General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe NVC rejected my marriage certification. My wife's Green Card is dead
The US Government has successfully broken my family apart. Anyone who talks to me about DREAMers while ignoring people like my wife who tried doing it the "legal" way and got mistreated from day one by the US Government will get an earful from me from now on.
My wife has asked me to complete my contract here and then go back home. June 1st will be my last day in my country for the rest of my life. I will not allow anyone in this government to hurt my wife ever again.
But, as an immigration attorney told me today, there is a deep anti-Chinese sentiment in all levels of immigration and Trump made it worse.
I am officially suspending my campaign for Arizona House.
On edit: Anyone who says "China" as a pejorative I will report immediately for bigotry. It's not China. It's the Chinese Communist Party or the Chinese Government. "China" means people like my wife. DU should never use country names to attack their government, since my wife, her family, our friends, and my former students ARE NOT part of that.
My wife already wonders why Americans hate her so much, based on comments on this board, news of attacks on Chinese and Asian people, and our history like the Chinese Exclusion Act.
elleng
(131,253 posts)XanaDUer2
(10,787 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)I've cut off my brother because of her.
Ilsa
(61,709 posts)Life is hard enough without listening to hateful crap from family. I've cut off communications from one sibling.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)His response: "Not much."
That started the bridge burning.
BoycottTimHortons
(34 posts)Would do the same tbqh.
stillcool
(32,626 posts)sorry for you both.
CanonRay
(14,125 posts)Is there any possibility of getting a Dem Congressmen involved?
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Kelly has ignored me and lied to me about communication since March
Sinema's office has offered a multitude of platitudes, then told me "the law is the law."
Demovictory9
(32,488 posts)discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,483 posts)...who is up for reelection next year. Her grandfather immigrated from Mexico.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,483 posts)She is a Senator representing the whole state.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,483 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,483 posts)discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,483 posts)This is really awful, them telling you "the law is the law" while the law says that these decisions are not based in any legal criteria but just up to the arbitrary and capricious opinions of low level bureaucrats.
JCMach1
(27,582 posts)Legal immigration (I know some of your pain and frustration) was of all people Sen. Marco Rubio.
Yep, that one.
He was extremely helpful.
Skittles
(153,249 posts)wonderful folk
blm
(113,122 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)And Democrats today are doing nothing.
joetheman
(1,450 posts)So sorry this happened to you and your wife. Sickened that you have no Dem advocate. Who is your Rep? Maybe we all could help out????
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Francis Walter was from PA, Pat McCarran was from NV. Not Dixiecrats
Francis Walter became the president of the Pioneer Fund, which funded Charles Murray's "The Bell Curve."
DFW
(54,465 posts)Not even a letter of regret or advice? That doesn't sound like him.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Status on her B2 visa.
DFW
(54,465 posts)He always came across to me as a good guy, although I was never in a position to need anything from him. I would assume his English is fluent, but we always spoke in Spanish, so I never really got to find out one on one. Also, immigration was not a subject that ever came up between us, as it was pretty obvious I wasn't directly affected by the issue. A native speaker of Spanish will instantly recognize my continental Spain accent, and therefore surmise (correctly) that I am no expert on the subject of border issues.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Unless you are Mexican, he has no interest in helping you.
He's helping my superintendent, whose wife is going through what mine is going through, but she is in Nogales and Mexican. Mine is in Shanghai and Chinese.
My friend calls him useless and worthless, as Raul is all talk and no action unless it makes him look good in his community.
sheshe2
(83,986 posts)That is just not right.
MustLoveBeagles
(11,668 posts)It shouldn't be this way.
BigmanPigman
(51,646 posts)Response to AZLD4Candidate (Original post)
Post removed
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)How dare you!
I've spent close to $7,000 out of my own pocket on my campaign.
When you go through what my wife and I have gone through for the last 14 months, including three missed birthdays and two missed anniversaries, you can shed your self-righteous indignation at me.
Until then, you need to apologize for questions my motives for running. I need to do for MY family first. As Rabbi Hillel said: "If I am not for me, who will be." Based on your disrespectful, haughty, and flippant response, you wouldn't even if you could.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)I would feel you lack the commitment to good government I deserve and believe my representatives owe me. I also feel my representatives should respect and believe in me.
I wished you well. Your turn to wish us well before you leave America forever.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)That isn't going to happen. If the US Government changes its mind and lets her in, my campaign is back on.
But family ALWAYS comes first.
Duppers
(28,127 posts)As it should be!!
Wishing you the best!
Response to Hortensis (Reply #28)
Celerity This message was self-deleted by its author.
shrike3
(3,836 posts)Why should he continue his campaign and remain apart from his wife? Seriously, what an odd attitude.
Duppers
(28,127 posts)summer_in_TX
(2,766 posts)I could add other adjectives but will refrain.
JonAndKatePlusABird
(315 posts)I wished you well. Your turn to wish us well before you leave America forever.
A bit callous, no?
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)But when it comes to times like Korea, there's no one more red white and blue
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal.
Applies with that nasty comment.
Withywindle
(9,988 posts)You think he's doing the WRONG thing by not abandoning his wife for a political campaign? By NOT choosing his political career over his marriage?
I would side-eye the hell out of any politician who would do that.
