondered why Manaforte did not give more state's evidence, like Cohen did.

[dchill]

23. Occam's Razor.

AKA "Duh."

[ElementaryPenguin]

27. Agree 100% also!!

Of this I am certain.

[Jarqui]

28. I continue to suspect Barr shut it down for some similar reasons

They were working their way up the responsibility tree and stopped before they were done with Roger Stone. They could have gone after others including Trump's kids.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/12/trump-william-barr-memo-mueller-obstruction-justice.html

A partial answer to the mystery is that Barr has publicly defended Trump on several of his pet issues. He endorsed the firing of James Comey, called for investigation of the Clinton Foundation, impugned the neutrality of Robert Mueller’s investigators, and defended Trump’s practice of demanding investigations of his enemies. Barr has a record as one of the members of the Republican legal Establishment most indulgent of Trump’s conspiratorial mafia ethos.

But a new report in the Wall Street Journal suggests a more complete answer. Earlier this year, Barr wrote a lengthy memo excoriating Mueller’s investigation of Trump for obstruction of justice. Mueller’s investigation was “grossly irresponsible,” had “potentially disastrous implications,” and other choice descriptions spread over 20 pages culled from public reports. This memo was completely unsolicited.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/william-barr-attorney-general-777041/

Barr has also demonstrated extreme views regarding executive privilege, and has argued that a president should be able to fire whomever he pleases. While serving as attorney general under George H.W. Bush, he sought to end the special counsel investigation into Iran-contra. While speaking to the New York Times in 2017, he argued that the Justice Department should be looking into Hillary Clinton’s sale of Uranium One rather than the Trump’s campaign’s connection to Russia.

A concern is that although investigations are currently continuing, what stops Barr from quietly shutting them down? Once Mueller goes to congress, who is going to say anything credible after that? I'd be keeping tabs on the 19 other SCO lawyers and US attorney prosecutors and make it known they might be called in to testify.

I do not trust Barr at all. Never did.

[Pachamama]

29. +10000

I believe that when Robert Mueller is called to testify and the questions are asked that we will discover that this is what happened and what we are witnessing right now before our very eyes is in fact more obstruction of justice.

Something is very very wrong and no one, none of the leaders in congress have seen the actual Mueller report and it’s very suspicious.

Schiff is spot on and I believe the truth will be revealed

[Golden Raisin]

30. Per Wikipedia Barr officially assumed his office on February 14th.

Mueller submitted his report on March 22nd --- 5 weeks later. This is after 2 years (pre-Barr) and with Mueller still asking for extensions on grand juries, indicating he was still going strong. It would not surprise me if Barr dropped the hammer on Mueller as soon as he was in power and demanded rapid wrap-up and closure. He was specifically placed in the Attorney General slot by Trump to stop the Mueller investigation. The assholic but, sadly, very effective PR stunt of the 4-page summary letter, which was eaten up like candy by media and Trump's deplorable base, was probably written on February 14th and held till ready.

[defacto7]

31. I think you've got it right. n/t

[Pepsidog]

32. Dems better start screaming release the report. WTF! Demand the report. Defund executive branch.

[Stuart G]

34. Question?...Who has the complete report? Mueller? Hell he wrote the report.

So, if he wishes, at some point, Mueller can make it public. Now, that wouldn't be according to the show, but fuck the show and the script. Barr and Trump can go take a trip somewhere. If the report needs to become public, then it needs to be made public. Congress will get the report, and someone will release it. One way or another..

[Ilsa]

35. A huge criminal fraud was perpetrated on us this last weekend by

Barr, trump, and anyone assisting them.

[Iggo]

37. Reason #1: Of course he did. (n/t)

[SleeplessinSoCal]

38. I also suspect there are many more guilty parties heading the GOP.

McConnell in particular has got to be a criminal.

