What I think / know. I very well might be wrong.

[Botany]

Last edited Fri Aug 12, 2022, 07:47 AM - Edit history (1)

Trump took highly classified documents with him to Florida

Trump knew that was illegal

The documents were "sensitive compartmented" information and had to do with national security

The "sensitive compartmented" information had something to do with America's nuclear weapons programs

Trump has already or wanted to sell that information to foreign governments or organized criminal operations

Saudi Arabia, China, Russia, Russian mob, and Iran (Iranian Revolutionary Guard) were the likely targets for being
potential buyers for this top secret information.

I would suggest that Erik Prince, Gen. Flynn, Manafort, and Roger Stone might have something to do with this
international criminal/nuclear terror operation. (I have no idea what to call "it." )

When the truth comes out it will be so bad that even Fox News will dump Trump PDQ and the MAGA/GOP folks will
try to pretend that they never knew him.

This "thing" will not only end Trump's political career and he might very well end up in prison too.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

1. Oh, I hope you're right! That would be fantastic. n/t

[Kablooie]

34. Fantastic as long as he hasn't already compromised America's security.

[Walleye]

2. I was wondering if Manafort helped pack the boxes

I think Trump really didn’t understand what all he was taking, all he knew was he wanted it and nobody can tell him no, that government secrets are worth a lot of money, it was currency to him, assets, he followed his only instinct which is to grab them and hold onto them. Figure out how to make money on it later. A con-man always says, “give me all the money, then we’ll talk about who it belongs to”

[Traildogbob]

14. Oooooh!!!🤔

[calimary]

21. Good one, Walleye!

“A con-man always says, ‘give me all the money, then we’ll talk about who it belongs to’.”

[Lars39]

3. Not worried about Jr and the other,

it’s Jared who really concerns me. Especially after his Bone Saw efforts. Kushner needs to be in prison.

[leftieNanner]

4. The CCTV tapes that they removed from MaraLago?

Might indicate who has been stopping by for a chit-chat and a Diet Coke with The Donald, hmmm?

[Backseat Driver]

31. Oops, those

G--gl- glass(es) were only on sale for one day at a mere $1,500 - text to bluetooth?, live, streaming? photo stills? AI beta(s)? but the tech has definitely been out there for a while. Creative Speculation notwithstanding, likely could have been improved a lot by now for certain applications.

[Novara]

5. If it involved nuclear weapons you can damn well be sure the FBI would have ...

... conducted an actual raid, kicking the doors down, way, way, way before now. No way would they have waited until now to get the material back. I believe the classified information involved other issues.

But I also believe that this will take him down, not the least because HE made it a felony! Oh man, the schadenfreude is strong with this one.

[OMGWTF]

13. Hopefully he'll be hoisted by his own petard.

[G2theD]

16. I'm thinking the same thing - they would have raided him by now

Unless … after inventorying everything they just now discovered something like that missing…
BUT you would think nuclear secrets would be the first thing they inventoried.

Possibly it is something they didn’t know about and they were just tipped off…
BUT it’s hard to believe that they didn’t know about documents of technical nature regarding nuclear weapons.

I DO believe that it likely has to do with Jared.
Either he flipped on TFLG, or he is in cahoots somehow. He looks clean cut but I think he is devious as hell.

Too many possibilities to make much of a concrete guess right now. Hopefully some informant will speak to the press, but with something so high stakes it would be very dangerous from several angles to get involved.

The fact that the FBI took this step and that TFLG won’t share the warrant seems to indicate it is highly important to the US - and highly embarrassing to him. Possibly national security information of some sort.

[DENVERPOPS]

33. Maybe, just maybe

the FBI/Archives pulled the first confiscation of Top Secret Boxes, so he would feel he was safe, but all the time the FBI was counting that if he felt safe, he would bring more hidden Top Secret records to Mar a Lago because he felt secure they wouldn't dare search his home again???

Different question: If several, or all of Trump's personal Secret Service Detail are fanatical Pro Trumphumpers, why isn't there a wholesale change of SS agents in his security detail???????? Also, why/who tipped off his detail that the FBI was coming to search?
Or was that intentional, so that they could watch the tapes to see who did what with the info before the FBI got there?

You know what? Our nation, and other nations around the world have a bunch more important things to do that having to deal with all these diversions of corrupt criminal politicians 24/7/365.......

