I took the weekend to think about all this...

[PCIntern]

And having read all the hundreds of posts, it has all been said here and better than I can possibly write it. I will add this however: over many years I have made suggestions here and there that we as liberals, Democrats, and freethinking people should pull out all stops and do what the right wing does so effectively, that is to demonize the other side, claim potential catastrophe, and go after many of these people personally and without mercy.

I have met extraordinary resistance here in this regard by many over the years, somewhat less in recent months following the insurrection, but nonetheless many people feel that we need to be high minded and positive in our approach. That we don’t want to lower ourselves to their level.

Well that level includes the fact that in many instances they have defeated us at least in the short term, and quite possibly if we cross a certain Rubicon , for the long term. The question of course is whether local, state, and federal elections this fall will turn the tide for us. If we’re going to play nice and not aggressively pursue our goals, “game over, man”. There is something between complete civility adherence and armed revolution and we need to find it and quickly. A perfect example were the reactions of some who excoriated the individual who posted about Ivanka‘s abortion. A debate ensued as to whether she was fair game. Of course she is fair game, she was appointed as a “senior advisor“ to her father (which is like appointing my dog to be a senior advisor in my family) and thus being utterly and completely incompetent in this regard, she is a target painted bright red . We Democrats often bring pillows to a gun fight and expect the average citizen to recognize our civility and humanity, and it just does not work that way.

When the Lincoln Project began its series of commercials and podcasts against Trump, we held them as remarkable and wondered why it took Republicans to come up with great commercials, quips, and satire within serious political discussion. That is because they fundamentally have no rules and we are too busy being sensitive to peoples inner needs. Those times are passed, and if you think for an instant that we can win this election by being logical, thoughtful, and appealing to people’s better sides, then you better start thinking about what life is going to be like living in a fascist country for essentially eternity.

We are going to need a replay of the 1960s in order to survive this and it is going to be a terrible mess but it is the only way out. Oh, and one more thing: anyone wondering why President Biden‘s numbers are low is because Trump still dominates news cycles and has edged out legitimately elected leaders, and our fascination with him, like the fascination of the OJ trial, has preempted everything else. Americans are absolutely unable to pay attention to multiple issues at once, Trump is in fact the issue and upstages anyone and everyone in the same fashion that the character of Hannibal Lecter, although on screen for not that many minutes, is the first thing you think about when discussing The Silence of the Lambs. do not forget for one moment that for many people the fascination and intrigue surrounding the OJ trial involved the trial itself, the judge, the prosecutors, the defense attorneys, the evidence, the glove, the celebrity status of many of the witnesses, and the victims who were beheaded were relegated to 15th Pl. in the sweepstakes of public opinion. Remember the line from Shakespeare: the play’s the thing. The subject of which has become what Hitchcock described as the McGuffin. The brilliance of the presentation in the 1/6 hearings is that it presents fact, neither opinion nor interpretation. We need to hit people over the heads…and hard.

[phylny]

1. I always enjoy your posts

and this is spot on.

I’d like to see us stop attacking each other here as well. Whether we are POC or white, women or men, from a red or blue state, religious or atheist or agnostic, we are on the same team.

[LiberalLovinLug]

76. I agree with your sentiments.

But from a different angle. Personally, I think there should be allowed deeper discussion in here. As long as its not personally insulting, or racist, sexist, etc. I think political arguments should be allowed to go deeper on DU. To get past the anger, and find facts and links to help ones arguments. Keep going. "fight it out" Until you come out the other side. To the point where each party can at least have the "ah ha" moment in understanding WHY the other party felt that way, or had come to those views. At the very least it could end on a cordial "agree to disagree". And meanwhile other readers learn a hell of a lot from this hashing out and laying it all on the table.

But its difficult to get near to that point most times because all too often, as soon as one of the debaters makes one comment that can be sent over to the jury to be judged as barely over one rule breaking line...mostly in relation to a critical comment about an action or non action of the party or rep of the party........all debate stops. That debater is immediately kicked off the thread, messages erased, and cowed into silence. Leaving one frustrated, and the other one thinking they "won" against someone not on their team.

I firmly believe that if you allow a spontaneous debate to evolve its course, even if it gets a little heated naturally, gets uncomfortable politically, so much can be learned from each other exposing their viewpoints completely. Not just from them but from any other readers. And by leaving arguments and their initiators hanging, because its so easy to do that....it only feeds the feelings that there is irreparable divisions. It may sound like I'm advocating the opposite as you, but political arguments need to be hashed out, in order to find consensus, and only then we will realize that, in the greater scope of things, we ARE all on the same team underneath it all.

[burrowowl]

92. Amen!

[gab13by13]

2. Is it really demonizing them if it's the truth?

Democrats need to run on big issues with a united voice.

