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Hugabear

(10,340 posts)
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:13 PM Oct 2012

Help me understand: how will the cold front actually make Sandy stronger?

Usually, when hurricanes encounter colder temperatures, they weaken. Yet some reports that I've ready indicate that the approaching cold front may actually strengthen Hurricane Sandy.

I'm not doubting the experts, but is there some meteorological explanation that I'm missing here?

24 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Help me understand: how will the cold front actually make Sandy stronger? (Original Post) Hugabear Oct 2012 OP
I think it's because it is forming a wall that keeps the storm in place. Armstead Oct 2012 #1
There is a high parked east of it, pushing it inland nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #3
Because the lows are getting stronger nadinbrzezinski Oct 2012 #2
Here is a detailed analysis Xipe Totec Oct 2012 #4
It's temperature differentials that determine the strength of storms. MineralMan Oct 2012 #5
This thing is like a very wide low speed tornado. RobertEarl Oct 2012 #23
2 reasons Botany Oct 2012 #6
Read the book "The Perfect Storm" obamanut2012 Oct 2012 #7
Cold fronts spin counter-clockwise, so the cold front will "suck" the storm further inland. Major Hogwash Oct 2012 #8
And the wind from the hurricane is already travellin' east to west dipsydoodle Oct 2012 #12
Here you go. Blue_In_AK Oct 2012 #9
I lost track of your other post dipsydoodle Oct 2012 #13
I'm no weather expert, Blue_In_AK Oct 2012 #19
It's also why there will be snow, SheilaT Oct 2012 #10
Because it will park her over Harrisburg, PA (where I am) for 24-48 hours. HopeHoops Oct 2012 #11
all that rain for 48 hours....oh man, you are in trouble DonRedwood Oct 2012 #15
We have good drainage. I'm worried about other people. The wind is our biggest concern. HopeHoops Oct 2012 #16
IF the cold front brings DRY air Lex Oct 2012 #14
This Might Help... WillyT Oct 2012 #17
So if you are good at 'splaining things, can you clarify this storm for me Samantha Oct 2012 #18
Hi Sam. Not much beyond very nasty weather cthulu2016 Oct 2012 #20
Thank you so much, cthulu2016 Samantha Oct 2012 #24
Enthalpy of Vaporization (in reverse) slutticus Oct 2012 #21
Thats why the wind blows RobertEarl Oct 2012 #22
 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
1. I think it's because it is forming a wall that keeps the storm in place.
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:14 PM
Oct 2012

That's what I've heard...Might be wrong though.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
2. Because the lows are getting stronger
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:16 PM
Oct 2012

You got three centers of low pressure mixing into a strong nor'easter. This s why you have no tropical weather warnings any more.

MineralMan

(146,309 posts)
5. It's temperature differentials that determine the strength of storms.
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:18 PM
Oct 2012

For example, in Minnesota, our very worst thunderstorms come when a cold front meets warmer, moisture laden air. The cold air dives under the warm air, creating upward circulation underneath and creating a region that has a large temperature differential. Lots of energy with that combination.

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
23. This thing is like a very wide low speed tornado.
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 07:13 PM
Oct 2012

Wind in the north side is blowing to the west from the east. The wind on the south side is blowing from the west to the east.

The south side is up to 20 degrees colder than the north side. The circulation turns to the left. Warm wind from the east then from the north and then from west back to east. It is only about a 1,000 mile wide tornado, and blowing at just an average speed of 40 mph. A huge low speed tornado.

As a comparison, Andrew was like a huge fast tornado, only about 100 miles wide. Katrina was about 200 miles wide. As these systems compact the winds become much more forceful.

Botany

(70,506 posts)
6. 2 reasons
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:18 PM
Oct 2012

1) When you have two fronts coming together you can spin off high winds and
tornado activity

2) The cold front coming from the north west and a stationary high pressure
cell in the North Atlantic will force the hurricane into a narrow "channel" to the
north and west which will focus the storms energy into a relatively narrow
area of land.

obamanut2012

(26,076 posts)
7. Read the book "The Perfect Storm"
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:27 PM
Oct 2012

Seriously! It explains so much of this, and it's just fascinating, even to a non-sciencey type like myself.

