I honestly have some problem with what Milley did as a precedent

[dsc]

I absolutely, 100%, understand why he did it. I 100% get that it likely was helpful. But, what if he, or his successor decides that withdrawing troops from our next forever war can't be done? Or what if the next time the general feels we should attack China and decides to do so? The civilians control the military here not the other way around. Milley should resign.

[question everything]

1. Except, no one in that administration followed any acceptable, normal, whatever you call it

So in a state of full chaos, one can understand the need to be the last man (or woman) standing

For Marco Rubio or others, who are still defending Whinny Donny and the Jan 6 terrorists and their own shameful reaction to point this behavior is really "calling the kettle" etc.

[Hoyt]

2. Alexander Vindman said something similar on CNN. Personally, I'm glad Milley did something.

But as Vindman said, going to China and potentially tipping them off the the madman-in-chief might bomb them, could have set off retaliation.

Again, I'm glad to see that Milley and others did not sit back and let the madman potentially start a war or gawd knows what else. But, there are some disturbing aspects of what transpired.

Would not want Milley, or others, to be charged or face any repercussions. Give him credit for doing what he thought best in a situation I hope we never experience again.

[Hoyt]

3. Sorry, double post.

[avebury]

4. I respectfully disagree. What he did was remind Senior Command

about process and procedure to make sure that Trump did not stomp all over that to start a war.

[Ponietz]

5. Not until Wray does

Civilian control of the military without constraints of effective law enforcement on those very civilians is meaningless.

I agree with you, in principle, but honestly, without law enforcement, and with a sociopathic presidency I’d prefer the military in control.

Criticizing Milley here seems similar to focusing on the crime of jaywalking when the person was running from a violent assault. Necessity and duress under the circumstances fully justify his actions.

[arlyellowdog]

6. He can resign and be a hero

He should say what he did was wrong and should never happen again, etc. We are all grateful he did what he did.

[dsc]

7. that would be fine

heck the medal of freedom would be great too.

[joetheman]

16. YES!!

[Saboburns]

8. Milley should get another star.

All enemies, foreign and the Republican domestic ones.

The Treason was done by Trump, attempting to overthrow our elected Government.

Give Milley another star.

[viva la]

9. Sometimes we tend to get all fundamentalist with the Constitution...

Seriously, if the Constitution truly allows a president to destroy the planet with a nuclear war simply because he's pissed that he lost an election, the Constitution can no longer be the ultimate rule.

The Founders never envisioned a weapon that could destroy millions in a few bombs. They would NEVER have given a president that much power if they knew the future technology. They were against kingly power, not for it. They just couldn't, in 1783, envision today-- and a president like Trump, who really would order a bomb raid just because he's pissed off. That is the LAST thing they wanted-- the caprice of a crazy monarch, as that was (George III) exactly what they were rebelling against.

Milley represents common sense. I really don't think Jefferson and Madison and the rest would value imperial power over common sense.

This is not a Michael Flynn type of general, who would disobey orders like "trans members of the military allowed". This was a thoughtful man saying, "We can't let a crazy president start a war with China or shoot off a nuke just because he's butthurt."

If he's setting a precedent, it's a good one-- leaders with common sense have to rein in the crazy president.

I do wish he'd have gone to "The Gang of Eight" (congress and Senate) with his concerns. That would have reinforced "civilian control", emphasized that "civilian control" does not mean the whim of one evil man, and perhaps given some Kevin McCarthy type a moment of disquiet that would lead him to vote for impeachment.

[H2O Man]

10. Respectfully disagree.

This isn't a "precedent," to start with.

Moreover, Defense Secretary James Schlesinger recalled years later that in the final days of the Nixon presidency he had issued an unprecedented set of orders: If the president gave any nuclear launch order, military commanders should check with either him or Secretary of State Henry Kissinger before executing them. Schlesinger feared that the president, who seemed depressed and was drinking heavily, might order Armageddon. Nixon himself had stoked official fears during a meeting with congressmen during which he reportedly said, “I can go in my office and pick up a telephone, and in 25 minutes, millions of people will be dead.” Senator Alan Cranston had phoned Schlesinger, warning about “the need for keeping a berserk president from plunging us into a holocaust.”

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/08/11/donald-trump-nuclear-weapons-richard-nixon-215478/

[Jim__]

11. Trump did extremely serious damage to our democracy.

Some of the damage he did has been exposed by Milley's actions. But, Trump also exposed some weaknesses in our democracy. We now know that a determined president can ignore the law and ignore almost all political procedures and do as he pleases, up to and including launching nuclear weapons in an unprovoked attack against any country in the world.

We need to make some serious changes to our governmental procedures. We have to try to address the fact that the military has the power to override civilian control. We need to address what Milley did; but that need is far down on my list of things we need to do.