I can't tell you, how many times I have confronted an older Trumphumper with the question: Don't you worry about your kids or grandkids futures????

Without exception, the ones I have asked that question say: What do I care, I am gonna be gone.................Holy Crap...........

Lincoln was quoted as saying: A Statesman is worried about the next generation, a Politician only in the next election......

[G2theD]

35. The FBI notified the SS. That was normal protocol so they didn't start shooting each other I suppose

[DENVERPOPS]

40. That is a thought

but then the FBI could have showed up at the gate and presented their paperwork to the Detail, stabilized the situation and not have given them time to do anything........

Aw hell, regardless, we might not ever know, like countless other things for the past four plus years........

[G2theD]

49. You are probably right, but who knows.

[ET Awful]

6. I think you're close to the mark. If you weren't, he would have released the warrant himself

for all to see. He has a copy, he could easily release it for everyone to see.

Waiting for him to make up an excuse why he doesn't similar to why he wouldn't release his tax returns.

[ashredux]

7. Sadly, That is very possible. There certainly is more to the story than we know today.

That is very possible. There certainly is more to the story than we know today.

I will bet big money that it’s going to be a fairly wide net that catches a lot of GOP crooks

[panfluteman]

8. In His Mind, Trump's Stealing of the Classified Documents Was Simply Getting Even

With the government for denying him a second term. It's as simple as that. And selling or scamming the documents and the info they contained was seen as a way to cash in big - maybe bigger than any other way he had access to at the time.

[BMW2020RT]

9. I would not be surprised to learn he withheld documents as leverage.

It was his high stakes bargaining chip when the investigation of his syndicate revealed criminal activity up to and including his attempt to overthrow the election of Joe Biden.

[wnylib]

17. I had not thought about that, but

it seems possible that using the documents as a bargaining chip might have been his motive for taking them.

Other possible motives are 1) the obvious money value if he sells them, or, 2) fulfilling a promise to Putin to obtain material for him, maybe in an agreement that Putin would back Trump in attempts to get back into the WH. Getting those documents and giving Putin access to them would demonstrate Trump's loyalty to him and continued usefulness in the future.

So, I am wondering if very recent US Intel about an attempted sale of the documents, or a meeting of interested players in access to the documents is what triggered the FBI raid.

[colorado_ufo]

30. I'll take number 2 for $10 billion.

Not only is he obligated to Putin, but he is scared to death of him. Putin doesn't play.

[BMW2020RT]

45. Maybe.

Whatever the reason, if the Tя☭mpenfuhrer no longer has the sensitive documents the justice department can proceed with their investigation unencumbered by the prospect of retaliatory espionage or backroom legal maneuvers to avoid the consequences of his criminal activity, past or future.

[Chautauquas]

10. something to do with America's nuclear weapons program?

How did you come up with that?

[Botany]

26. Some of the FBI/DoJ agents @ Merde a Log oh worked in export control/nuclear non proliferation

Last edited Thu Aug 11, 2022, 03:19 PM - Edit history (1)

n/t

[ancianita]

27. Because the warrant signed by the judge was issued to the DOJ's National Security Division.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Department_of_Justice_National_Security_Division

Jay Bratt, chief of the Counterintelligence and Export Control Section (CES) of the DOJ’s national security team, stated that to the press. And of course, AG Garland signed off on that division handling the search.

“[T]he fact that we have a national security division lawyer such as Jay Bratt, the head of counterintelligence and export control, does mean that we're talking about national security implications, not simply presidential records that aren't classified,” she remarked.

Mentioning the Espionage Act, she added that the law “actually has provisions that apply to essentially the mishandling through gross negligence, permitting documents to be removed from their proper place, or to be lost, stolen, or destroyed”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-espionage-act-fbi-raid-b2142685.html

More on the sensitive nature of the docs.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/09/us/politics/fbi-search-trump.html

This division handled the warranted search because it had good reason. If the docs did have anything related to any weapons program, we'd never really find out without leaks. So far the FBI and DOJ have said nothing directly to the press, and probably would downplay or omit what was found if they eventually did. We'll have to find out what the DOJ found in its future court filings. As it should be.

It's understandable that any reasonable person would be concerned about commander-in-chief access to defense intel.

[Chautauquas]

42. Thanks for all that info

I appreciate it

[James48]

11. He doesn't care what it was.

He only cares about it’s worth in dollars.

