Sun Aug 26, 2012, 05:37 PM

Odin2005 (53,521 posts)

We should have been colonizing the solar system by now.

In 1969 when Armstrong and Aldrin landed on the Moon everyone expected that we would keep going farther. But then in the mid 70s NASA got mauled by the small-minded deficit hawks who thought they did not need to keep up NASA's funding because we beat those Evil Commie Russians and that's all that mattered. It seems like all of a sudden nobody cared anymore, some even started bashing space exploration using the equally small-minded "we have more important things to do here on terra firma" argument.

I wonder if the Vietnam War and Watergate are to blame, destroying the belief in Big Government doing Big Things, making NASA a victim of the same rise of selfish Individualism that lead to the late 70s "tax revolts" in California and the election of Reagan in 1980. I suspect that also, among us on the Left that the strain of technophobic misanthropy found among many Green types who believe in the philosophy of Deep Ecology has something to do with it, thus the posts here on DU decrying space exploration as spreading the "cancer" of humanity.

According to astrophysicist Robert Zubrin a 3-year manned mission to Mars would cost $30 billion per mission and is perfectly feasible with today's technology. That is chump change compared to the "Defense" budget, and we would not have to pay all of that if it is set up as a multi-national mission. The problem is a lack of will. people either dogmatically assert that such a mission is either impossible, too expensive, or immoral, and all of those assertions are bullshit.

