General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSomebody tell me what I need to get into another country
New Zealand or the Netherlands or Costa rica ?
and how long can I stay ?
just getting mentally prepared although I seriously think Biden will win legally.
handmade34
(22,758 posts)just stay and work with the rest of us
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)Americans are pariahs right now. Thanks to Trump.
C_U_L8R
(45,025 posts)redstatebluegirl
(12,265 posts)OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)I was even planning to make post asking if anyone knew where all the libertarian paradises were so I would be armed with plenty of suggestions for the dipshits.
doc03
(35,389 posts)brush
(53,924 posts)Last edited Mon Nov 2, 2020, 06:32 PM - Edit history (1)
Nobody wants to chance covid.
This is what trump has done to us.
We can't go anywhere.
is around us, we are the only ones to save ourselves. VOTE if you already have ask your friends and families to VOTE.
kirkuchiyo
(402 posts)PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,914 posts)However, most countries aren't letting in Americans these days.
New Zealand, I believe, is only letting in their own citizens.
CatMor
(6,212 posts)Celerity
(43,589 posts)but you have chronic health conditions that are deemed to be a burden on the state, you will be refused a residence permit. In fact, even if you are a Canadian citizen with a child who is not a citizen, and has the same level of health issues, they will not be allowed to obtain a residence permit.
And those are but two of many examples.
CatMor
(6,212 posts)she has been there about 14 years. She has a great job and healthcare.
Celerity
(43,589 posts)Sweden, where I live, just changed to rules so that a married (to a Swede who is living here) or legally-partnered non-EU person has to now wait outside of Sweden for the decision. The backlog is insane atm as well, so you could be looking at years. Most Swedes thus are now choosing (or were until COVID-19) to go and stay with their partner in that person's country of residence. They also are no longer granting immediate permanent residency to refugees (due to tremendous political pressure from the majority of the population).
CatMor
(6,212 posts)do you agree with it.
Celerity
(43,589 posts)permanent residency. In the past 20 years or so, and especially since the 2nd US Iraq, we have taken in the US population-adjusted equivalent of over 50 million refugees and overall it has had an extremely deleterious effect on the nation state as a whole. It has allowed the rise of far-right, one issue Sweden Democrats, who now have real power in our Riksdag (parliament). It has helped to create a quite possibly permanent underclass and skewed wealth inequality upward at an extremely troublesome rate.
For decades upon decades we were in the top 5 globally (and often the top) in terms of wealth equality, which is the number one interlocking statistic that determines the over health of a nation from most all levels. A few years back we dropped out of the top 10 (for the first time post WWII) and are continuing to drop. Socio-economic and socio-cultural tensions are at alarming levels. Unlike the US, where the vast majority of immigrants and refugees want to be there, and the vast majority strive to integrate into the culture, etc, thsi is not the case here in Sweden. Huge chunks have little to no desire to integrate in, and instead detest the pluralistic, tolerant, democratic society of the country. There are a tonne of exceptions, of course, but overall it is a huge problem, The rest of the Nordic nations (especially the other 3 large ones, Norway, Finland, and above all the else, Denmark) often look on at Sweden with severe trepidation, and we are often used as an example for the far-right (and now even the centre right ofttimes) in those nations to stoke further fears and xenophobia internally.
It is an extremely complicated situation, fuelled historically for decades by a certain hubristic mentality that arose from the fact we were one of the few nations in Europe to emerge from WWII relatively unscathed, and then as our economy was booming and our social democratic Folkhemmet (our expansive social safety net) was humming along, a portion of our political leaders tried to export the The Swedish Model, especial to some of the 3rd world nations. It (the exportation of The Swedish Model) was overall a large fail, but the attitude of superiority was buttressed at home by multiple sectors. Jantelagen also plays a large role here, and is similar to the tall poppy syndrome. This was all revitalised and repackage in the 1990's (the true roots go back to the mid-1960's and few large newspapers with political agendas) and especially in the 2000's to justify taking in numbers of refugees that overwhelmed the system (and at the same tie, many Swedish politicians, power players, and pundits of a certain stripe ridiculed and baited the other Nordics and the EU overall, which lead to a lot of hostility).
