Pearl clutching Wray: FBI director 'very concerned' by reports of secret Chinese police stations in

[cbabe]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/nov/18/fbi-director-very-concerned-by-reports-of-secret-chinese-police-stations-in-us

FBI director ‘very concerned’ by reports of secret Chinese police stations in US

The United States is deeply concerned about the Chinese government setting up unauthorised “police stations” in US cities to possibly pursue influence operations, FBI director Christopher Wray has said.

“I’m very concerned about this. We are aware of the existence of these stations,” Wray told a US Senate homeland security and governmental affairs committee hearing, acknowledging the FBI’s investigative work on the issue but declining to give details.

…more…

[Deep State Witch]

1. One of my former supervisors

Was looking into something like this several years ago. She was told to stop because there was no "there" there. Although she retired about 5 years before I did, I'm wondering if she feels vindicated?

[Ocelot II]

2. Why is this "pearl clutching"? Sounds like a legit concern to me.

[iemanja]

21. +1

[msfiddlestix]

40. sounds like it to me too, if true.

where are these prisons located though, and who would they be authorized to arresst?

Wondering if this is true, would they be located in various "china towns" throughout the country's large cities?

Los Angeles, San Francisco, Oakland.... etc?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

41. Nobody has said they are prisons. They are not. Where did you invent that?

[msfiddlestix]

42. Should have said Jails I guess? What's the point of Police Stations if there are no jail cells?

And then once those jail cells fill up with prisoners, they'd have to be transported to another larger location, which I grew up understanding the term to be known as Prisons.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

43. Nobody has said they have jail cells. What orifice did you pull that out of?

Read the news stories, carefully now, for the first time or for comprehension, and you will see the point of these stations without jail cells. Further, not all police stations have jail cells. Read and you will see that "police stations" is just a handle, an appellation.

You will see then just how looney your fabrication is. There is a real issue there, but going on about non-existent jail cells is obscuring it.

[msfiddlestix]

44. Excise me... but that was really uncalled for.

The term Police STATIONS was stated.

Police stations have jail cells, even the smallest, tiniest substations have a jail cell.

Regardless of the fact that the term was omitted, it doesn't negate the fact that it is the function of any police station to jail those they consider offenders.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

45. You still don't get it, but if you read the stories you might. These do NOT have jail cells. Read

Jail cells (that they do not have) is not the point.

The term for these Chinese offices is just a clumsy appellation that someone applied and it stuck.

"The map is not the territory." Look that one up.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

46. I can't excise you, but keep posting misinfo about jail cells & someone else might excise your posts

[Bernardo de La Paz]

3. That metaphor is applied when people over-react to trivial matters. YOUR implication is

Your implication is that Wray is overly concerned and should be less agitated and not "clutching at his pearls" in a fit of fear and worry.

I think you are wrong to satirize this issue.

It's an issue in Canada and other countries.
It's an important issue because of the way China pressures expats.
It's an important issue given the reports this week of Chinese interference in elections in Canada and other countries.

[TheProle]

4. Just so we're clear

You're demeaning the investigation because Republicans have brought it up and you have to automatically align against anything they say or because you absolutely believe that such a thing is not happening?

[cbabe]

6. Ah. Nope. To clarify, think of all the times Susan Collins was accused

of pearl clutching when confronting serious issues, saying she was ‘concerned’.

Same with Wray. Serious issue and he is ‘concerned’.

That’s all.

[emulatorloo]

11. Wray said the FBI is investigating. Investigations aren't "Pearl Clutching."

Wray “ acknowledging the FBI’s investigative work on the issue but declining to give details. ”

Please correct you post. Thanks in advance!

[iemanja]

22. Because Collins concern was fake. There is no parallel here

The clear implication is that you think the FBI should not be investigating this issue. The question is why you think that.

[Hekate]

5. This is real. The Chinese govt is monitoring what they call overseas Chinese. If you doubt ...

… that they are real police stations, you don’t know the Chinese government.

I would have thought any such thing would be illegal as hell in the US, because they intend to enforce their own laws — not ours.

[exboyfil]

17. The techniques they use could be illegal

Spying on other people is how many PIs make their money. There are restrictions on foreign nationals working in this country (Visas, etc) so that is an avenue for enforcement along with the laws on wiretapping, breaking and entering, interference with the US mail, trespassing etc.

Our spies also do it in other country - some of them under the protection of diplomatic immunity.

What happens if the Chinese revoke a passport they have issued and then inform the US government that the Chinese national no longer has a passport and shouldn't be in our country. Do they get shipped back unless we give them refugee or some other status?

Are there any examples of the Chinese engaging in extraordinary rendition? They have absolutely no right to detain anyone in this country, and, if they do, they should be prosecuted for kidnapping. If they take actions outside the terms of their Visa, they should also be kicked out. It seems being paid to be police officers for China would be a violation of any Visa.

[W_HAMILTON]

25. I doubt it because if it's true, it means the FBI is even more inept than previously thought.

Allowing the Chinese to set up elaborate """secret police stations""" right here in our country, right under our noses, and the FBI can't conclusively say one way or another whether these claims are true or not?

[Hekate]

26. I read about these police stations awhile back. They exist in several countries, thus under other jurisdictions

…than ours.

China has a project called Belt & Road to establish its influence across multiple continents and oceans. They are very interested in mineral resources, the infrastructure to access them ( “Oh look, humble village sitting on top of oil, wouldn’t you like a bridge across yon river?” ) , and the political and economic power to access and defend those resources.

There’s a ton of info if you google Belt and Road.

Incidentally, despite the boastfulness of PNAC — Project for the New American Century — that was a lot of hubris. Personally I think the 21st century is that of Chinese ascendency. They are very focused. They have the long view. They have little interest in human rights.