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809 replies	Author	Time	Post
We should have been colonizing the solar system by now. (Original post)	Odin2005	Aug 2012	OP
we can't clothe the naked. feed the hungry, comfort and support the widow.	xchrom	Aug 2012	#1
There is plenty money to go around.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#2
Sure we can. What Odin's talking about is couch-cushion stuff compared to the defense budget. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#3
perhaps taking me too literally?	xchrom	Aug 2012	#5
Assuming it's one or the other is silly. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#6
Agree with you in general but right now we have accomplished neither.	randome	Aug 2012	#8
That's assuming it's one or the other, which remains silly. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#16
NASA has made advances towards all those things	Nevernose	Aug 2012	#47
It bugs me how few people get how miniscule NASA's budget is.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#60
It's part of a piece of rhetoric	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#137
+1,000,000,000,000	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#138
1 Trillion???	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#141
Heh, there is that, yeah.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#140
I usually figure	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#146
They are the "small minds" I hate.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#174
to them...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#185
That reminds me of an old saying:	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#200
interesting...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#206
And is why the popularity of the Kardashians is depressing.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#213
I don't envision ever getting in touch with them	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#217
Huh?	Keefer	Aug 2012	#247
Made perfect sense to me...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#413
that is good stuff.....any idea who said it?	navarth	Aug 2012	#694
The reason we're not colonizing the planets is because Michael Moorcock and Samuel R. Delany	klook	Aug 2012	#353
nice try	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#355
Doc Smith and Judith Merril Fist Fight in Heaven	klook	Aug 2012	#377
klook	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#382
"Consies," they were called	klook	Aug 2012	#398
Defeatig republicans	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#399
This is really fascinating to me	navarth	Aug 2012	#699
Thanks!	klook	Aug 2012	#722
hmmm...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#732
Hey, Navarth --	klook	Aug 2012	#734
klook	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#742
wonderful, wonderful. thank you so much	navarth	Aug 2012	#743
Silverberg	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#747
wow.	navarth	Aug 2012	#762
SF seems to generate a new label every 5 or so years	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#765
That list really knocked me out....	navarth	Aug 2012	#764
Wall Street executive bonuses are 1% of the US economy, about $150 billion	krispos42	Aug 2012	#737
Quoting the late, great Bill Hicks:	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#72
Hicks was a fucking genius!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#73
Thank you. Nt	xchrom	Aug 2012	#75
Beautiful sentiment but unilateral disarmament doesn't work. Sorry. nt.	Bernardo de La Paz	Aug 2012	#90
We could cut our military 90% without getting close to "unilateral disarmament"	hunter	Aug 2012	#115
I don't know about 90%, but I agree that a huge amount could be cut. 50%?	Bernardo de La Paz	Aug 2012	#120
If we modernized and implemented General Butler's plan for an actual Dept. of Defense	Egalitarian Thug	Aug 2012	#341
How many times has the United States been attacked in its entire history?	Hugabear	Aug 2012	#796
so?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#801
One of the key words that shouldn't be overlooked there...	drokhole	Aug 2012	#339
That's pretty much...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#357
Only fools and knaves can't discriminate between "drugs"...	drokhole	Aug 2012	#383
yup... okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#386
Tell Francis Crick to "go learn some science".	EOTE	Aug 2012	#490
oh boy...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#491
Whether someone "had a vision" or not would not be a factor in whether I trusted their design or not	EOTE	Aug 2012	#494
No, I'm a victim	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#513
For a fan of science, you think in an incredibly UNscientific manner.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#521
okay then...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#530
Once again, you think that anecdotes are science.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#617
Don't flatter yourself...	drokhole	Aug 2012	#619
Very interesting post. That TED talk is amazing.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#664
Actually...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#526
Talking to yourself now?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#618
If you aren't listening, why did you respond?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#630
Still refusing to address any salient points?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#631
sigh	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#632
So apparently you think anti-drug propaganda is observable fact.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#663
Wow	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#670
So, are you going to provide any proof for the urban legends you've been touting as fact?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#681
I posted 3 sources from NIH	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#687
You posted three sources from the NIH which had NOTHING to do with our discussion. That's called a	EOTE	Aug 2012	#692
Wow	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#697
Once again, they had NOTHING to do with our conversation.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#700
sounds like you can't argue against those articles	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#703
You have absolutely nothing but non-sequitors. Nothing but putting words in my mouth.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#705
Let me know when you've got	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#708
Are you slow or something? What in those articles is contrary to anything I've said?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#715
Wow	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#716
More urban legends and refusing to address even the simplest of issues.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#718
And by the way, thanks for showing how incredibly safe LSD is.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#688
And your attempts to evangelize are funny	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#690
So that's a big, fat no.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#695
When you are willing to post FACTS then we can talk	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#701
Your facts are that LSD can cause clinical insanity and that people get strychnine poisoning from	EOTE	Aug 2012	#704
yup... As I thought	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#707
Why the fuck should I argue against those articles (even though I already have)?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#709
except...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#711
A few more...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#714
Are these about hemmoroids?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#719
nope	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#720
So, I guess you gave up on telling me how safe I implied LSD is?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#721
Hey there buddy	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#726
You have been proven to be a liar numerous times on this thread.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#739
and thank you for your exit speech	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#741
How safe have I implied LSD is? I can guarantee you won't provide an honest answer to that question	EOTE	Aug 2012	#717
Dude	tama	Aug 2012	#746
I'm not sure what "whole-body fears" you're referring to.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#750
Dude...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#753
Leave me the fuck alone.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#754
I thought you weren't talking to me...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#756
That's certainly understandable.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#757
hmmm	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#759
"Grow up" says the creepy stalker who won't stop responding to posts not addressed to him.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#760
And here	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#763
Fears	tama	Aug 2012	#761
Sorry, I'm still not very certain to what you're referring.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#768
Very general level - on purpose	tama	Aug 2012	#778
I figure that fear	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#779
Yep	tama	Aug 2012	#780
mind you, most abstract fears	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#782
So, what are you trying to suggest, exactly?	EOTE	Aug 2012	#781
Art of Persuasion	tama	Aug 2012	#784
Makes sense, but I wasn't really aiming to convert a mass audience.	EOTE	Aug 2012	#786
The ego thing	tama	Aug 2012	#789
I'd love it too. nt	Mojorabbit	Aug 2012	#606
Considering the number of jobs that space colonization would generate...	Zalatix	Aug 2012	#95
THAT'S the spirit!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#103
Hell, Curiosity's employed about 4,400 people so far.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#104
Any new facility must have janitors.	Zalatix	Aug 2012	#111
Definitely - what I meant is I don't know if that number included them or not. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#207
So who starves and goes naked between here and there?	xchrom	Aug 2012	#105
Who says we do nothing between now and the next rocket that gets built?	Zalatix	Aug 2012	#110
I wish people...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#121
FAR less,	Keefer	Aug 2012	#253
My bad. Must be being done. Some where. Not on planet earth.	xchrom	Aug 2012	#166
That's a false choice of the worst kind.	baldguy	Aug 2012	#118
To quote SMBC: "Sorry, can't hear you. I only listen to noises that might save babies."	DRoseDARs	Aug 2012	#173
Cynical but oh so right on. Nt	xchrom	Aug 2012	#188
We clothe the the poor in space-age fiber.	sofa king	Aug 2012	#362