The Syrian conflict was the straw that broke the camel's back. At one point we were taking in the US equivalent of 3, 4, even 5 million a month. The majority of the populace finally had enough, and the ruling parties, for the most part, caved in and put a semi-end to it as they were all terrified of a Riksdag run by the Sweden Democrats, who were polling as the largest party at the time. There were exceptions, such as Miljöpartiet (The Greens who had done a 180 degree flip on immigration since the mid-2000's and have been very different that the US Green party at times) and Vänster ie. The Left, who are actual socialists and communists and who would laugh at US pols like Bernie self-labelling as a democrat socialist.
Atm, there is another smaller party, Centerpartiet, lead by Annie Lööf, who have been part of the centre right liberal (liberal in the non-US, rest of the world sense, ie, centre to centre right, free traders, deregulation to a point, big fans of privatisation or public-private partnerships, etc, think the New Labour UK Blairites, or the Clintonian neoliberals 3rd way platform, but at times maybe a bit less concerned with identity politics) and moderate conservative collations for years. Lööf fashions herself a kingmaker, and has weaponised the whole immigration issue (she has overall adopted an 'open up the floodgates' stance) in an attempt to try and cobble together a new collation with her (despite her party's small. small numbers) as the consigliere or even the PM. It is a shitstorm atm, and I fear the Sweden Democrats (the far right) will continue to gain in power.
Finally, I do want to clarify when I say far-right (re. the Sweden Democrats aka SD) that again, it is not at all like the US far right for the most part, other than the nationalism and xenophobia (and even there, many multi-generational non white immigrants vote for them). SD is far right in terms of that, but the majority are economically left. They do not want to get rid of the expansive welfare state at all, just kick out the recent non Swede refugees who they see as a drag on the state expenditures. They also are, for the most part, very secular, and not raving xian fundie lunatics (although there are a few). They also are very anti-Russia overall, due to the hundreds of years of wars with them (the vast majority of Swedes think like this.) Now, tbh, there are old old elements (many purged, but some still in the SD apparatus) who are actual white power fascists, but the SD leader, Jimmie Åkesson has tossed a shedload out over the years.
Hope that all helped to explain some things. I am a member of Socialdemokraterna, the centre-left (not centre-left like US, centre-left the way the rest of advanced world looks at it, many of the pols labelled as centre-left in the US would be centre ut more likely somewhat centre-right most elsewhere) Social Democrats, who were the biggest party for most of the 20th century, and currently are in a coalition government. Our leader, Stefan Löfven, is the current Prime Minster since 3 October 2014.
CatMor
(6,212 posts)being here in the USA I think of Sweden as a country of blue eyed blonds, well educated, happy and content. I also picture Swedes as liberal thinking (US type liberal]. I didn't know of the immigrant situation. All four of my grandparents immigrated here from Hungary so that is the European country I have followed. Sounds like Sweden and Hungary have some similar problems although I am totally anti Orban. I appreciate your explaining your situation in Sweden, it is very eye opening.
Celerity
(43,589 posts)higher percentage on non Western European first and second generation immigrants than the US does. Malmö, in the far south of Sweden (Skåne, right across the Öresund Bridge from Copenhagen, Denmark) was the first core EU nation city to go majority non Western European via immigration. The vast majority of the US-equivalent 50 million refugees since the 1990's and onward have no European background at all, as most have come from the US/UK/NATO war theatres of Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia, Libya, and Syria. The only other significant group are people from the Balkans, who fled the myriad conflicts occurring after the breakup of the former Yugoslavia. The dominant religion practiced by the vast majority is Islam, and unlike the US model, there are very few conterveiling forces to keep increased radicalisation from occurring, as well as sectarian internecine conflicts (ie Sunni versus Shia, etc).
