Are Dems caving on coronavirus lawsuits against corporations?

[luv2fly]

One piece of a bipartisan Covid-19 relief package unveiled late Monday would give corporations sweeping and retroactive immunity from coronavirus-related lawsuits, a top Republican priority that civil rights groups, labor unions, and small business owners have decried as a green light for companies to endanger their employees and customers.

A summary (pdf) of the proposed corporate liability protections—which the bipartisan group has attached to much-needed funding for state and local governments—says that employers would not be “subject to liability under federal employment law in Covid-19 exposure cases or change in working conditions related to Covid-19 if the employer was trying to conform to public health standards and guidance.” Companies would only be liable in cases of “gross negligence."

Story at:

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/12/bipartisan-relief-package-includes-plan-to-retroactively-immunize-corporations-from-lawsuits/

[Thrill]

1. Would it surprise you?

[Mike Niendorff]

2. At this moment in history?

YES.

It would be political suicide.

Dems: DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT.


MDN

[Mike Niendorff]

10. Not this time, no.

Not seeing it. It's a non-starter with horrendous consequences.


MDN

[Turin_C3PO]

16. We have to get aid out there.

People are going hungry. A bill has to be passed and the Dems might have to compromise to ensure the unemployment is extended.

[Demsrule86]

32. +100000

[luv2fly]

34. Tell that to those who will inevitably be hurt by this if true

We had to compromise, thoughts and prayers

[Rice4VP]

58. Exactly

[RandiFan1290]

3. It's the only thing the corps really care about in this whole debacle.

I have no doubt they will get exactly what they want.

[Loki Liesmith]

4. If it got an otherwise decent package they should cave

[lark]

11. it's totally not decent at all.

It gives pennies to states and corporations get out of jail free cards. Companys would have no incentive to provide any protections whatsoever since CDC guidelines have been so watered down by drumpf cronies as to be useless.

[Turin_C3PO]

17. It also includes

extended unemployment. People are literally going without meals. We may have to “cave” on a few things to get any aid out to the public.

[Demsrule86]

25. That is correct...leaving folks to starve and /or freeze to death must never happen. You get the

best deal you can and move on.

[lark]

35. But if the deal causes lots of workers to die, has anything been gained except by the rich?

There's no money in the 2nd part for people, not one dime, just for states and cities, so has nothing to do with letting people starve or have a place to live.

You do know the Pappa Johns, Home Depots, Popeyes and other asshole businesses will immediately stop anything they are doing for their staff and customers, stop all protections, and kill us all for their personal profits. That is exactly what will happen and we will have enabled this by giving in to the fascists who are trying to kill us.

[Rice4VP]

59. Millions of people have been working all along

every business that I’ve been into there are tons of precautions. This is a non-issue.

The only industry that really had rampant COVID was meat packaging, so maybe they can insist that they improve standard. Amazon has made improvements, etc

[Demsrule86]

60. It won't change anything...the first part has the UI...and other relief.

They broke it into two bills. The first bill helps people right now. UI is in the first bill and I think rent and foreclosure help. The companies you mention are doing it now. And they fire workers with Covid who have no recourse. The first bill does not contain the limited liability. The second bill does.

[lark]

62. Exactly, it was the 2nd bill that I was complaining about. I definitely want the first to pass.

It is the 2nd one that is dangerous to the working class. Right now people have the right to file suit against these companies, and some would lose and others would then straighten up not wanting the huge verdicts against them. With that verdict, all the companies that are paying extra to have the spaces sanitized would have no incentive other than doing the right thing, which is not an animating factor for the rich.

[Loki Liesmith]

26. Thats what I mean

If this is something the GOP really wants they’ll pay out for it.

[Demsrule86]

31. They don't really want it though.

They just want to say 'hey we tried'...mean Dems did this. Starving, freezing Americans means nothing to them.

[Whiskeytide]

22. Dem leadership should ...

... put together a meaningful and worthwhile package, one that helps everyone, and then agree to corporate protections in that package. Put it back on the assholes to then refuse it, and then fry them in the media for it. I hope this is their strategy.

[Demsrule86]

30. No way. We don't have time...now is the time to work out a deal.

[Hugin]

5. Once more, there is noting "bipartisan" going on here.

Unless, you happen to be describing Never Trumpers and Trumpanzees as your partisans.

