Hopping mad at the USPS and at my bank

[totodeinhere]

I hope that this post will help me to blow off some steam. I found out today that a personal check that I mailed via the USPS ten days ago never arrived. I sent the letter via priority mail and got a delivery confirmation receipt. Well, by entering the receipt's tracking number at the USPS website I was able to determine that the letter arrived at the Postal Service sorting center in the town where the person I sent the check to lives. But that was the last time the letter was seen. It was never delivered.

This incompetence upsets me. And since the check was for a fairly large amount of money I decided to call my bank to stop payment on the check in case the check falls into the wrong hands and someone tries to cash it. Then that's when my second dose of bad news arrived. My bank informed me that I would be charged a $30 fee to stop payment on the check. I asked them to waive the fee and they refused. This really upsets me. I did nothing wrong. The Postal service did something wrong and now I am the one suffering due to no fault of my own. And I doubt very seriously if the USPS will reimburse me that $30 or the $5 it cost to mail the letter.

People wonder why the Postal Service is in trouble. Well, debacles like this might be part of the reason.

And now since I had this bad experience with the USPS I think I will wire the money this time and that will cost me even more money.

And I just can't get over my greedy bank charging me that ridiculous fee even though I have done absolutely nothing wrong.

I have steam coming put of my ears.

[libinnyandia]

1. Can you change banks?

[totodeinhere]

3. Yes and I should have done that already. I was lazy.

But not having been smart enough to change banks before doesn't mean I deserve this. And it won't help me get my $30 back and it won't mitigate my anger at the USPS.

[Lisa D]

8. Tell them the $30 fee is why you're changing banks

and they might waive it. Then you can always change banks at a later date.

[Generic Brad]

49. You really think your bank is responsible for the USPS's error?

When you opened up your bank account you were provided a disclosure that told you what they charge to stop a payment. And you consider them greedy because they are charging you what they told you up front the charge would be for that service?

Your problem is with the post office, not your bank.

[totodeinhere]

53. And then I have other people in this same thread telling me that I am using this as an excuse

to bash the Postal Service. I guess I can't win no matter what I say.

[Generic Brad]

62. I understand your feelings towards the post office

Their error is costing you more money. I would be outraged over the situation as well.

[cyglet]

2. Sorry this happened

but next time, send it registered mail....then it has to be signed for by anyone who touches it, anywhere it goes.

[d_r]

4. on dec. 30 2011

i mailed a check at the very post office that contained the po box i was sending it to. it arrived yesterday. postmarked dec. 30. i know because i had already given the person another check. weird smack happens. they may be able to find it at that post office. you should call them.

[totodeinhere]

5. Yes, it is too late to call tonight but I will call them tomorrow.

And I will give them a piece of my mind.

[d_r]

6. i understand and wouldnt blame you

but you know you ll catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

[totodeinhere]

7. My supply of honey is running rather low right now. n/t

[SeattleVet]

20. Honey isn't the only thing that gets flies...

there are a lot more unpleasant substances that are far better for the task.

[MarianJack]

9. Once upon a time...

...bank robbery was done by guys with masks and guns.

Today it's the new term for "Customer Service".

I will go nowhere other than a 1 or 2 brance Credit Union. Not that they are any better, but I like being a name and face to them rather than a number. They know that I'll be in there raising hell if I get screwed.

PEACE!

[customerserviceguy]

11. We had some really good multi-branch credit unions out in the Pacific Northwest

Columbia Credit Union in Vancouver, WA, and Our Community CU in Shelton, WA were high qualty outfits. I still belong to the latter one, even though I moved out here nearly five years ago.

[MarianJack]

12. We have plenty of good small credit unionsup here in Maine.

The one we belong to now has a branch here in Augusta and another one in Portland.

PEACE!

[customerserviceguy]

22. Great!

The ones I've tried in NY and NJ are not ready for prime time, so I use a small community bank.

You have some really good microbrew up there in Maine, as well!

[MarianJack]

27. My wife can attest to the microbrews' quality

I've been in recovery for 22 years. In fact, TODAY is my 22nd anniversary. Today is also 14 years since my wife stopped smoking!

