General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPentagon Says Trump Was Never Supposed To Share Picture Of Damaged Iranian Launchpad
https://www.politicususa.com/2019/08/30/pentagon-says-trump-was-never-supposed-to-share-picture-of-damaged-iranian-launchpad.htmlPosted on Fri, Aug 30th, 2019 by Jason Easley
Pentagon Says Trump Was Never Supposed To Share Picture Of Damaged Iranian Launchpad
Trump tweeted a picture of a damaged Iranian launchpad that was part of an intelligence briefing that he was not supposed to publicly share.
Trump tweeted:
@realDonaldTrump
The United States of America was not involved in the catastrophic accident during final launch preparations for the Safir SLV Launch at Semnan Launch Site One in Iran. I wish Iran best wishes and good luck in determining what happened at Site One.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EDPFB_XWkAY6QWB?format=jpg
CNBC reported:
A U.S. defense official told CNBC that the picture in Trumps tweet, which appeared to be a snapshot of a physical copy of the satellite image, was included in a Friday intelligence briefing.
Experts told CNBC that the shot was likely never meant for public view.
There us shadow in the picture that Trump tweeted that appears to be the president snapping a shot of intelligence briefing, which he then tweeted out to his followers.
Recklessness with classified information has been a hallmark of the Trump presidency. Trump has leaked classified intelligence to Americas enemies and blabbed about intel to the American people.
The federal government has to hide information from the President Of The United States or risk it ending up on Twitter.
The biggest national security to the American people is sitting in the Oval Office, and the nation wont be safe until Trump gets shipped back to Trump Tower.
dhol82
(9,353 posts)Perseus
(4,341 posts)What a looser...Geez!
sarge43
(28,946 posts)The best they can do is tell him as little as possible.
dhol82
(9,353 posts)Mike_DuBois
(93 posts)Simple as that
Perseus
(4,341 posts)the title which the creature doesn't deserve.
As a matter of security they should just give him the lowest information, one that can not harm the country, they know very well he doesn't have the mind to make good decisions anyway, but he has the mind of a traitor, it just comes natural to him.
Mike_DuBois
(93 posts)Whether deserved or not, it's irrelevant what anyone thinks. Until he is no longer President, he IS the authority from which all classification derives.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)So, there is this trusted group somewhere who decides on their own, with no oversight by any elected official, what the president should know or not know?
Do these people also do that when there is a Democrat in office whom they dont trust?
People such as this guy, for example:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court-martial_of_Terry_Lakin
Doctor Terry Lakin, a lieutenant colonel in the United States Army, announced that he would refuse deployment, and subsequently refused to deploy to Afghanistan because of his concerns over President Obama's constitutional eligibility to be president. It was Lakin's hope that he could request a copy of Obama's birth certificate as part of a court-martial, a goal that had eluded previous military defendants. Lakin had the support of three retired American generals.
Thomas Hurt
(13,903 posts)Wellstone ruled
(34,661 posts)Oh and Comey broke the law,what a Ignorant Ass Wipe in the Oval latrine,I mean office.
hot2na
(358 posts)He only violated DOJ policy.
Wellstone ruled
(34,661 posts)sarcastic response.
My hunch is,Trump used the Iranian Photo in a attempt to drag Hillary back into his 2020 campaign. And he will throw in a ton of Comey after yesterday's spewing he wants his two and half years back that these two plus Obama stole from him.
Talk about one sick friggin Puppy.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)an important matter? They must know that whatever Trump sees and hears is going to straight to Putin, if not the entire world, like in this instance. Had enough yet, guys?
Eyeball_Kid
(7,440 posts)GOPers are terrified and won't act. We should always remember their cowardice and their complicity. THIS is who they are.
GOPers WILL NOT do the right thing. They are as criminal and unpatriotic as Trumpy. They are in Putin's hip pocket. The Republican Party has been co-opted by Putin and his oligarchs. They know it and they deny it. But we all should know by now that they are liars.