[Pacifist Patriot]

14. This is my frustration. We could be devastatingly effective...

just putting their own words and actions in both greater context and sharper focus. They practically write our political ads for us!

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

95. I agree that Dems could do better PR in general--messaging, ads, etc.

But I think just as big a problem is getting more people to see & hear the facts. We can't force the M$M to start telling the truth, or to let more Dems do so. Far too many Rs get their news only from Fox or even more extreme media sources.

[Mister Ed]

28. To paraphrase Harry Truman:

We'll just tell the truth about them, and it'll seem like demonization.

[NJCher]

35. now this

is something I can buy into, Mr. Ed.

[dchill]

50. You can't demonize a demon. You're just describing it.

[Butterflylady]

30. Big issues won't matter if we lose everything.

We need to win, so yes the poster is right on.

[JudyM]

88. I hate to post bad news but saw this massive poll today... and messaging is the absolutely urgency

right now.

More than 1 million voters switch to GOP in warning for Dems
https://apnews.com/article/2022-midterm-elections-biden-covid-health-presidential-e50db07385831e67f866ec45402be8b9

[soldierant]

93. Yes, that's alarming -

but some of hem - I can't say how many - are still Democrats, just switching registration to vote in the GOP primaries.I know that happened in Lauren Boebert's primary.

Not saying we don't need to work or worry, just saying I doubt all is lost.

[JudyM]

94. Right, but the research looked at that

and found similar results even in places without primaries.

[KarenS]

3. Sing it!! I agree,,,,

Pillows to a gun fight, indeed.

Thank you for this post.

[calimary]

54. Feather dusters to a gun fight. And I'm sick to death of it!

I want to hit back, and hit back HARD. And, okay, that means fighting not only hard but sneaky, nasty, and gloves only on if there’s some iron horseshoes in there, too.

I want to fight so dirty the bad guys need a bath before they even enter the room. WWRD. What Would Republicans Do? I’m sick and tired of being nice and playing fair. When only one side does that, that side gets royally ROLLED. The bad guys don’t play fair. They don’t follow any rules. They play for keeps. They play to win, and ruthless as can be.

Sick and tired of our Dems being pushovers. Fighting fair is only legit when both sides actually play that way. Unfortunately, our Dems play fair and the other side plays with matches. And guess who winds up getting burned!

Sick and tired of being nice. I want to see terror in the eyes of every damn Republican when even the word “Democrat” is uttered.

Taste of their own medicine. See how they like it. Especially when they think they have us all figured out as nice harmless little mice they can roast on a stick, as usual, and they won’t see it coming.

[FalloutShelter]

4. The worst are full of passionate intensity,

While the best lack all conviction.

I recently
Moved back to PA from NY and tomorrow I will meet with a group of women I have not seen in twenty years. In the 90s we formed an abortion rights org. Tomorrow we will be getting the band back together.
Time to go all in on this fellow Democrats.
Time is short for action.
Get fired up!

[dalton99a]

5. The enemy is slaughtering everyone in sight

While the villagers try to find the cleanest and purest shirt to wear for combat

[maddiemom]

11. Good One!

[KS Toronado]

20. +1

[LenaBaby61]

46. THIS 👆🏻👆🏻👆🏻

We're literally in a fight against serial murderers.

[KPN]

6. Well said. Couldn't agree more. Hit them hard, and

continuously, constantly and with everything we’ve got plus some and even harder. Ruthlessly and unendingly till they crawl back into the holes, cracks and crevices from which they slithered.

[rubbersole]

7. "between complete civility adherence and armed revolution"

There is an area somewhere in there that we should occupy. But also realize the right (Putin) is preparing for and stoking every hot button issue that will make armed revolution their ace in the hole. What will the faux/OANN/Newsmax/ Daily Caller crowd resort to after a blue tsunami marginalizes their "legitimate" political power? That stockpiled arsenal ain't gonna get returned to Wal-Mart by itself. "Pay attention to what they do, not what they say." Think Rittenhouse = hero.

Great post, PCIntern!

[hay rick]

89. Between civility and revolution

We fought centuries ago to secure basic human rights. Those rights were expanded and extended to more people over time. Now those rights are being taken away. If peaceful responses don't stop the regression, violent responses may be the only effective option to reclaim those rights. We can not conveniently ignore the fact that the original set of rights would never have been secured without bloodshed. The American Revolution was not accomplished by inviting the redcoats to tea.

[area51]

8. Agreed.

If dems don't get serious about fighting back, we'll lose our republic.

[Escurumbele]

9. Excellent Post...Thank you

[BSdetect]

10. There is a sad list of how we have been fucked over largely without response

2000 supreme court halts counting to give bush the win. Iraq.

Millions gave died.