I remember reading somewhere about the spin-off payout	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#392
I've seen as low as 8:1	kentauros	Aug 2012	#571
huh	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#572
Due to NASA seemingly being the only agency I ever see	kentauros	Aug 2012	#599
Best. Post. Ever.	eqfan592	Aug 2012	#559
Odin...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#4
That last paragraph sounds like a "storytime!" cue. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#7
Let us gather 'round the heat of a fuming Neo-con (as he comtemplates FOUR MORE YEARS)...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#9
Oh, my.	Warpy	Aug 2012	#13
I've had to re-design the engines	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#17
You could always go with non-orbital	kentauros	Aug 2012	#122
cool vid! thank you!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#128
You're welcome :)	kentauros	Aug 2012	#152
whoops!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#154
Who wouldn't?	kentauros	Aug 2012	#176
I'll stick with this body	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#190
Then you better hope we never find John Varley's Titan	kentauros	Aug 2012	#194
That book is best read while high.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#209
I can get pretty high meditating.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#243
I love Pohl's Heechee books!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#205
I haven't read them in a long while.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#227
"Went away" is the best euphemism when applied to buildings.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#19
Hey! It's a model...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#20
"Went Away" BWAHAHAHAHA!!!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#53
Perhaps I mispoke...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#79
Did you get any height with the shed, or was it mostly arc? n/t	jtuck004	Aug 2012	#88
well...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#92
Engineering a shed of unprecedented low density counts for something, right? (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#101
It was (originally) a medium sized red painted	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#109
"It's a little draft, but you can't beat one gram per cubic meter!" (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#203
welll...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#211
Zubrin was actually debunking the "it's too expensive" assumption.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#10
I sat in on one of Zubrin's presentations	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#12
That's a seriously awesome book.	eqfan592	Aug 2012	#560
All of his data	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#563
Not while most of the seven billion of us go to bed hungry	Warpy	Aug 2012	#11
Warpy	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#14
Thanks for proving my point.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#18
Amen. I just found some really cool Gil Scott Heron footage. Check it out.	Gregorian	Aug 2012	#37
You're absolutely right.	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#131
False equivalence	Warpy	Aug 2012	#242
Gee, Warpy	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#350
Try	Warpy	Aug 2012	#376
Oh jesus	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#379
oh jesus, part two	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#380
All things considered, it would be much easier to colonize Antarctica	bhikkhu	Aug 2012	#15
A Sagan quote:	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#22
I agree, but why ruin Antarctica or the ocean floor?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#23
Antarctica, yes. The ocean floor... maybe not.	cthulu2016	Aug 2012	#63
All those mountain expeditions and ocean voyages....	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#157
Why?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#21
Cleita...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#27
I believe you would.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#192
The engines I'd choose...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#204
Most of our own planet is uninhabitable by us except for technology.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#29
As somebody who camps a lot in extreme wilderness,	Cleita	Aug 2012	#34
we know where to get water and shelter on Mars	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#117
You know it's really cold there. So a shelter would have to be more than a lean to.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#178
Expanded foamed rock should do it	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#277
Somehow, I doubt you go camping buck naked and without supplies.	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#159
And so I would on Mars, but if all my life support fails and	Cleita	Aug 2012	#181
And the exact same is true of almost every environment on Earth.	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#202
I can breathe oxygen just about anywhere on earth except under water.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#219
All that free air won't do you much good if you are caught unprepared in a blizzard.	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#228
I'm not against technology.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#234
I don't want them!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#278
You think we should never have started mining. You are against technology. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#303
I grew up in a mining camp.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#327
The key difference here	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#358
You do realize how dangerous mining is.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#424
okay then...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#425
Open pit mining doesn't solve the problem. It also scars the landscape. Go to West Virginia	Cleita	Aug 2012	#433
are you comparing the appalachians to a Stony type rock???	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#434
You still have to extract the ores and make it into something.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#447
Solar fractional heating takes care of that	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#464
You talk about solar and yet if you are on an asteriod in the belt,	Cleita	Aug 2012	#495
The simple version is	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#514
Odin	tama	Aug 2012	#225
I agree with you.	hunter	Aug 2012	#133
If humans are either incapable or unwilling to be	avebury	Aug 2012	#24
I'm sure our primary interest would be in mining any heavenly body out there	Cleita	Aug 2012	#26
It is most cost-effective to mine asteroids.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#31
Getting things DOWN a gravity well is relatively easy!	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#77
Ummm, Cleita?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#87
Just another version of the "polluting space" mantra.	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#163
O c'mon. We don't have a good history of cleaning up after ourselves.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#187
Cleita...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#198
Perhaps, but really should we be rearranging the Solar System?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#221
Cleita, I'm always suspicous of the word "should"	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#226
"Let it become an enormous park."	Cleita	Aug 2012	#231
Cleita	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#233
That could probably be arranged. Send them all to their Libertarian paradise with	Cleita	Aug 2012	#237
Cleita,	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#241
Are there robots yet in that world?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#251
sigh	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#279
You can buy kits out in the middle of space?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#284
ah... humor...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#288
Oh, you just got the humor? I was there all along with the Libertarian paradise meme.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#290
I just finished a 70 page thesis	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#292
Sorry, I didn't mean to be offensive. n/t	Cleita	Aug 2012	#294
you weren't	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#298
That reminds me of Asimov's fictional world Solaria in his robot books.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#257
That one, and Caves of Steel are pretty good	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#260
You don't really think we could ever pollute space to any significant degree do you?	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#640
But what about the deadly pollution of the delicate vacuum, by industrial fumes?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#641
60 years ago when I was twelve, I didn't believe we could pollute the earth.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#642
There are some assumptions there	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#643
60 years ago would be 1952, at which point we had already significantly	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#644
and we've learned a bit since then...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#645
Have we learned not to pollute	tama	Aug 2012	#650
sigh	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#653
Think	tama	Aug 2012	#660
alrighty then	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#661
...	tama	Aug 2012	#662
Okay then	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#672
2)	tama	Aug 2012	#698
kind of figured	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#702
Thank you for your water, may it grow a life of beauty :)	tama	Aug 2012	#712
hmmm	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#725
Cool	tama	Aug 2012	#736
why not bring them with?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#740
Of course.	tama	Aug 2012	#744
nope	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#745
Ah	tama	Aug 2012	#748
that I am	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#749
LOL eom	tama	Aug 2012	#790
You are probably right but the average person didn't know it.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#651
Uhm I don't know.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#183
It's not a problem	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#195
Orbital ballistics is an entirely different subject from "little regard to what we leave behind".	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#197
By that logic	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#28