He’ll sell anything to anybody, for his cut if the profit.

[vlyons]

12. We will never know what the documents were about

because they are classified as top secret. If he is prosecuted, the evidence will be something like N-number of documents marked classified, N-number marked top secret, etc etc. I don't need to know what the documents actually say. I just know that he took them illegally.

I hope that he gets indicted for it. He probably won't.

[wiggs]

20. You may be right. Not only because it's sensitive information, but also because

there's a large amount of protectiveness among those in power who want to preserve the image of the US as a beacon of democracy, a stable super power, an example to the world.

Having placed in power a sociopathic corrupt criminal who sells nuclear info to the highest bidder brings us down a few notches...and many will strongly object behind the scenes to that happening

[appleannie1]

15. Someone had to have given info on where the documents were stored

Since the Kushner's have been trying to distance themselves, I wonder if it was one of them. Or perhaps the running hair dye freak or Manafort. It had to be someone close.

[Moostache]

18. IF *(that's a big qualified "if") true...

Then Trump should meet the same fate as Julius and Ethyl Rosenberg forthwith.
If what happened to Ethyl happens to TFG, well, that would just break my heart...

Ride the lightning 2 scoops.

[Enoki33]

19. Nuclear weapons program? Could be one

component. Think what would be of assistance to Putin in his continued dictatorship rule and grand geopolitical plans. The possibilities are many, but he has the level of power and money that tRump desperately craves. All roads lead to Putin. Think I should stop the speculation now.

[vlyons]

22. Lots of info on the Russian oligarchs and their money laundering

Info revealing who is informing on the oligarchs. Info on all sorts of illegal shipments into the US.

[RocRizzo55]

23. I've heard the word

"Treason" being stated.
After all, if he is setting the stage where he would be selling classified top secret information to out enemies.
And the penalty for treason is still a matter of capital punishment. Then again, wouldn't want him to go down as a martyr to his followers. Just life without parole would be enough.

[SledDriver]

24. The tapes and transcripts of all his conversations with Putin.

If he had declassified that stuff before he left, it would be available via FOIA request.
Biden could declassify it, which again would make it available via FOIA request.
So he kept it classified, took it with him when he left, and hid it figuring it would be awhile before anyone noticed it was missing.

If anyone did notice it was missing -- here's 15 boxes that doesn't contain that stuff.
Then it would take awhile for anyone to notice the 15 boxes didn't contain the stuff.
Then when they realized the 15 boxes didn't contain the stuff, more stalling tactics...

[moondust]

25. Was he not debriefed when he left the WH?

That should have made him acutely aware of the potential consequences of compromising classified materials. Same for Jared and anybody else he recklessly handed a free clearance.

[sarcasmo]

28. No doubt in my mind Trump sold classified information.

[JustAnotherGen]

29. I'm withholding any judgment on what is in

The boxes.

Why? I could see Christopher Wray screwing us over in late October -


Press Conference:

Wray - There was nothing classified in the boxes and my FBI was used.

[yonder]

32. Your wariness is not misplaced.

That Comey presser likely resulted in where we are at today - my, how things could have been different.

[SheltieLover]

37. Why has Joe left Wray, a reported Federalist, in this position?

Not bashing Joe, but I believe the FBI search has much more to do with qpukes trying to ensure tfg does not run in '24, than saving our democracy.

Perhaps paving the way for Death Satan?

[DENVERPOPS]

38. NO SHIT JAG

Comey pulled a Republican "October Surprise" that certainly had an effect on derailing the election of Hillary........

The Republicans are infamous for these "October Surprise" tactics, immediately before the elections, and have been doing it for decades and decades......With substantial impact every time...........

Ivanka and Jared were selling stuff long before Donnie was out of office......I'm sure those two have a trove of intel to sell for future wealth.

While Trump was still in office, Jared took the Saudi honchos a briefcase of stuff, turned back around immediately and came back to the US. with 150 Million to bail out one of his real estate disasters that needed money the next week. Then, what kind of top secret intel would it take to get TWO BILLION in Saudi backing for his investment company after leaving office............

When and if it ever comes out about the last four years of grifting by Trump, his spawn, the Republican Senate and House members, and the entire Republican Party it will be un-fathomable........of course if the Repubs get a senate and/or house majority in three months we will never hear of anything ever, and the 2024 election will be equivalent to one of Putins/Russian "democratic" elections.

