'That's terrifying': Anderson Cooper shaken after hearing Harvard scholars' 'dark' predictions on US

[CousinIT]

https://www.rawstory.com/how-democracies-die/

CNN host Anderson Cooper was left shaken on Tuesday after two Harvard scholars explained how the Republican Party has radicalized itself against democracy.

Political scientists Steven Levitsky and Daniel Ziblatt, authors of the bestselling book How Democracies Die, appeared on Cooper's program to explain how their studies of democratic failures bode ill tidings for the future of the American republic.

"It is pretty dark," said Levitsky. "When we wrote How Democracies Die four years ago, we were worried about the Republican Party because they allowed Donald Trump to be elected. They sort of dropped the ball and failed to protect our democracy from an authoritarian demagogue. But we did not expect that the entire Republican Party would evolve into an anti-democratic force, and that's where they are today."

Ziblatt, meanwhile, compared past instances in which democracies in European countries survived anti-democratic insurgencies, but he said that stopping those insurgencies depended on members of establishment parties standing firmly against them.

The Harvard scholar did not think that today's Republican Party is currently up to the task.

"Looking where we are compared to other countries, it's not looking very promising," he said.

[Rollo]

1. Exactly.

There is a very thin shield between a functioning democracy and what Trump represents: an overthrow like what happened in Germany in the 1930's.

[LiberalLovinLug]

43. Its great that some in the media say "that's terrifying"

But it's still not shrill enough. From the MSM and from Democrats themselves.

Fascism will suddenly be here, and there will be nothing we can do. It is being slowly normalized. I mean, an insurrection takes place, with evidence of pre-planning from the former President and his aids, and one of the major parties not only does not participate in an inquiry, but actively tries to sabotage it and demean it, and even more, deify the rioters as "patriots". And this is now normal. Most Republican voters think the election was stolen. This is now normal.

[NoMoreRepugs]

2. ..."it's not looking very promising" may be the understatement

of the Millennium.

[SoCalDavidS]

3. I Want To Leave, But My Parents Are Still Alive

I'm 55, and I think any opportunity to do so, is fading. I'm destined to be a grumpy old man, going day to day generally unhappy, and pissed off at people.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

7. As a fellow grumpy CA guy who's 55 within the next month ...

Who's mom and stepdad are (thankfully) still alive and kicking ... I feel you brother.

And I'm here for ya

Honestly though if things devolved too much, they have the resources to get us the three out of this country, and they just might. Mom's mom was born in Canada so she and him could probably just go, and then sponsor me after a time (I think is how it works).

Mom's talked about it ... she's pretty scared about the anti-democracy developments herself.

[Grasswire2]

15. Did Mom's mom give up her Canadian citizenship?

Because the law in Canada in 2009 was changed to allow the first generation born outside Canada to claim citizenship, as long as that parent did not renounce citizenship by naturalization somewhere else.

I am in the process of claiming Canadian citizenship, dual to my US status. My father was born in Canada, and lived in US on a green card all his adult life.

It takes a fair amount of time to process. It has been ten months since Canada received my application, so far.

[dflprincess]

19. It's probably taking so long

because they're overwhelmed with Americans making an application for citizenship.

I only wish I had that option.

[Grasswire2]

20. In January, when they received the application, the wait time was stated to be five months.

Which means that it should have been completed by early July.

Now the wait time is stated on the site to be 19 months. But logical reason should mean that those whose wait time was five months in January should have been finished long ago. Long ago.

This is not an application for citizenship. I am already lawfully a citizen by birthright.

It's a certificate of that citizenship.

And yes, I feel very fortunate. My father left me something.

I don't ever expect to use it, except maybe for a Canadian passport.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

24. I don't think she gave it up, no ... but I'm not positive

She never 'had a job', in the traditional sense, that I'm aware of. She was a painter and mosaic artist and 'sold stuff', but never had a job per se.

[jstephenj]

47. How do I immigrate to Canada?

I'm in my 40's and have a sizeable nest egg built up and I'm trying to persuade my mother into looking into the idea of moving as well.

[Grasswire2]

74. are you talking about becoming a citizen of Canada?

Here is the link for application.

It's a lengthy process and you probably could use some advice from an immigration lawyer.

[link:https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadian-citizenship/become-canadian-citizen/apply.html|


I wonder if USA residents can be considered refugees by Canada.

[wnylib]

48. Damn, wish I had a Canadian parent

or at least a Canadian friend who would allow me to come for an extended, indefinite visit.

I have this book and read it a few years ago when TFG was in office. The warning signs were there then. They have only grown worse since then.

[leighbythesea2]

26. Trying for dual

Citizenship myself. Ireland, bc of a grandparent. Just starting the process.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

28. Well then ...

ádh mór!

