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Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:08 PM

I firmly believe that President Biden should have made the securing of voting rights and

fair elections the top priority on his agenda, even before the BBB Act and he and the Democrats in Congress should be moving to abolish or make exceptions to the filibuster to accomplish that. My reasoning is that as long as Republicans believe that they can rig elections, they will not care about doing the will of the people or cooperating with Democrats and, because of that, Biden may never accomplish his agenda.

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Reply I firmly believe that President Biden should have made the securing of voting rights and (Original post)
Raven Dec 2021 OP
leftstreet Dec 2021 #1
Takket Dec 2021 #2
TigressDem Dec 2021 #7
jimfields33 Dec 2021 #8
Hugh_Lebowski Dec 2021 #10
ARandomPerson Dec 2021 #13
brooklynite Dec 2021 #20
TigressDem Dec 2021 #22
zaj Dec 2021 #33
justhanginon Dec 2021 #35
Polybius Dec 2021 #26
TigressDem Dec 2021 #37
brooklynite Dec 2021 #46
Trust_Reality Dec 2021 #49
MineralMan Dec 2021 #51
Chin music Dec 2021 #3
tinrobot Dec 2021 #4
leftstreet Dec 2021 #5
dawg Dec 2021 #6
TigressDem Dec 2021 #9
Mary in S. Carolina Dec 2021 #11
Colgate 64 Dec 2021 #12
Beastly Boy Dec 2021 #14
Cryptoad Dec 2021 #15
Dan Dec 2021 #16
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #29
Dan Dec 2021 #34
LymphocyteLover Dec 2021 #52
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #53
LymphocyteLover Dec 2021 #57
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #58
AverageOldGuy Dec 2021 #17
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #18
pamdb Dec 2021 #19
radius777 Dec 2021 #21
bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #23
BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #25
bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #27
BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #30
Ferrets are Cool Dec 2021 #32
bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #36
BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #38
bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #41
AncientAndy Dec 2021 #54
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #31
BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #24
radius777 Dec 2021 #39
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #42
LeftInTX Dec 2021 #43
BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #47
lame54 Dec 2021 #28
taxi Dec 2021 #40
lunatica Dec 2021 #44
BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #48
uponit7771 Dec 2021 #56
David__77 Dec 2021 #45
33taw Dec 2021 #50
LymphocyteLover Dec 2021 #55

Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:10 PM

1. DURec

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:12 PM

2. Biden has called for the passage of the voting rights bill many times

but it is DOA unless Manchin and Sinema carve out the filibuster for it.

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Response to Takket (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:30 PM

7. Anyone on DU in Manchin and/or Sinema's district? Can we get a recall?

AND WHO can we get to replace them mid-term?

Are the Governors in these states ReThug or DEM? Because don't they appoint replacements like in case of death or some other way of leaving office?

Would there be a special election in that case?

IF THESE DEMS won't be DEMS, then how can we replace them because ESPECIALLY IF the elections of 2022 and 2024 are rigged DEMS WILL NEED THE FILIBUSTER to keep the Creep Show from DESTROYING AMERICA.


AS DEMS (even if only DINOs) they are OUR problem. Let's solve it.


Keep the filibuster so we can be as much of a pain in the ReThugly collective if we lose the majority in the future.

Because it seems to ME that that may be what the ReThugs want, for the DEMS to abolish the filibuster so they can rig elections, get a majority and leave US completely powerless.


Think about it.

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:36 PM

8. Both are senators

Both hail from states with republicans as governor who would love nothing more then replace them. Not sure wed be thrilled. As far as recall, honestly itd be expensive and not sure its easy for a senator to be recalled.

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:45 PM

10. Their 'districts' are the states of Arizona and West Virginia

These states do not have Democratic governors, no.

Agree that abolishing filibuster is a risky proposition. BUT ... it's been pointed out in various articles I've read that Republicans use it and rely on it far more often than Democrats traditionally. Mainly because the GOP never wants to enact 'big' things, so Dems don't get many chances to use it.

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:57 PM

13. C'mon. Do a little research -- just a little -- before spouting off like this.

Manchin and Sinema are senators. They represent states, not congressional districts.

