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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWow.... Bill Maher spot on!!! Support for trump dropping
among R's. LAST thing we need to do is feed the trump meme that we are all looking down on them. Resist the urge to say "I told you so".
ItsjustMe
(11,245 posts)Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)griffi94
(3,733 posts)I'm all for giving it a try. However, after 40 years of hate radio, conservatives view anybody
not as conservative as a blood enemy. DeSantis or Hawley will pick up where Trump went down. They won't have
a glaring connection to Putin. In 3 months they'll be right back where they are now. Yammering about wokeness, socialism, and CRT.
LenaBaby61
(6,977 posts)PatSeg
(47,587 posts)and I do think we should exercise some caution, so that we don't come across as intolerant and dickish as republicans, but it is not going to be easy being they have endorsed violence, intolerance, and even treason. There are some things that cannot be condoned or excused.
Forgiveness is one thing, but there are some people, especially in positions of power who must be held accountable. History has shown that such people often come back unrepentant and destructive when given too much leniency.
ChazII
(6,206 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)So, for that reason, there won't be any "I told you so" moments.
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... Putler and his anti democracy tactics they're implementing in America TODAY.
OAITW r.2.0
(24,610 posts)This guy probably has a fair amount of Republican viewers that watch his show....maybe straight talk will puncture their information bubble.
RAB910
(3,509 posts)and that shouldn't be forgotten
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)People everywhere are doing the right thing because it is obviously the right thing not because someone told them to act that way. And that's why people around the world are seeing and reacting so strongly to this.
I think it's extremely important not to disturb this. Not to brag and say I told you so. Not to diminish what has happened by calling out people who are against it but to just let the goodness happen since it speaks loud and clear. It is the time to only concentrate on praise of the people there. And praise of other country's before our own.
BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)empedocles
(15,751 posts)Well put.
Very important marker for international relations.
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... Putlers plans in regards to anti democracy efforts.
No, they don't get out of this because they're against what America and what UKR stands for
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)100%
Just saying it's the perfect time to try a different approach. There could not be a more perfect time than this. And it gives the crazies an off ramp.
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... to come together with people who want to do what Putler is doing.
Texas mail in ballot primaries are a 100% shit show because of Putin/Republican Anti democracy laws.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)peel off the wrong side.
No one hates their side more than I do.
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... and trolling shit which is 90% of the GQP) but actually screwing the country up with anti democracy laws aren't going to come together.
They are hell bent on turning this nation into Texas / Belarus
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... support TFG and Putler save a few.
The poll he mention is of the constituents not the Putler lovers in congress.
THEY ... THEY Need to change their words and deeds to match the moment and they're NOT.
I'm not talking about the average rep voter ... its the pols who are making the anti voter laws.
They stop with those laws then maybe we should talk outside of that fuck em
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... at but the average rep isn't the people who vote during primaries.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)uponit7771
(90,364 posts)is going to take more work to route out.
I'm so pissed about the 40% mail in ballot rejections in Texas, a lot of warned people GOTv doesn't work against anti access laws and last minute rule changes.
Until the GQP changes on this ... we're in a fight ... too
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)to crawl on broken glass to vote. For those who can not we'll have to redouble our GOTV in swamps like TX for sure
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... and GQP pols are still aligning with his goals.
Look at Texas, 40% rejection of mail in ballot because the TX legislature changed the voting laws at the last minute then have people less than a month to find out their ballot was wrong and correct it.
That's not "People everywhere are doing the right thing ..."
Torchlight
(3,361 posts)'It's more profitable to apologize afterwards than to ask permission beforehand.'
LenaBaby61
(6,977 posts)Bluesaph
(703 posts)We definitely need to tie all republicans to trump! But if we want to Attract independents who fell for trump we need to be nice.
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)... cross voters, I don't trust his views any longer they're too sympathetic to GQP talking points.
ecstatic
(32,731 posts)WhiskeyGrinder
(22,432 posts)Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)WhiskeyGrinder
(22,432 posts)Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)trump & other crazies' support.
BannonsLiver
(16,448 posts)Is to not really bring it up again after they make the disclosure they no longer support Trump. My experience with a half dozen or so is that they are embarrassed. Once theyve come around I find it more helpful to focus on areas where there is agreement and try to work through issues where there is not. Spiking the football probably wouldnt make that easier. But I understand those on our side who just cant do that as well.
PJMcK
(22,048 posts)Maher is wrong on this as he so often is on other issues.