You cannot really compare the immigration of people to the North	avebury	Aug 2012	#33
"humans no longer have nobility that is once had" What nonsense.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#40
Amen	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#91
Avebury...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#41
If humans are incapable or unwilling to rid themselves of their	avebury	Aug 2012	#62
RIIIIIIGHT...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#85
Humans have never been anything like noble.	Codeine	Aug 2012	#51
This is exactly the misanthropy I mentioned in my OP.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#30
Parochial nonsense.	Codeine	Aug 2012	#35
I haven't seen that movie...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#42
Avatar was a great movie by James Cameron, he's going to the moon in 2017	bananas	Aug 2012	#321
Do you seriously think that if humans had the ability to	avebury	Aug 2012	#52
Have you seen what the other planets in our solar system look like?	Codeine	Aug 2012	#64
Movies and TV shows are your source	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#96
Look at the history of humanity - not overwhelmingly positive and	avebury	Aug 2012	#168
Asteroids are lifeless rocks.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#177
(Bob bows to his honorable opponent)	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#179
Yes, every other planet in the solar system looks like avatar	Confusious	Aug 2012	#59
Don't expect serious discussion from someone	Codeine	Aug 2012	#61
Or citing just about any SF these days to do so, for that matter	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#66
I just finished a thesis paper on SF	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#98
I hate cyberpunk, and I think cyberpunk tropes are a part of the problem.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#108
Cyberpunk is a terrible, cliched genre	Dash87	Aug 2012	#367
One can hope that someday you'll get through	Confusious	Aug 2012	#71
There are no Na'vi. We're it. We're the only manifestation of intelligent life in the universe.	lumberjack_jeff	Aug 2012	#394
LOL, Jeff. LOL. =)	AverageJoe90	Aug 2012	#669
Well, maybe I'll amend my first opinion a bit.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#25
O'Neill talked about this	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#32
Easy way to make a space colony:	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#36
Odin...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#43
I got the idea from Kim Stanley Robinson's new book "2312"	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#49
What color will the sky be? I kid of course, surely it will be fluorescent blue. n/t	2on2u	Aug 2012	#67
2312 was a great book; but, I still prefer Gerry O'Neill's designs	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#82
I was thinking that the asteroid's bulk would keep cosmic rays and solar flares out.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#124
There would be enough leftover asteroid or lunar regolith, plus 'slag' from the refining process....	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#134
Cool site, thanks!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#136
We should have bullt these by now.....	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#127
I would kill to live in one with the climate of San Franscisco.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#142
How about we grab	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#149
Too far away from the sun.	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#158
so we build up	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#161
Fair enough. Plenty of silica on the moon as well as nearby asteroids. n/t	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#180
I'm all in.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#189
Gimme another 11 people with some tech skills	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#193
Easily done.	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#150
Heretic	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#144
Under an entirely new set of rules, I would suppose.	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#155
getting paid by the mile would feel pretty good...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#160
Nooooo.	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#172
I Reaaallllly want to	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#182
"Export"?!?	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#215
I like it!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#222
I'm fine with wine.	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#258
at 5 cents per KWH	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#262
That is the fucking craziest shit I have ever seen	jsmirman	Aug 2012	#273
you could build the mirrors out of thick tin foil, and deisgn the whole thing to	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#280
Google "Lagrangian Point"	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#296
Thank you both for the answers	jsmirman	Aug 2012	#314
So this would work so long as	jsmirman	Aug 2012	#316
I'm by no means a mathmatician....	A HERETIC I AM	Aug 2012	#320
Argh	jsmirman	Aug 2012	#340
Great Book	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#359
probably safer than working with the problems	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#102
Ben Bova came up with it before that, but I doubt it was new for him either	Occulus	Aug 2012	#426
For the world is hollow and I have touched the sky	TheKentuckian	Aug 2012	#565
great episode!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#567
I'm holding out for a ringworld.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#145
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#151
Why can't robots do most of the structural work?	kentauros	Aug 2012	#162
With ladder logic PLC's	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#167
You're a Maker?!	kentauros	Aug 2012	#191
I am a Maker. Been one all my life...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#201
"Great Maker!"	kentauros	Aug 2012	#224
LOL	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#229
Then I have a site for you to mine:	kentauros	Aug 2012	#240
A ringworld would be awesome.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#184
Yeah, but that automated recentering system will burn ya!	kentauros	Aug 2012	#196
Ringworlds and Dyson Spheres are thousands of years away.	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#506
Thanks for taking my post literally	kentauros	Aug 2012	#569
Just make sure to leave spaces for the deserts.	Dr. Strange	Aug 2012	#713
You need spices	kentauros	Aug 2012	#723
Okay... I'll say it, if no one else does	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#728
May the Schwarz be with you!	kentauros	Aug 2012	#731
that works!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#733
Maybe so, but remember...	Dr. Strange	Aug 2012	#738
hell, we can't colonize earth	spanone	Aug 2012	#38
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#39
I was floored by those Huygens lander images from Titan.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#45
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#80
OP can't distinguish sci-fi from science.	stopbush	Aug 2012	#44
So you are calling Robert Zubrin a liar?	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#46
Putting a colony on any number of nearby bodies in our solar system	Codeine	Aug 2012	#48
...Sigh...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#106
Nonsense	Liberal_Dog	Aug 2012	#132
My HS library was depressingly underfunded	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#169
Robert Goddard flew the first liquid-fuel rocket just 22 years after the Wrights' first flight....	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#439
Robotic exploration is much cheaper and will produce more technical innovation	struggle4progress	Aug 2012	#50
It's not about "cheaper", and it's not about technological innovation.	Codeine	Aug 2012	#54
Some time in the eighties, best as I can tell.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#56
Bland, grey, and soulless.	Codeine	Aug 2012	#69
I'm a fan, and I build	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#139
when history ended (n/t)	BOG PERSON	Aug 2012	#57
The object of space exploration should be the scientific info we can obtain. That, of course,	struggle4progress	Aug 2012	#65
All depends on what you count	Confusious	Aug 2012	#93
ugh no thanks	BOG PERSON	Aug 2012	#55
I'd go to space in a heartbeat.	Codeine	Aug 2012	#58
I'll be the guy with the bags of tea	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#129
The Hubbert Hurdle applied to the Fermi Paradox	bhikkhu	Aug 2012	#68
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#86
Here's my rebuttal of the Paradox:	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#97
My response is simply "404"	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#99
Oh, I admit that it's just pure speculation on my part!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#113
Yeah, okay.	WinkyDink	Aug 2012	#70
Don't be so rude... The OP makes some good points.	Dash87	Aug 2012	#76
We can't even take care of our own planet.	Alduin	Aug 2012	#74
The other planets in the solar system are wastelands	Confusious	Aug 2012	#78
Yes.	Alduin	Aug 2012	#311
Well then please explain	Confusious	Aug 2012	#325
Because that's what life does.	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#81
Colonizing Mars means bring it BACK TO LIFE via terraforming.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#89
To my pagan friends, I usually reply	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#107
That's EXACTLY my attitude. We are Gaia's way of reproducing.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#119
Overall...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#125
Exactly.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#126
Easier said than done.	Alduin	Aug 2012	#309
We only know ours is fucked up	Nevernose	Aug 2012	#199
yep	heaven05	Aug 2012	#83
It's not a matter of technology. It's a matter of will.	NYC Liberal	Aug 2012	#84
we still only have about a 50/50 record when it comes to landing on Mars	Motown_Johnny	Aug 2012	#94
We should have been on Mars by now.	roamer65	Aug 2012	#100
Agree to Disagree.	bvar22	Aug 2012	#112
Attacking?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#114
Nobody is "attacking" anything.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#116
Yeah, I know.	bvar22	Aug 2012	#143
...sigh...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#165
The mining will be on asteroids, not Mars.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#171
I find it interesting	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#239
Let's hope they never watch the original Russian movie Solyaris	kentauros	Aug 2012	#248
