They are just laughing at us.

[Voltaire2]

If the situation were reversed, if Trump had won the election and 'BLM' and 'antifa' had stormed Congress in an attempt to prevent the constitutional process of confirming the election, there would have been a national emergency declared that same day. Thousands of people would have been arrested, including members of congress and perhaps Biden himself.

They would have pushed for treason charges against everyone and done their best to execute as many people as they could.

They are just fucking laughing at us.

[FoxNewsSucks]

1. Unless there are severe consequences, they'll keep laughing

and do it again.

[BComplex]

43. Bingo! I want the people at the TOP, who are RESPONSIBLE for this, to face SERIOUS

consequences. This country allows for all of this lopsided "justice". I'm so fucking sick of it.

[Elessar Zappa]

2. The reason why

you don’t see treason and sedition charges is that it likely wouldn’t stick. Prosecutors typically charge people with what they know will get a conviction.

[Solomon]

27. I'm so sick of that excuse. Tell that to black folks who get charged on scant evidence.

You'll be laughed out of the room.

[Moostache]

34. We don't seem to get it...

The point in politics is NOT convictions, NOT actually proving a crime...it is the perception and the media bleating over and over and over again about the CHARGES...the perceived 'crime' is far more damning than an actual one or even a court case.

Benghazi anyone? Even after whipping republican ass for 11 hours of testimony, Hillary was always damaged by the perceived problem more than the actual actions. This was also true for the infamous "e-mails" (which fell flat on its face when the GOP tried to go back to that well for Hunter Biden's laptop).

It is making something remind people of the EXACT thing you want them to think - and not trying to convince them of something else via nuance or logic or even common sense that causes the most lasting political damage...even more so than convictions and prison time.

THAT is where the GOP kicks our ever-loving ass, nearly every time.
They're just better at being slime than we are...and the results show it for the most part.

We had Trump allegedly on the ropes multiple times by his own hands in his disaster of a single term. He actually WAS impeached. TWICE. The problem was we played the cases in the court of public opinion and we tried to do so with nuanced language and competent prosecutions. We tried to PROVE his guilt instead of going hard on the reptilian's center of the brain.

That shit simply does not matter, PERIOD.
Let's go back in time a bit...

One word....Dukakis.
One image?

?1455606880

Another?
One phrase...Al Gore sighs.
One image?



Another?
One word...windsurfing.
One image?



You can go back further if you want, even a Republican CAN be felled by the same principle - KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID!

One phrase....'read my lips...no new taxes'.
One image?


What is happening in these January 6th cases seems to be the inverse...there are PLENTY of images to use to convict these idiots in the public opinion - that asshole with the Confederate Battle Flag should be THE SINGLE IMAGE of the coverage and public accountability campaign for ALL of these idiots...not stories about their ankle monitors making too much noise.

Fuck the bastards we did 06Jan2021. But just as Trump slimed away from impeachment because the cases relied too much on logic and reason and nuance, so too will the bastards from January walk if they are not similarly tarred and feathered as our democratic candidates so often are...

There was one man who the GOP TIRED to do this too...and it failed massively.

One phrase...'tan suit'.

[Ferrets are Cool]

39. Great post

👍

[Pepsidog]

52. Post of the year! This is what the Rs get and we don't.

[KS Toronado]

55. You're 100% correct

[Lucky Luciano]

74. I'll pile on. Great post.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

75. Sounds good but minor detail. They DONT watch

normal news!!!!! They will never hear any of it

[CrispyQ]

85. We need a marketing department--stat!

Instead, we have crickets. They are 40+ years ahead of us in messaging & broadcasting. We are so behind the 8-ball it's not even funny. And now we have a big segment of our population who live in an alternate reality. And we are still crickets, although perhaps the right wing media machine is so big now it wouldn't matter anyway.

