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(14,675 posts)Trumpocalypse
(6,143 posts)SheltieLover
(57,073 posts)Fullduplexxx
(7,863 posts)MontanaMama
(23,314 posts)I was thinking the exact same thing.
brush
(53,776 posts)Obvious ones. And we do care, don't we.
Just another trumper/handler who won't sleep with him anymore but gets his hateful message out.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)said the same thing about the Melbot's clothing messages in her book that came out last week.
crickets
(25,978 posts)Hekate
(90,681 posts)malchickiwick
(1,474 posts)For the record, she was much more than just a sympathizer. Uber-propagandist in fact.
appleannie1
(5,067 posts)paleotn
(17,912 posts)They both give me the creeps.
warmfeet
(3,321 posts)I thought everyone knew that.
bucolic_frolic
(43,161 posts)ancianita
(36,055 posts)A number of companies that serviced Nazis are still around -- Volkswagen,BMW, Kodak, Siemens, IBM, Bayer, and Ford. AP, too.
https://allthatsinteresting.com/major-brands-nazi-collaborators
Fanta orange soda is one of them.
bucolic_frolic
(43,161 posts)people wanted to move on, forget the bad times, governments had the Cold War to fight. It was the 60s before there were a few notes of it in books, it was actually controversial, and the late 80s before it was widely known, and things continue to leak to this day.
The great German chemical companies - IG Farben, GAF I think.
Western governments, with their focus on freedom and capitalism, did not have the will to separate business from fascism. It's kind of an open trap door we fall through every now and again. War for profit, profits from government spending.
The war was prosecuted in secrecy, of course. Only in the last 10-20 years have details leaked: Churchill's emphasis on imperialism and empire, his poor strategic moves. His reliance on controversial weapons (Churchill's Ministry of Ungentlemanly Warfare). How we defeated Rommel in Africa (Enigma again, and deception measures involving fake tank brigades). Seriously, the public was not told. FDR tightly controlled the entire global outcome, and the Nazis were dunces in espionage. They never questioned what they saw or were told.
ancianita
(36,055 posts)I'm a bit floored when you say that FDR tightly controlled the entire global outcome. I've never read that anywhere, have no idea now, nor did my parents, of what you mean by that. If you have any reference, I'd very much appreciate a book or link.
If it was about a major shift in monetary control, I read that's how winners keep power. Stalin did go his own way, it seems. You've really got me thinking about secrecy, honesty and power. But for now, back to the OP.
Melania should in no way be credited for knowingly making some symbolic move. Even if she understands her visual homage to Naziism, she'll deny it. She's already decided that public opinion means nothing to her, that her job is to show care to children and opioid addicted unfortunates. Before all this, she cut a calculated deal: to partner herself to a perceived strong/rich man while seeming to protect whatever low-to-high self esteem she has. Transactional people are like that. They defy scrutiny.
Response to ancianita (Reply #23)
Celerity This message was self-deleted by its author.
Celerity
(43,353 posts)The Anglo-American-European banking cartel helped finance both sides in the run-up to WW2. Averell Harriman (US Secretary of Commerce, Governor of New York, and Ambassador to the USSR and the UK) and his brother Roland, founded one of the biggest banks in the world, Brown Brothers Harriman. This bank was like the Goldman Sachs of the 1930's and 1940's. One of the founding partners of Brown Bros. Harriman, and point man for German investment, was none other than Prescott Bush, son-in-law of George Herbert Walker (also employed at BBH). Prescott, of course was the father of George HW Bush, and grandfather of George W Bush.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
BBH were the chief USA private banking intermediary (along with the Rockefeller's Chase Manhattan Bank and the energy assistance of their Standard Oil of New Jersey, now known as Exxon) for vast sums of money directly and indirectly funnelled in that funded the rapid rise of Hitler and especially the rebuild of the German military-industrial complex via hundreds of billions (in today's dollars) in investments and loans to Krups, I.G. Farben, etc.
Also involved, on the Euro side, were the British Rothschild-backed, Friedrich "Fritz" Thyssen-run Bank for Trade and Shipping (Bank voor Handel and Scheepvaart) in Rotterdam, the Netherlands.It was founded by the German industrialist Thyssen family in Holland to avoid the punitive post-WWI sanctions during the Weimar Republic days. The Thyssen industrialist family were well known reactionaries for decades and prior to WWII controlled the biggest mining and steel cartel in the world, Vereinigte Stahlwerke AG. The Rothschild proxy at Bank voor Handel and Scheepvaart was Emil Georg von Stauss. von Strauss, before becoming the president of Germany's largest bank, Deutsche Bank, was Managing Director of the European Petroleum Union, another Rothschild and Warburg family front organisation. (As an aside, Paul Warburg, along with JP Morgan, were principal driving forces of the US Federal Reserve, (created in 1913) as well.) Also involved in finacing the rise of post WWI industrial Germany were the Warburg family (Max in Europe, Paul in New York), and Kuhn Loeb and Co, (Jacob Schiff) in New York.