The state of the union is perilously close to disintegration when we have a major political party that feels no loyalty to their oaths of office and no loyalty to the Constitution. Putin wants the US to be weakened and destroyed, and the GOP is aiding and abetting Putin. The GOP is giving Trumpy the power to rip the nation to shreds.
lpbk2713
(42,772 posts)While being a major asset to Putin.
OAITW r.2.0
(24,737 posts)The onboard intelligence to do it himself.
mainer
(12,037 posts)and guessed that it was a photo taken with his phone.
Newest Reality
(12,712 posts)He'll do what he want!!!!
I wonder if he studied Cartman's style?
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Anything else is bullshit
vsrazdem
(2,177 posts)SpankMe
(2,972 posts)And there are OpSec protocols that have been violated here on multiple levels.
1. Classified data must always remain in a SCIF unless being moved between SCIFs in a sealed satchel by a courier.
2. An unclassified, uncontrolled camera (any recording device not approved for classified storage) may not be brought into a SCIF. Certain unclassified electronic devices are permitted in SCIFs under strict conditions, but must have cameras, WiFi/Bluetooth, microphones, external ports, etc., disabled. These devices are registered with paperwork and are given serial numbers by Security.
3. A device - such as a cell phone or camera - that is approved for classified storage may not be connected to any unclassified network - the Internet in particular.
In this case, we have a classified picture that was removed from a SCIF to an unclass area to be photographed by an uncleared camera, or an uncleared camera was brought into a SCIF to take a picture of a classified image. Neither of these acts falls under the "POTUS-may-declassify-anything-he-wants" rules.
The uncleared camera was then connected to the Internet and then the classified image was transmitted.
This was a multi-step effort to take data known to be classified and distribute it on unclassified channels.
I suppose we could say this constitutes declassification of this one image by POTUS. But, what about all the other OpSec violations that likely occurred to get that image out? To the extent that those violations may have caused data spills unintended by POTUS - or even unknown by him - can we still say that any other spilled classified data is permissible as "declassified by POTUS"?
If his cell phone caught other classified images or sounds during the transaction that he doesn't know are there and which could later leak out by hacking or inadvertent transmission, then does this fall under POTUS declassification principles?
My answer is - no.
This is an impeachable offense, in my opinion. Of not for the release of the image itself, then certainly due to the violations of security protocols.
vsrazdem
(2,177 posts)stopdiggin
(11,404 posts)including previous administrations and the Supreme court. It is reckless in the extreme -- but not outside the presidents powers, and thus not illegal.
Mustellus
(328 posts)... those rules are only for the peasantry...
dalton99a
(81,673 posts)The majority ruling in the 1988 Supreme Court case Department of Navy vs. Egan -- which addressed the legal recourse of a Navy employee who had been denied a security clearance -- addresses this line of authority.
"The President, after all, is the Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States" according to Article II of the Constitution, the courts majority wrote. "His authority to classify and control access to information bearing on national security ... flows primarily from this constitutional investment of power in the President, and exists quite apart from any explicit congressional grant."
Steven Aftergood, director of the Federation of American Scientists Project on Government Secrecy, said that such authority gives the president the authority to "classify and declassify at will."
https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/may/16/james-risch/does-president-have-ability-declassify-anything-an/
Putin chose well.
Mustellus
(328 posts).. didn't declassify Valerie Plame's existence, after they had Scooter Libby leak it. They could have saved his ass, but they let him go to prison for it.
Eyeball_Kid
(7,440 posts)Mike_DuBois
(93 posts)The perogative of a POTUS is ultimate decision making over classified information.
FakeNoose
(32,854 posts)He had to tweet it. The fact that everyone else in the world saw it too, well that's just collateral damage.
aggiesal
(8,943 posts)Cha
(297,935 posts)Signed a
LastLiberal in PalmSprings
(12,601 posts)Classification: Kindergarten
RO4Warren
(28 posts)Even someone as reprehensible as Trump does not deserve to be attacked on the basis of his physique. Two wrongs do not make a right = what we learn in Kindergarten.