[Ninga]

12. I so agree. We hosted a large vote counting gathering the night of the 2000 election. We had

a basement rec room with a projector TV and a 100 nch screen.

I will never ever forget the TV zooming in on the Bush family sitting in their hotel room looking quite smug even as doubt rolled in regarding who won.

I jumped up and screamed “the fix is in, look at their faces!” Unfortunately the tech was not available to rewind and freeze frame their faces.

I was aghast at the weeks that followed, as mostly weak responses pored in and certainly “crickets” from the base.

We stood by and watched as we and Gore were fucked over…..

[BSdetect]

18. Remember how they make an endless attack on Bill Clinton etc whilst these matters go quiet?

Or Benghazi for fucks sake.

[Ninga]

22. Yes, yes and yes!

[McKim]

31. I Remember this Too!!!!

I remember this too!!!!! George said: "I don't think we have heard all the returns from Florida!" This was a dead giveaway!!!!!

[McKim]

24. Thanks for Remembering this Tragedy

Thanks for remembering this tragedy which destroyed our international reputation and killed millions. This grotesque war crime has gone unpunished and it was the beginning of losing our way. It's also the reason many did not vote for Hilary and cost us the election.

[Bayard]

13. Agreed

trump won in 2016 because he pushed every prejudice button out there, loudly and unashamed.

We can no longer go high when they go low. Scream about every sex crime, corruption, misogyny in every rethuglican running for office. We don't even have to make any of it up.

[LenaBaby61]

47. "We can no longer go high when they go low."

They're literally slaughtering (women) us. NO time to make nice.

That other side is full of murderers and demons, literally.

[MadameButterfly]

77. We also need our candidates to be dynamic enough

to make news. We need a TR, an FDR, or a Winston CHurcill. Biden and Hillary are good people and highly qualified to run a government, but not so great at getting media attention or selling themselves. Trump isn't just good at getting attention. Biden has left a vacuum. He speaks only occasionally, when necessary, with difficulty. They are well written speeches from the heart. That's not enough to save democracy.

if we keep thinking the issue is whether to go to the middle or the left, or taking the high versus the low road, and ignore the communication skills of our leaders, we'll never get anywhere.

[Bayard]

78. Who are our most dynamic speakers?

Obama immediately comes to mind. Bernie and Elizabeth.

We also need some younger ones though. Cory Booker maybe.

[MadameButterfly]

98. how about Jamie Raskin?

[Pepsidog]

15. Absolutely correct. Time to take the gloves off and we also need to speak to people

in language they can understand. I loved Obama but his vocabulary went way above many peoples ability to understand. AOC said it, tell the people what’s at stake and what we can do for them if they elect certain candidates.

[McKim]

26. You Got that One Right!

You got that one right!!!! If you can't talk to Joe the Plumber you are dead in the water. I love Schiff and Ruskin but they are not resonating with voters we so need. We need more John Testers and regular folks here as leaders.

[LoisB]

16. Facts! Excellent post.

[mnhtnbb]

17. Everyone who has ever dealt with a bully knows that playing nice--going high--gets you nowhere.

Bullies must be beaten. Give no quarter. Kick 'em in the balls. When they grab their crotch, bust 'em in the head. When they fall on the ground, kick 'em in the kidneys. Do not let up.

The Republican bullies have brought this on themselves. The fight is for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. The fight is for liberty and justice for ALL. The fight now is for democracy itself. Will we defend it?

[spanone]

19. K&R

[Lonestarblue]

21. Excellent post! One of our problems is the narrowness of our media outlets.

Republicans have Fox, AM radio, several right-wing publishers like Breitbart, online conspiracy sites constantly generating new conspiracies, and even national media that while not given to Fox- like propaganda nevertheless gives Republicans a pass while insisting that both sides do the same sorts of things. We know they do not.

So there are two ways that Democrats can get people’s attention. One is to do it in person. Republicans here in Texas have established local organizations that do things in the community and keep their party in the public eye. I have seen nothing similar from Democrats. Republicans actively recruit future voters with college groups and other groups that focus on specific interests. The Moms for Liberty group was not a grass-roots effort. It was funded by Republican operatives.There are nonprofit organizations that work toward Democratic values, such as gun regulation groups, but no one would associate them with Democratic priorities. Republicans are good at self-promotion as a party, Democrats are not.

The second way to promote Democratic values and policies is to go on national media and call attention to our ideas, and not just MSNBC but Fox as well. Secretary Buttigieg already showed the way here. Is he the only person we have who can speak so eloquently and with such precision about what we believe? Where is the head of the DNC in helping to stir up outrage against what the SC and Republicans are doing to our rights? Could anyone but the most devoted political aficionado even tell you who the DNC chairman is? I doubt it. We need our leaders to do more.