SHHHHH!!!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#259
It's the Deep Ecology people.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#261
Being a Pagan Smith	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#263
You can't	tama	Aug 2012	#364
Given that "logic"	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#369
As I've said	tama	Aug 2012	#372
Sins of the father?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#375
No	tama	Aug 2012	#437
hmmm...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#440
So you think if we 'stay home and play nice', your putative Vogons will leave us alone?	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#444
Golden and Silver rule	tama	Aug 2012	#455
Being as their doesn't seem to be any other intelligent lifeforms in the Solar system...	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#459
Sounds good to me!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#467
"Doesn't seem to be"	tama	Aug 2012	#470
"Not all populations and cultures behave in that way" How about the Maya and the people of Rapa Nui?	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#446
How about the Maya?	tama	Aug 2012	#465
Well said!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#471
If you really feel that way, I know some people you should talk to:	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#442
The technology is already here to colonize the moon	Taverner	Aug 2012	#123
We've had the tech since 1939	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#130
You're crazy. The most important thing in the world is to make rich people richer	valerief	Aug 2012	#135
Then pass me my straitjacket, and get me my meds	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#147
Time to get drunk and jaded with the rest of us.	valerief	Aug 2012	#153
I'd rather build	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#156
What if we convince the PTB to build penal colonies in the Kuiper Belt? (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#164
LOL	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#170
Would renaming it Spacestralia and wrapping a cheesy reality show around it draw migrants? (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#175
hmmm	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#186
This subject should TRANSCEND political wrangling!	fxmakeupguy	Aug 2012	#148
Excellent post!	kentauros	Aug 2012	#208
WECOME TO DU!!!	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#216
If you're starting off with posts like that I sure hope you stick around for awhile! (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#218
Welcome	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#235
For all those people who are sneering at those who are concerned about polluting space,	Cleita	Aug 2012	#210
I'll continue to sneer at anyone who tries to cite Avatar as evidence in an argument. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#212
So it's a cartoon. Is that your problem?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#214
My "problem" is that it has zero bearing - none, zip, nada - on any reasonable argument. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#220
Nor should it so why do other people bring it up?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#223
Cleita	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#232
The Amazon rain forest, a cave environment, and <shudder> Pandora are all	Codeine	Aug 2012	#236
This is the error people make.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#245
But an asteroid isn't a cave.	Codeine	Aug 2012	#249
How do you know?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#255
Are you seriously trying to argue that airless asteroids are somehow vibrant ecosystems? (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#268
No and I don't know where you get that.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#274
By that 'logic' we shouldn't be mining anything, anywhere, ever. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#286
That would be fine with me.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#289
WTF???	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#291
There are other materials to make those things from.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#330
That's a really stupid thing to say via the Internet.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#300
Please leave. You only want to insult and feel superior to anyone who	Cleita	Aug 2012	#332
Did you post that with a sustainable, organically-grown computer?	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#448
Of course not.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#450
So you use advanced technology to sustain life, but prefer others go without?	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#456
Oh Snap!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#472
FACEPALM	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#306
And you have the chutzpah to post that on the Internet?	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#335
Why do I have to do that? I am a woman and I know how to spin and weave from	Cleita	Aug 2012	#338
Cleita	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#349
Actually, it would have to be a communal farming society like the New Stone Agers, the	Cleita	Aug 2012	#454
If it all broke down	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#460
Living like we did 200 years ago wouldn't be that bad.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#498
And you'd have have no antibiotics, few vaccines	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#517
Let me make something clear.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#527
While I like	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#531
I wasn't talking about doing it for hours or even doing it at all.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#534
hmmm...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#535
Spinning is a high intensity bicycle class in a gym.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#538
Interesting...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#543
It's not unhip what you do, but many people who have sedentary jobs	Cleita	Aug 2012	#546
sure...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#548
Oh it's not up to me to do it, but you guys who dream of	Cleita	Aug 2012	#549
in that case	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#551
Because it will give you the knowledge to fix them in space.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#553
Nice chatting with you, too	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#555
Gardening communities	tama	Aug 2012	#496
okay... here we go	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#515
Response	tama	Aug 2012	#536
Response to response	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#542
...	tama	Aug 2012	#573
Tama...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#575
Willing I am	tama	Aug 2012	#591
This is the stuff that makes my blood tingle	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#594
Are you familiar	tama	Aug 2012	#598
"The land belongs to everyone." How many homeless people stay at your place?	friendly_iconoclast	Aug 2012	#449
Me, I stay at their place. I can't offer my benefactors land to anyone can I now? n/t	Cleita	Aug 2012	#452
Without either, BILLIONS STARVE.	Ikonoklast	Aug 2012	#342
That is just a conjecture on your part.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#343
It HAS been tried	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#360
After hunter gatherers, there were farmers in the Stone Age.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#427
Cleita	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#428
Sorry, it wasn't technology but knowledge.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#505
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#519
Curanderas/os	tama	Aug 2012	#595
There is no use explaining that here.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#603
Who does? :D	tama	Aug 2012	#605
For that matter...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#430
Terra preta	tama	Aug 2012	#499
Thanks. I have actually read about it.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#502
I guessed you might have	tama	Aug 2012	#509
It likely was a planet	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#272
Avatar was about an earth-like planet.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#238
Nothing is really dead.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#250
You're venturing rapidly into "don't know what you're talking about" territory with that analogy. nt	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#265
Cleita	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#276
Well, when you figure out how to plant a garden, without needed energy sources and	Cleita	Aug 2012	#293
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#297
You are amazing.	drokhole	Aug 2012	#345
Is Mars really that dead?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#275
But it's dead now.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#281
So that means we should go destroy a geological record?	Cleita	Aug 2012	#282
Terraforming Mars will take a few hundred years.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#285
I don't think you will ever get an atmosphere through terraforming that will	Cleita	Aug 2012	#493
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#287
You could be no more wrong.	NCTraveler	Aug 2012	#468
No I don't but frankly I think we really need to examine our footprint and	Cleita	Aug 2012	#492
You say you didn't have a heater growing up.	NCTraveler	Aug 2012	#611
My bad. I didn't elaborate that it wasn't an electric or gas heater. I forget that	Cleita	Aug 2012	#621
I fully understood the implication. You don't understand heater efficiencies.	NCTraveler	Aug 2012	#622
If it is good for you.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#623
Cleita, it likely WAS alive	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#283
You keep talking about "polluting space".	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#331
Then go away and find someone rational enough for you.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#334
Is there a difference between	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#537
Guessing what you are thinking.	Cleita	Aug 2012	#541
I don't like intimidation	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#547
Cost of Hubble telescope program over the last THIRTY years = $10 billion	jsr	Aug 2012	#230
They want to privatize the Space Program. What killed it was the Privatizers. They don't want	sabrina 1	Aug 2012	#244
The solar system would beg to differ:	coalition_unwilling	Aug 2012	#246
Buddha's left nut!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#267
Again, the life on other planets wants us to remain on earth:	coalition_unwilling	Aug 2012	#370
Coalition...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#371