The media is as liberal as the conservative corporations that own it. ~bumper sticker

[Laura PourMeADrink]

72. And I remember the day FG got acquitted after Impeachment II, the legal

commentators said, that's it. If you can't get a conviction via "political"
ways like impeachment, no prosecutor would take on a criminal indictment
because the bar for evidence/witnesses is so much higher.

That said, it is utterly appalling the he's relaxed and playing golf in his
zillion dollar haven.

[2Gingersnaps]

80. Therefore proving in no uncertain terms

there truly is two Americas, "law and order" for thee but not for me. One man can die in the street for selling loose cigarettes, one man can rape and pillage an entire country and whine about how poorly treated he is.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

84. Sad, very sad, but true. We were just fuming about those people

That were obviously guilty of insider trading. Icahn! Wtf.

FG knew/ knows exactly how to toe the line with one foot on the legal side and the other foot on the illegal side. Should have saw this coming for sure with something I remember from the past. He never paid his casino fees to the state of New Jersey. And he just out-lawyered them and drug it out and drug it out until New Jersey said it wasn't worth it.

I'd love it if somebody did an update on all the legal issues surrounding him and what the status is.

[SheilaAnn]

3. It looks to me as if the DOJ is failing to do its job. Hope I'm wrong but Garland is not impressive

[leftstreet]

4. DURec

[gab13by13]

5. We have been told to relax,

that justice takes time. We have been told that we don't know what DOJ is or isn't doing regarding the coup attempt. Well I for one hope that DOJ is investigating because it has way more clout than the House select committee.

I repeat, the GQP strategy is to delay delay obstruct obstruct until it's Kornacki time.

[SCantiGOP]

6. The only change I would make in the OP

Is that there would have been at least dozens killed in that day. Not one person would have been allowed to enter the building without meeting armed resistance.

[Voltaire2]

8. yup.

[underpants]

7. Look what Trump on June 1 just for a bad photo op

That would have paled in comparison to the reaction if it was BLM.

[Initech]

9. Again the difference between us and them is 2500 radio stations, 3 news networks...

And an army of internet propagandists with huge subscriber bases. What do we have that can even remotely compare with that? Liberal media? Does that even exist anymore? Shit, we get one hour of Rachel Maddow and 15 minute monologues on late night talk shows, and the fuckheads are complaining that even *THAT* is too much!

It must be nice when you can control the narrative and have your talking points echoed 24 hours a day throughout the universe. Seriously, if we want to flip the narrative, we got to start thinking like they do, and start local.

[HUAJIAO]

16. THEY started local in 1980, even before, with a LONG LONG game plan.

It is now paying off...

[Initech]

17. Yup! To borrow a quote from Spaceballs:

"What have we got on this thing? A Cuisinart???".

It's going to take years, decades to catch up to their propaganda game, if we even can have the resources to fight it. Their network is way too strong.

[TheRealNorth]

25. And now they are moving to take control of the schools

Gotta brainwash them while they are young.

[Initech]

48. Yup. Don't think they're crashing school board meetings...

And attacking things like "critical race theory" for nothing. God forbid someone have an independent thought outside of the cult.

[CousinIT]

79. They are taking control of school boards not to transform the public schools...

....but to DESTROY them.

Koch/John Bircher/ALEC/GQP/QAnon want ONLY charter and private schools. Abolishing public schools AND the USPS has been on their 'to-do' list for quite some years. Along with takeover of the courts, which is done.

[CrispyQ]

81. +1

Our side dropped the ball when we ignored hate radio. Now it's morphed into a huge right wing media machine. I feel like no matter what we do now, we're too late to the dance. No one ever wants to admit we have some complicity in where we're at today, but we do. They've been playing the long game, while we've been reactionary mode.

[gab13by13]

40. They have unlimited supplies of dark money,

or as Alito would call it, money that doesn't have to be disclosed. They project, all one has to do is listen to what they say. They blame George Soros for pumping millions of dollars into the DNC when the truth of the matter is the Koch brothers, the Mercers, ALEC, Federalist Society, DeVos family have all been pumping tons of money into the GQP. The Federalist Society picks Supreme court justices and ALEC writes Bills for them. GQPers do nothing but fund raise which basically amounts to quid pro quos.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

77. And it's not what they say! It's what the RW media DOESN'T say

[Goodheart]

10. At the very least, Garland should have charged trump with obstruction of justice.

The treason stuff is iffy. The obstruction in the Mueller case is clear.

