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European Parliament Elections thread jamboree (Original Post) OnDoutside May 2019 OP
The Right make advances in Spain... OnDoutside May 2019 #1
Center-right narrowly leads in EU vote: estimate Eugene May 2019 #2
Unfortunately it looks like the Greens are doing well across Europe too. OnDoutside May 2019 #3
This is far from unfortunate for Europe Ghost Dog May 2019 #6
As an ideal, I agree, but the problem is single issue parties take away support from OnDoutside May 2019 #7
The Greens here are nothing like the Greens in the USA DFW May 2019 #11
Good MFM008 May 2019 #28
I've never met him in person DFW May 2019 #29
That's damned depressing so far. greatauntoftriplets May 2019 #4
+1 OnDoutside May 2019 #5
What I've seen is that far-right are gaining ground everywhere. OliverQ May 2019 #8
Apparently the populists failed in Denmark and the Netherlands, so that's good. OnDoutside May 2019 #9
Where religious extremism has been coddled and excused here, the right did well DFW May 2019 #12
I'm just hoping we can keep hanging on until a Democratic President in 2021. There are a few OnDoutside May 2019 #13
Except for the Greens doing well, not much DFW May 2019 #15
Agree with you on that. Our problem in the West is down to a lack OnDoutside May 2019 #16
Full agreement, there DFW May 2019 #25
I believe history will look favourably on Merkel's record. Were that other leaders were as resolute, OnDoutside May 2019 #30
So far, there is no one to replace Merkel DFW May 2019 #32
Thanks for a fantastic update ! OnDoutside May 2019 #33
It might, but there are some VERY youngish 60 plus people around these days. DFW May 2019 #34
Howard would be an excellent VP, though I would LOVE to see Buttigieg square up to Pence in a VP OnDoutside May 2019 #36
I've known Howard for almost 20 years now, and he has more energy than the energizer bunny DFW May 2019 #38
That's not true, though. Ghost Dog May 2019 #20
This is all very concerning indeed. nt UniteFightBack May 2019 #10
EU elections: centrist groups expected to lose grip on power OnDoutside May 2019 #14
Haven't the Europeans seen through Bannon and the Con yet? malaise May 2019 #17
Evidently not at all... 'CENTRE COLLAPSES' Baclava May 2019 #18
Bullshit "Brexit Party victory" from UK MSM spinners. Ghost Dog May 2019 #19
It's not as bad as it could have been. The Centre will do a deal with the Greens and/or Liberals. OnDoutside May 2019 #23
It's looking like the Far Right/Fascist/Populist haven't made any gains. They'll still be around the OnDoutside May 2019 #22
Very glad to hear this. I'm sure they'll try to disrupt as much as they can, but hopefully this suffragette May 2019 #26
Great news malaise May 2019 #27
Yes, it buys us a little time to get a Democratic President, to start leading again. OnDoutside May 2019 #31
All paper ballots? moondust May 2019 #21
I'm pretty sure some EU countries do, but all the ones I know, have paper ballots. After what OnDoutside May 2019 #24
No plans AT ALL here to imitate the USA with its hackable machines DFW May 2019 #35
We had a major scandal here in Ireland (what's new ?), where the Fianna Fail OnDoutside May 2019 #37

Eugene

(61,893 posts)
2. Center-right narrowly leads in EU vote: estimate
Sun May 26, 2019, 02:53 PM
May 2019
Center-right narrowly leads in EU vote: estimate (Reuters)

BRUSSELS (Reuters) - The center-right European Peoples’ Party would get 173 seats in the new European Parliament, followed by the Socialists with 147, and liberals getting 102 seats, a parliament official said on Sunday evening, presenting a first aggregated estimate.

The seat projection was based on national estimates from some EU states that have already been announced and pre-election voting intention figures for the others.


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-election-result-estimate/center-right-narrowly-leads-in-eu-vote-estimate-idUSKCN1SW0SW

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
7. As an ideal, I agree, but the problem is single issue parties take away support from
Sun May 26, 2019, 05:36 PM
May 2019

Broadbased progressive parties. Here in Ireland, during the economic crisis, the Green Party kept the criminally corrupt Fianna Fail in power, in return for the Environment ministry and a few other trinkets. Subsequently they got wiped out in parliament, but unfortunately the public's memory is short....even Fianna Fail are making a comeback.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
11. The Greens here are nothing like the Greens in the USA
Sun May 26, 2019, 06:30 PM
May 2019

Nothing like Ralph Nader or Jill Stein. The Greens here are more like Jay Inslee.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
29. I've never met him in person
Mon May 27, 2019, 05:22 AM
May 2019

But I've spoken to him on the phone for almost half an hour. He seems like a really good guy, knows where he's at, and what he wants to do. Not a bunch of tired slogans with no plan behind them, like so many others. You could do MUCH worse (look at Texas, for example!).

greatauntoftriplets

(175,735 posts)
4. That's damned depressing so far.
Sun May 26, 2019, 03:04 PM
May 2019

Marine Le Pen scares the bejesus out of me. She may be even worse than drumpf, if that's possible.