Health insurance for all = "silly causes." Welcome to my Ignore list. N.B. It's	coalition_unwilling	Aug 2012	#390
here we go	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#391
Perhaps the space based weapons (in both high and low earth orbit) had priority, Odin2005.	bobthedrummer	Aug 2012	#252
Robotic probes will be the principal mode of space exploration for the foreseeable future	entanglement	Aug 2012	#254
All the money or will in the world won't change the fact that we don't know HOW.	LeftyMom	Aug 2012	#256
We can do it for $30 billion dollars.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#266
We can't do it for $300 billion. Unless we decide the people involved are disposable.	LeftyMom	Aug 2012	#295
please!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#299
We can discover "how" through innovation.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#315
Let's send the Republicans to Uranus	AnnieBW	Aug 2012	#264
+1000	ellisonz	Aug 2012	#344
We need to get the country back into realizing the importance of science and exploration.	Marrah_G	Aug 2012	#269
If we do that	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#270
I agree that if we are going to spend trillions on military hardware, how much	Cleita	Aug 2012	#271
Yeah, let's spread our hatred and fighting to the stars.	Trillo	Aug 2012	#301
brilliant "logic"	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#302
We've already fired a missile at the moon. First it was explored, then was used as target practice.	Trillo	Aug 2012	#363
Oh sweet jeebers	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#368
You guys are so predictable.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#307
Most folks are pretty nice.	Trillo	Aug 2012	#366
riiight	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#374
Well, I think there is some on that 3rd rock.... guess that eliminates your point #1	Trillo	Aug 2012	#396
Trillo	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#397
I'm against that meme	tama	Aug 2012	#501
You said it yourself. NASA is competing directly with the Pentagon for technology spending.	leveymg	Aug 2012	#304
I wholly, emphatically agree with your post.	David__77	Aug 2012	#305
I'm a Technogaian who think technology and sustainibility go hand an hand.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#310
sigh... as an astrophysicist, I feel the saddest for the irrationally optimistic	MStuart	Aug 2012	#308
LMAO, people like you in 1950 thought space flight was impossible.	Odin2005	Aug 2012	#313
I don't know where you're getting your information from...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#319
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#322
I find it difficult to believe that you are an astrophysicist,	kentauros	Aug 2012	#323
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#324
Ah, the classic example of a	kentauros	Aug 2012	#328
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#326
Yeah, but when the fuel runs out, and all forward momentum stops dead,	kentauros	Aug 2012	#333
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#336
And we can't get to the Indies by sailing west.... n/t	PavePusher	Aug 2012	#337
When I was in elementary school (1960-66) my dream was to be on the 1st manned mission to Mars...	Rowdyboy	Aug 2012	#312
Anthropocentric BS	Sick of the GOP	Aug 2012	#317
Hey Buddy!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#318
This message was self-deleted by its author	Warren DeMontague	Aug 2012	#329
What Warren said!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#352
Preach it brother.	lumberjack_jeff	Aug 2012	#393
So we let the misanthropes stay on parts of Earth	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#395
Please read again what you wrote	tama	Aug 2012	#539
It usually means "man hater"	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#544
If the hint was too subtle	tama	Aug 2012	#550
Oh?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#552
A thing about philosophy	tama	Aug 2012	#580
Tama...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#581
Best space thread I've seen here in quite a while!	LunaSea	Aug 2012	#346
Why? We are NOT special and WILL die out one day regardless.	CaptPicard	Aug 2012	#347
I told them that whole "multicellular" thing was just a fad, but no, they wouldn't listen!	JHB	Aug 2012	#348
That was super-helpful. nt	Codeine	Aug 2012	#351
Thank you for your less than stirring screed	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#354
Post removed	Post removed	Aug 2012	#356
too many	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#361
That doesn't sound like the Jean-Luc Picard we all know.	Efilroft Sul	Aug 2012	#378
You are being disingenous to dismiss ...	GeorgeGist	Aug 2012	#365
no...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#373
Star Trek is just a TV show. I know that sometimes, it just seems sooo real!!!!. Just tv.	Romulox	Aug 2012	#381
so you are going to bring up a TV show???	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#384
Yes I am. Because we all KNOW that Science FANTASY animates much of this discussion. nt	Romulox	Aug 2012	#385
Who's this We?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#387
Gibberish. nt	Romulox	Aug 2012	#388
I agree with you, that	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#389
What immutable law of nature prevents us from ever leaving earth?	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#436
None, so far as I know. Who is stopping you from beginning a new life in the cosmos, right now?	Romulox	Aug 2012	#525
You are dead set on the "if we haven't done it now it must be impossible" mentality	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#529
Discussion hits a brick wall when you start refuting points nobody has made. nt	Romulox	Aug 2012	#629
Sorry, someone else must have said:	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#638
Is that a physical or a philosophical question?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#639
You put quote marks around something I didn't say, right in your subject line for post 529.	Romulox	Aug 2012	#666
And you still haven't answered MY question: Who's stopping you from living in space? What physical	Romulox	Aug 2012	#667
You really think it's an individual effort?	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#668
I'm not the one complaining about it, though. YOU are. So it's your job to convince everyone	Romulox	Aug 2012	#671
Now you're moving the goalposts	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#676
Learn how to use quotation marks, please! I NEVER used the word "impossible". nt	Romulox	Aug 2012	#680
So now you're saying colonizing spaces isn't impossible?	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#686
This is childish. I will make the points I wish to make. I will not refute points only you have	Romulox	Aug 2012	#689
You really can't think it's both impossible and possible at the same time	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#693
And you're refuting point I haven't made again! My point was that no one is "stopping" you from	Romulox	Aug 2012	#673
fallacy	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#675
If you want other people to pay for it, you'll have to convince us. That's just how it works. Else	Romulox	Aug 2012	#679
Gee, dude...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#683
Projection	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#678
This is childish. Perhaps I'll just invent some nonsense, put quotes around, and demand you defend	Romulox	Aug 2012	#682
So . . . stay the course but with quotation marks?	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#685
Quotation marks are a representation that someone said those exact words. You're being dishonest. nt	Romulox	Aug 2012	#691
If you insist. Why not clarify your stance.	4th law of robotics	Aug 2012	#696
I'M a rugged individualist, and I have to	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#674
The "rugged individualist" stuff was something only the HAL guy mentioned. I just said we aren't	Romulox	Aug 2012	#677
Presented without endorsement	caraher	Aug 2012	#400
"Space colonization" = Randian excuse to ignore the environment and poor	Liber T. Anjustis	Aug 2012	#401
Such gleamingly fine logic	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#406
Not one of those people but,	janlyn	Aug 2012	#402
Maybe it's part of YOUR nature	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#407
one tiny issue	BOG PERSON	Aug 2012	#403
oh dear... Here we go	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#408
it's not my favorite cause	BOG PERSON	Aug 2012	#411
...sigh...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#412
Post removed	Post removed	Aug 2012	#415
I seem to have touched a nerve...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#416
Um...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#421
no, the international financial cartel needs that money to extort more countries	librechik	Aug 2012	#404
Then we self-fund the project	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#409
meh, I'm one of those people who think robots can do the job better for the foreseeable future	librechik	Aug 2012	#414
okay then...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#417
yes--be sure to wear a lead cup--and don't start any long term relationships	librechik	Aug 2012	#419
librechik...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#420
right back atcha, jr!	librechik	Aug 2012	#422
Now I'm confused...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#423
Also...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#418
Why? Because we haven't f*cked up this planet enough? (nt)	Jeff In Milwaukee	Aug 2012	#405
Maybe some of us want to get away from the shit-slingers	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#410
You don't get to start a second planet until you clean up the first one...	Jeff In Milwaukee	Aug 2012	#429
HEH	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#431
Who gets to decide who leaves and who has to stay?	tama	Aug 2012	#451
Therein lies the question...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#462
Bro,	tama	Aug 2012	#482
No such thing...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#484
Some of us dare to take a look	tama	Aug 2012	#443
Tama...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#457
I kinda like Socrates	tama	Aug 2012	#478
cool	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#480
Know thyself - gnothi seauton	tama	Aug 2012	#488
it's great	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#489
Anti-philosophical attitude	tama	Aug 2012	#503
Tama...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#518
Rhetorics aside	tama	Aug 2012	#528
This seems to be your thing	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#532
Apparently not	XemaSab	Sep 2012	#809
....but then I got high...	jberryhill	Aug 2012	#432
point?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#435