There is nothing liberal in any of these packages except in the bill already passed by the House months ago and laying on Murderous Moscow Mitch's desk.

[Demsrule86]

21. The bill passed in the house will not become law period. And it is a compromise because Mitch

doesn't want anything.

[Dem4Life1102]

6. No. They are compromising to get help to the people

who need it. That’s how government works.

[Demsrule86]

20. Exactly right. This is how it works.

[BarackTheVote]

24. Eff that--

You think this won’t be abused, you are sadly mistaken—companies WILL call in sick people under the threat of being fired, and unless this bill provides the resources for quitting such a job, which it doesn’t, then they’ll have no choice but to come in, get their coworkers sick, get their customers sick—and the last time this thing reared its ugly head, its “due diligence” clause had NO teeth. A company would be shielded from all liability for putting up a SIGN. This thing will get people sick, mostly lower income people who are living paycheck to paycheck, people who likely don’t have health insurance, and their recourse will be... what? Shielding a company from liability at a time like this is horrific! There is no carrot in this thing that could possibly outweigh the damage that will be done by this section, this bill needs to go down in flames!

[Dem4Life1102]

55. So I guess all the people who's

unemployment is about to run out can eff that too.

[StarfishSaver]

66. Yes. Make them wait and starve and get evicted until the Democrats force a perfect deal

Because some progressives who aren't in danger of any of those things happening to them won't be happy otherwise.

What's so hard about that?

[MontanaFarmer]

7. Multinational meatpacking companies

must be protected at all costs; from COOL to covid relief, that's been GOP religion for years. They've shown they'll literally starve people to protect their masters. So democrats are left with the choice of rewarding that behavior to get people some help, or standing up for the (quite righteous) principle of the matter and not getting money out the door. Not an enviable choice; when the other side plays by the rules of craven indifference to working people that's always going to be the case. So what should they do? Probably cave, while trying to extract the most benefits possible for the most people in doing so

[Demsrule86]

18. They are essential workers thus that is their way around any liablility.

We have to fund government and send the help we can. Right here on DU, people are about to lose everything. The situation is Cleveland and other places is desperate.

[Bluethroughu]

12. If they allow immunity from liability after

These disgusting pigs bet on workers getting sick, Democrats in Congress will lose the midterms.

DON'T DO IT!

People are paying attention to this issue, and they don't want a compromise to be made over their safety.

[Demsrule86]

15. It is temporary. Would you allow 20 million people to starve and be thrown out of their houses.

Right now people are out of work and those with jobs show up sick That is our reality. UI will help stop the spread. And we can't have folks tossed out of their homes during the cold months. Are you prepared to watch kids starve because that is what would happen.

[Turin_C3PO]

23. Exactly.

We have to get some help out to the population.

[Demsrule86]

61. I was just reading about a two year old dropped off at a Goodwill...and people are stealing food.

[Bluethroughu]

64. If you think $600. Will help these people you

Are not living in America. $600. Will not pay the rent for most people, and what good does $600. Do when you are on the street.

You say we need temporary liability, only after $2000. A month for at least two years, and free health care. If you want to know how we pay for it, we tax the rich. If you make more than 500000 a year, you will pay the cost in a patriotic wellcare tax.

[Demsrule86]

13. I heard there will be two bills one will contain UI and other stuff...the other will contain the

liability and money for states...we can't allow millions of Americans to starve. They can't be collateral damage. And sadly, Democrats care and the Republicans don't.

[Hotler]

19. I have yet to see any indication that our party is done playing nice.

This should be a No-starter until we find out if we take Georgia and the senate. If we do, there is no reason to reach across the isle. Then we can tell Mitch to pound sand.

[Turin_C3PO]

27. It's already been too long.

People are hurting this very second and need the unemployment extended. If that means Dems have to “cave” on a few issues, so be it.

[JI7]

28. What does that even mean ?

[Demsrule86]

41. You can't play hardball when the result will be the wholesale starvation of 20 million Americans.

It is too bad the GOP don't give two fucks for the American people and are fine with this...but it is what it is.