 

OliverQ

(3,363 posts)
8. What I've seen is that far-right are gaining ground everywhere.
Sun May 26, 2019, 05:41 PM
May 2019

The entire world is embracing fascism.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
12. Where religious extremism has been coddled and excused here, the right did well
Sun May 26, 2019, 06:33 PM
May 2019

Otherwise, they didn't break out of any expected brackets.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
13. I'm just hoping we can keep hanging on until a Democratic President in 2021. There are a few
Sun May 26, 2019, 06:36 PM
May 2019

positives tonight, isn't there ?

DFW

(54,378 posts)
15. Except for the Greens doing well, not much
Sun May 26, 2019, 06:53 PM
May 2019

The German SPD deservedly got their asses handed to them (same tired old slogans that sent Martin Schulz packing 2 years ago), but their Spanish counterparts had a respectable showing.

Europe is fracturing, just like the Weimarer Republik did before Hitler's NSDAP "won" in 1933 (and check out with how much of the vote!). The vision of DeGaulle and Adenauer of uniting France and Germany, and integrating to the point where another war between France and Germany would be impossible is not dead, by any means, but the forces of disunity and nationalistic extremism are creeping back nonetheless.

It's really insane because today's European youth is completely on board with the notion of a united, borderless Europe. Go to any large gathering or main city square in Europe this summer, and you will find college students of 25 different nationalities, hanging out together as if they were all from the same place--and as far as they are concerned, they are. It's the fuck-ups here that go into politics. Voices of common sense get shouted down as if they were Democrats at a Fox Noise interview. It took a so-called "conservative" i.e. Angela Merkel, to have the courage to say no more nuclear power or coal burning in Germany. What did she get for her efforts? She got called "old and used up" by even the most liberal press here.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
16. Agree with you on that. Our problem in the West is down to a lack
Sun May 26, 2019, 06:59 PM
May 2019

Of leadership and no one of stature looking to step up. If that leadership doesn't appear in the US in Jan 2021, I am fearful of the future.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
25. Full agreement, there
Mon May 27, 2019, 04:22 AM
May 2019

Where Germany, due to their 20th century past, does not seek a dynamic charismatic leader, the USA does. Merkel's quite, competent stability was just what the doctor ordered for Germany, and indeed it is the envy of Europe at this point.

If Biden becomes the nominee, his VP pick will be crucial.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
30. I believe history will look favourably on Merkel's record. Were that other leaders were as resolute,
Mon May 27, 2019, 05:36 AM
May 2019

especially in France and the UK. Who's the favourite to replace her, and what are they like ?

I'm surprised how well Joe is holding up, it will be interesting to see how these debates go. The one positive is how many Democrats polled, want to coalesce around a candidate, I just hope the debates don't become nasty breaking that unity.

I agree about the VP pick, and though I'm not a betting man, if she continues to be strong my money would be on Harris.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
32. So far, there is no one to replace Merkel
Mon May 27, 2019, 08:05 AM
May 2019

Last edited Mon May 27, 2019, 03:52 PM - Edit history (1)

Her successor as party head, Annette Kramp-Karrenbauer, is an obvious choice, but far from a definite one. First the next federal elections have to take place, and they are not scheduled for two years. The last ones almost ended in a mess, and even the coalition that did result was unsatisfactory. What should have happened was a coalition between Merkel's CDU, the Greens and the FDP, who is a pro-business party that calls themselves "the Liberals." Like with the Greens, no similarity in terms with the USA.

The head of the FDP, who acts very much like he is in the pocket of the fossil fuel industry (coal, oil) torpedoed that coalition, and said he could never work with the Greens. Merkel was forced back into bed with the Social Democrats, who have nothing more to offer than tired old 20 year old slogans, and are in desperate need of rejuvenation. Unfortunately, the head of their youth division gave a fiery speech that could have come from Erich Honecker, himself, and sank the party's prospects for a rosy future in one blow.

One thing is for sure, if the elections were held today, Merkel would have no option but to coalesce with the Greens. But she has led her "conservatives (more socially liberal than half our Democrats, so don't get confused there, either)" slowly leftward, and the Greens have become slowly more pragmatic, so it makes sense. As of now, they don't have 50% between them, which means they would need a third coalition partner, and no one knows who that could be. Not "the Left" or the Afd, who are extremists on both ends of the spectrum, and not the FDP as long as they are led by the suspicious fossil fuel champion (if he is replaced, things get a LOT easier). One bright spot--last year, when Merkel stepped down as party leader, her party had three contenders to replace her. One hard-right (by their standards, not ours), one strong right, and the only woman, and she, the most moderate, won. VERY encouraging.

