Why Don't Epstein's Associates Blow the Whistle on Him?

[MineralMan]

In many cases, it's simple: They accepted his "gift" of one of his pre-groomed underage girls at some point. His plane wasn't known as the "Lolita Express" for nothing.

"Let me set you up for a massage, Buddy. It'll do wonders for you." Temptation is easy when you're dealing with philandering middle-aged men of wealth and power, who have gone soft in the middle.

And there it is. Once you accept his generous "gift," you're part of the abusive system he had carefully set up. Maybe your masseuse is a young model, struggling to make a living in that highly competitive business. Maybe she's a troubled teen that Epstein "rescued" and helped financially, in exchange for whatever it is she does.

So, you accept that "massage," which turns into more than a relaxing rubdown. Now, you're guilty of the same thing. You don't get to say, "I didn't know she was only 16 years old!" That trick never works.

Are you going to reveal your knowledge of Epstein's penchant for young girls? Nope. You're going to STFU and hope it doesn't get out that you accepted his generous "gift" of another human being's actions.

Epstein had lots and lots of "friends." He invited many people to his properties and onto his jet. You won't hear any of them talking about Epstein, the serial child sexual abuser. Nope.

[Bettie]

1. It is simple

very rich people have more in common with each other than they do us mere mortals.

They protect each other in most cases, no matter what.

[world wide wally]

17. Very much like the "Thin blue line" for police.

[Bettie]

44. The red velvet rope?

to keep the peons away from them?

[Pachamama]

2. It's the way they all keep the code of silence going....

The hope of course is that someone breaks rank.... maybe one of the "assistants" who sees a better deal in flipping?

[MineralMan]

5. Yes, that is the hope.

Sometimes, such scandals end up with people 'fessing up in exchange for immunity from prosecution. I think there's a good likelihood of that happening in this case, probably with some who stand to lose a great deal if they do not turn on Epstein.

We'll see.

Epstein's system has broken down, now. It worked for a long time, but the chain has broken.

[Clash City Rocker]

29. If only there was a risk of them going to a real prison

The kind of “prison” these guys get sent to probably have golf courses.

[MineralMan]

32. I'm pretty sure no federal prisons have golf courses

available to inmates. I looked it up on Google, and didn't find any such prison or prisons.

[Clash City Rocker]

36. Well, in any case, rich people don't go to the same prisons other people go to

So the fear level is probably not as high with these cretins.

[MineralMan]

38. Generally, that is true, but more because they are not violent people.

Prisons are all about managing people. Some people are dangerous, safety-wise, and some are not. Prison assignments are generally made on that basis. Generally. Rich prisoners tend not to be dangerous, so...

[TNNurse]

42. Epstein

is dangerous. He has assaulted little girls. Who knows how many?

[MineralMan]

55. I'm talking about dangerous to prison staff, not young girls.

There won't be any young girls at the federal prison where he goes.

[jberryhill]

58. They'll have to keep him away from the teen girl wing of the federal prison

It may be difficult, given how many teen girls one finds in a federal prison, but they'll just have to find a way.

[Drifter]

3. I'll bet Acosta is on that list

No one would pursue a plea deal like that without personally benefiting from it.
And that is why he is in the administration. More proof the president is compromised far worse than we realize.

Cheers
Drifter

[MineralMan]

7. That could well be.

I don't know about any particular individuals, though. Except Trump. He has a history of philandery and exploitation. He probably will not be directly implicated, though. He has that much power.

[bigbrother05]

39. Have to wonder what was in M. Cohen's files that didn't apply to Mueller probe

There were federal agents going through the data/tapes/videos to sort out privileged info and things that weren't directly related to the campaign/Russian inquiry.

As Trump's fixer and an obvious hoarder, Cohen likely had things on file that might tangibly connect him to Epstein. The names of people that were paid off could be very long over the time he worked for Trump.

[LiberalFighter]

25. Along with Acosta's scumbag attorneys.

[Kid Berwyn]

4. That and violence.

Fear of sudden death is a very powerful tool of control.

[rampartc]

6. you are on a roll mineral man. the only surprising thing is that these "victims"

are not smart enough to decline his hospitality.

katie Johnson, the 13 year old who was raped by trump, said something. she "still thought there was a difference between models and girls who did those things."

