I get abused here for advocating against bashing Democrats and petty bickering

[Cary]

The abusers posture as if, and imply that, their bashing makes them superior and they gaslight me, as if not only their bashing renders them superior but also there is something wrong with me for not understanding that.

Occasionally their arrogance gets them a hide, but not often enough in my opinion.

We have a Nazi in the White House. Put your arrogance down, for God's sake. Quit your insipid ego plays. I am not your enemy and the fact that you don't see that and waste your energy on petty nonsense speaks poorly of you. We have a Nazi in the White House. Direct your enegy against that.

VOTE DEMOCRATIC!

[912gdm]

1. don't take it personally

[Cary]

2. It is not about me it is about fighting Nazis

[Butterflylady]

19. How is he suppose to take it.

He has an opinion like everyone else and he should not be afraid to say it. I have learned their are certain democrats that one dare not criticize here. I always thought it was our democratic responsibility to call them out when we disagree with them. Thats why I take being on jury here very seriously, just like I would be in a court room.

[USALiberal]

3. Ummm, ok nt

[Cary]

8. If you have a point please make it.

Passive aggression is abusive, and very much part of the abuse to which I refer.

[USALiberal]

77. This has not went well for you. Nt

[Cary]

78. That is an odd comment

1. It went fine:

2. What difference would it make if it didn't?

You are an anonymous poster on an internet b.s. board making an assinine ego play to make me feel badly? Really?

Really?

[MineralMan]

4. Examples, please of the abuse.

As far as I can see, you haven't had any posts hidden, so whatever it is you think you're doing isn't raising any red flags.

People disagree with other people here. That's allowed. People criticize Democrats, especially during a primary campaign. That's not bashing.

So, let's see some examples where you are being abused. Thanks.

[Cary]

6. MM, that goes both ways, which is part of my point

My point, stop bashing Democrats and bickering and attack Nazis, is valid.

And yes I could be more aggressive in pushing back against abuse, but I try not to get hides and generally I don't get hides.

I will not be dredging up examples. I don't recall you being a Democrat basher or a petty bickerer and I was not referring to you. Quite the contrary I find you to be a thoughtful and interesting poster. I have also seen you fend off the kind of abuse to which I refer so I would think that you would understand my point.

Perhaps you don't see the irony of Democrat bashers at Democratic Underground arrogantly referring to their Democrat bashing at Democratic Underground as a hallmark of their superiority?

[Oregon1947]

13. Trump is a racist jerk and bad for the country but a Nazi is someone

who is supported Adolf Hitler in 1940. I think we can be more specific and this makes us look silly.

[deacon2]

21. Respectfully

Nazis are marching in the streets of America (Charlottesville, Portland). They are openly espousing their support for Trump. White Nationalists (not officially nazis, but do we really need to parse this?) are targeting and killing minorities and several were Trump supporters. One of his top advisers was a Neo-Nazi (Gorka). I think we actually look silly when we try to talk around these egregious facts and act as if they aren't happening or that we are having a normal political discussion. We are not. We are in a fight for our democracy whether we like it or not. I couldn't care less if we "look silly" to those who would let America descend into totalitarianism. Let's call things what they are. German Nazis supported Adolf Hitler and American Nazis support Donald Trump with his clear appreciation and approval.

[Cary]

23. No need to parse. No need to mince words

Godwin's Law is a quaint and obsolete notion. When you hit someone, like white supremacists, you hit them. You don't pull your punches.

[Oregon1947]

58. So you advocate our candidates saying this?..thats a losing

proposition.

[Cary]

69. Just another lame excuse for lack of discipline

How embarrassing.

[Cary]

24. I see.

So you feel you have to let it get to that point before you call it what it is.

I think that's foolish.

[MineralMan]

55. That's why we have an alert button on every post.

Bashing Democrats can get a post hidden, and often does. It depends on the jury.

We have a broad spectrum of points of view on DU. We also have broadly different views of what is and isn't bashing. I prefer a particular candidate in the Democratic primaries. Others, I do not like as well. Sometimes I point out reasons why I don't like a particular candidate as the Democratic nominee.

Some have called my rather mild criticisms "bashing." The definition of "bashing" varies among DUers. Some are quick to click the Alert button if another DUer doesn't like one candidate as much as another and says so. Others just see such statements as opinions that have nothing to do with bashing.