Sweden as a nation had tremendous success in the past with tacking in refugees. All one needs to do to see where many came from is to look at nations that underwent CIA triggered coups and wars since the 1950's onward. We have a large group of Persian from Iran who fled the CIA and MI-6 led coup (Operation Ajax) versus Mohammed Mossadeq in 1953 (when the horrific dictatorial Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi was reinstalled into power). We had more Persians come in when the Shah was removed from power in 1979 via the Islamic Revolution. We also have many Chileans here, who fled the country when the CIA murdered Salvador Allende i yet another US-backed coup. Many other nations have had refugees come to Sweden.
The main difference of two-fold.
1. The numbers were at a far more manageable level, and they were given time to assimilate into the overall zeitgeist.
2. The type of refugees from most of the past inflows were of a different background. Many back then came from successful, in some cases very powerful families and socio-economic situations. Many were highly educated, and/or had multi-generational familial histories of success, especially the Persians. Almost all of the earlier inflow cohorts have successfully been integrated into mainstream Swedish life (the Chileans, and even more so, the Persians, especially). This was not the case with the refugees from the past 20 odd years. The vast majority came from completely broken nation states, with little educational backgrounds nor familial histories of success at most all levels that could have translated into a solid underpinning for a somewhat (obviously, even with the earlier cohorts, there were bumps in the road) smooth integration glidepath.
The previous successes were used to quash most all dissent starting in the 1990's and especially 2003 and onward, and still often are (it is a favourite gimmick of Lööf ,with a few updated twists) although this tactic has pretty much been rendered ineffective as the years have rolled by and it now has been shown to be a false narrative.
cayugafalls
(5,646 posts)It will be hard getting the country back to an even keel after all the damage dump has done. We all have to work together and try to bring people in this country together.
Love is the only answer we have.
Beachnutt
(7,349 posts)countries want you to quarantine before entry but once I get in how long can I stay ?
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Im only familiar with the UK and Ireland. They WILL ask you questions about your reasons for visiting.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)accepting Americans who could produce a negative Covid test. That may have changed.
Do you have an income? Are you retired? Central America has long been a place for American retirees to go. Mexico, too. What you would probably have to do is apply for a retirement visa. Again, you'd have to research country by country. Income minimums vary country by country. Problem is, Covid has changed everything and you'd really have to do your homework.
Prior to the pandemic, I heard of retirees also settling in Asia. I was just talking to someone who said Portugal accepts retirees, so long as income is high enough. I have also heard the same about Italy. ONCE AGAIN, Covid has changed everything. You'd have to do your homework.
Now, in terms of how long you can stay immediately, it used to be that you could stay in Canada six months before you overstayed your welcome. Again, do your homework.
DFW
(54,448 posts)Even if you intend to come as a tourist, you need a special visa for now.
To come live here, you need an already-issued EU residence and/or work permit. If you are married to an EU citizen, you must still apply for residence and a work permit. They are not granted automatically. I know, because that is exactly what I was confronted with almost ten years ago when I applied. When I explained I was married to a German whose residence was in Germany, they said, "That's nice. What can I help you with?"
This is what I needed ten years ago when I applied for an EU residence permit:
Proof of long term employment
Proof of health insurance
A statement from my employer of salary (W-2 was OK).
A bank balance in the USA proving I could support myself even if I lost my job for a while.
A marriage document from the USA AND documents from Germany recognizing the American marriage certificate.
Proficiency in German (with me they waived this because when I spoke to them in German, they said, OK, we get it, you're fluent, we can dispense with that part).
Obviously this last part only applies to Germany and Austria. You need language proficiency in the language of where you intent to settle. In countries with more than one major official language, you need to be proficient in the language of the area where you intend to live. For example, if you intend to live in the northern part of Belgium, you need proficiency in Dutch. If you intend to live in Brussels or the south, you need proficiency in French. If you are looking at Hungary or Finland, all I can say is good luck. Neither of them is, from a linguistic point of view, a European language, and they both have a wildly complicated grammar, and none of their words are indo-European in origin. You have to start from square one. If all you know is English, Ireland is your only shot, since Brexit took the UK out of the EU.