Come on up soon & have some more of those great beers!

PEACE!

[customerserviceguy]

10. Checks and USPS

So very 19th Century. Why couldn't you just PayPal the money? If you funded the payment with a credit card (as opposed to a debit card) you'd even have the option of doing a chargeback if whatever you were buying with the money never arrived.

Delivery confirmation is just what you use to show that you never got a package or letter that somebody mailed to you, so you can make a claim on eBay or whatever. It really doesn't mean squat. Registered mail is the only thing to use for something of any real value.

[totodeinhere]

13. Well you live and learn. Yes in hindsight I realize that I should have used a different payment

method.

But that doesn't in any way excuse the USPS for losing that letter. They are not supposed to lose mail. It's their fault, not mine. 19th Century or not, if they provide that service they should not botch it up.

On edit - And of course that's one reason why the USPS is in trouble. People are using other methods rather than the mail.

[customerserviceguy]

21. Yes, it is their fault

But you know the old saying, "fool me once..."

It's part of the death spiral that the USPS is locked in. Service suffers, people go elsewhere, causing a loss of revenue and a "who gives a damn" attitude. Lather, rinse, repeat.

I refuse to stay on the sinking ship, no matter how unpatriotic or anti-union it makes me look to others.

[treestar]

14. The USPS is at fault

The bank's not - and they performed the extra service. Of course we all hate that type of fee, but they do something in return for it.

The USPS could be willing to reimburse the fee - at this point they may be trying to save themselves, so they may be interested in some customer service. If they just say "too bad" when it comes to their mistakes (as government agencies like to do at times) that'll lend to the arguments against them.

Just say some signs outside my PO today - another one, a big distribution center, may be shut down. There is defensive like information on the signs - about how the PO does not use taxpayer money, and how its pensions caused the problems and how that is Congress' fault.

[Lionessa]

25. I agree, if a package is destroyed, they cover it, why not this fee?

[sad sally]

15. from "The Postman"

He wasn't ready yet to face removing the jacket draped over the skeleton's narrow shoulders. Gordon grabbed sacks -- bearing the imprint U.S. POSTAL SERVICE -- and piled them about himself. Leaving a narrow opening in the door to let in fresh mountain air, he burrowed under the makeshift blankets with his bottle.
At last he looked over at his host, contemplating the dead civil servant's American flag shoulder patch. He unscrewed the flask and this time raised the container toward the hooded garment.
"Believe it or not, Mr. Postman, I always thought you folks gave good and honest service. Oh, people used you as whipping boys a lot, but I know what a tough job you all had. I was proud of you, even before the war.
"But this, Mr. Mailman" -- he lifted the flask -- "this goes beyond anything I'd come to expect! I consider my taxes very well spent." He drank to the postman, coughing a little but relishing the warm glow.

http://www.davidbrin.com/postman1.htm?du

[baldguy]

16. The same shit happens with UPS and FedEx.

It's not unique to the Post Office.

[totodeinhere]

17. If had had used UPS or FedEx and that happened I would also be angry at them.

Just because someone else might do the same thing doesn't excuse it. I didn't intend this as an anti USPS message. After all, I chose to use them in the first place.

[matt819]

18. My 2 cents

I don't use any postal or courier service to send checks. There are just too many other, more secure options.

However, I use both the USPS and UPS to send packages, thousands over the past several years. There have been delays with UPS, but nothing ever lost. USPS delivers more quickly to more distant locations, and often cheaper than UPS, and I can count on one hand the number of problems. In one case, a package was not delivered, and in another, an express mail package was delivered two days late. That's out of thousands. So, while I bitch and moan about delays and shipping costs, overall I've been pretty fortunate. And when I take a deep breath and consider the big picture, all of them are pretty impressive.

As for your letter, since the tracking showed that it was delivered to the post office, provided that post office isn't in a large city it should be fairly routine for them to take a closer look for it. I know that my local post office (town of a few thousand) would do that in a flash.

Regarding the banks - well, that's another story. My small town bank has a list of about 50 fees. It sucks, but it's become standard practice. And, yes, you may find credit unions or some other small bank that doesn't apply a fee for everything they do (or claim to do), but, in the end it's a tradeoff. You balance those fees, customer service, banking hours, ATM, etc., etc., and make the best decision you can at the time.