Might as well throw out any congressional oversight, any special investigations, any justice against the executive, whatsoever, forever.

And a giant waste of taxpayer money, to boot.

[Voltaire2]

12. of course treason is iffy, that would not matter to them.

And if not treason they would have used anything they could to get people executed, like for example: 18 U.S.C. § 844(d), (f), (i) 'Death resulting from offenses involving transportation of explosives, destruction of government property, or destruction of property related to foreign or interstate commerce.'

[Ray Bruns]

14. Treason doth never prosper, what's the reason? For if it prosper, none dare call it Treason.

John Harrington

[Demsrule86]

20. I don't think you will ever get Trump on anything...and charging a president once he is out of

the office is a bad precedent.

[Goodheart]

22. Say what?

It's an excellent precedent if he actually committed the crime. Which is obvious.

[Demsrule86]

24. It will be impossible to prove...and will make him a sympathetic figure too. Much of what he

did will be deemed policy and then there is the jury issues...you think you will ever get a jury to convict Trump? Knowing someone is guilty and proving it and getting a conviction are two different things. The states should go after him...and him where it hurts...the pocket book. I suspect that is all we are going to get in the end.

[Treefrog]

28. I agree, all these predictions that he's "going down" are just pipe dreams.

I’d love to be wrong.

[Demsrule86]

67. I would love to be wrong too...I hate him.

[Efilroft Sul]

11. And if Congress doesn't pass voter protection laws, the Republicans will steal 2022 and 2024.

Turnout won't matter if the GOP can just reverse the results they don't like. When our side rightfully loses its shit, you can bet bullets will be flying, prosecutions will be following, and punishments will be resulting. They'll be laughing harder at us.

[Voltaire2]

13. yup

[Demsrule86]

21. That is not true. There are things we can do...Congress isn't going to pass voter laws unless we win

at least two more Senate seats in 2022 and hold Sinema's. This is doable as it is statewide.

[Efilroft Sul]

30. You're kind of proving my point.

If the Democrats don't somehow get around the filibuster rule to strengthen voter laws and negate the shenanigans the Republicans are pulling at the state level, GOTV won't be good enough in 2022. It will already be too late.

[gab13by13]

41. I agree,

winning the House is going to be a monumental task. GOTV doesn't mean shit in gerrymandered districts and that is based on 2010 gerrymandering. The GQP hasn't even gerrymandered from the 2020 census.

Look at how many state Houses are controlled by the GQP. My state, Pa. always gets more Democratic votes and always loses more seats, how is getting out the vote going to fix that? Without passing S1 we have a hard row to hoe. Yes I have a plan how to do it but I'm not Chuck Schumer.

[Demsrule86]

65. We will not be able to do much about voting until and unless we win more senate seats in 22. We

should be able to win statewide races and even some House districts. I believe the Texas abortion law is going to hurt the GOP...but a the moment and until we get new members, we don't have the votes.

[Mad_Machine76]

32. We should never

just assume that we're doomed because we don't do one thing JMHO. The problems with our election system are numerous and some of the laws passed since 2020 are undoubtedly going to make things worse, but right-wing gerrymandering and voter suppression isn't just starting in 2022 and 2024 and probably won't end then either. As for them overturning elections, I would just like to see them try it (and I don't think anything that is currently being proposed would even address that issue?). I dare an election official to simply overturn an election result and see how quickly they have to backtrack and resign if not face criminal investigation (no matter what their "laws" say)

[Efilroft Sul]

36. The Republicans have poisoned the well, but we still think we can drink the water...

Last edited Thu Sep 9, 2021, 01:31 PM - Edit history (1)

…and make it taste better.

