Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Raven

(13,951 posts)
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:08 PM Dec 2021

I firmly believe that President Biden should have made the securing of voting rights and

fair elections the top priority on his agenda, even before the BBB Act and he and the Democrats in Congress should be moving to abolish or make exceptions to the filibuster to accomplish that. My reasoning is that as long as Republicans believe that they can rig elections, they will not care about doing the will of the people or cooperating with Democrats and, because of that, Biden may never accomplish his agenda.

58 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
I firmly believe that President Biden should have made the securing of voting rights and (Original Post) Raven Dec 2021 OP
DURec leftstreet Dec 2021 #1
Biden has called for the passage of the voting rights bill many times Takket Dec 2021 #2
Anyone on DU in Manchin and/or Sinema's district? Can we get a recall? TigressDem Dec 2021 #7
Both are senators jimfields33 Dec 2021 #8
Their 'districts' are the states of Arizona and West Virginia Hugh_Lebowski Dec 2021 #10
C'mon. Do a little research -- just a little -- before spouting off like this. ARandomPerson Dec 2021 #13
I'm surprised the people here aren't familiar with the Constitution... brooklynite Dec 2021 #20
Maybe with what is going on, we SHOULD be able to recall them. TigressDem Dec 2021 #22
Magical thinking doesn't help. zaj Dec 2021 #33
The recall petitions would start the day after the election results. Look at justhanginon Dec 2021 #35
Besides voting them out, there's no recall on Senators Polybius Dec 2021 #26
Thanks for an actual helpful comment. TigressDem Dec 2021 #37
One doesn't have to be a Constitutional Scholar; one simply has to read the Constitution... brooklynite Dec 2021 #46
Some of the replies to your original ideas and brainstorming were a little... impatient? Trust_Reality Dec 2021 #49
Senators and House Representatives Cannot Be Recalled! MineralMan Dec 2021 #51
This message was self-deleted by its author Chin music Dec 2021 #3
You're placing the blame on Biden? tinrobot Dec 2021 #4
The OP said "priority" leftstreet Dec 2021 #5
And how do you propose getting Manchin & Sinema to go along with that? dawg Dec 2021 #6
Can he do anything with an Executive Order to invalidate voter suppression laws on the Federal Level TigressDem Dec 2021 #9
I think it is his top priority Mary in S. Carolina Dec 2021 #11
Couldn't agree with you more! I think Pres. Biden Colgate 64 Dec 2021 #12
If he did, he would have ran the risk of ending up with neither. Beastly Boy Dec 2021 #14
Plz,,, do tell how to get Joe M to vote for,, Cryptoad Dec 2021 #15
When the AA vote is loss due to the GOP Dan Dec 2021 #16
It's not the just AA vote that got lost in Atlanta here recently, they increased the denial of mail uponit7771 Dec 2021 #29
+1000 Dan Dec 2021 #34
their partisan take-over of election boards and rules to overturn results if they suspect fraud LymphocyteLover Dec 2021 #52
+1, they are going 100% into voter denial and nullification as anti democracy measures and people uponit7771 Dec 2021 #53
I certainly agree-- I just have no idea what I can do about it besides donate. LymphocyteLover Dec 2021 #57
some people can only donate and phone bank but we need good message and message mechanics to uponit7771 Dec 2021 #58
Has nothing to do with Biden AverageOldGuy Dec 2021 #17
**************THIS !!!! ☝🏾☝🏾☝🏾*************** You've Got It !!! Biden could cure cancer and ... uponit7771 Dec 2021 #18
voting rights pamdb Dec 2021 #19
Agree, many people feel this way not just PoC. radius777 Dec 2021 #21
That would be a thin platform to run on. You need accomplishments, legislation, programs, laws. bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #23
Yet Republicans keep winning on a platform of no accomplishments, no programs, no laws.... BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #25
They have the system rigged in many states and places bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #27
I understand that. I was born and raised in several of those states and places. Why haven't we? BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #30
This x 1000 Ferrets are Cool Dec 2021 #32
Democrats view democracy as the natural state of affairs, Republicans know better bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #36
BUT!...BUT!...We are so much better at posting hard hitting witty and snarky tweets!!!! BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #38
Yes. Interest groups know this. They are a political class who want to remain in power as well bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #41
Democrats think politics is an honest business... AncientAndy Dec 2021 #54
RIGHT !!!! They can literally pimp slap infants as a platform and still win because they rigged ... uponit7771 Dec 2021 #31
I firmly believed the same thing, and posted many times, when Obama was sworn in... BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #24
+1. We need to fight dirty for the forseeable future radius777 Dec 2021 #39
+1, many people underestimate the efficacy of voter denial laws uponit7771 Dec 2021 #42
Obama could have done it in his first year! LeftInTX Dec 2021 #43
EXACTLY! And you KNOW he knew that...still, he persisted... BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #47
The phone call is coming from inside the house lame54 Dec 2021 #28
Yeah, it is taxi Dec 2021 #40
I'm wondering if Biden and his Administration are thinking that they can wait lunatica Dec 2021 #44
by the middle of 2022 the excuse will be that they're SO BUSY running for re-election there's no BamaRefugee Dec 2021 #48
... or they're waiting to till the last minute so these changes can't be challenged in court in ... uponit7771 Dec 2021 #56
Holding a "democracy summit" in the midst of this seems particularly wild to me. David__77 Dec 2021 #45
Voting rights requires a supportive Judiciary. We don't have that. I believe every presidential 33taw Dec 2021 #50
I'm pretty sure Biden understands the issue and the urgency and that also he can't do much LymphocyteLover Dec 2021 #55