[MineralMan]

9. Smart breaks down at the prospect of some things

for many. Some temptations don't get resisted if people have confidence they won't be discovered, I'm afraid. With wealth, power, or fame also comes a sense of invulnerability.

As for the modeling industry, there are far more young girls and women who dream of being a famous model than there are opportunities to become one. So, as people often do, some will compromise themselves in search of that dream. Others will take advantage of that, and do on a regular basis, from what I have read.

[Moostache]

35. Add "actresses" / "actors" to that list and the population of exploitable youth is huge.

Models, artists, actors, singers, and many others are vulnerable to the temptation of someone "helping" them with friendship and a little cash that becomes a visit to an exclusive area or club or party invite and then a private meeting and then a "massage" or "shoulder rub" and understanding before drinks/drugs/both are flowing...by the time the victims realize what is happening they are in compromised positions, being violated and unable to respond or resist as their mind or will would like to.

These predators know their desires and proclivities and also know just how many people our society has bred to be willing to get into compromised positions for a taste of the "good life", the material, the possessions and of course the power; or just how many are in bad situations beyond their own making and desperate for a life line, a way out, just hope in general. Willing, unwilling, able to consent or not....these are not matters of concern to the Epsteins and Trumps of the world.

Our sick modern society, stuffed to the gills with sexual messaging and innuendos and messages of greed and possessing as the only thing worth doing, helps set the jungle for these predators like never before, opening up enormous numbers of potential victims and ensuring that they will get whatever they seek, then they just apply time and pressure and wait. You almost NEVER hear of these kinds simply going the "full-Trump" and grabbing people or outright assaulting them on first contact. It is always nefarious, slow, almost reptilian in its cold-blooded calculus.

The Kings and Queens of Europe had the same kind of perverts and predators, as did the Pharaohs of Egypt and the Emperors of Rome. As long as money has conveyed privilege and power on a few over the many, offering a target rich environment and hedonistic exploitative playground, these scumbags have lived and walked among us.

Here's hoping that Epstein never experiences another free night in his time on the earth...it can't wipe away what he did, but it can at least prevent him from continuing to harm more people.

[LuvNewcastle]

46. Vampires are a metaphor for those kinds of people.

Whether people realize it or not, the concept of vampires comes from observations about decadent aristocracy and the way they behave, always sucking and taking and discarding. People like that are what makes the world so shitty. I hope that with gene therapy we might be able to change the genes that cause that sort of behavior. I guess they might come up with something far into the future, but I don't know if they'll be able to do it before the fuckers bring an end to this world.

[Hekate]

40. When referring to children of 13 and 14, please don't put "victims" in quotation marks

The difference between someone who is 17 1/2 and someone who is 18 may be a quibble, but the younger you go the more vulnerable to adult manipulation. At 16 and 15 a person may look sort of adult, but they are children, and not just in the law. Their emotions, their brains, their reasoning processes, their very internal organs, are not those of adults and won't be for years yet.

And this Epstein slime preyed on little girls of 13 and 14 promising them the glitter of some fairytale, only to rape them and pimp them out to his pals.

That experience psychologically warped them for life, and they would never be the same. I guarantee you.

[rampartc]

45. sorry. i was referring to the olser "clients" whom i don't consider to be victims at all

[Johnny2X2X]

8. Epstein is under the protection of the POTUS

Trump has helped Epstein whenever he could.

[MineralMan]

10. Maybe. But, there is no honor among bad people.

They will turn on anyone if they think it will protect themselves. Trump is SO over Epstein, I'm sure.

[LiberalArkie]

11. I really believe that this video has everything probably pretty well lined up as to who was doing

what.


https://vimeo.com/243335623

[Pachamama]

14. Excellent video showing the diagram of the "org chart"....

Interesting how it shows Epstein and his connection to Maxwell and as the "Launderer"...

Obviously Epstein was also a lot more....