Our representatives owe us honesty, hard work for the issues we care about, and transparency. They do NOT owe us personal sacrifice on that level.
jcgoldie
(11,656 posts)Terrible contribution to this thread.
Celerity
(43,642 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)I am doing what is a responsible husband should do.
Celerity
(43,642 posts)to see in the US, which is made up (other than the indigenous) entirely of immigrants or descendents of immigrants, all of whom came within only the past 466 years (St Augustine, FL, it's only been 414 years since Jamestown and the English), MAX.
The vast majority trace their initial ancestors there back for a far shorter time than that. The nation itself, in its current Constitutional form, is only 232 years old, and independent for only 245. So young compared to Europe and Asia.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)But I know what you are saying.
Celerity
(43,642 posts)liberalhistorian
(20,822 posts)legalized discrimination against Asians, especially Chinese immigrants, has, unfortunately, been very much a part of this country's DNA almost from its beginnings. Some of the worst anti-immigration laws of the 19th and 20th centuries were specifically aimed against keeping them out and keeping down the ones who were already here. TFG's Chinese hating diatribes and deliberate stirring up of anger and hate crimes against them exploited and built on that "tradition."
mopinko
(70,281 posts)it was a dick thing to say. i'm so sorry, and i am so sorry for your plight.
not everyone here is who they pretend to be.
is there any way to remarry? why arent they recognizing your marriage?
PufPuf23
(8,843 posts)Thank you for sharing your situation with DU, it is a learning moment.
panader0
(25,816 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)I go where my wife is. She is the most important person in my life.
panader0
(25,816 posts)and the Chinese border. I visited Hong Kong about '66. Later Thailand the next year. My dad was
stationed in Oahu and my mom was a travel fan.
Your priorities are correct---so sad about the treatment of your wife.
We Arizonans will miss you. All the best.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)But my family is more important and I need to be where my wife is. We've already been separated for 14 months.
getagrip_already
(14,923 posts)Nobody has an absolute right to a green card, but certainly there are abuses in the qualification process.
What reasons did they give (if any)?
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)And as I have been told by two immigration attorneys, the immigration people have a huge anti-Chinese attitude, look them over harder than anyone else, and will deny for any and all reasons.
Nobody has an absolute right to a green card. You would think the US Government wouldn't be in the business of separating Americans from their families.
Your lack of empathy is duly noted.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,349 posts)Why not get married here?
I know people that married friends just to get a green card for them. Im sure it didnt hurt they were Irish.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Because except for my uncle, parents, and brother, I have no family, but hers is all there.
We registered it with the US Consulate in Shanghai three days after before we took our honeymoon in Bali.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,349 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)We tried bringing her here on her B2 tourist visa and do an adjustment of status (which costs $1750 dollars), but the CBP in SEATAC refused her entry because she couldn't prove she was married (even though she had our marriage cert, a certified translation, and the paperwork from the consulate in Shanghai). Then they kept calling her anti-Chinese slurs, threatened to send the US Marshals to arrest me because I "can't prove you're her husband," then booted her out.
IR1 was the only avenue we had, and the NVC just killed that.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,349 posts)I assumed she was already here.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)status, the CBP in SEATAC refused to let her in and gave no reason. Legally, they don't have to a reason and they can deny anyone entry, even American citizens, with no appeal, due process, or any actual oversight. The law gives them almost 100% authority to do anything they want.
They did the same thing to my school district's superintendent and his wife. The law is written that encourages xenophobic abuse.
Patton French
(787 posts)Im am truly sorry your family is suffering this. I hope things improve.
JCMach1
(27,582 posts)Gauntlet of paperwork, filing, waiting, etc.
My wife and I had a tribal marriage in her home country. And even though we have a US citizen child together, it took nearly well over one year to complete the process.
Unlike the OP, we stripped a layer of bureaucracy and just filed a fiance visa and were 'officially' married in the US.
I am sorry the OP has had to go though this and the problems that come up along the way.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)family here. It should be as automatic as possible.
JCMach1
(27,582 posts)When you are trying to relocate back home...
Ms. Toad
(34,119 posts)you have to document the marriage terminated before you can be married again.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,349 posts)It doesnt matter because she is not here anyway
I guess Im just so used to Irish bartenders I know overstaying their visas and getting married. I knew one guy who married his employee (manager of his bar) to get her citizenship (hes gay).
I know there is a huge double standard. And it helps to be in the country.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)We tried to do the AOS route, but they wouldn't allow her in.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,349 posts)Im so sorry. It sucks.
Especially since I know so many people from European countries and Australia that just waltzed in and overstayed.
Seems like playing it above board doesnt pay.
Ms. Toad
(34,119 posts)Marriage is marriage. Once you are married (same gender marriage quirks aside, and plural marriage quirks aside) it is recognized everywhere.
Some of the same-gender marriage quirks were really mind bending.
We ran off to Canada to elope to beat the constitutional marriage ban in Ohio (we wanted to be able to establish we were married before it became unconstitutional for purposes of an adoption petition).
First - I had to prove I was actually divorced - since I had been married before (in the US). In Ontario that requires a significant amount of time for them to verify the validity of your divorce decree. In British Columbia a certified copy was enoug. We went to British Columbia.