I suspect that the day after the 2022 election things are gonna get really rocky. If they win, their crowd will feel super emboldened to carry on big time. If their crowd loses, I fear we can expect a J6 at every capitol in every state, but worse...........

Let's think positive thoughts on 2022 and hope that doesn't occur...........

[Raster]

36. It is no secret that the Saudis are looking for more firepower for their national arsenal...

...and would like this firepower unencumbered by the United States.

The Saudis (Mohamed Bone Saw) just gave Jared Kusher a $2 BILLION dollar "investment" against the advice of just about everyone in the Saudi royal family.

I believe that Trump and associates were in the process of selling U.S. military secrets (nuclear rocket technology) to the Saudis.

[jmowreader]

39. This is what I think

Trump is up to his eye shadow in debt to some not-very-savory people like the Saudis and the Russian mob.

He has no way of paying them back from the proceeds of his own businesses, largely because he chooses very-low-profit businesses to be in. He probably made more profit from selling ties than he does from golf courses and hotels.

When he was able to get elected president, he finally had a way to pay his debts. James Hall III, one of the most damaging spies of the Cold War, was earning thousands per month from his treachery - and the more documents he handed over, the more he made.

So...Trump has been doing the same shit. One Confidential document might reduce his debt by $10,000. A Secret document, maybe $25,000, and $50,000 for a Top Secret one. Something out of a Special Access compartment like signals intelligence or satellite surveillance would add another $25,000 to that. Giving the Saudis permission to cut up Jamal Khashoggi was probably worth a quarter-million. He gets $100 every time he says "fake news" because that's the secret woid, and as we all know when you say the secret woid you win a hundred dollars.

[Susan Calvin]

41. A question, please

I can't find any reference to sensitive compartmented information in the news so far, at least with regard to Trump. I found a story that says somebody else who took out SCI information got many years in prison, and a story that says what they took from Trump is being stored in a SCIF, but I can't find anything that says Trump took SCI information. The most I can find is top secret..

Well, I see that's not a question, just a paragraph full of statements. Do you or anybody else happen to have a link that says he took SCI information? That would be way worse than just top secret.

[ancianita]

44. What David Ignatius from the NYT says is that the FBI took 12 boxes more than the 15 already

removed by the National Archives. So getting to what is "sensitive compartmented information" in those 12 boxes is not going to be explained by the DOJ or press until a court filing by the DOJ, which will then give us some idea.

[Susan Calvin]

46. My next question, if he has SCI information,

Would be how did he get it? I wouldn't think even the president would have just free access to absolutely everything, especially SCI, but would have to show need to know for a specific purpose.

Not that I know anything about how it works for presidents.

[ancianita]

48. From what I've read of his four years IN office, he had aides "take upstairs" docs he wanted.

He had likely been thinking about their usefulness to him for a long time. So thats at least 27 boxes by the latest count.

Yes, Presidents have access to any/all classified information; they are commander-in-chiefs, right? Can some 3-letter agencies choose what to show him? Sure, and they do. But that doesn't mean that over time, all important DoD or intel docs were kept from him.

Trump could declassify any classified information he wanted, but those in the know about govt say that he'd have had to sign certain proofs of his declassifying them, which he didn't do.

So when he removed all that and took it to his Florida "residence," he'd maybe not have broken the law if he did it right before Biden was sworn in, as part of his moving "logistics." But by keeping them after the National Archives followed due process, he was committing an ongoing crime that he now will have to be indicted for.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2071

AND

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/793

[Susan Calvin]

50. Well, it seems to me,

That even if he had absolutely unlimited access, removing them is a major no-no, even for a president.

[ancianita]

52. Yep. It's that simple. And now he's broken more than one federal law.

And the DOJ and judge saw this as a national security threat.

[Dysfunctional]

43. I would like to know how he got those documents out of the White House.

People must have helped him and are just as guilty as he is. Every place I worked in the army after boot camp had special intelligence documents and tapes, that is why my records are still flagged after 58 years. Before being allowed to enter each place for the first time we were given the protocol on what we could and could not do. One thing we could not do was bring a book to work with the expectations that we could take the book out of the building. Every piece of paper in the building, outside of what the couriers took out, was kept in the building or was burnt.

[Susan Calvin]

47. Bingo. nt

[Tree Lady]

51. If that was really true

Why would they wait and let him sell to foreign governments? Doesn't our military stop things like that?