[baldguy]

19. Trust me - UPS and FedEx lose stuff ALL THE TIME.

I've shipped thousands of letters and packages for business over the last 25 yrs with each carrier.

[matt819]

61. I'm just suggesting some perspective

I've also shipped thousands, and I have to tell you, I'm amazed at how few items go astray. Sure, there are delays, inbound and out, and multi-package shipments get separated as often as not. And there's no question that some packages arrive looking like they'be been to hell and back. But I've never had to file a claim.

Look, I have my problems with UPS, but it's almost exclusively on the services side of things - billing, adjustments, etc., and I'm convinced that they are defrauding their shippers in one way or another. But losing packages? I'm one of the lucky ones, I guess.

In some way, I think it helps that I've gotten to know my UPS and FedEx delivery guys as well as the letter carrier and the folks at the post office. So I know they do a good job, seem to care about providing decent service with smile, and thus I'm more inclined to view things favorably - the benefits, maybe, of living in a small town and bumping into these folks daily.

[Honeycombe8]

52. Sorry. This won't happen with FedEx...

you ask for a signature on delivery (no extra fee). If the item disappears, you have the signature of the person who was responsible for it ... and likely the one who stole it.

I've been using FedEx for years. Any time I've required a signature, not once has the item been lost.

UPS charges $4 extra to get a signature, and they won't get one from a residence, if that's where you're sending your item.

Our office has used FedEx for letters and packages for many years. In 25 years of using FedEx, there has been only one time where a box ended up missing (signature wasn't required). Even then, we were able to track it to a particular warehouse; FedEx was able to find out that the box sort of fell apart (it hadn't been taped properly), and the contents lost.

I highly recommend FedEx. Not so sure about UPS. But with USPS...twice over a year ago I sent card with DVD and a package to relative in a nursing home. She didn't get either. They were clearly stolen. Twice in recent years mail carriers in USPS have been arrested for stealing mail, particularly around holiday time. One was a ring where they'd sell identity information to rings of identity theft people. The other were some guys stealing packages where signatures weren't required, which they'd steal and sell items or whatever.

[baldguy]

54. And when you look it up to see who signed for it, it says "Reception" or "Front desk"

Or it says "John Smith", or it's entirely illegible. As long as they can prove they delivered to the correct address (which they always do) and a human being signed for it, they're off the hook.

I've worked for a couple different companies, each of which shipped thousands of packages each day mostly with Fedex & UPS, but they also did some shipments with the USPS. The only difference I've seen is that Fedex & UPS - because they track their packages - can tell you when it's is lost sooner.

You also have to take into account the fact that there are large areas of the country where Fedex & UPS don't deliver at all, but where the USPS does. And without any premium in price either.

[Honeycombe8]

55. FedEx always gets a name, not job title or location. FedEx provides the TYPED name

in addition to the signature. I have seen where they get only a first initial and then the last name. That's enough to identify someone.

[baldguy]

57. No they don't "always". Are you kidding?

Just this week I tried to track three packages with Fedex (again, out of the several hundreds we do each day). They were each going to a different person in a different department at a large university. They were all addressed properly to specific individuals. This particular institution doesn't have a central receiving, so each package should have been delivered separately to each department.

They weren't.

Instead, the tracking says they were "delivered" all at the same time, but with an illegible scrawl for a signature. None of the recipients for these packages at the university have received their shipments, but as far as Fedex is concerned they were all delivered properly. I'm still waiting for a trace to be completed, but from my experience dealing with Fedex I know that we'll have to write off these three packages as lost and ship them again at no charge.

And this is not an isolated event; something similar happens 2-3 times a week for with Fedex and UPS shipments made by my company.

[Honeycombe8]

64. No, I'm not kidding. I suspect you didn't require "adult signature."

On my tracking at fedex.com, there has always been a typed signature. This is included in the email that was sent to you, BTW, from Fedex, confirming that it was delivered and signed for. (You checked that you wanted a delivery confirmation email, right?) In the email, signatures aren't copied. It's a typed email, containing the TYPED name of the person who signed for it.