The EPU (which eventually was folded into Deutsche Petroleum, that was co-founded in 1890 by the Rockelfellers) had some of its roots in Branobel, the Swedish/Russian Nobel family's (yes those Nobels, of the Prize fame) oil organisation. Branobel Oil Company (from their corporate archives at the link above) had linkages between Nobel Family (here in Sweden and Russia) the Rothschilds (both the French and the British family branches), and Steaua Romana (Romanian national oil company bought by Deutsche Bank. Again, Emil Georg von Strauss had joined Steava Romana in 1905, became general director by 1914 and in 1915 he became a member of the Board of Directors of Deutsche Bank. That link shows how they formed Europäische Petroleum Union (EPU).
From 1926 to 1931, with Strauss's inside assistance, the Anglo-Persian Oil Company (now known as BP, ie. British Petroleum) acquired all of the Deutsche Petroleum shares, with most of the financing coming from the British Rothschild banking family. Emil Georg von Stauss also served as chairman the board of Daimler-Benz, and then as chairman of BMW. When he died in 1942, he was given a state funeral by Hitler and the NSDAP.
http://images.library.wisc.edu/History/EFacs/GerRecon/omg1947n099/reference/history.omg1947n099.i0004.pdf
ancianita
(36,055 posts)Last edited Sun Sep 6, 2020, 12:38 AM - Edit history (2)
I appreciate the links and will keep reading.
It's not news to me, but I've never had sufficient exposure to this history, never read an in-depth tracing of Nazi money; just that cash, gold and wealth stripped from Holocaust victims was stashed abroad in Swiss, Austrian and other banks.
Publics who fund wealth and power are never trusted with the whole truth about who, how and why these agents wield it. Publics never become part of the world of being an authority except by forcing out any records erased, hidden, distorted; and when any of those get accessed and brought to light, both their content and public analyses are dismissed as arguable opinion.
bucolic_frolic
(43,161 posts)Published about the last 10-12 years as I recall. He synthesizes contemporary material from principals in the FDR administration, the top generals, and about his only confidant to whom he left a contempoary record, cousin Daisy. FDR played it tight to the chest. Africa was his timetable, according to Hamilton, it was a trial run for our troops and the new amphibious landing vehicles. His generals were often opposed. He juggled the tactical strike forces, disasters and empire ambitions of Churchill - Dieppe, Turkey, Rome. He directed the initial bombing of Tokyo, approved the Midway strategy, the Yamamoto strike. As former Secy of the Navy he surely paid attention to new technologies and their limits. FDR knew it was a global battle between democracy and totalitarianism.
Hamilton spent 10 years writing these books, they are a gift to the historical record in my view. Not sure too many people read them, it's a worn subject. But Hamilton emphasized that FDR didn't survive the war and thus couldn't put his own perspective on the process and outcome, as Churchill did. For several decades, into the 1980s, there was only the comprehensive Davis biography. It was 4 volumes, maybe 3,000 pages. Other biographers wax nostalgic, or emphasize personality, for or against. I've read Goodwin, Jean Edward Smith, they were very good. But I really enjoyed the Hamilton books, as well as Robert Dallek's FDR: A political life.
Hamilton is a Brit and predictably a bit more adept at the English language than most American writers.
https://www.history.com/news/rethinking-fdr-as-commander-in-chief
https://www.amazon.com/The-Mantle-Command-FDR-1941-1942/dp/0547775245
https://www.amazon.com/Commander-Chief-FDRs-Battle-Churchill/dp/1785900579
https://www.amazon.com/War-Peace-Final-Odyssey-1943-1945/dp/0544876806
https://www.amazon.com/Franklin-D-Roosevelt-Political-Life/dp/0143111213
Thanks for reading my verbose posts!
ancianita
(36,055 posts)A thousand thanks to you for taking the time to explain where you get your understandings from.
The history of global players, and how they exercise power through force and wealth, should be mandatory reading for Americans.
Time to crack these histories!
I hope that if any one good thing comes out of the general national cv confinement, it's that Americans have read more, thought more.
bucolic_frolic
(43,161 posts)where did the Deutschebank money originate?
ancianita
(36,055 posts)bucolic_frolic
(43,161 posts)The US was the final straw in defeating Germany in two world wars. And the financial fallout lacked transparency.
ancianita
(36,055 posts)Sucha NastyWoman
(2,748 posts)Anybody else notice that?
Wounded Bear
(58,653 posts)Withywindle
(9,988 posts)She's got a very eloquent collection!