But before we got married, we had to reconcile ourselves to never ever getting a divorce - unless we were willing to move to do it. Since (at the time) Ohio didn't recognize our marriage, it couldn't grant a divorce. And there is no such thing as common law divorce. Even if you are married at common law - you have to be divorced in court. So one of us would have had to move to a state that recognized our marriage and establish residency in order to file for divorce. So gay marriage, before the US woke up and recognized it, was kind of a super-glue marriage.
And the final quirk is that - post Obergefell - I may be in a legal pickle. Obergefell granted recognition to all marriages valid at the time/place of their inception - from the date of their inception. My common law marriage (recognized in Ohio until 1990) dates to September 11, 1981. The requirements are (1) believe ourselves to be married, (2) hold ourselves out to be married, (3) living as spouses and (4) eligible to be married. We satisfied the first 3 as of 9/11/81. Obergefell made the 4th retroactive.
So - that may make my Canadian marriage invalid . . . because we were not single individuals at the time we eloped in Canada (because we were already married to each other - even though recognition of that marriage only came into being retroactively in 2015).
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,349 posts)
as long as no one (your partner) is alleging polygamy.
My boyfriend and I waited until it was completely legal. For now
who knows what the loons on the Supreme Court will get up to.
I have two friends who were civil unioned in Vermont, civil unioned in Illinois, flew to California and married during that short time it was legal there, and then finally married in Illinois after the Supreme Court decision.
I tease them and say they were married more times than a Republican congressman.
Ms. Toad
(34,119 posts)To be married you have to be single at the time. So if you have ever been married, to anyone, you have to provide certified copies (at a minimum) of the court termination of the prior marriage as part of the licensing process.
Civil unions are not marriages.
Your friends' legal marriage is in California, as of Obergefell (which said denial of such marriages was unconstitutional and always had been, so pre-existing marriages which were legal at their inception were recognized as of the date of inception). If your friends answered the question as to marital status accurately (under the law at the time) Illinois should not have permitted them to marry since they were already married. My guess is that they inaccurately stated that they were not married to each other. (Not suggesting anything nefarious on their part - merely that they did not understand the law when they answered teh question.)
From the Cook County, Illinois website:
Under Illinois law, only eligible persons can marry. Both partners must:
be 18 years of age or older
not be blood relatives
not already be legally married to someone else or each other
In our case - at the time we were married in Canada, our marriage was not legally recognized in Ohio - since it was before Obergefell. At the time we were married in Canada, the legal answer to the question was that we were single, since we did not satisfy the 4th element for a common law marriage. Obergefell retroactively changed the answer to the 4th element and created a common law marriage that predated the Canadian marriage. Nothing we could have done to avoid the trap (other than hope that someday there would be an Obergefell).
I know your friends are not alone. I am an attorney, and this is an area of law where I have some expertise. I counseled quite a few friends contemplating such a path against attempting to create more than one marriage. It will be a nightmare for courts to sort out - especially when folks like your friends who were legally married in CA (or other early marriage states) split without formally divorcing, then married someone else elsewhere. I won't be teaching family law at the time these cases eventually make their way through the courts, but I expect to see a family law bar exam question along the lines of your friends (and I will be preparing folks to take the bar exam until I retire).
AZSkiffyGeek
(11,126 posts)It caused him a lot of headaches when the pastor filed the new certificate not knowing they were already married.
Ms. Toad
(34,119 posts)Nothing wrong with having a church ceremony post-marriage, but that makes the church marriage purely ceremonial. The legal marriage started the week before.
DFW
(54,465 posts)My wife and I got married in the USA, and when we asked the US Embassy in Bonn (how's that for dating things?) if we needed anything from Germany, they said we needed an "Ehefähigkeitszeugnis." Don't ask me what it is called in Chinese. This is basically an official (German, in our case) government document certifying that the potential foreign spouse is indeed still single.
Bureaucracy being what it was and is, that is the one document that it took us the longest to get from the Germans, and the one document the Americans never once asked to see when we were in Washington getting married! It was like Arlo Guthrie's 40 eight by ten color glossy photographs that the blind judge was never going to look at.
electric_blue68
(14,978 posts)BlueMTexpat
(15,374 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,980 posts)International Marriage Certificate from the locality (which you did) and the translation page notarized should be enough. Literally - that's what I had to present to the Italian embassy to get my citizenship.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,980 posts)And I'm black! But he's a white male business owner from Europe.
In Italy - being an educated black American is an advantage . . . as traditionally we 'hyper' assimilate and are considered to share 'family values' with Italy. If I had been say - from Sudan, or Egypt, or ANY Eastern European Country - not so easy.
Jarqui
(10,131 posts)you get certification from the appropriate Chinese authorities or whatever other evidence you can provide to refute their wrong conclusions?
Those attorneys should be able to get specific reasons for denial and help you gather the evidence to refute them.
I do not understand this harsh process. I find it hard to believe your rights as her husband are exhausted.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)paperwork from the American consulate in Shanghai. They rejected all of it.
There is no appeal. I can start over from the beginning and spend all the money again. But I can't afford that. I've already spent more than $5000 to get her here.
Jarqui
(10,131 posts)They don't have to say?