[Mme. Defarge]

30. Christopher Wray?

[ancianita]

41. Right? That's too suspicious. I've read about all the other connections. But not Wray. Bogus.

[LiberalArkie]

47. The Brian Benczkowski from Alpha bank is over these parts of the DOC

Assistant Attorney General—Criminal Division
Deputy Assistant Attorney General
Public Integrity Section
Office of Enforcement Operations
Deputy Assistant Attorney General
Asset Forfeiture and Money Laundering Section
Narcotic and Dangerous Drug Section
Child Exploitation and Obscenity Section
Deputy Assistant Attorney General
Office of International Affairs
International Criminal Investigative Training Assistance Program
Office of Oversees Prosecutorial Development Assistance and Training
Deputy Assistant Attorney General
Fraud Section
Appellate Section
Capital Case Section
Deputy Assistant Attorney General
Computer Crime and Intellectual Property Section
Human Rights and Special Prosecutions Section
Organized Crime and Gang Section
Chief of Staff to the Assistant Attorney General
Office of Administration
Counselor to the Assistant Attorney General
Office of Policy and Legislation

[ancianita]

48. I don't understand what's meant by "over." How does it even connect at ALL to Wray. I don't get it.

Nowhere have I read corroborating news about Wray's connections to Alpha.

Links?

[LiberalArkie]

50. Not Alfa, it was Rosfelt. The Russian oil company.

[ancianita]

61. And...? I still don't get Wray's inclusion in this. He's outside this network, investigating it.

Our Intelligence agencies gave this info to the FBI to do investigating and threat assessment.

There's no information to justify his inclusion on this chart of corruption. Wray was in the FBI long before these guys showed up in post-Yeltsin Russia.

[LiberalArkie]

49. Here is Wrays history.. Not that much,

https://heavy.com/news/2017/05/christopher-chris-wray-ray-fbi-director-us-attorney-comey-bio/


he did threaten to resign the DOJ if Comey got fired.

[ancianita]

68. A principled stand, one would think.

[LiberalArkie]

69. Yes, but Wray still there and Comey was fired.

[ancianita]

70. None of that justifies Wray being on thi chart of an international corruption network.

[Farmer-Rick]

12. So one capitalist king loves him some children to f*ck and he sets up another king

So, he has dirt on them and that keeps the others quiet. There are not a lot of kings so they can gang together and organize easily. They all know about this. At least the ones in power do. So what if a predator is raping little children? We are specially blessed by God with our wealth to do what ever trips our trigger. Who cares as long as I'm getting more capital and my rocks off.

I can't believe people still admire all these rich f*cks. From the Koch brothers, to the Trumps to the Gates and Waltons to the Bezos they are all in on it.

[Mike Nelson]

13. I was going to say...

… money and power. Your theory goes a step further... it amounts to seducing men into the lifestyle. Hopefully, there are people who did more than get away from the situation. It needs to be reported, especially by the men - as they are adults and have a better chance to stop the behavior.

[Qutzupalotl]

15. They're saying he made videos,

which would make it impossible to deny one’s involvement. Evidently the goal was to get wealthy and powerful people in his back pocket. Why he wanted or needed that is not clear to me yet.

[Baitball Blogger]

16. Country Club mentality.

They don't care where the money comes from. In fact they groove in the stories of abuse. It shows that these people have power. And power means money.

[Lonestarblue]

18. Did Epstein tape encounters?

I really, really, really hope that he did and the SDNY will find one of Trump with an underage girl. What really went on at Mar-a-Lago when Trump and Epstein had 28 girls over just for the two of them? I would think that employees at the time might have some idea.

[MineralMan]

20. I have no idea. It wouldn't surprise me, though.

If so, that would explain many things, wouldn't it?

He apparently had lots of photos, but we don't know exactly of whom or what. With hidden video cameras available everywhere and inserted in any number of innocent-looking things, it wouldn't surprise me at all if there are videos of people other than Epstein with underage girls.

But, where are they, if they still exist. On thumbdrives or DVDs? I don't know. His NYC home was searched, but there haven't been searches of his other properties that I've heard of. Perhaps there should be, although any such videos could be in some attorney's safe somewhere.

I just don't know.

[leftieNanner]

24. The tapes may have been removed by the

Carpet and tile guy.

[Polybius]

71. He also offered older girls

But even if they find one with Trump and a 22 year old, it will be very damaging.

[Midnightwalk]

19. Goodfellas

You know, we always called each other good fellas. Like you said to, uh, somebody, 'You're gonna like this guy. He's all right. He's a good fella. He's one of us.' You understand? We were good fellas.

You write about associates who committed an act. The wider problem is that people who associate with those with power tend to act in each others interest. Not necessarily to get something in return, but to stay in good standing.