It's a song, Bob	jberryhill	Aug 2012	#445
Oh	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#458
I was going to colonize space, but I got high	jberryhill	Aug 2012	#461
In a weird sort of way...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#463
Thanks for the great thread.	MyUncle	Aug 2012	#438
We aim to please	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#441
Personally, I consider this a possible RW meme, "The elect are headed to a better place. Fuck Earth"	patrice	Aug 2012	#453
Never enough facepalms for comments like these. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#466
SO much of the comments against space travel	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#469
You forgot "I'm not personally interested in this, therefore it's evil." (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#476
okay... that one got by me	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#477
What parts of the words "Personally" and "possible" do you not understand & what you just	patrice	Aug 2012	#479
could you elucidate?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#481
Of course I could, but "sissy don't play your game." nt	patrice	Aug 2012	#486
???	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#487
Maybe we should stop "colonizing" things in general.	Puregonzo1188	Aug 2012	#473
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#474
How about	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#475
Actually, there was a problem with the term 'space colony' back in the late 70s.	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#508
And	tama	Aug 2012	#511
don't worry this isn't going to happen	Johonny	Aug 2012	#510
Up to you	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#524
I work in this field you know	Johonny	Aug 2012	#540
Kind of the whole point is to disagree, until someone comes up	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#545
I think for any worth while expedition into space we would have to live at least 100+ years. And	demosincebirth	Aug 2012	#577
Demosincebirth	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#730
It's all great for the imagination and I think about it too. But for any deep space exportation, and	demosincebirth	Aug 2012	#785
well...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#787
Addendum...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#788
Naw, let's build one of these:	kentauros	Aug 2012	#797
EEP	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#798
I know.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#805
If I remember my readings correctly	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#806
I find our planet fascinating...every day. nt	demosincebirth	Aug 2012	#795
...and that's fine	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#800
I believe Paul Wellstone would beware of "Greeks" bearing "gifts." nt	patrice	Aug 2012	#483
How is this relevant?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#485
The militarization & weaponization of space:	patrice	Aug 2012	#627
Timeo danaos et dona ferentes	tama	Aug 2012	#504
Well, not all Greeks and not all gifts, just a warning to be wary of vehicles that can hide weapons.	patrice	Aug 2012	#512
Matrix	tama	Aug 2012	#522
he, he, "stuttering" . . . and therein lies a tale of those who can't/don't "speak" the "speech"	patrice	Aug 2012	#554
it's a bad sign	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#557
sez you.	patrice	Aug 2012	#568
right...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#570
Thanks, I was rather proud	tama	Aug 2012	#585
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#586
LOL	tama	Aug 2012	#592
Personally...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#597
"overly verbose ego-defense"	tama	Aug 2012	#604
Tama...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#608
I know	tama	Aug 2012	#610
Ma'am. Yes, Ma'am.	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#613
Consider changing that "erudition" to cognition and you might BEGIN, like Tama and I and Others, to	patrice	Aug 2012	#593
I'll stick with	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#596
Never agreed with Chomsky	tama	Aug 2012	#602
Had to look wiki	tama	Aug 2012	#600
One of the connotations of erudition	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#614
"No need to idolize them."	tama	Aug 2012	#652
I see two outcomes of an attempt to colonize Mars	CubicleGuy	Aug 2012	#497
This message was self-deleted by its author	randome	Aug 2012	#500
Why bring them back?	LunaSea	Aug 2012	#516
Bring me the Universe...	sibelian	Aug 2012	#507
and I'll have a cookie while doing it	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#533
Wow, this is a long thread. But I have to offer my 2 cents.	Proles	Aug 2012	#520
The window for colonizing any planet is closing..	LunaSea	Aug 2012	#523
The British television series UFO, produced in 1970,	Art_from_Ark	Aug 2012	#556
Both shows were interesting	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#558
+Billions and billions	Grave Grumbler	Aug 2012	#561
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#562
If I had my way, colonizing the Solar System.	Grave Grumbler	Aug 2012	#564
Gotta start somewhere...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#566
While I certainly advocate for the exploration of Mars,	Grave Grumbler	Aug 2012	#574
I can go with that.	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#576
We'll certainly know more about Ceres in 2015	Grave Grumbler	Aug 2012	#579
Flying to Mars with chemical rockets is daff	Kolesar	Aug 2012	#578
the standard trip	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#583
Try Plasma Propulsion	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#601
Or go cheap, and build a non-nuke Orion	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#635
I Want to Live on the Moon and Snort an endless supply of...	fascisthunter	Aug 2012	#582
remember to cut it	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#584
oh?	fascisthunter	Aug 2012	#587
Pure Helium will kill you	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#588
LOL! I don't of course	fascisthunter	Aug 2012	#589
Dude...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#590
Robert Zubrin is an anti-environmentalist Randian	McGee from Muskogee	Aug 2012	#607
sources?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#609
We should be solving problems on Earth by now.	Coyotl	Aug 2012	#612
Facts not in evidence	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#615
How are you going to change the gravity on Mars?	Coyotl	Aug 2012	#620
Do you have a point to make?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#628
Life has evolved here on Earth for billions of years. This is our home.	cpwm17	Aug 2012	#616
Okay...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#633
If some billionaire wants to have a really crappy (fun?) vacation to Mars, who's stopping him/her?	cpwm17	Aug 2012	#646
It's a new frontier	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#648
No way! Earth First!	Zorra	Aug 2012	#624
WOW! Great screed	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#634
If we had just followed through with Reagan's Star Wars and weaponized space ...	Jim__	Aug 2012	#625
???	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#637
The standard, tired "anything to do with space is military in nature" angle, I figured. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#751
Ah...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#752
You could probably simulate one of these threads with a pretty short perl script. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#755
Oh?	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#758
A chat channel I hung out on awhile back had a really out-there gun nut...	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#766
I remember dealing with	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#767
They had to get written up for that? Oy.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#769
It was a publicly run program	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#770
To be fair, in such a situation I wouldn't be shocked.	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#772
My wife says	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#773
Wow, this has turned into one of the longest running threads I've seen here in a long time!	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#626
great thread!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#636
The L5 Society was absorbed (engulfed and devoured by, assimilated by) the National Space Institute	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#647
Interesting!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#649
You can get part of the story from the NSS website	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#655
LongTomH	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#656
Interesting. I'd love to read it sometime!	LongTomH	Aug 2012	#658
I am immediately intrigued. (nt)	Posteritatis	Aug 2012	#774
hmmm...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#775
Yes, this is true...and we could have cured hunger, provided shelter and education for the world	Taverner	Aug 2012	#654
Holy crap Odin, I think this is one of the biggest threads I've ever seen	EvolveOrConvolve	Aug 2012	#657
I say we go	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#659
Kind of like graywarrior's "I want to create a thread that never dies" thread,	kentauros	Aug 2012	#724
Cool!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#727
I like mass-drivers.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#729
Cool tune!	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#783
I know how a rail gun works	kentauros	Aug 2012	#791
You would cancel the momentum	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#792
I thought as much on the momentum part.	kentauros	Aug 2012	#793
The idea I'm pushing, for the rocks	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#799
Okay, well, that idea is similar to another idea	kentauros	Aug 2012	#804
Whatever you guys and gals decide to do is going to be fine with me.	GliderGuider	Aug 2012	#665
Air-conditioning bill for our troops in the Middle East greater than the NASA budget.	David Zephyr	Aug 2012	#684
What I'm tired of	tama	Aug 2012	#706
I like the US military	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#710
And instead we are being told to bow our heads to the 'job creators' and arguing with people who	ck4829	Aug 2012	#735
only 230 posts to go...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#771
Of course, the REAL number of posts to achieve is	kentauros	Aug 2012	#794
You have that wrong. It's the MILITARIZATION of Space. Remember "Star Wars"? Do you	patrice	Aug 2012	#776
Ummm...	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#777
TOTALLY Wrong...	Iggy	Aug 2012	#802
pfft	a geek named Bob	Aug 2012	#803
Weak, Very Weak	Iggy	Sep 2012	#807
Well	a geek named Bob	Sep 2012	#808

Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Sun Aug 26, 2012, 05:39 PM

xchrom (108,903 posts)

1. we can't clothe the naked. feed the hungry, comfort and support the widow.

Last edited Mon Aug 27, 2012, 05:21 AM - Edit history (1)

we can't care for and bury the dead.

i might agree with the sentiment -- but....

We should have been colonizing the solar system by now.

1. we can't clothe the naked. feed the hungry, comfort and support the widow.

2. There is plenty money to go around.

3. Sure we can. What Odin's talking about is couch-cushion stuff compared to the defense budget. (nt)

5. perhaps taking me too literally?

6. Assuming it's one or the other is silly. (nt)

8. Agree with you in general but right now we have accomplished neither.

16. That's assuming it's one or the other, which remains silly. (nt)

47. NASA has made advances towards all those things

60. It bugs me how few people get how miniscule NASA's budget is.

137. It's part of a piece of rhetoric

138. +1,000,000,000,000

141. 1 Trillion???

140. Heh, there is that, yeah.

146. I usually figure

174. They are the "small minds" I hate.

185. to them...

200. That reminds me of an old saying:

206. interesting...

213. And is why the popularity of the Kardashians is depressing.

217. I don't envision ever getting in touch with them

247. Huh?

413. Made perfect sense to me...

694. that is good stuff.....any idea who said it?

353. The reason we're not colonizing the planets is because Michael Moorcock and Samuel R. Delany

355. nice try

377. Doc Smith and Judith Merril Fist Fight in Heaven

382. klook

398. "Consies," they were called

399. Defeatig republicans

699. This is really fascinating to me

722. Thanks!

732. hmmm...

734. Hey, Navarth --

742. klook

743. wonderful, wonderful. thank you so much

747. Silverberg

762. wow.

765. SF seems to generate a new label every 5 or so years

764. That list really knocked me out....

737. Wall Street executive bonuses are 1% of the US economy, about $150 billion

72. Quoting the late, great Bill Hicks:

73. Hicks was a fucking genius!

75. Thank you. Nt

90. Beautiful sentiment but unilateral disarmament doesn't work. Sorry. nt.

115. We could cut our military 90% without getting close to "unilateral disarmament"

120. I don't know about 90%, but I agree that a huge amount could be cut. 50%?

341. If we modernized and implemented General Butler's plan for an actual Dept. of Defense

796. How many times has the United States been attacked in its entire history?

801. so?

339. One of the key words that shouldn't be overlooked there...

357. That's pretty much...

383. Only fools and knaves can't discriminate between "drugs"...

386. yup... okay...

490. Tell Francis Crick to "go learn some science".

491. oh boy...

494. Whether someone "had a vision" or not would not be a factor in whether I trusted their design or not

513. No, I'm a victim

521. For a fan of science, you think in an incredibly UNscientific manner.

530. okay then...

617. Once again, you think that anecdotes are science.

619. Don't flatter yourself...

664. Very interesting post. That TED talk is amazing.

526. Actually...

618. Talking to yourself now?

630. If you aren't listening, why did you respond?

631. Still refusing to address any salient points?

632. sigh

663. So apparently you think anti-drug propaganda is observable fact.

670. Wow

681. So, are you going to provide any proof for the urban legends you've been touting as fact?

687. I posted 3 sources from NIH

692. You posted three sources from the NIH which had NOTHING to do with our discussion. That's called a

697. Wow

700. Once again, they had NOTHING to do with our conversation.

703. sounds like you can't argue against those articles

705. You have absolutely nothing but non-sequitors. Nothing but putting words in my mouth.

708. Let me know when you've got

715. Are you slow or something? What in those articles is contrary to anything I've said?

716. Wow