Is this below accurate (I just quickly looked up[ trying to get my head around it)
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/free-books/fiance-marriage-visa-book/chapter15-11.html
If you are applying for adjustment of status (a green card) in the U.S. and receive a USCIS notice telling you that your application has been denied, read the notice carefully. One of the things USCIS will tell you is whether you can appeal the denial, and if so, how.
In most situations, there is no appeal after a denial. If the law allows you to appeal, you can ask USCIS's Administrative Appeals Office (AAO) to look at your case and see whether the USCIS officer wrongly denied your green card. There will be a fee and a deadline for filing the appealdon't miss it.
If you're not allowed to appeal, you can do the next best thing: file a motion to have your case reopened or reconsidered. These motions are different than an appeal because you're basically asking the same person who denied your application to change his or her mindyour case is not transferred to the AAO. A motion to reconsider is what you file when you think the officer denied you for a wrong reason. You file a motion to reopen when the situation has changed or new facts have come to light since the officer made the decision denying your green card.
In the rare case, you might need to file a separate suit in federal court challenging the denial. You would need the assistance of an attorney to determine whether that's even possible.
If you have no other legal right to be in the U.S. when the application is denied (such as a pending political asylum application or a temporary work visa), you are likely to be placed into removal proceedings in immigration court. There, you will have the opportunity to renew your green card application before an immigration judge.
Is common law marriage another angle you could try?
https://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/us-immigration/can-you-get-green-card-common-law-marriage.html
It is gut wrenching to read your account. I'm so sorry.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)We're passed the USCIS. We're at the NVC.
You can only do AOS when the immigrant is here. She wasn't allowed to enter on February 27th because CBP invented reasons to reject her entry.
So this doesn't apply to us.
Jarqui
(10,131 posts)Bettie
(16,138 posts)they should allow her as a fiancé.
I'm so sorry that you are caught up in a broken system and that no one seems to be willing to help you.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Hold you remarry and get the certificate they want? From the government entity they accept. If they think the marriage itself is fake, thats odd when you lived there. Did she have a tough time answering questions?
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)That isn't happening.
She is stuck at the NVC. She hasn't seen a consular officer yet.
treestar
(82,383 posts)of why it's the correct certificate. The NVC alone can't reject a document.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)We did, but as an immigration attorney has told us, once they reject, the chance of them accepting after rejecting is slim and that there is a well instituted anti-Chinese bias in all immigration levels.
JCMach1
(27,582 posts)NVC is anal about attestation.
treestar
(82,383 posts)it's a pain, but they are supposed to follow the law, so if they are rejecting a proper certificate, that is described in the "document finder" as a marriage certificate from China, a mandamus suit could ask the court to order them to recognize it. A bureaucrat's whim is not supposed to overrule the rule of law.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)have complete and total control with no chance at appeal.
The INA of 1952 was written to keep people out, not bring them in by making the entire process as soul destroying, cumbersowe, costly, and long as possible. Remember, it was written by two of the biggest xenophobic bigots in Congress.
The law is written that they can say deny for any reason or no reason. You can't take them to court because the law states no appeals.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Board of Immigration Appeals
alphafemale
(18,497 posts)No words.
cate94
(2,816 posts)I dont think most Americans hate Asian people. I think 30% do and it creates difficulties that are sometimes insurmountable. It has become clear in the past few years that 30% of my countrypeople are complete asswipes. Trumpist, maskholes and anti-Vacciners. 30%. Meh. Im sorry for your pain.
JustAnotherGen
(31,980 posts)For those of us married to immigrants the 45 years sucked. You have to be in that situation - to truly understand it.
I don't understand why they cannot accept an international marriage license. I mean - we both know "why" - but it is really shitty.
My husband has been a green card holder since 1973. Lived in the Bronx from 4-12 - then the family went back to Italy. He came back September 9, 2001. We were married in 2012. He crossed his fingers in October last year (hoping Biden would win), applied for citizenship and has his exam/interview October this year.
What's different between the two? We both (you and me) know what happened here. You are right.
The universe's blessings to you both. I would go be with my spouse too. There's no way I would across the pond from my Giovanni.
ShazzieB
(16,582 posts)From what AZLD4 said, they didn't accept it because they're biased against Chinese who want to come here. THEY COULD have accepted it. But they don't HAVE to, and they didn't WANT to, so they didn't.
Our immigration setup is even more fucked up than I ever realized.
DFW
(54,465 posts)My wife doesn't want to, so it's not an issue for now. But she is a German citizen who has never resided in the USA. She has been detained numerous times at US airports when entering the country, but it was always by idiot CBP guys wanting to show off, and she was always released by a supervisor an hour later, who inevitably rolled his eyes at his subordinate and apologize to my wife. I guess it helps that she is a tall blonde German. Ever since the Covid-19 restrictions, we never even go to the airport without our marriage certificate, and since we got married in Virginia, they can't very well say there's a problem with the translation.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)When she was detained, they asked so many leading question (I have the affidavit) that she would have confessed to assassinating Kennedy because they used her naivety and ignorance against her.
As soon as I saw what the did, I told her she would never enter this country alone EVER again. Let them pull their leading, loaded questions crap on her. BTW, even though she is near-fluent in English, they didn't provide her an interpreter when she didn't understand the questions asked, or the nature of the questions asked.