Takket

(21,919 posts)
2. Biden has called for the passage of the voting rights bill many times
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:12 PM
Dec 2021

but it is DOA unless Manchin and Sinema carve out the filibuster for it.

TigressDem

(5,125 posts)
7. Anyone on DU in Manchin and/or Sinema's district? Can we get a recall?
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:30 PM
Dec 2021

AND WHO can we get to replace them mid-term?

Are the Governors in these states ReThug or DEM? Because don't they appoint replacements like in case of death or some other way of leaving office?

Would there be a special election in that case?

IF THESE DEMS won't be DEMS, then how can we replace them because ESPECIALLY IF the elections of 2022 and 2024 are rigged DEMS WILL NEED THE FILIBUSTER to keep the Creep Show from DESTROYING AMERICA.


AS DEMS (even if only DINOs) they are OUR problem. Let's solve it.


Keep the filibuster so we can be as much of a pain in the ReThugly collective if we lose the majority in the future.

Because it seems to ME that that may be what the ReThugs want, for the DEMS to abolish the filibuster so they can rig elections, get a majority and leave US completely powerless.


Think about it.

jimfields33

(16,749 posts)
8. Both are senators
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:36 PM
Dec 2021

Both hail from states with republicans as governor who would love nothing more then replace them. Not sure we’d be thrilled. As far as recall, honestly it’d be expensive and not sure it’s easy for a senator to be recalled.

 

Hugh_Lebowski

(33,643 posts)
10. Their 'districts' are the states of Arizona and West Virginia
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:45 PM
Dec 2021

These states do not have Democratic governors, no.

Agree that abolishing filibuster is a risky proposition. BUT ... it's been pointed out in various articles I've read that Republicans use it and rely on it far more often than Democrats traditionally. Mainly because the GOP never wants to enact 'big' things, so Dems don't get many chances to use it.

ARandomPerson

(2,406 posts)
13. C'mon. Do a little research -- just a little -- before spouting off like this.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:57 PM
Dec 2021

Manchin and Sinema are senators. They represent states, not congressional districts.

There is no mechanism for recalling US senators or congressmen.

West Virginia and Arizona both have Republican governors.

And in any case, West Virginia is very red and Arizona leans red. The idea that Democrats can replace Manchin or Sinema with impunity is absurd. In fact, Joe Manchin may be the only Democrat who is capable of winning in West Virginia. (Sinema is more expendable.)



brooklynite

(95,646 posts)
20. I'm surprised the people here aren't familiar with the Constitution...
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:25 PM
Dec 2021

There has NEVER been an ability to recall Federal elected officials. Add to which, the appointed or elected replacements would certainly be worse.