[ShazzieB]

33. I've been thinking about applying for dual citizenship, too.

My father was born in England. From what I've been able to find out, I should be eligible for dual citizenship in the UK. Haven't taken any action yet, but I've thought about it a lot.

[leighbythesea2]

49. I found out

In July--the option! I was so excited. It's actually my great grandmother who qualifies it.
The UK would be nice!
Good for you.
Not sure what to expect of the process, fingers crossed.

[wnylib]

50. A great-grandparent makes you eligible

for citizenship in the UK? Those are pretty generous standards.

My British ancestry goes back much too far to qualify.

The most recent European ancestry that I have is grandparents from Germany. I haven't checked, but as far as I know, that would not qualify me for dual citizenship in Germany and the US.

[leighbythesea2]

53. In Ireland...

A great-grandparent makes you elible, apparently. Mind you I am just inquiring with a firm now, and dont have details. But they said, yes that it is possible.

[wnylib]

59. Well, congratulations on your good fortune.

My best option for leaving the country would be looking into Canada.

[leighbythesea2]

67. Im very interested in Canada!

Best possibility for work.
My half sister is the one who figured out the potential for Ireland. But i know it's going to cost a little even for the consultation to learn the details--I've got to try. Too tantalizing.

But I was quite keen on Canada too. If you do find yourself seriously pursuing, let me know what you find out/how it goes?

I started my path as a retirement plan--a ways out (but that was in 2019, now its 2021, with no ability to travel during covid to check things out first hand--feel like it's speeding along!).
So I'm committed and love any/all info.
Am looking at Panama too. Going to try a relocation tour for that.

[wnylib]

68. I'm retired, so finances

are a possible obstacle for me. I have a pension and some savings, plus Social Security. I could probably still have SS if I didn't give up up citizenship. Getting work in Canada would not be easy at my age.

But, I am reasonably fluent in Spanish and have some experience teaching English language learners, so I might be able to get work teaching in a Latin American country.

Canada is preferable to me because of the language and the cultural similarity. Less adaptation necessary and I live near the Canadian border, have been there many times.

[wnylib]

69. PS.

The only thing I know now about emigration to Canada is that they have income requirements, which most countries do in order to avoid taking in people who would be burden to society. Like any nation, they want productive residents. I need to get more information on costs of living in various locations and tax laws for foreign residents, in addition to their immigration laws.

[leighbythesea2]

70. I envy your 2nd language

My bucket list includes learn 2nd language, "preferably Spanish" and live in a foreign country. Which logically means a spanish speaking country. So central american is on the list.

And yes, Canada proximity and similar culture is appealing.

Teaching would be nice right?

Just finished my masters and hope that opens foreign work possibilities more, adds colleges...

[wnylib]

71. Spanish was my major for a BA degree.

I do not have a masters, but took several graduate courses on teaching English to English language learners.

Depending on your field of study, a masters degree should be an asset in getting employment outside the country.

[BigmanPigman]

16. My sister was able to get Italian American citizenship for

herself, her daughter and me since we meet the requirements. If it comes down to it, we may be living in Italy in 2024. Ciao USA!

[not fooled]

31. France is where I'm going to try

for residency, next Spring, after I finish landscaping and painting my house to get it ready for sale.

Anyone who's emigrated to France, please share any tips.

There are other desirable places in the world to move to but most have much more stringent requirements. Based on my research, I meet the requirements for obtaining residency in France and for what my US house will sell for, I can buy something decent in Normandy or the Loire Valley.

I was hopeful after the 2020 election, but now have had it.

[wnylib]

60. What is it about France that makes it less

stringent than other countries?

[not fooled]

73. income and assets

Last I checked, you need to document under 1,300 euro income per month, which depending on exchange rate works out to roughly around 20,000 USD per year. Of course if you are retired you need more to live comfortably, it's just that apparently you can meet residency requirements for that amount. You also need 12 months' worth as a reserve.

Contrast France with Ireland, for example, which requires 50,000 euro/year (again, last I checked) and they issue residency only a year at a time for retirees. They really don't want Americans with no family ties moving there to retire.

I think Germany is similar in not requiring high income but land and houses are more expensive. Hence France.

[link:https://thegoodlifefrance.com/how-much-income-do-i-need-to-live-in-france/|]

The link above is geared towards Brits post-Brexit but states the required income.

I'm no expert on these matters and will find out more once I start the application process, but the above information seems reliable so I'm going for it.

[PortTack]

4. The democrats stand firmly in the way of this..there are way more of us than there of them

Worried yes..willing to give in or give up...never!