As for US, Biden is holding up well for now, but 18 months is an eternity in US politics, and anything could happen. Harris is one viable pick, though just one out of many. Far from my favorite, that's for sure. If Biden survives the gauntlet and picks up the nomination, I think Klobuchar, Buttigieg and Inslee have equal chances of being picked, and they don't have the baggage of Harris' ruthless prosecutions when she had that position. Biden could also go outside the circle of other candidates and pick someone completely off that radar, like Howard Dean or Joe Kennedy III. Who knows, maybe even Norm Ornstein or Al Franken? There is a lot of talent to choose from. I reject the notion that the ticket MUST include mixed gender and race just as I reject the notion that it must not. Get a ticket that inspires, and it will get people to the polls in droves. Their pigmentation or chromasomes are matters I don't care about.

One thing I see as a given--whoever our nominee picks as VP, the choice will not be universally popular. However, as long as it is someone who brings some true appeal to the table, and has a good heart (indeed, like Biden himself did in 2008), I'm happy.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
33. Thanks for a fantastic update !
Wed May 29, 2019, 05:45 PM
May 2019

With those federal elections in 2 years, it at least gives a little space for moderate politics to make a comeback. Hopefully anyway.

100% agree with your wish that the VP selection is an inspiring choice. If Joe is the nominee, I think it will narrow the field of VP candidates to those under 60 at least.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
34. It might, but there are some VERY youngish 60 plus people around these days.
Wed May 29, 2019, 06:08 PM
May 2019

Howard will be 71 this November (I can hardly believe it, but the calendar doesn't lie), and Jay Inslee is a VERY young 68. Howard and Jay have very youthful and dynamic voices and are quick on their feet. So, I wouldn't count them out just on their age. On the other hand, if the nominee goes for youth (Buttigieg, O'Rourke, Kennedy, e.g.), I can't fault THAT logic, either. That would depend somewhat on the age of the eventual nominee of course. If we nominate someone under 70, the choice of VP might be made from a different pool of possibles from what the pool might be if the nominee is over 70.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
36. Howard would be an excellent VP, though I would LOVE to see Buttigieg square up to Pence in a VP
Wed May 29, 2019, 06:56 PM
May 2019

debate !

I agree, this is entirely dependant on who the nominee is, and then the age makeup would change.

Also 60 is the new 39 !

DFW

(54,378 posts)
38. I've known Howard for almost 20 years now, and he has more energy than the energizer bunny
Wed May 29, 2019, 11:55 PM
May 2019

A couple of years ago, we rode from Washington to New York City together on the train, and he had just gotten in from London, had something to do in DC and then that evening in New York. Along the way, he said he was seriously jet lagged and needed to sleep. I said, sure, go ahead. He napped for all of five minutes, and then was completely recharged. If that had been me, I would have dozed off before the train got halfway to Baltimore, and probably wouldn't have woken up again until New Haven, an hour past where I wanted to get off!

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
14. EU elections: centrist groups expected to lose grip on power
Sun May 26, 2019, 06:40 PM
May 2019
The 40-year grip of the two main centrist political groups on the levers of power in Brussels looked set to be broken as voters in the European elections turned out in record numbers to bolster radical alternatives including the Greens and the far right.

A populist Eurosceptic surge failed to emerge on Sunday but they were on track to be returned to the European parliament in larger numbers than ever before, with Marine Le Pen’s National Rally celebrating a narrow symbolic victory over Emmanuel Macron’s En Marche in France.


EU election results 2019: across Europe
Read more
There were also signs of major success for the Greens, with the party jumping from 50 MEPs in 2014 to as many as 71 across Europe, almost doubling their result in Germany from the previous election to leapfrog the Social Democratic party (SPD) into second place with 22%, the exit polls suggested.

As votes for the centre parties fall away, the results trigger a starting gun on what will be tortuous negotiations over the key jobs in the EU institutions, including Jean-Claude Juncker’s replacement as European commission president.

The makeup of the parliament will be used by the 28 heads of state and government to guide their choice of replacement for Juncker and his counterpart in the European council, Donald Tusk.

SNIP

The estimated results based on exit polls leave the centre-right European People’s party as the largest in the parliament, but down from 221 seats to 173.

The Socialists and Democrats group also appeared set to drop from 191 seats to 147, leaving the two main groups looking likely to need help from Alliance of Liberals and Democrats (ALDE) with about 102 seats, bolstered by Macron’s En Marche, and the Greens to form a stable majority.

The European of Nations and Freedom group, which combines populist and far-right parties in countries including France and Italy, looked set to secure 57 seats, up 20 from five years ago.