TigressDem

(5,125 posts)
22. Maybe with what is going on, we SHOULD be able to recall them.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:34 PM
Dec 2021

They GET into position by the voters, we should have some remedy when they obstruct the party against their own voter's rights.

These Senators are STILL representatives of the people in that State. Why on Earth didn't the people get this power from the get go?

 

zaj

(3,433 posts)
33. Magical thinking doesn't help.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:00 PM
Dec 2021

Q: How exactly would we establish a recall process?

A: Secure 67 Senators AND 294 House members AND ratification 38 state legislatures.

So, good luck with that?

justhanginon

(3,295 posts)
35. The recall petitions would start the day after the election results. Look at
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:03 PM
Dec 2021

that crapfest in California over the governors recall.

Polybius

(15,750 posts)
26. Besides voting them out, there's no recall on Senators
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:38 PM
Dec 2021

Even if there were, Manchin's wouldn't be recalled. He's got over a 60% approval rating in WV. They love him.

TigressDem

(5,125 posts)
37. Thanks for an actual helpful comment.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:06 PM
Dec 2021

I think it is really interesting how this board has changed and everyone expects people here to be Constitutional Scholars and are no longer willing to help anyone anymore, just shoot them down.

Years ago we called that trolling, today it's just standard operating procedure.

Don't help educate anyone on the specifics of a situation, just come on and complain and call people names.



I'm out for today, but thanks for restoring my faith in DU.


Trust_Reality

(1,746 posts)
49. Some of the replies to your original ideas and brainstorming were a little... impatient?
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:55 PM
Dec 2021

Thanks for participating.

MineralMan

(146,436 posts)
51. Senators and House Representatives Cannot Be Recalled!
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:01 PM
Dec 2021

They can only be removed by their respective houses of Congress. They are federal offices, not local offices, and once elected no recall is possible. It's in the Constitution, and they are Constitutional elected officials.

It is important to understand basic things like that. If you haven't read the Constitution recently, I highly recommend doing that.

Response to Raven (Original post)

tinrobot

(10,985 posts)
4. You're placing the blame on Biden?
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:17 PM
Dec 2021

Not productive.

Let's focus on the people who are obstructing passage of the bill, not those who support it.

dawg

(10,632 posts)
6. And how do you propose getting Manchin & Sinema to go along with that?
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:26 PM
Dec 2021

Because you're not wrong about the importance of those things. I just don't think there was ever any realistic chance of getting them done.

TigressDem

(5,125 posts)
9. Can he do anything with an Executive Order to invalidate voter suppression laws on the Federal Level
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:37 PM
Dec 2021

Like withdraw Federal Funds for any state that chooses to take voting integrity out of the hands of The People and hand it over to elected officials who have a vested interest in appeasing party leaders.

 

Mary in S. Carolina

(1,364 posts)
11. I think it is his top priority
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:49 PM
Dec 2021

just not Manchins. Manchin now has what he wants, so let's get this passed.

Colgate 64

(14,739 posts)
12. Couldn't agree with you more! I think Pres. Biden
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 01:52 PM
Dec 2021

has blinders on, concentrating on his economic reforms but not paying attention to the existential threat to our democracy that is blinding us.

Beastly Boy

(9,950 posts)
14. If he did, he would have ran the risk of ending up with neither.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:00 PM
Dec 2021

Remember, we live in a largely racist and xenophobic society with white voters in the majority. Too many of them think of voting rights as a zero sum game - the more rights minorities get, the fewer rights they have left. Their position is ridiculous on its face, but persuading them to the contrary doesn't seem to be within the reach of the Biden administration.

Cryptoad

(8,254 posts)
15. Plz,,, do tell how to get Joe M to vote for,,
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:03 PM
Dec 2021

for all these policies that need his yes vote instead of blaming Biden for not being able to make Joe M to vote right

Dan

(3,677 posts)
16. When the AA vote is loss due to the GOP
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:15 PM
Dec 2021

It will truly be a one party government.

I guess we will see what happens - when POC can no longer vote, unless they are safe GOP voters.

We are not going back to the days of old Jim Crow!

I will die first.

uponit7771

(90,442 posts)
29. It's not the just AA vote that got lost in Atlanta here recently, they increased the denial of mail
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:46 PM
Dec 2021

... in ballot request AFTER they reduced the amount of time to request them.