The Republican Party is doing what it wants without consequences, and they are not playing by the rules. When the GOP seizes Congressional power in 2023, their rules are going to be used against all of us and they will laugh in the face of any threatened criminal investigation.

If we want to fix the well, Congressional Democrats have to neutralize the poison now, not later.

[gab13by13]

42. Exactly,

what scares me the most are people who say, all we have to do is win elections, GOTV. What we have to do is pass S1 or our democracy may be lost. We can't beat them in the courts, we can temporarily until it gets to the SC where 4 justices have already stated that states have the authority to run their elections as they see fit.

[Demsrule86]

66. Seriously...exactly how do you 'neutralized the poison' I seriously get tired of the lack of

ideas that could actually work.

[Efilroft Sul]

70. And I get tired of the Democrats not seeing the obvious danger in front of their noses.

GOTV is magical thinking. The Republicans have made it clear they will suppress votes up to and including the day of the election and nullify results they don't like when the election is over.

Congressional Democrats and the Justice Department must use their power to protect the vote while they still have it. Otherwise, what's the point about providing condescending, mealy-mouthed explanations of how we "don't understand how politics works" except to prove the both-siders types correct?

Not that you gave me a mealy-mouthed explanation. But others on here have.

[Escurumbele]

15. You have written nothing but the truth, and that is why I am reaching my point where I have

stopped watching the news, all I hear is complaints "the republicans did this. republicans did that" but never hear actions to push back on the criminality and corruption from the republicans. One would think republicans are the majority.

The worst of it all is that the majority of the country is liberal, why then are republicans able to get away with murder? Why is DeSantis, Abbot, the crazy from South Dakota and other republican murderers not being indicted? Why is it that Democrats don't push hard, why is it that Manchin and Sinema are holding the Democratic party and the country hostage without repercussions? Those two behave like republicans.

I AM FED UP! I don't watch the news anymore.

I have a lot of friends in Venezuela, and when Chavez took over I was worried about them, about what was happening to the country so I was keeping up with the news. Then I became fed up because when the opposition appeared on TV it was the same song.."the chavistas did this,, the chavistas did that" but there was no real action to fight back, and now Venezuela is a dump, politically, economically, all freedoms lost. People cannot go out with fear of being robbed, or killed, prices through the roof, etc. A totalitarian regime making things worst for the country while amassing a lot of money not belonging to them.

The same is happening here in the USA, republicans modus operandi is to create chaos, to create national anxiety, but that chaos and anxiety is due to Democrats not fighting hard. The filibuster should be abolished, the Electoral College as well. Why are Democrats so passive? I AM FED UP!!!

I don't know how to post so that the post shows up on this section of DU, but there is a great article in the Guardian, here is the link:
[link:https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/09/afghanistan-us-foreign-wars-congresswoman-barbara-lee|

[Initech]

51. What pisses me off is that the GOP barely gets a slap on the wrist!

Meanwhile, Franken is forced out because of a fucking 10 year old photo. Newsom is being recalled for completely bullshit reasons because the MAGAs want him replaced with a patsy. Cuomo is out on accusations of sexual harassment.

Desantis is literally killing his citizens and these morons want him for vice president! Abbott is also killing his citizens and destroying the Texas electrical grid and nothing happens to him! Ted Cruz bailed on his citizens in the middle of a natural disaster... nothing! It's fucking infuriating!

[ancianita]

54. It is the purpose of the Fifth Column to hold up the lintel until the corporate lords

enter and occupy government, military and means of production. Yesterday's plantation is today's corporate campus, with all the re-established hierarchal structure and CEO power of colonial magistrates; nations don't have presidents, corporations and colonies do.

