Irreconciable Differences

[NanceGreggs]

Every so often, I hear someone say that we should be reaching out to the other side in an effort to close the divide between ourselves and Republicans. While I admire their efforts - which I'm sure come from a good place - I can't help but be aware of their naivete, along with the futility of their mission.

The great divide that exists between "us and them' is no longer simply a matter of Republicans v Democrats in a political context; it has become a war between two factions that will never be resolved.

There is no longer any common ground to be shared in the spirit of mutual agreement. There can be no "meeting of the minds" when only one side can demonstrate that they have a mind, and the other side persists in the mindlessness of a cult.

The truth is that decent people do not want to associate with bigots - or those who claim not to be bigots, but support and elect homophobes, Islamaphobes, xenophobes, and anti-Semites in hopes their elected representatives do their dirty work for them.

People who embrace the idea of a fulsome education can never see eye-to-eye with those who embrace censoring our nation's history - warts and all - no less book-burning based on the abject ignorance of those who think the truth is subject to negotiation.

Even the most innocuous of discussions - like commenting on the weather - have become yet another battlefield. It is impossible to even broach the subject without being told that climate change is just another a hoax, and how hurricanes and tornadoes are the result of of God's wrath towards cities that hold Gay Pride parades.

The GOP and its voters have shown us who they are.

They are people willing to spread a deadly disease on the basis of personal freedoms, while denying women the personal freedom to have dominion over their own bodies.

They are people who believe that victims of gun violence - even when they're children - are a small price to pay for the personal freedom of being able to bear arms without any restrictions being imposed.

They are the people who take animal dewormers rather than take a vaccine that has been proven to be effective.

They are the people who believe that the November 2020 election was stolen from the rightful winner, Donald Trump, despite the fact that not a scintilla of evidence of vote fraud has been unearthed.

The fact is that there can be no "reaching out" to people who are so devoid of reason that their only defense of the implausible is what they've heard on FOX-News, what they've learned from Alex Jones, what they have gleaned from their insane reps like Marjorie Taylor-Green and Lauren Boebert, and what they've chosen to believe about whack-jobs still congregated in Dealey Plaza waiting for JFK Jr. to reappear from the dead in order to run as VP on Trump's 2024 ticket.

There is no common ground to be found between those who believe in the Constitution and the rule of law and those who believe both are expendable. There is no common ground to be found between the the well-informed and those who cling to their own stupidity. There is no common ground that exists between those who seek the facts and those who choose to believe that facts are simply opinions, and have no basis in reality.

When it comes to preserving our democracy, the idea of compromise is not an option. It is not a concept that is negotiable, something to be worked-out between warring political factions behind closed doors.

Our democracy is what it is, and pretending that those who seek to manipulate it, undermine it, and ultimately destroy it are simply those who need to be "reached out to" is as foolish as it is hopelessly doomed to failure.

This is war - and we can only hope that those on the side of democracy will win.

[Philosophizing Fool]

1. Frightening

Judging an entire group based upon the most radical and extreme elements has been done before. It didn't work so well, for anyone. Take a deep breath and try to lay aside the hate and fear, for those demonize others will often become the monster themselves.

"Us & Them" got me thinking of Pink Floyd so I leave with this.

Us and Them
Pink Floyd

Us and them
And after all, we're only ordinary men
Me and you
God only knows, it's not what we would choose to do

Forward he cried from the rear
And the front rank died
The General sat, and the lines on the map
Moved from side to side

Black and blue
And who knows which is which and who is who
Up and down
And in the end, it's only round and round and round

Haven't you heard it's a battle of words
The poster bearer cried
Listen son, said the man with the gun
There's room for you inside

(They're maybe gonna kill ya.
So like, if you give 'em a quick, short, sharp, shock, they don't do it again.
Dig it? I mean he get off light, come to think.
Of rationalising it, once.
It's only a difference, but why go and ruin it?
I mean good manners don't cost nothing, do they, eh?)

Down and out
It can't be helped, but there's a lot of it about
With, without
And who'll deny it's what the fighting's all about

Out of the way, it's a busy day
I've got things on my mind
For want of the price of tea and a slice
The old man died

Songwriters: Richard Wright
For non-commercial use only.

[taxi]

2. My question is

This entire group you mention are the very ones following the most radical and extreme elements. Those who don't follow are not part of the mentioned group. Are you really trying to defend the followers of a sick cult while ignoring their leaders?

[Joinfortmill]

4. WWII was about us and them.

Sometimes the "them" are immoral murdering beasts. You need to recognize the difference.

[True Blue American]

7. Seriously

That has been the problem all along. Those who make the decisions to go to war, for instance never serve. Others die. A good example is Bush lying us into war, plus Trump encouraging the mob to riot, hang Pence, etc.

The mob is now facing prison or punishment.

Bush and Trump are sitting in their mansions.

[agingdem]

9. Well, your aforementioned entire group

is over seventy million strong (not exactly a cul-de-sac in a sleepy suburb)...and, yes, they are monsters, all of them..because what binds them is their raw hate..and those supposed non-extremist nice folks are drawn to Trump, a depraved delusional psychopath, because he shares their hate, he legitimizes and justifies their hate, he gives them permission to maim and kill with impunity...if shredding the Constitution, defiling the Capital, hanging Pence and Pelosi, bludgeoning policemen, overturning an election is what it takes to "crown" their loathsome fascistic leader king, then that's ok because, well, you know.. HATE

BTW...read up on Neville Chamberlain and Hitler...to paraphrase Santayana..."those that forget their history are doomed to repeat it"...and Faulkner.."the past is never dead, it's not even past"...