It sounds like maybe you're not very familiar with the procedures of FedEx. I've been using them regularly for over 25 years. By regularly, I mean that I've used them many hundreds of times. I really do know what I'm talking about here.

Look at your delivery email. It will contain the name of hte person who signed. Since it's not a copy of anything that was signed, the entire email will be typed. You have to look for the name, but it's there.

If the person who signed for it didn't deliver it to the person who was supposed to receive it, that is not FedEx's fault. Call FedEx and ask for the name of the person who signed, if you can't find the typed name. You will have to call that person and ask what s/he did with the package.

You also have the option of FedEx keeping the package at a location, and requiring the person you are delivering to to go pick it up. You can also require that ONLY the direct recipient may sign for it. That delays delivery, so I never require that. But it wouldn't delay delivery, if you tell FedEx to "hold" the package for pickup.

[baldguy]

67. And I suspect that there aren't many 8 yr olds running around accepting Fedex packages

in Fortune 500 corporations, federal govt agencies and university campuses.



Get real.

[Fla_Democrat]

23. I've had issues with my local P.O.

Hmmm, P.O. yea, I was.

The most recent stupidity, was the delivery of two, "letters" from Netflix. Which were basically the trash from the mailer, the part with my address that I would tear off and throw away when I mailed the movie back. If the movie actually arrived. Stamped.. Received with no content.. XXXXX (local zip code). I've had mail go missing, movies cleared my que (I guess miss delivered and the wrong recipients mailed them back after watching), bills show up pre-'shredded', to the point I had to recreate the bill and envelope to mail my payment back.

Their solution was for me to get a P.O. Box..... what good would that do? It's the same line of people handling, er, mishandling my mail, I'd just be saving the carrier some gas. If it's pristine to the step of the local carrier, and he is tearing it to crap.. fire the guy. If not, WTF would a box do?

[Lionessa]

24. Oh, please, it's not like these and much worse happen at UPS, Fed Ex and the yellow one.

It sounds like you have a bank problem not a USPS problem. If the check was so important you should've spent the extra few buck to send it return receipt and registered.

Also $30 has been the standard that I'm aware of for at least the last 10 years for stop payment on checks, it's not new nor higher than usual.

Lastly have you checked with USPS, just as they will cover broken items, they may cover the $30 fee since the mail loss is clearly their fault.

[totodeinhere]

26. Thanks for your empathy. n/t

[Lionessa]

41. Why should I give your whine fest any sympathy? And

I have no empathy regarding this because I'd never be angry or hysterical over a bank charge or a misplaced piece of mail.

[totodeinhere]

46. I object to your calling me hysterical. I am not. I was wronged plain and simple. n/t

[Lionessa]

63. A mistake has happened, plain and simple. You are dramatizing it into a "wrong."

The idea that any entity is never going to make a mistake and that someone may have to somewhat unfairly pay for that mistake is a common experience. I'm absolutely sure you've made a mistake that cost someone somewhere $30 or more at one time or another. Shit happens, no need to be hysterical or hyped or dramatic.

[Honeycombe8]

65. No, this doesn't happen with a "signature required" FedEx package.

UPS also has signature required option for non-residential deliveries, but I've used that only once, so I can't say how well that works. It worked great for me the one time I used that. But UPS charges $4 extra to get a signature from a business delivery. There is no extra charge for FedEx getting a signature. AND you can request that these services send you a "delivery confirmation" email, which will contain the typed name of the person who signed for the package, and what day and time they signed for it.

There's a reason FedEx and UPS are successful and businesses use them regularly for deliveries. The usually cost more than USPS, though. Although that is not always the case. I've found it very difficult to cost compare the USPS. It's very easy to estimate costs upfront with FedEx and UPS; their websites have a "cost estimate" button when you fill out the shipping form.

Generally, I think that if I use one of those flat rate boxes, and don't care how long it takes, and I don't need tracking, the USPS is the cheapest way to go. But my packages have been stolen that way.