Then they called her nasty anti-Chinese things when they locked her in the airport with just a ratty mattress in the room (telling her that's all she deserved), took her phone from her so I didn't know where she was for three days, gave her two fifteen minute bathroom uses a day, and treated her worse than we treat inmates in prison.
Why? Because CBP has no oversight and unlimited power. Visas are just "invitations." Even with Immigrant Visas, they can deny you entry for any and all reasons, or none (like they do with your wife, exercising their power).
They've thrown me into secondary as an American citizen in Nogales at least a half dozen times because I refuse to answer personal questions like "where do you life," "what were you doing in Mexico," "How long were you there," and "when was the last time I went," among others. In my eyes, they have can ask two questions: "What's my citizenship" (that the passport proves immediately), and "are you bringing anything back." Everything else I respond with silence or "none of your business."
I'm even worse at the Border Patrol checkpoints on I-19, or just off the Tohono o'Odham Nation entering Tucson on Ajo Way. I don't even acknowledge their existence. They've always pulled me into secondary, but then I start screaming "not answering your questions is not a reason to pull me into secondary under the Supreme Court case Martinez-Fuerte. Would you like me to read it to you?" They've actually told me they don't care what the Supreme Court says. The Border Patrol is just as unaccountable and out of control as CBP and ICE (and all law enforcement for that matter).
At a House Party fundraiser, I was asked what I would do, if elected, about the Border Patrol and their abuses (because they abuse the Tohonos here too. . .profiling, destroying their private property, disrespecting their children, ignoring speed limits and traffic laws, etc). I simply said "I am running for the State House. Immigration unfortunately is a Federal Issue under Article One of the Constitution. But I believe the issues with CBP, ICE, and BP would and could be solved if we just implemented a 50 year hiring freeze." It gets very positive reactions.
Bettie
(16,138 posts)seriously our immigration policies are racist and have not adapted to the modern world. They seem stuck deep in the last century.
I'm sorry.
duhneece
(4,119 posts)at so many levels.
I wish you and yours all the best that this old world can offer.
Wingus Dingus
(8,059 posts)That is a shame.
shrike3
(3,836 posts)All the best to you and your wife, and may you enjoy whatever good things life has to offer.
keithbvadu2
(36,988 posts)How were you married? Religious or secular?
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)fill out the paperwork, pay fees, take official pictures, and get the certification within an hour.
She gives her Chinese ID, I give my passport.
She has no religion and Judaism is not one of the six recognized religions in China.
keithbvadu2
(36,988 posts)If it was religious, the right wing should be eager to support it.
Wonder if a later remarriage in this country might have made a difference?
Marriages have been conducted over the radio/telephone.
Maybe even by internet by now.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)keithbvadu2
(36,988 posts)OK. Your intro implied that marriage legitimacy was the primary factor.
"The NVC rejected my marriage certification."
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Demovictory9
(32,488 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)until 1943. It was known as the Chinese Exclusion Act. I do not believe, from my memory, any other nationality was outright denied entry into the US due to that under law.
Our immigration system enables bigotry, selectivity, and xenophobia.
Liberty Belle
(9,538 posts)Might it be easier to get the marriage recognized then?
I applaud you though for being willing to move to stay with your wife - you obviously really love her and she is fortunate to have you as her husband.
One last thought -- you might try writing directly to President Biden and see if there is any way he can intervene. Obama used to have an intern choose a few letters each week to have the President read - maybe Biden does the same? Especially you are a Dem who was running for office, perhaps there is something the President could do - and he should at least know that US officials were calling your wife racial slurs and fire them.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)It has nothing to do with the marriage. It's her nationality, as I have been told there is an ingrained Anti-Chinese attitude in our immigration enforcers because of Cold War attitudes. Evil commies and things like that. "Speak Chinese, spread disease."
但是,我可以中文。 所以,我也是 Typhoid Mary.
Politicub
(12,165 posts)I dont blame you for leaving the U.S. to be with your wife.
tarheelsunc
(2,117 posts)My wife is also from China and we started the process after getting married in 2012 and it took almost exactly two years from start to finish for her to get the visa. We never got outright denied, but we had to submit extra paperwork on top of what was required at multiple stages and it was impossible to get any sort of status update.
We got married in Hong Kong as opposed to mainland China and I am sure that helped a lot, but I'm not sure if that's something that would be an option for you or not. It seems really difficult to even get a visa to go to China at the moment due to COVID.
Hopefully everything works out for you two.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)It's good until August 2022. All I need to do to renew it is pay a fee, fill out a form, take two photographs, have my wife answer a few questions, and submit my passport.
Easy, streamlined process.
Irish_Dem
(47,583 posts)Or will you have to live in Thailand?
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Irish_Dem
(47,583 posts)Unbelievable what is happening to you.
I wish you and your wife the best.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Here in "the land of the free," she was denied entry. She was kicked out Her documents were rejected.
Irish_Dem
(47,583 posts)LudwigPastorius
(9,210 posts)Good luck.
LymphocyteLover
(5,662 posts)in research.
So sick they way they've been demonized especially lately.
Pinback
(12,173 posts)You are absolutely doing the right thing, and I would do the same without hesitation. I wish you all the best for a bright future with your wife in happier times to come.