[Ohio Joe]

12. I do not agree...

What Milley did was speak to his counterpart (something I would expect is done with friend or potential foe) and assure them policy had not changed and we would not perform an unprovoked first strike. If that fuckin guy ordered an unprovoked first strike anywhere, I would expect it to be declared an illegal order and the order not executed. The scenarios you describe would be for the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to take direct action in contradiction (or without authorization) on his own. Two very different things as far as I can tell.

[Walleye]

14. Exactly. Plus the whole world pretty much knew our president had lost his mind. That's pretty scary

[brush]

13. trump was and is still unstable. Milley did the right thing.

[CrackityJones75]

15. Your scenarios are not congruent.

Milley was doing his job notifying his counterparts that protocols in place would be followed.

[greatauntoftriplets]

17. And Wesley Clark, also on CNN, said the opposite.

Clark described Vindman as being naive about how contacts between military commanders of different countries interact with each other, especially during perilous times.

[Sanity Claws]

18. It happened under Nixon too

So Miley did not set precedent. He folllowed it.

[XanaDUer2]

19. Milley is a hero to me

he may have saved our asses.

[PortTack]

32. Totally!!

[Tetrachloride]

20. I vehemently resent any suggestion that General Milley should resign,

while Trump, Flynn , McCarthy , Cruz walk free.

The insurrection is ongoing. Milley knows a lot more than what is known.

[gab13by13]

26. More accurate reporting is surfacing,

Milley is a hero.

[WarGamer]

21. I was afraid to speak up for fear of the Hide Police...

I think it sets a shitty precedent (or shitty continuation of a former shitty precedent).

I mean... a General reassuring the enemy (or adversary) that we won't attack and promising to tip them off if ordered to attack???

Can you imagine Patton reassuring von Runstedt that the transition between FDR and Truman would be seamless and he'd let him know if there were any changes???

This is what DIPLOMATS do... NOT Generals.

[gab13by13]

27. It's also a shitty precedent

to watch someone destroy our democracy. Milley is a hero.

[Raine]

34. Agree nt

[Jarqui]

22. I heartily disagree

The real disgrace and betrayal was of so many in Trump's cabinet and party who did nothing during his term when he broke laws, attempted various coups, etc. Members of the Republican party in 1973-74 stepped up to stop Nixon. Faced with worse circumstances, the Republican party of 2016-21 enabled Trump and/or looked the other way.

Milley upheld his oath to the Constitution: "I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same"
Milley did not counter a lawful, direct order by Trump. He tried to make sure a potentially unlawful order (never given) by an unhinged man didn't start WW3.

If Trump's cabinet had 1/100th the conscience and commitment to do their sworn duty, it would never have come to Milley.

If there is any flaw, it is in the laws that Milley had to negotiate and the failure of Trump's cabinet and party to do their duty.

Even if Milley was wrong - and I do not feel for a second he was, he was clearly loyal and doing what he selflessly thought was best for the safety of the country. The traitors who stormed the capitol, let Russians meddle with an election and tried to undermine the integrity of 2020 election need to be held to account long before any discussion of what Gen Milley did. Hypocrite traitors should have no say in this matter with Milley.

[doc03]

24. Since Trump was obviously insane I think he did the right

thing. His job is to protect and defend the Constitution of the US from forighn and domestic enemies. Since nobody
would do their duty and protect us by invoking the 25th Amendment thank God he was there and not Flynn. He should receive a commendation for it. It is the military's obligation to refuse an unlawful order.

[gab13by13]

25. More accurate reporting is surfacing

about what General Milley did. Milley is a hero, early reports about his actions were, to be nice, misleading.

[11 Bravo]

28. General Milley and I swore the same oath, and although he is slightly senior to ...

the highest rank I attained (about 22 grades, I believe) it applied equally to both of us.
That means ALL enemies, foreign AND domestic.

BZ, Sir.

[Crunchy Frog]

29. He did what had to be done. If/when the Rs take over, they will do whatever the fuck they want.

Precedent will have absolutely no meaning. Milley helped to at least delay that scenario. If he resigned it would be taken as a sign of weakness by our enemies, and would embolden them even further than they already are.

[doc03]

30. Didn't Milley also stop Trump from deploying the

military against civilians in the BLM protests? Thank God we have him.

[LiberalFighter]

31. I can understand that if there wasn't an election campaign.

But this was after the idiot lost and Milley was seeing him go off his rockers.

[haele]

33. Former military here -

What he did may have been from an honorable motive, but it's in a really dark grey area when it comes to what is correct under the Constitution and the UCMJ.
It's a real slippery slope, could set a precedent for someone with a less honorable mindset - like Flynn.
The honorable thing would be for him to tender his resignation. I understand he is up for rotation out next year, but he really should get ahead of the controversy and take the consequences for his actions.
Because a GOP house or Senate will drag his name through the mud and try to send him to Leavenworth. He needs to remember his rank won't protect him if politics gets involved.


Haele