[Magoo48]

23. I read your post as a call to action.

I believe it time for we, the rank and file Dems, to stand up to bullies with direct actions and peaceful, creative, civil disobedience. We saw some of this around the nation this weekend. It must be sustained and x1000. My two cents.

[McKim]

29. Creative Civil Disobedience!!!!

Yes, creative civil disobedience is the way to go. Watch out for agent provocateurs who want to create violence. Violence in the streets can promote a fascist crack down. There are right wing forces who crave this.

[jaxexpat]

25. The jan 6 hearinghearings are (as if) Hollywood productions.

Thankfully, gone are the stutters and dramatic buildup that fizzle in the end. Everything Adam Schiff so eloquently said in his impeachment summary has totally come to pass. The 24/7 shouting from the rabid ones won the field. We shall see whether the polish shown on the current hearings can overcome our muteness. As a first resort, the DNC, should take its communication orders from AOC.

[Evolve Dammit]

63. You nailed it. As sure as the Bolton and Stone group stopped the recount in 2000.

[jaxexpat]

71. As sure as Boothe made an impromptu entrance, onto a stage,.......

without a cue, in a play where he had no speaking part, blew his line, broke his leg, thereby spawning one of the stranger epithets in showbiz or anywhere else. Totally bad TeeVee and, on the radio, just confusing really. Surely, "Please, Mr. Boothe, just a few words", would have been in order. Eventually, J. Lennon grabs the ancient microphone to plead, "just gimme some truth". Echoes back to Aristophanes, you know.

[Evolve Dammit]

79. Such heinous acts really are the mark of our species (and gender).

[jaxexpat]

80. Yep. That's why republicans are afraid of trans people.

They want all escape routes closed. They say, "we're in this together", but they're too confused by events beyond their control to understand that means, "we're all monkeys on this rock".

[Xoan]

27. Hear! Hear!

[flying_wahini]

32. Yes, I agree with everything you . I often watch as Dems let a perfect retort or moment pass because

of decorum. We need to be HAMMERING at the GOP every chance we get. McConnell needs to
answer more pointed questions and get some push back from reporters.

I wish that Midas Touch was helping to direct our ads and messages, I think one reason that they are so good as our messages get lost in the bullying ways of the GOP.

We have lots of ammo but our guns/messages aren’t BIG and LOUD enough. Why the White House Pataki made such a big splash is because SHE would go there. Also I think Kamala would be a wonderful messenger if the White House would cut her loose once in awhile. I wonder sometimes if Biden is so worried about civility that he tamps down our timely messages.

[LenaBaby61]

48. I wonder sometimes if Biden is so worried about civility that he tamps down our timely messages.

This is not the time to be civil, courteous--especially when that other side is trying to KILL you literally.

[flying_wahini]

81. What I said.

[LenaBaby61]

97. I agree with you 1,000 % .....

Sorry if I sounded like I wasn't

[purr-rat beauty]

33. I've come to the conclusion

They have a vast majority who RELISH in being demonic

These are the chauvinists, the closet pedophiles, the domestic abusers, the racists, the incestuous scum, the rapists, the evangelical scam artists, the corporate authoritarians, the gun fetishes, those who have little regard for the environment, those who worship war, those who hate the poor (even if they are) ...

they vote for the same pigs as a reflection of who they are

this is their party in a nutshell - they know it, we know it - it won't change minds.

[Phillies3737]

34. Nobody is sacred to them

Last edited Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:20 PM - Edit history (1)

Why should we question a “gloves off” attitude? That’s what is necessary to defeat these butt-lickers and Koolaid drinkers. Every level of government has been so fucked up by his orangeness. How does Biden stand a chance fixing what these fascists destroyed while they were embedded into local, state and federal agencies? Anyone who thinks that overturning Roe is a one-and-done, they’re in serious denial. They are gunning for us, literally and figuratively. Isn’t it time for us to lock and load and take some serious aim? Our voting rights have been hijacked, so going to the polls to defeat these monsters isn’t enough! Time for some guerrilla tactics?!

[Stuckinthebush]

36. A vote for any Republican is a vote for the death of this nation

Hyperbole? Perhaps but necessary. Time to take off the gloves.

Republicans kill woman
Republicans kill the poor
Republicans will kill you for a dollar and laugh
The time is now or never.
Republicans are evil

The long term consequences of this type of rhetoric may be unfortunate but it is unacceptable to allow them to continue to lie, cheat and steal for power. Most Americans respond to this type of imagery. Get it out there and get it out there fast and furious.

[usaf-vet]

37. I read the first paragraph and I agree 100%. Let's stop being the victim. Fight fire with napalm...

.... take no prisoners. It's the right-wing fascist battle plan and it has been that way since 1970.