The rewards come eventually. When it’s time to find someone for a position or to work on something the people in good graces have a huge advantage.

For every person who committed an act there were several who saw and heard things that were wrong and did nothing.

I don’t disagree with anything you said, just adding a different dimension to the discussion.

[MineralMan]

21. Yes, there's that element, too, I'm sure.

However, such associations and trusts are weaker than ones backed by incriminating evidence, particularly in the cases of rich and powerful people. Or so I believe.

[Midnightwalk]

27. Yeah

The people who only saw suspicious or incriminating activities are probably at least embarrassed and maybe ashamed they didn’t say anything. It is also harder to come forward with “I saw this thing that seemed wrong” rather than a concrete accusation. Seeing something concrete and not reporting it probably carries legal issues.

The people who committed acts have a more obvious reason to stay silent.

I hope there are enough investigators who are contacting the people who hung in these circles and are digging into any leads. That includes the FBI as well as investigative reporters.

You get these people when you get someone to flip. A paper trail of payoffs would be great but maybe less likely.

I hope we do get more arrests and if we do the story about the investigation will be interesting.

[SCVDem]

22. It wouldn't surprise me at all

If all these rich pricks had kompromat on each other.

Just a little insurance policy.

[MineralMan]

31. Someone mentioned that Epstein might have had hidden cameras

at his properties. In that case, perhaps some folks are silent because they have been told there is video of them and someone underage. That would work a treat in keeping someone quiet, I'd think.

[DinahMoeHum]

23. To sum up in one word. . .BLACKMAIL.

[ChicagoRonin]

26. Makes me think of this Godfather II scene

[link:

|

[KY_EnviroGuy]

28. Why? Fear of retribution, perhaps?

I believe there's a layer of high-wealth and powerful people that believe they are above the laws most of us adhere to, but also that there is an unwritten code of criminal honor that's similar to the mafia and Reagan's 11th commandment:

"Thou shalt not speak out negatively against any rich man or person of high influence".

Anyone who breaks this code is subject to losing their career and riches, and their reputation will be pounded to dust - along with that of any family members.

These people have tentacles that reach into finance, banking, industry and most of our media. They can do massive damage to any individual with just a few phone calls.

And, as you've said MineralMan, they know each other's weaknesses and they do keep notes......

[llmart]

34. "...tentacles that reach into finance, banking, industry and most of our media"

don't forget the churches.

Speaking of churches, isn't this the same psychology behind how the Catholic priests have gotten away with their pedophilia for decades upon decades?

[KY_EnviroGuy]

43. Very true - with their fake morality and prosperity gospel.

They never, never threaten their authoritarian structure and that structure includes the clergy.

One can tell by the way Republicans talk about their politicians, big business nobility and right-wing clergy with endless accolades and exaggerations. Makes me sick to hear it.

I think the structure varies by individual but typically starts at the top with their god of choice, then downward with high-level politicians, right-wing celebrities and CEOs, clergy, then friends and family of similar persuasion.

Horrible way to live and it's subject to fail or collapse at any time. But, they always have Limbaugh and Faux News to patch it up for them immediately with lots of new lies.

[Hekate]

33. Exactly what I thought

Exactly

[BobTheSubgenius]

37. All it takes is one.

And, I'd be surprised if there wasn't more than one negotiating through their attorney for a good plea deal.

The plutocrats may love each other, but each one loves him or herself more. In this case, all "him" I would think, but you never know...

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

51. That, and even if they didn't avail themselves of those "services,"

they would have known that Epstein and his lawyers could have crushed them like bugs if they tried to rat him out. "If you're a celebrity you can do anything."

[Turbineguy]

52. His safety net was to put people

in a position to blackmail. By him or others.

[jberryhill]

53. Why Didn't Bill Cosby's Associates Blow the Whistle on Him?

Is it because Cosby invited his friends and associates to also rape women he drugged?

Is that what you believe about Cosby?

[MineralMan]

54. Right now, the subject is Jeffrey Epstein.

Bill Cosby is an entirely another issue. And look how long it too for him to be caught and punished.

As far as I know, though, Bill Cosby didn't have an airplane known as the "Lolita Express" flying well-connected people to and from his various properties.

Different situations.