Note that neither Switzerland nor Norway nor the UK are members of the EU, so if you want to settle there, you need to ask them specifically what they require from an American to permit immigration.
If you intend to ask for state help (welfare, e.g.), forget it. They don't want you. If you have a skill a local firm desperately needs, and you have language proficiency, you have a chance even if you're not married to a local citizen.
IF you can present documentation (passport AND a visa specifically permitting you entry) that will permit you entry here, you will be expected to take a Corona test and quarantine while the result is being evaluated, or else quarantine for 2 weeks. They spot check, so if they come check, and you're not home, expect to be on a plane out of there by the next day, and to pay for it yourself.
Exceptions are made for citizens of both sides who are humanitarian missions (members of Doctors Without Borders, or researchers into Corona vaccines) that have been previously approved. If you have acceptable documents backing this up, and in the language of the country you are heading to, they will probably let you in. They may detain you for half an hour while they check.
By the way, the USA is similarly strict with Europeans wanting to visit, so neither side is especially accommodating these days. They detained my wife for half an hour when she accompanied me to the USA in July, but let her in after her documents checked out. Spouses of US citizens are allowed in for visits, but only after they check that your marriage is valid and current. When I returned to Germany in July, I was subjected to the third degree again both in Chicago (from whence I flew back to Germany) and Frankfurt (when I arrived back). I had to get an immediate Corona test right there at the airport. I had to pass a control checkpoint manned by three German army soldiers. They saw my American passport, and asked (in German) if I spoke German. I said (also in German), "yes, I do, you too?" Since they were in German army uniforms, they laughed at that, and it broke the ice. I breezed through the rest.
Times have definitely changed. I usually run back and forth between Europe and the USA on a regular basis. Since January, when I came back from our usual (and not this year) December-January trip, I have only been back for 6 weeks in the summer. My wife went right home from Boston (we have spent a few weeks on Cape Cod, Massachusetts every year since 1984). I don't know when the next trip will be.
In short, things have drastically changed since the beginning of the year. Ordinary Europeans are not welcome in the USA and ordinary Americans are not welcome here. I know one guy in California who had what he considered to be an urgent business trip to northern Germany, and didn't have enough documents to make the trip as a normal visitor. He chartered a private plane (must have set him back $40,000, since you can't do that trip in a Cessna), flew to a minor provincial airport in Germany, got let in, did his thing, and went right back and flew home. If you're rich and desperate, I guess you could always try that.
Permitted stays are: 90 days cumulatively within a 180 day period: no special visa necessary 8once you're in, that is). More than that, you need a visa permitting it.
For what it's worth: I agree. Biden will win legally. On the other hand, when have the Republicans respected legality in the last 20 years? Winning a US presidential election no longer automatically means you get to be president. In three of the last 5 elections, the loser was inaugurated.
roamer65
(36,747 posts)regnaD kciN
(26,045 posts)...since basically the way for non-British Commonwealth foreigners to gain residency is by investing massive amounts in business there. And I mean somewhere in the mid-six figures.
Costa Rica is a favorite among retirees, so Im guessing its pretty easy. Dont know anything about the Netherlands.
Keep in mind that its pretty much impossible to travel to other countries at this time, because theyre not letting U.S. nationals in due to the pandemic. I think you can still get into Mexico, but there are only a handful of other countries that havent shut their doors to us.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)negative Covid test. Otherwise, it's pretty tough.
Hermit-The-Prog
(33,484 posts)Canadian Beavers Frantically Building Timber Wall!
Clearly fogged in
(1,896 posts)Seem like nice people
ProfessorGAC
(65,248 posts)My dad went to school with a founding member of one of the big telecoms, back in the day.
He was LOADED! Like well into 9 figures, in the 80s.
His son (my age) married an Aussie. After several years, they wanted to go live there so the grandkids would be close to her parents. His mom & dad could charter a private to go visit, any time they felt like it.