First, the Republicans haven't turned their backs on Trump, even if he's getting a small percentage drop in his support. At the CPAC conference last weekend, Trump was by far the straw-pole favorite to be the GOP nominee in 2024.
Second, There are still plenty of Republicans in positions of political power and influence who continue The Big Lie and constantly insult anyone to the left of Genghis Kahn. For example, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Loren Boebert, Matt Gaetz, Louis Gohmert, Sarah Palin, Paul Gosar, Josh Hawley and Rand Paul-- among many others-- have recently made many disparaging and nasty or insulting comments about Democrats and President Biden. Why in the world should we respect or compromise with them?! Get real, Bill.
Lastly, Republicans around the country at the state level have been furiously rewriting their voting laws, gerrymandering their voting districts, purging their voting lists and creating legislative ways to overrule the will of the voters. They know they will lose elections if there are fair, open and honest elections. Maher expects us to be magnanimous? Fuck them and fuck Bill.
Perhaps Maher has a good point about the way to engage with our enemies after they are defeated. But the political war in the U.S. isn't over yet. It's way too early to be accommodating to the traitorous Republicans who haven't demonstrated a drop of contrition. Maybe later but otherwise our fight continues.
Response to PJMcK (Reply #15)
USALiberal This message was self-deleted by its author.
jcgoldie
(11,645 posts)Both sides asshole is what he is. GOP needs to be tied to Trump by the neck especially his comments about Putin.
Meadowoak
(5,558 posts)USALiberal
(10,877 posts)jcgoldie
(11,645 posts)I mean for political expediency you have to make them own their very unpopular position not weasel off the hook. A week ago Trump and many of his gop followers were praising how smart and savvy putin was now that they dont like images of civilians being murdered and white ones at that they dont get to pretend they werent pro putin all along. Aww we know you didnt mean it guys
TheRealNorth
(9,500 posts)Is that if you let them get away with it, they will try to rewrite history and suggest it was Biden and the Democratic Party that didn't support Ukraine.
I saw this firsthand with my MAGAT relatives in 2016- they ranted and screamed about Hillary "supporting" the Iraq War (by voting to authorize military action against Iraq), even though all the Republicans had supported that war and those same relatives had accused me of supporting the terrorists because I protested in the lead up to the Iraq War.
In summary, they will gaslight us and the media into believing they were really the ones supporting Ukraine if we let them.
gopiscrap
(23,765 posts)republican are the shit stains of humanity and deserve to be obliterated from the face of the earth
LuckyCharms
(17,458 posts)is pretend they change, pretend they have seen the light, when a societal inflection point is perceived by them. When they know that society as a whole perceives them as outcasts.
When they can't wear their MAGA hats anymore.
When they can't shoot their mouths off about politics every 30 seconds without getting verbally slapped down.
So what they do is pretend they have changed, pretend they have gravitated more toward normalcy. They might even say that they were wrong. But have their hearts and minds done a 180, truly? When the next asshole with skin that is a color not found in nature comes along, will they just revert back to their old ways? Yes, they probably will.
People do what they need to do to get along in life. When it is apparent to them that the vast majority of people they encounter think they are motherfuckers, then they stop behaving like motherfuckers, just to make their lives easier. "I used to be a real motherfucker, but I'm not a motherfucker anymore. Putin sucks, man! I'm working on my racism! I support Ukraine!"
OK, that's fine. but that does not mean I have to welcome them into my life with open arms. They fucked everyone else right up the old poop chute for years without a second thought. I have no obligation to forgive that. I do have an obligation not to go out of my way to be a total prick to them, but by my way of thinking, I'm better off just politely ignoring them.
Because they revealed what they are, and the vast majority of them have not changed, and will never change. They pose a risk to me, and to my country with their gullibility.
Xoan
(25,323 posts)Ask for forgiveness?
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)genxlib
(5,535 posts)Think of it like a subway station.
Once they get off the crazy train, which direction are they going.
I will work towards forgiveness if they are catching a train in the opposite direction back to reality. That comes with recognition of a mistake and remorse for the ill effects.
But if they are simply changing trains to continue on in the same direction, then to hell with them.
Until I see otherwise, it is almost certainly the latter.
Baked Potato
(7,733 posts)people voting against their own well being. It will take much work to get these people to come around. We shouldnt give up on them. They can change. They have to be shown a way out of Republican hold and out of Trumps rallies. The way out has to be crafted so people can cross over or come back to Democrats with dignity. Chiding them and pointing out their failings is short-term satisfaction, but ultimately counterproductive and feeds the cycle of mistrust and hatred towards Democrats. There is a compromise which, if utilized, can ensure a Democratic dominancy which can render Republicanism obsolete in a country thirsting for equality.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213474363
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)R to fall back on.
