Pfizer sees waning immunity from its Covid-19 vaccine, says developing new booster

[Nevilledog]

Link to tweet

Tweet text:
Angry Staffer
@Angry_Staffer
Pfizer sees waning immunity from symptomatic disease 6 months post-inoculation, will ask FDA for emergency use authorization for 3rd booster shot.

Important to note, severe disease protection is still *very* good, even after 6 months.

Pfizer sees waning immunity from its Covid-19 vaccine, says developing new booster
Pfizer said Thursday it is seeing waning immunity from its coronavirus vaccine and says it is picking up its efforts to develop a booster dose that will protect people from variants.
cnn.com
3:32 PM · Jul 8, 2021

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/08/health/pfizer-waning-immunity-bn/index.html

(CNN) — Pfizer said Thursday it is seeing waning immunity from its coronavirus vaccine and says it is picking up its efforts to develop a booster dose that will protect people from variants.

It said it would seek emergency use authorization from the US Food and Drug Administration for a booster dose in August after releasing more data about how well a third, booster dose of vaccine works.

"As seen in real world data released from the Israel Ministry of Health, vaccine efficacy in preventing both infection and symptomatic disease has declined six months post-vaccination, although efficacy in preventing serious illnesses remains high," the company said in a statement emailed to CNN.

"Additionally, during this period the Delta variant is becoming the dominate variant in Israel as well as many other countries. These findings are consistent with an ongoing analysis from the Companies' Phase 3 study," it added.

*snip*

[JoanofArgh]

1. I'll be getting it.

[Lovie777]

2. They were discussing booster dose months ago. . .

[Scrivener7]

3. I'm getting whiplash from the conflicting information. Didnt

they say the immunity lasted longer than they originally though?

[Ms. Toad]

7. Yup.

I look forward to the more complete data and peer reviewed research promise.

FWIW - both articles seem to be talking about duration of immunity, rather than effectiveness against new variants. So they do actually seem to be at odds rather than just talking about differnt aspects of protection against disease.

[StarryNite]

10. I was thinking the same thing.

It's like watching a Ping-Pong match.

[Deminpenn]

4. Look how quickly a booster that will also address

new mutations has been developed.

[Ms. Toad]

5. Interestng that this comes right after

an announcement that the immunity from mRNA vaccines might last years.

The vaccines made by Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna set off a persistent immune reaction in the body that may protect against the coronavirus for years, scientists reported on Monday.

The findings add to growing evidence that most people immunized with the mRNA vaccines may not need boosters, so long as the virus and its variants do not evolve much beyond their current forms — which is not guaranteed. People who recovered from Covid-19 before being vaccinated may not need boosters even if the virus does make a significant transformation.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/28/health/coronavirus-vaccines-immunity.html

[Nevilledog]

8. "so long as the virus and its variants do not evolve much beyond their current forms"

Maybe Delta, Delta Plus, & Lambda are evolving outside the vaccine's effective coverage.

Heck, I'll take as many boosters as needed.

[Ms. Toad]

11. Both articles are addressing durabilty of immunity -

not effectiveness against variants.

So while Pfizer and Moderna are developing Delta-specific boosters, they are talking about immunity wearng off (the opposite of what the NYT and other articles suggested about a week ago).

[Nevilledog]

12. Gotcha

[LisaL]

42. It looks to me that antibody levels have to be quite high to achieve good protection,

especially against the variants. So even if antibodies remain over time, but not at high enough levels, it won't be enough.

[Ms. Toad]

47. I haven't had a chance yet to figure out the opposite announcements a couple of days apart

I know some of the earlier discussions talked about two distinct mechanisms for immunity. So it may be level of antibodies - or it may be that each article is discussing a separate path to immunity.

[womanofthehills]

27. Add Epsilon to that list

Our own California variant. How will vaccines keep up??

[Ms. Toad]

48. Epsilon appears to predate Delta

It was discovered over the winter.

https://abc7.com/delta-variant-epsilon-vaccine-coronavirus-variants/10872667/

[obamanut2012]

9. I thought the same thing

???

[GoodRaisin]

6. Glad they are on top of it .

Looks like I'll be needing my booster in September.

[liberal_mama]

13. I had a bad flare-up of my autoimmune disease after my vaccines,not sure I can go through that again

I'm still dealing with this flare up several months later.

I was hoping that the vaccines provided longer immunity or the virus would be crushed with the vaccines & mask combo.

I will probably go back to personal lockdown status, get groceries delivered, and hope Covid will just disappear in the next few years. Not likely now with all the unvaccinated people running around maskless and spreading their germs.