That's why we have a juried moderation system on DU. No one person decides. A group reads the post and votes. It's a good system. None of my posts that criticize a particular candidate have been hidden. Therefore, I conclude that I am not "bashing" anyone.

I expect disagreement from other DUers. I've experienced a lot of it. But, that's how open discussion forums go.

[UniqueUserName]

41. I'll give you an example

In a thread saying to support Democrats no matter what I posted a response.

I'm not linking to the thread, because I really don't want to continue the conversation. I don't want to high-jack this thread, but this a cut/paste of what I wrote:

I would happily and vigorously vote for Bernie, Warren, Biden------well, hell, all of them but one. It's not going to be an issue; that candidate won't win.

But if that candidate won. I happily and cheerfully admit defeat. I'm lucky----or is it unlucky? -----in that I don't feel responsible for anyone since my spouse died this year. I feel no obligation to continue if Trump--or dummy-----makes the world unlivable. For me, it's like, If this is the world you want, have at it. Bye bye----I don't think that is what will happen. I hope senator Harris wins, but I expect any of our great candidates will win. We will win and win soundly.

I received mostly sympathetic responses after two prolific posters mocked me. I wasn't looking for sympathy. I didn't think I'd get any response. I thought most people would think, oh a grieving person and move on.

The responses that I got from these two were "GBCW" , and I responded back that I had to look up what that meant. If you don't know it means "Good Bye Cruel World"----now I know. I had to look it up. Then the poster responded "oh the drama". My last year has been extremely dramatic. I'm not sure about the rest of the posts. I thought the offensive poster had been conciliatory, and I acknowledged that.

When the other poster said the same thing "wash your socks" I realized I had to go look that up. If you don't know, that mean get a blowjob. I deleted my last post when I realized they were mocking me. These childish and cruel responses make democrats appear like another tribe. Tribe A, Tribe B, same thing. You and I KNOW that there's a huge difference. But some independent might think, "meh, why bother?"

Please don't feel like I need a response. You asked for an example of people being abusive.

[cwydro]

74. No, that's not what "washing socks" means. Not here at least.

[Mountain Mule]

60. It seems to me that I am always being notified for DU jury service

- Mostly in regard to outrageous statement about Bernie. While I do not support Bernie as a candidate, he's still 100,000 X better than the Second Coming of IQ45. I am voting Democrat, no matter what. Constructive criticism is a good thing, but bashing Democratic primary contenders gets us nowhere. Judging by my repeated requests to serve on jury panels, that seems to be a real problem around here.

[MineralMan]

66. We're all getting a lot of jury duty calls.

A couple a day for me, anyhow. Most of the time, though, there is no bashing - just disagreement with a candidate about something.

I haven't voted to hide a post for some time. I think about it before I do it. Disagreement is not bashing. Think that a particular candidate would not be the best choice as the nominee is not bashing. I'm not a Bernie supporter, for a number of reasons, although I would vote for him in the general election on the off chance that he became the nominee. I doubt that will happen.

Bashing is serious. I'm not seeing much of it. I'm seeing people having preferences for candidates and dislike for some other candidates. That's normal primary campaign stuff.

[Me.]

5. Yes I've Seen It

and aside from those who think they know what they don't know, I always wonder if the others are actually Democrats.

[Cary]

7. Since I have known such people in real life, yes some are Democrats

But certainly some are Republican and Russian troll disruptors.

[mcar]

9. I love it when the bashers say

it's only "constructive criticism." Like calling Democratic leaders spineless, corporatist, Turd Way stooges is constructive.

[Cary]

11. Yes.

But their denialism is more insidious.

My post is an attempt to shine a light on their denialism.

[aikoaiko]

14. Well, I think its working. The 2020 candidates are incredibly brave with their positions.

mostly.

to be more specific, I think the failed 2016 campaigns by Bernie and Hillary showed Democrats and lefty/left-leaning independents how to be fierce and uncompromising.

[Me.]

20. She's Not On Here (at least I Don't think)

but that sounds like Michelle Goldberg, member of the media and frequent Chris Hayes guest

[aikoaiko]

10. Give me a break. Its been quite the love fest around here.

This is not the place or the time to not criticize our candidates.

[Cary]

12. I express my opinion.

No break.

[Newest Reality]

28. Can you develop in yourself

some resilience about opposing remarks and views?

You are bound to get all kinds of responses when you put forth an opinion on a subject. In fact, good debate relies on that and their is a wide spectrum of views on any subject, from cogent and insightful to turgid and reactive.