There is no mechanism for recalling US senators or congressmen.

West Virginia and Arizona both have Republican governors.

And in any case, West Virginia is very red and Arizona leans red. The idea that Democrats can replace Manchin or Sinema with impunity is absurd. In fact, Joe Manchin may be the only Democrat who is capable of winning in West Virginia. (Sinema is more expendable.)



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Response to TigressDem (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:25 PM

20. I'm surprised the people here aren't familiar with the Constitution...

There has NEVER been an ability to recall Federal elected officials. Add to which, the appointed or elected replacements would certainly be worse.

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #20)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:34 PM

22. Maybe with what is going on, we SHOULD be able to recall them.

They GET into position by the voters, we should have some remedy when they obstruct the party against their own voter's rights.

These Senators are STILL representatives of the people in that State. Why on Earth didn't the people get this power from the get go?

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #22)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:00 PM

33. Magical thinking doesn't help.

 

Q: How exactly would we establish a recall process?

A: Secure 67 Senators AND 294 House members AND ratification 38 state legislatures.

So, good luck with that?

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #22)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:03 PM

35. The recall petitions would start the day after the election results. Look at

that crapfest in California over the governors recall.

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:38 PM

26. Besides voting them out, there's no recall on Senators

Even if there were, Manchin's wouldn't be recalled. He's got over a 60% approval rating in WV. They love him.

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Response to Polybius (Reply #26)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:06 PM

37. Thanks for an actual helpful comment.

I think it is really interesting how this board has changed and everyone expects people here to be Constitutional Scholars and are no longer willing to help anyone anymore, just shoot them down.

Years ago we called that trolling, today it's just standard operating procedure.

Don't help educate anyone on the specifics of a situation, just come on and complain and call people names.



I'm out for today, but thanks for restoring my faith in DU.


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Response to TigressDem (Reply #37)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:45 PM

46. One doesn't have to be a Constitutional Scholar; one simply has to read the Constitution...

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #37)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:55 PM

49. Some of the replies to your original ideas and brainstorming were a little... impatient?

Thanks for participating.

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Response to TigressDem (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:01 PM

51. Senators and House Representatives Cannot Be Recalled!

They can only be removed by their respective houses of Congress. They are federal offices, not local offices, and once elected no recall is possible. It's in the Constitution, and they are Constitutional elected officials.

It is important to understand basic things like that. If you haven't read the Constitution recently, I highly recommend doing that.

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Response to Raven (Original post)


Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:17 PM

4. You're placing the blame on Biden?

Not productive.

Let's focus on the people who are obstructing passage of the bill, not those who support it.

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Response to tinrobot (Reply #4)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:23 PM

5. The OP said "priority"

not blame

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:26 PM

6. And how do you propose getting Manchin & Sinema to go along with that?

Because you're not wrong about the importance of those things. I just don't think there was ever any realistic chance of getting them done.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:37 PM

9. Can he do anything with an Executive Order to invalidate voter suppression laws on the Federal Level

Like withdraw Federal Funds for any state that chooses to take voting integrity out of the hands of The People and hand it over to elected officials who have a vested interest in appeasing party leaders.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:49 PM

11. I think it is his top priority

 

just not Manchins. Manchin now has what he wants, so let's get this passed.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:52 PM

12. Couldn't agree with you more! I think Pres. Biden

has blinders on, concentrating on his economic reforms but not paying attention to the existential threat to our democracy that is blinding us.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:00 PM

14. If he did, he would have ran the risk of ending up with neither.

Remember, we live in a largely racist and xenophobic society with white voters in the majority. Too many of them think of voting rights as a zero sum game - the more rights minorities get, the fewer rights they have left. Their position is ridiculous on its face, but persuading them to the contrary doesn't seem to be within the reach of the Biden administration.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:03 PM

15. Plz,,, do tell how to get Joe M to vote for,,

for all these policies that need his yes vote instead of blaming Biden for not being able to make Joe M to vote right

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:15 PM

16. When the AA vote is loss due to the GOP

It will truly be a one party government.

I guess we will see what happens - when POC can no longer vote, unless they are safe GOP voters.

We are not going back to the days of old Jim Crow!

I will die first.