Ok, now I will read the rest of the OP and revise this response if necessary.

[usaf-vet]

41. As promised I read every word and my previous statment stands. Every word of it.

Let's stop being the victim. Fight fire with napalm..take no prisoners.

It's the right-wing fascist battle plan and it has been that way since 1970.

[SunSeeker]

87. Yup, been that way since Nixon secretly sabotaged the peace talks to get elected.

https://www.minnpost.com/eric-black-ink/2017/08/68-election-collusion-nixon-s-successful-sabotage-vietnam-peace-talks/


Republicans are fascists.

[unblock]

38. while i don't disagree, there is a problem in implementation: the media

i totally agree that there are times when you have to take the gloves off. if we continue the descent into authoritarianism, the only chance freedom and fairness will have will be civil war. tough verbal attacks and technical rule bending certainly seems a preferable alternative to a repeat of the early 1860s.

the problem is the media, which consistently has a strong right-wing bias, will not see it that way. democrats are constantly judged against perfection and moral purity, while republicans are judged by whether or they can continue to get at least 30% approval, which of course they always can no matter what.

the minute we start breaking any rules or norms or say anything over-the-top, they will pounce. they will call us hysterical or fringe or out of touch or unhinged.

what we need at a minimum is a well thought out and coordinated media strategy.

ideally, media ownership of an outlet to counter foxnews/oan/etc.

[niyad]

39. Absolutely spot on.

[Trueblue Texan]

40. It is time. I absolutely agree.

"A perfect example were the reactions of some who excoriated the individual who posted about Ivanka‘s abortion"

If we would excoriate the fascist Right the way we excoriate one another, we'd be winning, not worrying.

[Aviation Pro]

42. I've advocated this over and over and again and again

We play nice, because let's face it, the motherfuckers on the other side, intimidate a large percentage of folks on our side. The reason is as obvious as the agenda the said motherfuckers push on our country, they - the motherfuckers - have a large selection of big, bearded, fucking assholes, whose entire life has been centered around bullying and punching down. They hit the gyms; revel in "qualifying" with their AR-15 and Glock (or Sig Sauer) platforms; and raise their voices loud and fucking proud at every opportunity. We, on the other hand, try to be reasonable with these, again, motherfuckers, which makes zero sense.

So, what's the solution?

1. Hit the gyms. Yeah, yeah intimidating because of gym bros. Fine, stick a pair of headsets on your ears and go about the process of making gains. Muscles give a command presence in most situations, couple that with a strong mental acuity and you get to pipe down these motherfuckers real fast. See my anecdote below.

2. Get some firearms training. Yeah, yeah, you hate guns, fine. For hundreds of years the side that had the guns slaughtered the side that didn't. Read Jarod Diamond's, "Guns, Steel and Germs," for insight.

3. Learn to become clearheaded and directed in a standoff situation. A war face does wonders to calm down the cohorts of motherfucking monkeys when they start their howling. See anecdote below.

We are in the cold war phase right now. It's time to stop pretending that we're dealing with civilized people and gird our loins.

The anecdote

Once a month, I visit a local diner for a little me time; I like the cheat day meal of eggs over medium, three strips of pork bacon, hashed browns and two oversized pancakes. Generally, because the place is really busy on Sunday's, I sit at the counter not the least concerned who I sit next to, because why should I? So yesterday, I parked my butt in the last available seat and the waitress, who knows me by sight, asked if I wanted the usual, which I said yes and off she went. Sitting next to me was a senior gentleman wearing a forest green ball cap emblazoned with the flash of 11th Special Forces Group, a unit that is near to my heart, so I naturally struck up a conversation. As we're talking, a motherfucker two seats down, starts getting loud and proud about Bloated Tick and what he feels about President Biden; it was intentional and designed to intimidate anyone within earshot. The guy is a typical motherfucker, red faced, big belly and enjoys flexing his flabby biceps. Me, I'm a 5'8", 46" chested, 16"-armed powerlifter, who served on active duty in combat arms.

After listening to five seconds of his horseshit, I leaned forward in my seat, caught his eye and gave him the 1000-yard stare. Thereafter, he piped the fuck down and let the rest of the diner enjoy their breakfasts in peace. The point is, I brought his bullshit game to him and without speaking a word told the motherfucker, "Bring it."

We are the majority, and we need to act like it and look like it.

Forward.

[TBF]

43. 100%. I'm not sure if people are really understanding what the judges have done -

this is about controlling women for sure, but it is also about controlling the masses as a whole.

They hate professional women so this was a "fuck you" to us - but they also know we have the means to dodge and get any member of our family out of the country to a safe place quickly if we are forced to.