There seemed to have been several rather loaded words in your OP that suggest you might be taking a very personal, emotional and/or psychological approach to how you see this forum and react to content.

I would imagine that you would prefer that there are no unnecessary and exclusive restrictions that would overly interfere with the member's ability to express themselves within certain, acceptable boundaries.

So, if you adamantly want to express your opinion, you are doing that here. Perhaps it is more empowering for you to factor in that you are going to read and be exposed to responses and behaviors that push your boundaries and empower you to be more resilient, open and less affected by what is to be expected as you proceed?

I merely share that after years of experience. It takes time to be able to pull back a little and get a better perspective on this. The added advantage is that cooler heads prevail and you can make your point more rationally with calm and reasonable responses or you can ignore what you find to be a trigger. Otherwise, you might miss the fun, enjoyment and all that can be learned from the various shades of diversity you find in a free and open, public venue for discussion.

Debate can be an effective tool and a good skill to hone.

[Cary]

33. You assume I lack resilience

That is possible but you have no evidence of that.

It is also possible that I expect better and choose not to tolerate the lack of discipline. You have the best evidence to support that possibility. You have an absolute expert: me.

You can tolerate weak links in our fight against the Nazi in the White House but you cannot that from me.

[Newest Reality]

36. I didn't imply any evidence...

I asked a question about your capacity to do so. I am sorry if I didn't make that clear.

So, are you saying that you are intolerant, but expect toleration? I don't understand the contradiction there.

The lack of discipline point you make is interesting. What kind of discipline do you expect or demand? Is this about the members here, or in general? Maybe you can elaborate on what you mean by that and what your criteria for being a "weak link" is?

[Cary]

40. I am saying Democrats need to have discipline and work toward a common goal

I was clear. I was direct. I was to the point. I was correct.

As I said there is a dialectic at play with bashers getting more subtle and insidious. The telltale sign is when the bashers change the subject from having discipline and working toward a common purpose to some alleged defect in me.

Look closely and you can them working hard at that in this thread.

(look very closely)

[Newest Reality]

45. Okay...

So, let's assume that that is the case and your point is made.

Now, why can't they do that? I think having flexibility is strength and it does take discipline. There are various means here that can be used to rectify the problem and the forum has tools for that.

There is the ability to just overlook a comment that you feel is not fitting your criteria or tolerance level. There is the method of skillful responses that involve no falling prey to trolling or traps and yet, still bring your point to the fore.

Have you ever considered that the fact that you are so bothered by certain responses not only inflames a situation but sidetracks your ability to make your points clearly and effectively while saving energy and time?

I really don't see that ideal day when this forum and its contributes will fit your criteria to your liking, but it is fine that you want to point things out like that. I would prefer that people be honest and direct about what they think and then deal with things on a case-by-case basis in lieu of any kinds of unnecessary restrictions or censorship, wouldn't you agree?

[Cary]

71. The means is self actualization

I am not going to change anyone. If you assume that I have made my point then that is that.

Having discipline and working toward the crushing of Nazis is where you will find me. That is my choice. Make yours.

[Triloon]

61. I guess the larger point you are trying to make is along the lines of

'If we don't all hang together we'll surely all hang separately". I agree. But yesterday when I expressed that criticism of congressional leadership is valid and part of the democratic process you showered me with insults. Repeatedly. You even went so far as to say my attitude helped defeat Hillary. Today you are back complaining about being abused and gaslighted.
Get stuffed, Mr Discipline.

[Cary]

72. Your attitude is fair game.

That isn't an insult. An insult is "you suck" or 'your mother dresses you funny."

That your attitude helped elect Orange Hitler is an attack on your attitude, not you personally.

You need to understand that distinction or you have no business debating.

[Triloon]

75. then your attitude is fair game too

You claim to be fightin Nazis, but all I've seen is you trying to put down democrats.
You claim to be fightin Nazis, but you speak to enforce an authoritarian mindset of "Get in line and shut up."
You claim to be fightin Nazis, but you're sitting there fighting me.

You have admonished us all to stop bickering about petty things. I'll take you up on that right now.

Try Stovetop®, it's quick and easy!