We need to be the party of decency. One of the strongest arguments we have against Trump is that we will restore the values of respect and decency towards our fellow Americans.
Jim__
(14,092 posts)Hekate
(90,978 posts)Good Gawd.
GoCubsGo
(32,099 posts)Words can't even describe the amount of disgust I feel right now. All of Biden's "gaffes," real and imagined combine, don't hold a candle to this one act. Not even close.
RO4Warren
(28 posts)This is also an argument for making a stronger contrast with Trump. We aren't on solid footing attacking Trump's fitness if concerns about mental fitness for our candidate are an argument that has any supporting evidence.
I don't mean to cast aspersions on Biden here. But the right will have no concerns about doing so, and there are just too many unforced errors.
Hekate
(90,978 posts)...any arguments that he is.
RO4Warren
(28 posts)They are both white men in their 70s who have trouble with the truth and represent (different flavors of) the politics of the past. Biden, innocently so I believe. There is nothing innocent about Trump.
I simply can't refute arguments that Biden puts his foot in his mouth often and makes a lot of mistakes. He clearly does. And this will be effectively used against him and will cause many to have concerns about his ability to handle the office. Is he a vastly better human being than Trump, with better policies, a better tone, a better vision for America, a better chance of directing this country in a positive direction, and someone who I would most certainly vote for over Trump? Absolutely. Will I work to get him elected? Yes. Will I do so with the same conviction, passion, and optimism I could for several of the other candidates? No. I'll fake it the best I can, but I won't feel it. I'll be fighting against something, rather than for something. That matters, and I am hardly alone in feeling that way. I'm happy to be convinced otherwise, but so far Biden has not done that for me.
In a few (entirely surface) ways, he does resemble Trump. That's just a fact. We can't abandon objective truth in favor of tribalism and expect to win this fight. They are simply much better at that game than we will ever be, and we MUST refuse to play that game for all our sakes.
Hekate
(90,978 posts)Your arguments are specious.
You may note by the icon at the bottom of my post that "my" candidate is younger, female, and of color.
Nonetheless, there is nothing at all "wrong" with Biden. He's a storyteller -- he tells the story of a country that is not Trump's mean-spirited, resentful, and cruel place. He's an older guy -- a man full of experience who is not afraid to change with the times if that change means more inclusiveness, more opportunity -- and more kindness. He has never been false to himself or to us. When he opened his campaign with the video that said he wants to restore the soul of America, I got that 100%, because Trump's fascists are killing that soul.
Recommend the thread at the link above.
I read the link, but I'm not convinced my arguments are specious. I don't see how running someone who makes these types of mistakes helps us. This fight is too important to miss opportunities by misspeaking so often. There is also an enthusiasm gap that is clear. Maybe that will change. If Biden is our nominee, I very much hope it does. In fairness, I'm also well to his left, so I'm biased here, but I'm not convinced that my bias is influencing my thinking on his relative electability in our current climate against Trump. If I'm missing a key argument in that thread, please point me to it. I'm open to being convinced. In fact I'd prefer to be, because I'd have more confidence about 2020 .
To be clear about my bias, I also think Biden is the clear first choice of the establishment that I believe is beholden to big money interests. I think that is the fundamental problem with our Democracy right now and for a long time, second only to the current occupant of the Oval Office, and is partially if not mostly responsible for him being in office. People got tired of not being represented or listened to and voted for ANYTHING that would shake things up, even if that meant a racist, misogynist blowhard. I also think it's long past time for men to get out of the way and let people who represent the majority of this country have a shot at doing better than we've done. And, I want my daughter to see her reflection in the highest office in the world. I've seen enough of mine. So, pretty strong biases are in play.