The folks who can't do that are the bulk of the country. This makes things incredibly hard for younger and especially lower income families. Not just the women. Yes, they are being controlled & will have to take time off to raise the babies they are forced to have. BUT it also affects their families. Men who are now sole breadwinners in an economy where it's necessary for many families to have both adults working to even have a chance to break even. Low income folks are less likely to send their kids to college, or to see them graduate because the reality of paying bills gets in the way. This.controls.everyone. Which is exactly what the capitalists want - oppressed folks who don't have a lot of choices so they will work for whatever they can get, join the military and fight because it is pay & benefits, take those low level jobs that are sitting without takers for months now (kill off front liners during a pandemic because you are weak on things like mandatory masking and they need to be replaced).

Make no mistake - like everything else this is about economics. It always is. And we should be saying that loudly.

[Joinfortmill]

44. Yes, yes and yes. Be tough and be relentless.

[Paladin]

45. Bravo! Well said, as usual.

I've been doing a little thinking myself about what's happened, "over the many years." It seems like "They're going to take Roe away from us!" was a frequent battle cry for Democrats---but it doesn't seem like many of us honest-to-God really believed it. And here we are. We're going to have to fight like hell to get back the rights that have been taken away from us. Because if they can take Roe, they can take plenty of other things as well. Let's get busy.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

49. Couldn't agree more, my dear PCIntern! Pull out the stops and hit 'em HARD. Bravo! n/t

[Scrivener7]

51. SOOOOOO important!!! I am in total agreement. Very well said.

[Richard58]

52. I completely agree!

No more holding back! No more being Mr Nice guy. We need to go on the attack against these monsters. To hell with bipartisanship, this is a war! The Republicans have no problem with lying through their teeth about what the Democratic agenda is. But we don't need to lie about them. We just need to tell the truth! And tell the truth boldly! To be honest I get sick and tired of Biden's milquetoast approach to this. He should be calling Republicans what they really are, fascists! But not too long ago he was praising Mitch McConnell as "an honorable man" and a great guy. WTF Joe,? McConnell has spent his entire time trying to screw you over. But yet you praise him?
The Democrats should be railing against the Republican agenda. We should be attacking them for banning books, and trying to eliminate gay and trans rights. But have we heard of peep out of the Democrats? No! The most they do is tell us to vote harder in November! This isn't cutting it! We need to go on attack mode. Otherwise we are doomed as a nation!

[dchill]

53. If we don't meet them on their level, they will undermine us.

[inthewind21]

55. Newsflash

They already have.

[H2O Man]

56. Recommended.

I can honestly say that I never purposely used "dirty tactics" first in my 329 boxing matches. However, if an opponent did, and the referee did not take control, I went to town. And I was really good at it.

[PCIntern]

57. I bet you were....

Survival, man….

[H2O Man]

59. Yes.

I think it was a matter of survival and of punishment. I recognized the difference between "reacting" and "responding." If, for example, the opponent purposely hit me low, had I immediatelt reacted by hitting him low, the referee would penalize me. However, if I pulled him in closely, and said, "You've made a bad mistake, and now you must pay your dues" while pushing my thumb in his eye, I would not be penalized. Responding is best when it includes the psychological aspect of letting the opposition know which way the wind blows.

[pandr32]

58. Loud and proud

[bdamomma]

60. Great post

We must fight our lives depend on it.

[onecaliberal]

61. Yes! ALL OF THIS.

[Hekate]

62. + a bajillion with The Lincoln Project on top & a bonus for mentioning Ivanka

Gods help us, if it turned out that the SCOTUS’ own Handmaid Amy had once had an abortion, this discussion board would spend days wringing our hands over how we had to handle her gently and compassionately lest we lose our liberal credentials — instead of going after her savagely for being the tip of the spear for right wing religious fanatics intent on destroying the lives of all women who are not her.

And what is Ivanka but another spear aimed at women who are not her own precious self? Extraordinarily privileged, narcissistic, and a poster girl for nepotism at the highest level of the government that is supposed to serve all Americans.

What is wrong with us?

[CaptainTruth]

64. Excellent post. We can't continue playing by 2 different sets of rules...

...if we want to win.

It seems like we often play by old rules, when our opponents have already disregarded those rules & moved on to new ones.

We need to meet them on the "field of battle" as equals, not holding back our firepower.

Moderate responses are not effective against extreme acts.

[Glaisne]

65. We're at war.

It's time we act like it. For far too long Democrats behaved as if we were in a debate when the other side was waging war. It's time to change tactics. Sorry.

[Hotler]

66. There comes a time on the way home from school when you have to stop walking way and

stand up to the bully. And punch them right in the mouth as hard as you can. These fascist are not ones to turn our backs on. They can't wait to shoot us in the streets. This is no joke. If Desantis get into power there will be goon/death squads. This is real and not a drill.