[jcmaine72]

15. It depends on how you're defining the word "bashing"?

There should be a healthy, vigorous discussion about the issues facing our party and nation, as well one surrounding the future direction of our party and what we believe we should stand for. Such discussions can assuredly get heated and contentious. To me, that's fine and doesn't constitute bashing. I don't want to be a mindless automaton like the (R)epugs, blindly voting for a parenthetic letter. We're better than that.

[question everything]

51. Thank you! Well said!

[jcmaine72]

82. Thank you!

[Newest Reality]

73. Well said!!!

[jcmaine72]

83. Thanks!

[FakeNoose]

16. We are ALL pledged to vote D next year

... but each of us can choose which candidate we'd like to see as the standard-bearer for the Democratic Party. We're allowed to change our minds too, and so are you. Healthy debates, including polite disagreements, are allowed and even encouraged during this process.

Once our Party's nominee has been chosen next year - there will be no more disagreements allowed. At that point we'll all join hands (metaphorically) and march forward together.

[Pepsidog]

17. Democrats who bash democrats will lose my support. Dems must stick together.

[IronLionZion]

18. DUers get hostile during primary season

once we are in the general election, if anyone posts about voting against the Democratic nominee in any race you can alert the mods on them.

Vote blue no matter who

[Bernardo de La Paz]

22. UNITE! The Democrat 2020

They are doing one last print run: https://thedemocrat2020.com/collections/frontpage/products/the-democrat-2020-bumper-sticker

[KPN]

25. Maybe it has something to do with the way you present?

Granted, I sometimes am quite guilty of the same.

[Cary]

26. Oh please.

Look at the dynamic. It is not limited to me.

I am fascinated by the fact that I get attacked here at DU for advocating against Democrat bashing. I am fascinated by the fact that some would push back against that, but I am even more fascinated by the fact that people would suggest that I am somehow wrong to express that point of view and even more fascinated by people like you who.suggest that there is something wrong with me.

i used to think we were better than this. I used to think that we were more evolved. I was wrong.

[Newest Reality]

42. Wow...

You are painting with a broad brush and I think this statement needs some clarification. How do define a bash when you use a big hammer like that for us all here? We?

i used to think we were better than this. I used to think that we were more evolved. I was wrong.

Have you ever read The Tao by Lao Tzu? There is some great strategy there, so it is not about criticizing you. There are ways to say things that are not inflammatory and allow you to effectively make a point that is well taken by more people. The more you pick at a wound, the slower it will heal, etc.

[Cary]

48. Lao Tzu would support me, not you

Live close to the ground, don't bash Democrats, keep it simple and put all of your resources into crushing the Nazis totally so that they cannot rally and defeat you.

I morphed some Sun Tzu into that for good measure.

[Newest Reality]

54. That really didn't respond to what I said,

If you want to be vague while trying to make a point that is up to you, however. I respect that.

Clear communication is, to me, essential if you are going to wage a battle like you imply.

For instance, you used "we" in the above quote I gave. That is ripe for interpretation and people will fill in the blanks and it is technically called a missing referent. Do you mean the "we" in this discussion? Does "we" include you? Are you referring to we as the entire forum or is it all democrats? Being more precise with language is another way to strengthen any weaknesses and further the cause in certain cases.

And I will leave your interpretations of Lao Tzu and Sun Tzu in this matter at that, lest I be critical, etc.

Have a good time.

[Newest Reality]

70. I am going to make a few more points to be helpful.

I can't even read into your responses to me as having any sense of comradeship, agreement or response in kind to the general gist of what I was relating.

To build friendship and foment consent, it is really a two-way street and what you have here is one place where you can accomplish that if you want to. Try honoring those who engage with you enough and showing as much respect as you can and see how that goes.

Now, if you are stuck in some sort of defensive mode and filtering things in a certain way, I can certainly understand that. It is a matter of habit and really requires pulling back a little and paying attention to one's own mind. That is how I approach it, you don't have to.

Using terminology like "bashing", "gas lighting" and "abuse" seems to be out of place and may not help you make your point. This is not a psychological, technical evaluation forum, obviously. You are not required to stay in a situation where you are feeling abused and gas lit, so those terms don't apply here because you can leave and are safe where you are unless there is some underlying paranoia. I just don't think those terms are appropriate or accurate and involve your personality more than the issues and struggle you promote and I imagine you want that to take precedent, right?

Really, there are many, many more appropriate, colorful, descriptive terms you could utilize in place of those terms that would actually be even more effective, rather than inducing eye rolls and critical remarks.