[Kid Berwyn]

89. Outstanding post. Great article by Rep. Barbara Lee.

Why are Americans paying $32m every hour for wars since 9/11?

was the sole member of Congress to vote against the war in Afghanistan. Congress has yet to stand up against endless militarism

Barbara Lee
Sept. 9, 2021

Excerpt…

Twenty years on, the US and the world are much worse off for this failure of leadership. It is time to turn the page on two decades of endless war with a vague and ever-shifting mission. While this begins with removing the 2001 and 2002 authorizations for use of military force from the law books, it will also require decisive changes in our foreign policy decision processes and resource allocation.

Shortly after the attacks, President Bush sent a 60-word blank check to Congress that would give him or any other president the authority to wage war against enemies of their choosing. It was a sweeping resolution known as the 2001 authorization for use of military force, or the 2001 AUMF. I was the lone vote in Congress against the authorization because I feared it was too broad, giving the president the open-ended power to use military force anywhere, against anyone.

The human cost has been high: an untold number of civilian casualties overseas, two generations of American soldiers sent to fight without any clear objective or oversight and thousands of our troops and other personnel killed, wounded and traumatized in action.

The Afghanistan war alone has cost more than $2.6tn taxpayer dollars and killed more than 238,000 individuals. The 2002 AUMF, which authorized war against Iraq based on fabricated claims of weapons of mass destruction, has cost $1.9tn and killed an estimated 288,000. Together, these two AUMFs have been used by three successive presidents to engage in war in at least seven countries – from Yemen to Libya to Niger – against a continually growing list of adversaries that Congress never foresaw or intended. The Bush, Obama and Trump administrations have further identified to Congress combat-ready counter-terrorism deployments to at least 14 additional countries, indicating that the AUMFs could justify armed combat in those places as well. Only 56 current members of the House and 16 senators were present at the 2001 vote, making a mockery of the constitutional principle that only the people’s elected representatives in Congress can send our country to war.

The results today are a perpetual state of war and an ever-expanding military-industrial complex that consumes a greater and greater amount of our resources every year. Pentagon spending since 9/11 (adjusted for inflation) has increased by almost 50%. Each hour, taxpayers are paying $32m for the total cost of wars since 2001, and these wars have not made Americans safer or brought democracy or stability to the Middle East. To the contrary, they have further destabilized the region and show no sign of ending or achieving any of the long-ago stated goals.

Continues…

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/09/afghanistan-us-foreign-wars-congresswoman-barbara-lee

[dalton99a]

18. They see no consequences. They have no fear.

[Evolve Dammit]

31. K&R; Truth succinctly said.

[ffr]

19. Nail, meet hammer.

[bucolic_frolic]

23. We were not in power when it happened

We are late to the game, we have to manage fallout temporally and politically, according to law and make it stick with minimal possibility of acquittal or blowback, and we have to do it like Americans to our abnormal fellow Americans, meaning with integrity and reasonableness. Vindictiveness doesn't do us a lot of good. It may feel good, but it has fallout too. So we have principles. They won't feel lucky at the end of the day. They'll feel ashamed and lucky it wasn't worse.

[Ferrets are Cool]

71. Republicans feel shame? What alternative universe does this happen?

[Mad_Machine76]

26. I dunno

Some of them- like Kevin McCarthy- are screaming like stuck pigs about the Jan. 6 commissions requesting preservation of their phone and social media records for that day.

[gab13by13]

44. Have those records been turned over?

Today is the deadline.

[Mad_Machine76]

53. I thought that the commission

has only requested that the telecoms preserve the records. I don't recall that there was a deadline set for today to actually receive those records.

[Progressive Jones]

76. You are correct. nt

[WestIndianArchie]

29. Well

This is how the degenerate system of racism/white supremacy works.

[cilla4progress]

33. Well there are yesterday's firings of

Conway, Spicer off military review boards.



SMDH

[The Mouth]

35. There is no right to riot

There is a right to 'peacefully assemble to petition for the redress of grievances'.

1/6 was not peaceful. Events that are not peaceful should be treated as insurrections, regardless of the cause.

It's interesting that the same people calling for use of force on the BLM/Antifa rioters were the ones calling 1/6 peaceful.