[onecaliberal]

6. Being in the way has not stopped their progress one iota.

[certainot]

36. their 'progress' depends on dem/progs/media continuing the incredible stupidity of ignoring

the rw radio monopoly, the only reason bush or trump got anywhere near the white house

so these harvard authors probably have no clue that at $1000/hr, 1200 coordinated radio stations doing 15 hrs/day have been worth $90M/week or about $5B pr year for thirty fucking years! FREE for the authoritarian republicans. and now king dittohead, the guy who led those stations is dead, and a lot of this current rw hysteria is because they lost their head, the guy who pulled their authoritarian winkie for them every day and told them what to think and what to say to their friends family and coworkers when itt came to interpreting political events.

i will bet anything those harvard authors have no clue how big a part talk radio has had in this shit, like rachel maddow telling us for two nights about giuliani and facebook and dominion, without knowing or mentioning that the giuliani/powell press conference nov 19 was timed to start with the limbaugh show that day, that limbaugh clearly already knew what they were going to say - lying nonstop right along with them while they were doing the conference.

the constant media 'analysis' criticizing dems for lack of messaging vs 1500 free unchallenged coordinated radio stations is truly idiotic.

and lawrence odonnell has on a florida ed official getting threatened and harrassed by dumbfuck trumpers that probably base a lot of their 'outrage' on the emanations from rw radio stations that depend on 5 major fla universities (FLORIDA 20 Florida 10, Florida St. 4 Miami 2, South Florida 2, Central Florida 2) to keep supporting 20 xlimbaugh stations with sports programming.

[monkeyman1]

12. AGREED 100% - R N C- 28% -DEMS- 74% !

all depends what jacked up poll ya pay attention too ! give up - ya rite !

[UTUSN]

5. K&R

[Boomerproud]

8. This is not the country I was born in or grew up in.

I don't recognize it anymore.

[Hekate]

22. Also a Boomer, and also yes. This is not what we were supposed to be, at all.

I’m grateful to be in a beautiful place, and hope to survive the fire seasons as they cycle on.

As for leaving, we are not only too old for Canada to be interested in us, but our adult children do not see the situation as we do, and I’m not leaving them behind…

[calimary]

27. Me, too. And I do not recognize this America.

And we’re probably stuck here, ourselves. Too old to resettle elsewhere, and like you, we don’t want to leave our kids behind.

[Boomerproud]

30. I don't have children but there's nowhere for me to go.

I wish you peace.

[I_UndergroundPanther]

58. Same here

Nowhere to go.

I can't run to another country.
I feel that I don't have any means to escape the crazy fascist fuckers either.

[wnylib]

61. Does Canada have age restrictions on residency?

[Johnny2X2X]

9. Keep fighting!

Dems won in 2020 and they can win again in 2022.

It’s really hard watching a slow moving coup, but all is not lost. Dems have the voters and still have a lot of power to stop this.

[NEOBuckeye]

10. Cut off the head

TFG must be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Go after his cronies (Bannon, et al) and throw the book at them, too. They should be left rotting in prison cells and bankrupt for the rest of their days.

The Republican Party itself must be taken down like the FBI went after the Mob. Prosecution of corruption will start the process. We also must have full-on democratic reforms (e.g. RCV, proportional, multi-member districts) that allow multiple parties to compete and eviscerate any built-in structural advantages that currently benefit the GOP. Force the existing parties to break up into factions and build Parliamentary-style coalitions. That will go a long way towards making our system more representative.

Above all else, starve the fucking Republican Party beast to death. Drown it in a bathtub. Do whatever it takes to ruin them and wreck their batshit insane reactionaryism--before it wrecks the country completely.

[Pepsidog]

14. I agree but without Fox Trump is finished.Fox needs to be dealt with.

[BigmanPigman]

17. Bingo!!!

[soldierant]

25. I wouldn't underestimate OANN, and I believe

Newsmax is also in that camp?

[certainot]

37. fox is the cartoon cliff notes for talk radio.

it's not fox. fox is part of the free speech spectrum, with free easy choices for politics a click away. the rw radio monopoly is not.

and rw radio would be easy to destroy - its head is dead - which is why the GOP is all over the place and trumpism is doomed - it's headless without limbaugh

but also AI allows easy cheap transcription so it is no longer invisible

and why are 87 universities supporting 260 xlimbaugh stations while they deny global warming, attack public ed officials, and selll voter ssuppression?

[Joinfortmill]

11. Yup. It's up to the Biden Admin., the Democrats in Congress, and us. VOTE.

[Ollie Garkie]

13. when and if...

the takeover is complete, the radio blowhards, faux snooze, etc, will keep shoveling the shit and 40 percent of the population
will believe it's the finest chocolate.

[SpankMe]

18. In the end analysis, this isn't Republicans' fault

It lies purely on the shoulders of the 83+ million eligible to voters who didn't vote in the last election.