[Victor_c3]

40. Question about state level investigations

If, for instance, the SDNY investigations uncover new evidence of a federal crime, wouldn’t they be obligated to turn it over to the FBI? Wouldn’t the revelation of new evidence open a new investigation at the federal level of one isn’t currently going?

I have no idea how this sort of thing works, I’ve had to deal with an investigation against me at any level, let along state or federal.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

42. The investigations leading to the SDNY prosecutions were done by the FBI

in the first place, not the other way around. That's what the FBI does; they're the cops, and they collect and turn their evidence over to prosecutors who decide whether to present the evidence to a grand jury. If the grand jury returns an indictment, the FBI (or other law enforcement with jurisdiction) arrests the target and prosecutors charge him. SDNY is simply the division of the federal court system for the area that includes Manhattan, and it employs a group of prosecutors who always work with the FBI. SDNY is notoriously independent and is likely to vigorously prosecute whatever crimes for which it has obtained evidence.

The state court system in New York, which is separate from and independent from the federal system, is divided into counties, as in most states. The New York County District Attorney is the elected district attorney for New York County (Manhattan), New York. The Manhattan DA is looking at various financial crimes - offenses under state law - that may have been committed by Trump, his family and his businesses. The federal government (i.e., Trump, the DoJ or Barr) cannot interfere in any respect with state prosecutions.

[Victor_c3]

43. Thanks for taking the time for the explanation

I learned new today!

[JayhawkSD]

49. The FBI does not work for the states.

"That's what the FBI does; they're the cops, and they collect and turn their evidence over to prosecutors..."

They turn their evidence over to federal prosecutors, not state prosecutors. The FBI sometimes, often actually, assists states by providing lab work for them, and consulting, but they do not conduct investigations in behalf of states and turn the prosecution over to state prosecutors.

@Victor c3, "If, for instance, the SDNY investigations uncover..."

The SDNY is the "Southern District New York" which is a district of the US District Court and is part of the federal court system.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

50. Also true. States have their own investigators

although sometimes the FBI will assist if asked. In my state there is an agency called the Bureau of Criminal Apprehension (BCI), which does a lot of CSI-type analysis. Most states will have an agency like this.

[Sogo]

41. I agree, and

I mentioned in a post the other day that Barr needs to be investigated for obstruction of justice. Effing scumbags, all of them!

[Silver Gaia]

44. This is what I've been thinking all along.

It's either this, or what he got from Mueller was an interim report just intended to bring him up to speed, a report that was never intended to be made public, but that Barr seized upon to use to interject his pet theory about obstruction and let Trump use for propaganda campaign purposes.

Either way, it's all a lie and it STINKS to high heaven. We'll never know what happened here definitively if we can't see the report for ourselves.

I am also concerned about Barr's son being hired as a Trump attorney. I think he's there as an information conduit and to ease coordination between the WH and DOJ on all of this.

There is massive corruption here.

[Nitram]

45. There is no indication I have seen that suggests Barr "shut down the Mueller investigation."

Other than some "gut instincts," what evidence is there that this is the case?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

46. As I stated, I am speculating and I have no direct evidence.

I made it clear, I thought, that this is just my guess based on the timing and the outcome, which are damned suspicious.

[Nitram]

47. Pretty far fetched, I'd have to say. Let's focus on what we know Barr did. He released a 4-page

memo and exerted Trump of obstruction of justice without releasing the full 300-page repot.

[pnwmom]

56. Here's what's not far-fetched.

Even though Roger Stone, a lynchpin in the collusion with Russia via Wilileaks, doesn't go to trial in November -- and may yet produce more evidence for the prosecution in a plea agreement -- Mueller shut down the investigation.

Even though Mueller had the budget to go on through September, he shut down the investigation.

Even though neither Flynn nor Gates nor Butina had yet been sentenced -- because they have all been participating in other secret, ongoing investigations, Mueller shut down his investigation.

Even though the mystery company and Andrew Miller are both still fighting their subpoenas, and so has been the Mueller team, Mueller shut down the investigation.