[gab13by13]

45. We know the cause,

the insurrectionists told us the cause. They stated Trump sent us. They carried signs that said Stop the Steal. They were singling out Speaker Pelosi and Mike Pence who were in charge of the Electoral college vote certification.

The cause was a coup.

[The Mouth]

47. Denial ain't a river in Egypt

but it does seem to be an official position of the Retuglican party

[ancianita]

37. They can fuckin' laugh but it's not the last laugh. Not the last.

They don't even have any fight behind the laugh. It's the har-dee-har dumb laugh of the stupid playground bully. Not the happy laugh of recognition that they have "won."

[Blue Owl]

73. Damn right

It's a premature ejaculation, at best...

[Bev54]

38. Perhaps there would have been a state of emergency called

but you seem to forget that Biden was elected but not in office so could not call a state of emergency. Your reasoning seems flawed.

[gab13by13]

46. Biden had no power until Congress certified

the Electoral College votes and he was sworn in to office.

[Bev54]

57. He was not sworn into office until Jan 20

[Voltaire2]

49. sure, so what's the excuse starting Jan 20, 2021?

[Bev54]

56. Well it was hardly an emergency then

[Voltaire2]

58. its still a fucking emergency

they are still at it

the coup is ongoing.

[stillcool]

50. I don't like what if's...I don't much like what is either

and I really don't like what maybe will, maybe won't be. My reality is that this country is circling the drain. Not unusual, in the course of history. Life will go on, not for all of us, but that's life. It'll all shake out one way or another, and it will be another generation that decides what to make of the ashes. Every day is another reminder of how little control 'we the people have in the ability to affect how we are governed. I am not convinced we ever did, outside of our local governments. I intermittently ponder the worst that could happen...exhausting. Hope for the best, but not too much or I'll jinx it...but I'm done freaking out on a daily basis over this ever increasing, vomit inducing pile of horse-shit.

[zentrum]

59. You said it!

[treestar]

60. How do you know that?

That is pure speculation.

[Voltaire2]

61. Oh for example the fact that they appear to compete to see who can come up with

the most obviously bullshit explanation for what happened on Jan 6.

But sure whatever, have a nice day. Also about the republic? Seems we couldn't Mr. Franklin.

[treestar]

62. The Republic is fine

you have to convince others to vote your way, not continually complain someone else should do it.

And the legal system has to work its way, have evidence; it's not there for emotional satisfaction. Not everything is the "slam dunk case" people always think it is when it suits their emotional state.

Many people have been arrested for what they did on 1/6.

[orangecrush]

68. Evidence?

Like the bodies of the cops killed by these psychos,

[treestar]

87. Are you saying no one has been arrested for it?

Is that because it has not been figured out who they were? Even the most heinous crime needs to be solved, not just prosecute anybody so as to feel better.

[KPN]

83. Why am I reminded of Neville Chamberlain?

Last edited Fri Sep 10, 2021, 02:32 PM - Edit history (1)

[Voltaire2]

86. .

[treestar]

88. He didn't believe in the rule of law?

Or he did, and you thought that was bad? Foreign policy is not the same thing as a trial in a court of law.

Who do you want to prosecute? Just somebody, so it feels better? Or the people who did the crime with evidence they were the ones that did it?

[orangecrush]

63. WTAF, INDEED!

[randr]

64. You have a correct assessment of what would have happened if the shoe was on the other foot

This perfectly describes a fascist 3rd world countries reaction.
We are not a 3rd world country.
He who laughs last----

[Missn-Hitch]

69. That is god damn right. And it's sickening.

[tavernier]

78. But on the other hand,

more of them are are dying from laughter.

Truth can only be ignored for a while, and then reality steps in. They can’t finess and trump global warming and Covid. Those boys don’t play politics.

[Paladin]

82. You're exactly correct.

I'm getting really weary of American fascists pissing on us and laughing about it, without paying any price.

The other side has determined we are unwilling to fight back. And I think that's an accurate assessment. Shame on us.