Italy’s far-right League, headed by Deputy Prime Minister Matteo Salvini, is vying with Nigel Farage’s Brexit party as to which will be the biggest single party in the parliament, after polls suggested it would secure 27-31%, increasing its seats from 5 to 25.


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/26/european-elections-centrist-parties-projected-lose-grip-power
 

Baclava

(12,047 posts)
18. Evidently not at all... 'CENTRE COLLAPSES'
Sun May 26, 2019, 08:36 PM
May 2019

Brexit Party storms to victory in EU elections, Nigel Farage delivered a massive "wake-up call" to the Tories and Labour as he led the Brexit Party to a historic win in the European elections.

Hungary’s far-right nationalist Prime Minister Viktor Orban has scored a huge win

France: Marine Le Pen’s right wing party Rassemblement National (National Rally) (RN) becomes biggest party in France with 24% of votes amid historic high voter turnout

Italy's far-right League come out on top in EU election

Belgium: far-right surge in national parliament elections

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2019/may/26/european-elections-2019-results-eu-election-parliament-brexit-party-farage-tories-may-live

 

Ghost Dog

(16,881 posts)
19. Bullshit "Brexit Party victory" from UK MSM spinners.
Sun May 26, 2019, 08:50 PM
May 2019

"Many noting that the combined vote share of the three strong (English) Remain parties – the Lib Dems, the Greens and Change UK – it’s more than the 32 per cent the Brexit Party has taken. It’s a point Green co-leader Sian Berry has made on the BBC."

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/european-elections-results-live-updates-conservative-latest-brexit-party-eu-farage-ukip-tommy-a8931156.html

Add in Scottish, Welsh results even more so.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
23. It's not as bad as it could have been. The Centre will do a deal with the Greens and/or Liberals.
Mon May 27, 2019, 03:02 AM
May 2019

The Fascists will still only have 20-25%, and there is general agreement that the other groups won't touch them.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
22. It's looking like the Far Right/Fascist/Populist haven't made any gains. They'll still be around the
Mon May 27, 2019, 02:59 AM
May 2019

20-25% mark, but the Centre Right-Centre Left have lost their majority and will now have to horse trade with the Greens and/or the Liberals. Plus it appears the original candidate from the Centre Right for Commission President, did badly in his home patch, so now it is possible for Michel Barnier (who did so well for the EU in the Brexit negotiations), to win that vote.

It could have been a LOT worse !

suffragette

(12,232 posts)
26. Very glad to hear this. I'm sure they'll try to disrupt as much as they can, but hopefully this
Mon May 27, 2019, 04:47 AM
May 2019

puts a damper on their chances of doing so.

moondust

(19,981 posts)
21. All paper ballots?
Sun May 26, 2019, 10:32 PM
May 2019

Watching coverage on some EU TV stations, whenever they show polling places I only see paper ballots. Nothing about voting machines or foreign hacking.



Looks to me like migration and climate change are driving far right and greens; could be long-term issues. More radical right probably not a good sign for future "compromise," although if nothing gets done their support could fade.

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
24. I'm pretty sure some EU countries do, but all the ones I know, have paper ballots. After what
Mon May 27, 2019, 03:03 AM
May 2019

went on in the US, I think that won't change either.

DFW

(54,378 posts)
35. No plans AT ALL here to imitate the USA with its hackable machines
Wed May 29, 2019, 06:22 PM
May 2019

Although their software is not perfect here, and they don't take their weaknesses seriously enough.

Case in point, although this was 30 years ago: my wife went to vote one time, and was refused. She asked why, and was told that she lived in Munich (at the other end of Germany) and had to vote there. She has never lived in Munich in her life, and said their information was in error. They snottily said their computer showed that she lived in Munich, and therefore, she lived in Munich. A social worker by profession, my wife then then told hem to look up our daughters (aged 5 and 3 at the time), and asked where they lived. Sure enough, the girls lived right here at home. My wife said the election official should immediately call the police and have her arrested for child abandonment, or she would call them and have the election official cited for having made the false accusation publicly--or they could let her vote. There is NOTHING a bureaucrat fears more than being publicly shown up to be in error, so they let her vote. But they never did manage to erase her fictitious residence in Munich (she was subsequently "moved" up here where she had always been).

OnDoutside

(19,956 posts)
37. We had a major scandal here in Ireland (what's new ?), where the Fianna Fail
Wed May 29, 2019, 07:01 PM
May 2019

government of the time, (under that crook Bertie Ahern) decided we were to have voting machines. They paid a fortune for them, buying from a Dutch company who wouldn't release the software for public scrutiny, AND there was no paper trail ! They were stored in a warehouse for years (at enormous cost) before being scrapped. We have a great system of tallymen here, and people have confidence in the counting system.

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