Major Hogwash

(17,656 posts)
8. Cold fronts spin counter-clockwise, so the cold front will "suck" the storm further inland.
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:33 PM
Oct 2012

Thus increasing the wind speeds, bringing more moisture from the Atlantic Ocean farther inland.
Therefore, the amount of moisture sucked up into the eyewalls of the hurricane will increase and will rise higher than what it would have without the cold front's "sucking" effect.
When moisture rises that high in the air, it is pushed farther by the winds before it falls in the form of rain or snow, so this Frankenstorm will affect inland areas much farther from the coast than normal.

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)
13. I lost track of your other post
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 03:58 PM
Oct 2012

before I could ask a question.

The arctic cold and the jet stream just are , although the jet stream can move about a bit , so why doesn't that happen throughout the winter ? Or does it anyway ?

I'm UK so can't really relate to this hooligan weather.

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
19. I'm no weather expert,
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 06:37 PM
Oct 2012

But the jet stream does move around quite a bit. It affects our winters by bringing sudden warm winds sometimes, going from below zero to mid 40s in a a matter of hours.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
10. It's also why there will be snow,
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 02:49 PM
Oct 2012

and blizzard conditions in parts of West Virginia and Maryland.

 

HopeHoops

(47,675 posts)
11. Because it will park her over Harrisburg, PA (where I am) for 24-48 hours.
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 03:48 PM
Oct 2012

Parking makes the system build steam. It will also turn it to the right (satellite view) toward State College on her way to New York. Either way, we're fucked. Harrisburg is also a low pressure zone right now - bad combination. This is going to get nastier than it already is (and it's nasty now).

 

HopeHoops

(47,675 posts)
16. We have good drainage. I'm worried about other people. The wind is our biggest concern.
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 04:10 PM
Oct 2012

The roof is new, but that doesn't mean it will hold up. The trees and shrubs are in danger. I think the cars are in safe spots, at least based on past storms. But hell, this thing is fucking HUGE!

Samantha

(9,314 posts)
18. So if you are good at 'splaining things, can you clarify this storm for me
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 04:40 PM
Oct 2012

I am sitting in College Park, MD, 15 miles outside of DC. What do you think will happen here when the storm actually hits? I am very bad at these things. I keep looking at the maps, reading the info and I have formed a general opinion, but I am totally unsure of it. So any prediction would be greatly appreciated. It has been raining here since last evening, occasionally now we are getting some kind of quick gusts of wind, I expect all this to increase when the storm actually lands, but from what the local weather people said last night, we will be in the worst of it from this evening until tomorrow evening. What is the worst of it? I thought before 80 mph winds and perhaps 8 inches of rain for this area, but I just don't know now.

Sam

cthulu2016

(10,960 posts)
20. Hi Sam. Not much beyond very nasty weather
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 06:44 PM
Oct 2012

In College Park you'll have 40-50 MPH winds gusting to 70 and it will rain buckets, but if you are indoors it should just be a night of really nasty weather outside.

This is assuming that you are not in a flood area—I think of College Park as pretty well elevated.

The only big question for you is whether you lose power or not.

Samantha

(9,314 posts)
24. Thank you so much, cthulu2016
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 07:40 PM
Oct 2012

I had kind of thought maybe 8 inches of rain, high gusts of wind, maybe loss of power some time tonight. I don't know if College Park would be considered a flood area or not; my neighbor says it was built on a swamp (like DC). But someone visiting me told me he thought we might have some trees come down tonight because the ground is so soggy. It has been raining since last night.

I do think I am not in as bad a situation as those in NJ or NY and I really feel for them.

To the west about 150 miles is my small place in WV and the news said there is a blizzard going on on that area. What a rough night.

Sam

slutticus

(3,428 posts)
21. Enthalpy of Vaporization (in reverse)
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 06:44 PM
Oct 2012

Phase changes of water release massive amounts of energy.

Imagine all of the water vapor in sandy suddenly condensing, and every molecule in your body exploding at the speed of light. Total protonic reversal.


 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
22. Thats why the wind blows
Mon Oct 29, 2012, 07:01 PM
Oct 2012

Warm air from the Atlantic is blowing into the cold air from Alaska. Not only does the warm moisture laden air rise, causing a wind, the release of the energy in the warm air also causes wind as the ice falling from the sky displaces air below.

This storm has always had its highest winds to the southwest. That is because that is where the warm air and cold air are meeting.

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