This is what the center of the anti democracy acts from the GQP looks like; reducing resources to vote.

This is worst than voter suppression (mostly misdirection and misinformation) this is taking away the resources to vote in specific areas so people CAN NOT vote no matter the turn out.

LymphocyteLover

(5,767 posts)
52. their partisan take-over of election boards and rules to overturn results if they suspect fraud
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:03 PM
Dec 2021

are what is really really disturbing to me. It's FUBAR.

uponit7771

(90,442 posts)
53. +1, they are going 100% into voter denial and nullification as anti democracy measures and people
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:05 PM
Dec 2021

... are wondering what will we run on when the GQP doesn't have to run on anything.

No, we need to address voter access asap ... a 400% increase in mail ballot request denial in ATL shows how successful their AD measures are

LymphocyteLover

(5,767 posts)
57. I certainly agree-- I just have no idea what I can do about it besides donate.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:09 PM
Dec 2021

I live in a red state and my Sen's and Rep DGAF.

uponit7771

(90,442 posts)
58. some people can only donate and phone bank but we need good message and message mechanics to
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:14 PM
Dec 2021

... get through the GQP bullshit.

In 2020 our communication to communities of color were lacking, we need to get on radio and local tv for those communities nationwide this time

AverageOldGuy

(1,611 posts)
17. Has nothing to do with Biden
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:20 PM
Dec 2021

We are in the state we are in because this nation has never come to grips with the Civil War.

Following the end of the War, the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments were enacted. Those amendments laid the groundwork for the federal government to abolish state-based abuses of the criminal "justice system" and the electoral system. For the past 150 years, Congress and the federal courts have refused to finish what the Reconstruction Amendments started and now it is too late.

The USA is finished. We are on the way to becoming a fascist state; the journey will be completed with the Nov 2024 election. 1984 was just 60 years late in arriving.

uponit7771

(90,442 posts)
18. **************THIS !!!! ☝🏾☝🏾☝🏾*************** You've Got It !!! Biden could cure cancer and ...
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:23 PM
Dec 2021

... climate change in 2 months the GQP doesn't care because they have voter denial


Anti democracy measures WORK !!!

That's the reason why they act so stupid 100% of the time, they're not going to pay for it ... NOT AT ALL !!

pamdb

(1,337 posts)
19. voting rights
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:23 PM
Dec 2021

I have said from the beginning, right after the first package, the aid for the virus and such,(I forgot what it was called) when he was riding high, the next step should have been securing and improving voting rights. Without that, nothing else matters. Now they've fooled around so long trying to appease Manchin and the flake from AZ, they'll never get anything done or it will be so watered down, it won't make a difference. Infrastructure is all well and good, but not as important as voting rights.

radius777

(3,635 posts)
21. Agree, many people feel this way not just PoC.
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:27 PM
Dec 2021

Nicolle Wallace and her panel which includes several former Repubs say that voting rights are the 'four alarm fire' that Dems should be sounding on a daily basis and using every possible mechanism to force the issue.

Biden is president because black and brown voters stood on long lines in urban areas like Philly, Milwaukee, Detroit, Atlanta. Schumer is majority leader because black voters and Stacy Abrams helped win those two Senate seats in GA.

Suburban swing voters also voted for Biden due to fears of Trump and the threat the RW presents to democracy and rights more broadly such as voting rights, civil rights and women's rights/choice. Even though such voters typically lean center-right on economics they tend to lean left on social and structural issues.

BamaRefugee

(3,494 posts)
30. I understand that. I was born and raised in several of those states and places. Why haven't we?
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:49 PM
Dec 2021

You can LEGALLY "rig the system".

bucolic_frolic

(44,121 posts)
36. Democrats view democracy as the natural state of affairs, Republicans know better
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:05 PM
Dec 2021

We have been out-gamed.