[FrankTC]

10. Like Many, I Struggle With How To Relate To GOP People

It occurs to me to think that caring about them doesn't require reaching out to change their minds, beating my head against a wall. That would be futile, pointless, and painful. Caring about them doesn't even require face-to-face interactions or active personal relationships. Caring about them can simply entail doing everything I can to keep them from assuming and wielding power. So to this extent I agree with you: Indeed it is wise to "take a deep breath and try to lay aside the hate and fear." For example, you don't have to hate a child when you pick it up after a tantrum and carry it to a safe place, like for example its bedroom or federal maximum security. When you say it's time for a nap, you don't necessarily mean the kind it will never wake up from. So relating to GOP people is truly a struggle for me. One day I can't stand to be anywhere near a Trumpster, other days I'm more willing to interact with the nonpolitical parts of their personality -- from the perspective that nobody should be judged entirely on the basis of the worst thing they've ever done, said, or supported. And where I live, in a rural area, I run into people all the time who are kind and generous and helpful to all but who seem Ok with burning the country to the ground if that would smoke out every last living liberal. Difficult times. But on the whole I agree with NanceGreggs --the political differences are irreconcilable, and they won't be resolved by argumentation and invitations to a group hug, any more than those approaches are appropriate for dealing with a toddler's meltdown. We need to find other ways.

[old as dirt]

12. What? No video? This is totally unacceptable!

[MerryBlooms]

15. Name just 10 Republicans on the hill who are

Not described in Nance's, OP. You denying the harmful and far reaching radicalization of the republican party, is not helpful, nor wise. Are blind to what republican controlled states are doing to women, voting rights, civil rights? You have the Nerve to chastise Nance and DU for labeling extremists, extremists? Bugger off with that complete and utter nonsense!

[Permanut]

19. false equivalence is one of the favorite tools of bigots and hatemongers.

[Joinfortmill]

3. Yes, the GOP has morphed into a Nationalist Fascist Party. Beware!

[BSdetect]

5. Coupled to a flawed system where states determine voting conditions for a federal election

[betsuni]

6. Why I think the whole "Democrats are bad at messaging" thing is bullshit.

[samplegirl]

8. If they had there way

they would sweep anything of importance under the rug as if it never happened.
And do so! Look at mini Hitler Gaetz who has come out and announced there will be no nicey nice when
He, Taylor-Greene, and Boebert are running the show.
We can’t afford to stall and wait until that becomes reality.

[kairos12]

11. My refrain has always been NO accommodation with evil. Ever.

[ymetca]

13. Remember Obama's so-called "Apology Tour"?

Namby pamby Dems feel the need to apologize for past American "transgressions" (aka Crimes Against Humanity), and all that does is make our enemies (which we keep enlarging in numbers, strangely) want to kill us even more!

Now that we've realized that "we" Americans are the bad guys, we have no choice but to double-down, since everybody knows that payback's a bitch.

Thus our National Defense expenditures keep going up and up and up, year after year, hastening toward our inevitable, inexorably collapse as a viable "player" in the world of geopolitics. We just can't be trusted anymore.

It was only a matter of time until the "two superpowers" era of grinding out every last piece of material from the planet for dominance and submission games would begin to implode. It started with the USSR. Now it's the Good 'ol US of A's time in the barrel.

Maybe the way out of this is for us to finally admit that we are, indeed, the bad guys now (mea culpa, Vatican style and all that), and instead of arming the world for fun and profit, start showering the world with free goods and services instead. It'd be cheaper in the long run, than what we are heading toward now.

All this talk about our fellow citizens as being more "deplorable" then "us" strikes me as the pot calling the kettle black. We are all culpable for what our so-called "leaders" have done, because we fund it, and are a part of it. We're kind of at the Truth and Reconciliation phase of our nation's existence, IMHO. Maybe that's just me, but that's how I see it anyway.

I feel bad for what we've done to the world, to our fellow human beings on this planet. And apologies ain't gonna cut it no more.

The idea of so-called American Exceptionalism is still a possibility. But only if we turn things around. That's not gonna happen with more guns, bombs and threats to each other.

I don't want to pry your gun from your cold dead hands. I'd like you to no longer feel you need it, and hand it over gladly, so we can together melt it down into the plowshares this world truly needs.

[NanceGreggs]

14. And this has exactly what to do ...

... with Republicans being racist bigots who are stupid enough to burn books, swallow utterly ludicrous conspiracy theories, and follow the Dear Leader of their cult without question?

[ymetca]

17. My brother in law is one of them

He looks at me with suspicion, but I just persist in being a decent human being with him, insisting that we're all just trying to survive here. I don't hate him, even if he thinks I am what's wrong with America. I make my case. He makes his. But nobody throws punches or makes threats. Not always easy. Hate begets hate. It has to stop somewhere.

Sorry if my post felt inappropriate in response.

[dalton99a]

16. Kick

[Poiuyt]

18. I'm through being accommodating

Fuck them