He couldn't get approval to become a permanent resident.
His dad invested between $10-15 million to build a plant that made photoluminescent plastics, & signs.
Then, his mom & dad bought around a two million dollar house. He & his family lived there, and his parents would just stay there when they visited.
The guy my age ran the company. (He had a BBA from Notre Dame, and was head of sales for his dad's second start-up.
So even then, they dropped at least $15 million to clear the path.
Within 10 years, the company had about 900 Australian citizens working there.
Worked out for everyone!
Zing Zing Zingbah
(6,496 posts)Having degrees/certifications in high need areas for the particular country
You already have a job prospect in the country.
Knowing other languages if non-english speaking country.
Having relatives already there.
Statistical
(19,264 posts)Are you going there to retire? Going there to study/college? Going there to work? Going there as a tourist?
The answer on why you are entering the country changes things quite radically.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)St Nevis/Kitts, Barbuda, Dominica and Grenada to name a few, starting about $100K. Many offering discounts through the end of the year. Mr. Giblets spent many hours researching this over the weekend.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)What if you didn't want to become a citizen, but wanted to retire there? Did he check that out?
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)The other interesting thing is that passport then could entitle you to passage to other countries that you'd otherwise be banned from as a US citizen. We did not check into retirement-only options.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)We've been keeping our options open. Appreciate the feedback.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)about this. Been to St Kitts as well, both charming countries and the people were warm and friendly, they have good healthcare and education, stable economies and low crime. They're probably hurting from COVID due to tourism downturn. Also you have to consider hurricanes. Grenada is in the southern part of the caribbean, so it doesn't get hit as much as many other islands.
Food for thought!
shrike3
(3,816 posts)PasadenaTrudy
(3,998 posts)can last six months But with Covid, we cant go anywhere right now.
napi21
(45,806 posts)quarantine for 2 weeks, if they will accept sn American at all! Even Hawaii requires you to quarantine for 2 weeks in your hotel room there before you're allowed into the public areas. Send a big THANX AH to DT for our isolation!
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)but Costa Rica isn't a bad place. Cost of living is going up rapidly there, though so it's not the retirement haven for Americans it once was. Contact the closest Costa Rican consulate for more info.
SoCalNative
(4,613 posts)have offices in the Netherlands (tax dodgers that they are). If your employer has an office there, or anywhere in Europe, see about transferring.
jalan48
(13,901 posts)634-5789
(4,175 posts)Retrograde
(10,164 posts)Unless you're young, healthy, and have a valuable and wanted skill. Otherwise, good luck getting permanent residency, much less citizenship. Or maybe you're lucky enough to have a recent ancestor from a country that allows citizenship to pass to certain descendants, like Ireland.
Countries have limits on how long visitors can stay: they vary. Sometimes people will stay just shy of the allowed time, leave, come back, and do the same. I know someone who got deported for doing this, after being successful at it for over a decade.
There are countries that allow you to get landed status by showing that you have the resources for the rest of your life to show you won't be a drain on their systems. IIRC, prices start in the low millions of USD.
dlk
(11,582 posts)Dont give up.
Javaman
(62,534 posts)Its easier lacking that, you need a vocation that they would use. Beyond that money and lots of it. Not millionaire money but billionaire money. Lacking that, if you have grandparents that are from another country, you can try duel citizenship.
That last one is the one Im currently working on
A HERETIC I AM
(24,380 posts)but most countries with decent health care systems don't want immigrants to be an undue burden on the system.
I looked into immigrating to new Zealand when Trumpy got elected, and found out a few things;
1) You are right in that certain professional skillsets are highly sought after. If I was a Neurosurgeon or a Civil Engineer with expertise in Earthquake mitigation, I would already be down there.
2) They won't accept you if you are too old or not in good health. 2 strikes for me - I was 58 in 2017 and a COPD patient. They would overlook this one if #1 above was in particular need.