Jakes Progress
(11,123 posts)He can stop sending me emails for money.
DFW
(54,465 posts)I know him and Gabby, and this is not at all what he's like.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)His "constituent services" person does nothing. If you ask to speak to the Senator, you get "we'll pass the message along."
DFW
(54,465 posts)I rarely use them, as you dont abuse that kind of thing. And: it may not get you any farther than you are now, but if you want me to ask, you wouldnt be any worse off, either.
OrangeJoe
(351 posts)Talking to staff is standard operating procedure. There really are just too many constituents in most states for the member to take an active roll in the case. However, having said that cases do get bumped up the ladder if it gets into the press, the constituent is a big donor, a friend of the member or a public figure. Since the author of this piece seems to be running for a Congressional seat I'm surprised his campaign manager or finance committee chair hasn't reached out to the Senator's office and got the ball rolling. If it were me I'd take a meeting with the Senator's State Director and try to break the logjam. All this advice is based on my 6 years of being the state Director for a Senator.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)My Campaign Manager has reached out, only to get platitudes and close shoulders. My finance manager has as well.
But since I am a teacher by trade, it is very difficult to have people contact me, which is why my CM and FM are.
OrangeJoe
(351 posts)Well that doesn't give you as much horsepower as a Congressional candidate (not that it should matter I'm just telling you how things operate). I'd still recommend a meeting with the State Director, especially if you can bring in a state rep or 2. Good luck. While I don't know the whole story it certainly looks like you are getting hosed by INS and the runaround from your representatives.
DFW
(54,465 posts)I thought I recognized the name of Marks man on the case and finally asked. Sure enough, it was a guy I had talked to after Gabby was shot. He even served a term in Gabbys congressional seat. Same guy. Hell oversee this project, and keep both Mark and me in the loop. There are no guarantees, but this is no longer going to get buried in some pile of papers on some staffers desk, or in some bureaucrats file boxes.
If Vitamin C is the last resort, I think this is a legitimate case in which to make use of it.
Deep State Witch
(10,470 posts)I expect better of him. Sinema, not so much. She's a Republican in a Dem wig.
DFW
(54,465 posts)I checked with Mark Kelly. He had no idea about any of this. His staff were responsible for keeping it from him. He is now aware of the situation, and it is no longer being ignored. You can rescind your disappointment for now. Mark is perfectly willing to look into this. That's all I can say for now, as it is now in his/their hands.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)With that, I had a Kelly case worker blow me off in March when CBP as SEATAC abused her when she tried to enter the country to do an AOS. My expectations are really low right now, even after I was contacted by his S. Arizona leader.
After Raul has hanged up on me, Sinema said nothing but platitudes, and Kelly blowing me off, I expect little. I hope, with all my heart, I am completely wrong and Kelly does this for me. I will restart my campaign for AZ House, and I will work tirelessly for Mark Kelly with every fibre of my being.
Please help me, Mr. Kelly. 15 month separation is too long, as your subordinate told me on the phone.
onecaliberal
(32,949 posts)This country is the true original shithole.
marble falls
(57,405 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Tucson media is notoriously lazy and right wing. I've gone to them repeatedly and they never replied to me. The Arizona Daily Star didn't even publish my LOTE online when I wrote it.
Done these things already once.
Hekate
(90,927 posts)Just understand that. If you want to continue with DU, theres nothing stopping you we have many expats who post at DU, & youll be in good company.
All the best to you and your wife in the difficult days ahead. You will find your home.
Tadpole Raisin
(972 posts)Every Chinese person I have ever interacted with in my job and life has been kind, personable, and generous to a fault.
I do not understand this but I guess I shouldnt be surprised. My heart aches that people can and continue to be so cruel.
I wish you and your wife the best!
summer_in_TX
(2,766 posts)The least I'd expect from our government would be allowing those validly married to an American citizen to be able to get a green card. That should be part of immigration law, except for very unusual circumstances.
Best to you and your wife and blessings over you through very difficult times.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)They have two types of these visa.
CR1 which is given if the marriage is less than two years and gets more attention because of possible "green card spouse."
Ours is an IR1. If we were "green card spouses," she would have demanded to do this immediately. We only started to do this after I had to come back last year (in our 6th year of marriage) because of COVID19 restrictions in China and my mother's stroke.
summer_in_TX
(2,766 posts)I am sorry.
keithbvadu2
(36,988 posts)The Trump admin did not seem to practice bias against the Chinese when Jared Kushner's family was selling visas for family investments.
LeftInTX
(25,677 posts)They faked their deaths to get married in Mexico.
This was in 1925
They were Armenian refugees. My great grandfather came in 1910 by himself. Meanwhile, the US set quotas. My great grandmother tried to come in 1923, but was deported from Ellis Island. They had no marriage documentation because all records were destroyed. They cooked up a scheme to tell Mexican authorities that they were both widowed. It worked for them, but that was almost 100 years ago. In real life, they had been married since 1902.
Hobo
(757 posts)Same thing happened to me..... And because of it I am now single. They deserved to be in the ninth level of hell.
Hobo
relayerbob
(6,561 posts)They've made such a mess of it all.