[totodeinhere]

32. A mere mortal should not lose one of those big flat rate packages. And I know that the address was

correct because it was a pre-printed label. I suspect that if it were FedEx or UPS people in this thread would be all over them because they are big corporations. But they want to protect the USPS.

And yes my bank has a fee schedule. It's $30 for a stop payment order. My point is that they should waive this fee. I did nothing wrong. The USPS did something wrong. Why should I be the one who has to pay for this? It's not fair to me that I am suffering this much grief due to no fault of my own. And all it would take is a few strokes on a keyboard for my bank to fix this. No way does this cost them anywhere near $30, and they made a big profit last year.

[Lionessa]

42. Rarely has anyone not "did nothing wrong" when stop payments are required. It's almost always

either the payee, or a delivery system that failed. Normal people don't write checks and then just decide not to let them thru. Usually it's lost, or the payee didn't come up with his/her part of the bargain, things like that.

So why should all those folks who also "did nothing wrong" have to pay but you shouldn't? The bank didn't do anything wrong, that's for sure, well except for expecting people to pay to stop a check which takes them 2 secs to accomplish and should be free.

Unless and until you check with USPS to see if they'll pay the $30 since they do seem to have minimum $50 insurance on most mailings, then you're just griping instead of solving. Get a clue.

[Kellerfeller]

29. I recommend

"please contact our Track & Confirm customer service at 1-800-222-1811."

http://faq.usps.com/eCustomer/iq/usps/request.do?create=kb:USPSFAQ&view()=c%5Bc_usps0301d%5D&varset(source)=sourceType:embedded

[totodeinhere]

33. Thanks. I did. But it's too late. I already stopped payment on the check.

And they cannot reimburse me the $30 stop payment fee. The rep was very sympathetic and couldn't believe that my bank would not waive the fee, but she is powerless to do anything about it.

[Kellerfeller]

37. What did she say when you asked

what she could do after losing a piece of mail, with documentation that they lost it.??

[totodeinhere]

39. She said they would put a trace on it. But since I already paid $30 to stop payment on the check

even if they find it it will be too late. I have no problem with the rep. As I said she was very sympathetic and she did apologize. And I told her that of course I realize that it's not her fault.

[handmade34]

30. very sorry this happened... very frustrating

ugh... but, I will defend the USPS and say that it doesn't happen often and, even though it does cost a little more, I always insure anything of value --I send and I mail hundreds of packages and letters a year...

my understanding is that ALL banks charge at least $25-30 to stop payment on a check

..."Caveat emptor" ...it is a very unfortunate thing in our society today

[totodeinhere]

35. I'm not sure how insurancwe would work in this case.

Would they give me back my $400 is someone found the check and cashed it? And I do know from a friend's experience that if they lose a package and you make an insurance claim you have to go through a lot of rigamarole and wait quite a while to get it resolved.

[FarCenter]

31. You should have sent it with an ordinary first class stamp.

If the letter is in the general flow of mail, chances are very high that it will go through and be delivered expeditiously.

Sending it priorty mail with delivery confirmation takes it out of the main stream of mail and requires special handling, so stuff is more likely to happen.

So long as USPS doesn't loose more than about 1 out of 8 letters, the amount you save in postage is enough to stop payment of the lost checks and send replacements.

[totodeinhere]

38. It's kind of late for that now.

Instead of saying what I should have done, why not say what they should have done? They should have delivered my mail. I can't believe the posters in this thread who seem to want to blame me for this, not the people who are responsible for this. It's the old blame the victim schtick I guess.

And I do not make these mailing all the time. This is my first one and it will probably be my last, so there is no way that cheaper postage will get me my bank stop payment fee back.

[FarCenter]

43. I don't see why you are aggravated at your bank

They have a service for which they charge a standard fee. The bank does not differentiate why you are asking for them to stop the check.

The bank has to flag your account so that if the check turns up they can stop it from being debited from your account. Then they have to return the check to the bank of first deposit, so that the BOFD can reverse the credit and funds availability from the depositor's account. Then the BOFD has to return the check to the depositor.

All the above steps involve staff and costs for both banks.

[Doremus]

34. Not really digging all the USPS bashing going on here lately.

You lost me at the point that you paid over $5 to send a first class envelope.