Consider the ramifications of how you respond and approach this and maybe figure out more clearly what you want. Would you rather have all kinds of reactions to what you post, or would you like to have more people either put you on ignore, not bother to reply, or worse yet, respond with care and caution, (like I am doing) in order not to exacerbate your reactions and inflame your perspective? Then, you would have to wonder if you are only being catered to, treated with kid gloves, or just avoided completely. You wouldn't even know it. Is that acceptable?

So, that gives you more choices that have their pros and cons and am sure you can decide that for yourself correctly.

I hope that is helpful. I tried my best to not to accidentally offend you or spark too much controversy, and maybe you see my point about how what I just said had to be carefully worded as if giving special treatment.

Keep up that enthusiasm and fight the good fight, but practice more in the ring and add to your skills: for the cause! Thanks.

[question everything]

27. Pointing to offensive, bigoted acts by Demcorats -

yes, we have some of them - that cast a shadow on the party is not "bashing."

If we cannot criticize our own, if we follow "groupthink" than we will not be able to earn the support of independents and, yes, sane Republicans (there are a few there).

[Cary]

29. Tired, old excuse posited by the bashers.

And exploited by trolls.

Sorry, not.good enough.

[emmaverybo]

53. Echoing false media-stirred controversies, willfully ignoring or being ignorant of context so as to

ascribe bigotry or offense, going so far as to mischaracterize an incident in order to expose offense—when none intended or given—these are not honest efforts to fairly criticize our candidates, but rather propagandist strategies to bash and malign a candidate, to undermine her candidacy, and to foment unease among her supporters.

Often the troll concern adopts a high-minded guise—expressed as righteous indignation on behalf of others who should be offended, whether or not they are or were. Sometimes the outraged reaction is not meant to lobby against a Democrat, but is itself an over-reaction, often without
the full facts.

I am reminded of the puritans. Some were just trying to get rid of bothersome folks, satisfy a personal grudge, but many were convinced that they could tell who was a witch and that the witch’s removal protected the Democratic Party—er, village.

[SunSeeker]

30. I get abused here for calling for Trump's impeachment. Weird huh? nt

[yaesu]

34. I agree, he should be impeached even if it doesn't clear the Senate, which it won't

but at least it will be on the books.

[SunSeeker]

37. Exactly. nt

[NNadir]

31. "We have a Nazi in the White House."

Good point.

I'm ABB in the primaries, "Anyone But Bernie" but in the extremely unlikely case he were the nominee, I'd be comparing him to Jesus, something he might like.

However, this said, I recently wrote this elsewhere.

My preferred candidate is big on policy, and I will plainly confess that I suspect that there are many policies I'm sure she has outlined with which I disagree.

I'm supporting her mind and her personality as informed by her personal history not her policies as announced.

What is important in these extraordinary times is the ability to defend and articulate ideas, not for the purpose of getting elected but for the purpose of saving our country after being elected.

It has been America's good fortune to be lead by Lincoln and Franklin Roosevelt after disastrous Presidencies, but we have never before had an insane President.

We clearly need this fortune again. Both Lincoln and Roosevelt were highly controversial in their own times.

This is not a time for timidity, for cowering in fear of the nutcase with a gun. We need some courage to disarm this mad terrorist.

Let's test our candidates and ourselves.

Probably reference to the personal qualities of a legitimate Democratic Candidate is out of line, for instance implying that a leading candidate is too old, but I think policy criticisms are wise and help test our candidates, something the primary season is designed to do.

We don't simply need a different President; we are at a historical point where we need a "great" President.

[Cary]

38. I have never said anything negative about Sanders

That hasn't stopped strident and obnoxious people who claim to support him from abusing me.

[NNadir]

39. You can shrug it off. Most of them are not Susan Sarandon.

If they prove to be, there's no way to make them stop being Susan Sarandon, since Susan Sarandon is an asshole who thinks her views should allow people to be comfortable with Nazis in the White House.

Hillary Clinton is a great American. Susan Sarandon is a minor league actress with a poor education and difficulty with thinking straight. Anyone here who is similar is not worth your breath.

If they are still here after the nominee is selected, and still trashing our candidate, our wonderful administrators and their fine system of getting the consensus of our members with the Jury system will ban them.

[yaesu]

32. I have an ignore list full of those who get carried away with concern trolling, bashing

and I do notice more from one or two particular candidate groups. nt

[Cary]

35. I don't ignore

I.call.it out as I did here.