3) If you move down as a retiree, you have to have sufficient funds so that you are not a burden on a healthcare system you didn't contribute to. Makes perfect sense to me. Most western democracies with socialized medicine have similar restrictions/requirements
Also, there was a move by the NZ government in the last few years to restrict land purchases by non natives. Seems there are a shitload of rich, white folks buying legacy farmland (by that I mean farms that have been in the same families for generations) in order to have a place to escape to. The owners were happy to sell if the price was right, but the rest of the population didn't like the idea that so many outsiders were buying up so much prime agricultural land.
DFW
(54,448 posts)When I moved here, even though they collect 40,000 in taxes from me every three months, health care was NOT included (nor was anything else). I went to an insurance company that had health care as part of its offerings. They asked about age and pre-existing conditions, and then quoted me a monthly premium of 2500, or about $35,000 a year. I said no thanks, and kept my Blue Cross (the immigration authorities were cool with that as long as I paid all my bills myself). Blue Cross is basically useless, but at least the Germans accepted it as having health insurance, no matter that they cover basically nothing. I haven't had anything like $35000 a year in health costs, even including a 11000 hospital stay in 2011.
Kaleva
(36,361 posts)I have yet to see someone who is thinking of moving talking about Africa.
There's been a few that have mentioned South America, Central America or some Asian nation but the great majority talk about predominately white nations as their choices.
sinkingfeeling
(51,482 posts)beautiful national parks.
Kaleva
(36,361 posts)DFW
(54,448 posts)However, I don't know if qualified applicants are in any rush to apply.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)However, given I am a retiree, I'm told retiring there would be more expensive than one might think.
Kaleva
(36,361 posts)Being on SSDI and a small VA pension, $1695 a month is above my income but that's the average so there ought to be places within my price range.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)Pension and SS. Plus savings and however big a wad of cash we'd get out of our house. Thanks.
DFW
(54,448 posts)I'm sure Botswana or Namibia would be easy to get used to. The Seychelles, too, probably. But it would a cultural adjustment for sure, and like you noted, it could involve more money than one would imagine.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)And were planning to go back there, but then the pandemic hit.
DFW
(54,448 posts)The first time, she was with the UN war crimes tribunal in Sierra Leone. She also visited Senegal, where she picked up some infection that almost killed her. The UN doc saved her with real antibiotics (the local doctor gave her sugar pills to replace the real antibiotics he had sold on the black market).
The second time, she flew into Dar es Salaam, took a bus to Mombasa, a boat over to Zanzibar, and then a bus back down to Dar es Salaam to fly back. She had a wonderful time.. Now with two small daughters, a career and the virus, any plans to go back are on hold for a while.
shrike3
(3,816 posts)Mount Kilimanjaro, national parks. Saw some unexpected sights, like driving into a whole herd of elephants. (We were being driven by a professional, who I hoped knew what he was doing.) Coming on an 18 to 20-foot tall giraffe, who very nicely stood there for us so we could get a good look at him. A visit to the Crater, where we saw hippos OUT of the water, grazing. A young lion pair. All in all, wonderful. Unfortunately, husband didn't like the sound of Zanzibar -- I did the best I could -- but we didn't go there.
Interestingly, we also visited a snake bite clinic, and got to meet some local doctors. We also met a charming little boy, who spoke no English, recovering from a cobra bite. He'd been out behind the house at the woodpile, and the snake got him.
Our plan was to visit South Africa this time. I wanted to start at Kruger Park, where I understand there are black rhinos in the thousands. Husband liked the idea of Capetown, so we were going to go there.
I also have Botswana on my bucket list.
Congratulations on having such an adventurous and accomplished daughter. You must have raised her well.
DFW
(54,448 posts)Always ready for an argument, the born lawyer, already at age 3. But smart as a whip in school, determined to try anything unorthodox and make a success out of it. After her gig with the War Crimes Tribunal, she was supposed to go on the trip to Tanzania and Kenya with a girlfriend. The girlfriend got sick at the last minute, so instead of calliing it off, she said, so what the hell I'll do the trip on my own. Not thrilled, we let her go, and she had a great time. When she came back, she got herself a job with a British firm's Frankfurt arm, then got head-hunted by a New York firm, and became so important to them that she put in for partner after 2 years (you are supposed to wait 7 years), and they gave it to her. She was never over-confident, but never sold herself short either. Now, at 35, mother of two small girls, one of Germany's top attorneys in her field, making three time as much as I do, she is pretty much writing her own ticket.