BamaRefugee

(3,494 posts)
38. BUT!...BUT!...We are so much better at posting hard hitting witty and snarky tweets!!!!
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:10 PM
Dec 2021

You'd almost think that NOT getting crucial things passed when we we take power helps with fundraising later............

bucolic_frolic

(44,121 posts)
41. Yes. Interest groups know this. They are a political class who want to remain in power as well
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:20 PM
Dec 2021

It costs money to run those organizations and maintain offices and support.

uponit7771

(90,442 posts)
31. RIGHT !!!! They can literally pimp slap infants as a platform and still win because they rigged ...
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:50 PM
Dec 2021

... the system in their favor.

People are not understanding the impact of their AD measures

BamaRefugee

(3,494 posts)
24. I firmly believed the same thing, and posted many times, when Obama was sworn in...
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 02:37 PM
Dec 2021

Pass BULLETPROOF law after law after law for 2 full years that ENSURE everyone eligible can vote, with MANDATORY and frankly, BRUTAL sentences in Federal prisons to anyone who breaks those laws.
Only THEN can we move on to things like health care, infrastructure, and everything else. Make every law a roadblock for Republicans that will take YEARS to get around or over, so that they will be tied up in the courts for DECADES.
But....nope. Never happened. I firmly believe we would have kept control with Obama and not lost the midterms if we had done so...and now we are only what, 11 months away from FAILING TO PASS VOTING GUARANTEES and very possibly, once again, having Republicans in control of the House, grinding everything to a halt.
It's disheartening. I'm 70 years old, radicalized by Chicago 1968 and the Vietnam war, I've seen it all for a long long time and have never been able to figure out this massive failure on our part.
Let's be honest, Biden won because enough people were FED UP WITH THINGS, and yet, really...was anybody out in the streets because of INFRASTRUCTURE??????????????????????????????????????

radius777

(3,635 posts)
39. +1. We need to fight dirty for the forseeable future
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:17 PM
Dec 2021

meaning we need to gerrymander as hard as we can to get every last seat, need to put laws on state and local levels that strongly criminalize any attempt to subvert elections and suppress votes, etc. Expand and pack the Supreme Court. Make DC and PR states.

Agree that while BIF and BBB are nice things to have, Biden was elected for existential reasons namely the threat Trump and Trumpism pose to democracy and many of the rights liberals have fought for over the past 50 years.

BamaRefugee

(3,494 posts)
47. EXACTLY! And you KNOW he knew that...still, he persisted...
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:47 PM
Dec 2021

And left a legacy of litigation that will be used by the enemy ad infinitum....Now Biden too, nothing is gonna happen to voting laws, guaranteed....

taxi

(1,896 posts)
40. Yeah, it is
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:20 PM
Dec 2021

I thought we hit the ground running and were on a tear.
Oh well, learn something new every day.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
44. I'm wondering if Biden and his Administration are thinking that they can wait
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:39 PM
Dec 2021

Until the middle of 2022 to pressure the Senators to vote for the voting rights or even wait until 2023 for the general elections. Politicians are always thinking in those terms. It’s who they are.

BamaRefugee

(3,494 posts)
48. by the middle of 2022 the excuse will be that they're SO BUSY running for re-election there's no
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:50 PM
Dec 2021

TIME to pass voting laws, BUT, they will DEFINITELY BE ASKING FOR MONEY to really, golly gee, REALLY REALLY REALLY try soooooooooooooooo hard to pass some voting laws real soon..............only they won't.

uponit7771

(90,442 posts)
56. ... or they're waiting to till the last minute so these changes can't be challenged in court in ...
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:08 PM
Dec 2021

... enough time to change them.

There would have to be a slurry of "stays" (I think) on the new law for the GQP to win

33taw

(2,471 posts)
50. Voting rights requires a supportive Judiciary. We don't have that. I believe every presidential
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 03:57 PM
Dec 2021

election has one top priority and that is packing the courts with supportive jurists from top to bottom. When Hillary Clinton lost in 2016- Roe vs. Wade was destined to be overturned along with voting rights (it's not quite over, but we are close).

LymphocyteLover

(5,767 posts)
55. I'm pretty sure Biden understands the issue and the urgency and that also he can't do much
Sat Dec 11, 2021, 04:07 PM
Dec 2021

about it with the Senate he has. We've been trying for almost a year to get Manchinema to change their tune on the filibuster and they aren't budging, appparently.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»I firmly believe that Pre...