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Response to Dan (Reply #16)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:46 PM

29. It's not the just AA vote that got lost in Atlanta here recently, they increased the denial of mail

... in ballot request AFTER they reduced the amount of time to request them.

This is what the center of the anti democracy acts from the GQP looks like; reducing resources to vote.

This is worst than voter suppression (mostly misdirection and misinformation) this is taking away the resources to vote in specific areas so people CAN NOT vote no matter the turn out.

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #29)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:01 PM

34. +1000

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #29)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:03 PM

52. their partisan take-over of election boards and rules to overturn results if they suspect fraud

are what is really really disturbing to me. It's FUBAR.

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Response to LymphocyteLover (Reply #52)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:05 PM

53. +1, they are going 100% into voter denial and nullification as anti democracy measures and people

... are wondering what will we run on when the GQP doesn't have to run on anything.

No, we need to address voter access asap ... a 400% increase in mail ballot request denial in ATL shows how successful their AD measures are

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #53)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:09 PM

57. I certainly agree-- I just have no idea what I can do about it besides donate.

I live in a red state and my Sen's and Rep DGAF.

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Response to LymphocyteLover (Reply #57)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:14 PM

58. some people can only donate and phone bank but we need good message and message mechanics to

... get through the GQP bullshit.

In 2020 our communication to communities of color were lacking, we need to get on radio and local tv for those communities nationwide this time

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:20 PM

17. Has nothing to do with Biden

We are in the state we are in because this nation has never come to grips with the Civil War.

Following the end of the War, the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments were enacted. Those amendments laid the groundwork for the federal government to abolish state-based abuses of the criminal "justice system" and the electoral system. For the past 150 years, Congress and the federal courts have refused to finish what the Reconstruction Amendments started and now it is too late.

The USA is finished. We are on the way to becoming a fascist state; the journey will be completed with the Nov 2024 election. 1984 was just 60 years late in arriving.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:23 PM

18. **************THIS !!!! ☝🏾☝🏾☝🏾*************** You've Got It !!! Biden could cure cancer and ...

... climate change in 2 months the GQP doesn't care because they have voter denial


Anti democracy measures WORK !!!

That's the reason why they act so stupid 100% of the time, they're not going to pay for it ... NOT AT ALL !!

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:23 PM

19. voting rights


I have said from the beginning, right after the first package, the aid for the virus and such,(I forgot what it was called) when he was riding high, the next step should have been securing and improving voting rights. Without that, nothing else matters. Now they've fooled around so long trying to appease Manchin and the flake from AZ, they'll never get anything done or it will be so watered down, it won't make a difference. Infrastructure is all well and good, but not as important as voting rights.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:27 PM

21. Agree, many people feel this way not just PoC.

Nicolle Wallace and her panel which includes several former Repubs say that voting rights are the 'four alarm fire' that Dems should be sounding on a daily basis and using every possible mechanism to force the issue.

Biden is president because black and brown voters stood on long lines in urban areas like Philly, Milwaukee, Detroit, Atlanta. Schumer is majority leader because black voters and Stacy Abrams helped win those two Senate seats in GA.

Suburban swing voters also voted for Biden due to fears of Trump and the threat the RW presents to democracy and rights more broadly such as voting rights, civil rights and women's rights/choice. Even though such voters typically lean center-right on economics they tend to lean left on social and structural issues.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:37 PM

23. That would be a thin platform to run on. You need accomplishments, legislation, programs, laws.

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #23)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:38 PM

25. Yet Republicans keep winning on a platform of no accomplishments, no programs, no laws....

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #25)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:41 PM

27. They have the system rigged in many states and places

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #27)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:49 PM

30. I understand that. I was born and raised in several of those states and places. Why haven't we?

You can LEGALLY "rig the system".

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #30)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:00 PM

32. This x 1000

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #30)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:05 PM

36. Democrats view democracy as the natural state of affairs, Republicans know better

We have been out-gamed.

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #36)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:10 PM

38. BUT!...BUT!...We are so much better at posting hard hitting witty and snarky tweets!!!!

You'd almost think that NOT getting crucial things passed when we we take power helps with fundraising later............