MLAA
(17,348 posts)I lived four years in Shanghai and met nothing but wonderful people and made friendships. It was a wonderful experience.
I wish you and your wife the very, very best and I am so sorry. It is clearly our countrys loss not to have your wife here.
electric_blue68
(14,978 posts)I've had Chinese friends and acquaintances for decides (not right now) that started in my teens.
I live in NYC so we have actually kind of have 3 Chinatowns now. The original very old one in lower Manhattan, one deep in Brooklyn, and the "newest" one in Flushing, Queens tgat people have been hearing about mostly Chinese and some other Asians.
This is a very unreasonable, and sad situation.
I wish you and your wife safety, health and to flourish where you end up!
usedtobedemgurl
(1,150 posts)I am so sorry this happened to you.
You are right about the CCP and not saying "China." I have disabilities. I found work in teaching ESL to Chinese students. Now, the CCP has changed regulations, and I will not be able to make a living doing that any more. I am sad, but I have never blamed "China." I understand who is behind the regulations.
Through my job, I've had the opportunity to meet many fine people. We connected on WeChat. I am hoping these will be lifelong friendships. I am sad at what was done to you. I wish you and yours the very best. Ignore the haters. May you have much luck and happiness in your future.
Willis88
(109 posts)Be addressed immediately.
Even here on DU, there was a shocking display of racism against Chinese Americans. And she is an American under the law. As we seen with racism in this country, the law isnt always equally applied and we are seeing this injustice today.
I hope with time Biden can rid this racism within the government and your wife may be able to reapply in the future. I think its very important we keep our elected leaders accountable to do whats right and not just give them a pass because they are Dems and not TFG.
For a parallel, Im still deeply disappointed with the abandonment of the Afghan interpreters and SIV holders who served along our troops for years, risking their lives and the lives of their families. We abandoned the majority of them to the Taliban even though promises were made. Im hoping the veteran community that has served with the interprets can be their voice in correcting this wrong. Not sure what can be done at this point, but this history must not be forgotten.
Nothing will change unless we demand better and remember these miscarriages of our values.
I know you mentioned that your tried writing to Congress but received little help. Are there any media organizations that would pick this up as an example of anti-Asian discrimination. Maybe also write a letter to President Biden telling your story?
Im hoping that things work out in the long run. Youre a good man and faithful to your wife
halfulglas
(1,654 posts)For our grandparents or great-grandparents. I have had siblings and cousins say about immigrants, Yeah, but grandma or greatgrandad came the "right way." What they should have said was they were white when we welcomed their labor. Often the right way was getting off a boat and being healthy. Or after WWII they married a GI. Now they self righteously want to shut the door. If we still believe we are a welcoming country, we should especially live that belief when it comes to people married to citizens..
moonscape
(4,674 posts)PhD in economics, worked closely with Americans during the war, and still had to be in a certain category for preference to emigrate. He came as an agricultural worker and head to take an exam. Many other family members, white European, couldnt come in and ended up in South America. Of course the numbers wanting to come at the and of the war was huge, but in my extended family it was hardly a slam-dunk.
OnDoutside
(19,982 posts)Where do you go from here ? It's bizarre that the wife of an American can be excluded from the US like this.
DFW
(54,465 posts)The Germans STILL put me through the wringer, even though granting me residence entitled them to soak me for over half my income in taxes the second the permit was valid.. The only thing they let up on was the language requirement, since they didn't even know that I wasn't German until I showed them my passport.
OnDoutside
(19,982 posts)DFW
(54,465 posts)They are trained to deal with people who speak no German and arrive asking for everything. I arrived speaking fluent German and asking for nothing. Well, at least I got what I asked for. No health insurance, no pension, though I was asked to pay a yearly six figure income tax bill, a good part of which I get hit for double, due to holes in the Germany-USA double taxation treaty.
The last thing they expected was someone from the USA who just wanted to spend more time with his German wife, with a steady job, speaking fluent German, and not with his hand out. I didnt fit any of their pre-conceived models of what to expect, and it threw them for a loop. If there is one thing EU bureaucrats are NOT known for its flexibility in their thinking.
OnDoutside
(19,982 posts)Ace Rothstein
(3,195 posts)I'm so sorry. Sounds like the process is broken for something so important.
Elessar Zappa
(14,106 posts)in this thread are sympathetic to the OP. I know I certainly am.
Ace Rothstein
(3,195 posts)Just all the cumulative info he provided.
Elessar Zappa
(14,106 posts)This countrys immigration system is fucked up.
DFW
(54,465 posts)My brother's wife is from Japan, and it took them some serious overcoming of bureaucracy to permit her to live with him in the USA. Not only did they have to get married, but because of his top security clearance, she had to renounce her Japanese citizenship and become American. Their sons have dual citizenship with Japan, even though their mother no longer has a Japanese passport. The main obstacle is to be permitted to live where you want. My brother's wife would have been OK staying in Japan, but preferred to come to the USA because in Japan in 1981, a female bank teller had zero prospects of getting a better job in a Japanese bank. Within 10 years of coming to the USA, my sister-in-law was vice-director of the World Bank in Washington (for Asia, of course). But the initlal process of getting her in with a residence permit wasn't easy, even back then.