My husband got shingles on his face and eye a week after his 2nd dose of Pfizer and our doctor said it was from the vaccine so he told me that he's never getting a booster shot unfortunately.

[jimfields33]

14. I get my shingles vaccine next week. I can't wait!!!!!

In the middle of my Pfizer vaccine shots, I had my annual physical and he finally said I could get the shingles vaccine. I was so happy until I told him my second vaccine shot is April 23rd. He said, “nope. You need to wait. I figure almost 3 months should be good.

[Baitball Blogger]

22. Post your experiences with the shingles vaccine.

[jimfields33]

25. I will do that for sure.

[phylny]

28. I had my second shingles vaccine in January.

Sore arm. That was it. I feel fortunate to have it.

[Baitball Blogger]

29. Now I wonder if I should wait until Pfizer comes up with a booster for the Delta

I'm about 3 months out from the 2nd Pfizer, so I can get the shingles vaccine anytime, I guess.

[phylny]

31. Ask your doctor.

My best friend got shingles a few months ago and it was hell for her.

[NCDem47]

23. Totally anecdotal...

I tuned 50 late last year and had shingles shots. Had reactions to both of those vaccines and nothing from Pfizer COVID. On shingles shots, just aches, chills and light night sweats.

[jimfields33]

26. Thank you. I do not mind having some discomfort

I have spoken to some that have had shingles and went through hell. A few days of what you experienced I can handle. Thank you. I wasn’t sure what to expect. My covid Pfizer vaccine made me exhausted and tired the night of the shot and achy arms the following day.

[moonscape]

32. A friend of mine got went blind from

shingles. Got in her ear and ended up affecting her optic nerve (best recall of explanation.). It’s a rare occurrence, one in a million, but shingles can be a destructive piece of nasty.

[I_UndergroundPanther]

60. I got my first dose

Of Shingles vaccine last week. Don't ever want shingles.

[misanthrope]

34. Wow, that's funny because my herpes zoster-caused vertigo cleared up

remarkably in the days following my second Pfizer shot. I am getting a shingles vax before the end of the month to try and prevent another flare-up.

[wnylib]

39. How could a vaccine cause shingles?

Shingles is from a dormant chicken pox virus.

[liberal_mama]

54. Our doctor said the shingles were activated from the vaccine and he had 4 other patients

with shingles who were recently vaccinated the same week my husband got it. Our doctor is very pro-vaccine and said it's better to get shingles than to die of Covid and I agree on that.

I'm not convinced it's true, as I had shingles myself in May 2015 and I didn't have any vaccines around that time.

However, my husband believes the vaccine caused his shingles completely. So there will be no way he will get a booster. I'm really hoping these vaccines will last a while and hopefully the virus will just die out like other viruses have.

The worst part is his shingles is on his face and eye and it left pretty big scars. It looked awful and he couldn't work for 2 weeks. The medical bills have been high too as he has to see an eye specialist every week (still).

His co-workers are mostly younger than him (so not eligible for vaccination at the time me and my husband got our vaccines) and they were so upset and said they will never get the vaccine after seeing what happened to him. Most of them are Trumpers though so they probably wouldn't have gotten it anyway.

[wnylib]

55. Silly young coworkers. They probably

had the chicken pox vaccine when they were kids, so shingles is not a risk for them.

I have never, so far, had shingles, but I did have chicken pox as a child. It left one pockmark on my nose and one above one eyebrow, but they are barely visible.

My husband had shingles in his 30s and it was very painful for him. It was on his back so he could not reach it to apply the cream that the doctor prescribed. I had to do it, and then cover it so clothing did not stick to the cream or stimullate a painful itch.

[womanofthehills]

57. I read that immediately after a vaccine your immune system is stressed

And that can activate dormant viruses in your body.

[wnylib]

59. I looked it up because I was curious

about this. I found an article that says that some medications and immune system disruptions, like illness or vaccinations, can temorarily disrupt the immune system enough to allow the virus that causes chicken pox and shingles to reactivate. It says that it is rare in cases of vaccine, but can happen.

So I can understand your husband's concern. I had no idea until now that this was a possibility.


.

[I_UndergroundPanther]

15. Even though I got Moderna

I want to get the booster.

[LisaL]

20. Moderna has been making boosters.

NT

[wnylib]

40. I had an allergic skin rash from

my second Moderna shot. Not sure if a booster would be safe.

[SoCalDavidS]

16. Nice That We Get 3 Shots, While Assholes Get None

WE have to get a 3rd shot, because Pieces Of Shit in this country refuse to get even a single shot, and are therefore prolonging this pandemic indefinitely.