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #38)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:20 PM

41. Yes. Interest groups know this. They are a political class who want to remain in power as well

It costs money to run those organizations and maintain offices and support.

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #36)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:06 PM

54. Democrats think politics is an honest business...

 

Republicans know that it isnt.

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #25)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:50 PM

31. RIGHT !!!! They can literally pimp slap infants as a platform and still win because they rigged ...

... the system in their favor.

People are not understanding the impact of their AD measures

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:37 PM

24. I firmly believed the same thing, and posted many times, when Obama was sworn in...

Pass BULLETPROOF law after law after law for 2 full years that ENSURE everyone eligible can vote, with MANDATORY and frankly, BRUTAL sentences in Federal prisons to anyone who breaks those laws.
Only THEN can we move on to things like health care, infrastructure, and everything else. Make every law a roadblock for Republicans that will take YEARS to get around or over, so that they will be tied up in the courts for DECADES.
But....nope. Never happened. I firmly believe we would have kept control with Obama and not lost the midterms if we had done so...and now we are only what, 11 months away from FAILING TO PASS VOTING GUARANTEES and very possibly, once again, having Republicans in control of the House, grinding everything to a halt.
It's disheartening. I'm 70 years old, radicalized by Chicago 1968 and the Vietnam war, I've seen it all for a long long time and have never been able to figure out this massive failure on our part.
Let's be honest, Biden won because enough people were FED UP WITH THINGS, and yet, really...was anybody out in the streets because of INFRASTRUCTURE??????????????????????????????????????

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #24)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:17 PM

39. +1. We need to fight dirty for the forseeable future

meaning we need to gerrymander as hard as we can to get every last seat, need to put laws on state and local levels that strongly criminalize any attempt to subvert elections and suppress votes, etc. Expand and pack the Supreme Court. Make DC and PR states.

Agree that while BIF and BBB are nice things to have, Biden was elected for existential reasons namely the threat Trump and Trumpism pose to democracy and many of the rights liberals have fought for over the past 50 years.

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #24)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:26 PM

42. +1, many people underestimate the efficacy of voter denial laws

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Response to BamaRefugee (Reply #24)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:30 PM

43. Obama could have done it in his first year!

He had the votes.

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Response to LeftInTX (Reply #43)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:47 PM

47. EXACTLY! And you KNOW he knew that...still, he persisted...

And left a legacy of litigation that will be used by the enemy ad infinitum....Now Biden too, nothing is gonna happen to voting laws, guaranteed....

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:44 PM

28. The phone call is coming from inside the house

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Response to lame54 (Reply #28)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:20 PM

40. Yeah, it is

I thought we hit the ground running and were on a tear.
Oh well, learn something new every day.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:39 PM

44. I'm wondering if Biden and his Administration are thinking that they can wait

Until the middle of 2022 to pressure the Senators to vote for the voting rights or even wait until 2023 for the general elections. Politicians are always thinking in those terms. Its who they are.

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Response to lunatica (Reply #44)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:50 PM

48. by the middle of 2022 the excuse will be that they're SO BUSY running for re-election there's no

TIME to pass voting laws, BUT, they will DEFINITELY BE ASKING FOR MONEY to really, golly gee, REALLY REALLY REALLY try soooooooooooooooo hard to pass some voting laws real soon..............only they won't.

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Response to lunatica (Reply #44)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:08 PM

56. ... or they're waiting to till the last minute so these changes can't be challenged in court in ...

... enough time to change them.

There would have to be a slurry of "stays" (I think) on the new law for the GQP to win

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:45 PM

45. Holding a "democracy summit" in the midst of this seems particularly wild to me.

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:57 PM

50. Voting rights requires a supportive Judiciary. We don't have that. I believe every presidential

election has one top priority and that is packing the courts with supportive jurists from top to bottom. When Hillary Clinton lost in 2016- Roe vs. Wade was destined to be overturned along with voting rights (it's not quite over, but we are close).

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Response to Raven (Original post)

Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:07 PM

55. I'm pretty sure Biden understands the issue and the urgency and that also he can't do much

about it with the Senate he has. We've been trying for almost a year to get Manchinema to change their tune on the filibuster and they aren't budging, appparently.

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