[W_HAMILTON]

29. But this article is specifically referring to them setting up these stations in OUR cities.

[Hekate]

31. Just trying to broaden the perspective, since the OP was a bit dismissive of the gravity of the situation

[W_HAMILTON]

32. I can sympathize with the sentiment from the OP.

I see it as the FBI worrying about something that is of little consequence in the grand scheme of things -- ESPECIALLY given all the actual threats that they should be worrying about now -- and if it turns out these Chinese """secret police stations""" in our cities are an actual thing, well then, that is just yet another indictment on the FBI itself. Maybe they should have been on top of that rather than harassing Hillary for using private email for government business when there's not one damn politician out there that hasn't intermingled government work and their private emails/texts before.

[Hekate]

35. Perhaps someone could write to Nicolle Wallace to ask Frank Figliuzzi what he knows about it...

Someone in that realm who is an expert, and could speak knowledgeably for our benefit.

I missed whatever it was the OP saw that was up to the minute. When posting my replies I googled and there was a lot out there that seemed to confirm things I already knew about Chinese global activities, but I didn’t and don’t have the inclination to dig deeper tonight and write my peers here an essay on Chinese global ambitions. We have people at DU who could address it better than I.

They’re here — we know this. They are elsewhere on the globe — we know this. Barack Obama and his then-VP Joe Biden sure as hell knew this and I believe that boxing in China was part of the motivation of the Trans-Pacific Partnership that was so soundly beat up from both the American Right and the American Left. I know I have an old lefty friend who is a former old friend because of the crap she spewed at me about Hillary Clinton and Obama in the final weeks before the 2016 election.

Joe Biden mentioned at the outset of his presidency that he had “spent hundreds of hours on the phone” with Xi Jing Peng, and that among his qualities of intelligence and so on, “there’s not a democratic bone in his body.” China is autocratic to the core — just ask the Uighers and the Hong Kong residents.

On edit: I’ll be over here

https://www.democraticunderground.com/117815477

[Bernardo de La Paz]

39. Chicoms, Army etc. use contacts with expats to pressure them to spy on companies & dissidents. nt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

38. They are not "elaborate". And they had cover of "helping expats with government paperwork". . . nt

[tritsofme]

7. This is a strange thread

[cbabe]

8. Yep. Clear as mud. Why is that?

[emulatorloo]

12. Because you used the phrase "PEARL CLUTCHING" when there is an FBI investigation going on.

Wray ‘acknowledging the FBI’s investigative work on the issue but declining to give details.’

Characterizating an ongoing FBI Investigation as “Pearl Clutching” is false.

[cbabe]

13. Misreading my post. Pearl clutching references his use

of the word ‘concerned’. Done for now.

[emulatorloo]

15. No I'm not. It is you who misread or misrepresented Wray's statement.

You write “ Done for now.”

Good, you’ve caused enough trouble for the day.

[Hortensis]

24. It's almost always now used as an insult, to belittle.

The surprised, rather shocked, feedback here should be sufficient to make that clear. I mean, People's Republic of China "police stations" conducting illicit operations inside the U.S.?!

Xi needs his ass kicked, nation-state style of course, and is likely to. tRump is no longer president and this criminal violation of our sovereignty is absolutely unacceptable.

[brush]

9. WTF. Right under their noses. Bet we don't have police stations in China.

God! The Secret Service seems to be corrupt. The DOJ won't prosecute the traitor-in-chief, and now this.

[gab13by13]

10. I'm still waiting for Wray to be held accountable,

for lying to Congress. I flat out do not trust him. I believe the Chinese police stations but I also believe that Wray would like to switch the narrative away from the FBI's reaction, non-reaction to J6.

[sarisataka]

14. It's just China

What does it matter if their secret police are setting up shop in US cities?

[Sympthsical]

37. Imagine the reaction if someone said Russia had secret ops

China always gets this odd pass.

It's very strange.

Anyway, yes, China spies on its own citizens overseas. It's like people have never been around a major university before. It's been going on for years.

[Drum]

19. Here's one:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/117815477

[Iggo]

23. Oh my god, thank you!!!

[Hekate]

28. Thank you so much

[Hekate]

27. I am, so maybe I'm in the wrong thread

[Iggo]

34. Yeah, I didn't have to be a dick about it.

I’ll delete it.

[Hekate]

36. No hard feelings. I exited this thread myself & went over to the other one in Foreign Affairs...

See ya there

[exboyfil]

18. They should start with this to get these agents removed

Visa Classification Definition
E1, E2 Treaty trader or treaty investor
F-1 Foreign academic student, when certain conditions are met
H-1B, H-1C,
H-2A, H-2B, H-3 Temporary worker
I Foreign information media representative
J-1 Exchange visitor, when certain conditions are met
K-1 Fiancé of a U.S. citizen
L-1 Intra-company transferee
M-1 Foreign vocational student
O-1, O-2 Temporary worker in the sciences
P-1, P-2, P-3 Temporary worker in the arts, athletics in an exchange or cultural program
Q-1, Q-2 Cultural exchange visitor
R-1 Temporary religious worker with a nonprofit organization
TC Professional business worker admitted under U.S. Canada Free Trade Act (NAFTA)
TN Professional business worker admitted under NAFTA

[AkFemDem]

20. What are you suggesting?

That the Chinese government doesn’t spy on America and our allies?

That the Chinese government doesn’t monitor former Chinese citizens in America?

That the Chinese government doesn’t have interests that directly contradict our own?

That the FBI and other intelligence agencies don’t actively monitor such activities?

That the FBI and other intelligence agencies shouldn’t be concerned about espionage and foreign interference within our own borders?

[roamer65]

30. Start busting them.

[Celerity]

33. de rec for the Delphic framing