Mueller ended his investigation just a month after William Barr --the new AG who had written a 19 page memo saying Mueller's investigation was "fatally misconceived" -- was confirmed by the Senate.

Barr had testified to the Senate Judiciary that he met with Trump in 2017 and discussed Mueller; and he said he gave Trump his phone number. He said he had only spoken to him once since then, in connection with his appointment to be A.G.

We don't know all that Barr discussed with Trump; but, no,, it's not really far-fetched to think that Barr ordered Mueller to wrap it up.

[JayhawkSD]

48. "...a bunch of Russians (who will never be prosecuted here)"

You should check your facts. They are here, in court, in a trial being delayed not by the Russians, but by the prosecution.

The Russians showed up to defend themselves in court and the prosecution tried to prevent them by claiming that they, the prosecution, had "not been able to serve them." That service, the judge pointed out, was merely formal notice that they were required to appear in court and, he pointed out, they were presently in court, so he was unable to understand why the prosecution was objecting.

The Russians then asked for "discovery," which is their right. This is the presentation to them of the evidence which the prosecution has gathered against them. The prosecution demurred, saying that it was "not yet ready" to present that evidence. The judge was even less sympathetic than he had been with the prosecution's efforts to delay beginning of the trial. He wanted to know why, if they did not have their shit together, did they come to trial in the first place.

The evidence against the Russians has still not been presented to them, and the case is in danger of being thrown out of court.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

52. Which Russians?

Kilimnik is here but is not in custody and has not answered the charges against him. Butina, who was also in the country, was charged and has pled guilty. Veselnitskaya has been charged with money laundering in a case unrelated to the Trump Tower meeting. But the other Russians, the twelve hackers and thirteen media trolls to whom I was referring, are in Russia and are not likely ever to be tried here. Russia doesn't have an extradition treaty with the US. You may be referring to Concord Management, which is in court. https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/04/mueller-russia-interference-election-case-delay-570627 But the Russian individuals are not and probably never will be.

I always check my facts before I post. Everyone should.

[JayhawkSD]

53. Then I guess we both were in error.

I should have said that "some Russians were here in court," and you should have said, "...a bunch of Russians (some of whom will never be prosecuted here)."

I am predicting that you will reply that I was wrong, however, and you were right, because your post referred to "Russians" and not to "Russian companies" and that it is a Russian company that is being tried (unsuccessfully so far) here, and that no Russian individuals are and that makes you right because you were talking only about Russian individuals even though you didn't say so.

Got it. Democratic discussions are only for the purpose of agreeing with each other and providing mutual reinforcement.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

54. You predict incorrectly.

And I don't understand why you are being combative about this. You did accuse me of not checking my facts, which was not the case, so I offered an explanation. That's it. Relax and enjoy your weekend.

[pnwmom]

57. You were in error, not the OP. S/he was correct -- a bunch of Russians will never be prosecuted.

That doesn't preclude the prosecution of a single Russian company.

[JayhawkSD]

58. Talk about playing with words.

OP said, "Mueller has bagged a bunch of Russians (who will never be prosecuted here)"
OP did not say "Mueller has bagged a bunch of Russians (most of whom will never be prosecuted here)"
OP did not say "Mueller has bagged a bunch of Russians (who will never be prosecuted here, except for one company)
OP did said, "Mueller has bagged a bunch of Russians (who will never be prosecuted here)"

Absence of exclusion implies, if not explicitly states, inclusion. You can play all the word games you want to claim I was wrong and illustrate your intellectual superiority. That won't mean that I actually was wrong.

[pnwmom]

59. And you claim that I have been playing word games!

[True Blue American]

55. Thanks for the facts.

[MasonDreams]

60. Let's get Barr for Obstruction of Justice.

How hard could that be to demonstrate? Oversite after 2yrs of coverup aint easy, lets stop the cover up first.