[housecat]

67. Important post! Thank you. Now how do we get [some] Democrats to stop fighting with each other?

Unlike Rumpublicans, many/most Democrats are educated. Rather than believe that having too much formal education is our strength, consider how it can also become a disadvantage. We are taught to consider both sides, to debate, to bring evidence, to use good manners. We likely learned these in a classroom, maybe in law school. We really need to stop listening to disinformation and normalizing it; we must stop trying to debate people who only have disinformation; and we (and this might be the most difficult) must stop talking as if we don't have enough evidence to win in court. We have the evidence. The other side likely doesn't know what evidence is, let alone use it or respect it. I try to use evidence, but I will never win a debate with a Trumpie or my cat. Some of us find it difficult to just ignore the other side. Some are wired to only do it the right way and bring facts and evidence to the debate.

So perform. Yes, since we're out of time to learn how to fight, maybe we can pretend, to act, as if we are playing a part. If being loud, and repetitive, and animated, and crazy isn't our style, then just do it, and consider it a performance. Whatever it takes, we need to get all Democrats together with the goal to win, to defeat automatons who spout disinformation as truth.

Then vote, and persuade even the least involved Democrats to vote too, and save the performance for the next time.

[Liberal In Texas]

68. As always, good points. And I agree.

If that means outing some hypocrite pol, so be it. We have to go after this like our very lives depend on it.

Because it does.

[SouthernDem4ever]

69. Do repugs think no one else owns a gun?

If they do, they are more stupid than I thought. No one else uses them as props in pictures, that's all.

[Missn-Hitch]

70. When I hear, "we have all the guns".

I reply, "well, not ALL of them".

Tick, tock. I'm just waiting for the fascist fiesta to start.

[Baked Potato]

72. Every facet of governing to them is 'business'

Anything goes and anything is leverage.

Leverage can be taking advantage of an opportunity which presents itself. Leverage can be manufactured by the wealthy ones and nurtured and stoked by influencers.

Their Sheeple are content snoozing deeply in the cozy cocoons the RW make for them.

I agree with the ‘MacGuffin’ reference… they use them a lot.

[llmart]

73. I wish I could K&R this post a gazillion times!

Sometimes I have to just get off of DU when I see fellow DU'ers taking others to task if they aren't always politically correct when talking about the opposition. Not only with Ivanka but I have seen so many jump on someone who posts the meme "Lady Lindsay" about that SOB Graham.

I'm of a mind that when they go low, I'm going lower as long as they've got an "R" after their name. They never miss an opportunity to do it to us.

I'm not above playing dirty if that's the country we live in right now. All gloves are off.

[h2ebits]

74. Yes, you are absolutely correct.

We DO need a replay of the 1960's and 1970's to overcome what is happening today. We have allowed the "extreme monied class" and fascists to turn us against each other for their own personal gain and power.

From the female perspective, we fought for the right to vote over 100 years ago. Women marched, they were beaten up, they were thrown in prison. They were considered chattel by men and could be thrown into mental institutions at the will of their husbands. If it took place in a marriage, rape wasn't considered rape. Birth control didn't exist. Women had many children. Many women died in childbirth. By and large, women didn't work outside the home because they were busy raising the children and taking care of all of the responsibilities of maintaining the household--including taking care of their husbands whose only responsibility was being the "breadwinner" in the house, but money equals power.

Fast forward to the 1960's and 1970's. The next pitched battle by women for equality. Birth control became legally available. Catholic church banned its use (I dropped out of religion in high school--raised Catholic.) And, while I could be mistaken on today's Catholic men's rules, Catholic hospitals inform pregnant and in labor women that the life of the baby takes precedent over the life of the mother. So if there is any question on who will be saved--the woman can plan on dying. For the birth of my first child in 1968, my husband had to sign a document acknowledging that--and he did; only telling me afterward. Abortions became legal so backstreet butchers and clothes hangers became obsolete. The religious leaders--men--rose up and declared abortions to be a "moral" issue and disallowed them. The EEOC became active but was, and probably still is, overwhelmed by the number of cases being brought to its attention. They only accept the most egregious cases to pursue that they know they will win; leaving the rest of us with good cases to cast about in the private sector to find an attorney to help us. Yes, I know this from experience. Equality was and still is elusive for women.

And, here we are today. Actually, the battle for women to have equality as citizens of our country has never really ended. Women today; especially young women, have grown accustomed to a great many things that were fought over for years--this includes the ability to have our own credit cards and bank accounts (without our husbands or some male co-signing.) The ability to establish our own credit and buy houses and cars. But I digress.

The Supreme Court overturning Roe vs. Wade is the latest attack on women's rights and women's health. We thought we had won the war on women's health. Turns out it was just a battle that we won since it wasn't codified into law.