The dialectic is interesting. The bashers have gotten more subtle and insidious. I try to get more direct and better at identifying.

They out themselves here. Do you see them?

[NNadir]

43. On the issue most important to me, climate change, where my views are somewhat controversial...

...I have found the "ignore" button to be a wonderful thing.

I resisted using it for years, but I've found that there are just some people who are too stupid to engage.

In fact, there are certain forums I avoid completely; for example I no longer post on the E&E forum, even though I consider myself very much an environmentalist and very much in favor of addressing climate and other environmental issues. One of the mods there is on my ignore list for the reasons given above, and he uses his personal authority in a way I consider unjust. So I just don't write there.

It is not worthwhile to waste your energies and your time on stupidity. Five or six posts that are identical or nearly identical in the face of all reason and evidence is enough to use the key in my experience.

It's, again, wonderful. It's liberating.

[Thekaspervote]

50. Ha! I use the ignore button a lot too

[NNadir]

56. It's good for your health. n/t.

[yaesu]

67. T think a lot of them like to bait other members into getting the boot, which can easily happen here

I believe they get their kicks out of it.

[Judi Lynn]

85. It's vile having to witness an experienced troll doing this to a decent, honorable contributor.

Have seen it happening more than I could stand. One feels so helpless knowing what's happening, and seeing them pull it off slickly. They do live for it, and they will do it repeatedly. DU has lost some amazing voices due to this unbelievable hateful harassment.

[yaesu]

86. I agree 100%. nt

[treestar]

44. Some people have this idea that

putting things down makes them above it all and superior.

[Thekaspervote]

49. Indeed... luv luv the pix of Obama, yes greatest president of our time!!

[cwydro]

46. Sorry you've experienced abuse here. You seem like a fair-minded poster.

Just remember it’s nothing but pixels on a screen.

Unfortunately, it’s going to get worse before it gets better - especially in the primaries forum.

I took long breaks during the Hillary/Bernie wars.

[Thekaspervote]

47. Hey Cary, like the others have said don't let it get you down.

You’re right the arrogance of some posters opinions that they want to pass off as facts is nothing more than arm chair politics at its worst

ME TOO vote for our dem candidate! Stop the bashing of not only the candidates but other DU’ers

[Thekaspervote]

52. Just one other interesting thing. Looking down the list of commenters I don't see any of the usual

Names that are always there in the dem bashing ops.... telling

[brooklynite]

57. Please define "bashing"

[Thekaspervote]

63. Negative opinion that is not based in fact

I am not going to say anymore..as this thread was meant as support for a DU’er that feels picked on

[Arthur_Frain]

59. You haven't accepted one opposing point raised by anyone else in this thread as valid

All you have are excuses and more complaints.

Meanwhile, now theres a whole thread here in devotion to you defending yourself against everything under the sun, doing basically nothing but what you are complaining about, that is, bitching about how other democrats are treating other democrats.

The meta is stunning, but this is not a safe space. Defend your position validly, identify those who are only here to stir the shit and ignore them if you feel you must.

But telling other people they shouldn’t tell you what they think?

[Thekaspervote]

64. Thank you!! Very good advice

[bucolic_frolic]

62. BothSiders are undermining our ideology and logic too

They post something you agree with, and something negative about a Democrat that gives you cognitive dissonance. Then they give a third solution and you feel better. But it's the #2 part of the equation that they sought to plant. And it's in your mind now.

I agree many more should be booted, called out for their actions.

[Thekaspervote]

65. Thx for posting... agree

[Cary]

68. Oh yes. Let's continue to push back against that insidious "both sides" crap too.

I don't know about booting. Push back. Stick to the subject. Repudiate what they do.

Thanks.

[virgogal]

76. I would never stay anyplace where I felt abused.

[Cary]

79. I would never let an idiot drive me away

[brer cat]

80. You are shining a light

on people who do not wish to see. I agree that it seems to makes them feel superior although to me they come across as petty and small, more middle school than mature adults. I would never give serious attention to their opinion which is counter productive if they are trying to convince us of the greatness of their preferred candidate.

I totally agree that we need to direct our energy to the rancid republican party and quit the intra-party squabbles. That is not the way to win elections.

[Cary]

81. That is the message

I am amazed at the people who tenaciously cling to their right to sow.discord and discontent.

[Judi Lynn]

84. Great post. Rec. n/t