Swing states were won and lost by a few tens of thousands of votes. If a few million more of these non-voters spread throughout these close states would have voted, I believe there would have been decisive Democratic majorities in office that would be currently strengthening and stabilizing democratic norms.

Republicans are leveraging this "anomaly" with reckless abandon, and they're winning.

Polling of all sorts points to broad public support for Democratic policies across the board - health care, LGBT rights, guns, abortion, foreign relations, the environment, women, people of color and more. And this isn't weak support, either. Most of these poll from the low 60 to low 70 percent region in favor of the progressive side of these issues.

The general public skews more toward Republican policies on things like law enforcement (tough on crime) and illegal immigration (keep 'em out). Maybe on taxes, though weakly. But not much else.

If we could do something to transform voting into a true civic duty and public obligation - like watching the Super Bowl - we'd solve a lot of problems.

[durablend]

57. Watch what you wish for

You're assuming those 83+ million would necessarily vote for us.

[Binkie The Clown]

21. So why can't Fox news be shut down for promoting and supporting treason? nt

[calimary]

29. That's what I want to know.

Last edited Thu Oct 14, 2021, 12:05 PM - Edit history (1)

IS there a way to shut them down? Used to be you could challenge their fitness to hold a broadcast license in the public interest. I don’t think that’s a viable option anymore.

[Effete Snob]

35. They don't have a broadcast license

They do not need one. They are a cable network. They do not use the public airwaves.

[calimary]

39. Yep. Indeed. Is there ANY mechanism for that?

[Effete Snob]

40. There are very few mechanisms...

...in US law to shut down the operations of a private company saying what it wishes to say to people who wish to hear it over the infrastructure of private companies which wish to transmit it through wires.

The US government is pretty much prohibited from exercising power for the purpose of shutting people up.

[GoodRaisin]

32. The corporate owned media could change the messaging anytime they want to.

The plutocracy doesn’t seem to want to.

[Mariana]

41. Amendment I.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

[Binkie The Clown]

45. Does freedom of speech include inciting to treason? I don't think it does. nt

[Zeitghost]

56. You keep saying treason

But that word does not fit. Fox, despite all it's obvious flaws, lies and misinformation, is not waging war on the United States government.


Political speech is highly protected for good reason in this country. It's downright terrifying to see calls for it's censor from the left.

[Mariana]

63. Please post one video clip from Fox News Channel

that includes content that you believe is not covered by the First Amendment.

[OMGWTF]

42. Fux News is banned in Australia and NZ for being a propaganda network.

[hibbing]

23. No comments about CNN's complicity? n/t

[vanlassie]

34. BLAME MITCH McCONNELL.

[live love laugh]

38. Act I: TFG; Act 2: GOP Anti- Democratic Force; Act 3:

[demmiblue]

44. K&R

I just started to read their book and wondered what the authors would say if they were to comment today. Now I don't have to wonder.


Sticking the video here:

[wnylib]

64. I don't think that most people who ran off to Canada

to avoid being drafted thought that they were helping to end the war. They were refusing to be part of it, either due to their belief that it was an illegal, unecessary, and unwinnable war, or due to fear of dying for something that had no clearcut value or threat to the US.

Even my brother, who was career Navy and served 2 years in Vietnam, came out of it with serious doubts about our purpose and reasons for being there. When his son was sent to Iraq, he was furious about another generation going into an unecessary war for corporate interests. And he was a conservative Republican.

[JHB]

51. Nobody who has paid attention to just how radical Movement Conservatives actually have been...

...is surprised by this.

[ananda]

52. Good grief, it's been this dark since Florida 2000.

Geez

[wnylib]

65. Yes. That was our earliest, visible warning.

But we had been trending that way since Raygun.

[peggysue2]

54. The amazing point here?

Is that someone like Anderson Cooper appeared shocked, shaken by the thought that the Republican Party has become an anti-democratic organization, a serious threat to the American Republic.

Come on, Anderson. Where have you been, what have you been reading, seeing, hearing over the last decade, particularly the last 5 years?

Sleepwalking?

I'm glad to see the media finally taking note. But really, where the hell have they been??

[WarGamer]

55. Bottom line, forms of government don't last forever... look at Europe

They all have more modern founding documents than we do...

If it takes a breakup to get new founding principles, so be it.

[secondwind]

62. I didn't have to go so far away, my family's roots are in the island

of Hispaniola, I moved to the Dominican Republic lock, stock and barrel in June of 2020. I love it here, and am never going back. My daughter, who was living in Colorado, also is here, even the dogs came with us.

Have cousins here, nieces, nephews, and my great aunt Lillian, who is 110 years young, will be 111 in March of 2022.

[wnylib]

66. ¿Necesitan una maestra de ingles en Hispaniola?

[Tribetime]

72. I don't think the media or many people realize how bad it is