[jberryhill]

56. The situations aren't that different in principle

Yes, Cosby was black and Epstein isn't. Big deal.

Bill Cosby was a sexual predator who racked up a huge number of victims, and none of his associates seem to have known about that.

Since I'm so stupid, why don't you explain to me the relevant differences that allowed a rich and powerful man to be a serial sexual predator, without any of his close friends or associates specifically knowing about it.

[MineralMan]

57. I actually started another thread about entertainers and child sexual abuse.

If I recall, Cosby didn't molest children, as far as I know. There's a big difference.

[jberryhill]

59. Yes, there is a big difference

If one is molesting children, then one has to go through a whole lot more effort to conceal it under the cover of "massages" or "modeling" than the way Cosby did, since claiming "they came to me" won't work as well.

Does it strike you as at all unusual that in a deeply-investigated federal indictment detailing several victims and referring to a large number of other victims, and in which the role of a limited number of employees are mentioned as procurers, that there is utterly no reference or even implied suggestion in it whatsoever to any other person engaging in sexual assault against the victims?

Remarkably, none of the victims who have been pursuing the lawsuit in Florida - for which there is an extensive factual record - and this indictment, makes no reference to anyone engaging in unlawful sexual conduct other than Epstein.

How do you account for that?

[MineralMan]

62. How do I account for any of it? Not my job, actually.

As for the victims, a couple have named others. I don't think we have the whole story, actually. We may never have it.

I don't have the details, personally. Perhaps I'll learn them at the same time you do.

[jberryhill]

63. "I don't have the details, personally."

Your OP is fairly detailed.

You state:

" In many cases, it's simple: They accepted his "gift" of one of his pre-groomed underage girls at some point."

You don't claim this is a guess or just speculation. You state this as a fact.

[MineralMan]

64. Here's one story:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=12262227

You might want to read it.

Am I speculating? Obviously I am. But, do see the link above.

[jberryhill]

65. Why don't you have a look at that thread you linked to

I am very familiar with the details of that story.

>You might want to read it.

It's quite clear that you haven't read that thread.

[MineralMan]

66. Yes, I know you've seen that thread.

And now, I'm done answering your questions. I'm not on trial here.

[Polybius]

72. Bill Cosby likely didn't tell any of his friends

He did the monstrous deed himself. Epstein ran the ring. Many more people knew about it.

[jberryhill]

73. There's nothing in the indictment about a ring

The indictment, and the civil suit, detail a series of victims who were scouted and procured by certainof his employees and by other victims, to provide massages which he used to progressively groom them.

There’s a lot of other speculation going on, some of it verging on Pizzagate or Franklin Scandal conspiracy mongering, but that’s got nothing to do with what the federal prosecutors have charged him with.

Can you point me to the part of the Epstein indictment which describes this ring, or providing victims to persons other than himself?

I seriously must have missed that part.

[Eliot Rosewater]

60. Fascist traitor rapist in WH,

That is where my focus is.

and at least ONE on the SC

[PufPuf23]

67. Jimmy Savile in the UK is a good example as is

the Vatican that as an institution protected extensive pedophilia (under grace one supposes - sarcasm)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Savile_sexual_abuse_scandal

Jimmy Savile (1926–2011) was an English media personality who was well known in the United Kingdom for his eccentricities and, at the time of his death, was generally respected for his charitable work. He was knighted in 1990. In late 2012, almost a year after his death, reports surfaced indicating that Savile had committed sexual abuse throughout his 50-year career, his alleged victims ranging from prepubescent girls and boys to adults.
By 11 October 2012, allegations had been made to thirteen British police forces,[1] which led to the setting-up of inquiries into practices at the BBC and within the National Health Service. On 19 October, London's Metropolitan Police Service launched a formal criminal investigation, Operation Yewtree, into historic allegations of child sexual abuse by Savile and other individuals, some still living, over four decades. The Metropolitan Police stated that it was pursuing over 400 lines of inquiry, based on the claims of 200 witnesses, via fourteen police forces across the UK. It described the alleged abuse as being "on an unprecedented scale", and the number of potential victims as "staggering".[2][3] By 19 December, eight people had been questioned as part of the investigation. The Met stated that the total number of alleged victims was 589, of whom 450 alleged abuse by Savile.[4][5]