Baked Potato
(7,733 posts)A few thousand here and there can make a difference. Nobody like to be disrespected.
Santeria
(18 posts)At least enough of it where it would seriously become a liability within the Republican Party to support him.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)Still, the Donald Trump of 2022 does not look quite like the Donald Trump of old. One indication of this change came with the release of a new poll from NBC News. Over the course of Trumps presidency and since he left office, the poll has tracked attitudes of Republicans, asking them whether they see themselves mainly as supporters of Trump or mainly supporters of the party itself.
On the eve of the 2020 election, 54 percent of Republicans and independents who lean Republican said they considered themselves more a supporter of Trump than of the Republican Party, compared with 38 percent who said they considered themselves more a supporter of the Republican Party. By January 2021, views were evenly divided, with 46 percent saying Trump and 46 percent saying the GOP.
The latest poll, released last weekend, shows a reversal in attitudes, compared with the pre-election 2020 survey, and a further decline from last January. Today, 56 percent of Republicans say they are more supporters of the party than of Trump, while 36 percent say they are more supporters of Trump than the party.
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)Chipping away at the crazy people
uponit7771
(90,364 posts)GoodRaisin
(8,929 posts)Saying they support the Party I guess is a mild improvement from supporting the slobfather but their Republican agenda is still shit. No matter which Rs they vote for they are still Rs.
wiggs
(7,817 posts)will gladly get on the DeSantis/Green/Cruz/Paul bandwagon...anyone who gives them permission to be their worst selves, hate anyone they hate, and own the libs.
Lots of assholes want to be the next Trump and now have the playbook.
JustAnotherGen
(31,886 posts)I'll make my own decisions, and own my own behavior.
Personal Friend of mine, Mayor of my Town - and she WILL win re-election this November:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/n-j-mayor-ignores-calls-resign-over-profane-social-media-n1243557
We are surrounded by a sea of Red in Hunterdon county and have heard and see the worst of the worst of these people.
I will NEVER be friends or give them respect. Their votes (not once - but twice) tells me they look down on ME and my very existence.
I'm with Betsy to Republicans - and I mean it.
I'm not saying "I told you so". I'm saying - "You don't count to me - just like non white, non Christian, non heterosexual people don't count to the GOP".
Turn about is fair play - never up for discussion or debate with me. It's always fair play in surviving racist, homophobic Christian Shariah law implementing unAmerican 'its'.
Wake up Billy boy - they aren't your friends. Oh yeah - you are also a Millionaire many times over - so who the hell are you to talk down to ME Billy boy?
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)tenderfoot
(8,438 posts)They won't try 1/6 again!
Kingofalldems
(38,476 posts)We're supposed to be nice to the MAGAts now?
They literally want us dead.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)Talking about chipping away at FG support based on his being on the wrong side of Ukraine. Only. Incremental because this has been handed to us on a silver platter.
I_have_a_cat_bite
(38 posts)Some of his arguments sound like they were taken straight from 4chan trolls and my conservative grandfather.
JHB
(37,161 posts)How many decades of conservatives seizing upon any comment to take offense at will it take to get some people (not just Mahar) to stop blaming us for their foam?
Why are we responsible for the behavior of "the party of personal responsibility"?
I_have_a_cat_bite
(38 posts)I don't care what is said about them. We are called communists, marxists, and baby killers. My mom was run off the road after Trump became president and yelled at about her Obama sticker. She came home shaking. This is after they won. They really just want to get rid of us all.
budkin
(6,714 posts)He's quickly becoming another Joe Rogan.
lame54
(35,321 posts)We are in mid conflict - to soon to drop defenses
CPAC just made Trump their guy
displacedtexan
(15,696 posts)Post Civil War. Nixon. Dubya. Trump
Orrex
(63,224 posts)But a spineless, cowardly asshole who would be happy to continue servicing Trump--if not for the embarrassment of popular sentiment--is a self-serving hypocrite who will absolutely vote for the next GOP fascist who comes along.
ecstatic
(32,731 posts)They don't give two shits about hurting our feelings; in fact, from what I've been told, they specifically flocked to trump to "own the libs." But I guess for me it's a moot point since I don't interact with trumpers on this level anyway.