We'll probably all be getting 4th & 5th shots thanks to these Assholes.

[NH Ethylene]

17. I'm a little uncomfortable that the company that profits is calling the shots and producing the data

I'd really like to see independent studies done as well.

[Baitball Blogger]

21. +1

If the Israel breakthroughs had not reached national news, I wonder if we would be hearing this admission from Pfizer at all.

[misanthrope]

35. The version of this story I read a week or so ago

Quoted the following:

Some health experts expressed skepticism about the Israel study, saying mRNA vaccines like Pfizer have been shown to offer strong protection against COVID-19 infection.

"Speaking to colleagues in Israel, real skepticism about 64% number," Brown University School of Public Health Dean Ashish Jha wrote on Twitter. "Best data still suggest mRNA vaccines offer high degree of protection against infection."

"And superb protection against severe illness," Jha added. "Lets await more data but as of now If you're vaccinated, I wouldn't worry."

Jha clarified that he was not saying the results of the study were incorrect, but stressed that most data has suggested a high efficacy rate in protecting against the delta variant, pointing to a British study that found it was 90 percent effective.
...

Jha was cited as being an employee at Brown, not Pfizer. To me that shows expert skepticism beyond the realm of the manufacturer.

[LisaL]

44. Well, Israel has real-life data, not just some study.

They see a large number of vaccinated individuals become infected. Same in UK, by the way.

[uponit7771]

38. yep

[wnylib]

41. Good point. I have wondered about this, too.

[dweller]

18. I hope there is some kind of order

As to who gets the booster and not the havoc that went around the 1st time-
Like maybe going by the dates of 1st&2nd vax and contacting ppl to come in on set dates/times etc
I realize it was the shortages the 1st time, but finding an available slot was crazy
and nerve racking … hopefully it goes smoother with boosters

✌🏻

[I_UndergroundPanther]

24. I hope we can just

Go to the pharmacy walk in and get it.

The appointment thing and all the hassles made me so anxious I could barely do it.

[Baitball Blogger]

19. Are they going to improve it to protect against the Delta?

Or will it be the same thing?

[Boomerproud]

30. I'm not at all happy about this at all.

Somebody better get their shit together.

[Peppertoo]

33. CDC and FDA say booster not needed at this time.

[link:

Link to tweet

|]

Eric Topol was also questioning this.

It may be needed at some point and when it is, I will get it, but that is not today.

[LisaL]

37. CDC is claiming we are well protected, yet in both Israel and UK, vaccinated people are

getting infected with delta covid.

[Peppertoo]

62. those vaccinated with Pfizer/ Moderna are highly protected from symptomatic Covid

[LisaL]

43. And frankly, I fail to see why people who want boosters can't get them because

a large number of morons want to remain un-vaccinated (I've seen it's suggested by the media that it's too early to think about boosters when less than half of population is vaccinated). That un-vaccinated half of population is either not eligible (too young) or refuses to get vaccines for the most parts. So why should that prevent people from getting boosters?

[Peppertoo]

49. True but for now boosters are not needed & some of the scare talk about boosters

makes it more difficult to persuade those who need their first shots to get them.

[LisaL]

51. Again, why should I worry about those who refuse to get shots, and why should that prevent

me from getting a booster?

[Peppertoo]

52. Those who refuse to get shots perpetuate the viral spread

You don’t need a booster now.

[LisaL]

53. How is me not getting a booster shot going to change the mind of anti-vaxxers who don't want

the vaccine?

[Peppertoo]

56. You personally - not much

But the chatter about boosters is likely to dissuade those on the fence from getting their needed shots.

[NH Ethylene]

46. That is reassuring. I'm glad they are not relying solely on Pharma data. n/t

[Quixote1818]

36. I will be first in line. nt

[Maxheader]

45. scares the shit out of me...

And I ain't sceered of nuthin...

[LetMyPeopleVote]

50. Americans who have been fully vaccinated don't need a booster shot at this time,

Link to tweet

[ecstatic]

58. How would an mRNA booster work?

MRNA vaccines work by teaching "our cells how to make a protein—or even just a piece of a protein—that triggers an immune response."

Is the booster going to give the same message a second time or will there be a different set of instructions? Are they going to conduct research trials first before going live?

[LisaL]

61. Either way will work.

Booster can be the same vaccine as first two shots-it will trigger immune response increasing the number of antibodies.
Or booster can be specific for a variant.
Moderna and Pfizer have the ability to make variant specific vaccine boosters.

[appalachiablue]

63. K/R