I think Harris is a very good politician who may very well be President or VP, if not now, then in the future. After seeing her Biden debate bounce and drop, I'm not sure she's the right one to take on Trump, but I respect those who do. She's very strong in debates and I agree with her on a lot. There is no question that diversity needs to be a primary concern in this election. I was frankly concerned the Biden doesn't see it is the most important concern in his choice of VP. As if there aren't enough qualified women and people of color that he could state, as Booker did, that there would be a woman on the ticket one way or another. Period.
There's a very good argument to be made for Harris as AG at minimum, and also as Sec State. I'd have a heck of a lot of confidence that this mess would be cleaned up.
And I 100% agree that this is a battle for the soul of this country. That was a good speech and the tone was dead on. At the end of this process, I expect we will be on the same team, and I wish you luck. No question any Dem in the race would be better than Trump. I'm FULLY on board with that.
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,398 posts)TeamPooka
(24,286 posts)tblue37
(65,524 posts)classified information.
Lithos
(26,404 posts)My issue is that he is conflating a secret source with his public phone - the security consequences are tremendous. He is receiving classified information on a non-secure device.
L-
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)regarding a certain server.
Lithos
(26,404 posts)/sarcasm
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Stargazer09
(2,132 posts)ALL of it, is being routinely scooped up. No nation, friend or foe, would resist the temptation to download everything possible off that device. Its too easy.
Hes practically giving away data that used to be very difficult to find.
I want this nightmare to end. We deserve a sane, conscientious president.
shanti
(21,675 posts)He is a clear and present danger to us all.
KPN
(15,673 posts)demonstrate how important he is. It's all about his frigging fragile ego. ITMF now!
Farmer-Rick
(10,225 posts)He's too crazy to know the difference between classified information and his bowel movements. So they both get flung out with equal vigor.
This is what the Koch brothers, the Waltons. Goldman and the Google billionaires have brought us. This is what Mitch approves of. This is what the Supremes are cheering on. This is the result of capitalism gone wild and crazy.
Traitor Trump gone crazy is the spirit of our economic system. He is the crap it spews out.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)hurts or compromises us. I suspect Russia -- and any other country with a satellite -- has similar photos.
Hermit-The-Prog
(33,543 posts)Hoyt
(54,770 posts)The former, I don't think was a secret before.
VMA131Marine
(4,159 posts)Second, the resolution of the image is so high that it may exceed what is possible from an orbital platform; there is a practical limit because of atmospheric effects. An adversary could certainly figure this out and determine if the image were captured by a UAV or other aerial reconnaissance platform, presumably one that Iran did not detect. This image potentially exposed a US intelligence gathering platform that we wanted to keep secret.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)days ago. There are plenty of things to bash trump over. Not sure this is one of them.
https://www.apnews.com/66edcdd9d8634a06b51073af45be12b8
VMA131Marine
(4,159 posts)And if the US has an unknown and apparently undetectable aerial platform capable of taking that image at that resolution, it is certainly reasonable to question whether it was wise to disclose its existence. Trump's tweet tells countries what we can see and therefore what they have to hide from us.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)they are doing.
If we can take low-resolution images, we can take high resolution images. And, it's clear we knew about their failure days before trump released the image.
Now, trump is a racist, buffoon, cheat, liar, economic fool, . . . . . . . .
VMA131Marine
(4,159 posts)It tells adversaries of US capabilities that we were keeping secret for a reason. Trump just disclosed this for no reason other than to taunt the Iranians about what he knows. Now that he's let the cat out of the bag, it cannot be put back in.
Why are you defending this?
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)VMA131Marine
(4,159 posts)Because their leaders are smart enough to keep it secret. Iran most certainly does not have such capability; it could not even detect the vehicle that took the photograph.
Again, why are you trying to give Trump a pass on this. He just gave another gift to Putin by disclosing US intelligence gathering capabilities. It is a big deal.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)capability. A little more resolution aint gonna tell anyone anything new.
But as long as we are trying to bash trump, this should be enough for Impeachment.
VMA131Marine
(4,159 posts)You're making yourself look foolish with what you don't know.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)thats usually BS.