[totodeinhere]

36. I didn't say it was a first class envelope.

It was one of those flat rate mailers and they do cost $5. Well, actually $4.95 now that I checked it.

https://www.usps.com/send/priority-mail-flat.htm

[Doremus]

50. That was my point. You paid $5 for Priority instead of using a simple stamp.

The only reason I can fathom for doing that is that you wanted delivery confirmation that First Class doesn't offer. Except you said you paid $4.95 for Priority. DC costs extra, so we know you didn't buy it.

We also know you didn't pay $5 so that your envelope would get there faster. Priority and First Class are both expedited shipping.


My opinion? This whole thread is nothing but an excuse to rail on the USPS.

Pretty amateurish attempt too.

[totodeinhere]

51. Should I be allowed to complain when they lose my $400 check or not?

Maybe that's not much money to some people but it is to me. And if someone loses that much of my money I am going to complain whether it is the USPS or a private company. Notice that I also complained about my bank which is a private company. This isn't about bashing a public entity or public employees.

Read this link.

http://www.customerservicescoreboard.com/US+Postal+Service

It certainly looks like I'm not the only one complaining. There are hundreds of documented complaints about poor customer service with the USPS. Are all of those hundreds of complainers also just looking for an excuse to "rail on the USPS?" Or with that many complaints on just one website could there be a legitimate problem with the USPS?

Look, I support public employees. But that doesn't mean that when any employe screws up, public or private, that I can't complain about it.

[Doremus]

59. And a handy link to a bunch of complainers. How special. Here's a link for you:

USPS Ranked Top Postal Service in World's 20 Biggest Economies:

http://postandparcel.info/44361/news/companies/usps-ranked-top-postal-service-in-worlds-20-biggest-economies/

[jillan]

44. The reason the postal service is in trouble has nothing to do with their employees. And

why didn't you just transfer the money to this person online? Most banks offer that service at no fee, and there are sites like Paypal.

[totodeinhere]

47. The person I sent the money to asked for a check.

I should be able to mail a $400 check without it's getting lost. Again, let me repeat what I said previously. It's not fair to try to blame me for this by asking why didn't I do this or that. The Postal Service offers a service called priority mail. I chose to use it. That was my choice. I have a right to expect that when I use that service the Postal Service will deliver. This isn't about what I should have done. It's about what they should have done. If they can't guarantee safe delivery of priority mail then they should withdraw the service.

[baldguy]

56. Average daily volume:

Fedex: 3.4 million

UPS: 15.6 million


USPS: 563 million


This is another reason why the USPS "seems" less efficient - They may lose or misdeliver 2x the number of packages, but they handle 30x and 180x the volume.

[Liberal_in_LA]

45. The letter was probably delivered...to the wrong address

I ordered something recently. My order was sent by the company with tracking. It was tracked right to my zipcode, where it disappeared. I am pretty sure my postal person delivered it to the wrong unit. Almost every package that is mailed to me is placed on the doorstep of other units, and they give it to me. I guess this time, it was given to someone who decided to keep it. I was just out the money for the item, because the company had tracking that showed it was delivered.

[totodeinhere]

48. Yes I considered that possibility and that's why I chose to stop payment on the check. n/t

[LiberalFighter]

58. Did you file a complaint with both the post office that last had possession

and their superior?

Complaints are important. To the right people.

[Honeycombe8]

66. I'm unfamilar with "delivery confirmation receipt." Did you send it "certified mail"?

Certified is when you fill out that green card, require a signature for receipt, and the post office will send that signed green card back to you. Of course, you may not get the green card back. But the USPS should have a record of the certified mail, since it has a tracking # (you keep part of the green card with the tracking #, when you send it).

It costs several dollars to send a letter by certified mail. That's usu. what people use to send payments that must be verified that it was sent.

Still, when you're sending a payment, the vendor either gets a payment or not. That's all they know. They require payment by a certain date. They don't have to consider that the post office didn't get it to them on time. It's not their problem. They MAY let that slide, if you can show you sent it. But they don't have to.

[PassingFair]

68. Ignatius? Is that you?

This reminds me of one of his rants.



Rant on!