[seaglass]

29. This is not new, it has been one of two issues (the other being state aid) that has delayed covid

relief for months. WTF

I think it sucks, in a perfect world we would have a Senate majority and no need to negotiate. We aren't there so the choice appears to be give to get - what is the priority right now - aid to people desperately needing it or risk it all and wait until the end of January for a hoped for Senate majority and a Pres willing to sign off?

[LizBeth]

33. First, companies won't do anything different now than they have and there is not an issue. Second,

millions are being kicked off UI in a week and an half and they are desperate and need help NOW. They need to extend UI whether there is a added amount or not, or whether the liability thing stands or not. Reality for millions.

[BarackTheVote]

38. So you're okay

with your local McDonalds calling in a worker who is sick with Covid, who will then come in to work because they’ll be fired otherwise? Cause that’s the kind of situation that indemnifying corporations from covid liability is gonna cause.

[LizBeth]

39. So you are ok with millions drowning, kicked out of homes, no food or heat in winter?

We can both play this game with others lives.

Mine is a fact that will happen. Yours is a guess even though we know things won't change from the last 9 months and vaccines are on the way. I prefer my high horse to yours.

[BannonsLiver]

46. If it achieves ideological purity, my guess would be yes, probably so.

The ideological purity thing is up and down this thread.

[LizBeth]

48. Yes it is. Realty doesn't seem to phase some in the face of purity. I would take just staying on UI

with an extension with no increase if that allows me not to be kicked off, but knowing in just over a week I will be kicked off, I face a different realty than the posters on this thread, for sure.

[BannonsLiver]

49. Yeah

We have huge swaths of people who live in their own purity bubble where everything is black or white and there is no such thing as nuance. Most come from D+30 districts, I’d guess. I have a close friend who is barely hanging on by selling vintage items on Facebook market place. Yet, I was told by a poster here that they should apparently not do that and starve because “Mark Zuckerberg is a fascist.”

Sure Zuck is a prick. But most people trying to survive don’t have time for purity.

[LizBeth]

50. Wow, right? I have had the lecture of shopping discount stores while poor. Easy enough to

lecture me why I need to shop in store that have higher prices for the good of the whole, while I can't afford to feed myself.

[BannonsLiver]

53. Ah yes. The food snobs. Barf.

[LizBeth]

54. Lol, right.

[BannonsLiver]

51. Oh, and good luck to you LizBeth

I am sorry you are going through this.

[LizBeth]

52. Aren't you also? I have fingers crossed, but running out of time.

Thank you and back at you, if I remember correctly.

[Demsrule86]

42. The worker would like show up and not even tell the employer they were sick so as to keep a job...

that is what is happening right now...and if the worker told the company they were sick, they would be fired. That is the reality. UI will allow those who are ill to stay home with some money and in the end help stop the spread because you have to know people go to work sick if they can rather than lose a paycheck or their job.

[durablend]

63. You *really* think this is the case?

" UI will allow those who are ill to stay home with some money "

With nearly no state aid, they're going to be kicking people off UI in *droves* and forcing overpayments on many for *whatever flimsy reason they can come up with* to save money. And don't tell me that won't happen because it IS happening.

[theaocp]

36. Yes, I imagine the Republicans are holding American people hostage.

Since the donor class exerts endless influence in this country, yes, corporations will get what they want and the media will tell everyone how great the "compromise" was. We will decide again against controlling the narrative and the beatings will continue.

[Demsrule86]

43. It is not great, but it is necessary.

[greenjar_01]

37. I guess I don't get why people would be suing companies about the virus in the first place

It just seems like a weird hill to die on.

[BarackTheVote]

40. How about if they knowingly call in someone who has Covid

and get a bunch of employees sick? Cause it’s gonna happen—this guarantees it’s gonna happen.

[Demsrule86]

44. That is not how it works...do you work. Companies fire people with covid unless they have short term

disability.

[Demsrule86]

45. People are getting sick at the workplace because they need the money.

[BannonsLiver]

47. Extremely unlikely anyone would be able to prove they got it at work

[Rice4VP]

57. They should. At first it made sense, but now people have more information about

how to protect themselves. Just get money to people who need it

[StarfishSaver]

65. They're attacked when they don't make a deal and then they're attacked when they do