Takket
(21,677 posts)KPN
(15,673 posts)Endless HRC Benghazi and email investigations translate into the WH and the House for the GOP. WTF?!
BTW: Go Sox! ( or better, "Wait till next year!" as we would always say toward the end of each season back in the day).
edbermac
(15,950 posts)How dare they question the Orange Messiah!
progree
(10,930 posts)But the image shown in the president's tweet appears to be of far better quality, says Ankit Panda, an adjunct senior fellow at the Federation of American Scientists, who specializes in analyzing satellite imagery. "The resolution is amazingly high," says Panda. "I would think it's probably below well below 20 centimeters, which is much higher than anything I've ever seen."
Panda says that the tweet discloses "some pretty amazing capabilities that the public simply wasn't privy to before this."
It was not entirely clear where the president's photo came from. Panda believes it was likely taken by a classified U.S. satellite. But Melissa Hanham, deputy director of the Open Nuclear Network at the One Earth Foundation, believes that the resolution is so high, it may be beyond the physical limits at which satellites can operate. "The atmosphere is thick enough that after somewhere around 11 to nine centimeters, things get wonky," she says.
That could mean it was taken by a drone or spy plane, though such a vehicle would be violating Iranian airspace. Hanham also says that the European company Airbus has been experimenting with drones that fly so high, they are technically outside the atmosphere and thus operating outside of national boundaries. But she says she doesn't know whether the U.S. has such a system.
More from article -- But there's a redaction that might indicate ... on the other hand ...
dalton99a
(81,673 posts)calimary
(81,565 posts)Something prison-ish.
Bastard!
superpatriotman
(6,254 posts)Except that of God
blakstoneranger
(333 posts)And yet, he fires his assistant for leaking sensitive info on his family. But nothing happens to him. It's just a comical mistake. If he is so wrapped up in his "fan-dom" that he can't determine what gov information should or should not be release to the public, imagine what ivanka and jared might give away since both of them have top secret clearances. How much info has the POTUS already given away to putin and other dictators already! Republicans are treating this guy like a kid in a sandbox while they all stand around watching him play some sort of game. He's had private meetings with putin where he wouldn't allow notes! This experiment is OVER, enough with this businessman president stuff. This guy is a goofus. SAVE AMERICA, DUMP TRUMP 2020, PLEASE!!!
spanone
(135,919 posts)elias7
(4,035 posts)Wasnt that all about classified info. Of course, always rebut! Trump can declassify whatever he wants since hes president.
wss2001
(54 posts)Back channel messages to Putin of whatever Trump thinks his handler could use.
dalton99a
(81,673 posts)DFW
(54,477 posts)His sex life and his tax returns
I am thankful for the first.
Gothmog
(145,794 posts)VOX
(22,976 posts)Republicans would have melted down to the absolute core. Their screaming apeshittery would be non-stop. Impeachment and conviction would have been their NUMBER ONE PRIORITY.
Trump pulls this monumentally unpresidential shit, revealing classified information, and... not even crickets, just a vacuum.
The deck is heavily stacked. Something's got to give.
Vinca
(50,323 posts)RO4Warren
(28 posts)A U.S. defense official told CNBC that the picture in Trumps tweet, which appeared to be a snapshot of a physical copy of the satellite image, was included in a Friday intelligence briefing.
Trump is actually listening to / reading intelligence briefings? That's news in and of itself. I'm just not entirely sure whether it's good or bad.
LittleGirl
(8,292 posts)What are we going to do about that?
NCjack
(10,279 posts)Sen. Moscow Mitch.
SunSeeker
(51,787 posts)If he wasn't President, he'd be arrested for releasing classified information. He is a danger to our nation, in every way.
N_E_1 for Tennis
(9,794 posts)Brainfodder
(6,423 posts)..and he was left alone with no transparency, and has unprotected phone?
How dumb are people, put two and two together and get four this one time, before it truly is too late!?!