These days, it seems the whole process is like a car tire trying to navigate a street full of nails and thumb tacks.
honest.abe
(8,688 posts)My wife is not Chinese but is from Asia. We had some issues getting AOS (Adjustment of Status) after she arrived here on Green Card. They initially rejected our submission indicating we didnt provide enough information to verify our marriage was legit. I was shocked as I had sent them a large stack of information. I did all the paperwork myself with no immigration lawyer. Perhaps that was a mistake. Anyway I search online and most recommendations were to send them as much information as possible and overwhelm them with paper. So I sent them a massive resubmission with photos, travel docs, emails, letters, birthday cards, etc. I also contacted my congressman who is Steny Hoyer. He has a specific person on staff who handles immigration issues. I explained to her the situation and emailed them copies of some of the information I sent. Within a week after that we were approved. Not sure specifically what made it happen but I do believe Hoyer's staffer helped.
Good luck on however things turn out for you.
OrangeJoe
(351 posts)Every member, at least on the West Coast has a staffer who does immigration. They also have a veteran's person. What you have described is the way it worked in our office and the way it should work in other offices. Sounds to me like Kelly's staff is not up to snuff.
Joinfortmill
(14,487 posts)Escurumbele
(3,407 posts)but then comes a Democratic president who reverses some of the ugly stuff republicans left behind and you and your wife will be able to get things through.
I am sure the new administration will make things right.
former9thward
(32,111 posts)And if you read the OP his Senators and Representative, all Democrats, are unsympathetic.
eppur_se_muova
(36,309 posts)I remember McCarran from old Pogo strips where he was parodied as the Hon. Mole McCaroney, aka Molester Mole, one of the founders of the Audible Boy Bird Watchers Society and, later, the Jack Acid Society. I searched Wiki for the McCarran Act and found his name associated with three really horrible bills!
The Act was superseded in 1965:
No person shall receive any preference or priority or be discriminated against in the issuance of an immigrant visa because of the person's race, sex, nationality, place of birth, or place of residence.
But apparently TFG did some serious meddling with Immigration (DUH) which has not yet been cleared up by the courts. Still reading up on that. (e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_v._Hawaii)
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)They can deny for any reason and no reason. You don't think personal bias enters into the equation.
Prove the bias. Racial profiling is illegal in this country, but law enforcement does it with impunity. Why? Because there is no oversight.
eppur_se_muova
(36,309 posts)Ur-racist Steven Miller didn't want to admit even friendly Afghanis, and Steve Bannon engineered a Muslim immigration ban. They're not the type to shy away from traditional China-bashing for anything.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)It's why my wife say she is taking a trump when she needed to defecate.
ismnotwasm
(42,022 posts)I do not hate your wife. I suspect she is a marvelous, loving person. I hope you find resolution. Immigration policies are not only fucked up, but self destructive
Treefrog
(4,170 posts)Very sorry to hear that has happened.
Willis88
(109 posts)KT2000
(20,597 posts)Since SeaTac is involved, we have Senator Patty Murray who is quite senior.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,829 posts)Mr. Evil
(2,861 posts)One final push.
Make videos explaining your situation and put them everywhere (Tik Tok, Twitter, YouTube, etc.). Contact all news entities to gauge if they might consider running a segment on your dilemma (Laurence O'Donnell comes to mind). Contact other states Reps. and Senators who might be more empathetic and sympathetic that may be able to influence your Reps. and Senators.
Don't throw in the towel just yet. Stir the shitstorm! Shame them for being indifferent and keeping a family separated.
You would think in this day and technological age that a simple official global marriage database could be set up by governments (or maybe the UN) to acknowledge your and everyone else's marriage. As soon as your marriage certificate is filed, you're in the database. Immigration checks, you're officially recognized as married, end of questioning.
Never say die! (you could register as a lobbyist and shovel truckloads of money at your reps and then they'll probably give you more attention)
I wish you and your wife well and that I had more to offer.
LittleGirl
(8,292 posts)And Ive been following your campaign since you announced it. Im so sorry for the mess youre in. I too, would leave the country and never come back if they refused to admit my spouse. I guess were lucky since he became a citizen in 12.
All the best to you. You may miss America but apparently, they wont miss you so, fuck em.
Like my dying mother says, Go Live your life. Be happy and take care of each other. Thats all that matters! Go east young man.
JuJuChen
(2,216 posts)on a student Visa and took my citizenship, I'm Chinese born in Malaysia. I, too experience the hatred and looks and general of people who think I should "go back home" when I'm more successful than they are. Amazing to still love this country yet depressing to be condemned for not looking like the mold of what someone thinks a melting pot should look like.
PatrickforB
(14,602 posts)There is no place for any racism in ICE, or on this site. And this thing with anti-Chinese slurs because Trump came out with that awful initial slur in attempt to shift the blame for the terrible cost of COVID 19 from his own ineptitude and incompetence to China is terrible. Oh, racism against any non-white people is as 'American as apple pie,' but it should not be. We cannot allow it to continue.
Ilsa
(61,709 posts)I'm really sorry your wife has been treated so poorly, and that you need to leave.
Johonny
(20,927 posts)Anti-Chinese feeling in immigration are real. I won't elaborate on my own families dealings, but they weren't fun.