We should use it as the catalyst for forward movement on all fronts.

The time is growing late and we must head into battle to fight tooth and nail for our democratic republic to continue to exist For the People and By the People. Our corrupt Supreme Court has already done major damage to us--the separation of church and state, gun control, women's health, and the breakdown of precedent.

We must bang the drum loudly and go toe-to-toe to assert our rights. To take back the power that we freely gave away and take back control of our country from those who wish to destroy us from within. We need to march in the streets and make ourselves heard. We need to practice civil disobedience. We need to educate each other. We need to nurture more people to run for political office at all levels in our country. We need to register people to vote. We need to convince people to VOTE!

Yes, we need to hit people over the heads. . . .and hard.

[PatrickforB]

75. Damned right! We need to fight back UGLY, 24/7 tooth and nail.

Fight.

Back.

Ugly.

[jimlup]

82. Posts this far down don't actually get read by many but...

I agree with everything you said except - we are going to need much more than the "60's" to get through this. I think things will get very bad in the next 6 years. I don't know how it will turn out.

Here are some things that I do know:

1. We are going to take a hit in the 2022 election cycle. It could be quite severe. The electorate has a very short memory and even motivations like Roe are going to fade as the cycle approaches.

2. Biden will struggle in 2024. He may pull it off because the majority of the American people are sane and capable of reason but they also have to be motivated. He doesn't come across as motivating except against a frothing at the mouth person like tRump.

3. There is a large portion of RED America that is dead set to steer the ship towards oblivion and the past. They are bigots and racists and they are not reachable. Unfortunately, they will continue to be a major force in elections for a long time to come.

We need to face these likely outcomes, work like hell to hold the line in both 2022 and 2024 and really think about how we proceed AFTER the 2024 election cycle but that is when the game will get more serious. If tRump is elected we may well be facing a weird modern version of a civil war. If he is defeated that may still happen.

[Vinca]

83. Thank you, thank you, thank you for posting that. Democrats can spend every minute of the

day stewing about whether to call people of Latin origin LatinX (something they reportedly dislike, by the way) or they can call out Republicans for the difference between what they say and what they do. For example, following the stolen election bullshit, how many elected Democrats were on television talking about the Trump voters at the Villages in Florida who voted more than once using dead relatives as the extra votes? Crickets. And that was just one case of that. How often do elected Democrats mention sex scandals involving Republicans? Never. Financial crimes? Nothing. Every time a Republican says "groomer," Democrats should say "Matt Gaetz." This is not the United States of the past and a whole lot of voters won't look a politician's way unless they're uttering things usually seen on a tabloid cover. So let's make some covers.

[electric_blue68]

84. SO THIS! I designed some hard hitting letter size paper signs that I posted locally, and...

at 2 NYC Universities through several elections when I had access to computers. I used text and my own drawings.

So I have been hard hitting in my modest actions.


I guess I could go to my library and use their desk top app.

[SunSeeker]

86. K & R

[TigressDem]

90. I am all for aggressively getting the truth out, exposing them as the roaches they are...

But I think if we get 5 million DEMS to stand peacefully in DC and just chant, VOTE BLUE, VOTE FOR TRUTH, JUSTICE AND AMERICA. We could make the point that OUR SIDE can go to DC en masse and not break anything, shoot anyone, trample cops or smear shit in public places. We should all carry electric candles or flashlights so that we can point them up and be seen by satellites. Get drone shots.

I think we need to have protests that show we are hear and talk about what we stand for and rip them new assholes for what they have done, but WE DON'T NEED TO LIE. WHAT THEY HAVE DONE just needs to be exposed over and over again to the light of day.

BIDEN'S numbers are also low because the Democratic Governors Association will only let you complete a survey if you give at least $1 to the cause. Now I was doing OK at work so I was completing surveys, but I got Covid and was out for 2 weeks and am behind on a lot of bills. I've asked them for links to their surveys that don't require payment, but all I get are crickets.

[lefthandedskyhook]

91. They are getting their very guilty guts ripped out in public

Convictions will follow. Of course, as white collar first time felony convicts with expensive and corrupt lawyers, most will walk. The important thing is to root them out of our government forever. It should have happened after Nixon. This is a cost of not doing that thoroughly back when we had the chance

[ecstatic]

96. I agree. We are at war. Everyone should pick a role they're good at and for the love

of God, stop interfering with others on the battlefield who are waging their battles in the way they think is best. We don't all have to do things the same way--some will kill with kindness, and that is wonderful. Others will use comedy. Others intelligence. Others acting, etc. Stay in your lane and keep focused! I don't want to live in Russia 2.0. I really don't. When the smoke clears and we have our country back, then the hall monitors can swoop back in. Nobody will complain.