I don't know how well we raised her, but whether it was our doing or in spite of our doing, she turned out pretty well--as long as you don't get into an argument with her. NEVER argue with someone who is never wrong--they don't like it!
cagefreesoylentgreen
(838 posts)FWIW
Kaleva
(36,361 posts)meadowlander
(4,408 posts)at least until Covid is under control. The only exceptions are "special economic circumstances" (i.e. you have to be a movie star or have job skills that are critical to the NZ economy and can't be filled by citizens and residents).
Skittles
(153,226 posts)NEVER
I will stay and FIGHT.
2naSalit
(86,843 posts)I spent half my adult life fighting for wild lands and wildlife, I'm not leaving.
Hekate
(90,865 posts)TygrBright
(20,773 posts)Stinky The Clown
(67,832 posts)Yer American.
Nobody wants you anywhere near.
honest.abe
(8,685 posts)If you are old enough to retire and have a decent monthly income like Social Security then there are a number of countries that will take you. We are thinking about Panama or the Philippines. Just Google it. Tons of information online.
CanonRay
(14,121 posts)you're screwed like the rest of us.
Roisin Ni Fiachra
(2,574 posts)This is for Mexico, because they currently allow Americans in:
Get the most recent edition of The People's Guide To Mexico, and study it. Carl Franz and Lorena Havens know more about Mexico than most Mexicans, and the book is funny, and gives you a real feel for the country and the culture. The book can help you decide if Mexico will be possible for you.
Go online and get a tourist card. Get it for a 6 month period, the longest period you can get one for.
https://www.bajabound.com/before/permits/visa.php
If you drive across the border, get Mexican car insurance before you go:
https://www.vagabundos.com/
If you go to the Baja Peninsula, you do not have to pay an import fee for your vehicle. If you go to the mainland, you have to pay an import fee for your vehicle, probably $500 or more.
If you you cross the the border by vehicle, you will have to stop at the Mexican immigration office at the border to get your Tourist Card stamped. I don't know how you do it by air travel these days but I know the airlines make it really easy.
Once in Mexico, you in a whole 'nother country, amigo. Read the book. It really helps if you speak Spanish.
Baja is pretty easy for Americans, plus it's close to the border if you find you don't like Mexico and want to come back. When you find a place you like, find yourself an American friend to help show you the ropes. On the mainland, I recommend the coast of Oaxaca, but it's not as easy there for people who don't speak Spanish. Puerto Escondido has a lot of Americans and Canadians living there who might take you under their wing for a spell.
You can stay in Mexico forever, living on the fringe, or by applying for permanent residency, if you have money. It takes awhile to learn the ropes. Mexico is the easiest country to get into, and hang in, and have lots of fun in. If you surf, or like beaches and beach life, you may love Mexico.
I speak Spanish, and have lived on and off in Mexico since 1985, and love Mexico, and the Mexican people.
Best of luck to you.
pfitz59
(10,400 posts)Keep some Euros and dollars handy. Getting into another country is easy. Staying is a bit harder. its easier if you have plenty of cash. Most nations only allow immigrants who are either self-sufficient, or have needed skills. Some nations allow 'refugees'. If Trump wins I expect a flood of them...
peggysue2
(10,844 posts)Let the Maggots find another country. My kith and kin have been here a long time. We're not going anywhere regardless of what happens.
We stand. We fight. We win.
Because despite all the noise, there are more of us than them.
moonscape
(4,674 posts)imprisoned in the US, I'd be looking at Portugal.
Mr. Ected
(9,673 posts)My understanding is that if you arrive in CR by 11/30, you can stay until 3/2/2021.